Controversial: If survivors "tunnel gens" is it fair for the killer to tunnel survivors?
Everyone knows about the survivors that get off the hook and run immediately to the gen while protected by DS, wanting to take that generator out of the game as fast as possible without wasting time healing.
I'm getting a lot of survivors recently too that sit on the gen in your face, they take a hit, pop the gen right in your face and they'll take the second hit as a trade just to rush the generator out of the game.
Is the killer really the bad guy for tunneling survivors in games like these?
Food for thought.
Personally when I play survivor I try to be optimal on gens but I also like to try and survivor so my priority after an unhook is to heal in some way. At most I may tap a regressing generator but that's it.
Comments
Literally not the same.
There are a lot of perks that halt a survivor's ability to "tunnel" gens....
Pop, Corrupt, Thrilling Tremors, Ruin etc.
And only 1 or 2 perks that halt the killer's ability to halt tunneling. DS and maybe Borrowed Time.
Please stop it with " hook and run immediately to the gen while protected by DS, wanting to take that generator out of the game as fast as possible without wasting time healing."
What else are they suppose to do? Run to you and a locker so you can complain about it after?
Come on.
Again, where are these tools to stop tunneling? That is what my reply to you was about.
If The Killer wants to tunnel, he will succeed. Even if everyone stopped to help, which would come at a great cost to the objective. Those perks don't deny, they delay the inevitable. The Killer is not entitled to a Hook until he actually hooks. And that's a win according to you, not everyone agrees especially the fourth Survivor. Some people will play as one.
That's true about The Killer's investment in that chase but it's a chase he chose to engage in. The distinction is that after someone is rescued and you avoid interacting with them for X seconds doesn't regress your previous chase and hook progress with that specific Survivor. On the other hand, if a generator is regressing, a Survivor has to return to protect it from further regression. Tunneling Survivors would obviously be mandatory if after so much time, hook states are restored.
Corrupt is a zoning tool, thrilling is an information perk. Ruin doesnt stop a rush, and pop requires hooks.
I don't care how that 4th survivor feels, if you want to be 1v1, you need to play killer. Fact remains that survivors are a collective.
With that statement, you've proved my point that survivors have the tools to stop tunneling, but killers dont have the tools to stop the gen rush.
If killer chooses to tunnel, survivors can make him lose. If survivors choose to rush, killers cant make them lose.
Corrupt is a what? You mean it doesn't give you 2 minutes of time just only patrol 4 gens instead of 7?
And what's your point on Pop? DS requires the survivor to get hooked, a 5 second stun doesn't compare to 25% regression on a generator.
That's your opinion but the game disagrees. It didn't prove anything, those perks can extend the tunnel. You said stop which means a cessation, extend is postpone. DS extends the tunnel, but it certainly doesn't stop it. There are no perks to stop tunneling. And your last statement is also wrong but you lost credibility when you said those perks stop tunneling.
Played 3 games as killer last night, in all matches I was harshly mismatched in regards to ranks.
Game 1 as Trapper on Red Forest, played clean, no tunneling or defending hooked players. 1 sacrificed and 3 escaped.
Game 2 as GF on Ormond. Played clean, no tunneling or defending hooked players. 2 sacrifices and 2 escaped
Game 3 as spirit on Torment creek. Tunnel slugged three times and defended 1 player on hook, hooked slugged player on same hook shortly after hooked player was rescued, rinse and repeat. 4 sacrifices and 3 gens left 🤣🤣
That's why killers tunnel and camp/defend. Its super effective. I play both sides and I get angry when I get camped and/or tunnelled but i accept that its a clever tactic.
Corrupt is a zoning tool, it brings survivors to you, but you can still only chase one person at a time, allowing the other three to work on gens.
You're also not thinking about the people that hide and wait it out.
Sure it does, because pop takes 20 seconds off a gen, so 5 seconds of stun, plus the time to run them back down, plus a new loop. Pop gives you 20 seconds, ds can give them well over a minute.
I always know that I've torn someone to shreds when they're using literal definitions in an attempt to look smart.
This is all about a win condition. If you tunnel through all of the anti tunnel perks, you lose as killer. If you rush through all of the gen rush perks, you still win as survivor.
Thus survivors have the tools to stop tunneling, but killers dont have the tools to stop the gen rush.
You confuse knowing synonyms to quoting definitions of a word, I did the former not the latter. The point still stands, there is no perk that stops tunneling only perks that can extend the tunnel. And I don't see you explaining the perks and how they accomplish what you say. The fact that you're resorting to attacking me, rather than focusing on the discussion tells me everything I need to know.
And DS can only be used once.
Pop can be used 12 times.
That's 25% times 12 off gens compared to a 5 second stun.
By your logic that's 240 Seconds, compared to a 5 second stun.
Survivors don't tunnel gens.
Again, you're not seeing the survivors as a collective and you're ignoring distance and loops. Sure if they run in a straight line to nowhere, it's not much, but they dont.
sure i say tunnel them out by any means necessary!
For me the main difference is that you can complete your objective as killer without tunneling survivors off of hooks the entire time. Meanwhile, survivors repair gens by repairing gens, and the faster they do it the more likely it is for them to escape. There is no alternative.
Whether gens go too fast or not, that's still debateable in my opinion, and I understand arguments from either side. But if this game does get it's early game phase that will give killers more time to complete their objective, I fear this game will have some seriously unbearable killer queue times if the same update that includes the early game phase doesn't include some way of discouraging tunneling or camping, making the strategy far less effective, because at the moment those strategies, even camping, are still too good for how unfun they are to go against and how little skill they take, especially camping.
@2ndBusiestmusicnerd
If you are intentionally ignoring every other survivor to the point that they will stand in front of you and you won’t even swing at them because you want the other survivor that bad, yes, you are tunneling.
As a generator main, I hate when survivors tunnel me out of the game.
Fair enough, I thought you meant just chasing someone meant they were tunneling.
The optimal way to play either side is to tunnel. Gens or survivors, you want them out the game asap. The only difference is the community's perception in most cases is: when survivors do it, its apparently fine, but when killers do its "toxic". The exception being "gen rush", which is barely different to normal survivor gameplay, so I don't understand the big deal around the distinction really.
In either case its fine to tunnel. Both sides are allowed to do it. The game is just unbalanced in the survivors favor because of perks, gen times, and map design. Unless you're playing Nurse, Spirit, or Freddy. For Nurse you better hope you're good with her and your not in a map with dead zones or indoors.
Play how you want, you don't need to justify playing any specific way. There's no rule that says you can't tunnel or camp and there's no rule that says a survivor has to heal or not do a gen in your face. These are all just risk vs reward choices you make in the game. If they pay off then great, if not then that was the risk you took.
Dying light really only punishes survivors if they are already losing. Its effect is so minimal and its downside is stupidly strong, that it is more of a detriment at this point.
you know tho perk are not 100% like Ds is right noed may not be used and with pop you have to work for it by getting hooks,what survivor have to do use DS lose a chase and get hooked that not just ds if ub and bt are used as well.
Just play a killer with the ds bug forehead and eat the ds and be back on them in 2 seconds LMFAO
Actually I like dying light and its one of my favorite perks. Just because its not meta doesnt mean its bad.
Nope. That isnt fair, as killers would just tunnel the first hook out of the game. Ds needs a rework, not a nerf.
I wasn't saying it because it wasnt meta, but because after my experience with the perk, it acts like a placebo. There are other perks I find better success with. If you like it, go ahead. No perk is bad if you know how to use it.
Just have it so fully healing or beginning work on a gen deactivates DS.
The question may as well be "Is it fair for either side to do their objective?"
The answer to both is yes.
I am a pretty new player and have been trying not to tunnel, because that was being toxic. Now I defend generators and get a nice three gen, to be told I am a filthy generator camper.
As a killer regardless of how you play, if you ain't running around and snowballing you are apparently toxic according to survivors.
It has become quite clear that a killer should just simply ignore the "survivors guide to killer". If you believe a tunnel is a good move, to slug, to face camp... just do it because frankly survivors will call you names regardless of what you do.
This is what playing a killer for a week has taught me. Try to snowball, but if it goes out of control, to quick on generators... tunnel, slug and gen camp your way to victory. Let the flashlight clicking, teabagging, full second chance perk survivors complain about you not making the game fun for them? Focus on your own game, they are not considering the game of the killer so why should the killer consider them?
See I don't understand killers playing like that-I'm a killer main, I've rarely played survivor since I bought dbd in Feb (I probably should play survivor more just to get my gameplay better) and doing what you said that person did sounds so boring-I don't care if I lose all 4 survivors so long as I'm running about trying my best and hoping everyobe is having fun. Unfortunately that sometimes makes it look like I'm a prime target from t bagging and flashlight clicking etc....its a shame there isn't more respect in game
Tunneling And killing someone early isn’t scummy it’s the killers goal ..to kill Your welcome :)
Lol pathetic
I'm sorry but what? I get of you're sitting there camping you're three man I get going back to the hook and seeing them on the gen then yes hit the survivor but tunnel a gen? whats it going to do run away? I'm sorry but i play both and i will be honest i'm a survivor who hate survivors who trade for a gen but good god there are plenty of perks that help destroy gens progress without moaning. I switched from pc to xbox and this brand new parts gen rush swf isn't really a thing on xbox i don't play it and i don't play against it. yes two of us might bring in the toolbox but not all four and if you see 4 toolboxes bring franklins ruin thrilling and shroud of separation or a good peek a boo myers....put your grown up pantys on and just get over it
I agree to some extent, so long as tunneling doesn't come with an opportunity cost. Allowing yourself to be bodyblocked by other survivors, or forgoing 1-2 easy stabs in the mid game to try and chase down your RL Obsession, can lead to bad games. If folks are willing to take the hit, you just gotta give it to them sometimes: if the other 3 survivors are gen-planted while your doing a 2 minute grabass chase with Meg, you're not going to have a good game.
And that's all secondary to the fact tunneling, if unprovoked, just feels meanspirited and unsportsmanlike... which isn't fun for me when I'm killer. I'm OK losing a game vs. skilled survivors than playing like that. Now, someone decides dropping a pallot is worthy of a tbag - that's my RL Mori. "So you have chosen death." I still don't do tunnel even then when its not tactically sound, but if given a choice, I go for the Bagger.
As usual, no explanation as to how or why I'm wrong, just insults. Like I said, I've had this discussion before.
If you immediately jump on a gen off the hook without healing, I assume you're ready to continue playing the game and I'll tunnel you out. If you can do your objective, then I can do mine. Fair is fair.
That being said, I'm not going out of my way to tunnel solo survivors who by and large have no idea how to handle it or manage hook states between 4 survivors. It takes a bit of coordination to handle a dedicated tunneler.
Now you understand the bull crap conditions that killers have to meet for their perks to actually work.
I love how on killer side nothing should be free, because reasons, but on survivor side, they need it to be free because of what the killers might do.
Hell, pop should just have a 40 second cooldown and no conditions for activation, because without it, survivors just rush gens.
Why do you think that losing a gen which takes 2s to finish is toxic and should be counterable? The gen is finished because survivors made it 99% done not because the one tunneling the gen is toxic. Bring Ruin and Undying and give pressure properly, bring mori if you think you meet swf with 4 toolboxes.
If you are talking about the situation when you don't have Pop or Ruin and survivors want to tunnel an almost-finished machine, a buff of overcharge can work, maybe increase the penalty to 7/8/9%. A perk against gen rush which does not require hook or hex is needed, but should not be stronger than Pop or Ruin.
As a killer, I would say that camping except during End Game is toxic while tunneling is not. Killers taking the risk of BT, DS, and DH makes tunneling fair to the game imo. Here are some exceptions: Leatherface getting back to Kindred range every 5s and Wraith standing by the shack and hit everyone approaching without chasing even if no one else approached, these noobs are camping instead of tunneling.
In the end, yes I am a survivor main. At the same time, I am a r4 killer, Dr and Myers main, and I really find some killer mains are not able to empathize.
Yeah, create pressure where you can but try to prioritizing downing those with hooks gone already. I don't tunnel myself either, I'm more a "chase whoever I see" type of player. But I do understand the reason why you want someone gone ASAP. I just choose not to play that way same as you since I play to have fun more than to win. But its perfectly understandable to play to win as long as you're not toxic about it.
No pop is fine as is. I'm a killer main btw.
Its really good on nurse, as you get lots of early hooks.
I tunneled someone tonight for 'tunneling' a generator. They finished it right in my face after I hit them. So when they got unhooked, I downed them again, ate their DS, downed them a third time, and put them on the hook again. After that, I left them alone for a bit. I hooked at least three people, maybe even four, before hooking them for a third time. Got a 'Nice tunnel' message from them after the game. I thanked them for the compliment, and told them that their tunneling of the generator was nice too. I don't think it was a dirty play, though some may disagree. I didn't tunnel them out of the game -- even though I could have. And they ended with some decent amount of BP (20k) and probably at the very least safety pipped.
Sometimes, tunneling is a little necessary. You need to create pressure, and a good way to do that is putting someone on their death hook. But for the most part, I try to avoid tunneling someone straight out of the game to turn it into a 3v1. I don't want anyone to leave with less than 8000 BP if I can help it. I don't think there's anything wrong with it, though it can be very not-fun for survivors.