Please Do Something About Killer Item Spawns Being Moved by Chests.
The Issue Explained
This is an issue affecting many killers including the newest killer Springtrap where chests and killer items use the same spawns and chests take priority when a map is generated. This means on certain maps where key locations on the map only have 1 chest spawn or when multiple chests are being spawned in through certain offerings, it is making certain killer items which rely on being spawned by generators, spawn in places nowhere near the generators actively making certain killers almost entirely powerless for the match or removing 50% of their power and making survivors interaction with these items incredibly difficult.
The killers who have interactive items that need to be by generators such as Sadako to push condemn, Xenomorph/Alien to pressure generators AND for survivors to reliably get the turrets to break him out of power, end up having their TV's/Turret Stations spawning great distances away from generators. Below I've created a video showcasing just how egregious this issue can get with these killers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0G9U2B-Ctc&Most recently now Springtrap is also affected by this where his doors are being spawned edge map in places that are completely useless for both Springtrap and survivors. They are too far to ever reliably be used to spot Springtrap using the cameras and they are too far to reliably pressure certain areas of the map.
The door beside me and the door in the distance infront will be useless for the entire match.
The door off in the distance is so far aware from main that there is never a reason to use it.
Here is is on Xenomorph spawning 3 turrets right next to one another rather than being meaningfully spread out.
Why this is Such a Problem
This is a major design flaw because now we have situations where you simply lose the match based on offerings you can't predict in the lobby. It also means any event where the event offering spawns in chests like the recent winter event and the last anniversary event become borderline unplayable for these killers and in the case of the anniversary offering, it repeatedly shows up after the anniversary because people are using it for bloodpoints not spawning in extra chests.
Simultaneously, in the case of Xenomorph and Springtrap, the survivors interactions with the killer powers become exceedingly frustrating since you either need to go out your way to get a turret to the parts of the map where tunnels haven't spawned or you just can't use multiple cameras/doors for traversal around the map and to spot Springtrap.
I previously reported this as a bug and then it was said to not be a bug and intentional design, then the whole post was ignored despite many of us expressing our concerns with the problems this mechanic caused. So, here I am pleading on behalf of all players that this finally be addressed because it's actively gotten worse with the recent PTB with offering changes since in the PTB, the coin offerings are now secret we won't even be able to tell when a survivor brings in these offerings.
How We Attempted to Fix the Issue
We had 2 ways to try and deal with this problem
- We could force close the game when multiple offerings that spawned in more chests were used so we actually had a power. Something that should never under any circumstances be something a player needs to worry about doing.
- We could run the cut coin to remove 2 chests from play. However, the cut coin method only worked if survivors also didn't bring in offerings to spawn in more chests.
Killers ability to play the game and likewise, survivors interaction with killer powers under no circumstances should ever be held hostage because of offerings not being ran for this purpose. This is a mechanic that simply shouldn't exist in any capacity because it does nothing to improve the game. Losing a match before you've even loaded in isn't fun to play, nor is it fun to play against. Imagine if the next anniversary offering rendered a meta perk like decisive completely useless, it wouldn't be justifiable but for some reason it rendering a killers entire gameplay loop useless is supposedly fine?
Potential Fixes
The best way to fix it would be to make killer items spawn in first during map generation so they take priority. That way if killer needs their power to spawn near generators to be useful and for survivors to reliably interact with it, it actually happens. This would be the best solution because now chests and chest builds can be used against and on these killers while not needing to rework maps and such (you would need to make an exception for the basement). However I've got some other potential fixes.
- Make the cut coin offering work like the new shroud offering. Instead of just removing 2 chests, add a secondary condition that ignores all chest spawn effects from perks/offerings and then remove 2 chests. This way players using event items for bloodpoints keep the bloodpoints while killers can remove the chest effects no matter how many are used. This puts this offering in line with Sacrificial Wards and the new Shroud offerings.
- Add more spawns into the map with a minimum 2 spawns in a 24m radius of generators and put a limit on how close 2 chests can spawn beside each other. This way there will always be a spot for killer items by generators should the killer need it.
- Add in specific spawns for killer items. This way chests cannot displace killer spawns no matter what because they don't share the same spawns.
Final Thoughts
Please BHVR, address this issue. This is a mechanic that is now affecting 3 licensed killers including the most hyped killer in this games history, we pay real money for these killers and we should be allowed to play them on an even playing field no matter what map/offering is being ran. We should be allowed to participate in events without worry that half our power is going to be completely useless and survivors shouldn't need to take 30 second detours with Turrets to be able to use them in more than 1/4 of the map. Please address this problem. Thank you.
Comments
Originally I would've just dodged lobbies that had coins but guess I can't do that until they hopefully fix this, absolutely won't be buying springtrap until this gets fixed. Why does a game mechanic that survivors only do when they are throwing or doing a very specific build take precedent over killers basic gameplay.
Behavior: Please give priority to killer props. The goal of Operation Health is to make this game enjoyable for both sides right?This would be a step in the right direction because I have always loved the concept of this game; it allows you to immerse yourself in the role of the killer you play. However, it has become challenging to play casually in the current state of the game.
Sadako, my main, struggles against decent survivors due to her TV spawns not providing enough pressure to balance the game. This leads many players to avoid her and other killers with abilities involving chests during events because of the constant disadvantage posed by anniversary cakes. For an already low-tier killer, this makes matches rough and not fun or fair, forcing players in a simular situation to choose killers that guarantee a more enjoyable experience, like Blight or Nurse. Consequently, survivor players end up bored or annoyed at seeing the same killers each match, especially after a new killer release like Springtrap.
To add variety to matches and Restore Balance to the FORCE, I kindly ask PERCHANCE could you prioritize killer items.
P.S Buff Sadako plz
The fact that this "feature" is still in the game when Springtrap comes out is quite baffling. With the introduction of one of the expectedly biggest killers of all time, big enough to necessitate a "project health update", and this "feature" is still in the game is a terrible decision. The choice to try to make the game better to entice more people to play the game, then to just leave in a "feature" that can hard counter that killers power, and costs literally nothing to do, is actually quite a crazy and terrible take for the dev team to have.
I've been pointing this out ever since the Vecna dlc and really noticed how messed up Sadako's TV spawns can be on that map with these offerings. It really needs to be addressed, with a new killer using killer stations and for any future killers that may do the same.
Please BHVR, we beg you to address this!
Frankly he's not as strong as he seems and his perks aren't really that good, he really needs serious changes from the PTB to live because again… if he comes out in this state, he is absolutely not going to be considered A to B tier for very long. Let's look at this really.
Weaker antiloop than Huntress because he has one hatchet and has to wait several seconds to get it back when he very well might need it most. Weaker teleport than Sadako with the same issues as her; Sadako at least gets quickish teleport and a Condemned mechanic. Teleport Survivors can also use at a risk a lot like Dredge, but let's face it - everyone will just avoid using it because it's too risky and gives him an instant grab, why take that chance when you could just eliminate his power with the doors? Dredge has less of an issue with the lockers and their spawns than Springtrap will have. He's 110% speed outside of using the doors. He is otherwise an M1 Killer with a weak antiloop, decent mobility, nothing much to handle long chases, and a slow walking speed.
Dredge has a remnant and faster teleport. Sadako has condemned and faster teleport. Huntress has multiple hatchets despite being a slower movement speed. What in comparison makes Springtrap better at any of that than these three Killers?
I think he will inevitably, if he comes out in this state, settle to a mid B to high C in light of just how easily he can be countered, bullied, and how slow he gets his M2 back. He really does not have as much as people think, but at least he's fun. Hell, I think someone like Ghostface or Myers or even Bubba might be stronger… they at least can bash pallets, use stealth as a form of extended mindgame, or one hit people.
Why are there so many replies from people with 1 post/new accounts. Are people just making accounts to push this issue.
we're coming here from a youtube video, most of us didn't have a reason to use bhvr forums until now
Oh ok that makes sense.
Um, that's a rabbit.
please do what Rare does not, and fix this issue.
Xenomorph, Sadako, Plague and Springtrap.
That's 4 out of 40. That means exactly 10% of the killer roster is at the mercy of chest spawns.
Please fix this, especially since there might be more killers in the future that will also suffer for the same reasons.
PLEASE fix this, i have so many cobblers on sadako and i can't even use those
We can raise awareness about this by mass-equipping Shiny Coin on survivor once Springtrap hits live lol.
Yeah, this is a pretty big issue and continues to get bigger. It needs to be fixed for everyone's sake, but to allow the issue to fester while it affects the MOST REQUESTED KILLER EVER is folly. Both Springtrap AND the survivors suffer from this. BHVR fix pls
100 xeno main, hoping this gets fixed. Its not some balance issue its literally something as broken as hooks spawning aimed at walls. This often even ends up with several tunnels right next to eachother allowing survivors to build an entire fortress of turrets in seconds, and also causes multi floor generators to force you to go to the opposite floor first then work your way up or down to chase someone off a generator, let alone what it does for other killers. One swap of spawn priority could turn this into a quality of life improvement for everyone.
This is seriously counterintuitive and, frankly, detrimental to the game. Nobody thinks this is good for anyone. All we want is that killer powers actually work properly and reliably. Surely it's not much to ask?
Please fix this, behavior.
Please BHVR just fix it!😙
Not having to worry about crap killer item spawns would be a dream.
Why the hell is this even a problem, BHVR shouldn't be able to get away with laziness like this. Just make a new system separate from chests, pick some locations for the killer structures to be placed (preferably near generators) and we're good. Survivors shouldn't just have the ability to make a killer power worse with an addon that's totally unrelated to doing such a thing, hell there shouldn't be an addon that makes killer powers worse at all! If BHVR has time to hire multiple artists for cosmetics, they can definitely afford 2-3 programmers to fix an issue that shouldn't have existed in the first place.
This really needs to be fixed.
It’s so demoralising loading into the match and seeing you only have a couple of usable TVs.
Not much to say here that the post hasn't already addressed. With the upcoming Anniversary offerings spawning additional chests (even when the Killer uses them) this problem is only going to get worse if they don't change something soon.
I also wonder if it affects Pig's Jigsaw boxes. If yes, then they could be placed very close to each other, reducing the time required to get rid of head traps.
Even if it doesn't affect the Pig, the first post explains very well why this is detrimental to several killers and it should be changed.
Came across the video and now it makes sense why some killerpowers spawn edge map.
I play a little more survivor than killer, but this has to be fixed for games to be balanced, like people have said above me, prioritising killerpowers and then chests after would fix these problems.
-edit;
Giving one side the potential to "nerf" the otherside by bringing chest offerings is not a good idea/not balanced.
By making it prioritise the killer power spawns first, the games will be more equal and thus the collected game data you always mention would be more accurate too. Win-Win.
Please do change the chests!
With the amount of traction springtrap is getting, this should have been addressed during the health updates. it is better to solve this problem now, rather than when this patch goes live and the larger player base is effected by chests, as we all know there is going to be many springtrap mains >_<
According to another user in the thread, Pig is affected. Here's a full list of killers affected and the related prop:
This is a fourth of the killer roster, with effects on both sides of the coin.
Cool that someone try to warn devs, that this isnt fair! Mb this isnt a bug, but something that affect many killers who with this thing cant even use thier power effitiently, which is silly in my opinion.
BHVR please change killer item to be seprete from chest or make them have priority over chest because that is just unfun on killers that require their items to be fun
Killers' objects should always had a priority over chest, that's the only correct way to design it. I'm baffled by the fact this game is going to be 9 years and this still haven't been addressed since the first killer with map objects released.
Please change this Behavior
I'm assuming this post was made because of JcGlitchmaster making a video about this but he also did a follow-up to that video where the devs adressed it but not as a bug but that it's an intended feature of the game. https://youtu.be/jFTIsKrHvug?si=o1IOBTBLWEesVPcI
BHVR, Springtrap will be the main killer a lot of new players will main, please for the player retention you need to be successful due to them just quitting when they see that their power is useless because half the doors are on the edge of the map, making everyone run the coin offerings to ruin the experience of a springtrap at their least ethical, causing new players to quit DBD and ask for refunds due to how badly their first matches go.
I'm shocked a Dev or Community Manager hasn't commented on this post to say "Hey! Great Feedback! We will get this back to the devs" Or "We are keep an eye on this thread" or "Hey we hear you guys! While we don't have an exact solution to this issue right now, its worth noting"
Anything would be nice please <3
That's correct, OP has submitted it as a bug report and has been told that it was intended, which is why this is now being flagged as feedback, instead of being submitted as a bug report. Even if killer items coming after chests is a intended feature, it doesn't have to be that way. It's being talked about so heavily now due to Springtrap being affected by it, despite being the most anticipated killer in DBD's history.
I'm also hammering down the point that this needs to be fixed before Plague is added to 2v8, as it is a real possibility for the next version of it, which includes incredibly exciting features like the killer bot update and the play while you wait feature - why not also fix something that affects a killer that might join the roster, and make it the best received non-collab 2v8?
Please. Please. Please fix this BHVR. As an Onryo main, certain maps are essentially unplayable due to how TVs frequently spawn nowhere near generators or clustered all together (Backwater Swamp is especially bad). This has been happening for years now and it desperately needs addressed. I had hoped you would be doing so with the "spawn logic) changes noted on the roadmap, but it appears that was only for character spawns. Killer item spawn logic desperately needs a rework as well. Especially now with how many killers it effects.
The fact we have nearly 200 upvotes with only a single downvote should say something, BHVR. We really want this changed.
This change needs to happen. Killers were part of their power spawn are so inconsistent because of chest spawns. This will really hurt the new killers who join the game to play springtrap.
It's annoying yo deal with this, specifically on maps with multiple levels, withkiller items spawning on the lower level of the gen that its supposed to be by, like xenos tunnel, I keep having at least 2 tunnels spawn on the first level, underneath the gens that both tunnels are by, it's annoying
On a side note, if Singularity spawns extra chests can he then force his EMP's to be out in the middle of nowhere?
What if they cant deal with the chest spawns cuz they are very deeply connected with a map generation code.
And if they mb touch it, it will breakes the map generation. XD
Just dont want to create Bug by Daylight, dont you think?
I am glad someone finally addressed the whole situation.
The fact that this still exists is astonishing. And what's more, the fact that it even affects the most hyped chapter in the history of DBD and has not been adressed is simply incredible in all the possible wrong ways.
But remember: labor of love everyone.
Agreed
Ok, i have seen a lot of videos with springtrap on dbd, been analyzing them, seeing how he works, hes overall a very versatile killer like the wraith or michael myers, but if i get to say my opinion about it, i would change him slightly and rework him as so.
That is how i see as to how to fix springtrap, and i do believe that if someone reads this post, they might agree with me (and if someone that kinda just wanna ######### about it without even looking at all the data weve recovered and us playing both against springtrap and as springtrap, then you dont see springtrap as a good killer and play something else, thats all i have to say there)
If it breaks map generation, then perhaps that's all the more reason to overhaul the system. You could even pair it with the Swamp overhaul and the Dvarka shack map update.
Noticing a distinct lack of comments from community managers or devs here....
This is definitely something worth changing, the current design decreases incentive to play any of the killers whose powers are impacted by this
This is a very well presented and thought out explanation of an issue. Good job!
Please look into this issue as it damages the fun factor for both survivors and certain killers.