JaviiMii
JaviiMii
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3290478#Comment_3290478
Well that's because of SBMM and you have no idea who you're gonna verse.
I'm sure most killers have won at 3+ gens, it's not their fault that game was an easy one a d they brought good stuff because the very next game they could loose even with the same build.
My point is as someone who mains solo Q survivor it's rare I say "that killer played super well" over "my team was awful" and that's the biggest issue for me. I want my losses to be because I was beaten by a better player not because my team didnt do gens or cant even loop safe pallets
I see your point - but, based on egc I sometimes observe as killer, what survs notice in SoloQ is also very limited. There were a number of times where survs started blaming each other / one particular member because they thought they were doing nothing, when I could assure them said someone was either in chase, doing gens or was otherwise being useful - but they just didn't get a chance to see it.
Which is another reason why I think action-icons for surv are absolutely necessary; is in chase, does primary objective (gens, gates), does secondary objective (chests, totems), is in healing action (being healed or healing), is in locker, is afk. - Those are the most important ones imo.
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That is a pretty absolute statement that already comes with a bunch of caveats, like specific maps and only applying to a pretty limited number of killers and match outcomes. - The conclusion, as limited as it is, is still flawed though. Why? Because as survivor I for one face a number of different killers and builds, the team however stays pretty much the same. Now, if it was us and out skill (or lack thereof) that's the deciding facor, we should be losing as much regardless of the killer or their loadout or playstyle. But that is not the case. In the vast majority of cases the game outcome seems to be determined by strategies (namely hard tunneling/camping, Eruption+COB and certain killer-addon-combinations, e.g. double range nurse or alc ring blight, mdr Spritit etc.) and builds supporting these strategies.
That being said, yes. Survs playing meme builds and joking around are probably not gonna win against a sweating killer. Vice versa a meme build killer isn't gonna win against sweaty survs. - I don't take issue with those outcomes. I, personally, only take issue with hardcore sweating seemingly being the norm - which I don't particularily enjoy.
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It's a little outdated at this point but a while after the perk rework dropped I tracked 100 matches of SoloQ.
(I had a 37% escape rate)
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/339242/100-soloq-matches-later-match-outcomes/p1
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this sounds like a playstyle of someone who considers match a 1v1v1v1v1.
I also agree with Biscuits. Getting out while fully expecting it to be at the expense of everyone else might be an escape - but not a win.
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tbh. I found the whole totem situation to be more complex than that. Both haunted and retribution are "free cleanses" when someone injured is in chase and is expected to go down within the next 10 seconds anyway (in the case of haunted they preferably try to do so as far away from a hook as possible, imo). Undying as a somewhat unpredictable aura reading perk also seems to be a thing; the times my Distortion stacks just disappear because of it are quite frequent and I rather have it gone cause it's really hard to keep track of when your aura is being revealed (like I said; Distortion was a bit of an eye opener there). Devour should, imo, also go sooner rather than later.
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The RE6 Outfits of the characters that are in RE6.
I'd also take Leon's & Claire's Noir Outfit from RE2. Really wanted them to get some more cosmetics.
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/339242/100-soloq-matches-later-match-outcomes
You are looking at it from just your perspective, but what was the escape/kill rate for each game looking at your whole team? Like, you might have died, but did 2 of your teammates get out?
That's the "outcomes: all matches" bit. That does not take into account whether I died or escaped but how many out of the four survivors escaped:
"In total 12 matches were a 4E (one 3E+H included). 13 matches were a 3E (one 2E+H included). 5 matches were 2E. In total 16 survivors escaped through the hatch, in 14 matches they were the only survivor to escape. 12 matches were 1E through gates. In 42 matches no one escaped (=4K). There was also one match where three survivors DCd and one killer DCd, I count those matches as null."
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@toxik_survivor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/339242/100-soloq-matches-later-match-outcomes
This is nice because you played 100 matches but it's just not accurate when it's 1 person. You need multiple people on a different skill level. 100 people and 100 games per person would be way more accurate. I love the hard work and nice setup of graphs though.
That is true. Which is why I never claimed it was an accurate representation of "The soloQ experience". Though it should be fairly accurate as far as I and my soloQ experience is concerned. As far as anyone else is concerned it's just anecdotal evidence / a case study.
(edit: In case you're referring to the subjective perception bit; that is in regards to how things actually happened and how we remember/perceive them. I, for one, remember matches as being much worse than they were according to the numbers.)
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@kisfenkin said:
Are you going to put together something about perk usage and success with certain perks, if that data is there?
I went back and edited my posts in a hope to stop derailing your thread. Sorry about that.
Thanks ^-^ it's hard sometimes to stay on topic.
I did think about "success based on perk usage" - but I think there are too many unknowns in the data if you collect it as a survivor in SoloQ. You don't know the killer you're up against and you don't know what kind of teamies you get so you can never really know if it was the perks or something else that lead to the match outcome you got.
I think the best way to look at the question "in how far do perks influence the chances of winning the match" would be, on the survivor side, to go in with a swf where everyone is of equal skill level and has a fixed loadout for 100 matches. - And then compare the escape rates. Though even that comes with a number of limitations where it would be hard to tell if they are coincidence, if there's a correlation or if there's causation.
For killer it should be easier to see how specific loadouts affect kill rates though if you keep one loadout for 100 matches.
That being said. Once I get around to the loadout section of all this, I will probably have the one or another theory; perks aren't popular by chance. So while a perk being popular is not necessarily proof that something increases you escape/kill rates, it does certainly suggest people think it does.
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At 70. - Also all challenges except the Blight challenges (cause don't have him), the Corrective action one and the deplete medkits one done. Doing challenges really helps with getting through the Rift rather fast.
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I have a 37% escape rate in SoloQ.
SWF is a mixed bag for me mostly because I play with people who have anything between 5 and 5000 hours. - If I'm the potato of the team... maybe 25%, and if the killer is more on my level probably 40-50% (altruism kills and all that ^^) - and closer to 70-80% when I'm not the potato and the killer is on our precious potato's level.
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So, since it has been a common theme that "no gens get done anymore" I figured I could take a little closer look at the gens. Just aside from how many gens got completed overall. I was interested in two things: What was the final outcome when all five gens got completed? That all five got compelted happened quite frequently, after all. You would assume a lot of times there are pretty decent survival chances if all gens get done - and that is also true. I interpret the rather high "1E" number as there being two survivors left and one got the last gen done while the other got chased. Sometimes they managed to get the gate open before the killer could get to them, sometimes they played for hatch.
And in line with the "no gens get done anymore" is also the "it's just getting stomped at five gens all the time". So I figured I look at that as well. To my surprise, actually, there were very few matches that not only had a 4K at 5 gens - but none whatsoever where only one gen got done. Even when getting pretty much stomped it seems to be possible to somehow finish two gens. Speaking from my own experience: It doesn't feel that way. Meaning that in terms of "how did I feel about this match" it makes little difference if it was a 4K at 5 gens or if a couple gens did get done. Once gens grind to halt and it becomes obvious this will turn into a 4K it all feels equally miserable. - To me, anyhow.
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His tentacle is funny sometimes, that's true. - But it does follow a certain logic. I've come across a number of suvivors who know very well how it works and getting hits on them is pretty darn hard.
That being said; when playing as survivor I can't say I've seen an influx of Nemos tho.
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SoloQ is 37% for me - though it certainly doesn't feel that way.
SWF... idk. The people I play with have very different skill levels and mindsets - but probably for me personally somewhere between 40 and 50% maybe? Though more often than not it's at least a 1man out with swf.-
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I don't like being forced into a perk corner. I want to run whichever perks I want and not whichever ones I need to balance the game.
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Phew. Even though I can't say I find survivor super fun atm I think I'll never really switch to being a killer main. Idk. Just not my thing. So surv is probably still my preferred role.
Fav survivor is Felix. Yes, his cosmetics are nice and all and I guess he's eye candy - but even more than that I like his lore and how it ties in with the entity and all. Idk, I wasn't really interested in the lore of DBD until I stumbled over some YT videos about it. I listened to them as bedtime stories for a while and Felix's just stuck.
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nope. Whenever I attempted a late game save it didn't work out. Sometimes because of a lack of communication in SoloQ, sometimes because teamies didn't know how to save. Sometimes because the hooked ened up missing a skillcheck so we ran out of time and botched it in the process.
I've also moved on to take my attempts / fail skillchecks when I see based on the aura movement that someone is contemplating a save to signal to "just get the f out of here" - cause chances are it won't work out anyway. If I happen to be a rando in a somewhat competent duo or trio and it looks like they're already properly setting up and coordinating via vc (you can really tell after who is probably on comms) I'll give it a shot. - But other than that. Nope.
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@Dogma_loki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3115034#Comment_3115034
Yes I can do this with your blessing, I don't like stealing others thunder without asking them 1st. I will play 100 games in solo queue with the same build and attempting to "win" to the best of my ability for the entire match. Its probably going to take awhile as I am going to create some charts and track everything I can about the games. Any suggestions or helpful hints as someone that has already done it?
I already have a pretty good idea how this will turn out, I tend to play very altruistic which doesn't tend to work out well for my survival odds.
Sure, absolutely do go ahead ^-^
The only thing I would've done differently is probably have taken screenshots via Steam of all the match result screens - just to be on the safe side. - Also, since I was asked about it before and didn't have a very good answer maybe make a note on how many survivors insisted on being killed despite being able to walk out the exit gates.
Tips in general... it's better to have two screens; one with the match results and one with the excel sheet so you don't have to memorise the loadouts to copy them over. For successful suicides on hook I put it in the "DC" column but in square brackets [ ] and still counted it as a kill, while for DCs I didn't. Just to be able to tell the two apart. A killer DC was K. I think that's about it. It's really straightforward just copying stuff over for the most part xD .... Lemme send you a screenshot of the things I kept track of.
The color coding really helped to stay in the right column. - Abbreviations also really helped (though over time I became a little more efficient ... which is also one reason why I have to clean up the data in earlier matches so esp. the shorthands for item-add-ons match up and become search-able. (one note on the hooks: this was more about counting how many unhooks there could be performed during the match (so the max was 8) - I did it like that on purpose but I don't remember why, so I didn't include it here in the overview either. There's so many things to count and compare when it comes to hooks though, so if you want to knock yourself out; I'd be very interested to find out more about it xD)
Yeah, I mean. Do feel free to adjust and adapt stuff as you see fit ^-^
... Though I would stay away from trying to keep track of camping, tunneling, farming and stuff like that because it's really hard to evaluate while playing a match and also definitions tend to vary - one exception being super obvious farming with everyone being there or the prototypical face camping Bubba or the likes.
(I also feel called out on the being altruistic thing - the times I thought to myself "never again in SoloQ!" and one match later I do it again 🙈)
(Edit: I also just notice that right in the first match I apparently lost a gen. - I probably died at four gens and hadn't sorted everything out yet. For the most part I just want to use this opportunity to point out that I'm human and this was just a fun project so there might be an error here and there. Most susceptible to these kinds of errors are gens, hooks and items/offerings being in the wrong column)
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@Adjatha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3115243#Comment_3115243
Fair enough. That was my suspicion, but it's good to get some corroboration. I have had one single survivor step away from the exit gate and insist that I hook them after a hilariously one-sided match. One single survivor in the course of over two years now. I don't have a figure for the number of hatch escapes I gave after a one-sided killer game, but if I were to guess it would be maybe a touch under a hundred?
The "waiting to at least give the killer a hit at the gates" does happen, but the FAR more common situation is "wait by the gates, and when the killer swings, they just step out or dead hard out." Which takes what could've been a nice gesture and turns it into something pretty rude.
I had survivors insisting to die - one way or the other, and if need be to egc - mostly when playing solely for the memes e.g. as Zoom-Billy (trying to make laps around the maps with a single chainsaw-rush between chases/until I stumble into a surv. - Record: three times around big boat on swamp), T-Bag-chase-Ghostie, Trick Shot Huntress or Boop-Pig. Those are also the ones where I'm most likely to announce mid-match that I gonna die for that killer if they want it or not 😂
I also agree on the exit gate hits sometimes (often?) just being about rubbing it in / adding insult to injury. But I think I've gotten somewhat better at identifying those kinds of survivors and I just stay away from gates when I suspect that's what they're up to.
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@kisfenkin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3115167#Comment_3115167
You should stop, and here is why. For the 5-7.5k blood you are giving that survivor you are also giving them higher MMR, preventing your MMR from increasing as much as it should, and skewing the numbers so those numbers tell the devs that the killer you are playing and the build you are playing aren't quite good enough to kill that fourth survivor every time you let them go.
They don't watch the match and see you letting the fourth out, they see the flat numbers and it says you aren't doing better than you should be when in fact you are but you are manipulating the numbers. This is why it is so hard for the devs to actually even try to balance things, especially MMR, because we have people that are suiciding and people that are giving free wins. That can't help them figure out what is working and what is totally broken, that's for sure.
Hatch is neutral in terms of MMR. - And I won't comment on it any further because it is besides the point of this thread. (Not saying there is no argument to be made or it isn't a topic worth a discussion. Quite the contrary. - But this is not the right place for that.)
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@Adjatha said:
Out of curiosity:
You mentioned that you were giving the hatch 7 times and were not sure exactly how many times another member of the survivor team was given the hatch, but there were enough for you to remember it happening several times.
At any point in these hundred games, did ANY survivor intentionally give themselves up to the killer in the end game, so that the other side could get one single kill? Can you recall even a single instance where that was the case?
That is an excellent question and I didn't take notes on that one. Now, while I do remember those occasions happening during that time, I don't know if they were during my SoloQ matches or other matches. - Would have been very interesting to keep track of, in hindsight.
But my guess is: Probably not. Based on my own experience: even after a killer hardly got any hooks I was usually just glad it wasn't another death on whatever death streak I was on at the time.
Though I'm also not sure if you can really compare "given escapes" to "given kills". A killer has four chances per match to win, if they get three out of four they have won. - A survivor on the other hand has only one chance to win. By letting one survivor escape the killer doesn't actually lose anything that match, whereas a survivor letting themselves be killed is losing everything that match.
In terms of "nice gestures" I think what survivors more often do is the "com, com. Hit & down out the exit gate" - which seems to be a common theme across the board.
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@kisfenkin said:
"b) The all-or-nothing nature in terms of outcomes. If I were to exclude the occasions where a killer made it a point to let the last survivor escape the 4K rate would be way over 50%. I alone have been given hatch or gate seven times"
I never see this as the killer being nice. Either they are trying to manipulate their MMR, or they are trying to manipulate the devs through stats by not killing everyone they could. Either way, they are breaking the rules. Working with the killer is not allowed, and I FORCE them to take that extra kill when they choose me for this pity escape.
Also, I don't see any information on farming. I haven't played in a week or so, but like you I tabulated a bunch of data for the 50ish games I played in the first three days after the patch, and about a third of the killers were either new, not trying, or just flat out farming. I posted my data here on the forums for a while, but I tire of trying to do the devs job for them. Especially having to deal with the malicious killer mains that want to defend the changes regardless of whether it leads to the death of the game or not. The devs should have separated this update into parts so they could test each major thing individually, but they have never been about precision and don't seem to care.
How many of those escapes were farmers? You know, killers that refuse to even hit you unless you practically beg them for hooks?
At any rate thanks for the information. It's interesting to see and is almost exactly the same as mine was so it's validating to know that nothing has changed at all since the mid chapter patch. There were so many killer mains on this forum shouting 'give it time' etc. If you know how the game works you didn't need more time than it took to read the patch notes to know they were breaking things and would lose players over it.
I always give Hatch as killer as the ingame equivalent of a handshake. The game is over at that point. It's already clear who won and there is nothing being gained from the 4k. At least on my end. There's nothing malicious about it as far as I'm concerned. I guess opinions on that can vary though.
And you don't find any info on farming - and also not on camping or tunneling or throwing - because it's usually hard to tell from a SoloQ surv perspective so any information would be unrealiable. There was one match that was outright farming: A blight who just wanted to do their tome (though, they did play the first few minutes very seriously... but also very badly and I guess they just gave up). There were a couple occasions where it looked to me like the killer hard camped/tunneled to make it a 3v1 and then switched gears to maximise BP gain and there were also occasions where there were exit gates shenanigans where everyone just memed around and got some stuff for challenges/rituals (e.g. blinds, Trapper's traps and stuff like that).
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@BenOfMilam said:
I think I might try doing something like this in swf, so we can compare relative power levels of solo and swf with the power statistics
That would be super interesting to compare o: - Do you have a fixed swf group? (I decided against keeping track of swf because I play with very different people at very different skill levels - several-k-hours-comp(?)-players as well as just-installed-the-game-yesterday people - and while there are people I play with more frequently I don't have a fixed group. Given all that my swf matches are too all over the place to be useful, I think.)
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@Marigoria said:
Did you keep the end game screen for all of these? I'd like to see them to see what kind of perks everyone was running etc
I didn't keep the endgame screens. Did attempt it but I kept forgetting to save the screenshots and only later remembered I could just let steam do the collecting by just pressing F12. At that point it was too late though 🙈 - But I did keep a record of everything except teamie & killer Match-points. Put all teamie perks, items+add-ons, all killer perks and add-ons, all offerings* and all prestige levels (idk why) into an excel sheet.
I will do a breakdown of the loadouts once I have some time on my hands and feel like organising excel spreadsheets. It might take a while tho. 😬(I can post a screenshot of that part of the excel sheet here if you're interested - even though I used abbreviations at times most things should not need an explanation)
*another blunder was that I forgot there are personal and shared +25% all category BP so those are lumped together now.
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@Seraphor said:
With all Nurses, Blights and Huntresses, you must be at a fairly high MMR.
I literally never see Nurse, well maybe 1 out of 100 games. My games are also much more event than yours. I escape about 60-70% of the time, though half the time as the last survivor or via the hatch.
Thank you - but tbh I have a hard time believing I'm any higher than median in terms of MMR. For Nurse and Huntress it's hard to tell since they are free killers so they are at least tried by many people (+Rituals) and it's probably more about the add-ons rather than the killer itself that is an indicator of MMR. Not sure if I remember correctly but the Huntresses had 'I'm meaning business' skins & I remember seeing speed add-ons and Infantry Belts for at least a number of them. The Nurses were all over the place; some with Plaid Flanell (the brown one that lets you see where you blink) or Wooden Horse (Brown for less missed blink attacks) and some with the infamous range/recharge addons. Same goes for the Blights; some were I assume just doing the current tome (no/few/bad perks/add ons) and some were hard sweating.
When I look into the loadouts I'll probably also do a break down by Killer and Perks/Add-ons. Cause "Basekit Nurse" is really a different creature than "Omega Blink Nurse with Starstruck and aura reading".
@Dogma_loki said:
Love what you did here, the only thing I would bring up as a way to improve this is to have more than 1 person doing this and comparing results using the same parameters. Everyone has their own play styles and weakness' and strengths which would definitely affect these stats.
😏Do I see a volunteer? ^^
joking aside, while I agree it would be awesome if a few other people did it... I do 10/10 not recommend doing it. While the matches themselves took 21.5 hours that time doesn't account for writing down the outcomes and loadouts, loading screens and matchmaking. The actual time it took was probably closer to 40 hoursBut ye, you're completely right. - Even though these are 100 matches and it looks very statistic-y it's still only "statistically" relevant as far as I'm concerned. For everyone else it's still just more of a case study / anecdotal evidence.
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Ye, in certain situations there ought to be a forfeit/tap out option. - For killers in situations like these and also for survivors (the whole slugging the last two to prevent hatch from even spawning) as well.
That being said, what I like to do when that happens to me: use the time to practise whatever M2 the killer I play has. - Or to go back to a tile where I didn't do well and try to figure out what went wrong / how I should play that in the future. Or just try to hug a tile/object that you can easily get stuck on as tightly as possible. It's two minutes well spent, all things considered.
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usually a). Though it has little to do with altruism. - If it's going to be 3v1 it's gonna be a guaranteed loss anyway (and in my experience people don't tend to suicide at 3 or less gens) so I try to at least get the safe unhook points and maybe even the healing points. Exception is if they're suiciding because they're being camped; I'll stick to gens in that case. While I don't necessarily condone it I do understand where they're coming from.
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Disclaimer: I have not read through all comments. It does seem like people paint a rather black and white picture though.
I can see where OP is coming from. Personally, I would take a flashy bully squad over a stealth squad any day. I don't enjoy the whole hide at the faintest hint or TR game. So far the most it has accomplished is me involuntarily "camping" (being a back to hook Andy) because there is just no one else to be found once you do manage to down someone - and eventually you do between the bazillion gen kicks to check which ones they're working on. Maybetthere are people who enjoy that kind of gameplay - I'm not a fan.
On the survivor side I also find myself being somewhat annoyed by these teamies - especially when it gets to the point where they are screwing the team e. g. when I'm injured and maybe even on death hook and found myself a gen to quietly work on and the healthy not yet hooked stealther joins me. So far so good. - Then someone gets hooked. And they proceed to refuse to let go of the gen.That is until the first sign of TR when they run away from both the gen and the hooked person. That being said, sometimes you end up being the one who just kinda didn't cross paths with the killer until late game even though you've been quite busy running around to do gens, unhook, heal and what else might have to be done. It's sometimes hard to tell from the outside.
Personally, I'm absolutely not a looping god and will try to dodge the killer rather than run straight into them to draw aggro. But if it happens that everyone but me has been hooked I at least try to distract so hook stages among survs are evenly distributed and the killer doesn't feel tempted to just quickly tunnel the person on death hook out.
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I'll reply to every thread on the pharmacy issue. I agree & I'm really sad one of my fav perks is practically impossible to use. - At least make it a token system; you start with two and for [action] you charge tokens. As long as you have a token interacting with any old chest (for all I care only while injured) gives you a medkit, regardless of it already having been opened or not.
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Playing Nemo when I had a Leon and a Claire (who I think were duo-gaming) --- and I decided then and there to "cosplay" as Mr.X. Somehow Leon caught on and just started to run around the map in the same sequence you do when collecting the medallions. - We were very sad you can't crawl through the vent and can't go up to attic.
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Been playing a lot of soloQ since the update. Very mixed in terms of results. Vast majority of matches were not particularily fun. - Why keep playing SoloQ then? Cause there's something I'm curious about so I will have to get through another eight matches before I can quit soloQ (which I will).
SWF has been... various degrees of miserable as far as games are concerned. But nice in terms of people. The most annoying thing about SWF now is that if not all four are somewhat on the same level it's just not gonna work out. While before a weaker link could make up for typical "newbie behaviour" by focusing on gens and being there to heal the others and buy time with perks now it's just game over if they're found somewhat early in the game. Having the whole "git gud" attitude toward friends who just want to play casually together is killing the fun as far as the game is concerned. I just go to Iri I now and then idgaf when playing with friends and just expect a 95% death rate and focus on the fun side of chatting with friends while playing some game - which happens to be dbd. If friends find another game they rather play, I won't feel bad about stopping playing survivor altogether.
Have also been playing a lot more killer. That's been pretty fun, albeit a little bit boring to the point where I start to wonder how many more 3-4k it will take to move into a bracket where it's a fun back and forth and not a fun first five minutes and then it just all falls apart on the survivor side with the last five or seven minutes just being a stomp-fest. (I play Nemo most of the time; only add-ons I ever use are speedy zombies cause they're funny. Perks are always Lethal, BBQ, Spies & Jolt; I just like chase more than hide and seek and don't care too much for slow down cause dealing with gens is always the most annoying and boring aspect of the game. - At least I for one have never heard a killer say "I just love patrolling gens!" or a survivor going "I just love waiting for the next gen skillcheck!")
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@Advorsus said:
I honestly feel pretty much the same way. The game if played normally doesn't feel that much different. But so many survivors give up after the first down or hook since the patch, it seems like killers are doing better than they actually are.
The other thing I noticed is survivors saying it's not fun anymore. But I've noticed that survivors like myself who just play to play normally and effeciently (doing gens, breaking totems, saving when it's smart) aren't really experiencing this change of "fun".
If you're playing effeciently and normally, matches are the same.
However as a survivor you can't just play in the killers face anymore. You can't have your whole team body blocking and teabagging the whole match and still escape like before. If you want to play in that way to "have fun", you still can, but your chances of escaping go down a lot. Where before you had a bunch of perks that let you play that way without any real threat.
But now if you want to win, you actually have to play to win and escape.
If you as a killer play effeciently to win, and survivors play in the same way, the matches feel a lot closer and fair
"The other thing I noticed is survivors saying it's not fun anymore. But I've noticed that survivors like myself who just play to play normally and effeciently (doing gens, breaking totems, saving when it's smart) aren't really experiencing this change of "fun"." --- As someone who plays like that I do disagree. To me DBD is, indeed, a lot less fun as survivor than it was in May and June. - People can have different experiences and while I'm glad you have just as much fun as before other players who play just as normally may experience things differently (e.g. me). I'm saying that mainly because to me what you said sounded a lot like "if you don't have fun anymore you must be playing 'in the killer's face'".
That being said, I don't necessarily "play to win" - which in my head translates to "hard sweating" "nothing less than 100% laser focused". I play to have fun; just casual gaming where I can relax and chill; I play for recreational purposes only. If a game for recreation is more exhausting and less fun than work... then... well.
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All that being said, and on OPs note on survivors throwing. I have noticed that if there are more than one or two hooks before the first gen pops and/or someone is dead before at least three gens pop(/the third is about to pop) it's pretty much a guaranteed 4k anyway. At least in SoloQ. In SWF there's still some hope for a two man out. We don't talk about one man our via hatch because slugging for 4k seems to be the standard now.
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Was playing in a swf when that happened. Everyone got the endscreen that showed them and the killer having a dc. We all restarted the game just in case - so no clue if we waited out the 5min penalty by doing that without knowing or if we didn't get one.
(edit: that above is a new one for me. - That someone just gets randomly disconnected from the game always happened occasionally)
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I have the impression MMR overcompensates a lot. Like there is a delay or something. -For survivor I kept track of some soloQ matches and I noticed that after getting a lot of "7 deaths per escape" I suddenly got almost ten escapes in a row (one death in between matches iirc) --- followed by sweat-build spirits and nurses (not a blight iirc) that 4k after three minutes at zero gens done. - And then I get an Executioner with one yellow perk. --- And for killer I have noticed something similar. If I have a number of 4k in a row I suddenly get the most sweaty survivors --- then I get demolished for three or four games and suddenly get baby survivors. It very rarely lands in the middle for me. (Which is why, once I do find a comfortable spot as killer I try to stay there by giving hatch and allowing a 2E if the last two did decently and have only a gen left to do)
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Imagine them adding basement (*as in RE2's basement with the morgue and dogs) to the east wing and attic to the west wing. - Three story gaming.
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I have been playing a lot of soloQ recently again. And the one thing that kept bugging me the absolute most was the lack of two of the most basic call-outs: "Killer is on me" and "I'm going for the unhook". Those are probably the two most essential things you need to know to not "sandbag" each other all the time on a makro-game level. Other things are Perk and Add-on call outs - but that's not something you can implement.
Personally. I would like that, if you Q up as solo there are some basekit changes to survivors (like the often suggested HUD with basic action-icons). Plus some basic "Bond" and basic "Kindred"; for Bond reduce the range to 8 meters (the times I have run into a random/was run into by a random always felt like a super unnecessary thing. - One could also make it a somewhat more complex version where you can see the auras of survs further than 6m away and closer than 10m to avoid pallet/flashy-save "wallhacks" where it becomes too easy for survs to position themselves cause they can see the auras) and for Kindred remove the killer aura (which personally I don't find necessary but I can see how it looks to some degree unfair from a Killer's pov).
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3105561#Comment_3105561
In it, they state they were looking at taking team results into account as well. Additionally, nowhere in there do they actually state that the system ONLY looks at kills and escapes, he is simply stating that the system tries to predict a win or loss which is based on kills and escapes. Not necessarily that doing well in other areas doesn't contribute to having a win.
You are trying to look at things that are correlated and prove causation, which is not the case.
... Wow. No words. Wish Mandy or Peanits would get in here to clear this up - because if other people are as convinced as you are that would explain a lot of "but I'm high MMR" statements made on these forums.
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3104512#Comment_3104512
I ended up finding a source thanks to someone here. But it appears that you are incorrect. There is more to it then kills and escapes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=civV99mXFXo&t=1540s
Thats from one year prior (Feb 2021) and reflects an approach that was ultimately not implemented into the game. I started playing after SBMM was introduced so it's all just history for me anyway but afaik there were many months of testing before they settled on the current version. But you did have the right idea to check yt for the stream recording. I found the one the article was referencing (Oct. 2021): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIocxDbQ-9g It's what Andrew says from 22:50 on.
"There is a common misconception that by looking only at kills and escapes to adjust your MMR it's [SBMM is] 'ignoring' skill in the game. This isn't the truth. This is false. Kills and escapes are proxies for skill in that skilled play inherently leads to kills or escapes."
It follows the infamous Hockey example and the even more infamous sentence "Skilled play leads to wins. If they don't * insert shrug emoji * were they really skilled plays? Right? If your skilled play doesn't get you the win, was it really a skilled play to begin with?"
It goes on for a minute or two where he really makes it absolutely clear that counting anything other than kills and escapes leads to "really weird math" that doesn't work.
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I did wonder that too. If as killer your average kill rate is supposed to be above 2 your MMR is always gonna go up. And if as survivor your escape rate is supposed to be less than 50% on the whole its just always gonna go down. SBMM would have to somehow account for that...which begs the question what the point even is then. (Someone also mentioned not-top-tier-killer-players complaining about how their matches actually got harder --- which I personally havent seen but it would be the inevitable consequence)
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3104875#Comment_3104875
I know about the MMR rework, i'm not a moron, you can't see your MMR and we have no idea how this system works. Take a look at my post count, hours, and stats before you talk down to me.
The person here was claiming that only escapes and kills count and nothing else. I'm simply stating that in my experience that is not the case, because i played dozens of games after a few months break and only escaped literally 1 or 2 games (and both of those were through the hatch) and had potato teammates almost every game, but still personally played well, pipping nearly every match. Now i suddenly have very competent teammates with hundreds or thousands of hours and have been escaping nearly 50% of the time in solo queue the past few days.
The only possible explanation for this, is that i played well, my MMR increased (despite not escaping) and now i'm getting good teammates.
Anyone who says "it is only based on kills/escapes" isn't citing any sources for which BHVR actually explained that this is how it works. The only information we have right now, is that the "hatch doesn't count" which doesn't mean that it only counts escapes, it just means the hatch doesn't count.
The problem is that everyone always sees escaping as "you won" but the reality is, you can win without escaping if you play well in very other area.
wel. Apparently the vod of the dev Q&A where Andrew stated it has been removed from twitch.
Yesterday's Q&A Livestream with the Dead by Daylight dev team gave us quite a bit of info on upcoming changes to the game, including nerfs to the soon-to-be-released Boon perks and possible modifications to the Prestige system. Additionally, Lead Game Designer Patrick Harris finally explained exactly how the newly implemented…This is the best I could find. Someone used a clip of Andrew making the statement in a YT video. you should easily find it by searching "kills equal skill dbd". It's the one withaAndrews face in the thumbnail and was posted February.
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As survivor it depends on my mindset. If I actually want to survive I'm extremely vary of friendly killers and will try to remove myself from the farming/Memeing location regularly to get rid of bones & try to be out of reach when the last gen pops. I usually also walk to the other exit gate.
However, if I'm in a match without caring mutch about the result anyway I just embrace the goofing around and the wary tingle in the back of my head that once last gen pops playtime may be over. Which is hilarious in its own regard.
As killer I sometimes just feel like goofing around as ghostie or piggie. As Billy I prefer trying to make full chainsaw laps around the map and then zoom into the exit gates once they're opened. And as huntress I sometimes get myself in a spot where I can hit long distances and try to get trick long shots. - Scratch Myers is also on the list purely for the jumpscares but I don't really know how to pull that off yet. Survivors doing hilarious things also sometimes makes me turn friendly regardless of the killer I play. I just can't kill survs that make me crack up. -- Last surv also always gets hatch as long as I have noticed them doing anything useful at all.
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Just the regular reminder that DCing and suiciding on hook is first and foremost a symptom of an issue. Artificially making these stats look good via punitive measures that prevents high numbers isn't fixing anything, it just makes the underlying issue invisible. If anything it exacerbates the issues.
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At first I was under the impression that INTERACTING with a chest while injured would always give you a medkit - regardless of the chest having been opened already or not. That would also be the most sensible option, imo (together with a token system).
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3100636#Comment_3100636
Except there won't be a hatch unless killers intentionally allows them to have one.
I wouldn't go so far as saying intentionally have it; sure, killers have the advantage when it comes to finding the hatch first but you do have a chance as survivor. It's really where the slug to keep hatch from even spawning comes into play - and while it has been a thing before it has been the default in the recent past. Which, imo, might be one of the many aspects that makes survivors throw very early in the game atm. Just my personal take tho.
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... You do realise that the "well, there's still hatch" is essentially what's keeping survivors in the game once exit gates are, realistically, out of the question (aka once a survivor is out of the game before at least 3 gens have popped)?
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yes, something should be done so that fewer people give up by suiciding on hook. However, that behaviour is a symptom of an jssue and not the issue itself.
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I'd be the one in the friends Group B that would really like to make some friends in Group D but really struggles to do so cause they vibe differently.
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it went from ~40% to just below 30%
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Beginning of match depends if you sgould walk or run with sb. the gen is right around the corner but you dont know if the killer is gonna say hello sooner rather than later? Invest three seconds to have sb to be able to greed the gen/not have to think about pre leaving. All four spawned in the same Place? use sb to get yourself to a different corner of the map and on a different gen. Thats at least how I so it and it works well enough.
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In response to the various "hatch is free" - it still isn't.
It is the game mechanic to account for the game being assymetrical: 4v1 is supposed to be belanced with both sides having a fighting chance. The more survivors are down the more it's in the killer's favour. It's a lost battle and when one survivor is left there are two options: have the game end by default or introduce a new game stage. That's hatch. An intended phase of the game. Just like EGC is. The difference between survivors refusing to open doors and killers refusing to hook someone is that a killer can trigger egc while survivors can't trigger hatch. (And yes, intentionally leaving the last gen 99d for a prolonged period of time is imo comparable- but it's also something I only see squads do that are bullying anyways or when a killer is afk/farming. Maybe that is just me though, so I ask: do you see people do that all the time?)
To those that do it as a reaction to tbags and stuff - I understand your frustration but two wrongs don't make a right. I too resist the urge to get myself a flashlight and join the clicky clicky tbag crowd whenever I outplay a killer and continue to do the 3k+hatch thing regardless of how a survivor reacts to it. Because how is being mean to Killer/Survivor B doing anything about the fact that Killer/Survivor A was mean to me? Except for fulfilling a rather primal desire for revenge by projecting it on someone else.