Xernoton
Xernoton
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There already is an anti camping mechanic, that affects Wraith just as much as every other killer. His invisibility doesn't change that. Also, Wraith is by far not the weakest killer in the game. In fact he is quite solid. Not increadibly strong but also not super weak.
I can assure you, that survivors still escape. It's not nearly that bad and it honestly sounds like you let the game get to you. If that's the case, take a deep breath and think about, if you have any desire to play the game right now. If the answer is no, then there is no shame in not playing for a bit. Games are supposed to be fun and it seems like fun isn't the right word to describe your experience here.
Lastly, you are correct that nobody would play Wraith, if you removed his power. I mean, what would be the point? He would be Trapper without traps and a different look. Nobody would pick Wraith for something they could do on almost every other killer and no unique power.
If you have trouble going against Wraith specifically, then I recommend YouTube or the forums. Just ask how to play against him and there will be a lot of people more than happy to help.
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The worst ones are people to use cheats / exploits to hold you hostage.
What you described is definitely bad but not quite as bad as having to dc because some dicks glitched themselves into a locker using flashlights.
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It's not just Wesker. This happens with every killer. I'm not sure, if they ever consciously changed it but it's been this way for quite a while. I can't even remember the last time I was able to prevent an unhook. Even with people rushing to the unhook the millisecond I was done with animation.
It's not that big of a deal though. You aren't supposed to stop unhooks in any way, so you need to focus on everything else. The game still works fine.
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Well, they didn't change anything besides Trappers traps no longer glitching into the ground, so there will be a few things to work out still. Especially with newer killers that have been released while Hawkins was gone. I trust them to fix these one by one. Maybe even give the map a bit of an update because it's quite obviously a remnant of a very different DBD.
7 matches back to back on that map shouldn't happen though. The map repeat prevention is still a thing, isn't it? So that should make this impossible. Might be a bug.
Some small advice to dealing with Hawkins because it sounds like you could need it. First off, Wesker doesn't work on that map. Yet. There are quite a few issues with the doorways that need to be sorted out. With other killers, you will notice that there are many pallets but only few of them are actually strong. Only break the pallets that you absolutely can't play around and leave the rest as it is. This will often give you easy hits because survivors will run towards pallets that aren't all that strong. Additionally, you can make this map really nasty by giving up the hardest to defend gens and focusing on what you can contest. Not saying you should play for a 3 gen from start to finish but you don't need to defend every gen.
When it comes to dealing with frustration in DBD, I recommend meme builds. You know you're at a disadvantage, so you can just focus on making the build work. Maybe try a killer you've never played before or that you aren't very familiar with. Who cares, if you lose a match? It's much more important to have fun.
The toxicity in end game is a serious issue though. I don't know why but DBD has an issue with sore winners way much than sore losers. I find it helps to reflect on how I played in these situations. If they are calling you names, then report them and go on. They don't know you and they obviously want to make you miserable. There is no reason for you to give them that power.
If nothing helps, then take a break from DBD. Most of us have done it and there is no shame in it. Maybe your passion for DBD will return after a while. If not, then it can't be helped.
Anyways, best of luck.
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I meant that genuinely. Not sure why that would be negative or hateful. But saying something isn't fun and not explaining further, I honestly don't know what you wanted to hear.
Explain why you don't have fun and the people on this forum will suggest many ways to make the game more enjoyable for yourself. If you aren't interested in that, then pick a different game. One that you have fun playing.
We don't know why you don't have fun with DBD, we don't know how long you've been playing and we don't know you. Give us a bit to work with and there will be a few suggestions to help you out. But if nothing helps, then you shouldn't play DBD. At least for a while.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589447#Comment_3589447
SB and Lithe are not meta for long time. We had Dead Hard meta for long time. After DH gutted, we got MfT. So SB and Lithe did not stay as meta perks for long enough.
We will see real reactions pretty soon but i am hoping you are right. I don't wanna get all fun perks nerfed just because people don't enjoy against them.
If that ever happens, I'll be the first to defend them both. Even before DHs pick rate skyrocketed, Lithe and SB were popular but I do not remember many complaints about them. They were mostly regarded as fine. Strong and not great for the killer (as with any survivor perk other than maybe No Mither) but definitely fair.
I'll fly to the BHVR head quarters myself and have a little chat with the devs before that happens. Preferably over some Feng skins. Love you, devs!
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Ok...
Better luck with a different game, then.
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Gimme Blighted Bubba.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589069#Comment_3589069
Getting better is an impossible task, which is why killers tunnel at 5 Gens.
The killer tunneled you and end up all 4 escaped was probably the tunneling it self brought them into higher MMR where they should not be.
Why would it be an impossible task to get better? Throughout the match, I agree. You won't suddenly connect to the collective consciousness of all survivor players across the globe and become the best looper of all time like no one ever was. Especially since nobody can ever come close to me and my godlike looping skills, that I definitely have and only conveniently forget about in my survivor matches to give the killer a chance. Definitely.
But learning how to delay the killer in chase is not impossible overall. In fact it's one of the first things that survivors learn. It doesn't mean that everyone can be as good as their favorite content creator but it does mean, that they can learn a few things. Only, they will plateau at some point and not get much better. So tunneling by a better killer player would still put them in the same position. So "getting better" is actually not the best counter to tunneling because the killer player would also "get better".
I very much agree with the second part of your post. There seem to be quite a few players (often players with way less hours), that will try to give themself every advantage just to win. And when they eventually come into a MMR where that will no longer work, they will become frustrated and tell themself, that there is nothing they can do and the game is so unfair (not saying it's perfectly balanced, but it's really not so bad). When they could learn from their mistakes and improve further.
This isn't helped by the grade system either because it is still common for people to think that it determines their matchmaking or is a reflection of their MMR. So there is a placebo effect on top of it.
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@appleas said:
They did. Remember that patch they did that made scratch marks more easier to see with screenshots in the patch notes?
The scratch marks are barely visible now
To be honest, I don't remember that one. If you find it again, or if you have a general idea of when this happened, could you point me to it?
But I agree. Scratch marks are pretty hard to see at the moment. That's definitely not a good thing, considering it's the main tracking tool for a killer.
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@HugTechLover said:
Who knows, they could just be considering it as basekit now. It adds a good level of skill expression to the game, for both sides. Wish they would just give an answer to this so we can stop making repetitive threads and debates.
However, the hug tech does not give a “substantial unfair advantage”.
The locker exploit that was recently patched is a key example of a “substantial unfair advantage”.
In any case, it would be nice to have word from the devs.
Many of us think, that Hug Tech shouldn't be a thing (mainly because it can grant you hits without too much effort in many situations) but there are also people that defend Hug Tech. I accept that, even if I don't agree. But the radio silence from the devs on this issue isn't helping. Every few weeks we have the same discussion again and we ask for an official statement. So far without success.
Repeating the same arguments over and over again, won't change our opinions on the matter, so these posts also don't help anyone anymore.
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@Z0mbiv0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589268#Comment_3589268
There are in fact some many sentences that I think must sound hilarious to other languages speakers, though I guess it also depends on the native language of the reader. I think it's safe to say that to most spanish native speakers (at least those from Spain) English looks way too menacing and complex. I wish more people would be interested in learning other languages, I find them fascinating.
I have a similar feeling about Czech. I understand a couple of words (although I can neither read or write it) but it sounds a lot more... "Aggressive" than my mother tongue even though I am fully aware that not every Czech person is yelling at me. Or that's what I keep telling myself. English, I found to be very welcoming as a beginner learning the language. The pronunciation and orthography for your every day words seemed simple enough and you're surrounded by it pretty much all the time, so you have even more reason to get into it.
I have never been into learning different languages (other than English for some reason) but I respect the kind of dedication it takes. Sometimes though, you can find parallels between a country's history and their language and to a lesser degree the people. That is fascinating indeed. It is also said, that speaking Latin gives you an advantage in studying pure math. Although, the data on that is not very conclusive, from what I've seen.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589253#Comment_3589253
It wasn't ideal but it showed the main issue: that there are not enough servers for the players to ensure fair matches.
If you have bad ping in a multiplayer fps, you don't hit. Simple.
It is a problem that killers have an advantage if they have bad ping. And because of that VPNs are an issue as well. The game needs more servers and a protection against VPN killers or a way to ensure that hits are fair.
Then don't give me the constant feedback, that I got the hit. The sever deemed, that I shouldn't get the hit. I get it and that is somewhat fine (although this also has implications on this game's balance, if that many hits are laggy). But the part that really threw me and others off was the conflicting feedback. A survivor that goes down / is injured on the HUD, blood splattered across the camera and the audio clue to let you know, you hit the survivor only for it all to disappear a fraction of a second later. There have even been instances where you would get a stack of STBFL but the hit was validated anyway.
Do you have any idea how frustrating that is? It's no wonder there weren't many people playing killer at the time and it's a good thing that is no longer the case. Also, I live in western Europe. Not too far from the server, actually. And I have a very stable connection. So, that wasn't the issue but rather that the smallest of latencies makes a huge difference in this game. Do you want me to move to Frankfurt or London to avoid these issues? Sorry but that's a bit much for a video game.
If there was a way to implement hit validation without the conflicting feedback, then I wouldn't be against it. But that is not going to happen. Because (from what I understand) this isn't possible. The server would need to communicate with the killer's game before they actually get the feedback. We aren't talking about 50 ms here. Not even 30 ms (which is already very solid). But pretty much instantaneous. They could have servers every 1000 km or so and it still wouldn't be enough.
Where do we draw the line? At 15 ms? Well, have fun playing with 5 other people then. Because that is way less than can be expected from anyone. Everything up to 100 ms is considered a fine ping in different games. In DBD that makes a huge difference and looks awful but stocking up on servers and gate keeping the game from everyone who bought it and has a connection that is not at 15 ms or lower would definitely kill the game. 5 people can't buy enough skins to finance the game.
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Ideally the game should be balanced around the killer going for hooks over kills. But that isn't the case. It's the exact opposite and worse, if you don't tunnel as a killer you not only don't get the advantage of not having someone out early, but you'll also have to bother with more survivor perks that way.
That means, that a killer has to play a lot better, if they want to be able to go for more hooks than if they were to tunnel someone out early on. The problem is, that you cannot really measure, if the killer plays better than the survivors. At least not accurately. You can make an educated guess but that's about it. Because it's impossible to tell who plays better when the skill expressions on both sides differ so majorly.
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Sounds kind of funny when you don't speak Spanish, not gonna lie. I especially like the part about "perks super rotos". I have no idea what it means (though I am fully capable of using google translate myself, tyvm) but it sounds funny. This is not meant to be offensive. It just sounds funny when you absolutely don't speak the language. As with (probably) every other language.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588522#Comment_3588522
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588688#Comment_3588688
This would give the Devs the motivation to finally add an additional server in the middle east (or any other region with the same problem). Alternatively they could also reimplement Hit Validation. It used to exist, but the Devs shadow removed it over time.
We had seen what happened thanks to hit validation. I don't want to sound too "doom and gloom" but to say that this had the potential to kill the game wouldn't be far from the truth. Survivor queue times at the time took forever and killer queue times were about 5 seconds at the very max. You just can't give the killer the feedback that they get the hit and then take it away from them. Sometimes multiple times per chase.
If that ever came back in this form I'd stop playing. Because this feels like a huge "######### you" from the devs even if it isn't. If you think it's bad to be hit from a distance once or twice per match, then imagine that 4 times as often. With some survivors even starting to pallet camp because 1) they can't be hit and 2) it's funny when the killer suffers. This cannot happen again.
Additional servers in specific regions though, sounds like a good idea. Only, you can't punish the players for BHVR not having them yet and maybe never.
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NWO was a popular perk even before 6.1.0. As was Adrenaline. Gen regression has overall become weaker than before and around 6.1.0, which means that gens will regress less in your average match. This is not a bad thing necessarily. Because it also means, that the focus for killers shifts more towards chases and less towards: "How much longer can I stall the game while making at least some small progress?" or worse in 6.1.0: "Can I hold the match hostage until either the survivors give up / dc or the match shuts down?"
The issue is, that at the same time the survivor meta first shifted from stacking second chances to spam healing faster than any killer could ever hit you and then to: "Let's just stay injured and do gens." Or in other words; the survivor meta has shifted towards gen efficiency (not quite the same as gen rush but both have similar results).
This is why we see some killers leaning more into a hyper aggressive play style and also why UW has such a high popularity. If the gens are gonna get done anyway, might as well try to kill them as fast as possible. So the competition is no longer about who can delay their opponent longer, but who can outpace their opponent with both sides trying to keep the match as short as possible. Now, we don't see this to an extreme extend (luckily) because the regression meta is still working well but regardless it is where the game is headed towards.
The issue is not just regression perks being too weak but the survivor meta being to keep the match as short as possible. Which is why you still see so many medkits and toolboxes. If you can save even a second of time than that already puts you in a slightly better position. With MfT being a meta perk that extends chases and doesn't afford you to do anything special to get value out of it, there is more time for survivors overall to work on gens and as a result they get done faster. For many killers it is normal to lose 2-3 gens for their first chase. That is already 35%-55% of the survivors' objective and it forces the killer to play around the remaining 2-3 gens more actively. This can either happen by playing the long game (literally) or by doing everything to progress faster and more efficient than the survivors.
Both metas have led to gen times being shorter overall. To fix this, they'd need to find a healthy middle ground between delaying the other side and accelerating the own progression. A balance by sledge hammer approach is not going to work this time.
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Seems I get all your Aces, then. I also still have quite a few Davids and sometimes even a Bill. The rest is very similar to my own experience.
Edit: Dwight is the most popular male survivor because:
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I agree with @Seraphor here. Going against killers with bad connection doesn't feel great but encouraging lobby dodging (exactly what this would do) is probably not the smartest move. These players payed just as much money as everyone else (unless they are on Epic Games) to play the game and if they can't get a match because of this, then that's definitely a terrible thing. There is no warning: "Your ping must be lower than X ms or else you can't play because everyone will dodge you."
Also, how long are you willing to wait for a match? Depending on how many people would dodge this could easily take forever. And worse yet, MMR wouldn't work at all because it's completely ignored when it comes to backfilling. So the overall quality of matches would likely decrease as well. Which in turn causes the same symptoms as the issue it's trying to fix.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588678#Comment_3588678
Nemesis is licensed, i meant og characters only.
But Entity is power role here, she would give some powers to survivors. And some humanoid killers (Legion, SM) as well.
Nemesis was only an extreme example. The same would go for every other killer. If survivors are strong enough to have fighting chance in the 1v1 the one moment and then can't do anything but flee in the 1v4 the next moment, this looks weird.
I guess you could try and explain it with the Entity giving special powers to the survivors to make it more equal but still that'd be a bit weird. One moment the Entity wants a 1v1 on fair terms, the next she wants a 1v4 with the killer as the power role. If they found a way around this, then I'd be all for it. But if not, then I'd have my reservations.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588667#Comment_3588667
DbD already has a lot killers and even some survivors would make sense ( David, Haddie ) in fighting game. I'd like to see this genre game for DbD.
Survivor sacrifices was not enough for Entity, so she decided make killers fight with each other as well.
It would be conflicting though, if killers and survivors were equally strong in the 1v1. I mean, imagine David going against Nemesis and beating him or even just barely losing. How would that make sense the next time he gets chased by him in the base game?
I'm not against the idea of a DBD themed fighting game but they'd have to find a way around the conflicting implications here.
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@Grigerbest said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588640#Comment_3588640
There is 2 things, that I do like about Xeno, and don't like:
- Don't like, that Xeno feels addon dependent (I can't imagine playing without 30% helmet).
- I do like that you don't really need any aura reading perks on Xeno. Constant tunneling will always get you onto them, just by hearing gens.
A really good Xeno main is VERY hard to deal with, but still possible.
One of the most close to being balanced killers, even from first days of PTB.
Very true. Although, I am curious about the buffed cooldown. I'd really like to know how that'd feel. Definitely one of the decisions of all time to revert it before testing it.
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That very much depends on how well the Xenomorph and the survivors play. Even more than most other killers.
If the Xenomorph is super aware, keeps track of every survivor's position and is also good with their power, then it is super strong. Definitely a top tier killer. But if the Xenomorph is more of a human and less of a perfect machine and the survivors play well, then it falls off to lower A-tier or highest B-tier (depending on the map) in my opinion.
Missed tail attacks are quite punishing and you can make a lot of distance by using the turrets even if you don't break the Xeno out of their power.
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Artist would be the only one strong enough to beat Nicolas Cage.
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@stunningpallet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588563#Comment_3588563
But you're part of the drama, look at you and this post, it's pretty pathetic. Sorry for you!
Nice. Then I can add myself to the list of things to laugh at!
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@Dogma_loki said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587943#Comment_3587943
Maybe you should go look at your own posting about “mass hysteria” in another thread.
Why? Do you want me to copy and paste it here as well? This is what always happens with a new chapter and a popular killer. This is why I wrote I'll have something to laugh about. Because after that initial surge in popularity everything will go back to normal and the compaints will slowly calm. Most people will realise that it's not the end of the world and that the new killer is not so bad.
@stunningpallet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587943#Comment_3587943
Well that was a lot of frustration to unpack
Frustration? No. More like me looking forward to watching the same thing unfold as with every other killer ever. Most people will want to play Chucky, so that means that survivors will mostly play against Chucky. And looking back at previous releases, there will be complaints. A lot of them. There will also be calls for nerfs. A lot of them. This happens every single time. Even with Singularity there were some that claimed it was too strong (admittedly less than usual though).
Basically, I'm looking forward to the drama on the forums. The entertainment value alone is priceless. Or at least it's better than any show on Netflix.
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"In sociology and psychology, mass hysteria is a phenomenon that transmits collective illusions of threats, whether real or imaginary, through a population and society as a result of rumors and fear." ~ Wikipedia.
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Survivor: Open Handed and Bond. All the information you could ever need.
Killer: Lightborn, Shadowborn (I like not looking through a Pringles can for a change), Huntress' Lullaby and Zanshin Tactics (mostly on Doctor).
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I see what you mean but I think it won't have a huge impact on survivors because all of these perks are not super meta. For killers it's sad that Surge (or is it Jolt? Which one is it, I'm confused.) will be locked behind a dlc. It's pretty much the only regression perk that was available right off the bat, so that is not great. Then again, we managed before, so it might not be quite so bad.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587696#Comment_3587696
You say they’re balanced, others believe they’re overpowered. What lends credence to your opinion versus anyone else’s? Why do we use what you think as the measure of what is balanced/fair? (I agreed that they’re good, balanced perks but I know others disagree).
Luckily, I am not the one responsible for balancing at BHVR. That's a headache I don't need to deal with. So, I can express my opinions, hear others respond and say I either disagree or agree without it having any major consequences.
SB and Adrenaline are widely considered fair. You will find someone somewhere that claims they are overpowered, if you look hard enough, but for the most part we agree that they are fine. So, I'd say it's not just my opinion but that of (probably) a majority of players on both sides.
You raise a good point, that there is no well defined norm to measure, if a perk is just strong or overpowered. Personally, I consider SB and Adrenaline fair because 1) both perks have downsides, 2) they can be played around (<=> counterplay) and 3) they have an achievable skill cap to get max value out of, so you don't get free value without doing something for it.
Of course, though, if someone were to challenge me on this, I couldn't possibly defend it by saying: "It's the objective truth." Instead, I'd need to defend it by arguing why both perks are fine and explain why any extremes are either too niche to be considered in the grand scheme of things or aren't as bad as they may seem. There are things in this World, that can't be defined by any norm. So we can't get any number values to explain the strength of different perks and compare them.
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I'm not against this suggestion but I'd rather they don't play around with Haste. Movement speed is finicky that way. There is a reason that some killers are 5% slower than others and MfT is considered overpowered.
They could turn up the other numbers, or maybe even add something to help the killer find whoever they haven't hooked or hooked twice yet to incentivise going for more hooks and a higher bonus to healing and repairing could also be used to compensate for tunneling.
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Aura vision on injured team mates and they should see your aura too and 65% healing progress. That would make it pretty solid in my opinion. It still wouldn't be meta perk though, so its pick rate would stay low.
Your suggestion sounds like a bit much. I'm not a big fan of 2 survivors healing repeatedly in the same amount of time a single heal would take. Especially with We'll Make It slapped on top of it. I mean, spam healing really doesn't need to be so strong that it works even against Legion, whose entire point it is to keep survivors injured.
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It's not great but not bad either. Deadlock is a more reliable alternative.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587939#Comment_3587939
I believe they are not believe in Twins, just look Trickster and SM , they both got good changes. Because they know they can sell costumes for these two. But Twins? Yeah 5 Twins on the world will be happy about their rework.
Maybe there would be 7 or 8, if they didn't feel quite that bad to play. It's not hard to improve them in some way and they could squeeze something small like a reduction in cooldown into any patch. But they haven't done anything like this. And if they can sell skins for SM, a killer that is hated like nothing else, then it can't be that hard to do the same for Twins.
Just give us a little hat for Victor and you'll see the player counts of Twins rising! Give him Feng's bunny hoodie and I'll main Twins.
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Tunneling at 1 gen left doesn't work. By that point you either have enough hooks to not call it tunneling anymore, or tunneling won't save you. Tunneling at 2 gens doesn't work all that well either. Tunneling at 3 gens would still afford you to find the survivor you want to tunnel quickly. So for tunneling to work the most effective, you need to do it early on.
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Can't wait for the mass of complaints about Chucky. His popularity will be high, survivors will complain about like they did with Wesker and the devs will either have to nerf him or suffer the collective wrath of survivor mains for a week.
So, business as usual. I'm more interested in what happens after the first week. Will Chucky be the new Wesker? Or will he share the throne with Wesker? In both cases I'll have something to laugh at because it just shows, that BHVR cannot have a successful new killer without unleashing the wrath of some people.
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I love your optimism but recent history has shown us that they don't have their priorities in the same order as we do. I mean, Sadako, Trapper, Skull Merchant (twice), Knight and Trickster got some big changes, while Twins are still in the same sad state they were 1 3/4 years ago. When they were to be the next killer after GF / Legion to get a rework.
It seems that they have either given up on Twins or just have them very low on their list of priorities. Blight is probably in a similar spot. He works good enough and the announcement to remove hug tech was more than a year ago (I think). After that, there weren't any news regarding him. Also, Hug Tech might be a symptom of a necessary quality of life feature for him. So it wouldn't be easy to fix this. Imagine Blight getting stuck on anything and everything that's even remotely close. It would make him borderline unplayable.
I expect some more Freddy nerfs. Haven't had those in a while. Maybe his teleport should no longer charge when no survivor is asleep. Or how about slowing him down to 0.8 m/s while he charges a snare and increase that time to 5 seconds? Oh and you can't cancel it once you started. Don't want you trying to mind game with this. I'm joking but given the long list of small nerfs Freddy has suffered, I wouldn't be surprised to see some more.
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Wraith is pretty good in that regard. He has some useful addons in all rarities with lots of potential for synergy and no single addon that is completely pointless.
Doctor isn't bad either but some of his addons are a bit overly complex. He also suffers the same issue as Wraith that he has the same addons over and over again in different rarities. And sometimes the brown is pretty much just as good as the green, because you're more focused on the secondary effect anyway. Or at least that was the case until WoO countered the Order addons (Cheep move, devs.) and not the other way around.
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Wraith. I always have the luck of him teleporting across the map to hit me in a dead zone. For some reason, whenever I get chased by a Wraith all the pallets on the map just disappear. Funnily enough, they come back when he's gone. 😂
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587669#Comment_3587669
I’m talking about perks that are the best now. Not perks that were really broken/OP or good once upon a time. To use your example, Laurie’s perks aren’t good right now. OoO isn’t good unless you SWF, DS sucks, and Sole Survivor encourages a style of gameplay people here really seem to dislike (playing self-preservingly since the benefits only come into play when you’re the final survivor alive in the trial). Some survivors have dropped after Meg with perks that are currently good (like Kate, another really old survivor, and Feng. Same thing.) but all of Meg’s perks are still among the best and very, very few other survivors can claim that. I can’t even think of one who bats 2/3 let alone 3/3.
That's kind of exactly my point though. You can't have any perks stronger than SB and Adrenaline because that is where we draw the line between balanced and broken. There have been a lot of useful perks since. But they aren't quite as strong, so people just go ahead and call them bad. This is a phenomenon that both sides are guilty of.
Take Surge for example. It was really slept on until 6.1.0 came and other regression perks were nerfed (Surge was also buffed, but that didn't make a huge difference). Just because there are better alternatives doesn't mean something is bad.
I'd say the fact that Meg's perks are still among the best is a sign of good balancing or at least a sign that they did something right. Because it shows, that they resisted any form of power creep so far. It is true though that both sides have their fair share of characters with bad perks. So, I can't say I'm all that surprised that there weren't many cases of characters with 3 good perks.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3584642#Comment_3584642
What gets me is that 6 years later she still has the best perks in the game. Every other survivor perk since has really failed to measure up.
That's just not true. Think back to Laurie. She had old OoO and DS, which were horribly broken. Or Ash with old Mettle of Man. Or Mikaela with Circle of Balance, which needed 3 nerfs because it was that broken. Or Gabriel with MfT.
There have been other survivors with good perks. Perks that were even better than Meg's and needed to be nerfed. But when you compare one survivor that has perks that are as strong as can be without being broken, then it's only natural that most others will look bad in comparison. They just hit the sweet spot with Meg's perks and the fact that all 3 of her perks are this good doesn't hurt either. They are the exact maximum amount of powerful without being broken or unfair.
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The game is not in such a terrible spot, let's be honest. Does DBD have issues? Of course. But the devs are working on keeping this game alive and so far they have succeeded. Find me a game nowadays that doesn't have any bugs. It's pretty much impossible to write more than 10 lines of code without the chance of something going awry. And DBD has more than 10 lines of code. I'm pretty certain about that.
The game's balance is also not quite so bad. There are outliers of course but mostly it's fine. It's an asymmetrical game and the devs have nowhere else to look to because DBD is fairly unique. It's not like your average FPS game, where you have a douzen different games with the same mechanics and can copy some of that. Still, the game has become a lot more fair in terms of balance.
You aren't completely wrong though about optimisation. That has been an issue for a long time and I wish the devs would focus a bit more on that part. A new chapter every 3 months is nice but not as much, when some of us can barely play the game as is.
Maps have never been BHVR's strength. Some of them look fantastique but are an absolute nightmare to play on. Eyrie of Crows is stunning but after the 10th match I would rather have a good game there. Same goes for almost all of the new maps. They have their trouble of hitting the sweet spot with all things fair. At least they are willing to make adjustments though, so against my better judgement I still believe they will fix the most problematic maps and make them more enjoyable overall.
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I wouldn't say he is the weakest anymore. Not when Freddy exists in his current form.
Regardless, Trapper is in a tough spot. All the buffs he has received certainly help but his real problem wasn't tackled at all. It doesn't matter, if you have all your traps or not, when they won't do anything and traps won't do anything when survivors can easily see them from a distance. Trapper used to be pretty nasty because he could place his traps in spots that would make them completely invisible. This naturally felt terrible to play against.
But now we have the exact opposite with most maps making your traps stick out like a sore thumb. I'm sure gonna catch a lot of survivors with a trap that could have a neon sign next to it, saying: "Definitely a safe spot right here. Not trapped at all. First one to step on this mark gets a free medkit." and would probably be more hidden than it is now. They know the issue but for some reason they keep making the same mistakes. They delete any and all grass in their map reworks.
It's not true, that he has no chase power at all. In fact, his might the strongest chase power, theoretically. Set up a trap and suddenly the safest of loops becomes a death trap. But this is not going to help him all that much when he still needs to catch up and deal with the next loop. If his power were to work outside of chase, then this would not be as much of an issue but here we are.
Trapper also isn't useless on indoor maps. I'd say that Midwich (for all the wrong reasons) and Hawkins are some of his best maps. Midwich allows him to lean into his nastiest play style (lockdown Trapper) more strongly and with the latest buffs to his kit, he can perform fairly well on it. Hawkins has some spaces where traps are quite hard to see and similar to Midwich there are some spots that you can trap to shut down a good part of the map, which forces survivors into hit or hit scenarios. It's more that maps like Ormond, The Game, Badham, Eyrie of Crows, Haddonfield, Lery's, RPD, all Coldwinds, Borgo and now even Mother's Dwelling and Temple of Purgation are quite bad for him. There is no way you will catch a survivor by surprise with your traps.
The devs said before, that they don't want to change Trapper too much (understandable as he is symbolic for DBD) but all of these buffs don't fix his issues. Because the issue isn't Trapper so much as the game that has changed around him. He is one of those killers, that suffer from the game's old age. Survivors have learned to look out for traps and to avoid common trap spots. With the lack of other spots to hide traps in, there really isn't much he can do, other than playing lockdown Trapper, which I think most of us will agree is neither fun nor healthy for the game.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587434#Comment_3587434
The drones don't mark people who are stationary or crouching. In order for a SM to "force" a survivor to get a clawtrap, they would need to chase them off a gen towards a drone several times til a clawtrap comes on. Even then, the clawtrap has a 45 second timer, so those addons which require active clawtraps arnt getting a whole lot of value.
As far as OC+shotgun speakers... Are you a goldfish? You need the ding sound to remember there's gonna be a skillcheck right away? This should only surprise you once. After that, it's a survivor skill issue if they keep failing a predictable skillcheck.
It's really not hard to run after a survivor for 10 seconds, apply a lock on stack and then go back to your 3 gen. Especially once you have a bit of extra speed, because that makes it pretty much impossible to maintain distance. 3 gens are naturally a favorable position for a killer because they can get rid of the resources and get easier hits in the process, while also applying pressure to all 4 survivors in that area.
SM only makes this worse. Much worse. Because with her, there are quite a few loops where she will just get a hit no matter what you do. That forces you to leave and heal, or leave prematurely every time she comes near you. In both cases you lose a lot of time, that you would need on the gen. A coordinated SWF can still break through, while most other groups just lose too much time due to a lack of communication.
If Team Eternal struggle with these skillchecks, then how do you expect an average DBD player to hit them? Call me a goldfish but I do not know the exact timing of OC skillchecks, though I do hit them pretty consistently when I can hear them. Even, if I know that a skill check will happen, it's not easy to hit it when I don't have a clue about the exact timing (which varies even with OC, as far as I know) and the timing needs to be very precise. I mean, try it yourself. If you can do it, then congrats. But I and a lot of other players aren't that good. Though we still play against SMs, who need to do very little to apply that effect.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587365#Comment_3587365
How? The power only picks up moving survivors. How is this any worse than a Legion or Plague who does this exact loadout?
You can easily force survivors into claw traps, which makes them broken. It doesn't take that long and worse still, she still has the Shotgun Speakers, which make OC such a nightmare.
Kind of funny, if you think about it. They nerfed Doc's synergy with it, because it would too hard to hit the OC skillcheck. But SM can still do it. And it's Doctor's own perk! There is an achievement locked behind him using that perk and yet he has no synergy with it! But SM, who has become notorious for using gen kick perks too well still has her synergy. Mind boggling.
What SM does now is to keep survivors broken with the claw traps, which forces survivors to pre run against her just like before. Applying claw traps has also become a lot easier, which allows her to keep her haste effect at pretty much all times. So she gets easy hits on top of that (especially when she sets up her drones in a loop to apply the hindered effect). Also, the problematic addons still exist.
At this point, I think she might be irredeemable. They reworked her twice already, she still has the same issues as before (incredibly boring to play as and against) and she is still unhealthy and I doubt they'll rework her again. This is more than just a failure.
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3586836#Comment_3586836
do those twigs that are standing by themselves still have hitboxes of like 5 square meters? they feel better but i have no idea about ones that are attached to tiles. poor demo and billy are affected by the most random and dumbest stuff.
hawkins isn't swamp or dead dawg for sure but not the worst imo. it's a dark map at least and i like the debris at doorways, traps don't stick out that bad on them.
They do, unfortunately. You'll still hit them when you can't see that they're there even with Shadowborn. Especially when it comes to the jungle gyms, TL walls, 4 lane walls, pretty much any walls with vines on them are terrible (with the exception of the pillars in main building, they're pretty much fine). The stones feel quite similar to how they used to but I will admit I got one hit there, that I honestly didn't expect.
When they changed the hitboxes I spent a fair bit of time experimenting and I found that you can move right through them and even swing your weapon (as long as you aim a little to the side) but as soon as a killer power comes into play, they seem to grow by approximately 2 shacks worth of size. The random bushes are just as terrible as before too, but at least we weren't led to believe they improved.
At least Trapper has one more map that actually allows his power to work in some capacity. I think Hawkins could use a few small changes and it will be perfectly fine. Not just for Trapper but also for some newer killers. Maybe they could change a few of the pallet loops too. You do not want to play against a Doctor on that map.
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If they nerf STBFL of all perks, that's when I lose my faith in their idea of balance. STBFL is fine as is (mostly because it's a perk that only weak killers use) and there are way worse things to tackle.
@SleepyLunatic said:
I am stupid rn what is nwth?
Probably Nowhere To Hide.
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Buffing more than 100 perks or nerfing 1 perk... Decisions, decisions.
Also, if you keep buffing everything to always be stronger than what came before, you don't achieve balance but power creep. Just because everything is broken doesn't mean it's fair.
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@EmpireCity830 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587055#Comment_3587055
Lightborn is Hill Billy perk not Wraith, Wraith is Shadowborn
You're right. Sorry. Don't know how I mixed them up. I'll change my post accordingly.
Thanks for telling me.
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There are 3 commonly accessible ways to counter flashlights.
1) Stare at a wall. You do that already, so that's good. It means you have gotten used to looking out for it. But it's also important to press yourself as close to the wall as you can. That way, the survivor has much less of an angle to blind you from. Unfortunately there are some situations where the game will do a funny and you still get blinded. I am not sure how exactly this is caused but for the most part flashlights work fine and you won't be blinded when you press yourself close to a wall.
2) Get rid of the flashlight. That doesn't mean you have to destroy it but it can help to check around corners or other possible hiding spots when you saw someone had a flashlight. Often enough, it will suffice to just chase after them for a bit, maybe get an easy hit let them make distance and then go back to the other survivor. They will not make it back in time to blind you.
There is an alternative way, to get a survivor out of their hiding spot, which is just walking and checking spots for a few seconds and when it looks like you're sure nobody else is around you go back to the survivor on the ground and just look down on them. You don't pick them up, you just look down. Because survivors do not have an infinite amount of time to get a flashlight save, they will try to get into position early on. This leads to them coming out of their hiding spot when you stand there and pretend to pick up. Now you just follow the same steps from above and you should be fine.
3) If nothing else helps, there is still Lightborn (teachable perk of the Hillbilly). Lightborn is not a super good perk and I wouldn't recommend it unless there are at least 3 flashlights in your lobby but it does the job perfectly fine and chances are that a group with this many flashlights will do everything for a few flashlight saves. If you pretend like you just countered the flashlights with the strategies above, it will be really hard to tell and they'll keep trying that, wasting so much time that you can still win.
Also, when someone shines a flashlight on you, always make sure to look down (as well as it's not happening on a staircase). For some reason it is easier to blind a killer that looks at a survivor from an angle or up in the sky. But if you look all the way down, you can see from where the light is coming from, so you won't lose them, while not being vulnerable to the blind.
Hope this helps. See you in the fog.