GeneralV
GeneralV
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@CorvusCorax86 said:
Just checked a video from Otz showcasing his power. This is a video from 2018.
The ability to individually pull everyone into the dreamworld and make them slower was very exciting.
Was it too OP because of the aura reading ability and that is why he got reworked?
Was it too OP because of the aura reading ability and that is why he got reworked?
Nope.
If you wake up, the effect is gone. And there was, unfortunately, a 10 second delay between a survivor leaving your Terror Radius and their aura being shown.
He had one weakness: inability to interrupt survivors from finishing a generator or getting an unhook right in front of you if you weren't asleep. But that could have been easily fixed without a full rework. We didn't have the Incapacitated status effect back then, but we did have Madness 3.
I am not sure what was the full reasoning behind the rework when it was clearly not needed.
But my guess? Because some people played him in the exact same way people used to play Wraith (focusing the first person they saw), and if you ask those people they will say Freddy was F Tier.
Of course a slightly better Old Wraith isn't impressive, but it was 100% their own fault for not playing him properly and refusing to learn the specifics of his power.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620176#Comment_3620176
That's the spirit!!!
Yes, my friend, someone has to fight for Freddy.
Until we get our killer back.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620363#Comment_3620363
I'm with you dear friend. The original NoEM DLC is what made me buy DBD back in 2019 in the first place as I was a big fan of the movies. I played a solid amount of old Freddy and though it wasn't easy at times he was still fun to play even if he was on weak tier side.
I bought the base game together with the DLC in 2018.
He was the first killer I played, my favorite killer ever. Then he gets replaced by something else in 2019 and that isn't fair.
The only thing Freddy has going for him is the fact that he is Freddy Krueger, a legendary character. Because his current power is boring to the extreme and his add-ons are useless. The only thing worth salvaging is his teleport, and even that has its problems, hence this thread.
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Ah, a thread about my favorite killer! This is a sight for sore eyes, thank you so much for creating this one, my friend!
So, you're already familiar with my proposal for a Freddy change, but please allow me to expand it a little bit.
Power: Dream Demon
Pull survivors into the Dream World
-Survivors who are awake do not see The Nightmare.
-Once targeted by The Nightmare’s power, survivors enter the Dream Transition for 7 seconds.
-During the Dream Transition Survivors can see The Nightmare intermittently and they suffer from the Incapacitated status effect.
-When the Dream Transition Lapse, the Survivor is pulled into the Dream World.
Once in the Dream World:
-Survivor’s auras are revealed to The Nightmare when they are outside of his terror radius.
-Survivors suffer an action speed penalty of 40%.
-To exit the Dream World, Survivors can find non-sleeping Survivors to perform a wake up action.
-Failed Skill Checks can also wake up.
-Hooked Survivors wake up.
Special Ability: Dream Projection
-Teleport to a Generator in view. Releasing the button early will cancel the action.
-Survivors cannot interact with the targeted Generator.
“You have nothing to worry about. This won’t hurt one… little… bit.” -Freddy Krueger
The idea behind this concept of mine is pretty simple: the Incapacitated status effect solves the main problem people had with him, which was survivors finishing a gen or getting an unhook right in your face. Now that would be no longer a thing.
The teleport is here because It is the only thing worth salvaging from his current kit, at least in my opinion, and because the mobility is a huge help sometimes.
As for a bit of power trivia, I'm thinking:
-24 metres TR.
-1 second of movement speed penalty for putting a survivor into the Dream Transition (it used to be 1 second, then it was nerfed to 3 seconds after patch 1.8.1)
-No delay between a survivor leaving your terror radius and their aura being shown to you (another nerf from 1.8.1, no reason to keep it).
Overall, a modernized version of Old Freddy isn't really difficult, as his kit was already wonderful. A few QoL improvements and the most unique killer in this game's history is back to us!
The mere thought of getting my favorite killer back makes me happy.
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@jonifire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620357#Comment_3620357
Yes so we can give ideas before things change.
I mostly feel like good ideas often didn‘t get read. When you had a summary of all ideas in one of your pinned discussion about one topic. We could maybe give you good ideas, what we think would help.
In this case about Sadako I wrote a lot of ideas/ things I liked in feedback posts and most times this posts just disappear after a short time behind all complains.
It feels bad to know they don‘t get read.
Also for Freddy @GeneralV and many others, who like this character made a lot of good suggestions. In such discussion you could collect ideas, that would help you make this and other characters better, when you want to change them.
Thank you, I am happy you liked my ideas :)
I really miss my favorite killer.
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I don't know how it feels to play him, but playing against him isn't the experience of going against a well designed killer.
Overall, it is safe to say the community was tired of anti-loop killers, because chases without mindgames simply aren't fun. Xeno seems to be the peak of that specific type of killer.
The turrets are a weird addition because they can either be useless or extremely effective. They are not always going to be effective at slowing him down, but without them the situation is far more dangerous because every window and pallet can give him a potential hit.
I think this killer should have been stealthy. Sounds better than what we got.
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Being treated unfairly is, sadly, a part of my favorite killer's history in this game.
Unfortunately I am not a dev, I don't have the power to help him. He would be fixed by now.
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The fact they want to restore an old kit while improving it is a really good thing.
Hopefully everything goes well.
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You can't please everyone. No matter if it is your playstyle, your build, or even a suggestion on the Forums.
There will always be someone who dislikes it.
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Hopefully something really grim and dark.
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@KaTo1337 said:
Im telling the story over and over again:
Freddy... man the OG-Freddy with the Incapacitated-Effect while in Dream Transition.... it would make so much sense.
Well... I am able to win most of my matches with the current Freddy and yes, you have "more to do" now than OG, like mass fake-teleports und snares and all that sht, but it doesnt feel like Freddy.
Even Stretch Arms like in the first NOES-Movie back in 1984 (which would work like Xenos Tail) would fit more than hearing things louder... xD
Freddy... man the OG-Freddy with the Incapacitated-Effect while in Dream Transition.... it would make so much sense.
We have to try, my friend. We have to try and try until it happens.
Because if we don't, then who will?
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@Hunkulese said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620120#Comment_3620120
Yeah, I don't think you understood the change they made. There's no more maximizing emblems. You get the 4k, that's it. Done.
Unless I misunderstood you and the maximizing emblems wasn't related to Dredge.
Nah, I get it.
My second attempt with Dredge was a perfect game, except the last guy managed to find the hatch. The old system would have given me the achievement right there and then, the new one didn't.
And that was frustrating, not gonna lie.
But I think both have their pros and cons, to be honest. I think that one game with Dredge was worth the achievement, but just getting a 4k can be easier than maximizing the emblems (unless they get a lucky hatch).
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620122#Comment_3620122
True. I don't mind the reworking but they seem to go way overboard sometimes (or not enough, in the case of GoJ).
I do mind the reworking, but mostly because of the visuals. Balance can be adjusted separately.
As for Garden of Joy, I was honestly surprised when I was told they tweaked it. Way I see it, it was awful and it still is awful.
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@Nazzzak said:
Special mention needed for Rancid Abattoir. Deadzones, barely any pallets and what pallets there are are generally unsafe. I call that map the gen rush map. It's the only map I make an effort to just smash the gens out on because the pallets are all gone so fast, so need to get out asap.
And to think it was once a good map for survivors.
It is the opposite of The Game: what used to be a great map for killers became an improved version of Pallet Town.
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@Hunkulese said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619890#Comment_3619890
Either you didn't try for many adepts with the old system or you don't know how the new system works. The new system makes the adept achievements pretty much trivial and you don't really have to put much thought into anything. With the old system, there were so many ways you could fail.
With the old system I did: Trapper, Wraith, Hillbilly, Myers, Hag, Doctor, Huntress, Leatherface, Freddy, Pig, Clown, Spirit, Legion, Plague, Ghostface, Demogorgon, Oni, Deathslinger, Pyramid Head, Blight, Twins and Onryo.
With the new system I only did Adept Dredge.
But now that you made think about it, I realize I only said that because I am still a little salty from second attempt for Adept Dredge. Because let me tell ya, maximizing those emblems but not getting the achievement because the last guy managed to find the hatch was absolutely infuriating.
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@[Deleted User] said:
It's certainly concerning. But I'd rather them take a swing and miss on something than leave something in a bad state. Of course, that doesn't apply to completely inexplicable changes like Hillbilly.
As boring as Freddy is now, OG Freddy would be even more reviled than release Skull Merchant in current DbD. Can you imagine a killer than can inflict a 50% action speed penalty on a 3 gen on top of perks like Pentimento+Dying Light+etc? Did they get the Freddy rework and subsequent nerfs wrong? Probably. But the attempt was logical.
Skull Merchant is self-explanatory. Is she interesting to play against? Not particularly. But it's better than hostage merchant was.
Onryo...is a weird one. I think this is a case of them maybe not being that proficient at DbD or not doing their due diligence in terms of thinking how the power would be optimized. Players predicted the problems with the reworked kit within hours of the PTB dropping. It was really obvious that the spam teleport playstyle was going to be a thing.
Wake up and the slowdown is gone.
There is no waking up against Skull Merchant.
EDIT:
@xCakeStick said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620037#Comment_3620037
I think the visually the maps should have options on the old graphics or new graphics. But I was pointing out that's how the rework is only okay with doing.. anything else is terrible.
You have my respect, friend.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620026#Comment_3620026
If you had no intentions of hurting someone else's experience, then you wouldn't have made a suggestion that's non-optional, and would have FORCED other people to suffer through those old maps.
It doesn't matter if you gave other suggestions. The fact that you honestly think it's a good suggestion to FORCE people to play old maps, proves that you would be fine if player experiences are ruined.
If it bothers you that match, I just took it out from the post.
There, now two of two suggestions involve a choice.
Problem solved.
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Map reworks have been great visually, they've changed the game to make it look nicer and keep it line with other games.
I disagree with that, but I understand those are personal opinions.
What we can agree if is the fact that the mere word "rework" is a bad omen around here. Every time it happens we either know something will get ruined, or we desperately hope it doesn't happen.
And it isn't just the recent ones. If we go further back, we find the saddest examples:
-Freddy: The absolute worst rework in the game's history. In a matter of one patch (3.1.0), a killer that required only a reversion of nerfs and a single QoL change gets replaced by something else entirely. He was my main before the rework, and I have yet to get my favorite killer back.
-Hillbilly: The one change no one could have predicted. I mean, surely the "golden child" of Dead by Daylight's killer balance would avoid unnecessary changes, right?... Right?
Sure, someone could come here and point me towards Bubba or Legion. But as I've said on another thread, a full rework always has a risk.
And that is why it is dangerous to ask for those.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619906#Comment_3619906
Three out of three suggestions should involve a choice. The fact that you're even considering that other people should be forced to suffer through the old maps, makes this whole thing a terrible idea that should never happen.
Do you really think BHVR will look at this post, accept the suggestions, then pick the only one which doesn't involve a choice?
I am a not a developer, mate. I don't have power to make changes to this game. And even if I did I made it clear on the post that I have no intention of hurting someone else's experience.
If you have a problem with that suggestion and that suggestion only, fair enough. But don't act like it is all I've said here. A better option can be picked.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
I never ever want to play on one of the older maps, with their garbage looking color filters, where the entire maps are literally one super saturated color. If older maps get added back to the game, they should be custom mode only, so that it never affects me.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618567#Comment_3618567
And that's the main problem. Unless the older maps are a completely optional thing, that doesn't affect the main game mode at all, it would absolutely hurt my playing experience.
Please read the full post before commenting.
Two of three suggestions involve a choice, you wouldn't see anything you don't want to.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619802#Comment_3619802
Depends...
Hatch exists and good teams do as well.
Killer adepts were far easier when Merciless Killer didn't require you to kill all four survivors.
I got my Adept Huntress on Fractured Cowshed even though the last survivor actually found the hatch and escaped.
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At this point, I take MMR should be scrapped. The feedback is always negative, and it seems to have caused more harm than good.
The ranks weren't perfect. Sometimes that system failed, it happened.
But I would go back to them in a heartbeat because even the worst of that system was far more enjoyable than anything MMR has to offer.
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Happy new year, to you and every member of this community!
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I think this would be more powerful with Old Doctor.
Imagine a map-wide Static Field, constantly inflicting madness. That would be very, very powerful.
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I don't think it was ever necessary, to be honest. Of course, no one will ever blame a killer for tunneling someone who ran directly towards them or something like that, but you can win without ever using the strategy.
As for acceptable, I think @Pulsar has a good point here. It was generally considered to be more acceptable because there was more you could do against it. The maps didn't have as much deadzones as they do today and after patch 2.6.0 there was Decisive Strike, which was a direct counter to tunneling.
However, with the way things currently are, there is far less you can do if the killer decides they want you out of the game as soon as possible.
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@xCakeStick said:
If you watch August 2020 videos and any other videos from previous months and years, it's insane to see how Dead By Daylight had changed so much after August 2020, with new movement, new reworks for maps and in game models. I see why they did it, but the older stuff looked so much cooler, and fitted the games point.
but the older stuff looked so much cooler, and fitted the games point.
Indeed!
I understand some people like the changes, but I desperately want my favorite game back.
There has to be a way to do it without hurting anyone's experience.
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Nah, it doesn't really give you an advantage.
All they do is make the game look horrible. As if the map reworks hadn't messed up the visuals enough, a reshade just goes further down the rabbit hole.
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@jonifire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619486#Comment_3619486
Yep most reworks are just sad for players, who liked the characters before. The best thing would be to address the problems certain killers have, instead of changing most parts.
I‘m happy if they return Sadako to her old state. If behavior does it right with Sadako, then I hope Freddy is next.
The only killer behavior can‘t save is skull merchant, even after her rework she is unfairer than nurse and it‘s sad that she has a better stealt than ghost face. (She has a secret power suicide)
Yeah, that is the sad truth. They seem to be aware of the issue with Onryo, but Freddy and Billy have yet to be fixed.
As I've said on other threads, I'm really hoping they finally bring Freddy's old power back. It has been a long dance since 2019 and I miss my favorite killer so much.
As for Skull Merchant... well, I honestly have no idea how to save this character. There has to be way, but for now it seems she will remain the way she is, with people disconnecting the moment they hear the first notes of her chase theme.
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First of all, happy new year!
Second, I am not sure asking for a complete rework is a good idea. The mere word is a a bad omen, confirmed when you see the several examples we have.
Freddy? Worst rework in the game's history.
Billy? Ruined.
Skull Merchant? Awful to go against before the rework (judging from the information I've received), awful to play against after the rework.
Trickster? Made even more unfun.
Onryo? So bad it is getting reverted.
Imagine if Nurse gets the same treatment. She will place puddles of blood on the ground? Overheat?
Sure, maybe you can point me towards Bubba or Legion. But a full rework ALWAYS has a risk of ending badly.
And that will never change.
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Happy new year, my friend! To you and everyone else in this community.
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That sounds rough. Sorry you had to deal with that.
The MMR system simply doesn't work around here. It has been like that ever since the system was first introduced, and I don't doubt new players are getting hit with the worst scenarios the system has to offer.
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@Krazzik said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619437#Comment_3619437
But the survivor with DS in this scenario is getting a pity escape. As long as they hit the DS skill check they literally can't lose the game, simply because they equipped a perk. That's the reason DS (and OTR) get switched off in endgame. Survivors still have other ways of protecting their teammate after the unhook and if there are even two other survivors still alive at that point, it's pretty easy to all escape.
DS in endgame literally punishes killers for NOT tunnelling earlier in the game. If the killer doesn't tunnel, then the survivors will have their DS at endgame, where it's significantly stronger.
I still think it depends on the scenario. A survivor with DS isn't always getting a pity escape, it depends on how that end game goes.
However, the deactivation condition is already here, and I don't think it is going anywhere, even after they (hopefully) buff the perk in June.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619214#Comment_3619214
You're a trooper, you know that? I think most of us don't even remember it exists most of the time.
Thanks, it has been a habit since I first started playing.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619437#Comment_3619437
That's exactly why DS should disable. It being active is a borderline guaranteed escape, but it being deactivated is not a borderline guaranteed kill. There's still the basekit anti-tunnel protection and the possibility of bodyblocks from your teammates that can help you without DS, but there's nothing the killer can do (except the highly specific and niche scenario of Blood Warden being active, I guess) if DS is active.
It depends on the scenario though.
Maybe the killer caught someone else, maybe they were injured and rushed the save. Not every situation includes one person on struggle phase and the other three survivors alive, healthy and willing to go for the save. Sometimes DS ain't no guaranteed escape.
It increases your chances, of course, but it won't get you out every time.
However, now that the deactivation has been introduced I think it is highly unlikely they remove it.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619433#Comment_3619433
The reason it disables at end game is the killer cannot possibly stop you from escaping once the gates are open.
If he picks you up, you stun them and run out of gate, if they don't pick you up, you crawl out anyway.
It puts the killer in a lose/lose situation when they successfully caught you after you were unhooked and heading to the exit, but now they can't possibly win.
The end game isn't meant for pity kills nor escapes. Like I said, no one is entitled to anything just because all the gens got done.
Lets say the gates were open, the killer gets hit by DS, but the gates are blocked because the killer happened to have Blood Warden. Those are both fair scenarios, where players used powerful perks they had at their disposal to try and get an advantage.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619348#Comment_3619348
Unfortunately @Coffeecrashing is correct, the main reason Decisive Strike isn't used much now is because the 2 seconds of escape it actually buys you is ineffective against a good Nurse or Blight. If the stun is jacked up however we still hit the problem of it being weaponised.
The protection hit solution would be nice, but we hit the problem you describe. I was working on this to post in another thread, but I realised you can still body block for a full HP survivor with Decisive Strike, so that would be an issue...and I can't think of a way of preventing it. The one saving grace is at least it would be pretty obvious, however of course SWFs would still use it... and we do have the issue that Killers can get faked out by someone pretending to have DS. In any case this is what I have thus far.
Decisive Strike
Using whatever is at hand, you stab your aggressor in an ultimate attempt to escape.
If the exit gates are not yet powered, after being unhooked or unhooking yourself, Decisive Strike activates after 5 seconds. For the next 40/50/60 seconds:
- When being grabbed or picked up by the Killer, succeed a Skill Check to automatically escape their grasp, stunning them for 3.5 seconds.
- The killers power is disabled for 7 seconds.
- Successfuly stunning the Killer will deactivate Decisive Strike and result in you becoming the Obsession.
While Decisive Strike is active, it is deactivated if:
- The survivor performs any Conspicuous Actions.
- The survivor takes a Protection Hit.
- The Exit Gates are powered.
After successfully stunning the Killer with Decisive Strike, it is disabled for the rest of the trial.
The 5 seconds timer is to ensure protection hits off hook can't disable it... I was really trying to think about if you could beat the 5s timer. Even if you get hit immediately off hook with STBFL, rushed and downed again with Nurse, Blight, Spirit or Wesker, could they pick you up to beat the 5s timer? Wesker is possible, because he can immediately hit you off hook then Virulent Bound to instant grab you... but I don't think anyone else can without a grab...
It shouldn't deactivate at the end game.
If you get saved and the killer decides to tunnel you right then and there, what do you do? No, the perk must still be active when the gates are powered.
This is like making STBFL disable at the end game, imo.
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@glitchboi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619274#Comment_3619274
To be honest with you, I don't think it would be too powerful. Survivors would still be capable of knowing which pallets would be dream pallets since they wouldn't be visible outside of the dream world, and there would still be counterplay using windows and the common exhaustion perk Lithe. Plus, an animation of the particles of the pallet reversing back to their original places to create a dream pallet would be SICK.
I do also like the current Black Box that you have so maybe either one of those could be Very Rare. If it's too much it might be possible to give a downside for running the add-on such as the alarm clocks or nerfs his slowdown or aura reading to compensate when using it. Add-ons that change gameplay of the killer are really cool where they have downsides but make the killer's power different, such as Hag's Scarred Hand, Trapper Sack, and Scratched Mirror Myers.
But yeah I get what you mean with the alarm clocks, with the way old Freddy's kit is designed it might become EMPs part 2 (which is fine for Singularity but not sure with Freddy). Also missing skill checks is a 50/50 counter to Freddy as it not only gives him a method of slowdown with the skill checks damaging generators in the process but it also wakes up a survivor (which is a pretty interesting design for counterplay and I love what BHVR did there back then).
I miss when the dream world was actually scary and threatening rather than "oooh red puddle scarryyyyyy" though the dream pallets do help against that sort of even with current Freddy because it adds a degree of paranoia when it comes to dropping pallets.
If BHVR goes back to Freddy someday I hope that they listen to your suggestions as well as what any other prime Freddy enjoyers have to think, we can only hope to god that they don't butcher him again like they did in 2019.
Interesting points, my friend.
I can see the counterplay survivors could use against the Dream Pallets should they remain in the concept, though it is difficult to determine how strong they would actually be without the means of testing it. Between them and the Black Box I have now (which essentially has Class Photo's current effect, but without the downside) there are some interesting things that could be done with this ultra-rare add-on.
And yes, I do love the idea of missing skill checks to wake up. Freddy, and the whole ANOES chapter, were excellent on release and I love everything BHVR came up with back then. The 50/50 counter you've described is the reason why Overcharge was so good on him. At first it sounds weird, but slowly I think every Freddy player understood how brilliant it actually was.
Freddy has very little going for him right now, and as someone who absolutely loves this killer I would be honored if BHVR accepted my ideas for what should be done with him. The developers have a golden opportunity to fix the mistake of 2019 and I sincerely hope they take it.
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@glitchboi said:
Been waiting for this!
If Sadako's getting her old self back, then it's Freddy's turn. I mean, they should still have the assets for the effects of the pulling into dream ability. The incapacitated effect is what solves people unhooking against Freddy or holding gens against hm, so I already love that (the Twins brought one good thing to the table, lmao).
Do you think it would be possible to incorporate the alarm clocks into his power? Like maybe as something Freddy interacts with instead of the survivors? It's probably off the table in terms of survivor interaction, but I do like the models of the alarm clocks and the sounds they make. Or maybe make the alarm clocks exist for survivors to be able to interact with and escape the dream world with as a downside for Jump Rope. If not then it's totally understandable, I just want old Freddy to be fully playable again. Maybe an add-on for dream pallets too?
Overall really well-written as per usual with you, it's been 4.5 years ever since Freddy's disgusting rework so I hope the glory days of his comes back soon enough. I appreciate the dedication you're doing to try and bring back your favorite killer, there's no justification for BHVR to just straight up delete a killer's entire power, it's awful. Perhaps for the next half of 2024, we'll get a new roadmap that will feature an update to The Nightmare himself.
Hello, my friend! Good to see you here!
Yes, I gotta say their idea for Sadako's next changes gave me hope. I mean, if they are willing to do it with Sadako, why not Freddy? Thanks to the Incapacitated status effect it is very easy to modernize his kit from release. Though honestly, even if he was brought back without a single QoL improvement I would still love it.
As for the alarm clocks, I don't really like them. I know fellow Old Freddy players tried to incorporate them into their own concepts, but I just don't think it is a good idea to keep them. It would be far too easy to wake up, in my opinion. If their existence was tied to an add-on, it would have to be an extremely powerful add-on. I don't think Jump Rope has that level of strength, to be honest.
And the add-on for the Dream Pallets was actually a thing! This is from when I posted this concept in 2021:
Black Box:
-Broken pallets are replaced by Dream Pallets
-Non-sleeping survivors cannot see or interact with Dream Pallets
“I can sleep… I just don’t want to” -Dean Russell
I changed it because I thought it was too much. I mean: aura-reading, slowdown at base, mobility, pseudo-stealth, it is a powerful kit. Adding a chase ability on top of that felt a little too powerful. Not "Nurse" levels of powerful, but still...
However, the pre-drop meta wasn't as prominent back then as it is now, so maybe this would have to be reconsidered. What do you think? I'd love to hear your feedback.
And thank you so much for your kind words, my friend! It has been a long dance since patch 3.1.0 took away my favorite killer and ever since 2019 I am finally hopeful again. I really really hope the devs give him another chance, I miss him so much. I appreciate your support my friend, it means a lot to me.
Let us hope for a glorious Old Freddy comeback in 2024.
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@vito180 said:
Its looks like a dream for my eyes. I think that never happens 🥲
It could happen. Or not. Who knows?
I sincerely hope it does.
Either way, I'm glad you liked it!
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I always use it, mostly out of habit.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619019#Comment_3619019
DS was also a highly weaponized perk, where if the killer wasn't tunneling, then the survivor would try to force the killer into eating the DS. Yes, it happened a lot, and the "conspicuous actions" change didn't stop people from weaponizing the perk.
If the DS stun duration gets buffed, then BHVR needs to somehow nerf the perk to stop people from weaponizing it. If a survivor is trying to bodyblock because they have DS, that should deactivate the perk. Stepping into a locker should also deactivate the perk. Basically anything survivors did to weaponize the perk needs to go away.
But they can no longer force the killer to grab them off a gen.
A survivor jumping inside a locker doesn't help their team, and if the body-blocking is an issue you can slug them.
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Yes, it does.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619039#Comment_3619039
Look if you want to make a perk meta thats great but its not good game design to just make a meta perk so I won't ever agree with it. If you think a change is needed because something is so dire that you think meta perks that everyone / enough people should run to shift the entire way the game is played just make a basekit change that does the same thing instead.
Ah well, unfortunately I am not a dev. I don't have the power to do anything.
I think a basekit change would be a bit too strong, but DS meta again solves the problem we are currently seeing.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619030#Comment_3619030
Invisible counterplay should be weaker than other forms of counterplay 5s stun on a perk you don't know they have just shouldn't exist. If ds did something like made a sound when you downed them or was as visible as off the record, or dh I would agree. But I would never agree that invisible counterplay should be the strongest option just suggest a basekit change at that point don't make some psychology experiment.
But why should you be warned they have DS?
You aren't warned, for example, that the killer has Pain Res until the moment it triggers. Why should DS be any different?
How to do you counter Pain Res? You assume the killer has it. Same goes for DS, you assume the survivors have it.
So you either don't tunnel, or you slug them. But slugging is better than to go back to the hook immediately because of Unbreakable. Or someone else can come pick you up.
There is no reason for DS not to return to the meta.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619019#Comment_3619019
Its not the primary tool anymore you got 5 of them, if you want more tools equip more perks don't expect 1 perk to hard carry anymore since you also get basekit help and the tools have good synergy
Hopefully it will be, once more.
Are there other ways to avoid tunneling? Yes, there are. But none of them are as effective as DS and it shows. Just look at the sheer amount of tunneling that is happening now.
Was there tunneling when DS was good? Yes, but not on this same level.
DS will end this wave and it has to be done.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3619002#Comment_3619002
Thats why people who get unhooked have basekit bt, off the record, dead hard, ds, exhaustion removed, and 10s of a 10% movement speed boost. Its not meant to be all encompassing as one perk. Its meant to benefit a "strategy" of making more time while being tunneled. Yes strategies too can be balanced and needing to do what you have to when you need to or preemptively doing it to try and win is indeed part of the game.
But DS was the primary anti-tunnel tool, and its current state isn't doing anything. The amount of tunneling recently is unreasonable, something has to be done about.
Reverting DS is important because many killers didn't want to eat the stun. That helps a lot.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618978#Comment_3618978
Nope not really tunneling matters in most matches so making tools against it stronger without buffing tools for playing the game in other ways stronger is just a spit in the face of balance really.
Tunneling isn't balance, it is a strategy. But that strategy is frowned upon, that is why there must a perk to fight against it.
You can win without tunneling, that is a fact. Of course, no one will blame you for tunneling a survivor who ran directly towards you, but you don't necessarily have to take someone out as soon as possible.
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618958#Comment_3618958
DS should get a small buff, but it should 100% still get disabled at the end game. End game DS makes a 4 out way too free against a lot of killers if the Survivors are a smidge coordinated and the person currently on hook has it. The killer literally doesn't have enough time to play around it.
Also... I would like to point out that every single generator related perk is essentially disabled at end game regardless of which side it's on because the gens can't be interacted with at that point. Heck... Freddie even loses his teleport during end game. So, if we're going with no perk gets disabled at end game, a LOT of perks are going to have to... I don't know... get a secondary effect at end game?
The end game isn't a place for pity kills nor escapes. It is part of the game. No one is entitled to anything just because all the gens got done.
And no, I'm not talking about gen perks. Those are obviously not going to work. I'm talking about the fact that it doesn't really make sense for DS to deactivate at the end game. It is like, idk, making STBFL disable at the end game. That would be awful.
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@bjorksnas said:
Probably not, although ds was only ever made a 5s stun because of enduring so at most it would probably be set to a 4s stun. Might be respected a bit more than it is now but I never want to go back to where you had to 100% respect it 24/7 even if they didn't have it.
I never want to go back to where you had to 100% respect it 24/7 even if they didn't have it.
Better that than tunnel, tbh.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618964#Comment_3618964
Or it means 'killer has cleared out, rescue me'.
Usually, people communicate that by standing still on the hook.