Pulsar
Pulsar
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@Roco45 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020133#Comment_4020133
Ah so this is why you combat any suggested nerf to SWF, because you play SWF. Makes sense now.
More like because its a dumb idea.
######### around with SWF is one thing that actually will kill DBD. The negative press alone would be hugely detrimental.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020075#Comment_4020075
really? many here have openly admitted to doing it and survivors here have claimed this happens "almost every match". which is it? nobody does it or it happens a lot?
Even the most Killer-sided people here don't hard tunnel every game at 5 gens because they know its scummy and not appropriate.
But hey, if that's the kind of player you are, more power to you. Precisely why it should be extremely penalized.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020049#Comment_4020049
as long as your double standards stand then yes lol. works both ways. yet you still havnt explained how its not normal to tunnel but its perfectly normal and ok to loop when both things happen frequently. you dismiss it regarding it as "what if" but you have no valid reasoning when its flipped the other way round
Yeah because nobody hard tunnels at 5 gens lmao
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020035#Comment_4020035
once again you say its weird and not normal….according to you. but the amount of people that claim it happens every match suggest it is normal. i could say going in a circle or using comms isnt normal….it is normal but i could still say its weird and not normal just like you can say it for tunneling.
what if i said looping from the start of the match ruined my fun? i could call that an ass move to immediately start looping before i even get a hit. i dont think this, but i could very easily think it and say only loop mid match when the things are going poorly but not from the start.
So are we just gonna keep doing this, "what if" "what about" thing?
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020027#Comment_4020027
no i dont have anything against looping or swf with comms. how do you not understand your argument can be applied the other way around? if someone feels that they need to be in SWF with comms to win and know they cant win solo then by your logic they are better off not doing SWF with comms because they are not as good as they think they are. try winning soloq with no looping and only loop mid match when things are looking dire. you cant see your double standards here?
You keep bringing it up.
I don't know how to explain to you any other way. Tunneling off rip is weird and not normal. I think everyone tunnels every once in a while, especially if the game is going poorly. Deciding to be an ass and immediately ruin someone's game is just odd.
And then somehow trying to justify it by linking it to looping or SWF? Just so strange and nonsensical.
The more apt comparison would be to a 4-man SWF where every member has 5K hours bringing 4 toolboxes and genrushing builds, then having them t-bag and taunt in EGC. That's basically the Survivor equivalent of what you are doing by tunneling some random solo dude at 5 gens.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020016#Comment_4020016
You realy beilieve high c-tier killer (around same power are like clown,trickster, addonless wraith) had 70% kill rate just like that even against high mmr survivors, freddy even as d-tier and sadako have on average one of highest kill rates with pig, pinhead and do they need nerfs becasue they are too strong? No because many survivors doesnt understand their power and counterplay or give up same with vecna he is a-tier now maybe high b-tier but for many survivors 4 weak powers in 1 is too much to understand and they mostly know counterplay to 2 out of his 4 mini powers.
Skullmerchants whole bs was chess merchant and that was because bad gen spawns (3 gens spawned often and were super close togeather not like now), gen kicking meta (strong regression gen kicking perks that could be stacked togeather like eruption, COB and overcharge) and most problematic thing then gen kicking regression perks was no gen damage limit which is now 8 and after 8 times gen is damaged it cant be regressed anymore but back than this all things were in the game and skullmerchant was one of best killers probably best who could hardly benefit from all of these things more than blight or even nurse and that was why she was so hated back then and many hate her for that time existing till nowdays.
Every single one of those Killers is macro heavy and relies on good macro > good micro. That would be the difference, actually.
My feelings on SM are irrelevant. She was a problem. You can't just leave a Killer who is wildly overperforming alone. SM 2.0 was massively bloated and completely lacking any sort of skill or skill expression against her.
BHVR has no solution. SM, and her mains, are generally reviled even now. She has a horrible reputation, and for good reason. There's a large portion of the community who will never play against her. Then you have the SM mains who demand to have the statistically overpowered and universally hated SM 2.0 returned, and if they don't get it, nothing is good enough.
I don't normally take BHVR's side, but there is zero winning here. They can either piss off the majority of their playerbase, or piss of a small portion of their playerbase. I think the choice is pretty clear from a numbers point of view.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020010#Comment_4020010
true we can change what is normal but thats not the point. the point is what is currently normal being pulled into question by your comment. the question on if tunneling is problematic is also in question here because myself and others have been countering it with minimal issues and it gets countered in my killer matches too but thats not the point. again your point of tunneling so long i have forgotten how to play "normally" can be applied to people who normally play SWF or normally loop.
how about killers stop tunneling and play "normally" according to you which im guessing is spread hooks? now survivors have to play "normally" according to me which is no loops or maybe no comms in SWF. see how crazy that sounds?
I have genuinely no idea what you are arguing.
You seem to have something against SWF and looping, which is something I expected to see in 2020, not 2025. SWFs still lose far more than they win, even at "High MMR" and looping is totally nonsensical to complain about.
I'm simply saying that if you think you need to tunnel every match, you probably aren't as good as you think you are. You'd be better off not doing it, in the long run. Tunneling is totally fine to do at certain points, but immediately slamming four random players out of ego is insane to me.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020016#Comment_4020016
Hardly doubt that like all bhvr things.
I'm sure someone has the direct quote, but if you think you know better, more power to you.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019999#Comment_4019999
Only because people killed themselfs on hook against her to skip dc penalty, if you struggle against her with solid team that didnt give up than killers like wraith are too much for you (even the fact she was weaker than curent wraith).
Pretty sure those stats excluded DC's and suicides.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4020000#Comment_4020000
no im not complaining about looping at all, i understand its part of the game. just like tunneling is. are we really complaining about tunneling in 2025? its been around for nearly a decade just like looping has. my point is what is playing "normally"? looping has become the norm for the game, just like certain perks or SWF using comms. these are nornal and to be expected. if tunneling is as common as people claim it to be then that would make it normal wouldnt it?? or are basing "normal" on your view of what killer gameplay should be?
Facecamping was normal.
CoH was normal.
We can remove problematic things. Not that deep.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019983#Comment_4019983
maybe, sounds like many have relied on SWF, looping or certain perks that they cant play normally.
Seems like whataboutism
Also theres no way we are complaining about looping in 2025.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019917#Comment_4019917
Just piece of crap gimcrackery covered in gift wrap, I hope they reconsider this and make her as before, her second version.
The version with a 70% KR? Doubt it.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019965#Comment_4019965
i do what i need to do to win, if i need to milk it i will. i know what happens if i dont hard tunnel at 5 gens… i lose. why would i want that?
Sounds to me like you've relied on hard tunneling for so long that you've forgotten how to play normally.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019908#Comment_4019908
as already stated, saying killers need to tunnel to win isnt a complaint, its simply stating the need to do it so they do it. if killers were having a miserable time tunneling and saying "change it, im not having fun" fair enough but they generally dont say that. they just say "we need to tunnel so we will tunnel, not a problem"
im not saying tunneling is advanced or difficult. im saying looping is just as easy to do. i do both, i tunnel hard at 5 gens as killer and loop as survivor so i know how easy both tactics are so i have just as much (or little) respect for looping as i do for tunneling. it seems its mostly survivor mains that rely on looping to demonstrate their "skills" are the ones the get offended when someone calls them out on the fact its really as skillful as they claim. granted some killers are harder to loop than others but M1 killers takes 0 skill to loop, wraith or trapper for example. does it really take skill to loop a pallet…oh killer going the other way so better turn around and go the other way…about the get hit, drop pallet. easy. But that tunneling wraith has to find a way to down that survivor….not so easy.
"I tunnel hard at 5 gens"
Crazy thing to admit to.
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@THE_Crazy_Hyena said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019749#Comment_4019749
It has definitely been a thing since the early days.
But it is a lot harder to counter nowadays, with how much the game has changed.And that's good. The stuff that countered tunneling was absurdly strong.
We just need to also reign in tunneling now as well.
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Because the root cause is opportunity.
Killers do not need to tunnel. They want to, because it makes the game vastly easier. There's also pretty much zero meaningful consequence to tunneling in 99% of cases.
Now, how do we know this? Well, because we've seen tunneling remain through every meta. Before 6.1, we heard the cries(from myself even) that people would stop tunneling if only DH and DS were nerfed. While some did stop, most increased how frequently they tunneled because it got easier. Apply that to every update and here we are.
Unfortunately, BHVR chickened out on actually curbing the issue by making there be real consequences. A 3v1 is still the best situation for the Killer to be in, ergo, we will still see a massive amount of tunneling.
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just had a longtime friend uninstall after probably eight years. He hasn't played consistently in a while, but he would still hop on every so often. He was the person who really got me into DBD, so seeing him leave is.... difficult, especially after so many years. Now, it's only my friend who started during the Anniversary. Said friend wanted to play last night. Got camped or tunneled in three games, then called it quits.
sad to see DBD these days. I probably wouldn't play at all if not for my enormous ego telling me that I need to play if I want to have an opinion on the forums. So, I manage a few games every so often.
Nothing like how it used to be for me.
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@GuardianoftheCrystal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4019527#Comment_4019527
Idk anymore man, its just so bleh to play killer and survivor anymore. Solo queue survivor is lile C&b torture
LMAO
So real for that. Tried to play with my buddy last night, didn't go well lol
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What changes?
The nerf to anti-camp, which was already exceedingly weak. The ineffectual tunneling changes that don't punish hard tunneling?
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If @Reinami and I agree, it's probably a bad change.
These changes only negatively impact weaker Killers and haven't fixed deadzones.
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@Nun_So_Vile said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4018935#Comment_4018935
A rework would be one thing, especially if they phrased it "Until we find a way to reintroduce this killer". Now, any future killer can be under scrutiny. And from the killer side, how about Scout class and how one of the least pleasant classes to face in a 2v8 and equally as obnoxious from the killer perspective as Legion is to survs? They are not fixing problems, they are making them less bad, which you and I both know has never been the solution, despite it being their M.O. for many years. Band-aid solutions.
Good.
Some Killers don't work in 2v8 and we shouldn't try to force them in when they make the gameplay worse.
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As a former legion main, thank God they are out of 2v8.
Who would've thought that throwing one of the least pleasant Killers to face into a 2v8 that is...precariously balanced would be a bad idea.
He should've been fully reworked instead of re-tuned, but it is what it is now.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4018619#Comment_4018619
Who you mean wraith or wesker, I think you mean wraith which he is b-tier but now wesker is more close to high b-tier if you cant pull all these instahugs and other strong techs he is no that strong as people think.
Yes, I mean Wraith.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4018597#Comment_4018597
Wesker for sure he is fair.
Wraith is good only with addons because without them you cant make mistakes or you are super weak and punishable like lower c-tier killer (tbh I would like for him to have like some percentage from shadow addons in his basekit when he is cloaked slightly faster breaking and vault speed and than something he had but devs took it many years ago and thats seeing blood breighter just like draculas wolf form because wraith is just tracking killer too by his old perks).
He's easily B-tier. Excellent map pressure, good traversal, decent anti-loop and good utility.
He teaches newer players all of the important fundamentals whilst also not handicapping them in any way.
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Probably Wesker.
I think Wraith is the best Killer for new players, however.
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Hopefully it goes better than their last stream.
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What is bro on about?
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Amount of pallets doesn't seem to have increased, but the quality of loops has.
I should not be seeing rock filler into long-wall into jungle gym into Shack into rock filler.
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Most of these maps were already fairly balanced, imo. Except for some deadzones, I felt the pallet distribution and loop generation was fair.
Shelter Woods is probably fine with this update though.
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Some of them are alright. Rotten Fields has an almost appropriate amount of pallets now.
Other maps generate multiple structures that loop into CowTree.
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It's fine, kind of. The pallets helped, but it hasn't fixed the main issues with the map.
The map is still very small, linear and has extremely long sightlines, something old Haddonfield did not suffer from.
Adding more pallets is nice, but the map also needs to be bigger and have more LoS blockers.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4016818#Comment_4016818
That appears to be what the dev was saying.
I know for a fact those games are excluded from the official stat tracker, because I tested this by having a month where I pressed the abandon button as survivor each time it appeared, and it inflated my escape rates by over 15% because it threw out a bunch of games where I was seconds away from being sacrificed.
This is my problem with it.
How am I supposed to make informed feedback if I'm being fed false information?
There are a decent amount of DC's. I am sure that affects the Kill Rates and Escape Rates a bit. Abandon's though? That's almost every game. That has to have a massive impact.
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He would still be harder than Ghoul or Krasue.
Somehow.
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Unsure.
Seems more and more like DBD wants you to be miserable.
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@ranbuta said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4016199#Comment_4016199
As mentioned above, very little information is available about Wesker or Chucky, but I believe the skills of other killers are largely comparable. However, whether the average killer skill level in Asia is truly high or low remains unknown to anyone unless all servers are unified.
Incidentally, the high usage rates of wraith and selfcare stem from the fact that many killer players on Asian servers favor hit-and-run strategies. Players who persistently chase a single survivor are generally considered beginners. I believe this is another major difference between Asian servers and others.
So strange. Self-Care is a throw pick anywhere else, but the Asian servers allow it.
I suppose we'll never know for sure. Seems like the wild west over there.
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@ranbuta said:
There aren't many videos or guides in Japan that are useful for killer players. For example, Chucky was considered very low tier in Japan, and one reason for this was that various Chucky techniques were hardly known. (Another reason is that because selfcare usage is high, Hidey-Ho Mode wasn't very useful.)
Similarly, Wesker is currently considered quite low tier. The reason is the same: important techniques aren't widely known. These are often viewed in Japan as akin to bugs or glitches and don't spread widely. (Sharing such information often draws strong criticism.)
For these reasons, it's possible that killer players' techniques are underdeveloped.
Survivor play skill varies by player. However, on average, the skill level is somewhat high, while the number of extremely powerful players seems relatively low. (Of course, this is just my personal impression.)
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4016182#Comment_4016182
Well, I would counter with this question.
If Killer skills are, generally, underdeveloped and their best strategies are met with social stigma and not widely used, then how can we say Survivor skill is high?
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@tyantlmumagjiaonuha said:
I usually play on Asian servers, but occasionally play on servers in Europe, America, etc. via VPN, accepting the high ping. I play with streamers and friends. This statistic feels accurate based on actual experience. Survivor players on Asian servers play in line with the game's primary objective of fixing the Gen, so I believe their escape rate is higher.
On the other hand, I feel Western survivors don't prioritize escaping. They focus heavily on preventing hooks by stunning the killer or destroying hooks. On top of that, many users on the English forums loudly proclaim survivor powerlessness and killer OP, and I've been fed up with this gap for years. Whether you play to align with the game's core purpose or aim to crush your opponents—we're literally playing different games across regions.
I've noticed Asian Survivors aren't better at looping, they just stick to gens. There isn't really any altruistic play at all. Likewise, the Killers don't tunnel or camp.
Makes sense why the KR is lower. Killers aren't playing up to their potential and Survivors don't care about each other lol.
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Yeah, not surprising. The Asian servers have always been different.
Not much tunneling, very independent Survivors, little altruism.
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Eh.
Terrifier is just gore porn tbh. I would rather see more deserving licenses.
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@Dreigonix said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4015221#Comment_4015221
Care to elaborate?
Pixel just wants old SM. Why they insist on maining the most problematic Killers, and then insisting they arent, is beyond my scope.
Regardless, allowing them to design SM would be a massive mistake.
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@Raccoon said:
If BHVR apparently pulled these changes due to Killer outrage, what makes you think you'll ever see them come to live?
I doubt any attitudes are going to shift.
That is the concern.
If BHVR flinched so quickly on the PTB, I find it unlikely we see anything impactful.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014971#Comment_4014971
I'd really hope it wouldn't be the case that it was video evidence only.
I did have a game (as killer) with one cheater, and 2 teammates who were queuing alongside them and it was a similar situation. Invisible cheater, instahealing teammates, infinite invisible Head On hitboxes etc.
Reported them all with video evidence and only got one ban in the report feedback, so it might be the case that it's not video evidence only.
I mean, it doesn't make sense to include video evidence if they have gamelogs.
If the logs show, "Survivor X is healing Survivor Y at 200000% speed while Survivor X is located in the corner of the map" or "Survivor X is running at 200% speed for the last two minutes" then you wouldn't need video evidence.
I doubt BHVR will ever actually tell us the process, but I imagine a huge portion of it is down to video evidence.
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@Dreigonix said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014783#Comment_4014783
This. Literally all BHVR has to do is get in contact with Pixel Bush; he's played Merchant longer and more devotedly than anyone and he's made multiple pitches for reworks, all of which preserve her identity as a macroplay-heavy killer.
But anything's better than turning her into more microplay dashslop.
Hell no.
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Remember, we're in a "health update" lol
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I would like to say no, but since we really don't know how BHVR detects cheating, its theoretically possible.
It seems like it is all based on video evidence, if I had to guess. If they had the logs, they wouldn't need video evidence and could clearly see who was healing who.
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No.
DBD looks like a PS3 game. The only reason it runs like garbage is because it is terribly optimized. It relies on machines being able to brute force it.
There's no reason a game of DBD's scale and graphical intensity should run and be as unstable as it is.
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Hopefully they avoid both a dash and keeping her the same.
Both designs would suck.
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I have a suspicion that this isn't a bug or something they consider fixable.
I imagine this is part of his kit, meant to replace kidnap tech.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014334#Comment_4014334
Thank you, this is exactly what I've been hoping for. I think these are reasonable ideas, with a few notes:
Give it the Incapacitated effect as a placeholder. This prevents Item usage.
Blocking item usage and even pallets is a good idea, but I think full "incapacitated" is too much. The survivor should have a way to choose to do conspicuous actions and not just have the eruption problem of standing at a gen afk until a timer runs out. Just not the ability to "choose instantly while invincible standing at a pallet".
Things like chests, gens, and interacting with killer powers should be possible actions, but cancel the effect. Agree, though, that items or pallets, for example, should be blocked.
Remove auto-aim
This should just be a toggle in settings. Like shadowborn Fov, just let the player decide. I don't play console, so maybe it impacts them more, but iirc you do play console so maybe it's not as necessary as, say, a shooter.
The HUD should always be accurate, and reward keeping an eye on things,
This is an excellent point, and fully agree.
Unique Hook Bonus
No real complaints here in the theory, just that I don't think BHVR is going to make 2 tiers of the effect to implement. They've been hesitant to do "killer specific" core gameplay effects in the past, but they need to eventually make some kind of change that isn't just buffing blight because trapper needs help. Not sure if they will get over that for this feature.
It could also be spaghetti code issues. Like, doing so would cause hooks to spawn instead of exit gates or something.
As an aside, I've been asking for details since the PTB and this is the first time I've seen something other than just "it's abusable" with no explanation or solution besides "pull the plug on everything, don't do it, no no no no no".
Like I said, it's a placeholder. I think it's an issue that Elusive allows for flashlight saves and/or pallet saves.
They already made two tiers of the effect, I just modified it a bit.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014319#Comment_4014319
It's not the same level at all. If the phase 2 changes had gone live, there would have been massive queue time problems, and the entire chapter launch would have been a disaster. It would have cost BHVR a lot of money to have all that happen on the launch day of a new chapter.
The game is actually stable as it is right now.
It seems like it isn't the same level because you like one set of changes and dislike the other.
Not very objective, imo, but we are allowed to play favorites.