Blueberry
Blueberry
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What they mean when they say that is that they don't actually understand how DH works at high level play. Same for CoH.
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Hex perks shouldn't glow for survivors, they should all look like dull totems to them. This makes them harder to find as they wont hear them crackling and they'll start wasting more time cleansing all totems since they can't tell which is the right one.
If we're not gonna fix totems spawns this is the next best thing and saves you having to go back and tweak every map.
I don't think your idea of punishing the cleanser is the right route to go.
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Flashlights are fine, if anything quite a few of their addons need buffs.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2942059#Comment_2942059
they did not. I am just saying that for some killers, they don't even need to put any effort to make them strong/viable. just revert their previous changes and they're probably close to competing against SWF. they were already balanced around SWF arguably.
I see what you’re saying, I guess I just feel that’s giving them too much credit. I think it was just coincidence. But yeah, just revert to old forms, it won’t happen though unfortunately.
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@RisingTron said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2942059#Comment_2942059
Spirit 100% needed to be butchered I'm afraid. Although I would've just been happy with the Iron Will buff, the rest was just icing on the cake. I'd gotten so freakin tired of Spirit. Every game was Spirit with Stridor and I was losing my mind lmao. I went against 2 Spirts almost back to back yesterday and thought I transported back to the old days.
I’d say that’s more of an argument for other killer buffs than an issue with Spirit. Spirit is now not even competitive and she barely was before. I know it’s the popular thing to hate on Spirit but we just won’t agree here, I had no problem facing Spirit before.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2941559#Comment_2941559
well its not like there hasn't been killers in the past that weren't strong. just look at old spirit, old billy and freddy. your pretending like dev have never made strong killers. for some of killer, they simply need revert them. I do agree that they would long time to make weak killers that were not strong into strong killer though.
At the same time, I don't think survivors want stronger killers. survivors don't really want to be challenged. 2-3 hooks is most likely good balance. Many team games have ping systems and in-game UI which improves coordination for team-based games. The lack of one for DBD is game-balance for solo-survivor.
for most of lifespan, DBD balance logic is like: let's just have extremely bad matchmaking for soloQ(before MMR), debuff soloQ by making them completely disorganized as much as possible making most killer look like gods. SWF goes completely unchecked. As a result of killer looking like gods, let's just make all killer powers as underwhelming as possible so they auto-lose to strong swf to counter-balance their dominance on soloq. 1000 IQ gameplay logic.
at least with survivor icons, they're starting in a good spot. they got long way to go though for both killer and survivor.
I agree for the most part. However I don’t think old billy, spirit or Freddy needed their nerfs.
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This is all under the assumption that this would allow the devs to balance the game around SWF. I highly doubt they would actually properly balance around SWF even if we did make these changes to solo queue and even if they hypothetically did, at their rate of progress this would be like a literal 5 year plan...so basically not happen.
So yeah, in an ideal world this sounds great on paper. However realistically I have high doubts that it would actually play out the way we're envisioning.
I personally still feel like the power role currently in solo queue. The only way we're losing is because my teammates or I played poorly. I win most solo queue matches with like 2-3 hooks per game. Most solo queue issues are player skill issues, not game balance issues.
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Seeing as we haven't had a zone control/trap type killer since Hag and we only really have 2 in general I would be expecting that.
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When you see what map you loaded into.
Obviously being a bit hyperbolic here, but that's how ridiculously skewed some maps are.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2936894#Comment_2936894
Play Artist. Spine Chill doesn't do anything against her birds
That has nothing to do with literally anything we're talking about.
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Why waste 2 perk slots to completely counter split pressure when all you need is 1? CoH single handedly counters all split pressure, you don't need to waste another perk slot.
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@Entinaty said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2934729#Comment_2934729
Yet every time they design a killer like that someone thens starts the killer is OP or killer needs nerf comments. The two that come to mind are Pinhead and Legion and look at the amount of complaints they get.
Yeah there are a lot of people very loud about the game that also don't know much about the game. Unfortunately.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
It makes 2 weak Killers, those being Shape and Ghostface, weaker.
Every other Killer can just crab-walk to a Generator to counter it
This is so disingenuous. I have no not once, ever, in over 8k hours seen a killer actually do this. So unrealistic to expect someone to side walk to every. single. gen. just in case they are running it.
I wish people would stop using this as a counter argument for this topic.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2934729#Comment_2934729
The issue is that anti-loop killers that are heavily inconsistent become ineffective at anti-loop because their power is not shortening the chases. Many killer powers have semblance like they're suppose to end chases faster but their chases just end up being as long if not longer than normal killers. Nemesis is perfect example of this. The fact that his power gives survivor 3 health states +4 vials of free health states means that even though he has more chances to hit people. his chases end up being longer than other killers.
A lot of the game is already focused on generator defense perks. Old Ruin+Pop, Old undying+Ruin, now CI+Dead man switch. Its been focused on generator slowdown and 4vs1 map pressure for its entire lifespan. The lack of interactivity at pallet loops on strong survivor maps just leads the killer to need to break like 75% of the map before he gets to the point where he can play 25% of the pallet loops where he can get hits on. For all strong survivor teams, you'll basically lose all generators by the time you ever break the map.
I think generator defense perks just promote the killer to break loops and press spacebar simulator until all the safe pallets are gone in attempts to break most of the map before losing all 5 generators. Winning the game as killer because the entire map is deadzone is boring for killer. I don't think its healthy gameplay loop but its gameplay loop recipe that they've been using for years.
I don't disagree.
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It rarely does much, you don't really interrupt healing that often.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Spine Chill is fine.
Also what would you rather - facing Spine Chill or Adrenaline, Unbreakable, Soul Guard, etc.
I would rather 3 full S tier meta perks than 4, thanks.
I'd say that more points out the problem with the games meta S tier perks than it does give a reason not to change Spine Chill.
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It is pretty bad to have 1 perk completely counter an entire group of killers, that feels like bad design. Maybe it not working when the killer is Undetectable would be more fair. It would still counter Oblivious status.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935222#Comment_2935222
I'm actually scared and excited to see what happens to the twins, I still play them a fair bit
I'm expecting them to be gutted.
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Pig, Trapper and Sadako need a lot of help. However they already said Twins was next.
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Map offerings are good to have in the game. The problem is that some maps are just so unbalanced which is where they become an issue. Also it doesn't seem quite fair that all offerings are weighted equally when there's 4 survivors to 1 killer. I think the killers offering should have more weight.
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Well if it was anti-loop that required skilled play I wouldn't take much issue, such as PH landing his Punishment of the Damned through walls by predicting survivor movement. However generally the reason most people hate anti-loop killers is because what it turns into in reality is just circling the loop a couple times until you're forced to pallet throw and get hit through locked animation or try to bait it and still get m1'd. There isn't much skilled interaction going on there. Hence why people just pre drop pallets for a lot of those killers.
So less of the issue is "anti-loop" killers as a concept and more of an issue of how BHVR has designed their anti-loop killers. They take away from the funnest part of the game for survivors which is the chase.
Honestly I think the better killer design route to go is more focused around map pressure and game slow down. This allows survivors to have their long fun chases that they enjoy but at the same time those chases don't cost the killer as heavily. IE focusing the killer design more around handling a 1v4 rather than a 1v1.
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@Brimp said:
Nah this perk was long overdue. Ever since the final exhaustion nerf to where it doesn't come back 50% slower while running it has been used. So that's at least 5 years this perk has been allowed to just thrive in the overpowered monstrosity it is.
Overall I'm in the boat of "nerf exhaustion as a whole" cause I doubt they'll be reducing map sizes anytime soon.
I agree.
"Overall I'm in the boat of "nerf exhaustion as a whole" cause I doubt they'll be reducing map sizes anytime soon."
On board with this as well.
While DH is the worst offender which is why it's getting all the heat which is rightly deserved, Exhaustion as a whole has been way over tuned for years.
To put into perspective, if a perk was close to being at a "balanced" level of power then a hard nerf would make it disappear from the meta. However if we hypothetically literally doubled the Exhaustion debuff we would still see an Exhaustion perk on every single survivor in every single match. That is a massive nerf and they would still be meta..which should tell us how ridiculously over tuned Exhaustion perks are if you could nerf them that hard and they'd still be in every match.
People have just been allowed to get used to using over tuned perks for so ridiculously long that they've become accustomed to that level of power and think it's "balanced". Same can be said for a lot of the other second chance perks for that matter.
The main issue is map design, but as you eluded to, that isn't getting fixed. So this is the next best option.
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Make the Exhaustion debuff only recover while uninjured. This gives it a cost as now if you want to get full value you from it you'll have to commit more time to healing.
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Nothing really changed, still way too strong and in every game. It's still making hit and run killers/play styles unviable.
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Absolutely. NOED single handedly inflates kill rates significantly hindering their accuracy in terms of measuring balance. I wouldn't be surprised if NOED being turned off for a weekend even lowered the average kill rates by an entire kill.
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Smart to do, yes.
However it's basically the same as tunneling a survivor out or forcing a second stage hook by camping someone. So while it's the smartest thing to do, if I'm the killer it tells me what kind of match you want to play and I'm gonna sweat just as hard, no more fair play. They tell me what kind of match they want to play.
If I finish a gen in the killers face as survivor I don't blame him for camping or tunneling. I rushed gens so I expect him to rush hooks.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2930204#Comment_2930204
your missing the part that survivor are losing to him now instead escaping 24/7. wraith all over again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYUvwYB4-S8
Don't worry, it happens every time a killer becomes stronger. I still never get why survivor ever complain about "killer" variety when they kill their own variety with posts like these. Its been pretty long time since an m1 killer got some control over the game.
I'd change "pretty long time" to "never", but yeah I agree with your point lol.
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@kizuati said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931295#Comment_2931295
same could apply to any exhaustion perk that's 99'd tbh
And Exhaustion perks in general are over tuned. DH is just the worst offender and the most over tuned.
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You can bait out the iframe, you cannot bait out the distance. The distance has no counter play when used correctly. You essentially just greed every single loop. If he respects you get free loops if he doesn’t respect you dead hard the distance and make it to the window or pallet anyway. Bar a couple killer exceptions there’s no counter play there.
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That’s what happens when they unnecessarily nerf a killer and make them less fun to play when they’re already under played. Not to mention the CoH meta just completely destroys them along with all the rest of the hit and run killers.
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I like the concept you're going for, but tokens or a cooldown is still way too strong for how much it costs the killer to snuff. It needs to break the totem on snuff. This one keeps them as a finite resource that can eventually run out and two makes the survivors invest a little more time as they need to keep finding a new totem after the previous one is snuffed.
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So how is he unfun to play against exactly?
You shouldn't be healing and the mend takes seconds. What am I missing here?
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The irony is that this was "supposed" to be a buff..lol
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Umm so what's annoying about the Broken status effect after Mend? You don't heal against Legion anyway...so it's a wasted addon slot. I don't see what the issue is.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928771#Comment_2928771
Its weird, Exhaustion perks are "optional" to use. Killers who use Anti-exhaustion perks already risking a waste of perk slot if no survivor use Exhaustion. I dont know why those perk are so weak.
Fearmonger should increase to at least 10sec.
Bloodecho should work to all other survivors, not injured.
If Fearmonger was 15 seconds and Bloodecho simply had no cooldown I would call them decent.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2921197#Comment_2921197
i mean if we are gonna remove the sound que so Sadoku then remove it for demogorgon to with the portals
As it should be. Unfortunately they'll never make changes to Demo again.
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Another early game gen slow down.
At the start of the game all gens are blocked. Each blocked gen has a hex totem lit for it. In order to unblock a gen you have to break the corresponding hex totem for that gen.
This basically means at the start of the match you'd have 7 hex totems lit on the map.
It would take basically all the totem slots though so it would prevent you from running any other synergistic hex perks as well as a downside. So you couldn't run like Retribution or ToTH with it.
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An anti-gen tunneling perk. Something like each time a gen reaches 50% progress it gets blocked for 30 seconds. This can only trigger once per gen.
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Early game gen slow down that gets worse over time.
Something like -40% gen progress at the start but reduces every time a gen gets completed. So like 40-30-20-10-0. By the time you're down to your 3 gen the perk is dead and doing nothing. Numbers can be changed but you get the concept. Strong early, useless later.
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The main issue is a poorly balanced game, that's the umbrella answer.
More specifically:
- Maps are too large
- Tiles are too strong, loops too safe. Most aren't actually mindgameable when the majority of them should be.
- Overpowered perks, all the seconds chances and CoH
- A lot of the killer roster is way, way too weak and needs significant buffs. Most these killer buffs like the Legion and Ghostface one are way too insignificant and they need substantially more. Even after their buffs they're still bad.
Tunneling isn't really an issue, it's just a symptom of all the above mentioned problems. If you fixed those tunneling would go down a lot. Killers just feel forced to tunnel since the devs wont fix those problems and they're left with no choice. That said if you actually fixed those above issues to where tunneling wasn't necessary at high mmr then we could actually implement anti-camp/tunnel into the base game.
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Let me rephrase this, "Please make an anti-exhaustion killer perk that doesn't suck"
We have anti-exhaustion perks, they're just all terrible.
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@Kurri said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928557#Comment_2928557
Oh I think I know what you mean. I thought her disappearing there was just Killer animation the Killer could see, while survivors could still see my physical form. Like how Freddy's phasing works.
Oh nope. That's the real skill gap with her in trying to time your misdirects when they lose sight of you. Unfortunately it's currently too short of a disappearance and the phasing in and out doesn't last long enough after manifesting which is why I'm trying to get both of them lengthened. It's not really practical basically. The skill potential is almost there, but it's currently just not good enough to matter even if you do time it perfectly.
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I find even the concept that people think they could get nerfed just silly. Legion is still garbage tier, in what world are we thinking of nerfing that. They still need significant buffs.
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@Kurri said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2921197#Comment_2921197
And let the Killer player know when she phases out so they can learn to time it.
It already is that way.
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It's so terrible it should've just been added to his base kit.
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Roar at the end of ambush, charges faster, moves faster. To put it into perspective, even running both addons to make her charge faster and move faster it's still terrible. That's how bad it is.
Remove the sheathing sound from crouching, it ruins its mind games.
Box auras should be hidden until the RBT is activated at base kit.
Give her an extra trap at base.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926559#Comment_2926559
What about 32 or 40?
IMO, the big draw is the 1c/4s regression - which makes 99% gates impossible. Knowing that the exit takes so long to charge up may make losing that progress hurt so much more.
I think 32 or 40 sounds acceptable if its affecting the Obsession as well and the gates get the passive regression. The regression is a big draw but it's also at a very slow rate, not normal opening speed so I think that's alright. I like that it also gives a little more synergy to BW as well since you'll more likely have people that just open them instead of 99ing when they see you're running it. I doubt people would 99 at all if they saw you running it.
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@OpenX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926566#Comment_2926566
Depends what killer you are playing. Some of the strongest killers eat pallets like candy, and you literally need the god pallets to even have a chance to survive. Nemesis, Bubba, Blight, and even well played Demo's and Billies all need to be force fed pallets or you just die hideously with little to do about it.
It was a generalization because it's generally correct. There's always a few exceptions to the rule. Typically the anti-loop killers lack map pressure and even many of them their counter play is early dropping. Of course not the couple you mentioned.
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Pallets are so excessive on maps that you can just pre throw them all and have the gates open before you run out because that pre throwing prevented the killer from getting any pressure. This is also effective because way, way too many pallets in the game are just safe pallets without any mind game. Many of them you just have to break, you can't actually attempt to play them.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2924857#Comment_2924857
I totally get you, but 3 seconds per token grants 24 seconds of extra opening for non-obsessions and 48 additional seconds for the Obsession. That's over 1 minute of opening time. Pretty strong. Even at 0 stacks, a full exit gate will regress to nothing over 60 seconds. At max stacks, Exit gates can take from 44 to 68 seconds to open. I believe it's plenty strong. If anything, as you said, it should just be changed so that the Obsession doesn't have double the debuff.
Survivors like to 99% exit gates, and this keeps the end game alive while forcing survivors to actually open the gates instead of leaving them – granting the killer the advantage of end game collapse and access to Blood Warden, another Krueger perk. The worst aspects of the original is that the Obsession was immune to its sway, and its addition to the exit gates was miniscule at best, and nonexistent at its worst. Bringing Remember Me right now encourages killers to tunnel the Obsession to remove the greatest threat to their end game play. By encouraging the killer to leave the survivor to milk them for several tokens, it allows more dynamic gameplay and synergy with other obsession perks. It also makes the Obsession a juicy end-game query, as if they are the one opening the gate, it can take them a very long time to get through the opening phase. On one hand, this perk can add an entire health state worth of healing to the exit gate, which may be strong in many circumstances. On the other hand, once the Obsession evades the killer at the revelation of this perk – the survivors can walk away with hardly any detriment at all. It can work very well, it may not do much at all – but it would at least be a potential game changer that warrants a perk slot.
The core idea is to force survivors to glue themselves to the exits for longer and to punish them for leaving them at 99%. If they want to get out, they're going to have to commit to the EGC.
I was talking about it affecting the Obsession, not the Obsession getting the double effect as well. 24 seconds extra for opening is basically nothing. No Way Outs duration is barely even passable and that's much more.