radiantHero23
radiantHero23
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- radiantHero23
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491831#Comment_3491831
Exactly. I think it's sad how lately BHVR has been pushing so hard for wanting to show transparency and more communication with the playerbase (and that's great) then they go ahead, ignore all the feedback of a PTB, and do unexplainable stuff such as nerfing a random yellow add-on for a low tier killer while ignoring Blight's Alchemy Ring, that the community has asked a nerf for for ages.
I understand devs can't 100% listen to the community because of balance reasons, but even having a simple post made by one of the community managers here to explain the reasoning behind this choice would help. I'd like to know why Reiko's was still nerfed despite the overwhelming and unanimous feedback, why the changes went through despite everyone on the PTB forums, on the subreddit, on YouTube and pretty much every DBD online community asked for the live version to come back. I understand that all this community feedback apparently won't change the fact we're getting a completely different version of the character that changes her upside down and guts her fun factor (despite even a dev team member commenting on how full reworks for characters that have a dedicated playerbase are not a good idea) but at least knowing why they decided to go through would help a bit. I'd like to know why we can't have live Sadako and Reiko's back with just a change to the teleport cooldowns and Ring Drawing/Iri Tape nerf.
A post about the reasoning would help.
I would love to know why we got ignored the way we did.
I don't even think it's about balancing this time.
What we suggested was way better than what we have now balancing-wise.
She's now a soloq stomper and still weak against coordinated teams.
Not exactly what it should be.
The changes we all suggested would have made her fun and strong to play as AND against.
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
The update has been out for less than a week; give players (and yourself) some time to adapt to her new mechanics before advocating for completely nerfing the character.
The way she plays has changed a lot and it basically feels like a new killer; when it comes to old Sadako every content creator and guide always repeated "just ignore her power completely" and that's how everybody played against her. I can vouch for that, I main her and nobody ever cared to touch a tape, aside from the occasional very-new player who interacted with all TVs in the first few minutes of the game for no rhyme or reason.
Now she's completely changed (in a way that is different from the PTB, too), and you suddenly get tons of players who don't really care about forums nor read dev update posts still use the same tactics as before. But her power changed, and now ignoring her power or doing tapes at the last minute is no different to having an active Pig trap on and just... not doing anything about it. And I had many people play like that in my new Sadako matches - but that's ok, she's new, people who don't keep up with the updates outside of the game need to play multiple matches against a "new" character to learn how to counter her.
I'm not saying she's perfect nor that she won't need a few tweaks. Not at all, pretty sure she needs some and she will get them. I'm just saying that calling for hard nerfs and changes to a killer that was basically reworked into a different character, three days after the fact, is not fair - give the community time to properly understand the changes.
I think she needs changes right now.
Revert the rework.
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I think they should revert the changes and take some Ptb feedback into consideration.
Number changes and hand holding will not make her better to play.
She's not fun to play right now. At least for people who want to feel rewarded for their efforts.
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And no. I don't think simple number changes will help this rework be better.
It's flawed by design.
I would love to see it reverted and some of our feedback be taken into consideration.
But looking how things got this far, it's looking grim.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491717#Comment_3491717
Chief I wish I was on BHVR's bankroll to post on the forums, that'd be great.
I don't "only post to defend BHVR" either. There is a lot I have to criticise them for. I just don't think this rework is that bad, honestly. It might need a couple of tweaks in the future but people are acting like the character is completely ruined, which I don't think is true.
I feel like she is ruined for me.
She's super easy to play. She doesn't feel rewarding anymore. She's not strong against good teams and very strong against soloq. The Playstyle that I loved and that I fought for in the Ptb feedback is basicly gone. (not slugging)
It's about fun. Not strength.
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@Zakon05 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491731#Comment_3491731
It depends on your perspective of Sadako as a killer.
Sadako cultivated a following of players who enjoyed her for her unusual playstyle of being more about strategy and macro play, since she's so awful in chase. People who viewed condemned kills as her true win condition and what set her apart from other killers, particularly Dredge and Freddy.
This new version makes playing her like that much much harder to do. Condemned has become little more than a weak passive slowdown, something akin to Pig's beartraps. This was likely BHVR's intention for her all along.
The problem is that Sadako is god awful in chase. Like really, really bad. In contention for one of the worst chase killers in the entire game. The rework did nothing to fix that, it just gave her a useless gimmick of being immune to pallet stuns while demanifested, but survivors have no reason to drop pallets while you're demanifested.
Even compared to other M1 killers she's bad. Freddy's snares are legitimately better than anything Sadako can do, and that's just sad. Her condemned slowdown is not good enough to make up for how bad she is at chasing.
She also has a lullaby for some reason. If they removed the lullaby she would actually be a pretty solid hit-and-run ambush killer. However I do think that for the majority of the survivor playerbase, Sadako would be very difficult to deal with if not for the lullaby. She'd be almost like a better version of Wraith, since demanifesting doesn't slow her down at all.
Condemned against soloq is sadly much more than a minor slowdown... You can kill people with minimal effort now.
And yes I enjoyed her gameplay a lot.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
I'm a fan of this rework overall, to be honest. Condemned actually feels like a mechanic worth worrying about now, and Sadako players with good map awareness will be able to get kills with it more consistently. You can't just completely ignore it. It might be a bit easier to actually put the tapes back when you grab one, but you'll need to do it more often AND getting caught with a Tape is potentially lethal.
The post-PTB tweaks are even better, the cooldown reduction is great, 15 seconds felt a bit clunky so I can imagine 10 will be alright. TVs not being disabled for ages when you TP to them is amazing too.
The only thing I agree with is some of the addon changes, Reiko's Watch getting nerfed seems really unnecessary.
Apart from some of the addons, I really don't get the negative feedback towards the rework. The tweaks solved a lot of the big issues with it.
It's not about strength. It's about what is fun to play as and fun to play against. New Sadako (as we for told in the Ptb) is horrible to play against and super easy to play as. I feel like I don't earn my kills when I play her. Before the update my strategic skills and micromanagement where rewarded with a kill after a lot of work. Now it's just "teleport a lot and kill people."
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PS.: This is not about strength of the killer. It's about making her enjoyable to play and play against.
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@EvilTwin said:
Yep, devs completely neglected the most important parts of the feedback from the people who actually loves and plays her.
This is a sad day for what used to be my favorite thing about this game. Sadako now has zero skill expression. She will absolutely demolish newer players and struggle even more in chase. One of the worst changes in dbd history, no doubt.
RIP Sadako <3
Im so sad right now.
We did so much work on the feedback.
All for nothing.
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Please revert the changes!!!
Last chance!!!
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491475#Comment_3491475
I'm not sure what you mean by using TVs for information on survivors, could you elaborate?
Playing for Condemned pretty obviously got buffed, considering now you can both prevent a survivor from removing their Condemned stacks and apply more of them on hit.
The Manifestation/Demanifestation addons being nerfed is pretty much the only genuine downside I would agree with here, but I don't think it's fair to say that lowers her overall skill expression at all, let alone considerably.
And the power obviously isn't fundamentally different, all the pieces are still there. It's much closer to the Doctor and Leatherface reworks; same general power with the same general mechanics, but the way you engage with it changed a little.
When you condemn a survivor with projection. Their hud glows. So you know what survivor you hit.
She has a cooldown on her power now. SHES NOT STRONG IN CHASE.
Hooking survivors for stacks was a good mechanic.
Nerfing an addon, that should be basekit is super bad. Its billy all over again.
You dont play her do you?
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491464#Comment_3491464
Using TVS for information on survivors
Playing Condemn playstyle without slugging
Manifestation/Demanifestation mindgames (They are still there but they got nerfed)
Just a few things worth mentioning
And I disagree I think this is a fundemental difference, their powers work completely differently now.
thx
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@jesterkind said:
I've seen a lot of people say that new Sadako has less skill expression, and I don't understand that even slightly. If anything, if there's a problem with Sadako after these changes, it's that she requires too much skill expression.
You have to showcase a ton of map awareness to utilise Sadako properly. You need to know exactly where the survivors are, when they've picked up a tape, which direction they're running to insert that tape, and you need to position yourself to actually take advantage of those things. The changes that make tape interruptions matter boost her skill expression massively.
Genuinely, what skill expression did Sadako players even lose? I don't consider slug-for-Condemned to be particularly skill expressive, and nor is teleporting aimlessly within ten seconds of emerging, so... what's lost here?
The changes aren't perfect but they're definitely an improvement, and to compare them to Old Freddy is especially off the mark. That killer fundamentally changed, Sadako hasn't.
Please just stop.
Me and a lot of others had made a ton of lists about the topic already. Im done talking.
I have done so much work during the PTB.
None of it was heard. My work got ignored. THEY DONT CARE.
If you want to find out what i and a lot fo others meant, read the posts.
Sorry for the rude tone. Im super sad right now.
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Im super dissapointed.
Me and a lot of other players have made a lot of suggestions and gave ourt opinions LOUD and CLEAR in the PTB - Feedback.
Almost NONE of it was heard.
Im so sad right now.
As someone who has put a ton of time into this character (from release - 4th on steam leaderboards) and that has put a lot of time into helping out with constructive feedback, im just dissapointed in bhvr.
I will not be playing her as much.
Sad to see it go.
--> Freddy 2.0