Yeah it's annoying. Very rarely ever do I face camp except for some very rare circumstances. If I get FC'd as a survivor, well I just laugh it off and hope the other 3 are cranking out gens (I go soloQ)
My point is, “in game definitions” are a poor litmus.
But there is no way for the game itself to know gens “went too fast” thats the point. For example the game can tell when chases start and end. The op is asking for the game itself to acknowledge facecamping which it currently cannot do so and if it did it would be abuseable 100%.
My point is, “in game definitions” are a poor litmus.
If you want to bring in perks, Reassurance exists to punish camping.
There's no in game definition of facecamping or genrushing, there's no base mechanic that punishes either of those things, perks existing that make those strategies easier to deal with isn't creating an ingame definition of facecamping or genrushing.
The only thing devs have basically said exists is tunneling with the BT basekit changes and those were honestly fairly simple to implement and had little ability for abuse.
If you want to bring in perks, Reassurance exists to punish camping.
There's no in game definition of facecamping or genrushing, there's no base mechanic that punishes either of those things, perks existing that make those strategies easier to deal with isn't creating an ingame definition of facecamping or genrushing.
The only thing devs have basically said exists is tunneling with the BT basekit changes and those were honestly fairly simple to implement and had little ability for abuse.
Reassurance is less than a month old and a perk accessible through purchase only, at this time. Camping has been a problem for much longer than this particular “fix”, if you will, has existed.
And the base mechanics that punish generator repair speeds are (failed) skill checks along with killers damaging generators (which was recently buffed)—both of which regress generators.
There’s really no in-game glossary beyond kill, escape, totems, and other basic features of the game. But BHVR certainly acknowledges that aspects of the game exist beyond these things.
I definitely don’t like the idea of killer powers deactivating at or near hooks. But it’s foolish to pretend camping isn’t a problem in dire need of a solution.
They have very weak territorial killers in dbd, if they were to remove proxying, camping, or facecamping you would need to buff those killers significantly. They probably already tested these ideas but they found them to be probably worse for the fun factor of the game.
Maybe later on they will change these things, but i honestly dont see it happening at all. Just dont get downed or hell hide theres nothing wrong with that at all.
I would love to see an actual solution for camping but I don't think one can exist based on killer proximity to hook because one side or the other will game that line to their advantage.
And no solution for camping will work as long as Hag or Twins exist. Possibly even Huntress. They can camp from the other side of the map.
So we just aren't allowed to play our killer if we're camping, which you have to do to win as killer? Why do you think we camp anyway, for fun? Y'all always look at the effect but never the cause.
Killer powers should be disabled after they face camp for longer than 7 seconds
STBFL also needs to be toned down because at full stacks survivors cannot even hook trade, you can get two hits off before they complete the unhook
This would only slightly reduce the camping issue
-from someone who is tired of being face camped every game because its "legitimate strategy"
If you want taken seriously, be specific, be correct. There is no face camping in DbD. Face camping was fixed years ago.
Let me be more specific: in 2016 there was face camping. Face camping was when the killer bodyblocked the exact spot the survivor would have needed to unhook the hooked survivor. This was a problem. So the devs at the time made the hooks rotatable so that there were multiple unhook points. Since then there is no more face camping.
its not tho, even otzdarva himself said he thinks that at least the cannibals killer powers should disable when within 8m of the hook.
Not saying you should not be able to M1 during a trade just no cannibal charges, no huntress windup, no T3 myers face camping or any other killer who can make face camping too strong or uncounterable.
While that may be your philosophy, after multiple consecutive games in a row dying to constant camping and tunneling not everyone will be feeling like they just want to laugh it off especially if we're talking about solo q.
I need to point out that the opinion of an entertainer, as popular has he may be, holds no more weight as the opinion any other experienced player. ( Not much ;) )
Thr STBFL part is false. Even at max stacks trading is still possible. Otherwise I agree all killers should receive the Artist treatment and be unable to use their powers near a hook.
I need to point out that the opinion of an entertainer, as popular has he may be, holds no more weight as the opinion any other experienced player. ( Not much ;) )
Not to mention getting rid of hook grabs means there's no way to stop unhooks and will increase the unsafe rescues.
There's no ingame definition of facecamping so there's nothing here to implement
They can easily implement a system. Proximity checks already exist, they’d just have to make a system that takes proximity checks and POV/Cone checks together to determine what is going on in the match for a duration of time
I need to point out that the opinion of an entertainer, as popular has he may be, holds no more weight as the opinion any other experienced player. ( Not much ;) )
so you're saying your opinion holds about as much weight as Otz's then? I thought uhhh... Otz has been playing for over 6,000 hours since 2017. You're also saying your opinion doesn't matter, which yeah. I think someone who literally is paid to play DbD professionally since at least 2018 and is his actual career that he uses to pay bills and sustain himself and his wife for years with rent and food probably knows a little more about this game than you.
so you're saying your opinion holds about as much weight as Otz's then? I thought uhhh... Otz has been playing for over 6,000 hours since 2017. You're also saying your opinion doesn't matter, which yeah. I think someone who literally is paid to play DbD professionally since at least 2018 and is his actual career that he uses to pay bills and sustain himself and his wife for years with rent and food probably knows a little more about this game than you.
I would suggest you take on reading about cognitive biases and logical fallacies. It will do you good.
And we will get more hook divers, already hooks are swarmed in a lot of games, people complain of camping but they dont give us a chance to leave the hook before they unhook..... Do you really think we will leave if we see you there??
Hook bombing is not as common as hook camping in my experience, and even if it happens you can still M1.
I would suggest you take on reading about cognitive biases and logical fallacies. It will do you good.
You may start with the strawman.
Using clever language and terms that most people including me are familiar with do NOT make your argument more convincing, your hours and personal cognitive biases stack AGAINST you and you're not immune from logical fallacies yourself like, "I'm better than someone with a lot more experience than me because I call them an 'Entertainer'".
He's a content creator, not a literal clown. Being a content creator doesn't make you better or worse inherently.
He doesn't play worse for content, he doesn't waste time cracking jokes when playing seriously, he plays the game. That isn't to say Otz is incredible or insane with every single Killer, like he's pretty bad with some decent Killers like Doctor and Deathslinger and misses the power more than people who have more experience with them. He does take this into consideration too.
He's not superhuman nor does he need to be to be decent.
Using clever language and terms that most people including me are familiar with do NOT make your argument more convincing, your hours and personal cognitive biases stack AGAINST you and you're not immune from logical fallacies yourself like, "I'm better than someone with a lot more experience than me because I call them an 'Entertainer'".
He's a content creator, not a literal clown. Being a content creator doesn't make you better or worse inherently.
He doesn't play worse for content, he doesn't waste time cracking jokes when playing seriously, he plays the game.
I rest my case. Good luck with you future endeavours.
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
Well if they're keeping you in chase then they take you to the hook you could make the power re enable after a few seconds. It would still take a Myers camping at the hook to get this to work that way and you could just pause his Tier 3 instead of making him lose it. Count any situation where a Survivor drags the Killer into this zone a sufficient distance away and with enough time in chase as "not camping" except if the Killer gets a down.
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
Yeah, I used to not be able to tell when the killer had STBFL, but especially as the obsession it should be more common knowledge to force chases, bodyblock, block doorways as the obsession when you know the killer has stacks
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
I am a little curious.
Why can Hag place her Phantasm Traps almost under the Hooked Survivor but Artist can't place her Dire Crows anywhere near the Hook?
So I guess if survivors are running around the hook and you are attempting to zone them off you should be punished for it? Just accept you are dead and move on, what are the chances that you run into the game where the killer is playing leatherface, is a facecamper and chooses to camp you over the other 3 survivors? Unless you are doing something the killer doesn't like so you get frequently camped...
The chances that you run into people either hard tunneling or camping is pretty high, tbh.
What is wrong with being tunnelled? Yeah sure, it sucks for the person being tunnelled. When it happens to me I just accept he is trying to get someone out of the game asap, I can't fault them for it. If they don't then I'm grateful for it.
Its just a game, we don't need to kneecap killers over things that people find annoying.
I don't know how to respond to that complete lack of understanding, so I'm just gonna let it go.
Why can Hag place her Phantasm Traps almost under the Hooked Survivor but Artist can't place her Dire Crows anywhere near the Hook?
Phantasm traps require the Hag to hit and she's 4.4 so she often relies on traps to hit, while Dire Crows facing the hooked Survivor could down both Survivors through Endurance and guarantee a hit and Artist is 4.6 m/s. She's already pretty powerful without this also, though it's very wonky when you recently hook a person and you want to check gens like how Twins feel with this mechanic lol.
Hag RELIES on her power but Artist technically doesn't.
so you're saying your opinion holds about as much weight as Otz's then? I thought uhhh... Otz has been playing for over 6,000 hours since 2017. You're also saying your opinion doesn't matter, which yeah. I think someone who literally is paid to play DbD professionally since at least 2018 and is his actual career that he uses to pay bills and sustain himself and his wife for years with rent and food probably knows a little more about this game than you.
He's also not omniscient. Just because you play the game for a long time does not mean you know everything about it
It wasen't untill last year that Otz learned how a 50% reduction in speed worked for example. Despite playing the game for like 2-3 years or something at that point
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
For the first paragraph I think people would want something more akin to being unable to use M2 within 8m of a hooked survivor, so that wouldn't prevent T3 Myers since he already stalked into T3.
As far as STBFL, the prime users of STBFL have a reliable M2 to never lose stacks (Demo, Wesker, Nemesis). Also often times if I were the Obsession as the 4th person chased in soloq, and the killer leaves me after I drop a pallet or vault a window, I don't know if it was STBFL or them going for an easier chase. Am I required to stalk the killer every match as Obsession on the off chance they run STBFL, then only take hits when they are carrying people? I think something more akin to the Dying Light buff tooltip to let the Obsession know would be good enough for soloq.
Artist can't place birds within a certain range of the hook. Trapper can't place near a hook. Your going to have to specify which killer, and your going to say bubba to which I agree. Bubba shouldn't be able to use his chainsaw while face camping. But the other killers are fine imo.
I need to point out that the opinion of an entertainer, as popular has he may be, holds no more weight as the opinion any other experienced player. ( Not much ;) )
I would suggest you take on reading about cognitive biases and logical fallacies. It will do you good.
You may start with the strawman.
I think the logical fallacy you are referring to is the appeal to authority, all while you use the ad hominem fallacy. Yes, Otz's opinion isn't fact and he is fallible, but he's one of the people who should be listened to, the most, due to his knowledge of the game and him trying to take into account his own personal limitations.
The value can be adjusted from 7 seconds to something that is determined to be more reasonable and less abusable, but as of right now killers can do the bare minimum of catching someone once and secure 1 kill at the very least or get a snowballed 2-4k at the most easily just by face camping survivors especially if it is a team full of solo queue players.
The devs have balanced this game around SWF which is unreasonable considering the massive gap in survivor's effectiveness and awareness in a SWF vs Solo Q
The devs do not need to nerf SWFs more, but bring the information SWFs have to solo q survivor so that the killer buffs and survivor nerfs are reasonable to SWF and solo Q alike.
Hook grabs should be completely done away with.
And as for the obsession being relied on to counterplay against STBFL,
Why should I have to rely on another singular survivor alone to counter play the killers perk?
What if I am solo queuing and the obsession does not care to counter play against STBFL?
Am I supposed to just accept that this game was lost to begin with or that I have no way of countering a killers playstyle? that does not seem like healthy gameplay to me. There is outplay if you're in a SWF or the obsession realizes what is going on and plays accordingly, but if not then there is no counter play for STBFL max stacks and non obsession survivors.
Not to mention there is counter play for the counter play killers can just M2 the obsession and not lose stacks. Unless you expect solo q players to hook bomb every game and be as coordinated as a SWF that is an unreasonable assertion that the survivors have effective counterplay - only 1 survivor has counter play alone which the rest of the team must rely on and pray they realize whats happening if everyone is solo q.
As for it being abusable I disagree, it is not abusable for survivors to sit around the face camped survivor while the killer cannot use their M2 power, the killer can still easily M1, and if the survivors are just sitting in the "safe spaces" that is not doing anything productive to win the game, especially considering the survivors can still be basic attacked, T2 Myers can still use his power get T3 and return to the hook and face camp I am not saying the hook area should become a non T3 safe space, huntress could still snipe hooks across map. I am saying if the killer is face camping (within 8m of the hook for X amount of time) they should not be able to use their M2.
This would just prevent the abusability of killers like the cannibal from preventing trades on the hook or even getting 2 extra downs because the cannibal can still M2 through BT and down the unhooked survivor, I've done it before.
What about say a huntress or trickster or deathslinger chasing someone lining up a shot and they bomb into the hook range to do a drive by reassurance and loses a down because of it.
The huntress running BBQ that has 4 sec of aura read to try and line up a crossmap and loses aura read before they can get far enough away after a hook to get a hatchet off
The billy who wants to go pressure a gen but has to wait to charge his chainsaw until he gets far enough away and loses a gen because he couldnt get there as fast
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
Speaking is safe places, can you guys add hooks to these immortal areas on 2nd and 3rd floors where boil survivors always run to? It guarantees them having hook immunity, so they just run there every chase then stand there waiting to get downed. It's a bit silly, and will turn problematic if the anti slug rework goes live.
BHVR should adjust specific killers powers who are prone to camping based on whether or not they are choosing to participate in a chase or not. It should not be based on hook distance because that's an arbitrary number that can be played around. Camp penalty if you're within 8 meters? Just go 9 meters. This was the issue with old Borrowed Time and the Terror Radius until BHVR just made it work all the time.
Killer powers that are prone to camping should slowly lose its charge if you don't participate in chase - Starting off with Bubba. Bubba is ultimately a chase killer and as such should be treated like one. Don't make a stupid game mechanic that affects all killers just because a few problematic ones. The emblem penalty was a stupid idea and ultimately doesn't do anything - We shouldn't add to something that failed miserably. We also shouldn't add game mechanics that encourage cheese mechanics. Remember old Deep Wounds? Yeah that resulted in Moon Walking Legion.
Rework the perks and killers specifically to address the issue - Do not bandaid the problem by making a change that affects everyone the game - It should be a case by case basis where the goal is the same but the change is different.
I would love to see an actual solution for camping but I don't think one can exist based on killer proximity to hook because one side or the other will game that line to their advantage.
And no solution for camping will work as long as Hag or Twins exist. Possibly even Huntress. They can camp from the other side of the map.
My idea has always been to instead tie it to whether or not the Killer is in a chase or carrying someone else while anyone is on a hook. If the Killer is out hunting others, reward the Killer somehow. If the Killer is standing by, punish the Killer somehow.
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Comments
This is not a thing for the precise reason it is abusable.
Sure, and the exits should get blocked permanently if survivors do gens too fast
How's the game determine what "face camping" is, precisely?
Go on, tell me your original and scintillating idea. I'm sure no one here has ever heard it before.
There's no ingame definition of facecamping so there's nothing here to implement
Yeah it's annoying. Very rarely ever do I face camp except for some very rare circumstances. If I get FC'd as a survivor, well I just laugh it off and hope the other 3 are cranking out gens (I go soloQ)
There’s also no in game definition of gen rushing but…
And there's no mechanic in the game to punish that either. I'm not sure what your point is.
Gen slowdown perks exist to punish it..?
My point is, “in game definitions” are a poor litmus.
But there is no way for the game itself to know gens “went too fast” thats the point. For example the game can tell when chases start and end. The op is asking for the game itself to acknowledge facecamping which it currently cannot do so and if it did it would be abuseable 100%.
If you want to bring in perks, Reassurance exists to punish camping.
There's no in game definition of facecamping or genrushing, there's no base mechanic that punishes either of those things, perks existing that make those strategies easier to deal with isn't creating an ingame definition of facecamping or genrushing.
The only thing devs have basically said exists is tunneling with the BT basekit changes and those were honestly fairly simple to implement and had little ability for abuse.
Reassurance is less than a month old and a perk accessible through purchase only, at this time. Camping has been a problem for much longer than this particular “fix”, if you will, has existed.
And the base mechanics that punish generator repair speeds are (failed) skill checks along with killers damaging generators (which was recently buffed)—both of which regress generators.
There’s really no in-game glossary beyond kill, escape, totems, and other basic features of the game. But BHVR certainly acknowledges that aspects of the game exist beyond these things.
I definitely don’t like the idea of killer powers deactivating at or near hooks. But it’s foolish to pretend camping isn’t a problem in dire need of a solution.
They have very weak territorial killers in dbd, if they were to remove proxying, camping, or facecamping you would need to buff those killers significantly. They probably already tested these ideas but they found them to be probably worse for the fun factor of the game.
Maybe later on they will change these things, but i honestly dont see it happening at all. Just dont get downed or hell hide theres nothing wrong with that at all.
I would love to see an actual solution for camping but I don't think one can exist based on killer proximity to hook because one side or the other will game that line to their advantage.
And no solution for camping will work as long as Hag or Twins exist. Possibly even Huntress. They can camp from the other side of the map.
So we just aren't allowed to play our killer if we're camping, which you have to do to win as killer? Why do you think we camp anyway, for fun? Y'all always look at the effect but never the cause.
If you want taken seriously, be specific, be correct. There is no face camping in DbD. Face camping was fixed years ago.
Let me be more specific: in 2016 there was face camping. Face camping was when the killer bodyblocked the exact spot the survivor would have needed to unhook the hooked survivor. This was a problem. So the devs at the time made the hooks rotatable so that there were multiple unhook points. Since then there is no more face camping.
I need to point out that the opinion of an entertainer, as popular has he may be, holds no more weight as the opinion any other experienced player. ( Not much ;) )
Thr STBFL part is false. Even at max stacks trading is still possible. Otherwise I agree all killers should receive the Artist treatment and be unable to use their powers near a hook.
Not to mention getting rid of hook grabs means there's no way to stop unhooks and will increase the unsafe rescues.
They can easily implement a system. Proximity checks already exist, they’d just have to make a system that takes proximity checks and POV/Cone checks together to determine what is going on in the match for a duration of time
so you're saying your opinion holds about as much weight as Otz's then? I thought uhhh... Otz has been playing for over 6,000 hours since 2017. You're also saying your opinion doesn't matter, which yeah. I think someone who literally is paid to play DbD professionally since at least 2018 and is his actual career that he uses to pay bills and sustain himself and his wife for years with rent and food probably knows a little more about this game than you.
I would suggest you take on reading about cognitive biases and logical fallacies. It will do you good.
You may start with the strawman.
Hook bombing is not as common as hook camping in my experience, and even if it happens you can still M1.
Using clever language and terms that most people including me are familiar with do NOT make your argument more convincing, your hours and personal cognitive biases stack AGAINST you and you're not immune from logical fallacies yourself like, "I'm better than someone with a lot more experience than me because I call them an 'Entertainer'".
He's a content creator, not a literal clown. Being a content creator doesn't make you better or worse inherently.
He doesn't play worse for content, he doesn't waste time cracking jokes when playing seriously, he plays the game. That isn't to say Otz is incredible or insane with every single Killer, like he's pretty bad with some decent Killers like Doctor and Deathslinger and misses the power more than people who have more experience with them. He does take this into consideration too.
He's not superhuman nor does he need to be to be decent.
I rest my case. Good luck with you future endeavours.
I can understand the thought behind this - thinking of Trapper traps as technically that's his power and he cannot use them by the hook, but I think disabling a killers power completely near a hook that they've been at for 7s is impractical as there are so many ways this can be abused - Myers in T3 for example wouldn't be able to go near a hook - so you'd have "safe spaces" on the map where survivors are protected and that's something that's very abusable.
Also the STBFL comment re toning it down...a lot of that is on the Obsession in the match, it's very visible if the killer is running this perk and has gained stacks, pretty easy from the survivor side to tell - so to reduce the effect the Obsession can quite easily take a hit and cause the killer to lose their stacks that they've built up. There's outplay around the perk, players just do have to consider what perks the opposing side is running in the game and play around them to a degree.
My name isn't Future Endeavors but thanks dude. You too!
*Cries a little bit inside as an artist main*
Well if they're keeping you in chase then they take you to the hook you could make the power re enable after a few seconds. It would still take a Myers camping at the hook to get this to work that way and you could just pause his Tier 3 instead of making him lose it. Count any situation where a Survivor drags the Killer into this zone a sufficient distance away and with enough time in chase as "not camping" except if the Killer gets a down.
Yeah, I used to not be able to tell when the killer had STBFL, but especially as the obsession it should be more common knowledge to force chases, bodyblock, block doorways as the obsession when you know the killer has stacks
I am a little curious.
Why can Hag place her Phantasm Traps almost under the Hooked Survivor but Artist can't place her Dire Crows anywhere near the Hook?
The chances that you run into people either hard tunneling or camping is pretty high, tbh.
I think it's because you can avoid hag's trap by crouching under the hook. The crows couldn't be avoided though
You can wait for them to despawn, unlike Hag's Traps, which never go away.
unless you have a flashlight
I don't know how to respond to that complete lack of understanding, so I'm just gonna let it go.
Phantasm traps require the Hag to hit and she's 4.4 so she often relies on traps to hit, while Dire Crows facing the hooked Survivor could down both Survivors through Endurance and guarantee a hit and Artist is 4.6 m/s. She's already pretty powerful without this also, though it's very wonky when you recently hook a person and you want to check gens like how Twins feel with this mechanic lol.
Hag RELIES on her power but Artist technically doesn't.
He's also not omniscient. Just because you play the game for a long time does not mean you know everything about it
It wasen't untill last year that Otz learned how a 50% reduction in speed worked for example. Despite playing the game for like 2-3 years or something at that point
For the first paragraph I think people would want something more akin to being unable to use M2 within 8m of a hooked survivor, so that wouldn't prevent T3 Myers since he already stalked into T3.
As far as STBFL, the prime users of STBFL have a reliable M2 to never lose stacks (Demo, Wesker, Nemesis). Also often times if I were the Obsession as the 4th person chased in soloq, and the killer leaves me after I drop a pallet or vault a window, I don't know if it was STBFL or them going for an easier chase. Am I required to stalk the killer every match as Obsession on the off chance they run STBFL, then only take hits when they are carrying people? I think something more akin to the Dying Light buff tooltip to let the Obsession know would be good enough for soloq.
Especially a Leatherface lol
Artist can't place birds within a certain range of the hook. Trapper can't place near a hook. Your going to have to specify which killer, and your going to say bubba to which I agree. Bubba shouldn't be able to use his chainsaw while face camping. But the other killers are fine imo.
I think the logical fallacy you are referring to is the appeal to authority, all while you use the ad hominem fallacy. Yes, Otz's opinion isn't fact and he is fallible, but he's one of the people who should be listened to, the most, due to his knowledge of the game and him trying to take into account his own personal limitations.
What about say a huntress or trickster or deathslinger chasing someone lining up a shot and they bomb into the hook range to do a drive by reassurance and loses a down because of it.
The huntress running BBQ that has 4 sec of aura read to try and line up a crossmap and loses aura read before they can get far enough away after a hook to get a hatchet off
The billy who wants to go pressure a gen but has to wait to charge his chainsaw until he gets far enough away and loses a gen because he couldnt get there as fast
Speaking is safe places, can you guys add hooks to these immortal areas on 2nd and 3rd floors where boil survivors always run to? It guarantees them having hook immunity, so they just run there every chase then stand there waiting to get downed. It's a bit silly, and will turn problematic if the anti slug rework goes live.
BHVR should adjust specific killers powers who are prone to camping based on whether or not they are choosing to participate in a chase or not. It should not be based on hook distance because that's an arbitrary number that can be played around. Camp penalty if you're within 8 meters? Just go 9 meters. This was the issue with old Borrowed Time and the Terror Radius until BHVR just made it work all the time.
Killer powers that are prone to camping should slowly lose its charge if you don't participate in chase - Starting off with Bubba. Bubba is ultimately a chase killer and as such should be treated like one. Don't make a stupid game mechanic that affects all killers just because a few problematic ones. The emblem penalty was a stupid idea and ultimately doesn't do anything - We shouldn't add to something that failed miserably. We also shouldn't add game mechanics that encourage cheese mechanics. Remember old Deep Wounds? Yeah that resulted in Moon Walking Legion.
Rework the perks and killers specifically to address the issue - Do not bandaid the problem by making a change that affects everyone the game - It should be a case by case basis where the goal is the same but the change is different.
I need this level of class when exiting a fruitless interaction.
I am too petty.
How is that a complete lack of understanding? If anything, I would argue he understands better than your average player.
My idea has always been to instead tie it to whether or not the Killer is in a chase or carrying someone else while anyone is on a hook. If the Killer is out hunting others, reward the Killer somehow. If the Killer is standing by, punish the Killer somehow.