Krazzik
Krazzik
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If someone refuses to even -try- against new SM, who isn't nearly as strong at 3-genning as she used to be, then these people simply shouldn't be playing DBD really. You queue up knowing you may well end up against any killer.
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I'll submit an in-game report when I think it's warranted but since I don't record my gameplay and can't be bothered to jump through hoops submitting a ticket on their webite, I know my reports against hackers are unlikely to have any action taken.
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@BasementKing said:
I enjoy playing against the Twins, but because it's a relatively weak killer, people are forced to play 'dirty.' That's why some disconnect, especially newcomers
Twins is a pretty high tier killer, especially with boons being at an all-time low.
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I don't think so. It's hard to say because they're the least-played killer so they're really rare, but when I do playing Twins I don't notice loads of DCs.
Literally the ONLY killer I notice more DCs from is Skull Merchant. Even the other unpopular killers don't really get DCed against much more than usual.
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I think it's pretty unlikely for most killers to ever reach 8 events on a single gen even with multiple gen perks.
I will say though that Jolt seems to be by far the most impacted perk by this change. Jolt is built around dealing less gen regression but on multiple gens, so is punished much more harshly with the limit, and I think for killers who run Jolt, especially on smaller maps, they very well could hit the limit much more realistically.
That said, if they're getting a bunch of downs and hitting multiple gens with Jolt multiple times, they're probably doing pretty good that game :p
(PS I know it's Surge now)
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I can't understand people who have this extremist opinion that BHVR doesn't care about survivors at all, it makes no sense.
Not only does it make zero business sense for them to have this opinion, since survivor players should make about 80% of their customers, but they've added a bunch of things over time to help make survivor feel better to play.
Basekit BT was added with 10% Haste thrown in, and shortly afterwards buffed to 10 seconds. This made it so you werent basically forced to always run BT and so actually had another perk slot you could use for something else. Also removed the awful feeling of being insta-downed the moment you were unhooked if the survivor wasn't running it.
They added the Survivor HUD which, while far from perfect, added a LOT of basekit information for solo queue survivors especially. Now you can tell whenever anyone is in chase, whenever someone is doing a totem (which if NoED or Devour is in play can be big), and you can know if someone is on gens and thus NOT going for unhook. You even get to know progress of gens that people are on, so know exactly when one will pop. They could still add more info to it but compared to before it's HUGE.
The Anti-Facecamp Mechanic. While it doesn't address proxy camping and tunneling like some people somehow thought it would, it DOES combat full-on facecamping. Facecamping wasn't overly common, but when it did happen it could make the game just feel boring and miserable for everyone involved, and now the killer basically can't do it before endgame. There are ways to play around it, but all of these methods give survivors more opportunity to make a save than before.
Numerous balance changes like essentially removing exposed perks for Nurse, finally nerfing Blight's addons, severely nerfing gen kick perks so not every killer was just kicking gens all game, and various other nerfs to killer perks and addons.
How you can look at all of these things and say that BHVR doesn't care at all about survivors, it just doesn't make sense. Many of these things are getting old now but some are incredibly recent, so it's clear they are STILL doing things to help survivors, especially solo survivors.
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Man Door Hand Hook Car Door
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I don't really know the details but I think you need to buff her ambush somehow so that it's actually usable most of the time even without addons, and weaken her traps slightly.
As it stands her default ambush is only useful around short loops and maybe medium loops if you bring addons for it. And even then, the moment survivor see what you're doing they usually just run to another tile. It's just so weak and it's the obvious choice to receive a big buff. Heck even just adding a couple of her ambush addons basekit so it's usable around more loops in the game would help a bit, but I do think it needs more than that so survivors can't just run away the moment they see you crouch.
Her traps are... rather problematic, especially with Tampered Timer + a gear addon. Even after the nerf a while ago it can still put survivors in a no-win situation if a gen pops while they're on hook and they end up having to search 4 boxes. Literally just getting interupted a single time can give them no chance to get the trap off, and that's just not fair. They can play 'perfectly' and still get a head-pop.
This isn't -too- much of a problem now, mainly because Pig is so weak outside of her traps and so she isn't played much. If she became a lot stronger with other buffs and got picked more though, I think the issues her traps can cause would need to be ironed out.
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@alaenyia said:
I do not run either of these perks but have seen them used occasionally. Not even regularly. But the argument that this is too strong with a 4man SWF is pretty much automatically invalid considering it has been stated multiple times by DbD that the prevalence of 4man SWF is well under 10% of matches. So the majority of the people you play against are solo or maybe 2man.
This perk has immediate drawbacks for the survivors in that now you have 2 injured people and if they take a hit they have to mend, so this is not some walk-in-the-park "get outta slug" free card. This levels the field a bit considering things like Iron Will were nerfed into uselessness a long time ago.
Camp/Tunnel/Slug players are not employing a strategy, they are lazy and don't want to bother gaining game knowledge and actual strategies. My preferred killers are Trapper/Myers/Doctor, so nothing meta or top tier, but have absolutely no problem finding and hooking survivors w/o C/T/S because I just know where they are likely to be from years of gameplay.
Players who don't employ cheap tactics will be more successful overall against this perk combo.
FTP + BU is just as strong against killers who don't tunnel, so that's not really a good arguement. A killer can play 'nicely' and still get screwed over by the combo, despite making no mistakes.
That's the biggest issue with this combo, there's not much the killer can do to play around it, and it puts the killer in a lose-lose situation through no fault of their own. They can down a survivor and then have that chase invalidated before they can even recover from their attack animation. Unlike a flashie save that can be played around, if a second survivor is nearby with these two perks, they can just run in and use them the moment the killer gets the down. What is the killer supposed to do to prevent this happening?
After the survivor is insta-picked up, both survivors now have endurance so the killer can't even hit them without giving them a speed boost and a chance to reach a pallet or window. The chase that they had won is now extended for a bunch more time, and even though it required another survivor to be off gens, the two survivors still doing gens now have a bunch more time to do them before they even have to worry about unhooking anyone.
The only arguement I've seen that this combo is in anyway fair is "Well killers tunnel" and that just doesn't work because like I said at first, this combo is equally as devastating to killers who are playing fair. If somehow this combo ONLY worked against a tunnelling killer, then it would be fine, but it doesn't.
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"So many killers have insta down mechanics that I think and insta up is a fair trade"
Most killers don't have insta-down mechanics. The killers that have exposed baked into their kit are mostly lower and mid-tier killers (Myers, Ghostface, Bubba and Billy). Oni is the only high-tier killer with baked-in exposed and I personally rarely go against any of the killers I've listed so far, the most popular killers don't have it.
The only exposed addon that's that popular is Clown's Pinky Finger addon, which has been nerfed twice and I think should just be reworked, and the only popular exposed perk is NoED, which only works at endgame.
All the popular killers and even most of the unpopular killers don't have insta-downs and don't run insta-downs.
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If you play like that as survivor you're severely reducing your chance to escape.
You can play selfishly toward the end of the game but you need your teammates to stay alive as long as possible so gens get done. If you refuse to unhook people, suicide on hook and you let yourself get downed in 2 seconds in chase then gens aren't getting done and you aren't gonna escape through the gates.
It's... probably not bannable, since you can argue that you're trying to win, albeit in a weird, inefficient way, but it could also be argued you're intentionally throwing and thus it -could- be bannable.
Regardless, you -know- full well that you're screwing over your teammates and that you're gonna lose most of your matches so you're certainly not being a good player.
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It's a cool perk but it isn't OP or anything. I haven't noticed it being -that- popular but if does end up with an overwhelming pick rate I guess it'll get nerfed.
It's only a 5% gen speed buff and you're not always gonna be taking advantage of it anyhow.
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Cute like hot or cute like adorable?
Hottest to me is probably Vittorio and Jake.
Adorable? Eeeeh Dweet and Yoichi.
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To be fair the vast majority of my killer games where I end up against p100s are absolutely miserable because they're far better than I am. Perhaps I frequently get back filled into high MMR lobbies but whatever the reason is, I'm sorry to say I will usually dodge them too. No point going into a game I know it's gonna suck when I play DBD for fun.
People on these forums seem to think it's perfectly valid to just nope outta Skull Merchant games so why is lobby dodging the issue?
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627899#Comment_3627899
Different times? Different parts of the world of Dvarka? Maybe the crashing of Ripley's ship killed all nearby plantlife.
Maybe, but I'm firmly of the opinion it was a mistake but the devs just kinda went along with it.
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Yeah it's pretty BUSted 😙
But yeah it could do with a slight nerf or just getting replaced altogether.
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To be fair I don't think those two maps should be from the same realm anyhow, they're nothing alike aside from "sci-fi map".
Why is a completely barren wasteland like Nostromo Wreckage in a 'Deepwood'?
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Silent Hill, it's the only licence in DBD I really care about so I wouldn't mind another chapter. Harry Mason would make a cool survivor, and for killer... I dunno, Alessa I guess, though she's not technically evil. Maybe Walter?
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A lot of survivors think that getting the last gen done = win. So if the killer ends up securing a kill they otherwise wouldn't have thanks to NoED, they feel like it's undeserved.
This is ignoring the fact that the killer is one perk down for 90% of the match, or that Adren doesn't have as bad a rep despite being pretty comparable.
I figured survivors would prefer to go against a strong endgame perk that if you die to you still got to play the match, as opposed to really strong perks that can help you kill someone at 4 or 5 gens left.
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It's nice that you're trying to be a 'fun' killer, I used to be like that too, but everyone who plays killer long enough eventually goes through 'the change'. It'll happen to you.
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@[Deleted User] said:
isnt kick buffed to 5% and not 2,5% ?
Yes. But a regression event only needs 2.5% or higher. I thiiink the only thing that actually deals 2.5% regression now is when Knight's guards kick a gen?
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Bodyblocking is annoying as killer, sure, but it's literally a part of the game and one of the things survivors can do to thwart the killer. Onryo in particular is a killer who can completely avoid bodyblocking with her demanifest so it's a bit weird they complained.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623642#Comment_3623642
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623651#Comment_3623651
But there is a big difference between "any means" and "special attacks". Like it is written right now the obsession being hurt by a bear trap would take 2 tokens from STBFL, the same if he gets infected indirectly by the Plague, etc. In other words, even if you try to completely avoid the Obsession if for some reason they get hurt indirectly, you are still punished (maybe even when hurt by his own perks like FTP, but not sure about this one).
So I think that part should be changed, to avoid unwanted situations.
Yeah bear traps was the first thing I thought of. Like I said before I can't see STBFL being used that much after this nerf. The 1% nerf per stack was enough to be honest, though I'd argue the perk didn't really need a nerf in the first place since it's mainly a strong perk on weaker killers. Now many weak killers lose one of their best perks.
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I sorta hoped it was an original character as it feels like ages since we had one. Last three releases were all licenced. Then again the latest two original chapters were pretty dire so I dunno.
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He's still gonna be a top-tier killer, might even remain #2.
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Peanits mentioned in another thread that a survivor missing a skill check doesn't count as a regression event, so they can keep screwing up and losing progress.
As far as overcharge and I'm guessing any gen-kick perks, I'd assume they're dead-perks once you hit you limit on a gen. However this should be pretty rare in most normal games.
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Most of the changes look good, though Quick Gambit will still be garbage, I don't think the devs realise why it's such a bad perk, and REDUCING the paltry gen speed boost just to make it slightly easier to proc isn't gonna help. You still don't want to take the chase anywhere near gens being repaired since the killer can just leave you and head to the gen anytime.
Ruin is also.... eh... like it's technically a buff and with the changes to 'regression events', Ruin will be even better because it doesn't cause them, but 100% regression is still just a bit too low to ever want to run a hex. 200% and making it auto-cleanse after a kill would have been better.
As far as the 3-gen solution goes, it's pretty good as it should ONLY affect actual 3-genning as you should rarely ever reach 8 regression events on any single gen even with multiple gen regression perks. It does, however, mean that survivor-caused 3-gens will be harder to defend, and thus survivors don't really have to care if they 3-gen themselves since they can just play it slow and burn all the killer's kicks.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623563#Comment_3623563
We do have a question on that though: does the survivors missing the skill check from oppression count as its part of the perk (similar to huntress lullaby as that adds bonus regression to missed checks)
Peanits mentioned earlier that a survivor missing a skill check ISN'T counted as a regression event, so 'difficult skillcheck builds' are unaffected.
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To be fair the Shadowborn Haste change isn't too bad as it requires the survivors to blind the killer. If the survivors don't like the extra Haste they can just not blind the killer.
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Even with the new changes to kicking gens I don't think it's a good idea to bring old SM back, she had huge issues and those issues would still exist now.
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From the sounds of it she's pretty much back to how she used to be, only with hooking now 'locking in' condemned, which is a pretty cool change. We'll have to see if it's enough to keep condemned actually relevant though.
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With the current stated nerfs I don't think the perk will see much widespread use so I doubt it'll need any more tweaks.
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I mean they fixed one of those, m2ing the obsession now loses 2 stacks.
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Dead Hard, Decisive Strike, Adren, Off the Record, FTP+BU
Those are all I can think of off the top of my head.
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If you hate so many of the killers why are you even playing DBD? You're very likely gonna end up against someone you don't like.
And calling Dredge and Wraith sweat? What?
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Billy, Bubba, Blight and Oni are the killers I never play.
Steve, Nancy and Ash are the survivors I never play.
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DBD is definitely the worst I've seen out of the games I've played. As has been said there's not really any serious punishment for being toxic in chat so people feel like they can say whatever.
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I've gotten accussed multiple times of hacking for using Nurse's Calling and lunging around corners at people healing.
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@Steakdabait said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622398#Comment_3622398
It's not. Her entire kit on a fundamental level corrosive to the gameplay of dbd. She should be a clear example of what not to do with killers in the future for bhvr. Extreme area denial is flatly unhealthy for the game that dbd is and simply shouldn't be directly encouraged in a killer's design
It's area denial that's easy to counter when not in chase though.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622117#Comment_3622117
Thus far this is my experience. I'm waiting to go up against a 3-gen merchant, but still haven't seen one... or if I did, me and my team weren't good enough to make it to the 3-gen, my escape rate feels about the same as any other killer.
Thing is I like playing Skull Merchant, I don't tunnel or camp, and I try to hold a reasonable set of gens. I may give up on a couple, bit I'm always patrolling looking for gens. My experience on her is a lot of people just don't even really try.
I've let so many players escape because 2 or even 3 of their teammates just decided to go AFK immediately and/or not bother playing. Like when playing Bubba, sometimes it's really annoying getting tarred with the same brush. 😒
I've even left a Dwight slugged for 3 minutes for blatantly throwing his team who were trying under the bus and trying to get me to hook him. When he realised I wasn't being a Chess Merchant and wasn't gonna let him get out for free, he actually started playing again.
Pretty much. I think a lot of it is 'PTSD' from before her rework. A lot of survivors either don't know she got reworked or can't be bothered to learn how she works after her rework, they're used to giving up against the old Chess Merchant and they continue to do it even though she's worse at holding a 3-gen now.
For the record I'm not saying she's perfect and she does still have some issues with her kit that could be ironed out to make her more engaging to play against, but as far as 3-genning is concerned I really think there are multiple other killers who are just as good at holding a 3-gen who no one complains about.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622135#Comment_3622135
Yea stealth is very strong against avg solo queue player why "weak" killers have such high winrates. If cleansing it at 5 gens is the difference between you dying super early then go for it.
I totally understand that at high MMR you're not gonna have enough time for everyone to spend time looking for and cleansing their Plaything and THEN going back to cleanse the Penti on top of that, and players at that level are gonna be better equipped to handle the oblivious.
I just know that I'd rather waste some time doing a couple hexes and then focus on gens, rather than getting grabbed or going down in chase in 2 seconds and dying.
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@Chomperka said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622089#Comment_3622089
what? for what? They get no bloodpoints. OF COURSE there are trolls, but if you are gaining nothing from it, number of people stealthing will reduce drastically. As i said im just proposing a existing problem of hatch mechanic, which is toxic, and makes people to just stealth, abandom their teammates, or slug in case of a killer.
I mean they don't get much bp even if they start doing gens and immediatly get found and killed. Like if there's no hope of actually completing the gens, many players wont do the gens, they'll just hide. That seems pretty obvious, it's suicide if they actually do the gens.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622123#Comment_3622123
- Work on gens that have good sightlines
- Listen for killer audio queues
- Use icons which can generally tell you if the killer is an active threat
- SWF and completely ignore the effect
I would gladly trade a hook stage if it means the killer spent 2 perk slots to inconvenience me if I'm not paying attention. The quicker you do gens the less you need to worry about him getting value from obliviousness. It's a net benefit for the killer if you cleanse plaything.
I guess we'll just agree to disagree. I think most players aren't good enough to deal with being Oblivious all game, myself included, and that it's just way better to deal with it. I'm glad you're skilled enough that it isn't a problem though, I get grabbed pretty often when I can't hear the killer coming.
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SWFs would just still use Discord and could still chat map-wide, it wouldn't weaken them at all. They wouldn't start using the much weaker ingame chat. What?
Also I'm fairly confident that most solo queue players would always have it turned off so it wouldn't do a huge amount to help them.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622118#Comment_3622118
Giving the killer the occasional free hit is always preferable to map wide 30% repair debuff and possibly even the other effects. If it's a totem inside their gen setup or easily checked the game is probably going south extremely fast. You have to search around the map for up to 30+ seconds, spend 14 seconds cleansing, then give the killer a 30% debuff to all survs while you just spent all that time accomplishing very little.
I'd still say for most survivors they should cleanse it, then just keep an eye out for Penti and if it shows up they can head back and cleanse it again if they have time. Giving the killer constant easy hits and even the occasional gen-grab can be much worse, especially if it's a killer like Legion or Plague where giving them one easy-hit can be a down.
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I don't even use all three so it's no biggie for me but sure, doesn't effect me at all.
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I can't see them ever adding a full-on spider killer due to how many people are terrified of them, but a Drider-like killer maybe could work.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622098#Comment_3622098
Plaything pent only works because avg survivor has 0 awareness and cleanse it punishing their own team while wasting time
To be fair it takes a really good survivor to deal with perma-oblivious. Most survivors can't deal with it and should cleanse it.
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@Nick said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622113#Comment_3622113
I keep seeing people who say this. But did you play against any 3-gen skullmerchants after the rework? It's legit exactly the same. You get injured so easily, so the 'exposed' part is the same, she is fast, you are slow. She can just play the same 3-gen strategy like before
I just can't see how she's any better at holding a 3-gen than a Knight or a Doctor.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622103#Comment_3622103
Only a pro team has the mental fortitude to play out a match effectively against a 3 gen skull merchant though. The counterplay is just unexciting and requires you to play the long game widdling down her gens while taking very little risk once she goes towards her gens.
Her 3-gen capabilities were weakened during her rework. Currently she isn't really much better at 3-genning than other killers, since her drones don't work on people doing gens.