Tigernutz1979
Tigernutz1979
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- Tigernutz1979
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I like how different people see different things from this. Personally, I see being able to lead the killer on a long case as less of a skill thing than being able to do gens, unhook/protect/heal allies, sabotage hooks, get saves etc. Which is why when I play killer I tend to gives that player hatch as opposed to the one who ran around the map or clicked their flashlight qt me and begged to be chased. Who actually contributed to the teams success more? I get that some would say that if a survivor looped the killer for 4 gens, they were the hero of the match as they enabled the other 3 to secure the win. But without the other 3, it would have ultimately been a loss. Plus it's on the killer for not recognising and breaking the chase. Personally, if you click at me, you'll be ignored the entire match and get to leave with your 9k bp.
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Because at that stage, they've all but lost, and its a way to recoup a bit. I don't consider it toxic to be tunnelled or camped if there's 2, 1 or 0 gens remaining. Doing so at 5 gens is definitely toxic though.
And for the record, people excusing Bubba for camping is a load of c**p. Just because he is ultra effective at it doesn't make it any less toxic. I've never seen anything from the Devs where they specifically state any killer was designed to camp, tunnel or slug (and considering they are now actively taking steps to oppose such actions, would make them look majorly ridiculous if they had) so if you get a Twins who uses Victor to camp the hook, or a Bubba who camps, or any number of other combinations where they then go "Bubba is supposed to camp" or whatever, it's just a weak excuse for toxic, unskilled play.
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To the OP, I love your intention here. Doubtless, however, you'll get killer mains who will say "tunnelling and/or camping isn't toxic or "not playing nice", it's just efficient. And to me, therein lies the problem.
Yes it's efficient. Overwhelming so. Tunnel out a player at 5 gens and you are pretty much guaranteed a 3k, 4k if you slug #3 til you down #4 etc. The sole exception is swf, but that's not a guarantee that you won't still get a 3k/4k. The sheer advantage gained by taking out a survivor at the start is so overwhelming that killers see it as "playing smart/efficient". And until BHVR either heavily penalises such play, or heavily incentivises not tunnelling, the vast majority will continue to do so, that's at all skill levels from a total beginner to those with thousands of hours.
Camping is a completely different story. Hard camping first hook can usually be played around by gen rushing, but let be honest it's not ideal by any measure, especially not for the poor sod on the hook. And again, unless it's a 4-man swf, you don't know what others are doing. I'm a 99% soloQ player, and I'll try to save every single survivor I'm teamed with, even taking a hook trade if it stops them progressing a stage, yet how many times has that happened and I see the other 2 survivors working on a gen? Not often tbh. Most of the time one or both of them were also going for the save, meaning no-one is working on gens, and then you get stuck in a series of hook trades. Then there's my favourite, killers who claim their killer is "designed to camp" - the biggest pile of dog doo-doo of an excuse. Ok, so you play Twins and have an effective way to camp a hook while also looking for others. Or you are Bubba (enough said). Or you are one of the others people come up with a reason they are "designed" to camp (Trickser, Pyramid etc). Sorry, that doesn't wash with me. Yes, those killers I named have an effective way to camp. But that doesn't mean they were designed that way. Bubba is notoriously known for a camping killer, yet personally I have VASTLY more fun playing as him (which I do occasionally) without camping. I also do better in ratings, BP, pips etc.
To me, there's literally NO killer who was designed to camp. I play almost all killers to varying degrees, some way more than others, but the most fun I have in a game is by avoiding hard camping and hard tunnelling. Do I occasionally do strategic camp or tunnel? Absolutely! If there's 2 gens to go and I see a survivor near where I just hooked someone I'll get in a chase with them until they try to lead me away then go back and check the hook. And at end game, I'll obviously camp or tunnel someone who was just unhooked.
Until BHVR do something about hard C&T, people are gonna continue to do it, and thats a real shame and hugely detrimental to the game.
Btw, I'm a killer main (Cenobite), with occasional survivor games, which are 99% soloQ and 1% with 1 friend in a swf. So I don't main one of the top tier killers, and I'm not a survivor main.
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Until they do something about tunnelling, I honestly don't think they'll do anything about this. I mean, they practically PROMOTE tunnelling as it is....
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Literally about 20 just popped into my head, but one overriding thought quashed them all.
Please, please, never touch Five Nights.
Legitimately the one thing that would drive me and many others I know away from the game.
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The fact that swf has such an overwhelming advantage over soloQ is the core issue IMHO. However, "punishing" people for choosing to play with their friends is ridiculous. Instead of that, they need something to bring SoloQ up, and a killer buff.
Personally, i play 95% of my survivor games soloQ, and that's largely through choice. Theres plenty of posts for swfs, but i find DBD to me more immersive and yes, more fun, as soloQ. To me, its practically the only way to play this "horror" game. Communication between survivors should not be possible, and the game is vastly better without it. However, since there are so many ways to voice chat outside the game, this sadly isn't feasible. So the matter is how to bring soloQ up to be closer to swf. And how to improve killers in the process.
Simple in-game voice chat would help in this regard massively. That is the single greatest advantage a swf has. Icons / in game chat options aren't even gonna come close to making an iota of difference, especially since the main time people talk in swf other than at start is mid-chase.
I've always said that survivors who wanna communicate should have to equip an item to allow them to do so. And the communication should be broadcast in game, so killer can hear too.
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Most of the dc's I have personally seen are when a survivor either doesn't like the killer (like, i had all 4 survivors instantly dc in one match), or at 1st down if it happens quickly. Surely Bhvr can set up something that differentiates between a dc due to pettiness and a dc due to a hacker. A few nights ago I faced my first ever hacker, I stayed in the game right until the end.
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@Breadn said:
If there are way more people playing one side than the other, then it shows there is an issue with your game itself. It doesn't matter if it's "more balanced." In any game, especially a more casual game such as this, fun takes priority.
And when one role in your game is so unfun, and your game's grind is so unfun, that you need to provide bonuses, that shows a massive problem. Killer queues have been upwards of 10 minutes for most regions, and nothing is being done to address it other than this horrible band-aid.
Personally, I think it's insulting that they're dangling BP in our face for playing the role we don't enjoy. Fix the core game.
Until tunnelling and the whole bad experience that is soloQ are addressed once and for all, I don't see things changing. They may fluctuate a bit, but at the core these are the 2 biggest issues IMHO, and they are compounded by each other.
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I've never been a fan of DS, as I don't believe as a survivor I should be forced to use certain perks just to counter toxic killers - by this I refer to what most reasonable people (IMHO) accept to be toxic - namely hard tunnelling and hard camping from the start of the match.
I'm a killer main, but I don't tunnel or camp unless I feel the necessity to do so based on the situation (toxic survivors or at 1 or 0 gens remaining) so it honestly never really affected my killer plays, and people who call it an anti-tunnel perk are fooling themselves as the few times it did find a use against me, I caught them shortly after anyway.
In all honesty, BHVR need to implement an actual penalty to hard tunnelling / hard camping killers, otherwise there simply is not "downside" to what it undeniably a very strong tactic (I'll happily admit this - even though it is still toxic IMHO).
Personally, (although this will never happen lol), I'd be ok if DS applied a massive penalty to killers. A 10s stun (with a 1s reduction in duration as gens are completed), or rest of the match your vision is impaired, or something similar. The game needs a way to get killers away from using unskilled and toxic plays (which, again, are so damn effective that most games, killers will use them).
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@Maxx_Calin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3062244#Comment_3062244
Hooking someone is not the same as stunning them. When u are on a hook, u can still move and try to escape. If u were stunned on the hook. U wouldn't be able to do that. U would just be a body hanging there with no way of getting off without someone getting u off the hook.
Only for 1st hook. 2nd hook is pretty much like a stun, except it can be ended when you are unhooked.
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I tried Nurse once. I can honestly say that I have no intention of EVER doing so again.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
She’s the most powerful? I would have thought pinhead and pyramid head would be the most powerful lore wise
Pinhead turns her into a cenobite lol.
Infact, I'd love to see cenobite versions of all the killers, like what they did with Blight but with Pinhead lol
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@Adaez said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3054011#Comment_3054011
Sadako Yamamura is by far the most powerful killer and I'm now going to explain why.
Before I explain I want to specify that I'm talking about the movie version of the character.The original novel version is many in different ways and her powers revolve around a smallpox virus that causes heart attacks.
Nensha: Nensha was an ability she inherited from her human mother (her dad is a water spirit/demon btw). Nensha has a wide variety of skills but is mostly used to burn images/thoughts into objects and people's minds. It normally is just used to let people see memories but she can also use it to instantly kill people by overloading their mind. She can also use it to create illusions and enter people's dreams. Any damage she deals in the dreams affect their real body.
Healing: She is able to heal other's wounds, let a crippled man walk, curse blindness and revive the dead.
Telepathy: Can read other people's minds and talk to them.
Telekinesis: Can lift massive objects with her mind and shake entire streets of large buildings.
Super strength: She can lift people with a single hand and easily tear a human apart.
Future sight: Sadako is able to see the future and look into the past.
Psychic aura: Her psychic powers are so powerful that any human standing near her will gain psychic powers. This is how Yoichi got powers btw.
Hair: She can control her hair like an appendage and grow it to cover buildings. this hair is strong enough to rip people and other ghosts apart and drain someone's energy/lifeforce.
Technology: She is able to completely control all electronics, using them to spread her curse or even explode.
Flight: She can fly/levitate and move at speeds faster than the eye can detect.
Mind control: She can control living people. She can give said controlled people super strength to kill others with ease. She can do this to multiple people at once including those with psychic powers.
DNA altering: She can alter someone's DNA. she once changed a man's DNA so his offspring will be identical to her.
Teleportation: She can teleport to anywhere on the planet instantly.
Invisibly: She can become invisible and can chose if a specific person can see her.
Water control: She can control massive amounts of water.
Bugs: She can create and control massive amounts of bugs including locust and cicadas.
Death vision: Looking in her eyes will instantly kill you. This has worked on other onryo and demons.
Duplication: Sadako is able to multiply herself to create an army of duplicates that can be in multiple places at once.
Weather manipulation: She can control the weather including a massive typhoon that affected all of Japan.
Size: She can change her size to as big as a building to as small as a finger.
Necromancy: She can turn the people she's killed into an army of minions.
Dimensional powers: Sadako created a dimension that she can pull people into. It's near impossible to escape from and she is all powerful there. She is able to create portals to this world through any technology and reflection. Her bugs can also form together into a portal. (The forest with the well is apart of this dimension btw).
Absorption and fusion: she is able to absorb other supernatural beings. in her crossover with the Grudge she meet Kayako, another onryo like her. She fused together with her to create Sadakaya. another time she met the demon king of the underworld. She then overpowered him with her hair and absorbed him, adding all of his power to her own.
Her Curse: Anyone that goes near her corpse or anything her Nensha has burned will get her curse. She can control and manipulate these people all she wants as shown above. it's impossible to remove. Giving someone a copy of her tape won't remove the curse, she will simply spare you.
Basically, she is more powerful than any other killer in the game.
WAS, not is. Coz we have the entity's version, not the "above-God-like" being you listed.
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@Leatherface1990 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3048374#Comment_3048374
Add a 5 second or 10 second delay.
Fairly certain it's nowhere near that long. At t3, insidious is like 3 or 2 seconds of standing still, iirc. Not on game atm, so going off memory, I could be wrong.
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@Nathan13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3048302#Comment_3048302
I don’t think insidious hides the killers aura at least from what i’ve read.
I believe it does, but it's kinda obvious when you see the killer walk 2 steps, stop, then suddenly disappear a few seconds later lol
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Gonna upset people with this comment lol. I say, as a killer main / soloQ survivor, make Kindred basekit - the entire effect. And HEAVY penalties to hard camping and hard tunnelling. Like, I reckon the killer should lose ALOT of BP & points for doing these activities from the start, and the penalty drops the longer the match goes / as gens get completed.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3045135#Comment_3045135
In a perfect scenario, I'm sure we'd all love that. But unfortunately changing the rules to have more winners is just the easy part. Unfortunately there's just not enough time to add even more to the schedule at the moment. Between the other outfits in the tome, the store, and any events that may be going on, the art team's pretty swamped with outfits to create as is.
This doesn't surprise me in the least, but it would be nice for some sexual equality for men for once, God knows women bang on about it daily IRL lol.
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@Astrian said:
As an artist, it's easier and more fun to draw women than men. Women have better figures, better fashion, better anatomy. Men have a more strict and rigid structure that just isn't interesting or fun to draw. There's the horny aspect of course but that's not whole story.
As such, women have better cosmetics than men, because nobody wants to draw men.
Speak for yourself. Not all artists find it more fun to draw women. And the whole better figures, better anatomy is just because you are almost certainly a hetro male.
Would definitely prefer for a 1 of each situation, rather than 30+ for women, 5 for men. What does this show in terms of equality?
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Brand New Parts. A co-ordinated SWF with toolboxes will drill through gens super fast, but once they are used up they can't do it again, plus your strongest time during a match is when a gen or 2 have been done, and you are able to apply pressure in a smaller area because of it. Lethal Pursuer (Nemesis perk) can help you to immediately know where survivors are at the start of the match, which can reduce the effectiveness of BNP (by chasing them away from the gen they used it on, especially if you also have Hex: Ruin (Hag perk) or similar, which causes gens to auto-regress. It also requires 2 skill checks for the whole bonus to repair, if you have a high mobility killer or a small map (ideally both!) you can interrupt them during this and prevent the full bonus. Also there's Corrupt Intervention (Artist perk) which blocks the 3 gens furthest from you at the start of the match, which should help.
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@furret534 said:
The fact that there's not a single smolface here makes me very disappointed.
No idea who smolface is supposed to be 🤷🏻♂️
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I'm a killer main, not a top tier one either and I avoid tunnelling and camping wherever possible. The exceptions are toxic survivors, clones, and when there's 1 or 0 gens left. I also refuse to run NOED. Most of my games are against SWFs, and every match is a real hard battle, but the sense of accomplishment at the end, whether it's a 1k or a 4k is worth it IMHO.
Now, when I play survivor, I'm 95% soloQ. And usually (and even more so atm with the event) someone will get hard tunnelled out from the very start. I consider this a mark of a lack of skill and sheer bad manners personally, regardless of whether it's me or a random teammate. I get the massive advantage it gives the killer, but personally I feel that in general, and especially during this event, there really is no need for it. I believe that if tunnelling and camping were penalised heavily, we would end up with a much healthier atmosphere and community in general.
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I don't have a problem with Legion. Nor the add ons. It's just boring getting the same killer back to back, but that's RNG and MMR.
Saddened to see the same tired, weak response of "get good" though - but at least you added "or better", which made a difference lol.
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Agree with most of above, the one glaring statement I disagree with is "they enforce the only fun part of dbd, the chase". The chase isn't the only fun part for a lot of people, otherwise they'd just keep getting into chases endlessly, and gens would never get done lol. For me personally, there's times I enjoy chases and times I enjoy everything BUT chases.
Also, "get good" is literally the most cop-out statement used in the DBD community. Its not constructive in any way, and it's quite passive-aggressive and extremely insulting tbh.
I do stand by what you say though. However it is becoming more and more tedious as a survivor recently, to the point that I'm skipping playing DBD tonight just coz I cba with another slew of Legion after Legion after Legion.
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I'm not a veteran of either DbD or these forums, and I play both killer and survivor. Personally, yeah I get a little bit ****** off when I've had a great game as survivor, ran the killer, been altruistic, fixed gens etc and then I get hit, downed, hooked and the swf I was teamed with all leave together without even trying to find the totem (I play 90%+ of my survivor games as soloQ), yet I don't think NOED is a weak-killer tool or anything similar. After all, while I'm not the type of player who hunts for bones during the match, I could have. I also don't know spawn locations for totems (especially in Lerys), and actually believe the fact that people DO know them is a problem which the devs should fix.
When I play killer, I don't run NOED, because I tend to favour perks that give me tangible benefits for the duration of the game, yet I see the point and potential of end game builds (as I think of them). I also tend to end my games before the last generator is fixed. However, there have been times when I've been figuratively tortured by a swf, like yesterday, 4 man swf, me as Hag, 3 flashlights, I got 2 hooks out of the whole match and about 4 other hits which were healed before I could down them. They looped me like gods, 360s all over the place, and then carried on the torture for a good 3 minutes after the last generator was fixed before opening the exit gate, and then carried it on until the timer ended. (The gap between PC and console was never shown so glaringly to me lol). During the EGC I got 1 down and hook, and left one to die on the ground as timer was almost gone. This match was absolute torture, and NOED might have helped, but realistically not in a very big way, and I'd personally have preferred if EVERY SINGLE ONE of my hex totems (4 hex build) hadn't been destroyed immediately and in a coordinated fashion (1-2 seconds between booms) while I was in my first chase with the first loop god lol.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2885868#Comment_2885868
You can't take those people seriously. They're always the victims of tunneling because everything the killer does is tunneling to them.
Usually it just rolls off my shoulders, but they actually hit close to home on that occasion. My mum, my 7 year old, it was just vulgar, abusive and completely unnecessary.
Was there tunnelling? Yes, but in all honesty I believe I did my bit by allowing the unhook and heal. If I am patrolling gens and I find the 3 Megs who then split off, I pick one to go for. There's no way to tell them apart. When I manage to down 1 am I supposed to check if I've already hooked them and if so leave them to be revived?
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@Tigernutz1979 said:
Unfortunately in my opinion BT is a help, but doesn't prevent tunnelling. And DS is the same. If a killer wants you out, theres practically nothing you or anyone else can do about it. I personally refuse to use DS, as it doesn't stop tunnelling, just delays it. I always run BT when possible, but again as I said it doesn't stop it.
I honestly believe that the only way to stop it is if there is a penalty of some kind introduced, yet I don't think it will. The alternative is if killers stop doing it, and judging by some messages I've seen, that simply isn't going to happen.
I play both, and I do what I can to avoid tunnelling, camping or slugging. Yet one instance that's still fresh is where I faced 3 identical characters, who then complained of tunnelling, even though each time I had to injure then down.
And of course, all 3 bombarded me with messages about killing myself, what they would do to my family, the most hateful messages I've ever seen. All because I said I tried to avoid tunnelling, yet its hard to do when theres 3 identical characters, all with flashlights, all uninjured to start with, and all running together.
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Unfortunately in my opinion BT is a help, but doesn't prevent tunnelling. And DS is the same. If a killer wants you out, theres practically nothing you or anyone else can do about it. I personally refuse to use DS, as it doesn't stop tunnelling, just delays it. I always run BT when possible, but again as I said it doesn't stop it.
I honestly believe that the only way to stop it is if there is a penalty of some kind introduced, yet I don't think it will. The alternative is if killers stop doing it, and judging by some messages I've seen, that simply isn't going to happen.
I play both, and I do what I can to avoid tunnelling, camping or slugging. Yet one instance that's still fresh is where I faced 3 identical characters, who then complained of tunnelling, even though each time I had to injure then down.
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Says expired 😭
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Anyone have anything for Pinhead?
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Great Post, thanks very much for this. I only play a few killers, as such I can use this as a bit of information towards trying out others. Can I ask for information on what perks / addons you concluded with when assessing for these criteria please? It would help me to have something to aim for when trying out a new killer, and I'd rather not just use a pre-made build as I want to know why its good, not just that it is. Thanks!
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Sorry to hear that. As a killer main, yeah there are survivor players who go full toxic, but you haven't done anything even remotely like that. So you did a pallet save? I'd have applauded you for it personally, this guy or girl has seriously got issues if they have become obsessed with you and are targeting you. Nasty players unfortunately are out there. I sincerely hope you stay off his/her radar and get to enjoy the game.
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Never played as Meg, never want to lol. But I'm gonna go with C. No more vomiting on me please!
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I main Cenobite, and tbh I ignore CoH unless it's near me and I'm not in a chase. Granted the endless heals are grrr-worthy, but if I'm chasing someone I'm committed to hooking them. I'll break off if I see its one of the "Gold Medal Olympic Loopers" or if we go near a gen that's got 3 pistons going, but otherwise I'm sticking to you til I lose you or I hook you. I have never played Oni so I don't know if that's something you can do though.
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Hi, I've been playing for a while, mainly killer due to the fact that playing as a survivor in this game is so hard.
Please note I'm only speaking from my own perspective when I say this.
SURVIVOR: I don't play with friends except for very rarely, as for me it actually ruins the immersion factor. For me, playing a survivor, I'm supposed to have the information available to me from my perks and that's it. So having a friend telling me from the other side of the map what the killer is doing is just wrong! I actually discussed this with the people I do occasionally play with, and we don't do that any longer, which everyone has found to be an improvement in the level of enjoyment. Does it make things harder? Absolutely, but I'll take fun over an easy win any day. In fact, I think I've managed to escape only a handful of times from the last 50ish matches, whether solo (95% of the time) or as a duo.
KILLER: Playing against swf teams becomes apparent very early into the match, and certainly lowers my enjoyment of the match. I also find the swf teams engaging in toxic activities far more often, unfortunately. And I use that term based off what I've seen on Discord. It certainly is very disheartening when it happens, and when it happens a few times back to back I go looking for a different game to play.
My personal opinion is that swf is massively detrimental to the game, both from a solo survivor and a killer perspective. An interesting suggestion which I made to my friends and who also thought it was a great idea, was that if survivors were communicating with each other, then the killer should be able to listen in (but not communicate back), so the communication becomes the survivors "shouting" to each other, which the killer can obviously hear.
Thanks 😊
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I didn't even know this was a thing! I play on Xbox Series X, and have had a few strange moments while playing as Killer, such as people insta-healing, a blindness that lasted just under 20 seconds (I recorded it and checked after the match), and someone who was perma-sprinting.