NoHookDC
NoHookDC
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3425637#Comment_3425637
That's not really clear at all, most call it hook suicide, not hook dc lol
I had a friend commit suicide, so I don't like that word being used for gaming/entertainment purposes. So I did not use it.
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@ili said:
Unfortunately I don't think they will nerf, most of the community don't want cannibal nerfed, an example and comment above.
It's almost like 'I want to punish people for making me angry' is a incredibly horrible reason to nerf anything. Wild, that.
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Whenever someone says 'A nerf to punish people', what they are really saying is 'I don't like this, and I want people who use it to suffer.' or 'I want to punish people who broke my made up, unenforceable rules'.
So...No.
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You need Balanced Landing to affect falling screams.
So you could say it's for consistancy; If the Killer hears you yell when falling; No BL. If they don't hear a yell; BL.
So if Calm Spirit affected falling screams, it would throw this tell away.
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3425620#Comment_3425620
Whats your username mean then?
That being able to DC on the hook should be removed/changed. Hook-DCing is just ragequitting while dodging the DC penalty.
So there should be no ability to Hook-DC. Thus; NoHookDC.
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3425550#Comment_3425550
So I have a question then, if you get no hooks/sacrifices you ragequit correct?
Nope.
Regardless if I am playing Killer or Survivor; I never ragequit. Ragequitting is for people who can't handle losing in a PvP game, and instead makes excuses why it's not their fault they're quitting.
And since they're making excuses; they never learn to get better, and thus always make more excuses and continue to ragequit.
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Developers: We see camping and tunneling as valid tactics.
Survivors: When are you going to punish these?
Developers: ...We said they were valid tactics. Did you hear us?
Survivors: Yes we did. When are you punishing them?
Developers: They are valid tactics.
Survivors: Ok. So when are you punishing Killers for doing them?
Developers: 🤦♂️
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3424953#Comment_3424953
Heaven forbid killers have to put effort into winning. You really need to stop demanding tunneling stay viable just because you don't wanna put actual effort into winning even if spreading hooks became viable
Ah yes. Me being fine with the tactics is lazy, but you demanding change is not because...Survivors come first, I guess?
Maybe you can stop demanding tunneling be punished based on your anger over not winning? No? Rather pretend demanding the game cater to you is right and proper?
You do you, I guess.
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@EvilSerje said:
10 seconds till swarm of campers/tunnelers deploy and tell you that it's "valid tactic", "no other way around" and "learn to play".
And yet they are not wrong. 🤷♂️
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Heaven forbit Killers try to win ASAP. That's a tactic reserved for Survivors.
The Killer securing wins is not 'a design flaw', no matter how loudly Survivors scream this fallacy because they lost. So people need to stop demanding punishments just because they want to lose less.
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@MoNosEmpire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423824#Comment_3423824
well erm.. that is kinda what is happening with tunnelling when killers abuse it too easily. That one tunnel at the start of the game can throw many games into shambles, one tunnelled within the first 10 seconds, the next slugged, theres 2 down and not even 1 gen complete because of how low the skill gap is for a vast majority of survivors. The only potential fixes I can see right now would be to ban tunnelling until at least 2 survivors have been killed and add another playstyle which isn't oppressive so the killer feels pressured to protect gens rather than ignore stopping us doing the objective but rather kill us outright within seconds. I've noticed more as a whole that killers ignore gens completely now unless they have a gen perk and their main priority is tunnelling, which is quite sad if you think about it really.
And how would you 'ban tunneling' in a way that Survivors could not abuse like they do basekit BT?
Seriously. Survivors whined about tunneling, got a free perk out of it, and weaponized that free perk to force the Killer to tunnel via bodyblocking instead of running away. And when they get downed, they continue to whine that they were tunneled. It's like they expect the Killer to let them bodyblock & then run away unharmed.
So tell me; What could be done that Survivors would not maliciously abuse, exactly like they do basekit BT?
The other reason I know Survivors are just angry they lost? Because they scream onto the forum with insults: 'Braindead play', 'Lazy Killers', 'Toxic tryhards'. Etc.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423967#Comment_3423967
They removed that some time ago for some weird reason.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423954#Comment_3423954
It was like since Nurse came out and was changed maybe a year ago for a reason I do not know. This is not to make killers "bad" or survivors having it "easy". It's about fairness. Now I don't know why the killer keeps finding me because I have no feedback anymore. Other information perks like Nowhere To Hide, BBQ, Discordance etc can be found out because they have a trigger (kicking a Gen, being far from the hook, co-op on a Gen), whereas Stridor has not. You used to hear you being louder, but they removed that from the survivor's pov. Now you could basically guess if the killer has Stridor, has Crows or is cheating until the end. And even then you would need to wait until you can say for sure.
That's why I want the feedback back. I want to know if I can go for flashy saves while being injured or not. I want to know if the killer would hear me and that I should probably heal etc...
Not to make it harder for killer or easier for survivor.
That's why I want the feedback back. I want to know if I can go for flashy saves while being injured or not. I want to know if the killer would hear me and that I should probably heal etc...
That would literally make it easier for you, by taking out the guesswork in any actions you do.
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Ah yes, because why should the Killer have perks Survivors need to ever think about?
Just give them all audio clues so Survivors are never caught off guard. Ever.
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So now Aura perks are unfair?
I'm half expecting to see 'The Killer moving with his legs is unfair!' in another month or two.
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So basically:
- Survivors whine about tunneling.
- Devs give basekit BT.
- Survivors now bodyblock off the hook, essentially FORCING Killers to tunnel them.
- Killers: We want to stop tunneling but you are bodyblocking.
- Survivors: Just hit them!
- Killers hit them.
- Survivors: Whaaa! I'm still being tunneled! Give us punishments! Give us abuseable mechanics! Remove tunneling!
Is that about how it's going right now? Because your reply to INFINITE BT TO PREVENT TUNNELING is 'Just tunnel them!'
Oh, but don't DOWN them, right? Downing them would be bad, but just HITTING them, and getting all the slowdown of a hit, is ok! Just hit them, get the slowdown & weapon wipe animation, and let them escape, or it's TUNNELING! 😮
Survivor entitlement at max; "Give us infinite BT to prevent tunneling, then hit us if we abuse it to bodyblock.'
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423800#Comment_3423800
Killers aren't owed a minimum playtime and you shouldn't have a problem with gens being completed in a game where one sides goal is to complete gens 😳 also I seriously seriously doubt killers didn't have a problem w insta gen pop bnps, they at least would now no doubt whatsoever. Also you know the devs ask for feedback right? For a reason? How exactly do you view the addition of basekit bt?
That argument is disingenuous.
If the Killer could end the entire match in 2 minutes; there would be a problem.
Whining about being removed in a game where one side's goal is to, gasp and surprise, REMOVE YOU! Is entitled.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423791#Comment_3423791
I still have to wonder if you'd be fine with old bnps being brought back based on this logic lol
Old BNPs have nothing to do with Survivors whinging about camping, tunneling, and whatever else they deem 'toxic' (IE: Whatever makes them lose).
**THE DEVS** felt BNP was overperforming and nerfed it. Not Killers.
But Survivors stomp around, invent BS rules like 'Being removed from this game where the Killer removes us is BAD!' and expect the devs to change it all to make them happy.
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@Carth said:
Was regression getting nuked, base BT, the visual terror radius, HUD updates, and recent killers lacking anti loop not them attempting to address survivor issues?
To some Survivors; No Survivors issues are addressed until they literally cannot lose. 🤷♂️
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@Yoshirama said:
I said it before and I'm gonna say it now: even if tunneling is a strategy, is not good because you're making another player not able to play the game and that's just a bad experience.
The problem with tunneling is that is not just a strategy, is a mindset. Many people says that they tunnel because they have to (even when they don't), BHVR can buff killers to make them able to fly and people will continue to tunnel just because they can. So yes, tunneling needs to stop, but genrushing too, because you can't punish one side and let the other alone
I said it before and I'm gonna say it now: even if tunneling is a strategy, is not good because you're making another player not able to play the game and that's just a bad experience.
I'll say it before and I'll say it again: Survivors are not owed a minimum play time or fun value before they can be removed.
I've also said this before and I'll say it again: If you think being removed in a PvP game where one side's goal to remove you is a flaw; You are playing the wrong game.
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@Yoshirama said:
I just saw a better solution:
Pause the BT timer if the unhooked is being chased. Many killers waits for the BT to go to hit the survivor again, also, give them a little shiled if they hit just right when hey get unhooked.
And maybe make able to use OTR even if you got hit with basekit BT, because is BS that you can't use OTR because of that
Pause the BT timer if the unhooked is being chased
No. Unhooked Survivors already bodyblock with basekit BT. This idea means the Kilelr now HAS to hit them, or be permanently bodyblocked by someone who has infinite BT until hit.
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@Fuglylol said:
The objective of a GAME should always be to be as fun as possible for everyone playing. Ofc winning is more fun than losing.
Camping/Tunneling makes the game unfun. That killers feel like they need to do that to win/have fun is a problem aswell. It creates a toxic environment and ultimately hurts the game and playerbase. Gen rushing shouldnt be rewarded, neither should camping/tunneling be rewarded.
If Counter Strike was balanced in a way that the best way to win was to camp in spawn, people would do it. But it wouldnt be fun and people would stop playing. If the best way to kill a boss in WoW was to play 20 priest healer, people would do it but nobody (except priests) would like it. You cant blame players for it, its on the devs. If the issue of toxicity doesnt get fixed, DBD will die the moment a better game will get released.
So one issue that needs solving is that killers cant camp. Easiest fix would be that the hooked sv stops progressing if the killer is nearby without being in a chase or something similar. Also gen rushing needs a fix, preventing that is a bit harder. Make it so that survivors get rewarded for completing other objectives/looping by balancing the game in a way, that gens can only be done effectively after completing other objectives. Fixing the game shouldnt be an us vs them issue, like it currently so often is (as you can see in every thread here)
So one issue that needs solving is that killers cant camp. Easiest fix would be that the hooked sv stops progressing if the killer is nearby without being in a chase or something similar.
This has been suggested for literal years and ways Survivors could still abuse it have also been pointed out for literal years.
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@SuperMunchkin95 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423493#Comment_3423493
OK I see that logic now, but the BT lasts for about 8 seconds, so if you just stand there the survivors will get the message and run.
That's still 8 seconds in which they are preventing the killer from changing targets. You know; the thing Survivors already whine the Killer never does.
Plus they are STILL able to bodyblock because they know the Killer will be Hindered if he hits them after those 8 seconds.
It's just another mechanic that Survivors can weaponize. People need to stop looking for punishments.
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They do physically lunge further in their animation.
Survivors used to whine that Freddy had a longer lunge than everyone else because he had to move more to cover the same 5 foot lunge, unlike someone like Trapper.
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BT should just make the unhooked Survivor lose his hitbox for the duration/until he does any channeled actions (Healing, self-healing, doing a gen, doing a totem, saboing a hook/trapper trap/removing a Hag trap, opening a chest, etc.)
No being hit. No blocking the Killer. No progressing objectives unless you want to lose the protection.
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@SuperMunchkin95 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423483#Comment_3423483
I didn't say that specifically, but I said when the killer chooses to go for the survivor, (the unhooked survivor) nothing happens until he hits him which then the killer would get the Hindered. I'm going to re-edit to say that.
And how does that interact with BT?
With BT: Survivor can now bodyblock, and if he's hit, he gets BT AND the Killer is Hindered for half a minute.
That's broken and ripe for abuse.
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@SuperMunchkin95 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423474#Comment_3423474
Well I said when he hit the survivor with BT, so no survivor could bodyblock with BT
Your post does not mention BT at all.
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@SuperMunchkin95 said:
I think we all can agree this is our biggest problem, but some people think it could be solved by altering the perks until something works. For right now, perks are just fine except one or two. My idea for this is:
The killer hooks a Survivor... When the survivor is unhooked, If he chooses to go for him, nothing happens until he hits them. The killer will suffer from the Hindered status effect for about 30-35 seconds.
Now I understand that it handles a bit with tunneling, but there'a another Idea with Hindered...
The killer is camping a survivor on the hook, you manage to unhook the survivor, since the killer was in a certain range for a certain time, he'll suffer the hindered for about 30 seconds.
I think we all can agree this is our biggest problem
No. Some Survivors salty that they died agree it's a problem.
If he chooses to go for him, nothing happens until he hits them. The killer will suffer from the Hindered status effect for about 30-35 seconds.
ROFL! I mean R O F L! Great! So now the unhooked can bodyblock with BT and, if I hit them, I slowed down for half a minute!?
And you saw NO WAY in which this would be broken, busted, abused, and downright used as a weapon?
The killer is camping a survivor on the hook, you manage to unhook the survivor, since the killer was in a certain range for a certain time, he'll suffer the hindered for about 30 seconds.
Oh good. SO a Survivor can run up, farm an unhook, and now the Killer is punished.
All because Survivors insist camping should be 'punished' with mechanics they can abuse maliciously for EZ wins.
No. No. and No.
Did I mention 'no'?
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423396#Comment_3423396
I don't really think camping should be straight up removed just bc that just doesn't make much sense. I just think it shouldn't be as effective as it currently is/can be, for example with bubba or stbfl or deadlock etc.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423435#Comment_3423435
I'm fine with that but it should always have counterplay, but with again bubba as an example, it just doesn't
The counterplay is leaving.
Survivors don't get unhooks just because they think there should always be a way to save their friends. 🤷♂️
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423211#Comment_3423211
Completing a single generator doesn't remove a player from the game. They're not really the same.
Completing a single generator doesn't remove a player from the game.
Then don't play a game where your opponents goal is to remove you from the game.
This is such a BS excuse. People keep acting like Survivors deserve [x] amount of play time before they can be removed, or else changes are needed to force that to happen.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423354#Comment_3423354
If you think camping being viable is healthy for the game then yeah strange af take good for u and ur just wrong it's not even a conversation lmao, but we got it u don't want kills to take actual effort
If you think punishing camping is healthy for the game then strange take since the devs have said otherwise. But good for you, but you're just wrong and it's not even a conversation.
But we get it; you don't want the Killer to win.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423341#Comment_3423341
Nobody would have a problem w that if the meta tactic was actually fun or interesting. It's not about the killers that try to win it's about the devs not nerfing tunneling
Nobody would have a problem w that if the meta tactic was actually fun or interesting.
A lie. Survivors would whine regardless.
It's not about the killers that try to win it's about the devs not nerfing tunneling
Meaning it's about Killers winning in ways Survivors hate, and Survivors being entitled enough to think they can dictate what their opponent does.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423342#Comment_3423342
Go ahead and put words in my mouth I really do not care lol, camping not being viable would indeed be healthy for the game whether u like it or not 👍
By which you mean 'Healthy for Survivors winning more'. 👍️
Look at all that not developing DBD you've done; You don't get to decide what's 'healthy'. I've also noticed whiny Survivors always claim punching Killers in the crotch with massive nerfs is 'healthy for the game':
- Removing Killers they hate.
- Removing perks they hate.
- Removing/Punishing camping.
- Removing/Punishing tunneling.
- Removing/Punishing slugging.
All these, somehow, are 'healthy for the game'. Almost as if your average Survivor main has 0 clue how game balance & game design work, and simply want easier wins.
As long as Survivors can focus gens from 0-100%, Killers can focus kills. Deal with it.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423339#Comment_3423339
Because it's a lazy boring strat? Accept that the game wouldn't reward laziness if it was good, but it's like some of y'all don't want the game to be good 😛
What you really mean is that you died and want to limit how the Killer wins while hiding that behind a smokescreen of 'The health of the game'.
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No.
Accept that the Killer gets to try winning as hard as Survivors, or stop playing.
Tired of Survivors pitching temper tantrums and demanding Killers get punished for winning.
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@1ettuce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3423046#Comment_3423046
Why the hell should camping instead be rewarded?
Why the hell should camping be punished?
Accept that the Killer is trying to win as much as the Survivors. You don't get to decide how or when. End of story.
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@mizark3 said:
I'd give you 3/week tops (and even 3 is pushing it). Also it would need to show the count ingame when you go to leave match and above the button. Any more than that and it would run the risk of spilling over from avoiding the worst of what people hate to avoiding minor inconveniences.
I still think a Killer ban system would solve more of the problem (Barring the newest released Killer within half a chapter). With Killers being able to ban realms (Barring the newest released map also within half a chapter, and map offerings [although an argument for removing map offerings could be made as well]).
Hopefully by allowing theoretical 'free DCs' or Killer bans, they would recognize certain Killers are banned or 'dodged' at a greater rate, and fix whatever reason people wouldn't want to play against them. For example I hate when an Oni/Myers (and to a lesser extent Plague) charges up their power from your team, then pops their power on you. It feels so unearned, as you didn't colossally fail to give them their power. The occasional feedback surveys could ask the reasons for the chart toppers for bans/DCs.
So basically, you think Survivors blocking Killers they are too lazy to learn to play against should be a basis for balancing those Killers?
Yeah. No. Horrid reasoning to balance Killers.
And if you want Killer bans; I want to ban certain Survivor perks. Fair is fair; you want to take away my ability to use certain powers, I want to take away yours.
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Or accept that sometimes the Killer has to camp, and he decides when to do so?
Plus people have pointed out why it could be abused by Killers. Not to mention Survivors could run the Killer, force a hook change, then a teammate gets a free unhook.
So tired of these 'Punish Killers for doing something I don't personally approve of' threads. Accept that your opponent is trying to win as much as you are.
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@AMOLUDUS said:
you two probably play primarily assassins , here you come here with dissuasive pretensions ... if you played survivors you would know how frustrating it is to play DBD with randoms , and would support the idea that create a better system for those who leave in the middle of the game .
Congrats on being wrong; I play Survivor as well.
I'm just real enough to know that giving people DC credits would be abused to hell and back.
Source: People DCing on the hook for any one of a billion self-serving excuses. Now imagine they could ragequit anywhere if they had a free DC.
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@killeriseasy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3422717#Comment_3422717
Current dbd is currently getting easier to quit so I probably will. Good luck finding matches
K bye.
Imagine quitting a game because you can't choose your opponent. Do you also quit fighting games because you can't tell your opponent whom to pick? Or a shooter because you can't decide what guns the enemy team uses?
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@Senaxu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3422731#Comment_3422731
So you think it would be easier for the developers to replace a player who had a DC with a bot and if this player should then be interested in returning to the game, replace the created bot in order to actively participate in the game again..
.. THAN ..
..the distinction whether the DC'd player had previously pressed the "Leave Match" button?
Of course that would be amazing :D
Because players can easily DC without pressing 'leave match':
- Alt+F4
- Ctrl-Alt-Delete & close the game.
- Shut down their console/PC
- Pull the ethernet cable out.
- Unplug the modem
- Turn off their wireless card.
All ways to DC without pressing 'leave match' and all quite impossible to track other than 'player left'.
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@killeriseasy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3422636#Comment_3422636
It's simply the fact that I waste 15+ mins of my time playing against a killer that I suck against and isn't the least bit fun.
So? Either accept that you will get matched with Killers you don't like, or don't play.
Why should mains of those Killers get inflated queue times by allowing half the player base to block them? This is an incredibly selfish idea. 'I don't like Nurse, so Nurse players should get completely shafted by queue times to make me happy!'
And, of course, you turn around and say 'Killers blocking Survivors perks ain't the same'. So...selfish AND entitled; Survivors can block entire Killers, but Killers get...nothing. Because they're NPCs that have no right to have a fun game.
Fun games are a Survivor-only perk. Killer players exist for Survivor entertainment. That's all horrible ideas like this really say.
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How about 'no'?
It's already shown that giving players any way to DC WILL be abused as much as possible; just look at how many Survivors Hook-DC for literally any self-absorbed excuse they can make, with the incredibly selfish 'WhY sHoUlD i StAy If I aM nOt HaViNg FuN!?'
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Ah yes. We need to punish Killers for winning in ways Survivors don't like.
Of course, no one likes to lose, so first it will be 'punish hook camping'. Then 'punish slugging.' Then 'punish tunneling'. Then 'Punish the Killer for even trying to win'. Then 'You know what? Just don't let the Killer win. Survivors consider Killer players NPCs.'
The Killer deserves to secure wins, and 'But, but, but, but a PLAYER is REMOVED from the game!' is not a valid excuse to force the Killer to play sub-optimally. Don't play a PvP game if you can't handle being removed form the match when you lose.
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@WorthlessBeing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3422008#Comment_3422008
Actually the number of flashbangs and mines alone makes it worthwhile. That and the look of the survivor who doesn't understand what's happening. Priceless.
I love running Lightborn, seeing a SWF queue in with flashlights, and then all hook-ragequit when they can't bully me.
Hook-DCing needs to go. These toxic scrubs need to be forced to stay on that hook for 2 minutes, since they were trying to bully the Killer and their plan backfired.
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3420420#Comment_3420420
do the devs need video evidence of no one wanting to play against SM?
If the population would 'shrink' because Survivors can't ragequit on the hook while dodging the DC penalty; nothing of value would be lost.
After all; they don't finish games anyways.
So remove hook-DCs and let the toxic quitters leave. Win-Win. 🤷♂️
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Yeah, going to go with 'No'.
That thing would look so out of place and goofy.
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I love how some of the Survivor excuses to nerf a perk is 'unearned' or 'No skill'.
- Iron Maiden gives 'unearned' downs.
- NoED gives 'unearned' downs.
- Any Killer they dislike 'takes no skill'.
- Etc.
It's like some Survivors actually think they get to dictate what counts a skill for their opponent, and then want changes based on their subjective viewpoint.
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@Yippiekiyah said:
BNP rework idea- If a survivor attaches a bnp to a generator that generator can never regress beyond 50% progress.
No way. 4 BNPs = 4 gens that never drop below 50%.
Broken AF.
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@Dogma_loki said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3420273#Comment_3420273
Yes because forcing people to play a game they dont want to be in is a great decision.
Don't play if you can't handle being in a game where you don't want to play. 🤷♂️
Not a hard concept to understand.
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@Cataclysimz said:
It's almost as if BHVR really ######### need to address this
They did; They're not taking away Killer player agency just because some Survivors have decided they can dictate how and when Killers try to win.
Don't know how else to say it. 🤷♂️