Using Self Care = Admitting you are bad
Title.
Change my mind.
P.S. Self Care usage is officially declared at ~24%. That means that, on average, 1 survivor will have it each game and the other 3 won't. Do a little check for yourself and make a note of how many SCs you can see each game.
EDIT: Adding one of my replies to the main post because I see a lot of people misunderstood the context.
@Raziel said:
As a killer, I can work around survivors having Self Care and even use it to my advantage by making them waste time healing.
As a survivor I notice a considerable difference in match performance when using Self Care compared to when I do not. Simply put, having the ability to heal one's self frees me of having to plan my moves and devise strategies because, when combined with looping, Self Care allows the correction of every mistake I would make and prevents the Killer from getting me.
I do not need to worry about playing mind games with killers such as the Nurse or the Spirit because I can take one hit, enjoy my free Sprint Burst to the next pallet, loop till the gates are open or they give up and then heal up. If they lose me, it takes at most 30 seconds for me to get back into a position where I am guaranteed safety for 1 more mistake or a clear escape if the hatch or gates are available.
I am clearly not the only one who noticed this given that Self Care is encountered 96% of the time. This is not surprising since, by equipping this single perk, I can negate a portion of the game that would otherwise match my personal skill to the killer's personal skill.
By having the perk, it does not matter if I am of lower skill, by sticking to the simple plan of try something risky -> mess up -> loop -> selfcare / be helped by people with selfcare I have a clear shot at victory.
To summarise, in case you missed it, my point is not from a killer's perspective exclusively. I find the perk worse from the survivor perspective, in fact.
Comments
The ONLY reason self care is still a broken ass infinte heal self suffucuent perk and still in the game is because if the devs even mention a self care nerf, the Survivor Selfcare Defensive Cult will review bomb and write the devs death threats. Selfcare is an overpowerd perk. If 94% of players use it, its a damn good perk. Its op. Nothing anyone will say about it will ever change my mind.
self care is hands down the strongest perk in the game, it's effect just isn't as directly noticeable as say SB, NOED or DS so people don't complain about it as much
Wraith with bloodhound, and seeing scratches better makes escape damn near impossible.
Sure, don't get seen in the first place, and never run? Easier said than done. Especially since there is an ability that lets him see people while cloaked.
Nurses calling? It's a huge counter to SC unless you're playing against the handful that know both well enough to dodge the perk.
Stealth is not well rewarded as impatience often overpowers the desire to crouch walk, or even walk for the most part.
Me playing stealth is near useless because the other survivors will gladly blow it.
There a ton of really powerful tracking abilities the killer has that makes stealthy approaches a joke.
If you play a stealth game successfully, you can probably thank someone for being a distraction.
And because killers can quickly find survivors, the pace of the game changes which means it goes by too fast.
With few to no equalizers, survivors would just get slaughtered. They get slaughtered, they get angry, they complain or quit.
So they get perks like self care, which makes some sense as people in their position would probably learn to heal themselves anyhow.
If games end too quick and one sided, the game lacks balance. It will die.
I decided to help you out a bit.
Situation:you have no Self Care, one survivour is dead, one is being chased, you're injured. Instead of selfhealing for 24 seconds, you run around the map searching for another teammate or a chest (good luck getting a medkit or even a closed chest). And no, Bond doesn't help at all here, because of it's 32 meter radius which is OK on smaller maps, like Gideon Meat Plant, and absolutely unusable on larger ones, like Pale Rose or Lery's Memorial Institute. Good luck finding that survivour! And you could've just healed for 24 seconds and started repairing already, or even saved that chased guy from being downed!
Oh, and have fun playing with BBQ without ability to self-heal.
What about unreliable team mates or toxic SWFs?
I often run Self-Care in solo-queue, otherwise I could equip No Mither and have the same effect since a lot of those stupid team mates won't heal you or get themselves killed before chance arises.
Often it's not the Killer who's the biggest threat to a solo-Surv, it's the other Survivors.
This right here. The way things are now when playing solo survivor, is that 80% of the time I'm more scared of my team mates than i am of the killer, for several reasons.
At the end of the day i'll say the same here as i did in the thread about NOED apparently being a noob perk. Like it or not, it IS a perk and it will be used. You can point and tell me that I'm bad at the game and that won't make a damn bit of difference to me. I'm not here to impress people with my L33T skillz, I'm here to have fun. Sometimes it'll backfire on me and i'll get caught by an enterprising killer with nurses, tough luck to me. If a survivor wants to heal me outside of an obvious danger zone, i'll gladly let them heal me rather than use SC, but the odds aren't always going to be in my favour on that score.
Really though the number one killer could run this perk if they wanted. The player is allowed to use what they want. Even if it's "op" crutch perks. Even though NOED has counters
Uuuuummmm since my point was that neither perk is a noob perk....no?
You, sir, won the internet.
Shows how broken the perk actually is
Doubtful. Most probability would count this case similar to probability without replacement meaning if you had a bin of 10 different colored balls and pulled out a red one, you wouldn't be able to get the red one again. The 24% is more than likely accounting for the fact that you cannot have it in the other slots.
Can't get not one kill is not a double negative. Can't not get one kill is however, so stop trying to act smart. Can't get not one kill technically means only 1.
@Raziel Thank you!
Killers using any perk = them being bad at the game lols. I don't think this person could win a single match without using a killer perk. He already seems butthurt at the idea of survivors using self care.
Self care is kinda a double edged sword. Yes it is slow and going to be even slower in upcoming patch but still a good perk considering how often you get bad team mates. SC is great especially if you can loop well and break chases efficiently. It makes you a bit independent and can help you carry your team. Another minor advantage is that you can strategize usage of other perks like Resilience, Dead Hard i.e deciding when to completely heal yourself etc which wouldn't be easier if you try to get healed by your team.
Let people use what they want, simple.
I am not saying don't use it. I am saying don't pretend it's not OP.
Read the main post. I can work around SC just fine as killer. I analysed it from a survivor's perspective and concluded that it supplements lack of survivor skill. Regardless of whether the killer is skilled enough to counter it it makes the game unfair. You have to face the killer not let your perks do it.
I swear it's like nobody can read anything longer than 2 lines.
Read that post a few days ago but that response of yours didn't sound like you are talking about survivor's perspective.
I disagree killers have their perks as do survivors. Where would killers be without ruin? It's the same level of top tier perk.
Seems to me you are just bragging that self care isn't needed because you either don't use it and end up fine (or pretending), or you're a killer main who doesn't like it when your hard work is simply gone when they self care.
It requires less skill because you are making yourself more obvious to the killer when used.
I've kinda lost track of who thinks what so sorry if I've ignored every other comment before my comment.
I don't think it's a matter of not being skilled enough. There's been enough times that my teammates refused to heal me up that I'm tempted to make it part of my loadout. I normally don't, preferring to use that slot for something more beneficial such as We'll Make It, BT or UE.
Really, it's more of a Skilled Suvivor Perk imo. You have to be skilled enough to lose the Killer for enough time to use it, and it takes a long time to fully heal. Either that or you have to be skilled enough to lose the Killer, or provide a worse target, after an unhook to use it as well. n00b Survivors will mostly have it be a wasted slot since they'll never really be in a position to utilize it.
Overall, I'd rank it in with BBQ, NOED, etc etc. Each one is useful in specific circumstances, but they aren't active the entire match like Whispers for example. Definitely roughly the same in terms of power and usefulness. imo at least.
I use it because it's way too often I get pulled of the hook, the killer is damaging another player and the one who unhooks me sprints to the other side of the map.
90 Posts and I can only count strawman arguments. Sadly, this did not turn out to be a real debate. Might as well call it quits. Nobody has even tried to touch the most compelling argument against Self Care:
If you really are good at juking the killer, you WILL NEVER GET HIT. And that means that Self Care is a complete waste. If you expect getting hit, then you admit you are not good at juking the killer. You use self care because it compensates for you lacking this skill.
"90 posts and not enough people are agreeing with me, better make some ludicrous claim that my post was unsuccessful due to "strawman arguements"" Ok sweetie.
Are... are you high? There are some situations where you literally can't not take a hit,
M1 Myers
Hag Trap
Hatchet Throw
Wraith Speed Bump
Slow Pallet Vaults
Slow Window Vaults
Falls From Heights
GOOD KILLERS
MAYBE just MAYBE a survivor and a killer can be comparable skill wise, so while the killer might get the first hit the survivor manages to duke in the second half of the chase.
I don't get why killers bring "juking" up so often like survivors have a button to turn invisible or something, you act as if juking can be done at any and all obstacles in the game, it's ridiculous that so many pallet/healing/chase/looping conversations come down to some killer saying "juke" better, how about you chase better and not lose the loud, bleedings scratch mark leaving survivor?
Speaking of Straw Mans, we'll use your logic here against you.
If you're a really good killer that survivor won't get away to use Self Care in the 1st place. That means that if they get away YOU SUCK AT KILLER !!!!!
There see how your logic just blew a very big hole in your whole argument.
A REAL debate literally consists of opposing arguments. You don't want someone to change your mind you want people to agree with you, and like so many others on this forum, not agreeing with you equates to nobody being good enough.
The 'compelling' argument is YOUR view point. This isn't to say that the people who oppose you are right and you are wrong, but the fact that you call this a debate and then make a sweeping generalisation that every opposing argument is a 'straw man' argument, pretty much looses any credibility your viewpoint has.
If you just want to say that SC is bad and you don't like it, then just say it, don't ask people to 'change your mind' just so you can crap all over their posts because not enough people are agreeing with you.
My main argument is that I am a good survivor and I do not need Self Care at all. It has nothing to do with playing Killer.
Go ahead and pick a post out of this entire thread that counters my argument. I will wait.
Remember, my main point is that a survivor who is a pro at stealth, ending chases, juking and avoiding the killer in general has absolutely no use for Self Care as they will never get hit. A survivor who fails in any of those can artificially compensate for his lack of skill by using the perk.
Still waiting on you to show us your pro, stealth, never get hit survivor.
Please show us all how great of a Survivor you are. I think many of us would love to see it, or are you going to ignore my request again?
If they're healing mid-chase, not only does it greatly reduce the distance they gain and cause them to use pallets faster, but you can easily counter that with caulrophobia.
When I play survivor, I don't run it. It's a waste of a perk slot. Half the time someone comes sprinting over trying to heal you anyway. The only time it really matters is when you're the only survivor left.
That came out wrong.
My point is that your argument is biased and full of holes just because you don't run SC doesn't make you a good survivor. So the question becomes what perks do you use and if you say DS and or SB you're whole argument just went out the window.
Lucky you
And I'm forced to chase them to another part of the map until they finally see me and try to heal when I don't bring SC with me. Though, if you have lots of medkits, it's easily replacable, but risky because of Franklin's Demise.