Thusly_Boned
Thusly_Boned
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Ace. I hate his dumb smirking goober face.
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First off, regarding bias on the board, things always seem biased one way when one's perspective is from the opposite end of the bias spectrum. Not to sound gatekeeper-y, but unless you play at something at least approximating a 50/50 split, your opinion on game balance is almost irrelevant.
As for the topic, of course there's a issues with survivor, especially solo queue. I play exclusively solo when playing survivor, and I play a lot of survivor. And some days it feels really bad, man. Losses are a lot less fun when you're on your own, and not at least deriving some fun from goofing with friends.
But more than anything, DBD is an engine of imbalance, one that will always "correct" to imbalance when balancing is attempted (much like when one thing is fixed another will break due to the spaghetti code this game is built on). There's an ebb and flow, and the only sure thing is that everyone will have a legit grievance about game balance at any time.
For survivor, things will never be balanced so long as some people play with friends and others play solo. We're eight years into this, and if it could have been done, it would have been done. That said, I feel better about the survivor experience now than I did a year ago.
But anyone waiting for it to be fairly balanced is going to be waiting forever.
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I personally have very narrow definitions for both of these:
Gen-rushing - coming loaded for bear with perks/items that increase gen repair speed and working on them almost to the exclusion of all else. Even then I barely think it's a thing; a term born from some killer players not accepting the in most games a couple gens are going to go really early and that's normal.
Tunneling (everyone's favorite) - Hooking a survivor and then pursuing and re-hooking that survivor until they are dead, to the exclusion of all else. That last part is the key here - they have to actively ignore all the other survs and objectives (other than just smacking someone trying to draw them off) for me to consider it a legit tunnel (you know, like having tunnel vision). The minute the killer starts actively chasing another surv, it's not a tunnel.
And it absolutely has to be three consecutive hooks. If any other surv was hooked in between any of the times you were hooked, you weren't tunneled.
Also, it has to be early in the match, tunneling later in a match to try and salvage it doesn't count. Like the killer came into the match with the full intention of just removing the first surv they find as quickly as possible.
To many people interpret being hooked many times in a short period as being tunneled, but some killer will make you feel like they are constantly on you even while making your teammates feel the same way.
And people like to say that being tunneled is a skill issue (to the degree that actual skill has anything to do with anything in this game, which is not freaking much, but I digress), but the reason a tunnel as I define it feels so bad is that unless the killer is a literal baby potato, you never really have a chance as the surv in that situation. They might throw the game doing it, but they're going to kill you.
Regardless of how "good" you are, if you go into a 100 matches with a killer determined to kill you specifically and will pursue it at all cost, you're dying 95 times, at least. They might lose half those games, but tunneling is almost always effective in eliminating the tunneled.
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Yeah, this is my fourth anniversary event, and the matches are sweatier than ever. And I really don't get why this happens; everyone brings cakes and some people play like they want to end the match as quickly as humanly possible.
I mean with all the modifiers these even matches mean less in terms of proving your "skill" than ever, and it's clearly geared for fun/scoring, but people play like their lives depend on it. Does the idea of goofing off a bit for fun and points just bring out the spite in some folks?
I don't get it.
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No. The second a surv uses their protection to bodyblock or intentionally get downed to use DS, any claim to being tunneled is forfeited.
If a surv just got unhooked and then intentionally stays in the killer's face, they get what they get, and have only themselves to blame for what follows.
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@AggressiveFTW said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3753657#Comment_3753657
With the amount of complaints about map offerings over the years, I don't think scratched mirror Myers has a promising future. Either they will rework the offerings to block maps instead of sending you to certain maps or just remove them.
You could easily say this about a third of the entire killer roster in general. At this point there are so many builds (and entire killers) that are hard countered just by the map that I think you just know going into each match knowing that you might just be screwed, and I don't think there's any way to mitigate it.
But that's also just DBD in a nutshell; if you're not playing an and S/A-tier killer, every lobby you load into is a potential RNG-dictated auto-loss. Though I'll give you that with SM Myers it's even more pronounced.
I've just made my peace with that, I suppose.
Map blocking offerings are a decent idea, but you'd see many killers who don't need then really abuse them.
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Part of me doesn't care so long as they leave Scratched Mirror Myers wholly intact. It's one of the few things in the game that is always fun, and the closest thing to actual tension/horror DBD has to offer.
I don't even play to win as SM Myers, really. As long as I can make a few people absolutely crap their pants, I've gotten when I want out of those matches, lol.
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@mizark3 said:
I would say in general, Blight isn't hated. I would say sweatlords are what are truly 'root cause' hated. Blight is so strong, that he attracts sweatlords (just as Billy now is attracting sweatlords). If you really like a good steak, but 20 greasy goobers wipe it between their pits, you probably aren't going to want to eat it. Since too many experiences with Blight are the pit-sweat stained version, they start to think that is all Blights, and don't take the chance on eating that steak.
I would say Nurse is truly hated even though she similarly attracts sweatlords. Nurse just disables most of your ability to play the game, and you have to play an entirely different game to beat her. I share the opinion she should be on a different launcher/only in customs, she is that unenjoyable to face.
Yeah, I would agree that most of the reason that Blight is hated is because he attracts people obsessed with winning, and play Blight in the sweatiest way possible: the strongest perks and add-ons, hard tunneling right out of the gate every game, etc. Not all Blights, but most I encounter play like their lives depend on getting a 4K. There's a lot of intersectionality between sad, desperately sweaty players and S-Tier killers.
If there were a Venn diagram with people who play like their entire sense of self worth is tied to not losing at a video game and people who exclusively play S-tier killers, it'd be a near perfect circle. These are the same people that will exploit every major bug that comes along because they can't even conceive of not taking every legal advantage they possibly can, even if it makes the game painfully boring.
So yeah, more a player issue than a Blight issue. But that doesn't change that most Blight games suck.
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A 1v1 is a largely pointless tiny e-dong measuring contest, usually demanded by someone who just lost and trying to salvage some pride and can't process that the game isn't only chase.
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@D0NN1ED4RK0 said:
Cheryl
Especially when you play SH 1&3 and watch what happens to her dad
Last thing she rlly needed after all these events is to end up in the entity’s realm
And there’s also Lisa Garland (Cheryl legendary set who is a side character in sh1) who’s death scene is just heartbreaking in the original game and the saddest part of all is that her cosmetic implies that this is her after the events of SH1 :(
Yeah, Cheryl for sure. Poor girl just can't catch a break
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@Mr_K said:
Killer, in general, is better with keyboard/mouse.
For sure. I actually like surv better with a controller, but there's no question in my mind that in just about every scenario killer is much better with M&K.
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Chases are in the weird position of being both the most and least fun aspects of the game. Interactions are clearly the most exciting part of the game, but chases very often feel like a formulaic game loop, especially as your competition gets better.
As you move up in mmr players all start doing the "right" things more, but that can actually make the game more boring. It's like "I know what you're probably going to do, you know what I'm probably going to do, so we're going to do the same dance we've both probably done 20 times today". The game becomes essentially a series of coin flips. As players get better, they also get more predictable; "maximum efficiency" DBD is often an insufferable bore.
It can be really tedious, and the times I've most questioned why I'm still playing this game is in these situations where it just feels like groundhog day. And I mean this from both the killer/surv perspectives.
So while many players would like all tiles to function much the same way and strats to be predictably effective, I welcome more variability and weird stuff.
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Man, if anyone thinks Distortion is the most debated perk ever they're either new to the game or have a really short memory. I could probably name 20 perks I remember being more contentious among the community.
Distortion is a pretty benign perk and the fact this is even a thread just shows how few really problematic perks we currently have.
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@Marioneo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3728678#Comment_3728678
i feel this so hard hits not connecting and auto aiming into a wall or object has become much more worse
Agreed, and I think this is somehow related to all the weird latency/rubber banding issues that have been prevalent recently. The really bad rubberbanding seems to have been reduced, but everything still seems a bit off, and has for weeks now.
Auto-aim BS has always been a thing, especially when playing on console, but I've personally experienced the most egregious instances I can remember in the past month or so. Like I'll line up a sure hit, but when I swing I rotate 45-90 degrees and smack the wall or piece of junk.
Spinning is easy to deal with, but the aim dressing crap is pretty infuriating.
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It's a salve for their bruised little egos. The most unhinged I've seen people in DBD are SWFs that are losing or have lost. They often can't wrap their brains around it. Especially if they lost to a big comeback snowball when they thought they had it in the bag.
And calling someone trash after they beat you is one of the most hilarious things there is. Like if I'm trash and I just beat you, what does that make you? Garbage juice? Pure salt.
Just take the L and move on, you're making yourselves look stupid.
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It's been said already, but apples and oranges here:
One is in match, the other isn't. I won't lose my items/add-ons and 10-15 minutes of my time in a lost cause if a killer dodges my lobby. Worst case, I wait another minute or two for the next one. Usually, like 30 seconds.
And let's not forget that survs can and often do dodge lobbies as well.
I don't dodge often, and it's never because I am dodging just shopping for a lobby of newborn potatoes. It might be because it's 3-4 TTVs who you know aren't going to play an earnest match. Or it might be when I have a challenge and am not even prioritizing a win, but with a killer I rarely use and just don't want to face a squad of P100s.
And I know many experienced survs will load into a lobby, see a bunch of P0s and P1s in base cosmetics, and nope the hell right out of there.
Ditching in game is another animal altogether.
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@Paternalpark said:
Soloq is unbearable. The longer I play the worse my teammates get.
People don't waste their time starting up a game to just leave for the sake of it.
Fix the game for the majority of the playerbase, is that too much to ask?
People queue up and leave for the sake if it all the time. Yes, the broken aspects of the game can be frustrating as all hell, but lets not pretend a whole lot of DCs/hook suicides aren't simply impulsive baby behavior.
Like when there's no discernable (good) reason. The one I'll never get is people that quit at the end of the game, or in games their side is clearly winning. I've been part of many teams that were winning a match until a player decided to bounce. Just earlier tonight I had a teammate quit after all the gens were done seemingly just because they went down.
Just the same I've faced killers who DC'ed just as the last surv was about to leave. I get frustration, but do some people just not want their earned BP? Or want a timeout?
And the classic "I'm the first one one found and I'm really butthurt about it" immediate DC. A lot of the time people leave just because things aren't going their way, and often it's their own fault.
There is a notion that almost all quits are due to some sort of broken game mechanic or unfairness. But I'd bet at least half are just people being reactionary diaper babies.
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Yeah, I haven't been playing all the much lately, but I've been robbed by aim dressing more in the past couple weeks than what feels like the previous six months. And really egregious instances, too.
Of course the rest of the game is pretty janky at the moment, with rubber banding and choppiness like I've never seen before (with no indication it's due to the my connection or surv connections), so I figure it's related.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3722160#Comment_3722160
I mean everyone can do it at each specific platform should be the key… You cannot really tell people not to use things just because other platforms are unable to do that… Otherwise I probably am not allowed to go beyond 30/60 fps because console, or most likely the switch cannot do that?
I'm not saying anything can or should be done about it, but people playing on PC just have more at their disposal than people on other platforms. And people on PS5/Series X have an advantage over Switch players. And there's nothing to be done for it, but that doesn't mean it's fair.
It is what it is, and that's one of the many reasons (primary being that it is an asym with heavy RNG dependence) why DBD is simply not playing field on which you can measure skill on a PvP basis.
I'm not going to make a fuss unless it's outright hacking. There's no point.
But if I'm on PC playing at 120fps with shaders and and EQ headset, I'm probably gonna refrain from talking trash, or taking my "wins" too seriously.
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@radiantHero23 said:
First and foremost: The Skull Merchant is still unfun to play against.
However, the amount of hate she recieves is also not ok. Most of it is bias at this point.
This, pretty much.
But right or wrong, Skull Merchant's perception is sealed. She has been shunned, and no matter what changes are made, she's going to remain so.
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Cheating is kind of a subjective/relative term for most people, but I tend to think this, like most things people debate about, falls more into the "competitive advantage" area than any sort of blatant cheating (assuming the headset works as advertised).
Personally I think anything that isn't stock standard (even stuff like changing the brightness/contrast) is to some degree unfair unless everyone can do it. But it's DBD, where "balance" has no meaning, so it's certainly not anything I would even think much about.
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@SpitefulHateful said:
Never interact with the community. Community is joy killer. Truly, I hate the fact that a game with a rather captivating gameplay has to be online and played with other players.
Yeah, unfortunately I got to the point years ago where I simply disabled all avenues for postgame interaction, as it was little positivity, some neutral/cursory stuff (like your stock standard "GG"), and a whole lot of ugliness. On PC I disabled/hid chat, on console I set messaging to friends only and ignore friend requests I get while playing DBD.
I know I'm missing out on some wholesome interaction, but I also know I'm avoiding a ton of stuff that's just going to be really negative, aggressive, and toxic.
As was pointed out earlier, people tend to dwell on the bad stuff and get the loudest when they are in a negative space, and consequently that comprises most of the chat bandwidth.
I play nicely (I think) and try to always consider the experience of everyone else in the match, and I actually found that harder to do when I left myself exposed to the postgame stuff because no matter how considerate you try to be (while still trying to win), most of the feedback in this community is negative. I wish it weren't so, but I don't want playing to be an experience that leads me toward more cynical thoughts than the rest of the world already does.
I just want to play, have fun, and presume the best in others.
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@100PercentBPMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3714057#Comment_3714057
How's bg3 treating ya? I beat 1 and 2 to hype myself up but I think I burned myself out on turn based more than anything between that and P3r
I love it. I'd spent a long time away from classic crpg games, so it has been a really nice, nostalgic change of pace. The characters and writing are top tier, as well. The hype was definitely warranted, but at the same time I'm not sure I'd have enjoyed it as much as I have if I played it after a series of other turn based games.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
Yes, and every time a new map comes out, which is also a Green Offering, the chances of getting one goes down 😒
Which could be mitigated if BHVR removed one of the many obsolete items/addons that practically no one uses but are still prevalent still on the web.
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Depends on the killer/survivor, mostly.
But I recently took a long (about 6-7 week) hiatus to focus on BG3 and FFVIIR, and am really struggling to get reengaged/motivated. I get bored of DbD 2-3 matches in. Bought the newest chapter, mostly out of habit, but just don't care. Haven't even touched the new killer. I've had previous bouts where DbD started to feel like a hamster wheel, but not this bad.
Maybe the anniversary will be invigorating. Hopefully. But maybe after 4K+ hours I'm just cooked and I needed some perspective to see it.
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@Star99er said:
my only gripe is when you pick up a survivor completely facing a wall and still somehow getting blinded when nothing but the wall is in your LoS. Other than that blinds are fine
Yeah, I rarely get blinded (maybe like 1 in 20 attempts actually works) except at pallets, and half of the few that do work are with my face in a wall from some inexplicable angle that seems impossible. The other half are (well) coordinated teams who plan to go down in the open.
But the overwhelming majority of the time being aware of your positioning and/or facing a wall with thwart just about any flashlight/flashbang save attempt, regardless of how fast they get there. Most attempts are just pathetic, really, and I'm glad they are wasting their time trying.
That said, I'll occasionally throw on Lightborn if I see 3-4 flashlights in lobby, and more often if I see no items in lobby, because that usually is an item swapping flashlight bully squad.
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@OmegaXII said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710874#Comment_3710874
"It's just that we are in an aura reading meta now more than ever, and I just want to mitigate it a bit."
It's not just mitigate a bit, it's almost complete immunity even when Killer brings 3x Aura perks. So now the Killer can only play with 1 perk, which usually means the match is already a lose.
"And if you're a killer that can't compete without getting constant value from your aura perks…well, that's pretty much the definition of needing crutches and it's time to look at yourself a bit. Builds are all counterplay and no one is entitled to perk value."
This can be applied to literally any perks you bring, including Survivor Meta. Perks are designed to help you, but if getting value from any perks are counted as relying on clutches, then should I go perkless to satisfy you?
I already banned myself from Add-ons and Slowdown Perks, and now the Aura Perk. So tell me, what perks do you allow me to bring that doesn't counted as clutches? Beast of Prey?
Again, it blocks aura reading so long as it has stacks. It is absolutely not "total immunity". I played a Huntress last night who ate all my stacks immediately and I couldn't get them back because she had a perk setup where she was almost constantly triggering it regardless of where we were in relation to each other, and capitalized when they were gone. And that's wasn't a terribly uncommon experience.
A lot of killers run aura reading setups that ate redundant, or give too much time to recover stacks. If you can trigger the surv's Distortion repeatedly from distance and then again when you get close and they are out of stacks and then capitalize, it really makes distortion pretty low value. But you can't just load up on aura perks and then expect them to give you constant value. They're not supposed to be that powerful.
Against good killers, I am not getting constant value from them perk, and sometimes next to none. If you chew up a surv's Distortion stacks and they can keep close enough to keep replenishing them without you noticing they are there, that's pretty much a red flag that you probably rely on your aura perks too much and not enough on actually looking and listening.
And I play a lot of killer, and sometimes I don't get any value from my aura perks, but it doesn't ruin the match for me.
And there are many meta perks in the game that aren't crutches. But if your go-to build being countered means you can't compete, then that means those perks are have become crutches for you. It's like when old DH (which was the mother of all crutches) was nerfed and a lot of players instantly became very mid, while better players simply adapted.
DBD is set up where any build can largely be hard countered by another. And it's all down to chance, so everyone should be prepared to play with little or no perk value.
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Distortion is fine. As others have pointed out, it really only prevents one thing, and only so long as it has stacks. I often run it, but I don't really immerse. It's just that we are in an aura reading meta now more than ever, and I just want to mitigate it a bit.
Killers who have well thought out builds with chew up your stack really quickly, and it's not terribly unusual to lose all three stacks in the first minute any not get them back when the killer is good.
And if you're a killer that can't compete without getting constant value from your aura perks…well, that's pretty much the definition of needing crutches and it's time to look at yourself a bit. Builds are all counterplay and no one is entitled to perk value.
And learning to track survs without aid should be killer 101.
In terms of truly broken perks, I think most of those dragons have been slain, and we're left with handwringing over perks like this that are largely okay.
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@WolfyWood said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710218#Comment_3710218
Exactly my point, you discredit the thought that goes into both perks because its frustrating to not be able to pin it on anything but being outplayed.
Also, you were going to slug, bleed out, and tunnel anyways, this isn't really a threat anymore, I'd imagine most survivors are used to it by now.
More drivel from someone who obviously never really plays killer. All killers play the same, surv play requires mad skillz and even if you lose, it's only because the deck was stacked against you, right? GTFO with that nonsense. Most killers don't tunnel/camp/slug, and if you feel like they all do, it's probably a skill issue on your end.
As for the topic, honestly I don't care much so long as the survs can't advance objectives without deactivating DS. I have zero issue with DS in its current state.If I'm playing killer and the surv I just unhooked wants to waste their time trying to bait me (which is usually really obvious) just so they can get their DS off I'll gladly let them and as I chase someone else. If they're too persistent or bodyblock, I'll just put them on the ground and leave them there.
It's one of the cardinal rules of killer: don't chase people who obviously want to be chased.
And even if you successfully bait the killer into eating a DS, what have you gained? Unless it happens right away (like in cases where you're actually being tunneled), you're probably coming out on the wrong end of the time wasted equation. If you chase the killer around for 30+ seconds and get downed and DS them, you haven't done anything positive for yourself or your team. Or is wasting your own time just to justify filling a perk slot considered an "outplay" now?
Seems like when some survs waste half the match trailing chases around waiting for flashlight save opportunities they either don't get or botch. It only benefits the killer. To survs who chase the killer around after being unhooked trying to bait them into eating a DS, by all means keep doing it. Unless you're on my team, then knock that ######### off.
It shouldn't need to be said, but if the killer immediately chases you and no one else after you've been unhooked and you end up DSing them, the perk has done it's job, and in that case it helps your team.
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@Neaxolotl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3706956#Comment_3706956
I'm not dismissing anything, I'm just stating my opinion, I don't think using sound design so atrocious for balancing is good or healthy, and gaming industry in general should stop doing that kind of game design
That's totally fair, and in an ideal world it wouldn't be the way it is (and as someone with a hearing deficit I feel the impact of that design element more than most), but it is. And that being the case, some folks picking and choosing what sounds are prominent or vice versa is clearly not fair play, which is the question being posed here.
It's like people who listen to music but complain when they struggle because they make that choice; the game is what it is, and we have to account for it. But trying to change how it works in the player end isn't they way.
BHVR's general use of sound design is obviously an issue, but also a more high level discussion.
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@Neaxolotl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3706494#Comment_3706494
But still, balancing around sounds are weird when we talk about accessibility every day
Yeah, but hearing deficits don't differentiate between most types of sounds, so I don't think we can use the fact that some people (myself included) don't hear as well as others to dismiss the question.
If you are running software to do things like essentially slapping a reverse Iron Will on survs, or amplifying the sound of the TR, muffling ambient noise that interfere with sounds you'd like to hear, etc., that's pretty clearly cheating to me.
I can't count the number of times I've been straining to listen for certain sounds and wished they were louder (or that other sounds masking them were quieter or present at all), but actually getting that wish wouldn't be fair or intended.
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If there's 2+ gens left and only two survs, the game is effectively over. In those situations and I'm one of the remaining survs and it's obvious my teammate isn't doing jack, I'll just jump on a gen and let nature take its course.
Life is too short to waste time playing hide and seek in a game that wasn't designed for it.
And the survs aren't owed a handicap because their team is getting rinsed. Much like life, sometimes hopeless situations are just that - hopeless. Acceptance is a good thing here. Just die with some dignity and move on to the next game.
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NOED is something bad killers often use, but it sure as hell never carried anyone to high MMR
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3699774#Comment_3699774
You could make a case for the others, maybe, but the first one is literally just tunneling.
I think there's nuance there, still. Sometimes you see the last surv you hooked again first because that surv is just way worse than the rest of their team. I'll try to avoid hooking them again when this happens, but at a certain point you can only ignore a person so much when their ass is always the one that's out.
As for the topic in general, my experiences matches Scott's - five years in the game at just about every MMR level and I simply have never seen hard tunneling at remotely close to the rate so many describe. And not just in my games, but the games I watch being streamed. I just don't see it. I'll have days where I might see it 4 times out of 5 games, but those days are massive outliers.
And I do think that this is largely because people have such wildly different definitions of tunneling. And definitions aren't like feelings - not all of them are valid. I've been accused of it when I've hooked two (and even three) other survs between times I hooked the accusing party, just because I did it quickly. How do you even regard something like that?
I feel like many people just feel like that if they aren't left alone for a certain amount of time, that they're being tunneled, regardless of what else is going on. Really oppressive killers will feel like they are omnipresent, and always on you, even if they're hooking everyone. I think that is why high mobility killers seem to be accused of it the most (though I think many Blight players also sweaty goobers who tunnel by design, which makes it feel like all Blights tunnel) It sucks to be on the receiving end of that, but it is what it is.
And I also agree with Scott in that I think that many people who are saying that they are "always" being tunneled are telling on themselves for being bad without being self-aware about it.
And just because it was brought up earlier, surv players who actually pay attention know when their teammates are being tunneled. It's not often a case of survs thinking tunneling isn't happening because it isn't happening to them. If one of your teammates just died and no one else has been hooked, you don't need an advanced degree to sort out that tunneling is going on.
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The Legion's problems are baked into them. Unless they get rebuilt from the ground up (like an entirely new power), Legion will always suck.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3675110#Comment_3675110
As I feel you as far as people announcing they are quitting is always on this forum. It still sucks to see people leave the game I want this game to thrive. People just saying by I don't care isn't the way to go about it.
DbD is a weird game that isn't for everyone (no matter which side you play, it feels unfair a lot), and I would bet that turnover his higher for it than most others. People are constantly leaving. And people are constantly coming in.
No one should waste their time wringing their hands over people who are crying just to cry with nothing of real substance to say. Especially people who obviously didn't really play both sides of the game.
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I do not like NOED, I haven't run it even once since my first 20 hours in the game like 5 years ago, and I wouldn't be even a little sad if it were deleted. The Venn diagram overlap of players who consistently run NOED and players who are new/bad is almost a perfect circle (the exception being if it is part of a meme end game build).
That said, I am sick of hearing that it gives "free kills". You don't enter the dying state as soon as the killer sees you in the endgame, they still have to catch and hit you. There's no such thing as a free kill.
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A theater being off on its own a bit isn't unusual at all really.
But even with that being the case, I think most of the maps were/are meant to feel a little cobbled together and disjointed. Patched together in an off-putting or unnatural way.
I think only a portion of the maps feel like they were just cut out of the real world and dropped into the Entity's realm; the rest are surreal by design, I'd bet.
On the subject of theaters being isolated, I've long thought a drive-in would make a great map.
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She didn't need any buffs, but the only egregious thing was the speed while holding a hatchet. With that being reverted, I don't really any issue.
Still odd that they identified her as needing buffs at all, though.
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Dredge has to be in the convo for scariest as well.
Brutality is another debate altogether, and where I feel most killers land. But like disturbing on multiple levels? You're talking about like 3-4 of them. I'd like to see a really eldritch killer who is genuinely terrifying; maybe we'll get a Lovecraftian, Mindflayer type killer that will set a new bar.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3669107#Comment_3669107
Current win streak of hens and his friends is around 130 and going, killer requirement is usually nobody escapes through gates after all gens are done... Not 4k.
For some, for many others any 3K+ is a win. That's one of the other reflections of how casual this game is, there isn't even a loose official definition of what a win even is. The community has been pretty much left to define their own.
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The percentage of killer players going on these streaks is miniscule. You can't balance the game around players who dedicate tons of time to the game and play it as efficiently as humanly possible.
This game was not and is not designed to be balanced around optimal gameplay; it was designed to be played casually. As such, really sweaty, uber-dedicated gamers are gonna break it. But lucky for us, the VAST majority of players are nowhere near this level, even if they aspire to be (or delude themselves into thinking they are).
It's just that these very few also happen to be the most visible. Most killer players will never even sniff a 20 game winstreak, much less 1000+. And even so, many players lie (GASP!) or are otherwise deceptive about their winstreaks. Most people bragging about their play in online forums are full of it.
If you change the game to handicap the extreme end of the spectrum, you're going to break the game entirely for like 99% of killer players. Just like you can't balance the game around super SWFs without making solo queue absolutely unplayable.
Just take solace that very few of us will actually encounter these people in pubs, and most never will.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3668463#Comment_3668463
I’m getting sick of the woe is me posts from survivors on here now it was killer woe is me posts for years but the goalposts changed
True. A good rule of thumb is that is someone plays one side almost exclusively, they are going to cry about how hard that side has it. This is because they only have half a perspective.
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I play both sides equally (and at 4K hours that is a really good taste of each side), and while surv is a little bit down now, this "wE suRvs are jUSt maDe to sUfFeR" talk is just absurd.
I don't think survivor play is appreciably worse than it has been at any point in my tenure. And while some things have been lost, others have been gained. There's an ebb and flow, and it is felt on alternatively on both sides.
People brush it off, but as a strictly solo player, I found the new surv HUD to be a goddamn revelation. Best single thing either side has gotten in years. Having an idea of what your team is up to in solo was a massive change.
BnPs weren't lost, I think they're better.
Medkits weren't lost, they were balanced (a souped up green medkit was stupid OP, probably the strongest item in the game, and I abused them, it was almost criminal).
Prove Thyself was always pretty mid, not much has changed. Anyone focusing on Prove Thyself probably isn't all that good.
Gen times got increased marginally, but the old (and much more effective) killer slowdown meta was gutted.
I think 6.1.0, while disruptive, was in part very necessary. I think the game was surv leaning before, and the surv meta was stale as hell. OG DH was the most busted thing in the game and had been for years. It had to go. Think of a busted perk on the other side, Eruption. That was nerfed to the ground almost immediately in comparison.
The only loss I felt that seemed really excessive to me was the stun duration of DS. That was egregious, but another rework is coming, so there's hope.
In the end, this is just another "us v. them" topic that only reflects how biased some people's perspectives are. I try not to be gatekeeper-y, but more and more I feel like if a player doesn't have somewhat equal time in both sides (not just having trialed the "other" side), I don't really care about their opinion on game balance.
You can't just put the shoe on the other foot for a minute, you have walk in it in equal measure. Some of these ######### takes just reek of people who play like a 90/10 split.
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It's perception bias. Players almost always play the way they would have before loading into a lobby, regardless of the offerings. When you bring an offering and hope for a long game, you feel it a lot more if it's a quick one, but that doesn't mean bringing the offering was the cause.
I always play whichever role has the BP bonus, and bring a BPS or Anniversary Cake almost every single game (I rack up hundreds of them during the anniversary) and over a big sample size note nothing but the usual chaos.
The only time I get annoyed is during the anniversary event itself, when everyone is bringing the event cakes, and many players play like they're on a timer. That is annoying.
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Pig got buffed. Chase is where she was hurting, and the nerfs to the RBT don't really change anything unless you play for head pops, in which case you were pissing into the wind anyway.
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Everyone can play nice if they want to, but the trade off is that you can't play nice and win all (or even most) of your games.
I always just try to play laid back, because this game is so imbalanced that I don't feel like winning really says much about the player's skill, and I don't really get any validation from it. People who play like winning consistently in DBD actually means something amuse me. That said, I do have a strong competitive side that I can't totally suppress, and if I go up against a super sweaty/bully squad, I can get intense. But we're talking maybe 5-10% of my games.
Most games I just want to have fun, and generally try to match the vibe my opponents are bringing.
I like to win, but it's not the most important thing to me in DBD. If I ever became one of those Blight/Nurse mains who bring their best loadout and methodically tunnel the first hooked surv every single game, I'd be really disappointed in myself. I just refuse to allow myself to care so much that I play like a robot. Losing half my games is preferable.
I just don't think this game is remotely built for that type of intense competitiveness.
tl;dr here is that you can play nice if it's important to you. No one is forcing anyone to sweat, every player is the captain of their own ship.
If winning every game is so important to a person that they feel like they don't have any choice but to play like their life depends on winning, that's on them, not their opponent.
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A number of reasons:
- Some are new to the game and feel like safety in numbers applies in DBD.
- Some are new and want to watch others to know what to do
- Regardless of experience, people are all pretty like minded and without coordination, tend to do adopt similar tactics. For example, experienced survs in solo all may go for the central gen right off the bat, whereas a team in comms would not.
- Due to lack of coordination, solo survs will just run into each other more, or lead the killer right into their teammates.
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@Pulsar said:
Because it's psychological manipulation targeting at-risk people and children.
It's scummy, straight-up.
This.
@humanbeing1704 said:
Mostly because it was added way into the games life cycle I know that’s why it pissed me off
And this.
It is scummy, without question. Creating artificial scarcity is just a crappy, coercive way of doing business. Effective, but gross. Not everyone has money for trivial purchases all the time. And even less so around the windows when most limited time items are available (like Christmas, most notably).
I don't know how many times recently I've seen a limited time cosmetic I wanted but couldn't justify it in that moment. Now I'm a grown ass adult with serious financial responsibilities and a little (not enough all the time, lol) self control, but a lot of players are kids or younger people with less impulse control (and maybe mommy and daddy's credit card info), and for them this is almost predatory.
And it's one thing if a company does this with a property as a rule, and you know what to expect. It gets worse when you do what BHVR did and pull a whole bunch of stuff that had been available year round into it almost without warning. That's really what irked me. They changed their ecosystem years into the game's life.
I tend to avoid games that do this, and all of a sudden I found myself heavily invested in a game that just decided to really lean into it, which makes me resentful.
And none of this is even taking into account how relatively overpriced these cosmetics are. Like grossly overpriced, especially for a game that isn't ftp.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
All reworked maps and new maps we got lately are terrible bad.
BHVR is new design for maps: Big dead zones, filler pallets which guaranteed hits, garbage loops and gens are so closer to each other.
Yeah i am not fan of this.
Also tons of random junk/objects/obstacles that make things just as bad (in some cases worse than they were) for most killers. New maps look good, but are very cluttered, and not in a way that is useful to anyone. Red Forest/Mother's Dwelling is a great example of this; visually amazing, but functionally a cluttered mess. Hate it as killer, love it as survivor.
In general, map balance is the biggest problem in the DBD. By that I mean there is barely any map balance, and I'm not sure there is a solution at this point.
@ReverseVelocity said:
I think Garden of Joy should get an actual gameplay pass.
I genuinely don't know what they did when they "looked at it". The main building is still an infinite with a god pallet next to it and there's completely safe pallets within strolling distance of each other. Did they even touch the map at all?
The GoJ rework was funny because they gave it a pass and barely touched the biggest issue. You can absolutely abuse killers with that dining room window loop, and I figured that would be the first thing they addressed.
Other maps are imbalanced but in a way that feels appropriate (imo), like Haddonfield. You have huge dead zones (street) and extremely strong loops (the houses). I think if every map had loops evenly distributed around the map, it'd be boring as hell.
But like all things there are limits, and maps like GoJ cross them.