bjorksnas
bjorksnas
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@ASurvkillivorer said:
What do you mean by corrupt?
You can't PR a corrupt gen since it can't have any progress?
They talking about it comparatively as a blocking / slowdown perks that pair well with pain res instead of pain res + gridlock
- you physically can't get a pain res pop while corrupt is active meaning it would never block a pain res
- it minimizes the spread of progress to 4 gens so more likely than not 1 pain res will get full value and disrupt multiple survivors
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Either gone or overhauled,
Visible numbers, Ranked/Casual Modes, better tracking and variance in matchmaking completely agree with the halo dev
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@Bardon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3699292#Comment_3699292
But none of those are nearly as egregious and many are situational not constant.
pig roar (not constant)
wraith bings and bongs and whooshing (not constant but pretty egregious)
dredges whooshing (egregious and constant)
trappers breathing (egregious and constant to the point of easy tracking in loops)
hags gargling (egregious and constant to the point of easy tracking in loops)
nemesis stomping (egregious and constant)
knights stomping (egregious and constant)
chuckys laughing (only when using the stealth power to counteract the fact he is stealthy so in terms of situational its the exact opposite of when you would want it)
Some of them are worse
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@Bardon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3699154#Comment_3699154
You forgot Demogorgon, his STOMPY STOMPY is worse than a lullaby and makes stealth perks/addons useless. "Oh no, I don't hear him scream but the ground is shaking and it's coming from behind that wall. I wonder where Demo could be?"
well if we go that in depth
pig roar
wraith bings and bongs and whooshing
dredges whooshing
trappers breathing
hags gargling
nemesis stomping
knights stomping
chuckys laughing
most killers whether stealthy or not have loud sounds that drastically impact stealth with perks, weirdly enough all stealth killers and killers with secondary stealth abilities in their power (except skull merchant because shes special) all have some kind of tell to their stealth or drawback like an uncloak or stand up or roar or cooldown or what have you. Most of them being sound based
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only 4 killers have a lulabye
huntress because she is a ranged killer
trickster because its funny
onion because otherwise she would just be bootleg wraith
freddy because he can have stealth but not too much
it would have to be a mostly universal change / stealth nerf to give killers lulaybes just because they use stealth perks and addons. it would be kind of silly to make it just for wesker for a mid tier perk
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Since you asked so nicely anything for you
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Well it all happened pretty fast across 2 updates mainly 6.1.0 and 6.2.0 but it was an accumulated change starting at around the release of the blight so 4.2.0
More forms of gaining bp started entering the game with the introduction of tomes meaning both sides had an additional ~4m bp they could earn just by completing challenges
Leading up to the release of 6.1.0 the devs wanted to introduce a overhaul of the prestige system since the old system would see all perks, addons, offerings get deleted every time you would prestige a character leading to either rushing p3 then grinding out all the perks or simply getting to p1 and never max prestiging a character because of everything you would lose by prestiging a character, on top of raising the upper end of prestige
To account for the fact that both less bp was needed to get a lot of perks on a character, no reset, and more prestiges happening they removed the bp bonus from BBQ and WGLF since it found its way into many peoples builds and instead replaced it with the incentive system AND raising the bp cap in each category to 10k, which while the system was poorly implemented for a bit (the bonus you received could change mid match so if you took a match with a 100% bonus if it changed to 25% before the match ended you only got 25% bonus) it was decently done to eliminate the need for these perks in peoples builds
Then this change was finialized in 6.2.0 with the cost reduction in bloodwebs reducing most costs by ~33% and eventually more forms of bp entering the game overall on top of that, more frequent bp bonus events, more bp scoring events from temporary events and empty spots in the rewards track being filled with some bp.
Basically a fat stack of changes that realistically changed how much bp you needed while also increasing how much bp you earned and bonus bp you could earn without equipping perks meant it was a good time to remove big bonus tied to these perks.
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Usually its 2 patches so its gonna be another ~5 weeks till we see any proposed changes and ~8 weeks till anything releases
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Every killer blight / nurse doesn't mean it should be easy
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seems like a one off bug, idk if thats killswitch worthy because its not replicable
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Cover the left side of your screen, just don't have the hud and manually keep track of all hook states and health states of your teammates as well as progress / activity they are doing
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I think they are about equal but twins are definitely easier to use, the main difference is while victor is a power house you are still reliant on charlotte to do most of the work with hooking and since slugging is slowed down a bit you mostly have to drag your feet while hooking, but since blight is always on top of a survivor he downs his overall down time is a lot less and he could snowball a lot faster to slug out a match.
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nuh uh
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man is 19/20 for booning hex totems and he is desperate
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@fulltonon said:
Luckily us vs them is somehow perfectly allowed in this place, so they won't get banned or anything.
Well us vs them is allowed because its kinda hard to not let it be, psychologically people will associate with one side of the game more than the other and any change to it will feel like a personal attack. Expecting everyone to be fully conscious of it and able to separate themselves from it at all times is kind of a big ask. Sure it ruins discussion a bit to say they can't change this because this. But most of the time when people make changes they also make it from bias so judging it from bias at the same time only makes sense.
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@IamFran said:
That have been the forum meta since the begining (well at least since January 2019 when I registered).
The only changing thing are the perks and killers they complain about.
They might have been but ive been seeing an abundance of them recently, instead of there being maybe 1 post like that every 2-3 days it seems daily we get multiple new account first post complaints, the amount has gone up
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@WeirdHexButOk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3692301#Comment_3692301
I actually never play as those killers so I wasn't sure how pwyf interacts with them. Why should insta down killers with mobility benefit more from extra speed when slower killers could use the boost?
Its just about whats an offensive action, if it can directly injure survivors then its an offensive action + a few exceptions, thats just how the perk works blight and nurse do no damage unless they attack and thus lose no stacks unless they attack
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3688402#Comment_3688402
The learning curve for Blight is much greater. Huntress doesn’t require the same degree of skill expression, and there are even ranged killers who require more skill than her (they don’t have the unusually large hitboxes Huntress gets). Like I can’t believe this is an argument.
Its fine if you don't understand the difference between skill floor, learning curve, and mastery but I think while huntress might be easier to pick up they both have a similar upper level of skill difficulty to perform the strongest tactics
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Clown isn't the best user of PWYF the killers with instant downs who don't lose stacks for mobility are because they can use stacks more efficiently or need a hit to get the ball rolling, id say oni / bubba / myers use it better than clown can ever hope to
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Since pips only represent recent playtime and provide a bp bonus it doesn't really make sense to have depiping be a thing, its not babying if it doesn't actually mean anything just like how they removed deranking removing depiping is no harm no foul since it isn't part of matchmaking or any type of prestige is just free bloodpoints
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Based on the way it looks even from your pov he crossed through the entire pallet right as you started to drop it meaning on their screen they likely crossed through it before you even started to drop it. Wesker is just too fast I see nothing wrong with this
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The only time I think a mechanic to punish tunneling should exist is for the first survivor hooked in a match, tunneling someone at at 5 gens 1 hook is just never a good look or is fun the rest of the time is usually fine though
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@Peanits said:
First, I just want to make it absolutely clear that this is not intended to 'solve tunneling'. This change is solely to make the perk provide more consistent value when it activates, not bring an end to the entire tunneling playstyle. I wouldn't recommend approaching this with the idea that it will end tunneling entirely as that is not the purpose behind the change - you would be setting yourself up for disappointment.
Secondly, regarding disabling Killer powers: I see this getting suggested a lot, but this is not an option. It's one of those things that sounds really simple on paper, but once you start drilling down into it, it turns out to be a whole can of worms. Each Killer power works differently from one another, and there is no one-size-fits all solution that can apply to all of them. Each power would need to be considered on a case by case basis to determine what should happen when they're 'disabled'.
For example, even if you disable the Killer's power button to stop The Nurse from blinking, there are multiple Killers who may already have traps set up around the map - would these also need to be disabled, or are they okay since they were already there? Some Killers also have passive powers/mechanics, such as The Cenobite's Chain Hunt, which would also need to be considered. It would also limit the possibilities for future Killer powers since we would always need to worry, "But how would it work if it was disabled by this one specific perk?"
To be frank, this would be unsustainable. With over 30 Killers in the game and more on the way, having special conditions for each one would require far too much ongoing support just to make that condition feasible. To give an real example from the past, the original version of Tinkerer used to increase the effectiveness of all charge speed add-ons. Even with only a handful of Killers in the game at the time, it ended up being very confusing for players to keep track of which add-ons it could affect, a nightmare to balance because those add-ons could be too strong with the perk or too weak without it, and an unreasonable amount of work to upkeep as the game grew. In the same way, this would require quite a bit of additional work to be done for every Killer just to support one perk. It's one of the reasons that perks typically don't interact with powers, and the few that do are gradually moving away from that (e.g. Adrenaline waking up Survivors).
Don't get me wrong, it's a neat idea and the intention behind it is good, but it's way outside the scope for a single perk and could quickly turn into a confusing mess.
Fair enough, I just hope a content creator or someone with a more widespread platform in the community picks up on this so that more people can read and understand this because it makes a lot of sense knowing the developer standpoint on this of why it isn't a simple change.
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I was hoping huntress would instead reload 1 or 2 hatchets whenever they hooked a survivor with those addons instead but a 15% haste clown might be interesting
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I mean if people end up in a group together in a match they can choose what rules they play by. If everyone is on board / knows each other than the game rules don't really apply to them since no one is going to report each other. Even if it was reportable rule breaking if they don't report it then no harm no foul no one gets in trouble.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690740#Comment_3690740
That's why I think 4s+ 2 uses would have been enough.
lmao no 2 uses is silly, 4s would be enough of a buff though
3s is enough for high level players
low level players get no use out of it since they don't own the perk
mid level players are the only ones who need a duration buff because they don't use it very well either due to lack of skill, lack of planning, lack of communication ect, the only buff is needed for that group anything more is just gravy that the higher skilled players will abuse or slog through
and making the perk have 2 uses means its just a single perk that hard counters an entire strategy which is just no, its like saying unbreakable should have infinite uses, if you want more anti-tunnel use more anti-tunnel don't just giga buff one perk
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Id say about 80% of the time successfully or not the unhooked survivor with endurance comes barreling at me or tries to get in my way even if I am explicitly trying to go after the other survivor. Might be conformation bias since the times it happens feel disproportionately worse than the times it doesn't but still its high time something is changed about it
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@OmegaXII said:
All survivors share a total 12 hook counts, and they won't die at all until the 9th hooks. This'll completely remove all the tunneling & camping in the game.
But at the same time, Gen Speed needs to be drastically reduces for this change, otherwise Killer will have no chance of winning at all.
What do you think?
I think the thing most people fail to see is that tunneling and camping just aren't things the devs want to remove from the game, there are a million ways to go about changing it but the devs just don't want to change that much at once they want to do safe small bursts of changes to 1 character and maybe a few other perks and specific things at a time. Something that involves changing a large portion of the game like removing a mechanic or playstyle require a mountain of work and if not all done at once would likely mean a massive drop in player counts if not in a playable state and even then people likely won't like the new metas that form.
Camping would still work since while its shared hook states defending someone on a hook deprives someone of hooks later down the line
Slugging would skyrocket whats the point of putting someone on a hook when slugging them can kill them outright without a song and dance of potentially hooking a survivor 9 times
1 for 1s can quickly drain a teams resources so each hook can be stretched into 2~3 if a killer patrols well
Gen times could easily have to be 2x as long to make up for most killers
Top tiers would likely still top tier and can easily shift into slugging compared to killers like clown
Overall just no thanks, I don't like the kind of game a change like this would create
An ideal anti-tunneling change wouldn't be a removal it would be a mechanic to weaken it while incentivizing going after other survivors, and ideally weaken a situation where it is most frowned upon like at the start of a match
For example protection for the first survivor hooked each match to prevent tunneling off the bat
New mechanic: Drained
The first survivor hooked each match gains a new status effect, Drained, this lasts until another survivor is hooked or until they are hooked again. A drained survivor has a ~-10% gen and healing speed penalty (non stacking only using highest form of slowdown aka 4 stacks of thana would only be 20% slowdown and 3 stacks would still only be 10%) if a drained survivor is hooked they don't lose another hook stage
Aka to tunnel the first guy out of a match you would need to hook them 4 times in a row. But if you go after others you can go back to them later and kill them in 3 hooks. As a reward for not tunneling you get a reduced gen and healing speed from the survivor and as a penalty for tunneling you would need to chase them again.
That would be proper a anti-tunnel change
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@Marioneo said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pqMjGedQt8
in the video provided Otz talks about why buffing the duration of Ds won't solve tunneling especially against meta killers and instead says it should be made a common perk not locked behind a paywall for new players and begiven an additional effect that disables a killers power for 30-40 seconds so it can affect Nurses and blights.
Thoughts?
stretches his words a bit with how long it should be disabled he said for killers like blight / nurse it should drain or pause token regen while stunned, so at most it would be ~5-10s
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Wdym I love when I go for the survivor who wasn't on the hook and get blinded by the unhooked survivor then have to deal with DS + OTR if I decide to chase them such a fun interaction
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She didn't get way too much 2 hatchets and 10% windup barely make up for 6.5 years of negative changes and map updates aka slap 400 trees around with massive branches that prevent you from doing cool stuff, 5 indoor maps, and putting almost every gen in a closed off spaces so less map pressure. And well the main reason for the buffs some maps are just massive locker deadzones with my favorite examples being badham and haddonfield, nearest reload can easily be a +10s walk
Id say after 6.5 years a bit of basekit buffs were well deserved since they can't sacrifice the artistic integrity of maps to make huntress, dredge, and trickster better
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Use slowdown that is dependent on the killer you play not just a global set usually using 1-2 of the right perks on a killer can be stronger than using 4 perks that don't suit them for slowdown
Some killers get hooks easier and faster than others, blight / nurse / billy using perks like pop and pain res reward fast hook chaining with pressure
Some killers can push survivors off objectives quickly like doctor, using perks like DMS can provide a lot more slowdown
Ect
Don't just try and make a 4 perk slowdown build to use on everyone figure out what each perk is good for (otzdarva has a million guides so he probably has one for any specific perk or killer) and build something that best suits them
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The conspicuous action nerf was tastefully done and it was only every 5s to counter enduring reducing all stuns, so changing it to 3s was never really that bad except for middle of the pack players who weren't smart enough to use it synergistically instead of relying on the perk to do all the work itself
Changing to 5s doesn't really fix the top end problem of the perk against high tier killers but does make it much better for middle of the pack survivors and against killers who don't have mobility
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Better Than New, Make it last till injured again and for 25s after being injured
Blood Rush, Let it be used after each unhook, let it be usable while injured giving deep wound and only healing deep wound, or alternatively also give it 2s of 150% haste upon activation (6m/s)
Camaraderie activate on both hook stages, give an icon for all survivors to show they have it and that its activeCorrective Action turn them into great skillchecks and cover own missed skillchecks into good skillchecks
Fast Track gain tokens upon being hooked yourself
Friendly Competition marks a gen by working on it when any marked gen is complete all survivors who worked on it gets the boost 60s uptime 30s cooldown, all other gens become unmarked when it activates, can't mark gens while on cooldown
Invocation: Weaving Spiders, this one needs more time but its probably safe for a buff
Low Profile 125% speed 2.92m/s
Lucky Star increase the duration to 20s and make the effects global (all survivors see all other survivors and all gens)
Pharmacy make the medkit function like an old green medkit (11s heal) but also be a temporary itemPoised grant double the duration (to 20s) and grant 3% haste while active
Potential Energy make it a 1:1 conversion and tokens are halved upon being hooked instead of all lost upon being injured
Premonition 45s cooldown reveals the killers aura for 4s if in their terror radius, otherwise just a noise notification
Quick Gambit show the gens aura intensity based on gen progression and let it linger for 12s (so a quick pass by saves 1% on a gen)
Red Herring make entering and exiting lockers silent while active (so you can use it faster)
Resurgence make the healing be non regressable (like bnp or weaving spiders)
Rookie Spirit decease repair time to stop regression from 5% to 1%
Scavenger restore 25% upon completing a gen repair in addition to its normal effects
Self Preservation remove the range limit aka if any other survivor is injured by any means you leave no blood scratch marks and make no grunts of pain for 10s
Sole Survivor give the lucky break effect for 10s upon being unhooked (no scratch marks or blood)
Solidarity make the healing be non regressable (like bnp or weaving spiders)
Spine Chill Old activation condition but doesn't work outside of terror radius, always active in chase 6% vault speed returned
Teamwork: Collective Stealth remove cooldown linger 10s after leaving the 12m range, make it so both if you heal or get healed it activates also let it hide auras
Teamwork: Power of Two remove cooldown linger 10s after leaving the 12m range, make it so both if you heal or get healed it activates
Technician reduce noise radius by 50% and make it decrease progress lost to 7/6/5% (instead of base 10%) missed skillchecks are silent
This is not Happening increase skillcheck odds by 50%
Up the Ante remove aces perks from the game
Visionary Works 24/7 and shows gen progress based on aura intensityIts not much and might not make them meta but it would make all of them better
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3688402#Comment_3688402
The learning curve for Blight is much greater. Huntress doesn’t require the same degree of skill expression, and there are even ranged killers who require more skill than her (they don’t have the unusually large hitboxes Huntress gets). Like I can’t believe this is an argument.
I mean the bare minimum skill to get results with the power blight is definitely more difficult but the key phrase is mastery with all the cool huntress shots possible in the game like orbitals cross maps, throwing through gaps ect it does compare nicely to blights mastery of map knowledge and techs in terms of mastery.
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4s stun and 4s power disable would have been a better balance since longer duration mostly just hurts low tier killers more than high tier killers
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3688250#Comment_3688250
A 60/40 killer survivor split but you think Huntress is as difficult to master as Blight? And that this killer isn’t overpowered—it’s just a skill issue? Yikes.
I mean it says master, if you put everything that would go into mastering both characters I think they come pretty close in terms of difficulty to perform high level tactics map knowledge ect.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3687586#Comment_3687586
Again there's a disparity, there's people saying blight's only interesting because of this bug that's going away
But in the same breath there's people saying most blights are average and never used it anyway.
It doesn't make any sense lol.
fair enough im of the more is more group, not a this is the end of the world group, normal gameplay replaces it 90% of the time so not being able to view gameplay in a different way from time to time is boring but its not that bad unless it also ruins normal collision
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@Brokenbones said:
People claiming to be Blight fans defending hug tech by saying "normal" blight is boring/too easy
lol
Well it is, blights been blight for like 3 years, more mechanics more interesting
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I think the perks in their own ways were problematic and needed to be fixed but the fixes were either too lazy or too heavy handed
Iron will this perk was problematic because of how often other sounds were also broken and to this day still break, no grunts of pain in chase extends chase time through making it harder to successfully mindgame a survivor and buying free time when a killer mindgames nothing and you hold W, now this on its own isn't extremely problematic except for the main counter to iron will being skilled enough to pick out the other sounds a survivor makes in chase just not working most of the time. Instead of fixing the sounds and making them more consistent across the board they took the easy option of nerf iron will instead of across the board fixes.
Self care was preemptively nerfed to match the medkit healing speeds but I think it could easily be buffed from 48s heals to 40s or 36s with no real problem but if it stayed at 32s with all the synergy of other perks you could bring means it would just be a better infinite medkit by a wide margin. I think a balance of 1 perk slot being worse than a medkit, 2 perk slots being equal, and 3 perks slots better than a medkit is a more fair balance, compared to its current state of 3 whole perk slots still being worse than 1 medkit (at least its infinite) and especially compared to what it used to be because 2 perk slots for an infinite strong medkit would be busted. It could use a bit of love but not full revert.
TLDR Iron will was nerfed because it was easier than fixing related problems and self care was preemptively nerfed a bit too hard
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@fulltonon said:
Like, literally absolutely invincible, until killer hooks others or survivor touches gen, no hitbox.
This is not a trolling and I'm 100% sure this will fix tunneling.
No need for BT DS blah blah blah blah fixes, just one dumb invincible mode will do.
"fix" aka removal doesn't actually fix a problem just makes a different one
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The main reason that killers need to be stronger is that eventually for the gameplay loop to work the killer has to catch the survivor, whether that is through overpowering the resources they have with fast destructive powers like oni and singularity, playing around their resources like huntress, or just going over the top and hitting them before they can even reach the next thing like blight, or outright ignoring them trapper / hag / nurse.
Eventually for the gameplay loop to work killers have to catch survivors so if a survivor was equal to a killer each match would be 1 chase and over which can be seen against bad players where in 1-2 chases they lose all 5 gens while conversely really good killers and strong killers can end up with multiple hooks before too many gens get done. If survivors were to be equal the number of hooks stats would be reduced or the number of gens / gen time increased just for a power fantasy of 1-2 long chases a match which probably at that rate end up being 1 survivor plays the game while everyone else does gens.
Its just a worse gameplay loop without it
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sure you can borrow some rings just have them home by 11pm
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Certain pallets basically all but require being broken to continue chase, but conversely most of them would be a trap if you could force survivors to vault back and fourth on them
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I mean its the same with half the effects in the game, what perks do the killers and survivors have and how to look out for signs of what they might have, blight addons are no different its a puzzle and the more info you can gleam the better you can compete against the other side
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Im glad the perk is good and buried because it just wasn't good for the game or a healthy perk design, free speed for being injured, one of the strongest status effects for one of the most mundane activation requirements in the game that happens nearly every match and affects almost every chase and killer
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683734#Comment_3683734
That makes more sense, and at least make it so it requires an unhook/protection hit/save first. The fact made for this requires you to be injured first kinda kills a lot of the toxic elements, and at least let's the killer get a foot hold before it starts.
I'd be tempted to give a small speed boost (say 5%) to Buckle Up as well to help reach a tile, as just endurance for the picked up survivor on its own might kill the perk.
Buckle Up
When healing a Survivor in the Dying State:
- The Aura of the Killer is revealed to the both of you.
- Completing a Healing Action on the dying Survivor grants that survivor Endurance Status Effect for 6/8/10 seconds.
- Completing a Healing Action on the dying Survivor also grants you both 5% Haste for 6/8/10 seconds.
This would still keep Buckle Up decent on its own and open up synergies with Made For This.
I think the diversity it grants by switching the endurance is good since you get 3 versions of the combo
Self sacrifice, FTP + Buckle up
Normal combo with activation, FTP + WGLF
Neutral recovery combo, Made for this + Buckle up
Rather than FTP + Buckle up just being the best version of all 3, more build diversity
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683791#Comment_3683791
I'm talking about before Buckle Up received its buff. It used to be that it only gave Endurance to the survivor who got picked up.
Also I still tend to see both perks being used individually on the regular so I'd have to disagree with that claim of the two perks already being dead on their own.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683812#Comment_3683812
The only problem I find with this change is that it would make the old survivor speed build of MFT + Hope + Power Of Two + Blood Pact come back again, but even stronger since MFT would be replaced with Buckle Up which would be 2% higher than MFT.
No it never gave endurance before 7.1.0 which made it give it to both survivors, it when from no endurance to endurance for both, there was no endurance for the picked up survivor inbetween
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683734#Comment_3683734
That's how Buckle Up used to be and nobody would use it for that reason. Hence why they buffed Buckle Up the way they did.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683731#Comment_3683731
I'd rather they not just kill off either of these two perks because on their own they aren't exactly a problem and perks that aren't exactly much of a problem on their own shouldn't be killed off imo.
No its not how it used to be it gained endurance status effect in 7.1.0 but made for this came out in 7.0.0 meaning you could have an effective version of this combo before that but it just wasn't worthwhile to use (soul guard + for the people + made for this or were gonna live forever if the other survivor isn't running soul guard) the supposed three perk version already existed before the 2 perk version was made.
These two perks aren't being killed off on their own because they are already dead perks on their own
Making it either a 2 perk combo that you need to invest some time into activating or a 3 perk combo instead is better for build diversity and balance
