LlamaArmour
LlamaArmour
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I have both console and pc and can confirm that both are the same in terms of camping etc; but pc killers are generally better, and also more likely to use different killers (I'm looking at you Huntress and Nurse).
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No problem with NOED (from a survivor main). It does feel cheap at times but to be honest, the whole game does at certain points.
Also, the bones argument is very valid. Instead of spending time breaking every totem you see, try only breaking hidden ones, that way you won't waste your time breaking them, and they'll be easy to check at a later date.
I don't even think a totem counter is necessary either. The whole power of NOED is that it makes survivors waste time looking around to check totems. Aside from that, there's no reason it should grant a killer more than 1 extra kill (2 at a stretch). Adding a totem counter is basically killing the perk.
Again, this is from the pov of a survivor main (ex killer main)
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@coppersly said:
With the introduction of Pyramid Head, we see a fluid power meter that both acts as an intended limit while also allowing the user to decide to use their power whenever they please because you can use it at any charge above 0. This is by far the most fluid and well designed power meter in the game so far imo. It's actually pretty well done, good job BHVR.
Now with that sentiment, I'd like to suggest a change to Nurse's power meter to act almost exactly as Pyramid Head's does. I suggest that instead of having a discrete charge mechanic where you must charge a full blink before you can use it, it should instead draw continuously from the total meter up to the max blink charge normally allowed for both blinks, if there is enough meter to support these actions.
Here's a gif simulating draining 1 blink. Imagine there's no blink counter, and more meter left after a single charge that you can draw from for your second blink. I know it's jpeg'd to hell but that's the life of a free gif editor.
This will eliminate the very frustrating "feature" of thinking you have 2 whole blinks but you're at <100% charge or the server thinks you didn't have both blinks yet. It will also reward skilled play by allowing the player more opportunity to go for attacks without full charge and risking the miss or hit. You're still punished by the cooldown but now you can actually choose your blinks instead of being spoon fed the chance to blink. I also believe this would shift the importance of running the CD addons and leave more room open for more builds. I honestly dislike greatly having to run the CD addons because I will literally blink 50% less in a game otherwise.
Please leave your critique I honestly think this suggestion would be the best middle ground for people like me who don't like the cooldown and other people who argue she was OP and needed one.
Nice idea dude, I think this is a great mid point between old Nurse and current Nurse! It should definitely keep the Nurse mains happy too xD
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1315662#Comment_1315662
I experienced plenty of survivors that could loop me very well and sometimes even force me to give up on that chase. It wasn't an impossible task like people claim it's just very few people actually knew what to do and actually employed that strategy. Most people just tried to loop her like a regular killer and you won't win doing that. You do now, but that's why I've made a suggestion for changing her powerbar to work like Pyramid Head's so that would at least be something much better than the current haphazardly done cooldown, while still having a cooldown.
I wasn't saying it's not possible to loop nurse. It was very possible; however, just because it was possible doesn't mean it's okay. I've come back from games where a survivor DC'd straight away multiple times, but i'm sure that doesn't mean that there should only be 3 survivors right? My point being that there are always exceptions to the norm. You seem like a Nurse main, so I'm sure you've had way more experiences whereby survivors weren't able to loop you, but naturally you'd remember the times they could.
Besides, you don't loop Nurse like a regular killer now lol. Her power is exactly the same, just staggered. You can still blink through walls/pallets.
I don't quite understand what you mean about a cooldown like pyramid heads? Could you explain more please?
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Come on guys, can anyone really deny that it was unfair for her to see you from like 20m away, to mind game her, and then for her to be right behind you (or even on you) in 3seconds despite having a wall/pallet separating us?
I get that it's not fun, and maybe there could have been a different way to tweak her power instead constantly looking down. However, it was ridiculously OP. Particularly when you went against a slugging Nurse.
I always say this, but her power is game breaking by design; so it's hard for the devs to balance between overpowered and underpowered.
What do you guys think about her fatigue being shortened, and instead being able to walk at normal speed (whilst looking forward) but not being able to m1/blink, whilst keeping the new blink cooldown?
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@supersonic853 said:
This is a continuation of my last question how many killers do you wish you faced more and less. While survivors may be skins theres often stuff associated with them and how most people that play them act. And survivors have their own slight passives seems like with jake having ironwill basekit sounds like and we all know claud so i just thought id ask.
More:Adam (Like wheres the adam players?)
Less:Megs Personally i have problems with meg players and how they act and it just gets annoying at the end of the day.
Link to my last question
Adam main here, and yup I can confirm that 99% of the time i'm the only Adam.
Works out well though because I feel unique xD.
I'd like to see more Detective Tapp, I don't remember the last time I saw him; and I'd like to see less Claudette (she's my old main and I love her but there's almost always at least 2 per game)
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@Alice_pbg said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1148209#Comment_1148209
That's what I'm saying, it will never be unanimous.
The time limit has to be set in stone. This is the max amount of time you have, do your objective.
And one could just as easily argue that the killer didn't manage to kill the survivors, so they lost.
During the egc the entity already kills the survivors, what would be the difference in this case? There's a time limit to escape, you didn't escape in time, you died.
The only difference is that the time limit is in place at the start of the game.
If you can come up with a different way to end a game fairly where both sides win or both sides lose, I'd be happy to hear it
Why does it have to be 2 wins or 2 loses?
The survivors are the ones that push the game forward, the killers are the reactive role. So it makes sense that in this scenario the survivors lost.
It's like payload maps in team fortress 2. Doesn't matter how amazing the fight is, if you don't push the payload to the objective before the time limit, it's your loss.
My idea is only meant to come into play in a situation where no one was having fun, as you described in your OP.
That is not what I wrote. I said "YOU just want it to end". The other side is not a part of it.
The "both sides" part, simply means this happens when ypu play survivor or killer.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1148216#Comment_1148216
Why? And what do you mean by lose? No one is losing any emblem score or bps in this.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1148279#Comment_1148279
Why does it have to be situational?
The conditions you said just let the game go forever as long as someone taps a gen every now and again.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1148313#Comment_1148313
This is already a thing, what would be different about it?
It needs to be situational because who would the game decide is the winner?
If it's a draw then the losing side would have sore losers that will just hide till the time limit is up to avoid a loss.
What I said was just an example that could easily be tweaked hence me saying perhaps. It could easily be changed to having to work on a gen for 5 seconds consecutively as another example.
There are times that I've steamrolled the survivors in 10mins and the last 2 just hide and do nothing.
With your example I have to wait 10mins for the game to end as a draw? Or would it be a win for the killer? In which case it means that in situatuons when 4 gens are done in 5/6 mins and they get 3 genned, the killer just needs to hold out till the timer runs out? Legion would be perfect for this scenario, and borderline holding the game hostage.
Again, I think a time limit is a good idea, but it needs to be conditional. With that being said, people that play this game will find a way to abuse anything haha.
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I agree with the time limit, but it would need to be very situational.
Perhaps if it started once there were 2 survivors left and only if they haven't touched a gen/been chased in 3 minutes?
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@PigMainClaudette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1135458#Comment_1135458
So, Billy would require more skill is wjat you're saying?
He is also different in the sense that he has high mobility, destruction AND and instant-down in his BASE KIT with one button. That is not balance.
Huntress is the most balanced killer in the game.
That's one of the things I'm saying. Alongside others that you chose not to address...
I also said that he's "one of the most balanced in the games current state" where maps are too big for killers to traverse, gens go too quickly for killers to apply adequate pressure, and chases take too long; but yet again, you chose not to address that.
I have no idea why you're even saying that Huntress is the most balanced as if I mentioned Billy being the most balanced lmao.
Anyway, Huntress might be one of the most balanced killers by design, but in the games current state she still falls victim to big maps that have a lot of LOS blockers/grass, and back to back jungle gyms/T-walls.
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@Archimedes5000 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1135471#Comment_1135471
Ubreakable and BT right.
But DS? Most of the killer streamers I watch often tunnel surviviors early game to disable DS. So basically DS CAUSES TUNNELING, not reduces it.
I guess it's an endless loop haha.
I personally only use it because I get tunneled.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1135595#Comment_1135595
Wow you really felt the need to attack them eh? Get face camped a lot?
I think it was more on the side of "if they're genrushing and I know I cant stop it, I'm going to secure at least one kill". Which is the smart play. If 4 gens are done and the last about to pop with 3 other people not hooked once, why the ######### would they give up the one kill they can actually obtain?
Can you not read?
I specifically said "Gen rushing isn't a valid reason tho imo. At least it's not unless all gens are complete and it's to secure a kill".
You talk about attacking, but you attacked me for no apparent reason.
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@Go_Go_Roboto said:
How else will noob survivors learn their lesson?
I gotta wait more than a few minutes to get in a game? Not my fault so I'm gonna have fun however I want. Toxic people get what they deserve. It's my right to play as I want. I paid for this game, too. SWFs are toxic. I just want to play the game and they are tryharding bringing toolboxes and perks that speed up the game. Why even q if your gonna end the game immediately?
At least if I facecamp I get content outside of the round. I'll get profile comments and post game messages. It's just a LOL. Why do people care so much about a game? Losers if you ask me. You can't play toxic and genrush then me mad about me doing something not even as bad.
If they're t-bagging then fair enough, I understand the facecamp/tunnel. They basically asked for it.
Gen rushing isn't a valid reason tho imo. At least it's not unless all gens are complete and it's to secure a kill. Otherwise you're just denying yourself more chases, more bloodpoints, and making the game go even faster.
Also, you're most likely facecamping because you're mad that you couldn't catch the survivor which just boosts their ego even more; and if that isn't the case then I have news for you...
You're the toxic one.
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DS, BT and unbreakable are basically necessities in the games current climate to be honest.
Literally every other game someone is camping/tunnelling me or a teammate (at red ranks), and if they aren't, then they're slugging everyone.
I try to run different perks but always end up wishing I had one of the aforementioned perks due to the way the game plays out.
I honestly feel like killers drive the meta.
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@PigMainClaudette said:
You know what? One thing has always confused me more about Hillbilly and his power more than most others: Why is HE the only killer allowed to hold his power the way he can? And, yes, I know that Leatherface can too, but he's a joke to play at this point. Still a point for both of them.
Doctor? Loses ALL charge if the button is released. Pig? Dash meter resets. Freddy? Teleport cancelled AND goes on cooldown. Plague? Uses power, but to a lesser extent.
Nurse's basekit changes also weren't THAT bad. If Hillbilly gets loads of stronger add-ons, but a slightly lessened base-kit, it'll simply drive away all those who are on a bandwagon. Stuff like this happens all the time. It's also JUST happened with Warhammer 40k and the Iron Hands faction. People will jump ship as soon as there's a possibly negative change, but those people are only using that character/faction simply because it is powerful.
Why don't we just reserve judgement until we actually see any changes to the character.
If Billy couldn't hold his chainsaw then he would have to predict exactly where a survivor is going and how long they will take to get there. Not to mention taking away all of his mind game potential.
What you're saying is basically the equivalent of if Huntress couldn't hold a hatchet and had to let it go as soon as she pulled it up.
He's like that because it makes sense considering how different his power is to the other killers you mentioned.
Devs pls don't gut my boy Billy, he's legit one of the most balanced killers in the games current state.
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As someone who plays controller on PC (personal preference), and also owns the game on console; I can confirm that it makes a huge difference.
Survivor becomes slightly easier on keyboard because the movements are less fluid, making you harder to predict vs killers like Huntress.
Killer becomes a lot easier because for some unknown reason the sensitivity is very low on controller compared to M/K, i.e. when I use a mouse, not only am I more accurate, but I can also move my camera faster- which makes it easier to track survivors that move erratically.
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It has to be DS for me.
The feeling of chasing a survivor for 2 gens, finally downing them, and then they DS you was heartbreaking.
It was usually followed by another gen popping shortly after, or beginning another chase and then they DS you too.
I'm not even sure I can talk about it without crying, it's still too soon haha.
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I guess it's for the same reason that Ash doesn't have a chainsaw haha.
Would be cool to see though.
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No reason to touch Spine Chill. Not everyone wants to be jump scared, and it takes up one perk slot with a good (neither amazing, nor terrible) perk.
Besides that it's my favourite perk so delete this thread pls 😂
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Trapper should never start with all of his traps, that's absurd.
Imagine being put in the basement and he traps around the hook, every entrance, and the loops around the basement. That's a guaranteed death.
It's nothing like Hag or Freddy before anyone says anything, because their powers don't cause damage, nor will they immobilise a survivor. Not to mention their powers have work arounds aside from alerting the killer that you're on the way.
The above applies to more hooks than just the basement too.
I do think 2 traps as base would be good though (I would suggest starting with 3 and once you put one down you can hold 2 max).
On another note, why is everyone complaining about a buff, despite it being a small one? Be grateful.
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@Boosted_Dwight said:
I think the ruin change came at a bad time. While it was a good change it definitely wasn't a good time to release it.
- Matchmaking is broken
- Most maps are very unbalanced
- Tool boxes and other perks needed looking into (I'm aware they're working on tool boxes right now)
- Generator speed? I'm not so sure about that one.
They should have released this new change when the game was healthy enough to take it.
Agreed.
I don't even know why everyone's complaining when it breaks in the first minute either way 😂.
Overall this game is so hard to balance by nature that it's hard for the devs not to rely on statistics instead of anecdotal evidence.
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He's more powerful than a lot of people realise, but by no means over powered.
I don't like going against him though so I wouldn't lose my ######### if he got nerfed lmao.
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@gantes said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1060386#Comment_1060386
I know she doesn't exactly need to be stronger, I just feel like every other slow killer has a way to get around the map faster and her power design would be more compatible with a 115 killer, especially considering the fact she's slower makes her probably the most map reliant killer in the game, since playing tiles feels bad for her when she can't use her power.
I think balancing her around 115% speed would be healthier considering the direction this game has been taking with maps lately. But I see the point for keeping her 110 though, she's absolutely terrifying in the maps where she can use her power at will. I don't think her being faster is a balance necessity, it's more of a consistency/design issue.
Like, back when she could legitimately get cross map shots in most maps I get why that change would break her, but even wide open maps like McMillan's are just clusters of trees now. That's not the world we live in anymore.
I get you, that makes sense. Personally I think she's fine as is, but I never play as her so I guess I'm not as qualified to comment on her viability as others.
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@gantes said:
I mean the current 110 killers are Huntress (who shouldn't be 110 in the first place), Hag (the most unpopular killer in the game) and Spirit (absolutely terrible design) so I hope not. Making killers that are slower than the standard speed means that they need an extremely strong power to be viable, which ends up with abominations like the Spirit or the Nurse.
I'm just curious, why do you think Huntress shouldn't be 110?
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@Runcore said:
NOED is perfectly balanced. Killer is playing with -1 perk practicaly whole game and if you are playing vs smart survivors that cleanse totems during game, there will be no NOED after repairing last gen. I see problem in players that go gen-rush and ignore totems to repair gen as fast as possible and then die with NOED. Instead of change tactic and focus on cleansing they go cry over forum how NOED is extremely OP and trying to make their lives easier. Problem is in survivors that play for fast win and ignore objectives. Instead of gen-rushing focus on totems and you will make killer playing with 3 perks only for whole game even after all repaired gens. Survivors just have to use that circle thing on their neck and they will be totaly fine with NOED as its is now. If you are hurry to escape fast, you will be in danger of NOED because you didnt touch other objectives and focused purely on escaping.
I totally agree. I've been saying for ages that it's one of the most balanced killer perks. I just don't understand why people cry about something with such an easy counter.
People cry about gen rushing all the time, yet they have a counter in NOED and choose not to use it.
I'm never mad when I get hit by it because I know it means we didn't cleanse totems. Simple as.
It makes no sense to say NOED rewards bad killers, but turn around and say second chance perks like DS are okay.
I honestly think people will never be satisfied with this game to be honest.
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@Karl_Childers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1047823#Comment_1047823
Disagree. This game is very toxic...I could totally see people being annoyed that their teammate has voice chat turned off.
No downside? How about everything in my post.
- Solo survivor who chooses to play without voice chat now WORSE off because killers are buffed around everyone having communication. How is this not a downside?!
- current SWF simply turning it off because they’d rather use Discord. This is very likely. So in these games where the solo’s teammates are SWF, who exactly is the solo survivor talking to? Not a downside?!
The point is that killers are being buffed. Do you not see how it could put many survivors in a worse spot? Trust me, many players would want nothing to do it. But by buffing killers, you are telling them use this or you are screwed. No thanks.
I'm glad someone else can see the bigger picture when it comes to balancing!
You actually raised some points I hadn't even considered too, I.e. teammates being mad at you for muting, and SWF using DC instead.
I really hope this change never happens.
I do agree with others about the chat wheel though, I've been an advocate of this since I first found out about the in game gestures. It just never made sense to me that there was no way to tell my team what was happening.
I guess the main problem is, perks like kindred would be a lot less powerful if I could tell my team I'm going for the save (not a huge issue tbh).
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1047525#Comment_1047525
Well of course there would be an easy way to mute it if you don't want to hear somebody's mic.
Did you not read what I said?
I said I would personally mute it, but as killers would obviously be buffed accordingly, it would make the "solo survivor" even weaker than they already are. By solo survivor I mean people that play with no comms.
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Most likely because of language barriers, and toxicness.
Also, remember every time you've been abused in end game chat? Now imagine that during game. Sounds like a terrible idea now right?
Lastly, I would personally disable in game comms, but with the inevitable killer buffs, I would get destroyed every game. Remember that solo survivor is the weakest role in the game, followed by killer, and the strongest is SWF.
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@Tro said:
Let me explain myself since you think I'm being sarcastic.
“Do you think that she has the lowest kill rate because she has the highest skill cap and hardly anyone plays her, therefore hardly anyone practices her? Or do you always look at data at face value?”
First off, there’s a reason nobody players her other than her high skill cap, its her reward is not worth the time put into it, you get better results with spirit or hillbilly, hell even new doctor. I’m not looking at data at face value, I’m looking at the facts. By that logic then ruin didn’t need a nerf either because with hundreds of hours of practice anyone can hit great skillchecks…
“All of your suggestions just make her broken again. Like I said before, her power is game breaking by design, so she needs a massive cool down.”
Actually they do not. I am not saying all of those, I’m suggesting ONE of those, or even something else. She was nerfed for having a ridiculous number of blinks with no downside. Now she has up to 2 which she must use by the way to move because of her base speed being slower than survivors but I’m sure you knew that already.
“A) the whole reason the cool down was increased is because a good Nurse would never let you escape as she would always be all over you with next to no rest.”
True but they went from 5-6 blinks w no cooldown, to a max of 2 with individual c/ds because the 3 blink addon is a joke. Now you use your blinks to find a survivor, wait for 2 blink cooldowns to come
back while the survivor makes ground, then you have 2 blinks to catch the survivor and get a single hit, after which you must wait again for 2 c/ds and repeat (btw how much time has elapsed?), and that’s not counting DH, purple addon med kit, and assuming you guessed correctly what the survivor was going to do, if you miss any of your blinks you are done. The reason people don’t play her is not just she is hard to learn; she was just as hard to learn before. The reason people don’t play her now its because it’s not worth it.
“C) increasing her base speed would defeat the whole purpose of her design. She's supposed to be a killer that can bypass walls, pallets and windows, but as a trade for that power her base speed is slow. Increasing her base speed would just make her ridiculously OP (not sure if you're trolling)”
Except there’s plenty of things she can’t “bypass”, and the cooldown between blinks and fatigue make it nearly impossible for players to use her with exception of your “top tier nurses” which I have yet to see.
D) not sure if you're trolling with this one either but 3/4 blinks is stupid and I'm sure everyone unanimously agrees with that (except you for some weird reason).
3 or 4 blinks would not make her OP because the individual cooldowns and the fatigue would still be there. They could even make it that you can only blink twice in a row but you have up to four blinks in reserve.
I can agree that you can have more consistent results with Spirit or Billy. I also know for a fact that as soon as Nurse was toned down, she disappeared. I have literally seen maybe 4 Nurses max and I play pretty much every day, and this is starting from day one of the nerf, not a gradual decrease in player numbers. Surely this shows that people aren't willing to put the time in any more? Ruin is completely different. You could push through it/hit all greats/gen tap/break the totem. There were many ways to counter it; but that's a whole other debate.
To respond to your responses.
A) see my suggestion for change in my last post.
However, old Nurse was nowhere near as hard to learn lol are you serious? Before you could just blink to the nearest LOS blocker, if you don't see them then rinse and repeat until you do. Now that you need to be more careful with your blinks this isn't always a viable option which equals a higher learning curve.
C) so can she or can she not blink through pallets, walls and windows, which are ultimately all of a survivors defences? Just because you haven't seen a top tier Nurse doesn't mean they don't exist.
D) like I said, the whole reason she was nerfed is that she could bypass defences too easily whilst not having enough of a drawback. Giving her extra blinks is not the way to fix this. I'm pretty sure most people think that base Nurse was fine because 2 blinks max give the survivor a chance to escape. Any more than that and you can blink to the nearest LOS blocker, blink to make sure they're going the way you predict, then finally blink onto them if you were right.
Like I said in my previous post to you, what about if she had her previous base kit but only when out of chase? That way she would retain her map pressure, but it keeps her chase potential from being too high (outright deadly in the wrong hands).
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@Endstille said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1045053#Comment_1045053
I am not quite sure what you mean with does the killrate do take pickrate into account, the killrate is the average amount of kills of said killer in the games being played.
The thing is, she no longer has a reward part at all. Learning nurse was a thing in the past, the old nurse was perfect for that. I completely disagree that her power is being gamebreaking in any kind or way, it doesn't disable the movement for survivors.
Movement/Mindgaming was a constant thing against old nurse which made for the most fun trials of them all. No bs, just skill on both sides. She now is a limited version of her former self, little to no map pressure, easy to dodge/juke. They made the counterplay to her so dumbed down it is horrible, you can actually run away in a straight line and it will extend the chase for an long amount of time given how easy it is to do.
Oh ok I meant are the kills averaged out. I still believe its due to her high skill cap and also because she's less fun to play.
You can disagree that her power is game breaking, but it still is. The whole premise of the chase is that survivors have limited defences against the killer I.e. pallets and windows. Introducing a killer that can completely ignore these is game breaking. Whether you think it's powerful/fair/fun or not, she completely changes the rules of the game. I hope that you understand what I mean now.
Referring to my original post, Nurse is an example of why you can't balance based on the best of the best because when played correctly there is no escape. Oh you found a pallet? Shame that won't be useful. A window? Nope, still not useful. You broke LOS? Let me catch LOS once and you're dead (I'm talking at the highest level, not an average or even a good player). Balancing for the good players means that the best Nurses have a huge advantage.
I agree that she had mind game potential. I also think that the amount of potential she had was disproportionate to the downside she had (due to the reasons I said above).
Whether or not you have seen her played to her potential is another question entirely. I know I have. I also know that there are still Nurses that agree she is fine balance wise, with the only problem being the fun factor (which is a very valid point, just doesn't equal balance). This group of people is mostly made up of people that are proficient with Nurse, and also people that understand the game, and how powerful she is.
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@Tro said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1044612#Comment_1044612
Where? from where do you get this? Because you cant play against her or because you've seen a streamer that has hrs played with her? Because I'll tell you where you haven't seen it, on the game. Ive posted this before but I'll repost it every time someone says she's OP or top tier. Im a good nurse, I play both killer and survivor at red ranks (not that it matters).
We all agree she needed a nerf but she was way over nerfed. Now she has one of the lowest kill rates of any killer for both experienced and new players alike.
Either:
a)remove or lower the cooldown for blink, maybe make the cool down reset both blinks instead of one per cool down.
b) Remove fatigue and leave everything else as is.
c) increase her base speed to 4.2-4.4 like hag/huntress/spirit or
d) give her 3-4 blinks and leave everything else as is.
Any ONE of these would put her back at the top or near the top tier without making her as OP as she once was.
Where do I get what from? If you're going to be sarcastic and act like a douche for no reason, at least explain yourself.
Do you think that she has the lowest kill rate because she has the highest skill cap and hardly anyone plays her, therefore hardly anyone practices her? Or do you always look at data at face value?
All of your suggestions just make her broken again. Like I said before, her power is game breaking by design, so she needs a massive cool down.
A) the whole reason the cool down was increased is because a good Nurse would never let you escape as she would always be all over you with next to no rest.
B) see the answer for A
C) increasing her base speed would defeat the whole purpose of her design. She's supposed to be a killer that can bypass walls, pallets and windows, but as a trade for that power her base speed is slow. Increasing her base speed would just make her ridiculously OP (not sure if you're trolling)
D) not sure if you're trolling with this one either but 3/4 blinks is stupid and I'm sure everyone unanimously agrees with that (except you for some weird reason).
I'm seriously not sure if you're being serious with some of those points lol but if you were a good Nurse like you said you were then you would know those suggestions are ludicrous.
In fact, I'll give you a suggestion. How about she has 2 blinks with only fatigue as per her old basekit, but only when not in chase. That way, she still has map pressure, but a good Nurse (I'm talking the ones that blink exactly onto you every time) won't be able to destroy teams no matter what.
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@Endstille said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1044612#Comment_1044612
Yes the best killer or 2nd best killer with a killrate lower than clown. facepalm
What you describe is how old nurse worked, she needed addons changed and nothing else. Now you can put time into her and get no reward at all. You can perform the same with any other killer, even better depending on which.
Is the kill rate taking pick rate into account?
Furthermore, like I said; she's high risk and high reward. She needs to have a massive downside to counter her power.
Also where did I describe old Nurse? Was it the part where I said she bypasses survivor defences and has a game breaking power? Because that still stands.
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Nurse is a perfect example of why this game is unable to be balanced based on the best players (as I would usually advocate). Can you imagine balancing Nurse around average killers? She would be all you see, and she would be destroying every game!
She is a rare exception whereby if you are amazing you will be able to bypass all of the survivors defences and down them within 20/30 seconds. However, if you aren't amazing you'll get stomped.
I personally think she should be left as she is. It's good to have a killer with a high risk and a high reward, otherwise anyone that is moderately decent can pick her up and destroy teams almost effortlessly. Not to mention that it rewards players that are willing to put in the time and effort into learning her.
People suggest silly things like making her base speed faster, or giving her more blinks/less cool down; but they forget that her power by design is game breaking and that this needs to be balanced by making her less powerful in other areas.
To summarise; Nurse is in a good spot at the moment, don't let the fact that people struggle to play her cloud the fact that she is still top 2 (arguably the best killer).
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Unpopular opinion but I actually like the new ruin (playing with and going against it).
I'd say removing the great skill check bonus and making toolboxes 5/10/15% less effective would be a healthy buff.
It's funny though because old ruin forced survivors to get better. New ruin forces killers to get better. Regardless, both versions will still be broken before you get a chance to use them.
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@DwightOP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/945405#Comment_945405
It's not a nerf to noed since swf already have this information. It would be only a nerf if NOON could have this information and even swf would benefit from that. But they don't.
It is a nerf because not all SWF coordinate on how many totems are left.
I can only recall doing it 1 time ever.
Whereas if there was a counter then everybody would go out of their way to break them.
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Totem counter would kill NOED and buff inner strength.
IMO it should only be available while using perks like small game and inner strength. Otherwise it's a huge nerf to NOED.
I think the game is fine as it is, if you're so concerned about there being more totems then take a stroll around the map to check. Thats the whole point of NOED anyway (to slow the game down/punish survivors for not taking the time to search). Or run small game if you can't find the totems.
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Trapper would be ridiculous if he started with every trap. Imagine he downed someone at the shack and could place 10 traps without leaving; that survivor is effectively dead.
As another example, he could trap up every loop he comes across without any downside. People compare his traps to Freddy and Hag, but neither of their traps hurt and they also have requirements/counterplay on top of just stepping on them (I.e. you need to be asleep for Freddy snares to work, and you can flashlight/crouch over Hag's traps), whereas the only counter play to Trapper's require you to have dead hard or a toolbox/saboteur.
Body block hag isn't a fair comparison because that's a very specific build which takes away her ability to teleport AND she's a slow killer to begin with. Trapper is fast AF and can snowball like a kid at Christmas in the North Pole.
IMO all he needs is:
1) Start with 2 traps as basekit
1.5) 1 trap guaranteed to start within 16 meters (this ones debatable, not sure how effective it would be)
2) Make his traps visible even when on top of them (once you get close they disappear which is really annoying)
3) Make his traps guaranteed to spawn close to generators/loops
These alone would make him waaaay better
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Wraith is fine as he is. The only thing I think he could do with is to be completely invisible outside of 20m (just an example).
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When are we gonna fix Shelter Woods? It's ridiculous for survivor (even when I'm killer I feel really bad at times haha)
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@Haku said:
I mean problematic loops is nowhere near = the game is survivor sided. Some days as a survivor I get Shelter woods very often. Do I have to bring screens from that place ? I mean it is the entire place you need a screenshot of... .How about Hawkins ? I can show you similar bullshit places on other maps where there is a gen to do and there is literally nothing around to keep you safe if the killer approach. There are map problems but they are for both sides. It is easy to look only on your side. At least you have a choice what to do. The survivors have to use what is around them when chased. And lets not forget the RNG. Sometmes things are there. Sometimes they are not. That is what makes it okay to some extent
This sums up my thoughts haha, I like that you mentioned Shelter Woods because that map has a crazy abundance of dead zones. I totally agree with your point on the RNG, its perhaps one of the more important things to consider in this discussion.
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@xllxENIGMAxllx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/905791#Comment_905791
Actually all loops i'm show only show the broken loops but all around of that loops there's jungle gym and windows. So no is not a dead zone only loops that are mindgamable. Those i've shown is not mindgamable because the pallet and window are connected perfectly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hW-fTtR-o-Q
The start show how broken he can be.
The RNG on that map spawn was pretty ridiculous I'll be honest, but that LF messed up completely..
There were 2 gens in close proximity (most likely a 3rd nearby), so once those pallets are gone there's minimal safety, a 3 gen, and then it's gg.
The fact that LF didn't run those loops correctly made them seem better than they are. For example, if every time he vaults the window, the survivor runs to another loop then why not either just leave him alone or don't vault and just bloodlust him till he drops the pallet, which renders that loop gone?
Don't spend 5 gens getting mind gamed.
Ultimately, like I said, its RNG, it could go either way. I have personally never seen such a dirty set up on that map, and would go as far to say that the majority of the time when I do run into a similar setup, the rest of the map is mainly comprised of dead zone after dead zone.
I do agree that I have seen some dirty loops though, particularly when a jungle gym spawns next to shack, but just like killers gotta kill, survivors gotta survive.
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@xllxENIGMAxllx said:
I mean look at that
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/477/EMRTNCF25HAD.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/246/6GXBDV894OHR.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/768/IG3GQOO7ZX2E.jpg
I got dozen of them including coldwind farm , crotus prenn and haddonfield. That should not exist i get those loops 2 games of 5 it's insane.
So hear me out community and devs you should reduce the tiles connected by each other (shacks , L-T walls , Jungle Jym , Jungle Jym (Ormond version) connected to each others. I mean Suffocation Pit is the perfect exemple of this and is literally uncounterable dropping chase only delay the issues.
I agree that those loops are annoying (survivor main here).
What would you change though? If those loops didn't spawn then it means one survivor can loop till they drop the pallet and then it's gg for every other survivor that goes to that area from there on because it's now a massive dead zone.
Every one of those loops you showed is mind-gameable, a better example would be the big middle structures on most maps (which I still think needs to exist, just toned down slightly).
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@csandman1977 said:
I know survivors can't help but know this is a team game, but at the same time, many think that they should be able to 1v1 the killer. Which leads to calls for powerful killer perks to be nerfed or survivor perks to be reworked and made more powerful.
This is especially true for solos as the lack of coordination and meaningful communication between teammates is nonexistent.
So how do we stop or at least mitigate selfish play between people who are supposed to be working together?
I have a couple ideas that arent fully fleshed out but i think they would be a start. I know some of these are going to get hateful responses but oh well.
1) In game chat. Yes it is optional. Yes you can mute everyone. Every online game has in game coms. Dont like it mute it. Yes killers would have to be buffed slightly to compensate. Is it lots of work? Yes. Can it be good? Yes.
2) Bloodpoints. This is a team game but we receive bloodpoints for individual actions. And when we are first to go then we get none. People complain about being morid, or tunneled or camped. They DC when they get downed to deny killer points out of spite. But what would happen if we kept the emblem system based on individual contributions, but then received up to double based on what the team did? So you go in. Do 2 gens, rescue a person, heal a person. Get chased for a few seconds. A couple pallet stuns and get hooked. You are probably looking at around 18k-ish blood points for what you did. While you are doing that, the rest of your team completes the generators, opens the exit and 2 of them escape. Now the game tallies all the bloodpoints the entire team collected. Avereges them out and all survivors get that many bonus points at end of game. People who dc still get 0.
Yes there will be the people who hide and do nothing, just like now but ultimately when you get into the higher ranks that should be rarer and rarer.
This would also have the bonus of bringing survivor and killer bloodpoints closer, as people wouldn't have to fight each other for the objectives in order to get bloodpoints.
What do you all think? Am i completely wrong?
I really like your ideas! I've been an advocate of in game chat for a while now but the 2nd idea is new to me.
It isn't a team game though. There's a slight difference between a 4v1 and a 1v1 x4.
What I mean by this is that, points are given individually, other survivors can choose whether to help me or not, and as Apple2o quoted, the devs don't even think of it as a team game.
So while your ideas would definitely fix a lot of issues (DC'ing, selfish teammates, SWF vs solo imbalances etc), it also goes against the idea that the devs originally had for the game, and so unless they deviate from that we probably won't see these changes 😭.
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@I_Face_Camp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/903200#Comment_903200
It's not unfun for everyone tho. Like I said I enjoy playing and playing against campers. And the argument against a depip is easily torn down. Survivors can bring keys, insta heals, and brand new pets which zoom them outta the game and result in killers depips. It goes both ways that's part of the game. And to top it all off, what is the point of reaching a high rank? Absolutely nothing
Fair enough. I do think you're in the minority regarding enjoying being camped tbh though lol.
I also don't think that instaheals, keys etc are in the same category. If I find and camp a survivor straight away, that's an instant depip with no chance for them to do anything. Whereas, instaheals/keys etc are very annoying but I have many times gone up against survivors with those items and won; not to mention, the killer can see the items you're bringing in and put on franklins as a counter. What counter can a survivor have to camping when he doesn't know what killer you are or that you're going to camp?
There is no point in ranking up you're right but that's our opinion. Some people like to be the highest rank for their own morale, or to prove a point.
P.S. I do camp at times, mainly when I'd be an idiot not to e.g. 2 hooked survivors next to each other and the other 2 swarming the hook, or also when someone starts tea bagging at every pallet.
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@LordRegal said:
The thing that gets me about her at this point is every time a thread saying how unfun Nurse is now (and I wholeheartedly agree), people inevitably come in and say “Nurse is fine, she’s still OP and breaks the game”...but I also note that no one makes threads about that anymore. If something is complain-worthy, someone will make a thread about it...right now we see threads on Spirit, Freddy, and Oni since those are the current killers deemed to be strong (though Oni I’d argue is more because he’s new than anything else). No one complains about Nurse being OP anymore unless it’s to counterbalance those of us saying she’s not fun to play anymore. That more than anything I think showcases just how far she’s fallen.
No one complains because no one ever plays her. I've played against 2 Nurse's since the rework and I play pretty much every day (with exceptions).
She's still OP, it's just not as fun to play as her any more.
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@DarthRane said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/902938#Comment_902938
Broken is only good against bad survivors because good survivors are just going to do gens anyway, survivors do not have a hard time finding each other, as for medkit the 2 most common items are tool boxes and med kits.
He's just not a good killer an ability where you have to abandon chase is not a good ability.
You don't have to abandon chase though? It's just as much a tracking tool as it is for injuring survivors.
Legions ability is fine (albeit annoying), the problem is that most people only use it to deal damage.
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Honestly camping is annoying but I can live with it most of the time.
However, the one killer that generally makes me salty when he camps is LF and its because:
1) My teammates keep coming to save me after realising he's camping (survivor fault)
2) I die on hook and there's almost nothing anyone can do about it
3) My SWF (if I'm playing SWF) has to wait while I play the rest of the game/vice versa
Number 3 is my main gripe, as with the other 2 I can just move on with the game, but with 3), we now have to wait. I might also add that there are multiple other reasons people don't like it; for example, that player now loses a pip because you thought it was funny to camp, or maybe they had limited time to play one or 2 games and they ended up playing against that.
It's specifically the ability to down multiple people off of the hook that pi**es people off, because unless the person has BT then both survivors are now downed. With other killers it's less annoying because they can only target either the rescued or the rescuer.
So yeah I can appreciate why people would stop playing the game after running into a camping LF, especially when they probably didn't get to play much of the game except seeing their teammate get chainsawed and then spamming spacebar till they die.
As a final note, LF is one of my favourite killers to go against (2nd to Demogorgon and closely followed by Huntress), before it's assumed that I'm here to hate on him. I just think he either needs a complete rework, or he needs a nerf to his chainsaw straight after someone is unhooked (perhaps temporary BT for the rescued?), and a buff everywhere else.
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Spirit without a doubt.
Trapper and Freddy are joint second: Trapper because of the tall grass and Forever Freddy because I'm scared of commitment (jk, its actually his snares)
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@vossler24 said:
Finally mastered Oni and oh boy oh boy is he good, not nurse pre-nerf S tier but above current nurse (which I feel now sits mid A tier, R.I.P nurse, new players will never get you) Oni, oh boy, his run is infinite to however long his power lasts and will get you a hit almost always, with the only counter being to time his turns and attacks, down a straight line or if a survivor turns too early or late, it's a hit, his insta down attack, yeah takes time but again, used right, wow, his perks are garbage except for new players, he is great for learning maps, and after returning to the game seeing I have to start once more at rank 20 from 1 (DBD and I had a falling out due to killers not even being a threat minus nurse but I could never get use to her) so I used all BP in a different killer to start anew with Oni, rank 20-13 the survivors may as well not even existed (many months I was gone for, I lost alot of skill but Oni really dragged me back up) rank 12-7 toxic players with toxic messages but they faired a bit better, cause I was trying different combos to make him optimal instead of my safe go to, dying light, thanatophobia, ruin and overcharge/huntress lullaby/devour hope, I tried spies, predator, nurse's calling and deerstalker, Oni becomes impossible to hide from, but gen rush still always a pain, I didn't miss the 2:18 games survivors could do, shame to see gens hasn't been sorted yet, I tried all TR perks that makes being nearby a pain, still gen rush, but in solo games, try the one that I mentioned where he is impossible to hide from, other than that to all I've tried, the 4 I use typically is the only way to get enough time to actually play the game, but that's fine, I still want to track, I have time to find but injured survivors can get away, so there are some add ons that increases the blood orbs frequency, and some that increases range you can see, either have 1 of each or 2 of the frequency, never lose a survivor and power build up super fast, he is basically a disciplined hillbilly that can track, and is the tracking that makes him as good as hillbilly but his dash doesn't get affected by walls, which I feel tops hillbilly, Oni is best played at high sensitivity if you want to make top use of his power, so he is much stronger on PC than console
Forgot to add he took me back to rank 1 in a day
If you think Oni is above Nurse, then who are your top 5 killers?
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@anarchy753 said:
It's lovely that free hits from accidentally bumping into a survivor are gone, but the key points that make Spirit a miserable experience have really not been addressed by her changes. Namely:
There is 0 feedback to her power. You cannot make any form of informed or reactionary decision against the Spirit's power. You can know she's phasing, and your options are "completely guess where she is and hope I don't go down from a hit launched while invisible." That isn't fun. There's no skill to going against an opponent that has a massive amount of information as to your precise location, and all you know is "she's right up my ass."
Which brings us to the other big issue, sound. If you don't have Iron Will, you're #########. If you do have Iron Will, she has Stridor and you're ######### anyway. It's impossible to play around giving your exact location to her constantly. You can try all the backtracking and walking and avoiding grass patches all you like, but when your character keeps shouting "I'm right here!" it's pointless, and it sucks to play. At the very least, Iron Will should finally be changed to trump Stridor. If you're burning a perk JUST to not make injured grunts, there's no reason a perk that makes everyone louder and easier to find should ALSO be the one that trumps silence in the injured condition. It really doesn't feel great when the only somewhat reliable counterplay to a killer's power is 100% negated by their perk.
I'm really glad someone said this. I was literally saying this to a friend earlier today lol; the only good thing is that I rarely see her anymore (which is probably why the complaints have subsided).
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@YummySushiPJs said:
Mine will always be Buffy Summers. I’m not sure it’ll ever happen. But I can dream.
I wish I didn't read this.
I need it now 😭