ElusivePukka
ElusivePukka
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- ElusivePukka
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"You end the game pretty quickly"
No. By design, you don't do that with Tombstone unless those survivors are particularly bad at situational awareness.
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Legion, Demogorgon, Ghost Face, Executioner, Nemesis, and Cenobite all have innate Killer Instinct procs, and true.
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@MikeyBoi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/281620/spine-chill
The proper way to use spine chill is to preemptively run to a gym or a safe pallet as soon as the perk lights up from a generator. If it’s a Swf on coms then the survivor with spinechill will tell their friends to prerun, smart survivors will place spine chill on the left side of the perk slots to get a better peripheral to see it lighting up on their screen.. There’s a few factors to determine if a survivor has Spinechill or also survivors might get greddy with vaulting windows because they have spine chill resilience together for 15% faster vault speed and you might swing and miss them playing killer..
To counter spine chill you simply moon walk to the generator if it’s behind a wall/ gym..
Is spine chill op? Maybe…
That is definitely not the way to use Spine Chill - that'll end with a lot of false positives from chases and undirected patrols. The amount of time I see survivors because they panic and prerun is unreal.
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@Peanits said:
This is normal. When you play a Killer for the first time, the game will base your rating on your other Killers rather than the default/lowest rating. From there, it'll adjust separately as you play. If you have a few bad matches, your rating with that Killer will lower and you'll start to get paired with Survivors that you're more comfortable with. If you're a natural with that Killer, it'll stay the same or even increase depending on how well you're doing.
On the one hand, thanks for the transparency.
On the other, this can be summed up as "We didn't lie, we merely misled people"
The entire notion that you need hours invested into a killer before the system will even attempt to acknowledge a lack of individuation is laughable, and is a disincentive for people to play off-meta or have new experiences in the game.
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My best to you, and I hope you do well out there in the wide world.
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1) Ruin... Meh
2) Dead hard... Unreliable
3) Noed... Predictable
4) Sbmm... Well-Meaning
5) low tier killers... Player-Based
6) solo survivor... Extant
7) Optimization... Minimal
8) Cosmetics... Flashy
9) Flashlights... Clicky
10) Swf... Meh
11) Rpd... Twisty
12) Grade rewards... Meh
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Pig.
Every boop, head pop, and oinkfest is a treasure - and the satisfaction of proving survivor's expectations of an easy win wrong is just delicious.
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Just had a SWF team actually GG after the game when their big Head On tech failed and I got my 3k - I knew there was a key, I just didn't want to sweat it. So that was neat.
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I generally agree with you. A lot of people here, on media sites, or in game don't really know what they're talking about - they'll use terms as crutches, same as [insert flavour of the month] perks :P
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@Myla said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2511116#Comment_2511116
There is no gamble on a silent pallet break pallet lol. Bruh just look at the animation lmao and again rng doesn't matter since if you're trying to mind game chances are you're in a SAFE tile. Doesn't matter if you fake a break survivor can just react and vault back to the pallet because again SAFE tile.
What about about Alert not being Meta? The fact that a perk exist that completely destroy this perk should be pointed out.
It's a perk discussion. Flaws should be pointed out - I'm not shutting his perk down. I'm creating incentive for him to think on how to improve around said flaws.
There's absolutely a gamble on perk selection as counterplay, and the idea that 'chances are you're on a safe tile' is RNG dependent whether you want to be honest about it or not.
Sure, there's stuff that can be used against it. That's not a flaw. Good game mechanics require a give and take. The fact that the counterplay is niche relegates it to our minor back and forth, rather than a real and glaring issue with the design.
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@Myla said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2511098#Comment_2511098
What about it is hyperbolic?
'Ease' implies an absence of difficulty, while ignoring that a counterplay perk for either side is essentially a gamble every time - saying the idea is easily countered by 1. map RNG/design or 2. equipping Alert is an exaggeration both of the need for counterplay and the agency of player control.
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Pressing M1 with whatever perks and tools you like and understanding survivors don't genrush by just doing their task with what's allotted them. Just do your task, prioritize a fast/safe heal like Heartbound says (Botany Knowledge ftw), and acknowledge you've been blessed with 1.5 tasks versus killers with 2.5 - with .5 devoted to bones.
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The previous system had the same issue, whether people want to admit it or not - it was ridiculously easy to turn a few hours into ranks up regardless of role. "Rank means nothing" has never been more true, but that doesn't detract from that being apt before the change as well.
On the rewards, though, you definitely have merit.
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@Myla said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510836#Comment_2510836
I like how you conveniently removed the "EASILY countered" :P
Yeah, I removed the hyperbolic misrepresentation, what of it?
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It's still fun to play killer, you just need to learn to relax. I've switched to roughly 50k/50s, these days, versus 2/3 of my games being killer.
Do challenges, try to learn about the game - see what rocks you can zoom to with a killer lunge.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510820#Comment_2510820
Yah no.... those points came from people be altruistic when honestly, they should of just left.
You survivors have the stick, you just refuse to use it. Let's be honest, he got those points due to your own greed for points and pride in trying to get everybody out.
Yeah, no. I'm a killer main, just playing survivor there because I do like to have both sides under my belt. No killer should be rewarded for that, and no survivor should be punished for it. Let's be honest, he got those points because BHVR prefers there being no incentive to be better save personal pride and gumption.
The unearned arrogance of my fellow killers regarding camps is abysmal.
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@Yamaoka said:
I gotta say the map is huge, incredibly detailed (maybe except for the PS2 graphics Tiger) and... Honestly fun to play in my opinion.
Due to the huge map size I knew survivors would have to spend a lot of time traveling between hooks and gens if I ended chases quickly (which I did) so I never felt like I had to proxy any hooks, tunnel, camp or slug throughout the game allowing for a fair(ly long) match (and a 11 hook game).
Maneuvering through all those tight rooms and corridors was a nice little challenge and just way more fun than all those open old school maps where survivors just look at you from 100 meters whilst sitting on a gen and start running away in a perfectly straight line.
If you dislike the RPD map what exactly is it you dislike about it ?
I dislike the verticality. It feels like 4 floors, even though it's something like 2.25, and it's twisting enough so that there's potential for loops/pallets too powerful for the most skilled killer to head off. As a survivor or as a killer, I run the risk of getting lost, and some of the information perks are too vague to get usable information from.
As far as level of complexity, I liked Hawkins. It was unbalanced, but it flowed. RPD lacks that same flow for me, and I know it feels the same for others. I like the detail in RPD, I like the concept, but it honestly feels like one and a half maps stuck together - which I like for scale, for much the same reasons you cited, I just wish they weren't on top of each other.
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@Heartbound said:
If the devs really wanted to stop face camping they'd have hooks function like Pyramid Head cages. Just have the Entity swallow the hook after 10 seconds or so.
The one game I ran Kindred I got facecamped out of the gate so we had some survivors since I'm stubborn, but survivor queues were fast that night so I didn't really care. Rip brown toolbox.
TBH, those cages are one of the best features of the SH chapter. I would love if hooks behaved similarly.
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@Myla said:
Competent survivors wouldn't be affected by it since they just need to wait for the animation before running away, you can argue that there is tiles where you can't see the animation but it's probably a safe pallet anyway and survivor could just react and vault to safety again lol.
There's also the perk Alert which should reveal if it's fake or not.
Anyway I like the idea but I just think it's easily countered.
If your argument is "that can be countered", then most perks should be deleted :P
Alert's not exactly meta, it would just become higher on the roster than usual.
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Just got facecamped by a Wraith who AFKed for 6 minutes to try his NOED/Blood Warden combo - which he got one exposed hit out of,and two hooks. Took me a minute to find the very last totem, and they popped the gens before I actually got it. Thanks to the Elfen Dwight I saved BT-ing me off the hook we all got out, but dang: it sucks to see stuff like that encouraged considering the Wraith's non-participation still netted him nearly double the BP of the survivors - none of whom were able to get enough benevolent or evader emblem points for even bronze.
Killers lose points - to a degree - if no other survivors are around. It's not enough to actually do anything about the problem - it's a bandaid, a patch theatre by which the devs pretend they see and care about the issue. They need to incentivize leaving the hook, on top of punishing those who stay without cause. Carrot and stick.
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This option is just amusing.
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I make sure to play both. Playing survivor helps you play killer better, and vice versa.
My main goals as killer are to develop my skills as that killer, understand how they function and how things differ from other killers. This takes some time for trial and error, but more than anything I just like having a roster of game mechanics I know I can function within and discover emergent play with.
As a survivor, I will typically be running a challenge these days, or prioritizing a teammate's survival - I often end up a dedicated runner, to the point I get facecamped or given up on. I frequently score either the least or the most survivor-side, but almost never in between.. which I find amusing, at the least
Setting your own goals past kill/escape is one of the keys to success and happiness in this game.
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@ThiccBudhha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510350#Comment_2510350
It depends on how you define artifical and legitimate, I suppose. But generally speaking, knowing something isn't going to return brings out the money bags regardless.
Both do, certainly, but I lived through 90s holiday sales and was the weirdo who crunched numbers for fun - Furby dominated for a couple years when they underestimated demand, but Beanie Babies did FOMO with storehouses full of the stuff, "releasing found stock" and it drove people wild for a decade.
I'm just saying that kinda mentality can get new people coming in and get people logging in "just one more time" - and it's not like they're codes for real money value; just BP codes is what got some of my circle back into DBD last holiday season.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510427#Comment_2510427
The problem with your whole argument is it presumes 2 incorrect positions
1. That I only mentioned top level streamers, which I didn't, I also said tournament players.
2. That no DBD streamers are great, or in fact, tournament level players of the game.
You explicitly call out OTz as not being a great killer, which is your opinion to have, but he's a really good killer by most people's approximation. And what about players like Zubat? There are plenty of examples that upend your argument on that base alone, but you still haven't addressed the fact that tourney players do the same thing in most cases, with the best killers(or best campers).
Of course most of these players aren't the general player base, but there are plenty of good survivors that aren't on a tournament team, and that's what so many content creators were comparing about MMR for, it's not literally just the same four survivors they would play, they would just be playing against a run of the mill optimal SWF group game after game that would negatively affect their content.
And lastly, 2K is not necessarily a win, that's a draw
Let's break this down like you did:
- I only commented on streamers because tournament play isn't a typical sandbox experience, and while some tournament players do play with toxic tactics they're not consistently doing well and many have more in their arsenal than what is essentially the "give up for cruise control" method. It's not something rewarded in real play except by the braindead or uncaring.
- For your second strawman, there's not much to address: the pretense that because tournament play and tournament players show this style proves it has merit is inherently wrong. Content is content, and especially tournament play is made worse when one side is simply optimal versus engaging.
- As for the last thing - I agree that a 2k isn't a real win, but BHVR has stated differently. My personal definition of a win varies, but it's more based on whether I think I did well or improved a particular skill - we all have different metrics, and I'll take a 1k where I think everyone did well over a 4k where the other team performed sub-par.
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I'm in the minority of killer mains in that I don't particularly mind keys. I like my moris, you get to like keys, and when I'm playing with friends it's a nice feeling to have that rush.
The hatch spawn mechanics, however, could at the very least use clarification, so that killers and survivors work with the same information: since survivors (off the top of my head) have two methods of tracking the hatch, I like the notion of a respawned hatch foiling the "sacrifice a few minutes disconnect penalty for a free escape" tech.
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While I think some matches are fairer, that goes out the window when crossplay and SWFs join the fray - the systems just don't seem equipped to handle it. I've been playing roughly 50k/50s since the new matchmaking, versus 60k/40s before, and the system also can't seem to handle spikes in player function or quantity.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510343#Comment_2510343
Ok, so what does any of that have to do with what I said? I didn't remark on all top level streamers being amazing.
That wasn't the point. The best streamers still use tunneling and camping, do they not? Optimal play may be boring for many, but that isn't the point either. We're doing everything to deny the fact that at the end of the day, what I said was correct. If you want to win consistently, there are times you will need to tunnel, and possibly even camp, as much as someone else online might not like it..
Aso, I only ever use the streamers argument because so many of you here like to sight them as the top experts of DBD. Frankly idgaf of OTz shows videos of him losing constantly or not (although he is personally my fav DBD streamer), that doesn't take away from his wins and what he does to achieve them, and he's got as many hours as anyone playing this game.
It has to do with what you said because you brought them up as an example of people who use these tactics - and my point is that these people, regardless of following, are poor examples of anything. What you said is correct, these people use those tactics: and my point stands that they're wrong to do so. If you want to win, which by BHVR standards is a 2k: no, you don't need to tunnel or camp. You are, in fact, giving up on the potential for more if the survivors involved have a lick of sense.
I wouldn't 'cite' OTz as a top expert of DBD, nor most of the names I see put forth as 'proof' of something an individual takes issue with, and I'd laugh at those who did - they're experts in content creation, not in gameplay. If any content creators are 'experts', it'll be the dataminers and white hats reporting on exploits. Their credibility is further hit by fellow content creators calling out the hypocrisy and inconsistency of people who pretend that tunnels and camps are necessary.
Understanding why someone has a following, and the bias inherent to all content creation, is important for understanding why they may be a particularly bad source for examples.
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The threat of the chainsaw is better than as an actual weapon - he definitely feels weaker, but I think if players adjust he can be found to be pretty balanced, similar to the Nurse rework.
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I like the grade system. It feels more intuitive, even if it's mostly just a slightly clarified version of ranks.
SBMM isn't great, but as long as I'm getting my 2-4k games and getting at least one of my friends out the door, I'm largely content. My friend and I had a fun day recently of going through killer adepts - I'm apparently better at Nurse than I thought, with a conservative playstyle, even against the SWFs I was getting.
I am getting absolute trash from console teammates, though, which was a problem before the new systems. I really wish that SBMM seemed more consistent when it came to cross-platform play.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510299#Comment_2510299
FOMO is great to make players engaged.
Frankly, FOMO is historically best coupled with artificial scarcity rather than legitimate scarcity - it lets people ride multiple hype trains, which the games and toy industry excels at providing.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510282#Comment_2510282
Which is why top level streamers and tourney players so do it... Mhm totally not a biased opinion
"Top level streamers" aren't particularly good players. Truly optimal play is pretty boring, regardless of game: you don't get a following for pure success, you get a following for near misses, close failures, and enough savvy to spin a narrative. Plus, when "top level streamers" also call out how laughably fallacious that narrative is, that argument is proven just as silly as the people who fall for it.
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Pig Drill <3
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Tunneling isn't a must for any killer.
It's a must for players who've artificially capped their skill ceiling by choosing to blame others for their own lack of competence.
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I like to play against SWFs, as long as they're not just sound-griefing and the like. Coordinated teams can actually make for more chill killer matches, because dang if they don't get predictable.
There's no killer I dislike playing against, especially when the killer understands the power and isn't reducing themselves to M1 camps and tunnels. It really helps get into a rhythm as survivor if you and the killer both understand how you operate.
Skill is why I play the game, but being able to relax is why I keep going.
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"Most fun" can be very subjective. I will, personally, like killers with extreme highs and lows - it's why I main Pig.
I deliberately avoid toxic playstyles, I'm playing a game not trying to ruin other people's time, so I don't always get the full 4k.. but when a head pops, I can't help but smile. It makes the more frustrating games worth it.
I also play a lot of Doctor, but that feels like cheating - I can pretty easily fill up my emblem points just toying with survivors, so I'll often play pretty casually. It lets me just play chill music and listen to the screams :P
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2508627#Comment_2508627
I'd rather base kit kindred over hearing mouth breathing 14 year olds. I know it will be more work for the balancing team, but it is the better option.
Or worse, the inevitable screaming of a kid and their parent, or terrible music blasting distorted nonsense in proximity - or worse, across the map. Voice comms are part of why a lot of other asymmetrical horror games fail.
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Buff? No. Rework to update functionality to reflect the current sandbox? Absolutely.
The Add-Ons are the biggest issue, frankly, as otherwise she's still solid for a player who bothers to understand her use.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2506719#Comment_2506719
What are you on about? Nobody is talking about 20 second 3 man on gen. Thats not how you rush. You rush by spreading out 3 survivors with brand new part, and 1 dedicated chaser. Thats 3 gens done by the time the killer stops the 4th survivor with a flashlight who baits the killer to the closest T-wall. By the time you hook that person your 4th gen is likely about to be 50%. <---And this is an extreme scenario, but it still happens roughly 20% of the time at the tippity top of MMR. The other 40% are survivors in premades spreading out and spawning spread out. Get your first chase in and its 20/20 minimum, <---thats half a gen with no perks. And its also assuming the survivor is brain dead and can't lead a chase further than 20 seconds only pressing W. The average thing that happens is by the time you hook the first person 2-3 gens are done. I don't give a damn if you're the strongest nurse in the game, I hang out with that guy constantly and his games still get a 3 pop even if he goes 20/20. So miss me with that excuse. The only people that should be making excuses for this are the devs.
Genrush. Doesn't. Exist.
A lack of map pressure allowing survivors to do their one task in the game isn't some sacred, secret art or forbidden technique, it's just bad game design. The idea that 'genrush' exists fosters the delusion that the issue is somehow laid on survivors, which is why I'll not tolerate it.
Your example is a killer being baited - the killer's fault. Your example is survivors spreading out and using the tools provided to them, a method recommended by the current mechanics of the game - BHVR's fault. The only time a 'genrush' could be real in this era of the game is if 2-man 25 second gens were the plan and able to be done with consistency - which, while possible, just isn't a thing without mitigating circumstance.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2505628#Comment_2505628
"Genrush isn't even real"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRx8rOH_Tuo
This is still more or less the same game as it was 11 months ago with Dead Hard being mega buffed and Vacuum pallets back into the game. There hasn't been any changes to gen speed, and I can still co-op with friends and kill all gens in under 4 minutes.
Tru3 gets streamsniped by crazies all the time, even as people deliberately getting into his lobby, and it's technically possible to get a 20-22 second gen. He's not an example of typical play, and I stand by what I said kiddo.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2506354#Comment_2506354
Im not believing a reddit post from over three years ago.
And yes "basically doesn't do anything" is pretty much the same as "slightly" anyways.
Sounds about right. Don't believe data, don't believe the people in charge, just believe what you're told by a known feature of game design giving a pretense of reward.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2506303#Comment_2506303
Tell me you didn't read the post without telling me you didn't read the post 2: electric boogaloo
I read the post. I'm commenting on the people this post is about - tell me you can't read context without reading context.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2506294#Comment_2506294
I believe the game more than the players
Believe the data, but if you have to: believe the devs.
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Considering how quick I see totems pop, I'm shocked people would call it OP with any sincerity - but this is DBD
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2506266#Comment_2506266
It's not a rumour, the game literally tells you every time before you prestiege.
The game literally tells you that, and then players ran the numbers - it's a lie.
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@Deon_1 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2505628#Comment_2505628
Post the killer(s) you mainly use and your perks , please . & don't lie either , you're anonymous .
Pig, Doctor, Trapper, in that order, and frankly I don't use a set string of perks. I typically have 1 slow and three info perks, and all that's been historically and currently enough to keep my rank/grade up.
And yes, I'll happily call people who behave that way toxic and lesser. I'm not gonna be baited into naming and shaming, but when your following is based on how toxic you are, it's not because of your skill.
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I actually had an unbreakable pallet on Gideon's too, but I wasn't able to report because of a crash. Best of luck with this one
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Still doing fine with Pig, explicitly because of people like OP.
Overconfident or dismissive survivors get stomped, it's the way of things in most asymmetrical horror.
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@psionic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2505598#Comment_2505598
You must be kidding. Do you even play killer?
Killer main, easily over 2,000 hours. Genrush isn't even real since the changes from the old days, tunneling and camping plateau your personal skill to the point you're as braindead as the NOED/Dead Hard-dependent, and some third thing which baby killers tout as a necessary strat despite being inherent evidence of something lacking from the player's arsenal.
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@psionic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2505481#Comment_2505481
Camp and tunnel against SWF is a MUST.
If you want to be the "good samaritan" it's up to you. But don't call people bad players when they are trying to have a fair match at least.
"Camp and tunnel is a must"
"Trying to have a fair match"
No. I think people with actual skill are gonna call you a bad player when you actively hurt your ability to pressure gens and do most scoring events in the match.
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A big issue is the poor implementation of the reworked totem spawns, which has consistently resulted in unbreakable totems. Along with the general issues with geometry this game has, I'd like them to fix their design process before they add more maps - we'd have more variety, but if the last few map releases are examples they've got some behind the scenes (likely staffing) problems they need to clean up.