VantablackPharaoh91
VantablackPharaoh91
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@RenoPro said:
I'm a survivor main and slugging is not a problem for me, in normal match basically never happen or like what 1 on 15? Not a problem.
I play both sides pretty equal and I'd say that's about in line with my experience, too.
Slugging this way does NOT happen near as frequently as some people think it does; this is a non-issue.
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You can always be my fren in 2v8 or 1v4 but I demand the occasional murder selfie. If you're okay with that yeah, you can be my fren. Boop the Ghostie pls?
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They tried basekit unbreakable in a PTB. Survivors abused it. Blame people abusing stuff for why we don't have this.
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I don't find pretty much any Killer perk that big a deal to go against because I don't care whether I escape or not.
I really do not like Knockout though because of the way some Killers tend to use it.
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What Killers do you currently enjoy playing? What games and playstyles do you like? That can help inform you. For me, I love stealth games, so I gravitated to stealth Killers first. I've been a proud, happy Ghostface Main for almost two years counting. :)
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- No word on this but I really hope so!
- This seems likely for balance reasons, they will probably also adjust older added Killers.
- This is a complex question. We don't know yet for sure, but it's very possible that some licensed Killers may already have AI written for them in case of disconnects, judging by how quickly bots for Huntress, Nurse, Wraith, and Billy were introduced after we previously ONLY knew about Trapper having a bot. In fact, pretty much any trapping Killer could reuse the code for Trapper, any stealth Killer the code for Wraith, any ranged the code for Huntress, etc. We also know that bot AI for Survivors at least appears to be trained on real data from real rounds, so it's likely Killer bot AI is the same. Though some Killers seem to have unique issues that require work from the ground up, so they may take longer… but if there is AI in the works for licensed Killers, this would indicate that these Killers would definitely be added to 2v8, so never say never! Besides, people would riot if we couldn't have Ghostface and Myers in 2v8, they're some of the most requested licensed adds.
- Doubtful, and no I do not think it would combat queue times at all. Plus do you really want to be hit by double buffed Plagues, Legions, Wraiths, or Huntresses? I don't…
- It's likely this mode will, unfortunately, become permanent because it's well loved, RIP queue times. But if it continues to have issues, then BHVR may consider making it a returning feature instead, which I personally believe would be much healthier for the game.
- They tested this, people hated it, so probably not.
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For me it's a timing and Killer familiarity thing. I know about how far my Killer goes when I lunge, and how far I go when I swing. This comes from practice, and there's a bit of gut instinct there too. I can't really give a definitive answer because it's just a practice, timing, and muscle memory knowledge thing. But the more you practice the better you get, and the more you realize how far each distance "feels" in a sense.
And yes, I do need to readjust every time I switch to a smaller or taller Killer, my baseline is Ghostface.
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There's a really simple fix to this if they wanna keep the Mori system as a basekit option: Allow the Killer one free Mori on anyone who is on Death Hook. That is, make the GREEN Mori basekit, not Cypress. Then rework all Moris to add an additional Mori to the basekit per offering - Yellow adds one (so 2 can die this way), Green adds two (three moris total), Iri adds three (everyone can be Mori'd). This would remove this scenario entirely.
Now, this might increase tunnelling for Moris, but since we have many perks that help against tunnelling this should be a non-issue. If it's really a problem, have this only activate on the last two Survivors remaining in the trial, and if there have been no gens progressed, then have the Mori be instant the second that one of the two is downed. This means ratting as a 2v1 is discouraged AND it means progressing the game.Allowing the Killer the flexibility to just Mori one person they want who is on death hook means less slugging for a 4k, less 2v1 situations, etc. The only downside is a possible increase in tunnelling but like I said - we have things to deal with tunnelling. We don't have something to deal with these 2v1 hostage situations.
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This is just a straight buff to people who want to grief in 2v1 scenarios with no downsides. No.
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@TieBreaker said:
We don't even know what the change is going to be. They might just add a short cooldown to the perk, so it's not providing non-stop aura reading. There's no point in mourning something that isn't even dead yet.
This.
For all we know they could actually BUFF it, or change it to do something else but with the same guaranteed aura effect. The strength is in aura reading, not in the fact it works on items. And remember, BHVR wants a chase meta, not a gen meta. Anything that aids tracking by necessity aids chase, getting to chase, etc. -
Chaos Shuffle should be the permanent mode, not 2v8. At least not yet, because 2v8 was half baked and really needs more time to percolate before it's EVER added permanently. Ideally, I want both. :) Chaos Shuffle right now and 2v8 in, gosh, IDK… a year or so, so that every Killer, map, and more classes can be added with more tweaks? And in between then and now, some occasional 2v8 weeks as a rotating mode, just to test new things and make it the best it can be.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3780762#Comment_3780762
I've spoken to killer mains who post their kill rate stats around 75% and they still claim the game isn't ridiculously killer sided.
It's not. Maybe you just get very strong KIller players because you are very good, or they get very weak Survivors for some reason, or they are in the upper echelons of players. You cannot judge the game being "sided" or not by the best of the best. You need to judge by the average… and the average player both sides is pretty mediocre.
Now there's nothing wrong with BEING mediocre, being up too high or too low in skill generally feels bad anyway. It's bad to be in high MMR too much because now you might have to always hardcore sweat, whereas it's bad to be in low MMR too much because now you're literally stomping babies. You want to be in the right range for you.
And as it turns out, the game is pretty balanced at 60/40 when you're at the right range for you. If you're better than this, you're pretty damn good. But very few people outside of the babiest baby pool MMR are worse than this, and that's a good thing, because that is where all Killers and all Survivor perks work best. That IS peak DBD operating at its very best, anything other than that is an outlier we shouldn't be balancing around, and I'm confused why you seem to think BHVR doesn't wanna balance around the normal average player who is mediocre.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781007#Comment_3781007
How are Wesley and Trickster in need of reworks??
Trickster's rework feels bad to play against and most Trickster Mains I know do not like his changes at all.
Wesker is a pile of glitches people only accept because we call them "techs", he's hands down the most "broken" (literally) Killer in the game because every other thing he does breaks something or is itself a glitchy mess. If the only reason your Killer is strong is due to abuse of glitches disguised as "techs" then maybe the Killer should be looked at. Blight got slaughtered for less.
Oh, and thank you for saying I'm delightful and respectful, @hermitkermit. Too bad Reddit and the official DBD Discord server didn't think the same of me. -
They didn't @MechWarrior3, but someone else sure did.
It's not okay to have situations that you CANNOT avoid period in the game because of developer oversights or glitches. That should simply not exist.
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Please.
I just wanna be able to know I am on track, it helps me keep track of who I need to hook yet for perks like Grim Embrace.
People who want to tunnel will already tunnel. That isn't an excuse for a QoL feature to not happen.
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Ashes are funny. :)
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@totallynotamegmain said:
this is why I can’t wait for 2v8 to return; no perks means no meta builds on either side 😁
But people figured out the meta there in week 2 of 2v8… ._.
This game is never gonna be free of meta. The only solution is to hard nerf chase and gen perks until other perks become more viable.
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@hermitkermit said:
I love little info graphics like these. Personally I am one of the few that don’t really believe in “killer tiers”. As I believe that any killer has the potential to be very deadly if enough time is dedicated to them. And statistics support this belief which is part of the reason I have it. I don’t believe BHVR comes out with any killer and tries to make them “b tier or d tier etc.” I think different killers are good at different things and those things can be specific to individual player play styles/preferences. All that to say that this makes me smile for the trapper. <3 sorry he got some DCs though. Keep trapping on
I'm exactly like you, I don't believe in Killer Tierlists. I believe ANY Killer can be very good, or very bad. It depends on the player.
When I say "weak Killers", I mean "Killers that do not have a ton of power in their kit, so winning consistently requires more overall skill and cleverness as well as knowing that Killer REALLY well." Myers is a weak Killer not because he's BAD, but because he requires knowing what does and does not work, being flexible, and all the little ins and outs of what he can and cannot do with various addons. Winning consistently with Myers means you need to put in a lot more effort than the average Killer player to do well.
When I say "strong Killers", I mean "Killers that have lots of stuff in their kit that can be extremely powerful when mastered." Pinhead is a strong Killer not because he's really really good, but because once he is mastered he can create situations that are very difficult for all but an experienced SWF to get out of, and doing so requires significant effort to get to that point consistently. Pinhead already has stuff in his kit that makes him good against the average Survivor, but go a bit further and you become very strong, to the point you can even become highly competitive with him and do well.
When I say "overpowered" or "underpowered", I mean those Killers that either do something that breaks the game, or fundamentally can't keep up with the game in its current state at all. Nurse is an overpowered Killer because for the effort you put in, she is much too strong and her kit is so basic is is really simple to learn, plus being good at her gives more value than the average Killer. She breaks looping, she just breaks looping. That's overpowered. She is in bad need of tweaks to be made more fair, but that doesn't mean she cannot lose. Meanwhile Freddy is an underpowered Killer in that he does many things, but none of them overly well and none of them seem to be as effective - he antiloops poorly, he teleports poorly, he stealths poorly, and he slows down the game poorly. He is in bad need of tweaks to be fully effective, but that doesn't mean he can't win.
If I had to tierlist Killers, I would do them like this, in order (left to right) of most to least need of any changes to make them more balanced:
Wesker is plagued by glitches and could stand to have some stuff made partial basekit. He needs looking at. Skull Merchant's kit is bloated and needs a change badly. Trickster's changes are not fun for Trickster Main and feel bad for Survivor Mains, he needs to be given another look. I am happy to explain anyone else on this list.
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It's gonna be a massive slaughter @Ayodam… :/ Survivors will need to adapt FAST.
I love 2v8 bit this version of it is extremely, deeply problematic and flawed. I want it back, but NOT until it goes through some serious fixes and tweaking, not until it adds more maps killers and classes, not until we can pip in it, and not until it's completely ready to stand on its own two feet. It clearly has the desire for it and the playerbase for it, but it just isn't there yet and badly needs a lot more work and testing before it EVER comes back or goes permanent.I honestly would not mind seeing 1v4 turned into a ranked mode, we had the rotating modifier queue, AND we had 2v8 for quickplay. That means three different experiences to shift between so nobody ever feels like they HAVE to sweat. Then repurpose grades to ONLY be important or used in ranked mode. Because there's certain Killers I would prefer to keep in the chill zone in an unranked less MMR important setting where I do not feel pressured to win so hard (either to practice someone new, to vibe, or to just not have to worry about doing so well I run into sweats after five wins), and certain Killers I wanna test my skills and get better with (so a ranked mode is perfect for that). The same is true of Survivor - I am a very competitive minded SWF-running Survivor, but sometimes that is too much and I really just want a space I can chill out a bit, where MMR isn't as important and I don't feel pressured to win so hard. Having multiple modes is good for that, as long as I can still gain pips or BP in both, and still feel like I am having a goal accomplished in both.
I just want the option of how hard to make the game for myself. Because I don't always wanna have to time when the best time to not have sweats is, or run into a super SWF when I'm trying to learn Doctor, or run into a hardcore sweaty Nurse when I'm just trying to Adept Yui. And I think most people want that. Most people WANT a casual mode and a ranked mode and they want BOTH to give us something for doing it so everyone feels like they're able to get something at every level of play. It baffles me BHVR has not gotten us that yet. This game could cater to so many people who love horror, casual and comp and heavy "I gotta win" and "I just wanna derp with my friends" alike. There's space for everyone in this community and we all just wanna play the game in the big horror playground, so it's strange BHVR hasn't made it yet.
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I'm not gonna continue this repeated attempt to bait me into an argument even after the Mods stepped in asking for it to stop, because I can see that this is EXACTLY what is happening here.
The entire thread disagrees with the people saying this change is not needed. Like it or not guys, the scratch mark change is coming. It was much needed, it is a bug fix, it was intended, the Devs stepped in to agree it was intended. Those disagreeing are simply incorrect this is not necessary, but are certainly allowed to feel that way.
Looks like it's time to adapt and change our playstyles! I certainly will be, especially since Distortion is also likely to be nerfed soon. That means I need to get better and change how I play, and everyone else should too. We can all better deal with the coming MUCH NEEDED scratch mark changes that WILL be in the game by simply stealthing more frequently, using lockers, or crouching/walking. If you would also like to hide scratch marks, you can also run:
- Lightweight
- Lightfooted
- Babysitter
- Boon: Shadow Step
- Dance With Me
- Deception
- Distortion (yes even with its changes)
- Diversion
- Low Profile
- Lucky Break
- Parental Guidance
- Poised
- Self-Preservation
- Teamwork: Collective Stealth
In addition if you want to be more aware of your scratch marks to be stealthy, you can run:
- Fixated
- Inner Focus
And if you want to be stealthy, you can also run Urban Evasion and aura reading perks to help you avoid the Killer without leaving scratch marks at all by crouching or walking.
As you can see, there are many solutions to this issue, so having brighter scratch marks is a non-issue. Can't wait until they come to the game! Great change, Devs, it was much needed. :)
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@Toaster427 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3780277#Comment_3780277
You're cherry picking what the community is asking for and applying it out of context.
The community is asking for chases in terms of killer powers, I.E killers that have an EZ "I win" button they can press that completely shuts down a loop, which is beyond annoying and kills chases in the game, people want less of that.
Nobody is asking for killers to easily find survivors whenever they want, just like nobody is asking for for something like permanent auras being shown to the killer to "promote chase", that's just ridiculous.
You should listening to the people who are actually asking for things instead of just using it to missquote people for your own agenda.
How am I cherry-picking or applying anything out of context? I literally quoted you, the context is right there for all to see. Plus, I am not really saying anything that others here haven't said already, and the fact that people seem to be agreeing with me here and not you seems to indicate that no, I am describing exactly what the community wants. More chase doesn't mean "a different Killer power" as that isn't even on the table for discussion here; "more chase" means "more chase" means "getting to chases quicker" which is what the Devs have been steadily doing for months now - giving us ways to get to chase faster, because chase is chase and chases are fun.
Now, IDK how much Killer you play, but only three Killers actually have an "EZ I win" button: Nurse, Blight, and Billy who is getting changes according to the roadmap. And all of them still have counterplay. Everyone else in the roster requires being better at mindgames than Survivor or knowing how to actually apply their power. Even Artist whose power is entirely about shutting down loops requires actual skill and effort to do that properly. I have no agenda, but when you say things like "Killers with an EZ I Win button", you show that YOU certainly do have one - making the game harder for Killers for no reason so it's easier for Survivors to escape. I don't see how just slightly making scratch marks a little brighter suddenly makes it so much harder for you to escape, if you're any good at Survivor this really shouldn't matter at all. In fact you should be welcoming it so you have more chances to express your skill, it's nonsense to be against it in that sense.
You can disagree all you want with what I have said here, but the Devs have come in and stated why this change is happening. They clearly agree with everyone here saying the change is fine, so therefore the change is fine and just something else you'll have to get used to by maybe running different perks or changing your playstyle. I'm not even sure why you're after me. Is it because I quoted you? Is it because I have a Killer profile picture? If I had say, Leon Kennedy as my profile picture would you read my comments more favorably? Do you think I play zero Survivor?
The point is, if you want to be stealthy play stealthy. That means not leaving scratch marks. Killer players are allowed to have things in the game that are anti-frustration features too, and since we just got an Iron Will buff we kinda need something to compensate for the loss of that tracking info especially because we have a new Killer that works like Spirit in part and needs that info. Why is it okay for Survivors to have all this info, but not Killers?
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@Paternalpark said:
So the red blood stain from the killer is practically none existent these days due to maps being brighter, as was stated.
Can we make the red stain brighter so the survivor role has the equivalent buff?
Scratch marks tracks survivors, red blood stain tracks killers.
I
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3780114#Comment_3780114
This has been the most constructive comment so far, thanks.
Survivors do not need to track the Killer the same way that Killers need to track Survivors, so the Red Stain doesn't need to be brighter at all. In fact I don't think most people have any issue with ever noticing the Red Stain; if it becomes an issue the Devs can always change it but it currently seems to be bright enough in most maps. We also have many tools to read where Killers are besides the Red Stain, even stealth Killers. Brightening it wouldn't do anything concrete. Meanwhile in almost every map, scratch marks are kinda hard to see and definitely not as bright as the Red Stain itself is, so yes. They need to be changed, but the Red Stain doesn't right now. Not every change for one side needs an equivalent buff for the other.
Also I think you misconstrued what CoffeeCrashing was saying. They weren't saying that it was a bad thing that the old Scratch Marks stuck out on the original maps, they're saying that was a GOOD thing. The initial reason they were not made brighter sooner is BECAUSE those maps were washed out so they didn't need to. Now that every map is much brighter due to the updated graphics, the Devs are changing the scratch marks to match. Scratch marks are SUPPOSED to be bright, obvious, and easy to track. And since perks like Iron Will recently got buffed, Killers kind of need something to be able to track if they can't track by sound, right? As Survivor you don't wanna just hide and do gens, you love being chased, right? At least I do when I am Survivor.
Killer is not supposed to be frustratingly difficult because of unintended glitches or outdated mechanics any more than Survivor is. I wish you understood that, because It seems from your post history you don't play a lot of Killer. Now, I don't want to assume you're only a Survivor Main, but you sure seem to post some very unbalanced, biased, and unclear takes. I would suggest running Predator for a bit as Killer and then taking it off to see just how bad the scratch marks currently can get, so you can appreciate just why this change is sorely needed.
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You are correct, I did mean Undone. My bad. :)
My point still stands however.
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You didn't read what I said. It's not "a lame excuse", it's just the truth.
The issue with this is the same as for Unforeseen. It doesn't affect Survivors that are confident and know what they are doing because they know how to handle these sorts of skillcheck alterations. New Survivors do not.
Therefore the change hits newcomers harder and that by design is a bad idea. This wouldn't solve the issue you want it to solve and would only make it harder for new players.
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I really do not want people to dodge me as Survivor because I play Nea and her innate ability is Urban Evasion, so they think I am gonna rat all round. I really do not wanna load into a Lobby as Killer of four Jeffs who all innately have Distortion thus rendering my All-Seeing Stalker Aura Reading Ghostface useless. It would literally strip the personality and fun and randomness from the game. It cannot and does not work.
Also Blast Mine, frankly, is really annoying to be hit by multiple times just like any other stun perk. If I saw a lobby full of Jills and her innate ability was Blast Mine I would dodge it. I would legit dodge every single Jill-having lobby, every single time.
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They tried this. The result was the much hated first take on the finisher Mori and Basekit Unbreakable system.
SWFs abused it. That's why we cannot have this. Because people can and will abuse it. This hits prolonged downs meant to pressure, and unfairly so. It just isn't a good idea because it takes away an intended part of the Killer toolkit and replaces it with a new tool that the worst kind of player can use simply to grief.We do need a solution to actual toxic four man slugging bleedouts, but this is not it.
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I agree, 150% Haste on Survivor period is too much. I say no higher than 125% Haste; 140% on Killer.
Staying in the gate without doing anything like healing, waving, scouting, etc should be punished with being Exposed and full Aura reveal you can't hide from with Distortion. Teabagging should be punished with inability to leave the round, measured as at least two rapid crouches or more in quick succession. Bam that is IT, there is no reason for you to EVER do this except grief.
New Killer Perk: Last Laugh
Whenever a Survivor lingers in the Exit gate or camps the Hatch for 20/15/10 seconds, this perk activates. While active, Survivors may not open the Hatch, activate a Gate, or leave through an opened gate by any means for the next 60 seconds. Additional Survivors in the exit gate strengthen the effect by 10 seconds for a maximum of 100 seconds. While active, no Survivor that lingered in the gate or is not running/healing/walking for at least 5 seconds beforehand is able to leave the Trial until the the timer expires. Survivors are also Exposed and Downed Survivors crawl 100% slower during this time. If a Survivor should crouch more than 4/3/2 times in rapid succession, they will be instantly grabbed by the Entity and teleported to the furthest hook from any Exit Gate. -
So basekit Huntress' Lullaby that only hits new players harder? I don't think so.
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I think you need to explain what you mean before the Devs or anyone else can answer any part of this question. What "PC Exploit Cheats" are you talking about?
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This really isn't lore accurate, why would the Entity save or heal Survivors? There's also several flaws with this:
- Saved by the Entity: There is no reason to "save" someone who is dying in 2 minutes due to endgame collapse. They lost. You lost. It sucks to be slugged but you're dead in 2 minutes, just wait the 2 minutes. Nobody seems to have issues waiting in the exit gate for 2 minutes so why is being slugged for 2 minutes while you wait for collapse such a big ask? This tool can also be abused by SWFs who force a four man slug after opening a gate to get a free 4 man out, or to force the Killer to down and kick the hatch SOLELY so they don't get an adept they may have been working for. Remember how everyone always does locker standoffs with Tombstone Myers when they try to get the achievement? Now imagine that times 1000. We shouldn't be rewarding bad behavior or adding new griefing techniques, I don't care how much you or anyone else hates being four man slugged or slugged at all. Absolutely should never be added, being slugged in the endgame should not be a get out of death free card for the Survivor. You lost.
- Healed by the Entity: 120 seconds is way the hell too much and I think you know it's way too much. You don't need "120 seconds for the Killer to find the other Survivor and hook them" nor do we need to put a bunch of stress on a Killer JUST trying to go for a 4k. Killers are ALLOWED to 4k. 30 seconds max, you shouldn't need more than that if you're actually being slugged like this because the Killer's probably looking for the other person. And what happens if the Killer gets looped by someone, someone who maybe hacked or someone who has on perks their KIller cannot counter? So both Survivors just get to go free after 120 seconds simply because the Killer has trouble catching one? Just because your friend runs the Killer for 120 seconds, you now get to have a free pass out to get the hatch or the door for doing nothing but lie there? What sense does that make? That doesn't sound very fun or fair for M1 Killers or Killers who happen to slug well. And again, this should not be a thing in this form at all, because it ONCE AGAIN can be used to grief by denying Killer adepts for the most petty reasons. Just make it a 2 minute bleedout, we don't NEED all this. Nobody seems to care if they have to wait 2 minutes at the gate so clearly, 2 minutes of bleedout is a-okay.
I need you to realize that not every single Killer in this game is Billy, Blight, or Nurse who would NEED a change like this. Most Killers would be hit by these way too hard even if they DIDN'T slug for the 4k, simply for wanting a friggin' 4k. Both of these are needless Survivor buffs to an issue that can simply be fixed with literally one thing: making the bleedout timer 2 minutes instead of four since people are fine with that wait time. Or, we could add a bleedout button after 2 minutes. There is utterly zero reason to buff Survivors in the endgame because of a loss - unless you also think we need a last minute catchup mechanic for Killers who haven't got a kill by endgame time, which is the only way anyone let alone the Devs could ever remotely consider something like this fair.
Until then, put on Unbreakable, Adrenaline, or Plot Twist and wait until the Devs come up with a solution that is fair to both sides and isn't exploitable by bad actors.
Because Killers are allowed to win the game and slugging is an intended part of the game.
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The Devs can still see the match and who the players were, pulling it up based on your ID. They then can find the match and go from there.
Anonymous Mode doesn't protect cheaters. However, you need to have video proof and send an email. If you suspect cheating you should have recording software ready, clipping software, something. Even consoles these days can clip. You can also still report the cheat through ingame I believe.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3780487#Comment_3780487
The match is already a draw or won by Killers in a 2v1. This just ends the match in a timely manner. One of the Survivors can still juice on one side of the map while the other Surv opens the gate on the other, for them both to escape. Heck, it is even more possible if people quit on hook, because there would be more pallets to use. I mean it isn't like I gave the Killer instadowns too.
According to the devs and to the game, the match is not over until all Survivors are dead or out of the gates/hatch. Period.
There is no other criteria for what the end of a match is, nor should there be.
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@BugReporterOnly said:
It can't be permanent in this state. Also if killer queues are long I'd like to see this as an event node. Maybe Bloodhunt 2v8 a week before each chapter release even mid chapter releases but a ton of things need to be worked on before this can be permanent. One is they need to not use the same assets on the bigger maps in diffrent ways. I'd like them to use the base map but design the rest to be different for 2v8. I'd also like to see something done about how killers can't get to the gates to try and pressure them because there is 3 and they are spread out a lot.
Oh my Entity a Bloodhunt 2v8 with 400% bonus both sides would be friggin' amazing. :D
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@MrMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779695#Comment_3779695
Nurse could get some aura blindness when charging blink, it's pretty much a free hit to teleport after survivors that are being aura read as her.
Also, they could nerf Blights addons further. Even after all this time, people are still running Iri Tag for 10% more speed and Blighted Rat for +3% per rush. Just make it 5% on iri tag, 2% on rat and 1.5% on crow. Idk. Tone it all down. Billy is seemingly about to get some nerfs.
It's true what you say, Lethal is only a problem on these killers because they have the mobility to take advantage of the 11s duration.
I agree. Only an issue on these two Killers. I say Blindness during a Blink and maybe even blindness during a rush would be perfect changes to make these two more fair, and break the synergy Lethal has for them.
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Literally why? All it does is give a strong start to a game, as well as enhance aura read by just a couple seconds. It's somewhat useless on its own, and only helps with aura perks. It doesn't counter aura perks or stealth perks on Survivors at all. In fact Distortion counters it pretty damn hard. Lethal is fine.
Distortion deserves a nerf. It counters 50+ Killer powers, addons, and perks in a way that there is NO equivalent to on Killer side. It's overtuned, it ruins the chase-forward nature of the game, and it gives SWFs way too much info on what Killers could be running. It's too often used to rat and throw games for SoloQers and it unfairly rewards not helping the team. As much as it pains me to say because I love using Distortion, it has to change.
Compare this to Lethal which aids chase for Killers, starts the game getting on its feet, doesn't counter any Survivor perks at all, is on;y used to support aura read builds, and overall is much more useful on certain Killers or on very new Killers still learning. If anything, Lethal Pursuer is like a Killer's version of WoO - it helps baby Killers a lot, but is still useful for experienced Killers. If WoO is not a problem, and i feel like you probably would agree WoO is not a problem and needs no nerf, then Lethal doesn't need one, either.
We really do not need compensation nerfs to perks you personally do not like on the other side whenever a much deserved overtuned perk, Killer, addon, or item gets a nerf. Asking for one is pure entitlement, and shows your bias.
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It isn't ready yet and needs a loooooong time on the cooker before it's even ready for its next iteration. It needs to go away for the game's own good so they can tweak it based on feedback, then bring it back better.
In this form, it is half baked and undercooked. Please make it leave SOONER so they can start working on making it better SOONER, with queue times like they are they absolutely should never have extended it at all.
However, I am very excited to see how much better it will be when it does return.
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Why? Anonymous mode exists. That already does this.
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I do not want this mode back in this state. I do not want it back at all until:
- Queue time related issues are fixed
- They have more than 5 Killers
- There are more than 4 classes
- There are more than 4 maps
- Survivors have to do 10 gens not 8
- The mode is slightly more balanced both for classes and Killers
- It is harder to predict where cages will spawn to prevent running right to them
- Certain Killers are not overly OP busted in it, so two people can't combo the strongest Killers and only those every round
- And you cap each class at two or three per 8 people, so eight people can't combo the strongest two classes and only those every round
Fix most of if not all of these, and I will gladly welcome 2v8 come back as a permanent mode. Until then, it needs to remain a rotating mode coming back every so often in a permanent rotating mode queue alongside Chaos Shuffle and any other modes, modifiers, and events.
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I mean… now the people who run SWF know what it feels like when a SWF on comms does this to Killer. Annoying, right?
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@LapisInfernalis said:
To all survivors: Let us all use Object of Obsession, take an item with us, drop it next to the Gen we work on and get a free 6% speed boost.
That doesn't work. Only one person can be the Obsession at a time.
And Dying Light counters that, and soon so will Wretched Fate. -
This perk doesn't need a nerf.
What it does need is to show Survs the aura of the dropped item in white. That's it. That is ALL it needs.
It's not that strong a perk, let Killers have things guys. Would you really rather have MORE gen control? What is with the complaining about aura read these days? Why do we have to cry "nerf" for every single perk Killers have? Not every single Killer is Blight and Nurse.
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WoO is not nearly anywhere close to old DH, MFT, or any of these meta perks. It's objectively an OK balanced perk with no real issues whatsoever.
However…
It does breed very bad Survivor habits. People who run it truly do fall apart when it fails. We saw this effect most prominently in Chaos Shuffle and Lights Out to some degree. I have seen WoO-pilled Survivors DC because I used braincells to counter it. I have seen WoO-pilled Survivors DC because I used PERKS to counter it. It is 100% overused, and 100% probably needs looking at for the sole reason that it can boost bad Survs to a place they cannot handle AND it gives good Survs a bit too much info.
Give it a time limit. That's all it needs. Reveal auras of all available pallets and vaults for 10 seconds, then it goes on cooldown for 30 seconds. Or, Reveal Auras of all available pallets and vaults ONLY within about 16-20 meters of that Survivor. It shouldn't be so brainless braindead easy to use, but it also needs to be there to help teach newer Survivors how to loop. Why not have it work ONLY on vaults and have another perk do it for pallets?
Or why not make it a perk that shows everyone else the auras of vaults and pallets when you're near them instead of just you for a bit, then give it a time limit - 10 second reveal, 30 second cooldown? or make it a perk that recharges but you need to be in chase. There has to be something more interesting that we can do with WoO, Killers don't get permanent free easy aura reveal on everything so why should Survivors? it's clear "but it costs a perkslot" isn't enough of a drawback if the perk is this overused, and in fact I believe WoO overuse is part of why maps keep becoming smaller and losing more and more vaults and pallets. Because WoO is too strong in pallet and vault dense maps.
No perk should ever be a perk that you absolutely MUST RUN to do well as Survivor or Killer, and in light of how it gives more info for old hands than new Survs as intended? I think it needs looking at. Just something very light. Because it really does promote repetitive, boring, braindead gameplay that feels bad to play against. You just aren't intended to ALWAYS know where EVERY SINGLE vault and pallet are all the time forever, that defeats the point of resource management and defeats the thrill of trying to run a Killer. You're not supposed to know when and where the baby Meg threw a pallet, if God pallet is gone already, etc. Plus we have a few other perks that show pallet and vault auras, and changing WoO in this way would allow for a lot more team aura of vault and pallet related perks, opening up more playstyles around these tiles like say… Any Means or Chem Trap do.
We have visual cues besides WoO to tell us where pallets and vaults are just as Killers have crows and scratch marks to tell us where Survivors are. Do we really need WoO to be THIS useful? Do we really, truly need a perk intended for new Survivors to learn loops to be so useful that SWFs can slap it on a chase build and instantly tell everyone in comms where stuff is?
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Yes it did… and it was trash then, too. It would be trash now.
Punishing the player for things that were out of their control, having a singular bad round, or otherwise not streaking win after win after win (which isn't even POSSIBLE fully without serious luck in this game) is terrible game design, and only encourages extreme sweat. It wasn't okay and wasn't fair.
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@ChainsLogic said:
I must say, as someone who likes both sides, and plays them pretty equally, that I can't relate to the hypocrisy of many dbd players. Simply put, being a killer or a survivor main makes one highly biased, so their input on balance shouldn't be taken too seriously most of the time. That said, I respect the willingness to look beyond your biases.
I read this in the Pinhead voice because of your profile pic.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779858#Comment_3779858
I love it when players have empathy and respect for the other side. Moments like that has what kept me into Dbd for all these years.
"But farming isn't in the spirit of the game!" - some people
OK. Neither is being a hyper sweatlord. Being nice and respectful, even farming, has a place in DBD. Let people play how they want. -
You do realize why they do that, right?
It's because if you give someone the tools to take an inch, they will instead take a mile. We're talking your four gen slowdown Killers and SWFs all running genrush builds here.
THAT is why the changes are small tweaks or small buffs. So as not to create horrid imbalance that breaks the game the way CoBRuption or MFT did. -
I agree suicide on hook should be addressed. Maybe make it so Survivors cannot attempt to self-unhook without Slippery Meat, and they can't unhook themselves at all unless they have Wicked or Deliverance? I don't see why we need self-unhook attempts anymore anyway, especially if THIS is how they're being used. If they really want out force hem to stand their boring selves under the hook and show the team what kind of player they really are.
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Killers are getting much needed changes to QoL or much needed buffs. I think the Survivor community is having trouble adapting. I think a lot of Survivors also got very complacent. Some began at a point where there really wasn't as much threat to Survivor so they never had to adapt. Now they have to.
It's going to take time. It may take years. It took Killers years to adapt to how Survivor-sided the game was, and now that it's properly a bit more Killer sided (in order to make it truly SURVIVAL Horror as intended) some Survivor players do not like it. Fact is… Survivors aren't intended to all escape easily OR be able to not be challenged. Survivor is supposed to be much harder. And some people don't like that, I think."Yes, it hurts. Growth often does." - The Singularity
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Adjust the Reveal jank. Make it based on actual character line of sight.
Only fix he needs. Make Reveals take longer if you can't do that.
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Can we do something about people doing stuff like this already? It's griefing. It's literally just a form of griefing and it doesn't belong in the game.