Worst case scenario - Trapper
Just out of curiosity, what really is the worst case scenario if trapper just started with all of his traps, and could carry all of them at once, just like hag? The mechanic of his 'power' being all spread out via rng across the map at this point just feels archaic.
Would the improvement to his time budget as a killer just be too enormous to be allowed?
Comments
I think the worst case scenario is his super camping potential when he has Bloody Coil equipped. If he hooks someone and blocks off every route to them with a trap, there is very little hope for that poor soul.
Heck, I’m currently playing blood point farming with him and I’m only using Padded Jaws and brown bag and the second I get one person in the basement, it’s GG. I trap all routes to it, the moment I hear that they disarmed a trap, I zoom right back and reset it while the rescuer is unhooking. They literally have no chance to escape unless they’re both running Dead Hard. And even then, they won’t get far.
This isn’t a complaint about camping, btw, it’s just trying to look at it from an angle the Devs would look at it. Rather than starting with all his traps, I would think buffing his setting speed, giving him yellow bag as basekit, and allowing him to be able to instantly pick up unset traps by just walking over or next to them would be enough. Oh, and a more consistent amount of traps on the maps. Some maps feel like I only have 5 traps to work with while others have 10. It’s so frustrating.
Having 6 traps ready to place in the basement, making rescuing literally impossible. Just drop the picking up traps, and have them recharge over time after they’re placed. Much better change than allowing scummy plays.
I mean I think Hag is pretty damn overpowered. I really don't want another Hag with spammable traps at every single loop. It would get old very quickly.
He'd spam all his traps at a 3 gen, shack/main building, or someone who's hooked. Survivors would be forced to waste their early game attempting to disarm those traps while also avoiding trapper inside his own trap web. He needs buffs tho
The worst case scenario is him being able to completely and utterly lock down an area almost instantly. Which is a tool that would mostly be used for camping.
Edit: you have to remember, his traps are stronger than Hag's when they go off
Start with two traps and be able to carry three would be ok. Make that 3+4 with bag that is enough.
Well I'm not saying that trapper wouldn't need changes in response to making his power more consistent. Perhaps disarming traps could be faster, perhaps trapper no longer gets a noise notification when they are disarmed so the player has to pay attention to which traps are active or deactivated? I'm not sure what the right answer would be.
A lot of people have talked about his ability to camp, but don't a lot of killers end up camping a 3-gen or basement anyway since gens can fly quickly with even the slightest level of efficiency from survivors? Wouldn't this just make the trapper's strength the endgame as targets worth protecting drop, giving more traps for a smaller area, instead of other killers where they might excel in the 1v1, slowdown, or map pressure avenues?
I would also argue that a lot of people would consider rusty shackles hag traps to be stronger than trapper's bear traps, and he cannot instantly teleport to them. They also have a more intensely strict hitbox. So assuming the survivor gets free, it does the same amount of damage as 1 hag teleport + M1. (Best case scenario, besides just not stepping in it.) But in both cases the hag and trapper player made the correct read of player pathing, the trapper vastly more accurately than the hag on top of that as well.
Beyond this, however, there is also the discussion to be had that the camping strategy of trapper would likely be the first order optimal strategy, but that trapper players would end up growing out of it as it is both boring, and too easy.
Ultimately my goal with this question is to promote diversity of gameplay by buffing killers into more competitive levels of strength.
Not saying you're wrong, I was just giving you a theory on why the Devs are hesitant to give him all his traps at the start of the match.
Thats fair, I was only asking for the worst case scenario. But the devs do budget killer powers with addons included, and I don't have enough hours on trapper to know at a glance which ones would become broken without the time investment of collecting his traps.
What ever they do, I hope and pray they don't touch his red add-ons. They are a Godsend against sweaty SWF.
He has some mad addon, Purple stone, Iri stone, Blood coil.
They force him to use a bag in order so he can only pick 1 of those addon, or he can use 2 of those and suffer carry 1 trap.
But beside that, those coil, jaw are really pointless. Fast setup feel a little better, but not improve anything.
He should not start with all traps, what make he weak is because you pay 20sec to go collect, go back, setup a trap, then an injured survivor steps on it and escape on first try.
His escape trap RNG should be removed, and so disarming traps should adding skill check to increase the risk to survivors.
I agree that worst-case scenario is that he spams all his traps in one place, like the basement. Even if he could reload from lockers instead of having all of his traps right away, there are tons of lockers in key areas like that, so he could just walk back and forth to the locker and spam all of his traps in one place.
Personally, I lean toward a solution where the entity just gives him traps on a certain schedule (every x number of seconds), and he can hold a max of y number at the same time and have a max number of z total traps on the map. I don't think it's fair that he has to trudge all around the map to pick them up at the start, but it also wouldn't be fair if he could hold them all at once.
He takes the time to set them all up in one place, no one goes there because they noticed. Now he decides to pick them all up again or some at least. It's a lot of time wasted but it's the risk you're willing to take.
I mean look at hag players, most just spam it in one area, usually a 3 gen area and settle for that, or around a hooked survivor, or shack.
He'll bump elbows with her, not that I'd mind I love hag.
In any scenario where he gets serious buff, it means more people will play him thus I'll face him more which will greatly upset me.
He's the one killer I pray devs change the last as I dislike facing him so very much.
okay, just because ive read this a lot here:
"the worst case is that he (the Trapper) is going to put all traps in one area and then camp it"
that is literally how the Killer is ment to be played.
he is an area defense Killer, thats his entire job. he locks down a 3 gen and then defends it or he makes hook rescues extremely risky by having a lot of traps in that general area.
he is not ment to be a map wide force to be dealt with, he is not a Hillbilly or Wraith. He is a stationary, slow and strategic character.
People actually think this change would make him OP. Lol.
I played a certain add-on combo on 8 matches each (not much) to compare how good add-on can perform.
4.000 BP Yellow bag out perform 14.000 BP Red addon.
Now give him Purple + Yellow bag as default
I’d be happy with the brown bag special as his base. Let him carry two. I usually only carry the brown brag and brown glove and do wonderfully.
His problem is if there is a survivor dedicated to follow you to the end and disarm traps, youre an M1 killer.
If not, Trapper is more scary than people think.
They should put a skill check while disarming. Fail or cancel skill check will get trapped. Coil decrease skill check zone. That will put some risk to those survivor who follows you.
I feel like all his traps should be active at the start of the match
why doesn't trapper have killer instinct when a survivor is about to mess with his trap?
shouldn't he instinctively know when they gonna ######### with his traps?
What is already being said. The only thing that saves some survivors is that Trapper has to go get more traps. If he had them all, and the first down goes to basement. GG. If he had them all he could lock down a side of the map instantly and 3 gen strat would explode. When that happens, DC penalities or not, surivivors are not going to want to play against 3 gen strat trapper for half an hour.
If he had them all, he could shut down every loop/or pallet in his first chase. Unlike Hag, you can crouch over her traps without setting them off or you can destroy them with a flashlight. She also has to be within range to teleport and not busy enough to pay attention during the few seconds she has the green light to teleport.
The difference with trapper is that his traps both hold you immobile until he gets there and with add ons can put you into the dying state just for escaping. That's a BIG difference. Most people who get trapped are an assured down. If hag teleports and hits you, she still has to funnel you into another trap or catch up to you in chase. No other killer has such potential of having you downed on your belly without the killer even being present.
I agree with Ghouled Mojo that the brown add on with the extra trap being basekit would be a good addition. That seems reasonable.
Muh artistic vision. Now go spend 2 minutes collecting all those traps.
Worst case he has a simalar playstyle to hag without the camping.