Red_Beard
Red_Beard
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@Nikkiwhat said:
Played a bunch of games yesterday and today (PS4), most were actually solid for once. Even playing as Oni, zipping around with his power I had zero issues. However, during these days of playing (same back when I played during the Anniversary & last Bloodhunt) had a bunch of matches play HORRIBLY.
So far the main factors I found to be playing Pyramid Head with his Powers to cause performance issues, the other was that Midwich was a CONSTANT hellhole for me. Played on Midwich as Trapper, as Michael Myers, Wraith and so forth. With different Perks etc, so no other common factor played a part other than the map itself.
Took video of the moments of one matches I had on the map. The rest of my matches I had before and after this one, were on different maps and I had few to no performance issues. I had issues similar to these on the revamped Farm Maps like Thompson House (and the other daytime Farm Map variants) when I played a few weeks ago. One issue I've never seen before is at one point in the video when 3 Survivors were gathered, I smacked Jake (you hear him scream) but he doesn't get injured the first hit and took a second hit to injure him. I had no issues on my end relating to internet, no other match have I had this happen before in recent gameplay.
When you wrote this, I reflected on my games that day and it felt like it had been running pretty decent for me too. Still some stutters here and there but not bad overall. The last couple days have been the same. Some stutters, but nothing unmanageable. After the performance patch, it ran decent for a couple days, then started to degrade again. When 5.1.1 came out it got really bad again. But that day it started feeling smoother. Have you been able to play the last couple days and does it feel decent still? If so, I wonder if there was some type of maintenance or upgrade to the server that would explain why that day it started feeling better because I don't think there was an update.
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@SweetTerror said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2443403#Comment_2443403
You asked how long I'm willing to wait to get the best match possible, and yet if we had a decent matchmaking system, this wouldn't be an issue. I shouldn't have to choose between long queue times for a good match, or quick queue times with lopsided results. Both outcomes lead to a disinterest in the game altogether.
All I'm saying is that the SBMM provided a much more even playing field for me. Now that it's turned off I really don't ever care to play solo survivor or killer much anymore. My first killer match after it was turned off had me go up against an all red rank swf. Needless to say my ranked 13 killer didn't do so well. 😕 I don't expect every match to be on point, but right now there are far more lopsided results than there are good matches.
You do have to chose though because BHVR doesn’t control who queues for which role. And since there is an imbalance at times, they have chosen to open match making up further to alleviate the queue times. It has absolutely nothing to do with which system they have implemented.
So let’s assume SBMM is implemented and I’ll ask again. If there aren’t enough players on in your skill range to fill all the roles, how long are you willing to wait till enough are available? My guess is like most people you won’t want to sit in queue for long amounts time.
I’m glad the test worked well for you. Me personally as a solo survivor, most of the time when queues were fast I had decent teammates. And while it was better for me as a survivor, a lot of the killers we faced couldn’t put enough pressure on to keep the gens from getting done in 5 minutes. Then later on when queue times where long, I had lots of matches with potato teammates. I’m a 2200 player. One of the teammates I got was so new they didn’t know what borrowed time did. I know because I talked to them in end game chat. So the SBMM system was and will absolutely pair you with and against people way outside of your skill range to alleviate queue times or I would not have had that experience.
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Here was my next match. Still matching pretty close.
This outcome was not a skill thing either. The killer was not very good in chase. This wonderful killer hardcore tunneled the survivor with 10k points out at 4 gens. Of course most survivors want to save that person so we try to help instead of pounding out gens. The survivor with 1k points actually DC'd. Not sure why it shows them with 1k points. Must be some bug if the killer starts the mori animation before the DC.
Forget all the base perk suggestions. Just some emotes that pop up for all survivors that say things like "Do Gens", "I'm going for the save", "On a gen", Being chased", or "Take a hit" would help solo queue.
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I just had this match. This is when my queues are fast.
Looks like it matched to ranks pretty well.
The current system wants to match like ranks together. It is programmed to do so. The reason it doesn't like in your case is because of queue times. If one side is experiencing long queue times, the system looks for players outside of the initial rank range to get players in a match faster.
Fun fact: Those players that posted about rank and skill discrepancies during the SBMM tests weren't posting to say SBMM is doing it and rank based match making isn't. They were posting to say it happens with SBMM too. BHVR has been strict with rank match making before. It always led to complaints about how long queue times were. I remember before cross play was added on both XBox and PC (yes, I used to play on both), my region having killer queues as long as 30 minutes. I remember some other regions having queues of an hour. On PS4 it was survivors with the long queues.
One of the SBMM tests had a high MMR streamer that had over 2 hour long queues. The only game he got was because a high rank SWF stream sniped him. BHVR is not going to allow queues to be that long. In this last test, I also had some very lopsided matches. One match I would have 8000 hour players. The next I might have 250 hour players. The only difference was I couldn't see a rank number in the end screen to tell how far out of my skill range the system needed to look to find me a match in an acceptable time.
How long are you willing to wait to get the best match possible? If you don't want to wait any longer than you currently do when you have your longest queue times, you are going to have to deal with lopsided matches with either system.
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Not sure if it would be considered against the rules or not. I wouldn't do it though because it seems scummy in my opinion. If I was going to try and slug for the 4k I would have just hit the last one and tried to get the second hit before they could help the other and then go pick up the first slug. If it doesn't work out, at least I don't feel like a dick.
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This happens with killer M1 attacks too. If you lunge and continue to hold the button down you can spin around and still hit the survivor and damage them even though the swing animation has ended. It is that the hit box of the weapon lingers after the swinging part of the animation is complete. I'm not sure if this is by design or just something they overlooked and don't think is a big deal. When you get hit with those as a survivor it looks like a bad hit. And before someone says "if you spun around with a knife in your hand it would cut someone if you hit them", not all weapons are knives in the game. Doctor has a bat, Myers has a pipe. It would be cool if it adjusted from a survivor standpoint. It might make 360s easier though.
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I don’t think most people would define that as tunneling. That is just chasing. If you are running the killer for a long time that is a good thing for your team, assuming they are doing gens, and doesn’t need anything to reward you.
I think most consider tunneling to be when the killer goes after the person that was just unhooked. There are a few perks for that. Borrowed time and decisive strike do the job pretty well in my opinion.
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@Mercês said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2440245#Comment_2440245
I know how the current emblem system works, but it doesn't make sense when evalidation a player's skill.
The MALICIOUS Emblem represents the Killer's ability to apply pressure on Survivors and prevent them from helping each other.
Points are won by hurting, interrupting, and downing Survivors, and lost if the Survivors are healed.
Points are also awarded each time a Survivor is hooked, which are NOT lost when the Survivor is unhooked.
For example, suppose 1. (player 1 gets 30 hits and survivors manage heal 10 times) and 2. (player 2 gets 10 hits and survivors manage to heal 0 times). Even tho on case 1 we had survivors healing 33% of the time, we would still getting a better emblem than case 2. Case 2 certainly applied more pressure, because survivors got so much pressure they got no time to heal.
The DEVOUT Emblem represents the Killer's ability to sacrifice and kill Survivors.
Each Survivor eliminated from the Trial grants points.
Sacrifices, Moris, and Reverse Bear Trap kills grant the same amount of points.
No points are awarded for any Survivor that bleeds out.
Hooking all Survivors at least once will guarantee at minimum a Bronze Emblem.
An Iridescent Emblem requires performing nine or more Hook actions in the Trial.
Performing 9 hooks often translates on letting survivors go (by not hooking everybody at the same time like I did). The only way I can do that is letting them win chases, healing, and complete generators, which conflics with the others emblem system.
The CHASER Emblem represents the Killer's ability to find and chase Survivors.
A few points are won each time a Survivor is found, and also by winning the Chase; the shorter the Chase, the higher the points.
Staying within a close proximity to hooked Survivors will reduce points in this Emblem over time.
Also doen't make sense. If survivors commit a bunch of mistakes and show off on your face and you end up downing them, you're forced to let them escape, either by letting them go of grasp, which decreases your points, or letting them heal others survivors, which decreases your points. If you have the opportunity of ending the match but chooses not to for the sake of this emblem, you will lose on gens, which decreases your points on gatekeeper. As I said, you're forced to let them go in order to find them again (this is a joke, right?). That's not right and I really hope they are not keeping this.
I could point other problems, but just tired.
If you know how the emblem system works then you know why you didn't pip on that game. You slugged and didn't get many hooks and ended the match before you could build up points.
You put too much emphasis on the deduction items and how much they really affect the other emblems. I did a little experiment just before the wraith buff and played 50 rank 1 or 2 (I depipped a couple) wraith games in a row. I was playing to kill as many survivors as I could but also get as many hooks as I could. Here are my pips from those 50 games.
I had 18 double pips. But only because I played to get as many hooks as possible. Survivors healing or them getting a few more gens done did not hurt me as much as you are trying to claim it does.
It doesn't make sense to you because your see wins in kills/escapes. Again, a lot of the emblem system is to incentivize game play that creates fun matches in BHVR's opinion. Did you watch any of the hardcore survivor that the 4 streamers did? There were times they were discussing whether they should let the killer down them so they could get more altruism points. They had to evaluate the risk of losing a survivor over gaining more emblem status as the ultimate goal for them was to get to rank 1.
You should have known when you had all the survivors slugged you weren't going to be rewarded. But you chose to end the game instead of trying to play in a way required to earn the reward. If you cared about rank then you should have adjusted. At least you safety pipped so you didn't lose anything.
When SBMM comes out you wont get to see your match making rating so you won't have to worry about it. Just play to kill as fast as you can and in theory you should be matched with survivors of similar skill so the matches will be more engaging for you. Hopefully it works. I have my doubts.
As far as the new ranking system for rewards, I don't think they have shared how it will work. But if it is similar to the emblem system, you are going to have to play in a way to earn those points if you want them.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2438702#Comment_2438702
for rank system, it goes by emblems. Piping is consider winning. depip is losing. black pip is drawing. What I imagine the system does is that it tries to look for your average emblem count on each emblem and it tries to compare it to group of survivors with similar emblem score.
if your emblem score on average is really high. for example you get gold emblems on average, it will try to look for survivors that also get gold emblems on average. Obviously, having high emblem average means you will pip very often. that is my guess to why you can face rainbow survivors ranks in current matchmaking sometimes.
issue with that system? Your ability to achieve their emblems is based off other person's skill-level. so for example. you could be red rank survivor and you just face killers that play their killer poorly, as such, it makes really easy to iri emblems in all categories. as long matchmaking keeps giving you easy games, you'll eventually hit red ranks(this is why ranking system is more based off time than skill). you could also face strong killer players as survivor and their play is very refined such that it becomes very difficult to pip so you end up drawing a bunch but eventually you end up getting to r1.
so now you have two types of red survivors that both achieved red ranks but one person achieved by facing worse opponents and the other person achieved by facing very tough opponents. so you can face a red rank team survivor team as killer that is so much weaker than compare to another red rank team. Similar stuff can happen with killer.
It all stems from emblem system not being good metric for objectively being able to identify wins from losses. that nurse game image is just one example. It just makes matchmaking super random where you can have very bad teammates as survivor and huge randomness to strength of teams when playing killer.
You don't have to explain how the emblem system works, I understand it and was here when it was put in place so I remember some of the discussions and reasoning BHVR had for it.
Whether or not pipping is a win is a matter of opinion and not something defined by BHVR. Some people thinking gaining a rank pip is a win, some people think getting a certain amount of points is a win and some think a certain amount of kills or escapes is a win.
The reason the emblem system rewards for game play how it does is because when BHVR designed it, that is how they felt the game should be played. They want killers to get as many hooks as they can. They want killers to get in lots of chases. They don't want you to spend time around a hooked survivor unless you are chasing someone else. They don't want survivors to just do gens. They want you to get chased. They want you to get saves. It is meant to reward players for going out there and doing lots of things because BHVR thinks that is what creates games that are the most fun.
The problem with complaints like the OP's is that they have defined their win as killing all or most of the survivors. They think they did it really fast and should be rewarded with the most rank up. The emblem system says no because you didn't play the way we feel you should play to make the matches fun.
I understand how there can be a large difference in skill in red ranks. I play there on both killer and survivor. But that said, someone who is consistently in red ranks is better than someone consistently in purple ranks assuming both are actively trying to earn pips. Some of this issue could be alleviated by resetting rank back further than just 5 rank spots on reset. Those survivors that are better are going to get there sooner. I also don't really see it as a huge problem though either. Yeah, you will get some games that are very lopsided, but in my experience, those extreme cases are not the majority of the matches. Most of my matches playing red ranks are the in between when queue times are good.
As for rainbow ranks, the current match making system is designed to first start looking for players within 6 rank spots of difference. If there are too many players on one side causing a long queue time, the system looks out further in order to get people in matches faster. BHVR has played around with this in the past. They have been pretty strict on who they match people with rank wise. It has always ended with complaints about how long queue times are. You think 5 to 10 minutes now for a match is a long time. I remember before cross play when killer queues used to get up to 30 minutes in my region on PC. I remember other regions talking about hour long queue times. Me personally, I would much rather face an oppenent/s that are much better than me than wait 30 minutes to find an oppenent/s I'm more evenly matched to. And I guarantee this is going to happen with SBMM because BHVR knows it is worse to have people waiting long times in queue just to find the perfect people to match them with.
You see the picture from the OP and say the rank system is terrible because it matched those survivors with that killer. I say well it was better than waiting 30 minutes to get in a game and wont be much better with SBMM if queues are long. You see the killer not getting a pip and say it doesn't define wins and losses well. I say it's not designed to define wins and losses by kills and escapes. It is designed to reward players for playing in a way the creates fun matches for both sides. I think the OP is the one who needs the explanation on how the pip system works. Maybe instead of trying to slug all 4 survivors as fast as they can, they pick up and hook the person they downed and let another survivor come and rescue. If you do this a lot throughout the match you will earn a pip. You will also earn more blood points. Another system designed to reward for playing in a way that creates fun matches.
All this said, it really doesn't matter anymore anyway. SBMM is coming whether you want it or not. Hopefully it works. I'm expect though we will see pictures posted just like this with the new system. Again because they also need to think about queue times. They only difference is we won't see a colored emblem by their names showing how far off the match making had to go to get them a match.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2438200#Comment_2438200
Well if MMR for killer is based off rank and emblem system. he would lose MMR as he did not pip(win), but not lose much as he did not depip.
I mean, that is how you know the emblem system is pretty bad. it cannot tell difference between winning and losing.
This is why MMR was much better. it was more accurate at predicting wins and losses. It improved matchmaking quality greatly.
What is considered a win or loss is not defined though. Just because you see the 4K in 3 minutes as a win doesn’t mean that is what BHVR considered a win. The emblem system was designed to reward players with rank points for playing in a way that BHVR feels is the most fun way for both sides. That is why you lose points for camping if no other survivor is near the hook even though BHVR considers camping an acceptable strategy. That’s why the devout emblem is based on hook actions and not kills. That’s why as a survivor you can’t pip if all you did was sit on gens the whole match and escaped.
I don’t think it is a bad system. It just doesn’t fit some people’s perception of winning.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2438140#Comment_2438140
Problem is that you don't know, if he would get or lose rating for those games. There is chance he would lose it anyway.
I don’t disagree with you about not knowing how it works. I was just pointing out it’s not clear what they are asking for and if it is to fix the emblem system, it is going away, at least for match making purposes.
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What are you asking them to fix, match making or scoring? They are changing the way match making works and ranks won’t be used for match making and instead be used for rewards. If you played last week when ranks were covered up in the end screen, that was their latest test of the new system they are developing.
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It took 5 days to get my first response on a ticket I submitted this August. I had to submit some additional information and I’m still waiting to hear back on that.
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That devout bug has been around for a while. If I am remembering correctly, a mod even stated it was a known issue. In my opinion, they focus too much on new content and not nearly enough on fixing the existing systems. This isn’t really a developer decision, it’s a management decision.
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I think the patch notes said the new rank for rewards system is on the PTB but not the SBMM. That might indicate SBMM is coming with the new chapter. It might also just be them testing the reward system so they can fix bugs and have it ready whenever they decide to roll SBMM out for good.
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@Pukenplag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2436993#Comment_2436993
I can't blame people for being frustrated, but I can blame people when they never think what work goes behind certain things.
You release something, people buy it, but it is not working as good as intended. To fix that issue, you have to spend tons of money and lots of time to first diagnose the cause, then other lots of money and time to fix ths issue.
If they can't simply diagnose the issue, of course they can't solve it.
How much it costs them is purely speculative on your part. If they are using the people that would be working on an new chapter, then the cost is the delay of future sales assuming it postponed a chapter release. If they delay a non essential project, like SBMM or "Auto Ban", it wouldn't really cost them anymore assuming those people wouldn't have been laid off once their original project was completed. If they hire a completely new team to tackle it, sure there is extra cost, but in my opinion, money well spent to fix the issues on the systems they (BHVR) CLAIMS the game works for. Most likely though their management doesn't think it is an issue that will lose them money so they don't prioritize it over new content.
If they can't fix it then they should say so. Then people waiting and begging for a fix will know to quit putting their money and time into a game that is no longer compatible with their system. They should also stop advertising the game as PS4, and Xbox One compatible and also increase their recommended computer specifications for the game. Again, this isn't something that has only been happening for month, it has been YEARS.
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@Pukenplag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2436869#Comment_2436869
I think the real issue is that a lot of people think optimization is done by pressing a button, while in reality it can be suuuuch a big pain... I sincerely appreciate the team is working on optimization.
I don't really think anyone thinks it is easy to fix. But this isn't something that has only been going on for 3 months. It has been going on for years. They had a "big" campaign to improve performance for consoles and lower end PCs in 2019 and failed. Not only that, they just flat out stopped talking about it. You can't blame people for being frustrated for dealing with the crap performance for years and not accepting their lack of communication about the issue. It's great that Mandy is able to say they are working on it, and hopefully they really are, but that isn't enough to completely dissolve the distrust they have built in the community that have felt unheard and left behind for years.
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I'm not working with the killer bro, I'm getting my struggle points. See since I ran the killer I didn't have time to do gens, totems and open chests for points like you did and I've got to get them some how.
Them struggling to the end is no more selfish than you hiding and waiting for hatch. Also, if me struggling gives time for the killer to find hatch before I die, that means they probably weren't camping me and you could have come in for a save.
Me personally, it depends on what my perception of the other alive survivor is. If it seemed to me like they were being an active member of the survivor team and not just hiding the whole game, I'll probably die for you to get hatch. If it seemed like you were just hiding the whole game I'll probably be getting my struggle points. You reap what you sow I guess.
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Many of my games during the test looked like that so I don't see it as any different. I would get 8000 hour survivors in one match and 250 hour survivors in my next. If I had good survivors we destroyed the killers unless it was a tinkerer, ruin, undying blight, a couple cracked spirits and a few other exceptions. I also think one shot build wraiths felt very hard to beat. If I got crap survivors, we were against the sweatiest killers that proxy camped every hook and immediately tunneled off hook and the other two survivors were usually crouched behind a tree waiting to save instead of punishing the camp and pounding out gens.
I don't know how if it is matching to skill I could have such extreme games. Why with rank, especially during the climb, you can get those extreme games, but usually it is much rarer for me. Especially once I get to rank 1. Most games are more the in between type for me on rank based. And the rainbow ranks you run into isn't because the match making to ranks doesn't work, it's because queue time are usually long for one side and it opens up. I think they could really just tweak how people rank with the current system to keep potatoes out of red rank a little better and this match making would be fine.
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Scratch getting good survivors during my better queue times for survivor. I just got out of a game with a survivor that only had 250 hours and this is my good survivor queue time. They were not a smurf. HOW? If the system is matching people of similar skill, why am I getting one extreme to the next? If I got a survivor with 8000 hours (Bryan_S) in my lobby that runs no perks and still outperforms everyone in the lobby, why am I getting a 250 hour survivor in my next match? How can I be in the ballpark of skill to get matched with a great survivor and then in the ballpark of skill and getting matched with a relatively new survivor?
These matches are not fun. It's either we complete all gens in 4 minutes and the killer had no chance or I have teammates that crouch around the map and we get destroyed by the sweatiest killers in the game.
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This MMR test has been the worst for me. The majority of my matches don't feel fun. It's either all the survivors are very efficient and we blow through gens or it's teammates that hide in lockers from BBQ even when the killer is on the opposite side of the map or get off the gen and hide behind a rock because spine chill activated even though there is no terror radius and they can see the obsession is being chased. And those matches with the "stealthy" survivors seem to be against the sweatiest of the sweaty killers that proxy camp and tunnel immediately off of the hook even though there are 5 gens still up.
How can my teammates go from 8000 hour players to 450 hour players that are clearly 450 hour players and not on smurf accounts? Especially when the majority of my game play has been survivor since they reset and started recording the data again. I definitely do not enjoy this round of MMR testing more than emblem rank based. Even the last test I seemed to bounce around from extreme to extreme. With rank based my matches are more of the in between with a few of the extreme cases here and there. With this MMR test it is extreme cases most of the time with a couple in-between matches here and there.
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I completely agree. The other thing that annoys me is most of the other survivors instead of being on gens are already crouched by the killer so they can get the unhook 2 seconds after the killer hooks them so it is hard to get any altruism points unless you are rushing the hook too. Then they ######### talk you and call you worthless afterwards because you don’t have as many points because all you could max out was objective because no one else would do gens.
So sometimes I decide to only do 2 gens max. Then I go look for totems and chests or chase after the killer and try to get them to chase me or be in the area to get a save before the others rush in. But then I get told in end game I’m useless because I didn’t sit on gens even though my lightbringer emblem is red and I have more points than most of them.
It doesn’t really matter what the truth is, people only believe what they want.
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Just to give an example of my previous post, I just got out of a match against a 1700 hour blight main. They were decent but weren't running the meta build and were streaming so I'm sure a bit distracted. One of the other survivors playing Ace got in a chase and went down really fast. The rest of the match they didn't touch another gen. Because they didn't do anything but hide, the rest of the team was killed before the final gen could get done. One gen was 50% and another was 75% and easily could have been finished if they would have helped. In the end, the killer found Ace trying to open a gate after hatch was closed but the killer let him go because he offered his flashlight. He told me in end chat he had 450 hours playing.
How can I get paired with survivors with 8000 hours at one time, but then get survivors with less than 500 later on? How is this any different than rank based?
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Here has been my experience this far as a solo survivor. I have mostly been playing survivor the last couple months so the system should have a decent amount of data on my survivor play.
During the morning hours when my survivor queues are fastest, I feel I have been getting better survivors than I was with emblem rank match making. Most of my games at this time it seems the survivors are too efficient for the killers to be able to overcome and thus feels like the killers I face are not of the same skill level, at least as of the team as a collective. Their have been a few exceptions but for the most part the only killers that seem to have been able to put on enough pressure have been ruin, undying, tinkerer blights and 1 cracked spirit. Speaking of spirits, it seems a lot of them have taken the iron will buff hard (not saying it was a bad buff, just pointing out my experience). I only played against one nurse and they didn't do well.
In the evening, when my survivor queues are long, the level skill of my teammates drastically drops. Most of the killers still feel like I out skill based on how chases go. Then the next match might be a 6k hour wraith that destroys us. So it seems like it can be all over the place.
I have a little over 2100 hours. In my morning queues I have been paired with 3 fairly well known streamers with thousands of hours more play time than me and in my opinion, highly out skill me. I'm not sure why the SBMM would think I'm of the same skill level.
With the exception of better teammates during my better survivor queue times, I do not feel like my matches have seemed more fair or evenly matched than they were with emblem rank match making.
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Here has been my experience this far as a solo survivor. I have mostly been playing survivor the last couple months so the system should have a decent amount of data on my survivor play.
During the morning hours when my survivor queues are fastest, I feel I have been getting better survivors than I was with emblem rank match making. Most of my games at this time it seems the survivors are too efficient for the killers to be able to overcome and thus feels like the killers I face are not of the same skill level, at least as of the team as a collective. Their have been a few exceptions but for the most part the only killers that seem to have been able to put on enough pressure have been ruin, undying, tinkerer blights and 1 cracked spirit. Speaking of spirits, it seems a lot of them have taken the iron will buff hard (not saying it was a bad buff, just pointing out my experience). I only played against one nurse and they didn't do well.
In the evening, when my survivor queues are long, the level skill of my teammates drastically drops. Most of the killers still feel like I out skill based on how chases go. Then the next match might be a 6k hour wraith that destroys us. So it seems like it can be all over the place.
I have a little over 2100 hours. In my morning queues I have been paired with 3 fairly well known streamers with thousands of hours more play time than me and in my opinion, highly out skill me. I'm not sure why the SBMM would think I'm of the same skill level.
With the exception of better teammates during my better survivor queue times, I do not feel like my matches have seemed more fair or evenly matched than they were with emblem rank match making.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
Eh, it worked for me.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/KBB4DECCDERW/image.png
Poor Kate was tunneled all game (hence the 12k points) and we couldn't save her but did take a load of hits and 3 of us got out through the gates. Wasn't that bad.
Looks like it didn't work well for the killer though.
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@Shaped said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422625#Comment_2422625
Kinda same tbh. I mean I try but I get burned out really fast because of the issues. It makes me play other games instead after a match or two.
And I love how some people on pc and next gen act like bhvr is perfect company because the game works on their system ignoring our problems and attacking everyone who says anything bad about the company.
Talk about lack of empathy and ignorance. We struggled since the game came on our platforms but now it is becoming unplayable and they act like it is not an issue or minor one.
I'm on PC and I have issues. I have well above the recommended specs too. After they did the performance update the game was feeling better. But recently it started running really choppy again. I just got out of a Lery's match that was stuttering so much it started giving me a headache. And this is a map they specifically targeted with their update.
I also hate how they have completely quit communicating about this again. And whenever someone points it out, they get the "we already acknowledged it" crap. Yeah, we know you acknowledged it. Give us some more information on what you are doing to fix it and when you plan to push out the next fix attempts so we can decide if this game is going to be worth our time.
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422623#Comment_2422623
This is complete BS, good sir. I have never played Blight in my life, just tried playing him for the first time and I was matched against a 4-man sweat squad who genrushed me in matters of minutes. Please, stop misinformation: there is only one MMR score for all killers as it was with ranks.
Then that would be good feedback to give them in the Feedback section. It is indeed supposed to be specific for each killer. That is why you can not killer swap in lobby anymore. After the last test they said they were making an adjustment so that if you have a high MMR with one of more killers, it will affect your MMR for other killers you dont play as often. This is because just because you are new to a specific killer doesn't mean you don't know how to effectively counter survivors with basic abilities so you shouldn't be completely starting from zero and facing survivors who don't know how do anything yet.
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In every survey they ask what license we might like to see, I have always put Hellraiser. Too bad the game has too many performance issues for me to spend money on it.
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During the day when my survivor queues are good, I seem to get mostly great survivors. I just played with EdgarAlanBro. I'm not sure why. I doubt I am anywhere near his level. Most of the killer's we have gone against can't seem to keep enough pressure on unless it is a ruin, undying, tinkerer blight, with a couple exceptions from a decent oni and wraith.
At night when my survivor queues are long, I get anything and everything. Last night I played a game with a survivor that didn't know what borrowed time really did. They said they didn't have many hours in the game compared to my 2100. Most of the killers I faced were not at the same skill as me either. I'm sure this is to alleviate long queue times.
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When I was playing survivor this morning I was getting mostly good teammates. Better than usually. Queue times were fast. The killers were a bit of a mix bag, some good, some bad.
Now that I'm playing this evening, with slow queue times, I am guessing the range is widening to reduce my queue time. I am getting very bad teammates. One game we were in endgame and the Myers camping their basement hook. I ran down and rescued the survivor and I had borrowed time. They ran around in the basement trying to avoid the killer instead of running up the stairs. I asked them in end game chat why they didn't run up and tank the hit with BT and they said they didn't know what BT really did. They said they didn't have very many hours playing. I have over 2000. The killers have mostly not been the same skill as me either.
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@Lucifer17 said:
Its a last gen bug with the terror radius. My friend who plays on xbox one had it happen the other day but me on the series S has had no lag or audio bugs
I'm on PC and I have had it happen.
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@BingBongMan said:
It sounds like a very limited issue, you're basically the only person I've heard of that's had that happen.
You can't disable something just because 1 or 2 people are having an issue.
Not to mention how DC penalties prevent DBD players from acting like literal children who quit if they don't like the smallest thing.
There are a lot of people that post about this in the technical section. The mod there has actually stated BHVR is aware of the issue and looking into it. It has been going on for a while now.
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Did you look at any threads before you posted this? BHVR is testing the skill based match making system. During this test you are no longer matched together by emblem ranks but by a system BHVR is developing to match people together of similar skill. They are hiding the ranks to get better feedback of the system based on how the games felt. If they don’t hide the ranks, the majority of the feedback they get is that it isn’t working because they had people of different ranks in their match even though they specifically state they aren’t matching based on rank.
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I too have had matches where the killer has no terror radius. I have had it with several different killers but it happens mostly with Nemesis for me. I check perks and add ons after the match and there is no reason the should not have had TR.
Sometimes sounds seemed delayed too. Like pallet kicks or pain grunts after being healed.
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They sure seem to be distracting the community with all the letter find hype. I hope people that are not satisfied with performance still speak with their wallets and we can put some pressure on BHVR to make performance improvements their top priority.
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I think the icons are just being used for testing the system. I believe when the system goes live, they will have the ranks shown again. Of course, ranks will only be for rewards when that happens.
The reason they are hiding the ranks during tests is to get better feedback of how the system works. Previously, even though they clearly state emblems ranks are not being used for match making, they would still get complaints about how people were matched against or with others or large rank disparities. They really want to know your opinion of if you thought you were matched with people of similar skill based on how the matches go, not based on emblem ranks in the end screen.
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it is for the skill based match making test that just started today. This system is to try and match players together that are of similar skill level instead of using the emblem system for match making. The reason they are hiding ranks is because even though they clearly state the system isn't using emblem ranks to determine skill for match making, people still flood the forums with complaints about how it doesn't work because they were matched against people with large rank disparities.
So when you give feedback about your matches during the test, they want to know if you feel like the people you played with and/or against felt like they were of a similar skill level to you based on how the matches go.
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When they tweeted last weekend to say that the switch update was going to be last Tuesday they said they were planning a bug fix patch for all platforms for the next Tuesday.
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@SMitchell8 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2397589#Comment_2397589
Tries to kobe, gets to stage 2, killer tunnels them and that takes a player out, damaging the survivors chances of escaping.
Are you trying to persuade me not to let people hit stage two when they try to Kobe in my face? I've played this game long enough to not care about pips and escapes. If we all die because of it, I'm fine with it.
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But it’s double blood points and I need to get my stacks. 😃
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@chapizwow said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2401329#Comment_2401329
why do you even bother...you are dealing with someone in denial; he doesn't even care about "proof", that's just his argument armor to avoid the idea he could be wrong. He's just been saying the same thing since the first comment "proof proof proof".
Mostly I did it to help out EntiySpawn because I was at least one person that said they could get hits cancelled even though they have better ping than a survivor. But you are right, I am getting the feeling I could tell them I am sitting in a chair as I type this message and they would say they don't believe me because I didn't post a video, with a valid ID clearly showing I am who I say I am, and a current day newspaper to prove I didn't record it 2 weeks ago.
And honestly I think we are on the same side as it pertains to the update. I like the new pallet stun/hit validation because I feel it is fairer. But I also see how people can be frustrated to see hits on their screens and having them cancelled. And telling anyone who complains about it on the forum that it is because they have worse ping than the survivor and need to get better internet might not be true because it can happen to killers that have better ping than the survivor.
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@Pizzaman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2401078#Comment_2401078
EntitySpawn was the killer, claims to have had a ping of 40, survivor a ping of 60. I get that. Still no proof was delivered. It's all just talk. No proof. I could claim to have had a match as killer with a ping of 20 and survivors had a ping of 200 and I got robbed of my hits through all those pallets (which I did not, but I could claim that).
Again, it's all just talk. Walls of text. No solid evidence. Calculations based on hear-say. We are on Page 2 of this discussion (in one of many discussions), yet there's no single piece of valid evidence. Looks like this is the status quo, and nobody can actually prove that this is unintended behaviour.
Did you look at my example? You don't need to see it on a video to prove it is possible. And since you can prove it is possible with math why would you just assume he/she is lying?
Are you saying the numbers I used are based on hear say? I used 40 ping and 65 ping to match what EntitySpawn said they had. The rest of the numbers I chose to use for the example to prove with math that a lower ping killer can have this happen. You are correct. The timestamps are not what occurred in the posted video. They don't have to be to prove this. Math is valid evidence.
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@Pizzaman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2400858#Comment_2400858
Look, I'm not saying it's happening, I'm not saying it's not happening. All that is needed to understand the situation is EVIDENCE.
Take EntitySpawn's post as an example. It says that it's happening, even though there was a 40 ping and that it looks like it was not good enough. Also what about the survivors latency? If someone makes a post with a concrete information ("40 ping"), then why not just put that it into a video together with some live action and show it to the world? Clearly the number 40 must come from somewhere, why not just show that? Is it really that hard? I'm not blindly believing people that just make claims in a "post" (and until there's evidence, it's just a claim), and nobody else should either.
"Just because a killer player gets stunned and didn't get the hit does not mean they have worse ping than the survivor." Yeah, so even more important to show those numbers in the evidence *.
Again, if someone claims that he/she got robbed of a hit (or even multiple hits) while his/her latency to the server was indeed lower than the suvivors latency to the server, then why would that person not put up the evidence *? Understand, everyone can make claims by making a post. If you want get heard, provide evidence *. Everything that is said, is just a claim until there's solid evidence *. And just putting text in this forum is not evidence *.
If this is an actual issue, and people know exactly that their latency to the server is lower than the latency to the server of other players (as they claim), yet they still get robbed, then it shouldn't be too hard to put up some solid evidence *. If a person can't provide any evidence *, but still claims they got robbed that's just a big red flag to me.
* What is solid evidence in this case: a live action gameplay recording with an indication that shows the killers latency to the server and the survivors latency to the server.
@EntitySpawn didn't say the killer in the video had a ping of 40 and the survivor had a ping of 60+. He said he has been in a match himself with a ping of 40 and a survivor with a ping of 60+ and had a hit cancelled at a pallet. He said this because you said "how is the video proving anything at all except that the killer seems to have had worse latency to the servers than the survivor?". Why should you not believe him?
You don't need a video to prove this can happen either. All you need is math.
I don't know what a pallet drop time is so just to give it a time, let's use .25 seconds or 250 milliseconds. If someone knows the official time, let us know. Using that and knowing a stun occurs at 50% that means it would take 125 milliseconds from start of pallet throw to get to 50% and initiate a stun. Let's look at a scenario using time stamps in HH:MM:SS:SSS. Assume the survivor has a ping of 65ms and the killer has a ping of 40ms at the time of their actions in game. Just to keep it simple, let's assume zero server processing time.
Survivor drops a pallet at 12:58:50:942
With a ping of 65ms, the pallet drop start arrives at the server at 12:58:51:007.
With our pallet drop time assumption, the server sees the pallet at 50% at 12:58:51:132.
On the killer side, they swung at some point and the hit occurs at 12:58:51:093. They see blood splatter and a scream because killer actions get instantaneous feedback as verified by a mod in one of the threads about this.
With a ping of 40ms, the killer hit gets to the server at 12:58:51:133.
Since the hit is 1ms after the stun, the stun is rewarded and the hit is cancelled.
On the killer screen, the pallet reaches 50% at 12:58:51:172. This is 39ms after the hit occurred on their screen.
So by the math, the killer with the better ping still sees the hit on their screen and has it cancelled because the server still received the stun before the hit. I believe EntitySpawn when he says he has been in games with survivors with worse ping and had his hits cancelled because the math proves that it can happen. It is not all about who has the best ping and absolutely killers with better ping can have this happen.
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@SnakeSound222 said:
I think the pallet stun range also got buffed because I’m being stunned farther away than normal.
Also if you slow the video to 0.25 speed and watch that first hit, you’ll see some undeniable BS.
What do you mean by undeniable BS? Is it because you think the hit occurred before the pallet was thrown? Remember this is from the killer's perspective. When the killer sees the pallet being thrown is not exactly when the pallet was thrown by the survivor. When the survivor presses the button to throw the pallet it has to travel X milliseconds to the server + X milliseconds of server processing + X milliseconds to the killer's computer before the killer sees it. It looked different from the survivors perspective and it would have been nice to see them post that as well.
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2400688#Comment_2400688
Ping has nothing to do with it, I made a post how my 40ping was not good enough to get hits on 60+ping and then people started ping doesnt really matter
I never said ping didn't really matter. I said it wasn't the only thing that factors into whether or not you get the hit at the pallet. But I'll help you out on this one.
@Pizzaman it is not only about killer and survivor ping. Just because a killer player gets stunned and didn't get the hit does not mean they have worse ping than the survivor. When the actions were first pressed in real time matters, as well as length of time actions take, as well as server process time all matter in the interaction. If the pallet was dropped at the exact same time in real time that the killer swings and time to hit the survivor is the same as time for the pallet to reach 50%, the person with the better ping will win. But it is unlikely that both the survivor and killer player both press their buttons at the exact same time and I don't know what the official times are for swing to hit and pallet to 50% are but they might not be the same and probably aren't. Because of this, it is possible for a survivor with worse ping to have the pallet stun reach the server first.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2399678#Comment_2399678
The problem is, on the killers screen, they should have got that hit. If the killer cannot discern whether or not their hits should actually connect anymore, then killer is impossible to play. You need to see into the future, and predict where the servers think you are, not where you actually are on your screen.
It's much easier for the survivors to do this when it favoured the killer before, because survivors are looking into the past, they just need to give some extra distance between them and the killer, they know where the killer is coming from. But for the killer to compensate in the same way as survivors used to do, the killer has to look into the future, and predict where the survivors will be, before they get there.
Latency has been a part of the game for the killer since we have moved to dedicated servers. That's why grabs don't really work, which they are trying to make better. Killer has been dealing with latency for a while. I think you make it a bigger deal than it really is. The survivor isn't seconds ahead of the killer, they are milliseconds. Yes, now killer players need to adapt to latency having more role at pallet interactions.
Also, it is not true that survivors do not have to look "into the future". When the killer player presses the button to lunge, they don't see the animation before the killer pressed the button, they see it X milliseconds of the killer's ping + X milliseconds of server process + X milliseconds of survivor ping after the killer hit the button. People used to complain about being "exhausted on the ground". That was them waiting till the last possible moment to dead hard and them receiving the exhaustion debuff meaning the dead hard went off on their screen but they still got hit and were laying there on the ground with the debuff. BHVR added server validation to this so that if the hit was received by the server before the dead hard was, the exhaustion status is now cancelled. And I am completely fine with the answer being I need to "see into the future" to predict better and press the button sooner.
As I have said in many of my replies now too, I agree, it sucks as killer to see a survivor hit on your screen and have it cancelled. Hopefully BHVR can do something to reduce how often this happens and at the minimum, give a better indicator to killer players that the hit was cancelled. In the meantime, if you get a hit at a pallet you need to keep your eyes on the screen and make sure the hit wasn't cancelled.
Even though I am a proponent of the change because I feel this makes pallet interactions more fair, I also see and understand how this is a nerf to killers as well. Just because this nerfs them doesn't mean the change needs to be reverted. If the data shows certain killers have slipped too far in BHVR's opinion, I'm sure they will add buffs to them in other ways to get them to a level BHVR wants them at. Notice too I said where BHVR wants them at and not where the community wants them.
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@Carth said:
It's far more than just a 'whose action got to the server first'. Feel free to see the many examples in this video of a killer hit being rejected on the -same side- of the pallet.
Pallet stuns on the same side of the pallet as the killer without getting hit have been around long before this recent pallet hit validation. It has been referred to as reverse pallet stuns. Yes, it is still the stun getting to the server before the hit. This whole video is also only from the killer's perspective. Remember when the killer sees the pallet being thrown is not the same time the survivor actual started throwing the pallet. The survivor player hits the button to throw the pallet on their end, has to travel to the server, the server spends a brief amount of time processing the data, then has to be sent to the killer player's computer. This is latency.
It's not all about who has the best ping either. It also matters what time in real time the actions occur and how long the actions take. Please see this picture of a person doing some of the math on why a survivor with higher ping could get the stun before the hit against a killer with lower ping.
Yes I agree, it sucks as the killer player to see the hit and have it taken away. The feedback is being given to the developers as per the forum mods and hopefully some adjustments can be made to reduce this from happening as much as possible. Remember it also sucks for the survivor to see a pallet be thrown in time to stun the killer but get hit through the pallet. I play both sides as I'm sure most of the players do. I just want a fair system and if I'm playing survivor and the pallet stun gets to the server before the killer hit, I think I should be awarded the stun and not be hit. I feel it should be this way when I play killer as well. Why should I be rewarded for hitting the survivor when the server says the stun happened first? Hopefully a solution to the visual comes through soon.
Also, I would like to point out I have seen some people say that the killer is losing weapon wipe animation time too as well as eating the pallet stun when their hits are cancelled. I did not see the killer performing the wipe animation on any of the stuns in this video you posted.
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@burt0r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2399678#Comment_2399678
Well I guess the game showing the killer the down nonetheless leading to the killer breaking the pallet and then attempting to pickup the survivor only to realize that they dropped the chase and the survivor has already made 4-5 seconds additional distance plus maybe loss of los is of no importance then.
Nice of you to put words in my mouth for me.
I agree it is frustrating to see. The mods have said they are taking this feedback to the dev team to see what can be done to alleviate this. My point is the survivor was correctly awarded the stun and the hit not given because the server received the stun first. It feels like the killer was robbed because the latency caused them to see a hit but in reality, this was false.
You are aware this can happen now. So my suggestion to you would be if you get a hit at a pallet and the pallet was dropped, you need to keep your eyes on the screen and verify the hit wasn’t rejected until hopefully an adjustment can be made by the developers.
Also, to answer your next post, while playing survivor I have dropped a pallet and stunned a killer and been hit. I have seen others post they to have both been stunned and hit the survivor and the hit was validated as a good hit. That is how it is supposed to work. If the hit gets to the server before the pallet reaches 50%, then the hit will count and the killer is stunned. If the server sees the pallet hit 50% first, then the stun occurs but the hit doesn’t count, even if the killer sees it on their screen.