Elan
Elan
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- Elan
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They want so see how impactfull those buffs to her were in order to cancel the rework they announced. Yet due to live stream from past I imagine they haven't started it yet apart from concepts.
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Imagine if they create alternative realm for Vecna (upside down) and give Demogorgon access to this realm too. Would be insane. Sadly, I doubt that we will have more maps when Vecna will come out, as they stated that new map will be out in March and will be very unique.
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@SoGo said:
Feedback is welcome.
Basekit Change:
• Severed Tongue is now fully basekit.Choclo Corn (Common):
• Now reduces the disintegration timer of crows by 4 seconds.Oil Paints (Common):
• Now it makes it so crows are no longer fully repeled when entering a locker, only making the repel action jump by 50%.Vibrant Obituary (Common):
• Now also has the former effect of the Oil Paints (Increased detection radius of Crows).Automatic Writing (Uncommon):
• Now removes the cooldown after crows disintegrate altogether. When a crow disintegrates, it just immediately returns to you.Still Life Crow (Uncommon):
• Increases the crow disintegration timer by 6 seconds.O Grief, O Lover (Rare):
• Now lingers for 5 seconds.Charcoal Stick (Rare):
• Increases the Crow placement speed by 50%.
• Mutes Crow placing sounds.
(Idea by @Carniveris )Silver Bell (Rare):
• Now lingers for 8 seconds after the swarm is removed.Severed Tongue (Very Rare):
• Now increases the hitbox of flying crows by 15%.Ink Egg (Very Rare):
• Remove the downside completely.Garden Of Rot (Iridescent -> Very Rare):
• Now extends the Flight Path by 2 meters.
(Idea by @Carniveris and @HolyDarky )Iridescent Feather (Iridescent):
• Now doesn't require all crows to be released to activate. The duration of the Undetectable is set to be 200% of the cooldown's duration.Iridescent feather was always a weird one to me. If I remember it still decreases crows by 1 for some reason.
→ Remove downside of losing crow
→ When you damage swarmed survivor, Artist is granted undetectable for 30s
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Spreading hooks between 2 survivors is not tunneling. I play friends and it's completely random but chances that it would chose the same two survivors over and over is absolutely minimal and if it's still not tunneling. Also survivors are notified of becoming obsession so they have headstart before killer comes and also can avoid becoming obsession by hiding in a locker.
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note: I was lying, lunge is 2m, not 5m
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4035848#Comment_4035848
True she is more managable... but she fell off uber hard after she got nerfed. She was pretty common on her release, cause she was insane strong... but now she has been nerfed, despite being still quite strong she is 27th in pick rate on Nightlight...
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XCB6JST8KGGQ/screenshot-20251208-185827-firefox.jpg
This is a pretty insane falloff for any killer... and the reason is quite simple... why play Krasue, who is basically just a dash killer with extra steps over the likes of Kaneki, Blight or Wesker?
Kaneki is stronger and easier, Blight is way stronger, and Wesker is similar strength but much more engaging with more skill expression.
Krasue is cookie cutter killer design, when you get down to it, she is just a 4.8 scamper bot with her spit being the only thing that changes anything up, and because her infection is meaningless, the spit doesn't bring anything engaging either.
Krasue does nothing to stand out on her own. She could have been poised to be the more chase oriented Plague... as is she just another dash killer with extra steps.
I agree that Krasue fell off after pretty significant nerfs. Two truly massive nerfs that made her feel not so good to play was 1) wind up being nerfed along with the collision sliding (0.2s and 0.6s to 0.32s and 0.30s) 2) pallet vault being nerfed from 1.5s to 1.9s making holding w against her over loops pretty good counterplay without interesting mindgames that the old scamper offered. She is the only killer who's excluded from using most perks when in active mode (head form). I wouldn't call her dash killer as it's more of 5m long lunge in third person that offer hug teching. In loops she fell off in 1v1 because you pretty much just predrop pallet, hold w around loop and when she closes distance you go for 50/50 and with nerfed wind up it's much easier to react. I think her core design doesn't offer uniqness unless she's compeltely reworked. Whole her playstyle is 1) find someone, 2) infect them 3) fly on them, 4) play 50/50, hold w untill you get hit, 5) fly on them again, 6) repeate whole cycle
I'll leave there a few pinpoint I made to anyone who feels she's still strong
→ Autoaim got nerfed to track survivor within 5m, meaning if you stay further from the object she can bounce the spit off, there is very high chance that you will keep dodging it, similiar to PH's punishment
→ Krasue can curve her whip attack only at the beggining of lunge, meaning that if you keep "360", there is very high chance she will miss, lose valuable distance
→ Crouching, stairs and bigger objects have high chance of missing her whip on you
→ bodyblocking is by far the most viable startegy to slow her down massively and force her to keep switching, leaving you fungus on spot, so you can switch with your teammate once he get cleansed and repeat. Krasue will have to go to body form
→ If you are in filler, just run around and keep watching her (if she doublebacks, flies etc.), she will move 0.8m/s faster so it will take her time to close the gap and she can't hit you with whip if she doesn't prewind up at middle of the side, at worst it will be 50/50 hit
→ Dodge the spit in the open carefully, if you turn back to her, you will lose distance and she may get free hit
→ Keep in mind that her whip is about 5m longer lunge attack, imagine door at shack to it's corner
→ Keep in mind that she has about 1.5s cooldown when stopping flight, so you can spin her before she lunges
→ Lunges from further than 1.5m will play the wind up animation, therefore are easier to spin, close whips can be adjusted much easier and will most likey result in a hit
→ Stunning Krasue in head form is easier, due to her wind up time, keep in mind, that head stuns last 0.5s longer
→ keep in mind, that when Krasue is in head form she has access to aura and regression perks, but she can't utilize most of other perks (superior, dark arrogance, brutal strenght, unbound,…) so you may keep in mind that a lot of options other killers have she can't use
→ Keep in mind that her head form moves at 4.8m/s and can't get any faster
→ Don't leave the loops when getting hits, she will have to cycle through the catch up play to down you, this will buy you way more time than abandoning the loop.
→ keep in mind that Krasue vaulting a pallet takes roughly 2s, which means that any safer pallets must be broken by her to damage you. Don't panic, she has enough cooldowns for you to utilize the pallet before she will be able to hit you
→ Always take fungus with you, there are 6 fungi total
→ If you are chased by krasue and infected and have fungus, don't eat it, unless you are sure you will be in safe area to outlast the cleanse duration
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@LeviathanEmperor said:
Good afternoon, dear developers, I am one of the players and ardent fans of your game, I want to suggest an idea. Can you examine it? The idea is to place 1 or 2 "houses", places where survivors can hide from the maniac and he will not be able to reach them, the camping system will be active, like hooks, so the maniac will have to switch to other survivors. This system will make the gameplay even more exciting. And the survivors won't hide there forever, they'll have to get out to fix generators or otherwise help the team if they want to get more blood points. I hope you will consider my idea.
Despite it's not good idea something new would defienetly help the game, however most people reject anything new, fresh or meta-changing simply because they don't want to adjust the core flow of the matches.
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Scamper shouldn't come back at all. Look how they had to nerf Krasue's scamper, by 0.4s, somehow Ghoul still has fast scamper + 50 % hinderance and I don't understand why. What I would like to see for Chucky? One of this options…
A) Revert cooldown back to 8s, but keep 8m/s dash speed
B) Revert 10m/s dash speed, but keep 12s cooldown
C) Revert flicks limitations but keep both cooldown and speed
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@lettuchia said:
Imagine complaining about a dash power being generic but wanting "m1 with stat buffs" to come back. We don't need a compromise, we need people to stop complaining that Myers finally has a salvageable power design
It's not the point. Myers was different from other killers. There are so many dash killers - Chucky, Pig, Wesker, Krasue, Blight, Kaneki,… he just lost identity to become one of them but much better. Tell me why would you play Chucky over Myers? Or Pig? Now all his stalk is just to stare at someone for 10s to become instadown 60s dash killer that shreds through pallet, which again there are many pallet shredding killers - Demo, Nemo, Blight… but none of them have instadown, which again is just powercreeping after powercreeping.
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@SoGo said:
This is... completely wrong data wise?
I don't feel like chacking the wiki rn, but I'd swear that the fastest repair speed with 4 survivors on a gen was around 40 seconds.
Also, 110 second gens would be a bore. I'd rather see buffs to Pain Res.
Nah, long gens are boring way to go. There may be some other adjustments.
→ Injured survivor grants speed debuff (thana basekit)
→ Each unique hook damages all gens by let's say 10 %
→ Deadlock basekit etc.
From my survivor games I defienetly feel that gens are flying or not flying, Sometimes my teams don't touch gens for 5mins and the other time everyone has own progress on gens = 3 gens done if survivor does well in a chase.
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I never truly enjoyed Myers neither playing against him, but now it feels like playing against Bubba on steroids with extra steps, you have pallet, you survive for moment, you don't, you die. With lucky RNG you can last a while, with some (fe. new Cowshed) you gonna die no matter what.
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I think they stated that Spirit was last killer to receive unique theme as new killers always get it and older killers mostly got it. I think that currently the og chase is Trapper, Wraith, Huntress, Plague, Freddy, Bubba, Pig… Only Myers had unique theme all untill Demogorgon.
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New killer: Cult leader (Dahlia Gillespie)
Passive power: Dahlia can place up to 3 manifestation of her around map, every manifestation has it's own strenght and weakness.
M1: Moves at 7m/s, can break gens, pallets, walls but cannot damage survivors. Can cast curse of false vision, false vision causes survivors to see halucinations (wrong progress on gens, hook stages, heals, see broken totems as unbroken, repaired gens as unrepaired…) Survivor get's cursed when repairing cursed gen, vaulting cursed pallet or window.
M2: Moves at 4.4m/s, wield dual blades, can be repositioned and remotely controled to do lunge forward, causes deep wounds on injury and broken for 60s when downed. Cannot perfrom damage actions.
M3: Moves at 3.8m/s, can be used to block area, doesn't work within 16m of hooked survivor.
Active power: Barb wires
Dahlia can put traps on pallets, windows and gens. Interacting with these causes injury but can't down survivors. Survivors can remove barb wire but are revealed by killer instinct when doing so.
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@KingOfDoom55 said:
How about demogorgon gets an addon pass or power rework or buffs? I've noticed that demo hasn't gotten any changes for a long time and since ST chpt2 is coming out next month, it'll be the perfect time to give some deserved changes, for example: his portals, the cooldown to use them is... bad, just to say, and not reliable compared to most other killer mobility and his abyss still had a action input delay/buffer period before you can even use a shred attack (attempting to do so used a m1 instead, ruining the moment to use shred) and some of they're addond are... not good, the useful ones like the iri ones provide a notice and useful change and unique, old lifeguard wistle was great (even if op) was unique in its own right for obvious reasons, but most of his addons affect his portals and barely any for his shred that DOESNT decrease cooldowns, adding or reworking one to insta down but remove the ability to break pallets is an example (altho, I wouldn't recommend adding that one, as it is an example) would make them more unique and feel like demo has so much potential for a rework or addon pass, but will accept some good buffs as well but I feel like addon passing or rework would be a better choice in my opinion
Demogorgon is a bit tricky. His antiloop - shred is very solid but his teleport is bit outdated. They might do few adjustments:
→ Instant portal placement
→ Instant portal activation
→ Added recycle system, similiar to Hag
→ Make teleport through portal silent
→ Increase base undetectable a bit
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@SoGo said:
I agree with buffing Rotten Swine.
Elixir is fine as is, imo. Remember, it works in Head Form.
That's true, but you have to spit, wait out 1.3s cooldown then vault and it feels a bit too clunky.
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Okey, I just opened an idea to further discussion, chill. May some of those suggestions seem good to you, despite adjustments or not?
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@Gandor said:
What would be the counterplay?
This is like asking - would it be broken if survivors got 5m/s base movement speed?
The counterplay would be exact same, spread out and don't let him 5th hit, bodyblock etc.
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@juciy8717 said:
thank you for defending me and how am I copying I literally put best to worst elan so get fax checked I've been playing sense 2021 and 2023, I put them worst to best so ok
Copycat is more of a community repetitive opinions. Fe. They said Dredge is A tier a few years back, now after he got multiple buffs, everyone is saying he's top worst killers. I mean, he's bad, but it's how overall opinions are changed on some narratives.
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@CompetitifDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4035723#Comment_4035723
Brother, Krasue is not B tier. Kaneki, Lary and Billy are not S tiers. Houndmaster is NOT C tier!!! 😭 Wdym he's being a copycat? His tierlist is completely different, and WAY more realistic than yours.
I'll tell you why I stated them there. Of course there are multiple opinions, so I'm not arguing.
Krasue is top of B because good players can spin her whip but most people just eat the damage to get the speed, you can crouch her whip, you can camp the pallets, you can hold w around pallets, so against good players she has quite long time to down. Her antiloop isn't that great either, in scenario of her dash in loops there are a lot of killers who can do better, she has the comfort of third person though. Bodyblock, revaults, crouching, a lot of fungi etc. Against average she's bottom A at best with iri addon and disolution.
Ghoul is S and tha't nothing I'll argue about. There is nonexisting skill floor to do everything, instant catch up into m1s, free injury through walls, 1s scamper, 50 % hindred, slodown in term of mending. He has everything, and not even good Ghoul players can still do very well.
Billy requires a lot of skill, but him having insane map mobility, skipping health states, ignoring obstacles etc. Good Billy will sh*t on you.
Singularity now also requires no skill as they gave him aim assists into everything, you can no longer destroy pods, just disable them and in overlock he has free acces to 5 killer perks. S, sorry.
Houndmaster is another example of counterplay or no counterplay. When you go against people who know the counterplay, they will just camp every pallet to force you being m1 killer, redirections are pretty ez to dodge. I'm HM main, I know her cryptonids. Again, again low skilled player she might be A against good players she's C, sorry, I love her, but she's terrible.
My tierlist comes from high mmr and skilled players. At low mmr, we can say that Pig and Onryo are S tier because they will kill 30 % of players with their power.
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@tes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4035577#Comment_4035577
She will stomp solo q still more likely. But. Average solo q.
Bodyblock her to protect infected survivor, and she becomes so harmless. I played against her even on her strongest period, and it was really stressful when no one help you. But I had match when player on her felt so miserable just by constant bodyblocking, first time I felt I am bullying someone in this game.
And that’s so ironic… so sfw more likely gonna feel better already having advantages, while solo suffering by default
Yeah, I mean she's more managable in solo now. You have more time to react to her whip wind up, if she uses scamper you have a lot of time to step forward and revault tech and crouch tech also work against her.
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Seems like copycat.
- Nurse S tier
- Blight S tier
- Billy S tier
- Ghoul S tier
- Larry S tier
- Dracula A tier
- Krause B tier
- Twins A tier
- Plague B tier
- Spirit A tier
- Pyramid Head B tier
- Wesker B tier
- Hound master C tier
- Oni A tier
- Freddy A tier
- Vecna DND B tier
- Artist C tier
- Micheal Myers A tier
- Pin head B tier
- Huntress B tier
- Chucky tier
- Unknown C tier
- Spring trap B tier
- Xenomorph B tier
- Nemesis B tier
- Death slinger B tier
- Hag F tier
- Wraith B tier
- Clown A tier
- Skull merchant F tier
- Knight B tier
- Dredge F tier
- Bubba/Leather face D tier
- Doctor D tier
- Sadako c tier
- Pig D tier
- Legion B tier
- Trickster B tier
- Demogorgon B tier
- Ghost face C tier
- Trapper F tier
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@tes said:
I would like all killers having their own lunge length depends on their weapon and power type, as well as just fixing client priority on servers and textures on maps.
The perfect world where Blight stick doesn’t have smaller hit box, while Billy crouchtech fixed well… by making his hitbox actually feel like chainsaw.
Lunge killers having more kind of projection hit box, that “fade down” at the end of animation…
This tbh can add some variability to killer and giving a new breath to M1 killers for example :/ While you can use this mechanic as a natural way to tune down strong killers and rather encourage actual ability usage…
About Krasue: I think she is doomed either being miserable or broken. As well as Ghoul. Their core design extremely cheap and poor.
As I said, Krasue got nerfed significantly, while Ghoul is still too powerfull for very low skill ceiling. There is no world where Krasue would be at Ghoul lvl. Her scampers last too long, so they are truly pointless, her mobility is the only powerfull aspect of her kit.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4035544#Comment_4035544
I'm 100 with you on Myers/Chucky.
Not so sure about the Thai culture statement though... considering I'm specifically asking for the elements of her kit that are derived from Thai culture actually become part of her kit, instead of little more than trial scenery...
She is at least passable... but she is very "eh..." in her current form. Very little unique or interesting about her. She basically plays like a non existent cooldown Unknown for a few seconds, looking for an environment bounce on her ranged shot, before becoming a 4.8m/s OG Scamper Chucky with no cooldown…
If the point of each killer is to be unique, Krasue is doing a pretty poor job given half her mechanics literally don't matter, and the ones that do are just jacked up versions of existing killers.
There are very few unique killers, half of them are dash killers half of them are zoning killers. I don't agree that Krasue is not unique though. There are killers with much better dash abilities but not with third person camera. In term of loops she's more of 50/50 and her letahlity in term of 1v1 is not as good as some other killers have because at this point you close gap untill 5é/5é and so on. Not much things can change her to be more unique, and making her infection-based killer would make her more uninteresting as all you would do is spam reg and we have already enough range killers.
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@UndeddJester said:
Also to anyone downvoting, I would appreciate an explanation why if you'd be so kind?
I would happily debate with you, but you've currently given me nothing to work with... So to cover the only arguments I can think of:
- Don't want to have to land multiple hits. Plague seems to manage fine having to land multiple hits, and she's not got a movement speed steroid on demand. She has shorter range, no auto tracking, pretty much the same cooldown and a longer wind up time than Krasue... and she has to also down as an m1 killer afterwards, so I don't see an issue here.
- Don't want to deal with broken. It takes 3 hits of regurgitate to become broken. Again that's about the same as Plague, and unlike Plague, shrooms can be eaten on the move. Not to mention hitting you in Head form is probably faster. Once you're hooked, broken is removed as you go back to partial infection... so broken isn't really a game breaker... what difference is it being broken and injured and just being Injured if you're already in chase?
- This makes Krasue too weak. Again Plague seems to work perfectly fine, and I see no reason why this Krasue would struggle any more than Plague. We're introducing some slowdown mechanics and making body blocking less effective vs. Krasue too. Numbers can be always be tweaked, it's more the concept that matters.
- Krasue isn't about infection, that's Plague game. So she's just a dash/scamper killer with extra steps? I don't feel like that really makes her stand out amongst the myriad of other killers that do what she does already. The most striking part of her kit is the green fungi, which is clearly an important part of the characters lore/mythos, as is the leech mechanic... why have it at all if it doesn't matter for her power?
Other than that I don't know where the push back is coming from... She could be a nice midground between Plague and Wesker with these changes, where Plague is full infection gameplay, Wesker is mostly chase with a little infection, while Krasue is half infection, half chase...
If that vision is the wrong way, I'm interested in other ideas... but as it stands I can't escape the feeling her whole leech system feels kinda tacked on now it is removed when hooked, and she's otherwise just a 4.8 scamper bot with extra steps.
I would compare this to old Chucky, Old Krasue was overtuned but now is somewhat fine. Surely with recent Myers there is no reason to play Chucky anymore, so I'll leave Krasue as she is to those few players who like the thai culture
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Sorry to both, I'm stupid. I ran it on Demo and somehow didnt noticed it's only lv 2. Thanks for feedback
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
It was always 4%, it hasn't been nerfed
Went from 8 stacks max to 7
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@CrimsonMothKing said:
It hasn't been nerfed?
And it does kinda stack with Fire Up, just pick up speed is capped at 42%, so once Fire Up gets 2 stacks it stops.
Went from 8 stacks max to 7
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I've played Krasue a lot. The proposal of her being 4.4 is fine, but I don't think she needs multiple reg. hits to inflict leech one. The nerfed autoaim is sometimes pretty inconsistent and direct hits are way harder mid looping. I think the leech 2 is overall pointless to have, because it's just punishment for people who ignore it long enough. At the same point though I don't like the idea of spamming reg to force someone into leech 2. What I would do:
→ Increase time it takes to reach leech 2 from 60s to 70s
→ If leech 2 is gained, survivors can't decrease leech meter by eating glowing fungi anymore and leech will only be removed when hooked.
→ Decrease glowing fungi max count to 4 so survivors actually have to run for them in order to use them, currently there are 6 and if 4 survivors hold one, 2 will be respawning.
→ Chicken head will still increase fungi count by 2
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Killer main here, if I exclude the tunneling at 5 gens, main reason why killers don't spread hooks are:
→ Massive balance gap between killers
- Nurse, Blight, Kaneki, Billy
- Dracula, Krasue, Singularity
- ….
- Pig, hag, Ghostie, Trapper, Skully
→ Fast gen speed
- gen related perks
- no gen defence vs gen defence builds without in game base generator slowdown
→ Poor performance when killer needs to maintain pressure, fe. tunnel someone out when he has 3 hooks, two of them on same survivor
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@KingOfDoom55 said:
Her power allows her to infect any and every interactable object aside from her fountains and infects survivors and lasts a long time
The only way to prevent full infect is use the fountains which gives your location away and gives the killer a op m2 which, if angled correctly, can go up to 20-30 meters I believe and able to swiped left to right extremely fast to almost always guarantee hit, and in rare instances, she can 2 tap someone to down them with the same vile stream if their at full health, combine this with gen lock down, and it makes it impossible to escape, all matches I have had with her always ends up with a 3 or 4ks
And the only way to not get full infection to not run, do gens, or totems (not sure sure chests) in order to not get fully infected, but not only that, when she hooks someone, she can infect them if they aren't already but it also KEEPS THEIR CURRENT SICKNESS PROGRESS and it injuries and permanently causes the broken affect until its gotten rid of, and it's not fun to be damned if you and damned if you don't,
People complained about day 1 wesker being op with 8% hindered with hit infection staying at its current progress even on hook (or increases while on hook, idk if that was a thing, but I think it was, correct me if I'm wrong) and bc of it, his infection doesn't do anything other than passive slowdown which doesn't really do anything aside from giving him a insta carry when they are infected and injured (or insta carry when healthy and fully infected which almosy NEVER happens)
I'm surprised not many people are talking about how op she is and unfair she is, yes, ik loops and corners are your best friend against her, but, even so, it's way to difficult to not get downed from 20ish meters away by a spec of vile stream (it also has a short cooldown as well, making it easy to attack again after the first)
Plague is fine. Her iri add ons a bit overtuned, apart from that I don't see any reasons nerfing her. Iridescent seal might be the only add on needing nerf. Or at least notification from black incense that it's in play.
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@Steakdabait said:
She is unfortunately has to be clunky with how she was designed or she will be back to insanely oppressive(which she already is in the 1v1 still) again. Scamper is a black and white mechanic and is probably one of the worse mechanics in the game to play against when it's too strong while still feeling really bad when correctly tuned.
There isn't a way to fix her with variable changes alone imoI disagree. She doesn't need reverts or crazy buffs. Just to be a bit smoother to play. She still has quite a lot of counterplay and just minor tweaks compromised between current and release Krasue might be enough. Buffing the stun back to 2s and increasing leech from whip might be enough.
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@Leon_Loves_Cheryl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4034377#Comment_4034377
P100 high MMR Ghoul main here. I'm seeing a lot of opinions from people who are either very average at the game, or do not fully understand intended design. I want to clarify some of these suggestions and explain why they aren't the best possible solution for Ghoul.
Revert leap distance to 16m
Yes. The initial leap distance reduction was unnecessary. I've been saying this since that change was implemented. All they had to do was reduce the range in which you can grab survivors by two meters, not the range of the entire power by two meters. Hopefully they do this some day because 14 meters does not feel nearly as good to play as 16 did. (It also made Ghoul addon-reliant on Handkerchief, and making Killers addon-reliant is never a good thing.)
Revert 1 token lose when breaking pallet
No. Losing tokens on breaking pallets is designed to counterbalance his ability to catch you outside of loops with his power. If you outplay him at a loop and force him to break the pallet, you should receive a payoff for that. Two tokens is the perfect sweet spot and it is the best alternative to increasing his cancel cooldown (which would be a horrible change because it would remove all the cooler plays you can do with his power if it had a longer cancel cooldown.) Cancel cooldown in this context is referring to the amount of time he has to wait before he can basic attack. You want this to be at its current value because it encourages him to use his power offensively and to cut off Survivor pathing rather than purely for mobility. Losing tokens on pallet break is the best compromise for this mechanic.
Remove deepwound from grab attack
No. Multiple reasons for this.
- From a game design perspective, it "feels weird" to attack an Injured Survivor with your power and for it to just…not do anything. Applying Deep Wound solves this weird feeling problem by still doing some form of "damage".
- As an M1 Killer, Kaneki is extremely vulnerable to Exhaustion perks but especially ones that result in Deep Wound such as Dead Hard. Smart Kaneki players have the option of Deep Wounding an already injured Survivor to shut down their Dead Hard, rewarding intelligent play. Removing this ability will lower Kaneki's skill cap and also make him significantly more vulnerable to exhaustion perks for no good reason as he is already an M1 Killer.
Increase time it takes to vault when enraged by 0.2s
This is by far the worst suggestion here. Absolutely do not do this. His enraged vault is literally his only anti-loop, and it isn't even consistent anti-loop (some loops require some trial-and-error to find out which ones you can actually catch the survivor at if you enraged vault.) The vault itself also has counterplay by staying out of Ghoul's sight if he's on the other side of the pallet so he can't lock onto you to vault. Nerfing the vault just lowers the skillcap of playing against Ghoul for no good reason while also significantly increasing the number of loops in which this maneuver is effectively useless/a time waster for the Killer, and it lessens the value of becoming Enraged. Literally one of the worst possible suggestions.
Increase cooldown before retaining full movement speed after canceling leap by 0.5s
No, for similar reasons as above. At least your suggestion isn't saying to lengthen the delay before his basic attack, but in a similar vein movement is all Ghoul truly has, so reducing his movespeed in any fashion and for any duration is incredibly crippling to his ability to catch up and cut off, which is what he's all about. This is how his power is meant to work. You shouldn't nerf his ability to move in and cut off survivors because that's the aspect of his kit that actually takes skill.
Rework mori to be shorter and less punishing throughout the game
This is mostly a matter of personal taste rather than opinion, and therefore doesn't really belong in a list of balancing suggestions. Additionally, the devs do not balance the game around mori's because they're just for fun/flavor. They don't provide a massive power boost to the Killer. It's just theatrics. Mori's don't need to be something they fine-tune on a razor's edge. It's fine as is (I really enjoy the animation as it is anyway.)
Cut in half the time a Ghoul can hold tentacles charged
No. He needs that time to figure out his pathing to cut off the survivor. Making it harder to do that (by reducing the time he has to plan out his route) disincentivizes using his power in skillful ways. This lowers Ghoul's skill cap (seeing the pattern in your suggestions yet?)
Decrease grab attack maximum distance to 6m
You have to be joking.
Well, I'm sorry. But Ghoul is truly not healthy at all. Not only because his skill floor is non-existing but because he can do everything with no effort. Let me explain the most frustrating stuff and it's not about skill of survivor but a pure gambling.
→ Ghoul get's free injure on you, that itself is fine for me. The issue is the stun that cancels exhasution perks, has insane range and is still gitting through objects.
→ Ghoul leaps to you, instantly cancel and follow with M1 hit in about 1s that is also not healthy as all catchup killers have cooldowns - Wesker, Krasue, Blight, Nurse, Chucky etc.
→ Pallets are completely gamble and mostly a lose-lose situations - not only that pallets got massively nerfed but Ghoul can:
- Just hold W and hit you,
- Fake tentacles and instantly m1
- Scamper, hinders you for 50 % and get a guaranteed hits on 80 % of pallets,
- Leap over loop nad bodyblock,
- etc. So there is no standard counterplay because you can't gamble 20/1 options he will do.
→ Apply deepwounds on top of mark and can hold power for about 8s, which is ridiculous.
If those things are adjusted, which they announced that they will touch Ghoul eventually with another nerf. I'm truly sorry, but Ghoul = effortless win. That's why I don't play him. And that guy who posted here the same video where he leaps multiple times around pallet to block it is something I haven't seen and I play against P100 Ghouls and Ghouls overall in about 5 of 9 games.
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@Wezqu said:
It does not count as escape in Behavior's in house data but they should really fix it on the stat site to show that they abandoned and if the bot died.
But what is the point of stat tracker when the stats are not correct?
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That seems like pretty weak killer on top of nothing truly reflecting his movie theme. Few debuffs and screams are pretty meh. If he makes survivor float for some time and other survivors have to come, then he would lower survivor side efficiency, which seems way more interesting.
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@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
I heard somewhere on here that any match with an abandon is prettymuch voided off the stats and arent counted, and that it prevents mmr from moving up or down.
That is not true information. If you look at data on official stats, it counts as escapes and lowers your kill rate.
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What I would like to see.
→ Placing portal is instant and imidiately activates it.
→ When teleporting, loud noise remains but Demogorgon can see auras of all injured survivors.
→ Increase detection rate and oblivious radius around portals to 8m
→ Demo can cycle portals if he has all of them set.
→ Increase undetectable when teleporting to 10s
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I hate Ghoul, but I can see some adjustments to make him more fair and more skillfull.
→ Revert leap distance to 16m
→ Revert 1 token lose when breaking pallet
→ Remove deepwound from grab attack
→ Increase time it takes to vault when enraged by 0.2s
→ Increase cooldown before retaining full movement speed after canceling leap by 0.5s
→ Rework mori to be shorter and less punishing throughout the game
→ Cut in half the time a Ghoul can hold tentacles charged
→ Decrease grab attack maximum distance to 6m
At the moment Ghoul is very easy to play and capable of achieving great results without much thinking, which isn't good design.
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@MashedBroccoli said:
the killer can always comeback and win though with the exception of all survivors in the exit gate.bhvr would also have to consider adding killer bots because there are still challenges that require the survivor to reach the end game collapse to complete.
Honestly, i think there should only be 3 abandon situations and bhvr has went too crazy adding them and one they should’ve added they haven’t yet.
4 man slug, slugged for the 4k, all survivors are bots.
If I'm not mistaken, survivor can abandon when:
→ All other survivors are bots (- MMR)
→ When he's downed for the 4th time (- MMR)
→ When he's last survivor standing (- MMR)
→ When no survivor is last standing (- MMR)
Killers can abandon:
→ When all remaining and alive survivors are bots (- MMR)
→ When generator hasn't been completed in last 10mins (- MMR)
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4034063#Comment_4034063
Wrong post. This is about the RPD achievement being awful.
Yaay. Noted. Cheers.
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@Lore said:
Hello, here I'd like to complain about a perk I feel isn't really good at all in the current version of DbD: Undone. 😥
FOR WHOEVER DOESN'T KNOW WHAT UNDONE DOES:
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________When a Survivor misses a healing or repair Skill Check, gain 3 tokens, up to 18/24/30.
When you perform the damage action on a generator, if you have any tokens, consume all of them. For each token consumed, the generator loses 1% total progress and then becomes blocked for 1 second. Then, once the generator is unblocked, it starts regressing.
This perk goes on cooldown for 60 seconds.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
I honestly feel like Undone doesn't have a place in the game: almost no survivors except for new ones ever really fail skill checks enough to justify taking it, and honestly it's a shame because on paper the perk seems really fun and a breath of fresh air when comparing it to some of the rest (unless of course you're running it with a Doctor build or something like that). So… how do we fix this? 🤔
I was thinking that maybe it could gain tokens whenever a survivor hits a GREAT skill check instead, or maybe whenever a survivor completes an action or consumes an item, which would give a lot more value to the perk. 🤩
More ideas are welcome, and I REALLY REALLY hope Undone gets the love it deserves sometime in the future.Thanks for listening to my rant! <3
Hitting great skillchecks should not boost killer's perk. And undone is sort of anti-noob perk.
Rework:
→ For each remaining generator, you have token (max. 5)
→ When you manually damage generator each stack grants: extra 2 % damage and the generator will be blocked for 3s for each stack. There might be 20-30s window before the perk can be used to prevent 3 genning.
=
→ When you kick gen with 5 stacks, the gen loses total 15 % and is blocked for 15s
→ When you kick gen with 4 stacks, the gen loses 13 % and is blocked for 12s
→ When you kick gen with three stacks, the gen loses 11 % and is blocked for 9s
→ When you kick gen with two stacks, the gen loses 9 % and is blocked for 6s
→ When damaging gen with one token, the gen loses 7 % and is blocked for 3s
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The perk has too many downsides to shine over any other perks:
→ You have to be injured, but can't be broken.
→ You have to hit 4 great skillchecks, but can't miss any.
→ You have to heal without interupting.
→ You must have healing perk or item equipped.
Possible reworks:
- When injured, if you hit 4 great skillchecks while repairing, you gain ability to heal yourself without medkit. Perk gets 20 charges and each second of healing consumes one. When fully self-healed, perk disables with it's remaining charges.
- Leave at as is, but bump the bonus to 200 %.
- Token based, fe. max 8. Each great skillcheck grants 1 token for the remainder of the trial, each token grants 10 % faster self-heal.
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I've been playing Artist a lot and I will post my feedback below:
→ She's lacking mobility, which would make sense as she is able to injure and down cross map. Problem is that it works only against noobs.
→ Her put crow in a loop is boring, force to w from survivor and isn't competitive enough
→ Crows auras give a lot of feedback to dodge
I'm sorry to all Artist mains, but I can't see her being any better than bottom of B
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They can just make so you see all gens, despite them being competed or not. It wouldn't be any problematic perk. Out of comms it might help people to not 3 gen.
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@JPLongstreet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033349#Comment_4033349
They definitely need to tweak those killers yes, but there are now problematic pallet spawns on a few maps.
I think that the old long tiles were a bit too much. New are defienetly not as good, but they can be indeed tweaked. We just need to stop ignoring how those 4 killers completely break balance of the game and that everything is caused by them being so much stronger than others. And I will say it again, but Ghoul is not only ovepowerd but also requires almost no effort to play. Which is bad design at first.
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Nah, I think that will simpty make people give up instead of going for late game kills. I'd say if the exits are opened for 1min+ you can abandon
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@ChrysesCat said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033817#Comment_4033817
No I am talking about people using head on to bully instead of using them for saves and abusing them
You cannot abuse Head On anymore, there was era where people could stack exhaustion. I feel like Head On is one of perk that isn't as funny to play against but has counterplay and in the end people don't progress games. I hate more when people don't interact but sit on gens.
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Sometimes the bully squad means:
→ Used items (fe. ex styptics, flashlights…)
→ Used perks (We gonna live forever etc.)
→ Used tiles (Didn't go down instantly)
So I ask what is bullying for you?
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033593#Comment_4033593
Basically they aren't turned off for the whole game, people who run powerful things are usually the ones going for the win, making it miserable for those memeing in the event using the powers etc.
They'd still be playable in the normal queue while the event is up, it's just kind of making the game less extreme in the event mode, iri addons and s-tiers are usually only fun for the one playing them on both sides.Honey, I'm sorry for ruining your dreams, but no matter what everyone in high tiers will run the most unfun things they can. That's why my 95 % of games are Nurses, Ghouls, Billies and Blight with Corrupt, Pain Res, DMS, Surge, Eruption, Pop, Lethal etc. And those 5 % of other killers are usually the same perks and the players play the same way. Every time I try to run anything fun on either side, it will end up with me throwing, because those perks can't compete the other side meta. I don't blame killers to hard tunnel, camp or slug because in the end it's a way to win which is goal in competitive game like dbd. Same way I don't blame survivors for genrush because more than half of the killer roaster is so boring to play against as there is nothing else fun or interactive to do (fe. if you hold W against Knight's bots to get free hit anyway but not double tapped or when you go against Ghoul who requires zero skill to down someone etc.)
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Why would people who main s tier killer unable to play them?
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Decimated borgo spawn same amount of pallets as within density era, I got about 25 pallets on shattered square. Not every pallet was good, but most were.