Gwinty
Gwinty
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Blast Mine is fine.
The thing is like with the new Flashbang people are not used to use it. It will take a bit of time for them to figure out the best way to make the perk work.
However I see good potential here. Especialy in the late game and with a 3 gen. That blast mine can make it difficule for a Killer: Kick the Gen with Pop and risk a Blast Mine or chase the survivor and risk loosing the gen.
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I think you left out some points of the game.
First of all there is not only the chase. You can also play hide-and-seek with the Killer and that can be exciting too. Sure this does not fit everybodys tast but there are more than enough people who like this playstyle and have fun with it.
The thing about Deathslinger and Trickster is that survivors always try to play the same way against them as they would against a normal M1 Killer. Trickster especialy has more than enough meaningful counterplay, however you need to think ahead. Just mindlessly running to the next loop without thinking about hiding will get you killed and will make Trickster look oppressive.
Same for Deathslinger: Slinger takes skill to aim and shot. Maybe his projectile could be a bit slower to make room for more juking, but he is by no means more unbeatable than any other Killer. Same for Twins who can be outplayed quiet nicely with jukes and kicks to Victor. Also you can take Vici away from Charlotte to counter her as she is a simple M1 killer without him.
Some of those issues are caused by survivors not trying to outplay the Killers in a different way and just expecting to use their usual tactics against them. Then when that tactic fails they blame the Killers power to be too overpowered without looking if a different approach could have saved them.
This is not saying that there could not be some more impications fo counterplay for some Killers or some tweaks.
Funny enough I agree with your conclusion. Blight is a work of art and they should make more Killers like him.
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Oh boy, here we go again telling Killers to play the NPC in the game...
While I do agree that Killers should not camp and tunnel, I do not think you adress this the right way. Offering a cake does not mean that the Killer has to play the way you like it. You are not "paying" them to play nice with a cake.
I do agree that Killers should use the opportunity to farm. I do so myself by taking BBQ and hunting as many hooks as possible. But you should consider that some people do not want to farm but rather want to play a normal game. Now for me there is no difference as I start to look at my points more and more when comparing my performance as a Killer...
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@TwitchyMike said:
I honestly hate this map. It was better when it was dark. Why would anyone want a map during daytime? It just doesn't fit the theme of this game at all. Either put it back to the way it was or delete it.
Well, let me answere your question even thou it was rhetorical.
I want a daytime map because "horror" is not just "something dark" for me. A bright map can also be scary and with the corn, the house and the slaughterhouse they made the right move. I think the map is decent as getting hunted by Hillbilly or Bubba through the corn feels just right. Light gives you a false hope while there is still no escape. Also Myers and Ghostface fit well here when they stalk you through the Corn.
Maybe some fixes to scrachmarks or auras would do it well but aside from that I like that map.
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Overrated: Freddy. Sure he has map mobility and he is not a bad Killer. But over all he is not that big of a deal anymore and people who still complain about him give him way to much credit.
Underrated: Nemesis. I think he is not as bad as people make him. Give the players time to learn him and adjust to him. I think he will do better than we expect.
Even: Blight. With the right field of vision blight is now in a very good spot and I do not think there are many people who still think he is weak.
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While I understand your complain you need to think about it in a different way:
Cleansing all Totems is a side objective. Like in any game you get a reward for that side objective and that is the "happy ending" to the story. If you do not complete the side objective you get the "neutral ending" to the story which is one more death for the team.
Maybe this should be empathised more or become a bigger thing in the game. And yes maybe some balance changes to NOED would be nice. But over all I think it is a decent perk that has meaningful counterplay (as all hexes) and enforces a longer game. As such it counters pure genrushing.
However we can talk about the fact that the Killer should get bigger motivation to work against this, to protect his totems.
Maybe make it like this: NOED activates once the last generator is completed. Once this happens the perk gets stack equal to the number of remaining totems. Each time the Killer downs a survivor one stack of NOED is lost. Once all stacks are depleted NOED breaks.
This would reward totem cleansing, encourage the Killer to protect totems (Thrill of the Hunt comes to mind) and still retain NOEDs thread level.
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@calem said:
I have encountered far too many boring games since the event started than I ever did before. So many killers are tunnelling and face-camping, and so many survivors are bringing Prove Thyself/BNPs and keys. And for some reason these people do these things in games with 4 or 5 event cakes.
From the survivor side I have experienced either me or my friends getting tunnelled and camped off hook, a huge amount of Wraith players who are using silent bell + indoor map offerings, Nurses with Infectious who slug the entire team with 4 or 5 gens left, and Bubbas with Insidious who camp their first hook in the basement.
And then when I have tried to play killer, many games have ended within 5 minutes because of Prove Thyself, BNPs, keys, and just general gen-rushing strategies. Not to mention the surprising amount of Haddonfield offerings.
Just curious as to how many people on here have been having terrible games like I have since the event started, and why people could possibly want to play so boring (for both sides) when each game gets 300-500% extra bloodpoints?
Funny, for me it is the opposide.
Yes I have a mixed bag of opponents and I had keys and other questionable stuff. But so far I had descent matches with good players, mostly writing "gg" and then leaving, only waiting at the gate for a quick hit out. Sure, some people pushed gens hard and some where very good with their flashlight, but that was just the game.
As a survivor I had descent Killers who did not camp or tunnel. No complains so far.
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@Piruluk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2327450#Comment_2327450
You can get the stronger ones latter anyway.
I do not think so. It depends on how weak the "weak link" is. You as a killer take the risk not being able to fully stack BBQ by doing this as gens can fly by if your "weak link" is not weak enough, has Deceisive Strike or teammate protecting them.
However if the weak link is too weak...well...weaklings die, big deal.
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@KerJuice said:
That’s noble of you. I do my best to keep count. It only gets tricky when survivors wear the same clothing. Then I try to pay attention to the gamer tags.
Well, you go one step further than I do.
While I do like to hook everybody at least once befor I go for the second and third hook, I never look at the gamer tag. If I find a lobby with 4 Claudettes in full prestige then I will just hunt whoever gets in my way. This is on the survivors in my opinion.
Still noble from you that you make the effort, I could not do it.
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What do you mean by "Derp-palming Ghostface" thou? Never heard that term.
I play Ghostface quiet a lot and the only offensive thing I do is tbagging back at the survivor. You know the usual: We stand at the pallet, the survivor tbaggs and I tbag back at them and things like that.
And isn't the whole thing about Huntress that you can make a YouTube compilation about her hitting sick trickshots across the map? That is literaly complaining about a Killer playing a Killer.
Cheating and teaming up with the Killer is reportable and you should do that. Get the evidence and report the cheater. No mercy on them.
The problem with the post is that while the complain is valid (respect other players). Most of your examples strike me as whining about Killers having fun without even disrespecting a survivor. Like, how is a trickshot a disrespect? And I do not even like Huntress, I hate playing against her.
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I had the best games in a long time since the event started.
Desecent survivors, no bad manner even thou they stomped me and I still get bloodpoints. Also no camping, no tunneling on the Killer side. Has been fun so far.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2324903#Comment_2324903
Care to list said counters? And if you're so confident Scott Jund is always up for the challenge if you truly want to prove us all wrong.
@DelsKibara said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2324660#Comment_2324660
Not to say your argument has no merits.
But Oracle is a Comp level team. Dowsey plays with pubs.
There's no comparison.
But isn't this a bit hypocritic?
The whole Spirit has no counter argument assumes that the Spirit plays perfect. Scott Jund as an example is a very good Spirit and plays the game for maybe thousands and thousands of hours. He plays her "perfect". Most Spirit players are avarage people like me who play her maybe a few hours a week. Also most players do not have the perfect headset that people like Scott or Dowsey have further downgrading them as Spirit players.
Now if we say she has "no counters" we always assume this "perfect Spirit". Then if somebody brings up Oracle we deny that argument because they are "too perfect". As such we are always comparing a "perfect Spirit" with "imperect survivors", creating a flawed argument.
Now I do not want to say that Spirit is "fun" (that is subjective) or has counterplay. I merely want to point this out. The "no counterplay" argument is after all only focused on the 1vs1 scenario and even Scott who complains a lot about Spirit always tells people that she is not OP but only unfun for him because for him only the chase is a fun moment in the game.
For me stealth is a fun moment of the game. And I do not think that many people will agree with that as it is subjective after all.
And just for the record: Yes, Spirit needs changes. However they need to change her in a way that does not remove her fantasy or just tone her down without giving her anything in return. Otherwise we would just be complaining that there is a strong Killer...
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@sumps1 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2325046#Comment_2325046
I may have misread, I thought you meant hook a survivor with a crown x amount of times, implying that person with the crown would need to be hooked multiple times in the game. My apologies.
On further thought though survivors would just not pick the crown up until end game surely?
Maybe. Hard to say if they think they have the time to pick it up.
And no problem, maybe I was not very clear about my idea either.
To clearify: My idea was to hook a number of individual survivors who have collected a crown once. So per game you can get 4 stacks of this max but you need to change your playstile. If you just hook and camp you can only get 1 stack while if you try to go for all survivors you get up to 4 stacks.
Also set the total number of "crown hook" you need high. As higher number would encourage going after multiple survivors more often as you would see the effect of getting 4 stacks instead of 2 more on higher numbers.
Sure it would paint a target on the back of the survivor that collect a crown but only once.
Not saying my idea is perfect, there are surely flaws. I just wanted to make a suggestion.
I do like hard to archive challenges for cosmetics. This is what keeps a game fresh and why I think this crowns for Killers is lazy. I want to work my ass off and get a cosmetic that shows off how much work I put into it. This is also why I would dislike it if this could be archived by tunneling or camping. Both take relativly no skill and I want to show off my skills.
This is also why I do not dislike it that crowns are hard to get for a survivor, but I do dislike it that they are so easy for Killers.
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Well, how do I put this: You need to learn how to deal with it.
Even safe pallets often can yield you a hit because most survivors do not play perfect. Sometimes you can even try to mindgame them because we are human and make mistakes.
Otherwise: Do not respect them and learn where you created a death zone. It takes skill to chase survivors into those zones but it is possible.
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I personaly like Sloppy Butcher, Thanatophobia and Surge. Sloppy helps with the hit and run, Thana for general slowdown and Surge because you often suprice them near Generators. You can replace Surge with the new Eruption.
Make your Choice is a decent addition, Whispers is my favourite for tracking, if it detects correctly Forced Penance can also be great as the wounded survivors from Sloppy often tend to provoke their teammates to go for a protection hit. This then applies them with a Broken Status, allowing you to drop that chase for ~60 seconds to apply pressure elsewhere and return to that survivor.
Nurses would also be a decent choice but the budget slowdown combo of Nurses, Sloppy and Thana is a bit stale for me.
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@sumps1 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2324911#Comment_2324911
So survivors that have collected the crown will be tunnelled even harder? No thanks.
How is it tunneling if you have to hook them once?
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@van9684 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/262362/this-event-is-extremely-unfair
Killers need special accommodations or they flood these forums to complain and bully others.
Sure thing. Any more generalized ad hominem?
Aside from your crude attack on Killers in general: I think this is right. Killers have it a bit to easy to get the crown.
My suggestion would be that a Killers only gets the Crown if she/he hooks X survivors that have collected the crown.
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@BBQnDemogorgon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2323547#Comment_2323547
Limited time cosmetics, community wide in game goals, new event theme objectives like the goo flowers that one Halloween event had.
Basically 2017-2018 DbD events.
Maybe I am wrong but isn't there a community count on how many crowns we earn so that we get a Trapper and a David cosmetic?
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I never thought that Counterforce would be Hex killer perk. However I had hopes that this would make Hexes into a more interesting side objective for survivors and that they could try to add more interesting Hexes if they release those perks. To be fair I would be all in for more anti-hex perks if we get more interesting Hexes.
Small Game is still better for finding the Totem, yes. Counterforce shines more when you already have an idea where the Totem spawns or when you have teammate who tell you where to go. Could be a nice addition to a build with Inner Strengh as the extra speed from cleasing transforms into extra speed healing.
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I like it. Trickster is a fun killer to face for me even if I agree with Phasmamain: Dodging his knifes means very little compared to Huntress and Slinger. Still with the right loops you can have fun chases against him and he forces you to play in a different way and to take a different path when running away (high walls).
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@STARS_truck said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2323952#Comment_2323952
Pig is an extremely boring and unfair killer for new people playing the game. Most of the time people get their first trap and are then tunnelled out of the game. She should be limited to force you to go to three boxes max.
And thats how Pigs loose the game. Because when you tunnle the one with the party hat than you are not using your power. The hat timer stops during a chase and as such the Pig will get nothing out of her power if she tunnels.
The only unfun thing about Pigs are her two monster add-ons. But even with those add-ons she will not tunnel as the add-ons are there to kill you with her Beartrap.
To be quiet honest: Pig is the least tunnel heavy Killer in the game by design.
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I do not share you opinion on this one.
As an example I quiet like the new corn maps. The obsurced vision, the slaughterhouse and tompson house are scary. It all looks normal until you get to that one point that just looks wrong. Chasing through the corn has its own feeling, facing a stealth Killer here as well. For me having a scary outdoor map that is not just "dark" is a refreshing tast.
Raccon City is a different story as it is Resident Evil. Here are some other concepts at work but they do their job well, like the zombies outside that you hear screeching.
The only map that disappointed me is Autoheaven. It is too open and crushed cars are not scaring me that much. The map just looks like a tidy junkyard. It is not even messy or dangerous to walk on and not even overgrown with plants or something like that. Here are details missing...
For me BHVR has taken a step forwards with the new map. They interduce new kinds of scenarios that play to different factors and different fears. I think they could work a bit more with subtile sound effects but over all they are on a good way.
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Tast can be different I guess.
The fun thing is, that from a design perspective I like Haddonfield, especial if I play versus Nemesis. The zombies in those buildings are a nice touche and the suburban style fits well into the game. I love plaing Ghostface here for those reasons -
BUT Haddonfield is a mess when it comes to loops, spawns and other things. The map is torture for Killers and needs some changes to be fun for both sides. Nothing makes me want to mori a suvivor more than a Haddonfield offering.
Same for Reccoon City.
The map looks good and I like playing Myers and Ghostface here. The look is cool and it is a different kind of indoor map. It fits well into DbD and I am hyped as hell to play more on it.
From a gameplay standpoint I had too few matches here to make a good statment. Sure the map is big and as it is new I do not know spawns or good routes by now. However there are some funny loops and so far no survivor was able to abuse the map as much as Haddonfield.
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Spirit is the divine reconing for tbagging and bad mannering red rank survivors who think that they can bully rank 20-8 killers.
Okay but on the serious side. You only think about competitveness and balance here. Think about the setting.
Spirit plays to a common horror fantasy: The ghost with a grude. You know this from, well, The Grude, The Ring and other classic movies. If you think about what all those ghosts have in common it is that they can suddenly appear behind you and make for good jump scares. Spirit embodies this fantasy and this is why she is in the game.
For all the need of nerfing her or changing her, please consider that this fantasy is the reason she was created and you should adjust your nerfs/change suggestions to this. A Killer is more than stats and balance, it is also about horror aestetics and fantasy.
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While I am on board for a pirate themed Killer and Pyke has the aestetics for DbD I do not think that his power would fit well. He would be just a watered down copy of Deathslinger / Sprit as some have already pointed out.
Not that I would dislike seeing Pyke in this game, as I said his aestetics fit. But we would need to do something with his power.
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Trapper. Looks good with the new model but his power is still bad. Traps can be disarmed quiet easy, he has no map presence and unless you set up a good basement your can not build any pressure. And worsed of all: He can only carry 1 trap. This does not allow him to juggle traps with his basekit making him even more limited.
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For one part I think you are right. There is a learning curve with spawns and predicting where survivors go.
However I see a flaw in your argument: Yes you can slap on some training wheels now with Leathal Pursuer, BBQ and Discordance this is right. If you take the learning curve however and do your work with spawns and tracking on your own you can dumb those perks and take better perks.
As such you can make your build more flexible with skill which is not a bad thing in my opinion. New players can learn while not suffering to harshly and advanced players can use more effective perks as a reward. I mean, yes I still use BBQ, but I can drop it for the most part and take other good perks here. I just like my BBQ minigame.
Also I do not think that BBQ is a bad perk. At least it takes some efford to be of any use. Discordance is worse in this regard as it gives you information without any effort from the Killer. This should be considered too.
Additionaly I want to note that there are some maps where spawns just do not help you. Haddonfield is the worsted offender here as it allows you nothing in terms of tracking with the buildings. Yes there should be a survivor here, but he/she could also be on the second floor or hiding in a bush. You know the deal...
Also you forgot one of the best tracking perks thats free: Tinkerer. it comes with Hillbilly who also gives Enduring and Lightborne, two good perks and it allows you to track generators while becoming undetectable for a short time.
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I do not think this was a nerf. This was a bugfix as GoodBodyKaru pointed out. Nemesis is supposed to be his own killer and not Pyramide Head 0.9 after all.
Also I do not think that Nemsis is as trashy as some make him. Sure he needs some buffs (faster tier up or a bigger reward for T3) but overall he has a good and fun power (I like dodging it, it is a bit like Demogorgon for me), Zombies are braindead as they come but tons of fun, his design is cool and I like his chase music.
Yes there are issues but there are clearly worse Killers right nox...just look at Trapper.
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Try to play stealthy.
While it is true that in chase a good spirit will kill you that can not happen if she rarely gets to chase you. As such stealth is a good option and Spine Chill a good perk also Sprint Burst can give her a hard time.
Also not every Sprit is a god tier player with a good headset. The "no counter" argument is targeted at good/great Spirits with the equipment. But not every Spirit is that god tier tournament player with 300$ headset.
As such you can try to confuse the spirit by double vaulting, crouching and other stuff. It can work and it will work. Windows and vault are her enemy as she can not phase through them. Predropping pallets is also a good way. Try to read the Spirit if she does the same approach multiple times and play by it. Most people are predictable.
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@JimboMason said:
Alright, I'm gonna be honest here before I jump into the actual discussion, I wasn't on board for the longest time on getting a LGBTQ+ survivor, mostly because I felt like it felt weird in a game like dbd and that there are bigger issues in the game, but I've shifted my view over some time, and I've come to support the idea of getting a character like this. My main thing is, once we've gotten our character, how else can we help promote diversity and progressiveness. An idea I had is maybe, to help spread awareness, is that we can get a survivor who is either autistic or schizophrenic, as someone who has a family member who deals with both of these. Overall, I would love to see more diversity within the game, as I've come to see how important it actually is, and, even if it is a horror game, I want to see more people come into the game and feel comfortable that they are represented within the game.
edit: please be civil everyone, I've already seen some peepo get heated up
I think the next logical step would be to add an LGBTQ+ Killer.
If it is about representation then not only survivors should get it but also Killers. This would not feel right for me.
Also the question is how much representation do we want in a horror game. Because if there is representation then it will happen on both sides. We already saw how the topic if Leatherface counts (or if he has authism) can heat the flames. Adding a Killer like this is most likely to spark even more conflict as the Killer is the bad one, the one who moris and commits attrociets (Just please do not add a Killer who commits his attrociets because of this, let that Killer have a whole different motivation). However it would be nessecary as both sides should be included in the representation.
However the idea to include characters like this on both sides is important. Representation means normalization and thus adding a LGBTQ+ character only to one side would not be "normal" in the entities realm. If a person fits the entities vision of a Killer / survivor the entity will reach out for that person without any regard for their identity.
The next step would be to release a Tome about those characters, telling their tales.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
Freddy and Huntress
I can confirm this. I played a bit of Freddy and his snares did not hinder the survivors the way they should. Survivors where still able to run at full speed sometimes but not always. The snares where very unreliable, sometimes they slowed and sometimes they did nothing. It was quiet annoying especialy on shack.
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@Edilibs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2317935#Comment_2317935
I play without Ruin and i "do" win. The problem is that i will win more with Ruin builds as opposed to having 4 perks and no Ruin or Undying/Ruin and i can potentially lose depending on what killer i have.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2317948#Comment_2317948
Yuck? lol There are many, many people that still play with Undying/Ruin because the gens go very fast against a optimal team and sometimes they dont even need to be fully optimal for you to lose. Im very good at DBD so i dont need you telling me about skill etc, im actually great at the game and wish there were tournaments for it but anyway with that said like i mentioned above i win without it but the % of me winning with Undying/Ruin is considerably greater and noticeable as opposed to me playing 4 (no gen reduction perks) perks. Pop sometimes is not enough... Do you even main killer? Try playing Clown or Trapper 3 consecutive games without any Ruin and see how well that goes. Oh yeah play him at rank 1 btw to increase your chances of going against stronger survivors. Once you do that "then" come talk to me about Undying/Ruin being overrated or whatever it is your trying to get at
Yeah, I feel that.
I do not enjoy using Ruin on Killers where it does not fit their image. As an example I dislike running Ruin on Ghostface, Bubba, Freddy and Myers. However when I use Ruin (+Pop) I get far better results.
I tried playing Myers without any slowdown and I enjoy the build much more (Monitor, Bamboozle, Infectious, Safe the Best). However the results are clear: Unless I get lucky with the spawn of the survivors (all together, 2:2) I am in for a match with 3/4 hooks at best. With ruin this number goes up quiet a bit.
I wish I could run build without any slowdown more often and to a greater effect. But I have the feeling that it is not even skill dependet if I can get away with this, it is spawn dependet.
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@Tizzle said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2320314#Comment_2320314
Let me get this straight.
You expect the unhooker to just stand around in plain site in front of the hook waiting for the Killer to come back so they don't tunnel the person that was on the hook??????
Then if they don't it's their fault your chasing the recently unhooked, absolutely mind boggling.
No. But I expect the person to unhook me in a safe way. Especialy as you get more points for a safe unhook.
Just unhooking with the Killer on your heels and not trying to aggro the Killer (come on, finaly a point where clickering that flashlight is legit) or go into hiding with you is just bad. It is close to unhooking in front of the Killer without Borrow Time and you would not let that slide either.
It is the unhookers job to make sure that the guy on the hook gets to safety. This does not account for bad luck or a tunneling Killer.
You can also go into hiding with the one you rescued. But healing right under the hook is a bad decision unless you know that the Killer is already in another chase or you have We'll make it.
At least the survivors should not blame the Killer in this case and complain about "tunneling". Same if you try to bodyblock with Borrow Time, it is not "tunneling" if this happens.
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I think that they closly monitored the development of Nemesis, his powers, his aestetics and everything about them. Same for Leon, Clair, Chris, Jill, the map and even the badge charm. Everything that is their property is monitored and not released without them confirming it. As such they are not disappointed with this. I do not think that BHVR could have released anything that was not checked multiple times by capcom. Same for every other franchise by the way.
As such they will be mostly please with the results. Steam charts and players (Jills, Leons and Nemesis in you lobbies) tell the whole story. The chapter itself was a success.
Now about the performance. I think that they will be interested in this but to a lesser degree. Capcom will adress this as they do not want a taint on their product. However you now need to consider that they released worse products and know that crashes, performance issues and so on happens. Especialy with the whole crossplatform thing a service that not many games provide to this degree. Please note that BHVR offers the game on many platforms and there are few games who are that widely spread.
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@Wavy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2318695#Comment_2318695
as for the survivor perks
DS: dont tunnel
BT: go for the unhooker
DH: bait it
UB: dont slug
But isn`t this what survivors want?
Or you can take a perk that is always there. Prove Thyself, Sprint Burst, Iron Will, Kindred, Spine Chill or Windows of opportunity. Neither can be "countered" by a Killer.
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@Wavy said:
Killers are actually stronger than survivors I think. You cant counter killer meta perks easily, but you can counter survivor meta perks easily
Well...
According to what I could find on the net these are the "top" perks for Killers:
- BBQ & Chilly
- Hex: Ruin
- Pop goes the Weasel
- Discordance
- Starstruck
- Corrupt Intervention
BBQ is countered by going into a locker. Ruin can be cleansed. Discordance can be noticed very quickly and you can evade it by playing optimal as splitting up is beneficial for survivors. Starstruck can be countered by not walking into the terror radius of the Killer. Corrupt Intervention can be waited out.
Only Pop can not be "countered". But it takes an efford from the Killer to get activated.
As such the top perks for Killer scan be countered very easily.
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@slunder said:
I often see killers complaining that they are to weak. However, they are not. They have easy strategies that do not require that much talent to pull of.
If survivors are bad, then you win.
But what is the survivors are good loopers? Then the killer can simply catch someone and facecamp him. About 2 gens should be done at this point. Most of the time, other survivors will try to rescue the hooked survivor and if you simply face-camp and you are not a complete beginner (or have a one shot) there is no rescuing. But if they do generators, then you will get one kill and the exits will be powered. With Noed, you can down and facecamp the next survivor and there, you have your second kill! It is a draw even if the survivors are better than you!
So most of the time you win, but with easy strategies you will have a draw at worst. You can never lose as killer with these strategies + a very basic level of skill.
Here is a counter-argument you may have:
-"It involves getting hate messages, so this strategy is not that good". Killers can simply disable the chat or block any survivor that added him without reading the messages, besides this does not force a defeat upon a camper it just makes him feel annoyed after the game.
So no, survivors are not op, because killers can simply use simple strategies to draw or win every game.
Killer is not "weak", survivors are just stronger.
"If survivors are bad, then you win." Well...this is the way it should be. The better side should win. Whats bad or wrong about that?
A 2 kills vs 2 escapes is the expected outcome for a match this is what would be balanced. However you do not say anything about how to performe better than the avarage then you get a risk / reward ratio: You can not get a 4k by camping if the survivors are not potatoes. And this is what my statement is about: Survivors have no real difference in the risk/reward ratio when they go for a 3 man escape. Their ration only chages when they go for a 4 man escape. As such survivors are "stronger" than killers as they can get a better result with only a little increase in risk.
Note that we still do not know what a "win" is in this game for a Killer. Is a 4k a win? Is it a 3k? Or do we count hooks - after all we got a hook-o-meter rescently - this could very well be up for debate and would change my argument a bit. I only accounted for kills here. If we account for hooks then the risk / reward ration for Killers is changed.
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Survivors should get a secondary objective. Totems are not a bad thing but something that should be expanded on beyond simple pressing M1 for X seconds. This would help the game and make it better.
Maybe they should also try out different stuff to thrown in the Killers path when it hunts you. Like oil that slows the Killer down or something like that beside pallets. This could make loops stronger against certain Killers or weaker against others so that survivors need to think more during the chase.
Also just for the notes: I think survivor plays a lot easier than Killer. My obejctive is much more doable and I only need to think about one opponent. Juggeling 4 opponens makes it thougher.
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@Wavy said:
Survivor mains are starting to leave the game. This is because of the all strong killers and strong meta perks out there like Corrupt Intervention, Ruin + Undying, Tinkerer, Discordance, Bamboozle, Pop Goes The Weasel and more.
As for the killers people leave the game because of Blight, Nurse, Spirit, Huntress, Deathslinger and Hag ( basically all strong and unfair killers).
You can counter survivor meta EXTREMELY EASY. For example:
Borrowed Time; Go for the unhooker
Decisive Strike; Dont tunnel
Unbreakable; Dont Slug
Dead Hard; Bait it.
Killer meta perks on the other hand are harder to counter.
You cant counter Tinkerer, you cant counter Pop Goes The Weasel, you can counter Ruin + Undying but it takes so much time. You can counter NOED but it takes so much time, you cant counter bamboozle.
As you can see there are a lot of survivor perks that can be countered so easily. but you cant counter most of the killer perks. Survivors are running out of resources and some survivor perks are nerfed already (Decisive Strike, Borrowed time etc.) These are the reasons why survivors are starting to leave the game. And honestly, I hope they focus on the survivors instead of the killers. Because killer perks are starting to get strong and killers are becoming so unfun and boring to play against (Especially Deathslinger). So yeah i hope they do something about this.
So you are telling me...
That I as a Killer do not tunnle, do go for the unhooker, do not slug is...a bad thing because I counter your Perks?
I though survivors wanted me not to slug, tunnel and so on...
You can in fact counter Tinkerer. The Killer is not invisible, he just just stealthy. You can counter Pop: Run away from Generators that are being worked on (also, how much does Pop rest the game? Do the math...). Also Killer perks are not getting stronger and stronger. Have you seen Nemesis Perks? Compare them to Hag.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
No point in complaining here.
People will say it is a "valid strategy".
Or, they will say that this Plague probably got bullied in a previous game and there is no way that the person can be such a guy on its own.
Sadly, there are people like this in the game. The best thing is to just ignore them as good as possible, yes, it sucks, but there is no point in ranting in the Postgame Chat, they wont change their behavior, they will not suddenly think "Oh right, I AM a dick". Just leave after you are dead and go into the next game, luckily players like that are quite rare.
EDIT: I just saw that the same Jeff was standing there the whole time. If they were teaming, you should report both of them - this is a bannable offense.
I do not care if the Plague got bullied in her previous game. Two wrong do not make a right.
Question is what was the Plague trying to archive here. From my perspective this looks like she was camping the Key because otherwise it would be 2 escapes: The other survivor gets the unhook and both can escape through the hatch. So what else should the Plague do to prevent that. This could be a valid tactic. Could. However...
@kaeru said:
Team with killer is reportable.
...then there is this. Straight up. Teaming up with the Killer is reportable for a good reason, it is disgusting and the person should suffer for that.
Problem is that you can use family share to still play off your DLCs and so on. A problem I encountered in Dark Souls 3 for the first time. People would cheat, get banned and just abuse family share to still play the game. Yes the lose their save data but that can be fixed by cheating again. It is not a problem unique to DbD it is a problem for every multiplayer PVP Steam game...sadly.
Btw love the survivor build. Mine is pretty much the same as I like Deceisive Strike and Deliverance after the nerf of DS. Also Borrow Time is a must. I just add We are gonna live forever for less grind. Love it.
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I think that all Killers can be fun to face.
It realy depends on the player as fun is subjective. Also survivors need to adapt against Killers.
I saw the complain that most Killers now are "anti-looping". This is true but also not. They need to be looped in a different way.
I for an example like playing against Pyramide Head after his nerf. Right now you can do so much stuff around him to fool him, dodge him and abuse his cooldown after charging his attack. I also like to play against Nemesis who faces my braindead team and me with his own and so on.
Many people may disagree with this. But fun is subjective.
A Killers "fun level" is the same as wine: Yes there are some criteria by which you can tell if it is a good wine (depth of tast) but you may not enjoy what is considered a "great wine" or "wine of the year" because it does not fit your tast. A Killer can be perfectly fun by some objective messures (tell, counterplay and others) like Huntress and I still dislike playing against Huntress far more than I dislike Spirt. Its a tast.
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Yun-Jin, David and Nea as a Killer.
Bill and Meg as a survivor.
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I have nothing against it but I would never encourage it.
Once in a while I have a group of survivors who want to farm Bloodpoints by taking hits, healing and taking hits again. I support this, hit them and wait. As long as you are friendly I consider this "post game", it is over and now we can make the best out of it. I get BP, they get BP and everyone wins.
If they are friendly then I am too, simple as that.
Also tbagging is something...different. If I am Ghostface I tbag back at them because its fun for me.
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Well, give both sides a different objective.
Survivors only have gens. Killers only have hooks.
I as a Killer would love a secondary objective. Remove my Mori, make me work for a Mori by having an extended chase or something like that.
As a survivor, give me a secondary objective as well, a different escape route that can only be unlocked by collecting things. Maybe even a egoistic escape option: You can finish it but only one other survivor can come with you...
Make both sides have a choice.
Also maybe different obstacles I can throw in a Killers face: Oil barrles to slow them, electric wires to stun them briefly and something like that. Heck, make the option to crouch more effective against Slinger or Nemesis to make loops more interesting...but some new objects would be nice.
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@Munqaxus said:
After 5 totems are done the killer becomes vulnerable. If the killer is stunned, a survivor can use the action key to knock the killer down. The third time this happens, the survivors can then kill the downed killer.
No. Killers need to be invincible beasts that you fear. That is the whole aspect of horror here: That you are unable to do anything other than running.
Yes, survivors need a secondary objective. True. But it should be an alternate way to escape or something like that and not to kill the Killer or to give them other boni.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2315564#Comment_2315564
If keys could only spawn in the basement, and the basement always spawned a key... that would just make all killers want to camp the basement.
True that. Keys need a general rework.
My point with this hasty suggestion was: Give me something to interact with. Even flashlights offer more interaction than keys and I hate flashlights (they are not generaly overpowered, I just personaly dislike them). My idea was that if the survivors could play to "earn" the key and the Killer could intercept that, then I would like this.
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The problem is that "fun" is subjective.
For me as a Killer I get my fun from different things:
As Ghostface I have fun if I can pull off a good stalk and down the survivor without getting noticed.
As Bubba I have fun if I hit a nice chainsaw around a loop because I predicted good and sprinted around it.
As Meyrs I have fun if I get a good jump scare off during my match or get a descent T3 play.
Also I play the BBQ minigame: Stacking BBQ full is the wincon of the match for me. Everything else is a bonus.
As a survivor I play the "We are gonna live forever"-minigame. Same as BBQ but with that perk. At the same time I main Adam as a survivor and I have much fun if I can pull of a nice Deliverance play. Most times this gets ruined by my team and not by the killer, but hey...
Also I like to play the stealth game.
Generaly speaking: Most people have fun looping. As most survivors try to do the same kind of looping against all killers they have no fun against somebody like Doc who needs to be played in a different way. Same with Pyramide Head or Wraith. Survivors need to adapt a bit here. Chasing and looping is fun. M1 gaming a generator is not. Sadly generators are required to open the gates and to escape (winning is fun) and survivors are not alway effectiv at doing it.
For Killers this is why "genrushing" is a problem. It robbs them off the "fun part", the chase when all generators get done while you just walk across the map playing the "swamp walk simulator". Not to blame the survivors here, they are just playing the objective.
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Nemesis nerf and "no fun"?
I guess we live in different dimensions. Tell me, what did BHVR do in your dimension to make Nemesis unfun and nerf deserving.
In my dimension Nemesis gives you 2 sprints per chase or is just a M1 killer that can be looped. He offers interesting play at pallets and low loops and his zombies are a massive laughing stock, great comedy. For me Nemesis is fine and while I think he could get a little buff I would wait a second with this until people figure out all of the stuff you can do with him.
But nerfs? To what? Braindead zombies? In this case we need to nerf SoloQ survivors too...
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@Purgatorian said:
Keys should not spawn in chests, if this continues killers should be able to find moris on the ground too.
Or the key should only spawn in one chest that requires long time to unlock and spawns in the Killers basement.
I do not dislike key just like that. I hate the fact that you have to find and camp the hatch in most scenarios. Camping the hatch is about as much fun as watching paint dry. Give me a good chase, tense hide and seek or something and I am fine with 2 people escaping with only 3 gens done...
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I was thinking about a way to change the endgame with a Key.
The problem is that a Killer can only camp the hatch against a survivor with a key. This is boring for both sides and does not offer any form of play. As such I wish for the Key to be more interactive for both sides. Do not delete them, rework them for a fun mechanic. I can live with 2 survivors escaping through the hatch as long as I get an interesting chase or a tense hide and seek (yes, I like stealth).