SuzuKR
SuzuKR
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- SuzuKR
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If you're unhooking, you aren't being tunneled.
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I have one and it's one of the best purchases I've ever made. Becomes warm super quick and helps me get some of the best sleep ever.
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The only way to properly reduce camping in a healthy manner is to incentivize/buff not-camping gameplay so that it's not as necessary as a strategy.
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I don't feel entitled to anything on either side. If I deserved it, I'd get it. If I didn't get it, I didn't deserve it.
(Obviously, not counting cases with cheaters/game-breaking bugs like the one where you could get permanently stuck in a hill a while back)
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Why would you want the three best designed and best balanced killers in the game gone?
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ily Sluzzy, never change
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Yes
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Nurse first, Blight second.
Nurse is the only killer in the entire game that makes you 100% rely on your own skill in the most fair and even 50/50 way. Blight is very close, but still is mechanically restricted on some tiles and loops so he’s not quite 100%, since he cannot 50/50 every single location ever. There is no mechanical limits with Nurse in chase. The sole and exclusive thing that determines who wins every trade attempt (hit or dodge) is who is more skillful at mindgaming.
It is not “I win or lose this trade because of/despite mechanical limitations out of my control making it inherently more advantaged for one side or the other.” It is “I win or lose this trade because I have correctly or incorrectly made the mindgame/read through their skill versus mine in an even 50/50.”
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@SmarulKusia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2827075#Comment_2827075
You’re ignoring the fact that Nurse has an incredible large player base, from low to high MMR.
that’s going to dilute her kill rate because low MMR players definitely outnumber high MMR. This was true for several killers last time BHR released stats, Huntress and Wraith followed the same trend.
You’d only look at kill rates as an effective measure of balance if the killer has a low play rate + kill rate because it means that even players that are trying to specialise in that killer are struggling - the only killer following this trend was Twins.
or alternatively if the killer has a high kill rate and high play rate - which was the case for Bubba, and shows that he is far too effective at securing kills.
She averages to 2K at the literal highest levels of play in this game, and that’s WITH heavily restricted survivors. With complete zero restrictions for either side, she drops below 2K average.
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I just don't see a point in being like "I beat toxic person and was toxic back, lol karma". I think karmic situations are funny too, but there's nothing to discuss other than just "toxic people bad". Which feels... kind of like a given.
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There's no such thing as playing dirty if it's within the rules.
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Have you tried playing better?
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Karma I guess, which is funny. But also another us versus them post, which is pretty cringe.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829937#Comment_2829937
When I compared it to old spirit logic, I was referring to the whole "guess right you don't get hit" way you described it. That is essentially what people described old spirit as. A guessing game and a not very enjoyable one either
I appreciate the in-depth analysis of how you would ideally play against a Blight on a certain tile. It often feels like a lot of the time when you try to run tiles against movement speed addon Blights you're going to get hit regardless if you run the tile well or not due to how many rushes he has and how fast he moves.
I agree that mindgaming is a big part of skill in this game but I also find it difficult to mindgame a killer who is moving too fast to even react to. Like what you're saying about running the L wall T wall makes complete sense in theory but I would argue it is a lot harder than you make it seem to be in practice.
Nevertheless thank you for the detailed response, I'll try to keep it in mind the next time I'm up against a Blight and see if it is any help.
Every single tile and loop outside of things like just big oval/pile of debris with pallet is mindgameable, and assuming both sides are fairly decent at the game (aka, know how to run any given tile correctly), the only way to shorten the chase is to mindgame. This isn't a Blight-specific thing. The reason Blight is good design is precisely because it's as close to 50-50 odds as possible. Weaker killers inherently hit a ceiling, because they have multiple mechanical limitations, meaning the mindgame starts incredibly slanted not in their favor for strong tiles. For instance, there is no good way to mindgame a long-wall jungle gym as a standard M1. Basically the only possible way to deal with that tile is to either give up the chase, or brute force it (which takes forever with how strong the tile is, especially if it's connected to others). You could argue that's not exactly enjoyable either. It doesn't matter what mindgames you make, basically none of them work there because there's too many options for the survivor and very few for the M1 to reduce their options with.
Conversely, someone like Blight has equally good odds of landing a hit as the survivor does of avoiding it. It's not "I lose this entire chase (or have to spend a huge amount of time to brute force it) because I'm at this tile and there is a glass ceiling to the extent of what this killer is mechanically capable of", it's "I win or lose this trade because I correctly or incorrectly mindgamed/read the opponent". Does that make sense? Same with the LT example. A standard M1 has options of double backing here and there to catch out the survivor, and survivor has to make the correct read in what the killer will try and do.
Obviously, it's easier said than done, but that's the gist of mindgames in the first place. You have to constantly adapt to how your opponent is playing. For instance, as the Blight player, if a player tends to fake vaults alot, I'd play with the idea they'd probably continue to do so. Likewise, as the survivor, if they try and go for sliding way more than bump logic, I know I can peel off most loops and be completely out of their range. So, as both, I switch up how I'd play as/against them, so they have no consistent basis to work off of. That is why it's skill-defining. What do you think the opponent will do? Can you bait/pressure them into making the wrong read? Can you guess how they will try and counter that read? So on and so forth.
For instance, if as the survivor, I'm super inconsistent about when I take/fake vaults, when I hold W/double back/etc whenever I cut off lines of sight, etc, the Blight is not going to have any guaranteed guess of what I do. But I can also use that against them. I set up a false queue, like a certain visual/movement/habit I'd do if I'm about to fake, and then do that when I actually commit later, when they're looking out for all those ways to make the correct read on me. For instance, if I want to commit to a vault, I'll usually be hugging a loop as tight as I can. I do that, I break LOS, and then I immediately split completely off from the loop. The Blight slides around it, and then realizes I'm not there. Stuff like that. Mindgames aren't about reaction, they're about prediction. For instance with Nurse, if a survivor is looking behind them, it is a cue they'll try and double back - maybe. But will they actually do so? Who knows, you'll have to guess and see. Likewise, running without looking back, and then doubling last second to throw off that same cue. So on and so forth.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829906#Comment_2829906
Isn't this just a repeat of what people said about old spirit then?
I don't get it
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829911#Comment_2829911
A blight has to commit to an action, an action that he has multiple ways of making up for/correcting if he makes a mistake. Especially with the vial which gives him more tokens and makes them regenerate faster.
If the only legitimate counterplay to something moving this quickly is 'mindgame' then there's a problem.
You fake a vault, he corrects and hits you anyway because his hitbox is very generous
You use dead hard, congratulations - you're using one of the only perks that helps against the strongest killers in this game. You're also using the most universally complained about perk in the game
These are not actual ways to counterplay Blights, especially Blights that move so fast, can hit you around corners and so on.
No, cause you have all of the information about what the Blight is doing, which old Spirit didn't give. You had no clue if Spirit was phasing, when she was phasing, and where she was phasing. Blight gives multiple indicators of all actions, especially at ranges that close (eg, at a tile mid-chase). You can hear him slam, you can hear him if he decides to burn multiple Rushes to speed up his last 1-2 (if he's using speed add-ons), you can hear how many slams he already used up, you can hear where his Rushes take him, you can hear what side of a wall or surface the Blight is on, and if you have LOS on him, you can see him as well and deduce places he cannot reach from his current location with his left-over bounces based off the surrounding tile objects and environmental debris.
For instance, let's take an LT wall. You are running around the L. Your (main two) options are to either take the fast vault on the L, or veer off and head towards the T. If you think the Blight is going to go for a hug around the L, you turn the corner, break LOS, and then split off towards the T. If you think Blight will use bump logic to go for the T, you take the fast vault back around the L. If the Blight is using up multiple Rushes to accelerate himself, then you only have 1-2 potential Rushes to even have to dodge, and you can just put yourself in a position he can't comfortably access you from if he doesn't commit to a side. For example, if you've seen the Blight player consistently tries to go for the accelerated last 1-2 Rushes and you think this newest attempt isn't a feint, there's no reason to commit to a side for the first few slams. Just stay by the place you cut off his LOS and then veer off before he goes for his actual committed Rush. Him preparatory-slamming takes up time that you can use to reposition yourself if necessary as well, and if he misses, it means he's on a hefty 10-second downtime where he has literally zero power.
Mindgaming is the most skillful method of chase in this entire game, especially the closer it gets to a 50/50. Chases should be determined off player skill versus player skill, not the tile/mechanical limitations. Pay attention to your surroundings, learn how Blight bump logic works, get a grasp on how the Blight player tends to play, be unpredictable, cut off LOS, and make and fake mindgame reads. There are points on every standard non-junkloop (ie, random oval with pallet) tile you can force said mindgame. Eg, with the LT. To hit you in time if you do go for the fast vault on the L, he has to start the swing the moment he turns the corner. That drastically reduces his movespeed momentum since he's going from his Rush into a swing, and by extension, his attack range. Even if he flicks and adjusts, if you already pre-emptively left for the T wall instead, he is literally incapable of reaching you, distance-wise. Conversely, if he expected you to fake the vault and go for the T so he Rushes that way but you already vaulted, he is physically incapable of reaching you in time.
Using up slams at the start with speed add-ons is one of those high-risk high-reward gambles. You shorten the time window significantly, but in return, you are gambling with a 10s cooldown of having zero power which is major against good survivors, and that the entire gamble hinges on you landing the hit within only 1-2 Rushes actually used for navigation/to go for the swing.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829902#Comment_2829902
"You aren't supposed to"
So you're saying it has no counterplay?
How do you mindgame something that moves that fast then?
The counterplay IS mindgaming it. Make a read what the Blight is going to do and place yourself not in his way. You guess right, you dodge it. You don't, you get hit.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829836#Comment_2829836
Do you mind explaining the counterplay to a killer who moves so fast you barely have a window to react to them?
You aren't supposed to. You're supposed to mindgame it.
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@egg_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828465#Comment_2828465
Tldr except that what you're (willingly?) omitting data because the average 2k comes from the different maps chosen in for the game. Nurse in ct/dds/wy/chapel is expected to 4k as much as blight is expected to 4k in certain maps where they play like suffocation pit. Call "expected to 4k" balance again please
I don’t know why you have the idea that’s somehow relevant. Yes, there are horribly designed maps. Midwich is horribly designed and favors the killer (assuming they can counter hold W). Maps like Badham are horribly designed and favor survivors. So on and so forth. Of course if you put them in a drastically uneven map, the expected results will also be drastically uneven. That’s a given. What’s your point?
Also, maps like Coal Tower/Suffocation Pit/Wrecker’s Yard/etc and other relatively even-sided maps are where the 2K average comes from. When Nurse/Blight players at the highest levels of play face equally high skilled survivors on an even map, the average comes down to 2K. MMR gives uneven matches often, and many people don’t know how to face Nurse or Blight correctly in general. When matchups are blatantly uneven, of course the results will be as well. If one side is extremely experienced and the other side isn’t, the result will be one-sided. That’s not bad, that’s just a given. Which doesn’t happen when put up against actual equal matchups.
Anyways, let me know if you need help Googling how to play against Nurse/Blight.
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It’s amusing despite all the sorts of claims that people will make against Nurse/Blight, at the highest levels of play, they only average out to around 2K. People will go on and on and on about how unbeatable and unfair and OP and badly designed and whatever else they are, despite none of the actual results agreeing with them.
Yeah, maybe if an AI that could perfectly read the future and make the right mindgame call every single time always played them, sure. But that’s not the case here. People mindgame each other and the one that made the better play at a given instance is the one that successfully lands/avoids the hit from that instance.
If you’re in a complete dead zone, you will get almost guaranteed get hit. That’s not something bad. That’s literally how it should be. Your goal is to not end up in dead zones in the first place. Furthermore, because of how Nurse works, even in “dead zones” for traditional killers that would catch up via plain movespeed, if you evade her blink by making the better mindgame, it’s not a guaranteed hit zone the way it is with other killers.
On any other tile, every single thing a Nurse or Blight can do can be mindgamed to either evade a hit or prevent them from going for the hit entirely. Likewise, no one auto-wins or auto-loses based off the tile. No matter how strong or weak the tile is, almost every single tile can be mindgamed. It means having to actually use your brain to make the right call instead of just relying on what the map gives you to determine the result’s favor.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2827186#Comment_2827186
Because Blight can use his rushes to outzone you where he wants you and you just die.
I can dodge a Hatchet.
I can dodge a Shred.
I can juke a Nurse.
I can fake out a Spirit.
I can window vault against a Bubba.
There is nothing against a Blight. You just die. Even if you get lucky and find a resource, it is nothing that two bounces won't get around. It's absurd.
Play better. Learn to mindgame tiles better.
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@gendoss said:
The pallet stuns aren't so bad for me but what really gets me is pallet and window vaults. It's pretty much forced me to run Spine Chill + Resilience because if I don't I can be standing up on the other side of the pallet and still get hit.
And yes it is super dumb that the lower your ping is the more you get rewarded. Hopefully they make vaults server sided soon.
Uh. I don't know if you're aware of how server validation works, but the person with the lower ping would still be the one being "rewarded" with server-side checks. You know, since what they do happens before what the laggier person does. You can't possibly unironically think it's reasonable for games to favor the person with the worse connection. You're literally expecting the other side to predict the future. That's beyond insanely stupid.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2827072#Comment_2827072
K. How do I mindgame two rocks the size of a barrel, a tree, and the gen I am working on?
I'll wait.
Don't be in a deadzone while injured if you know he's close enough to get to you before you can get to the closest tile. Have better map awareness. I don't know if you're expecting one of the worst possible scenarios to be caught in to be favorable for you in even the tiniest bit or something.
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@JonahsTablet said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2827068#Comment_2827068
I disagree with Nurse, she's the only killer that makes people saying "this game is killer sided" slightly valid. Her problem is that once you learn how to ignore the fundamentals of the game, she becomes so ridiculously strong that Slowdown + the right add-ons on her is just too much. That being said I'm fine with her, I don't want this game to ever actually be balanced, just remove the ridiculously oppressive stuff like Dead Hard and old Ruin + Undying and I'm good.
Which is why she still only averages out to 2K at highest levels of play possible, and even lower if you play with completely zero restrictions. Everything about her chase is the the epitome of mindgaming. Whoever makes the better read/play gets the success. Nurse makes the right read/survivor makes the wrong read, a hit happens. Vice versa and a hit is dodged. That’s as skillful as you can possibly get.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2826362#Comment_2826362
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2826389#Comment_2826389
These points do not allow you to reality alter the map. There are many instances where your brain means absolutely nothing. You just die. Because he can just rush rush rush. It is extremely easy for Blight to create a dead zone.
I say again, he is in the top 3 at high MMR for a reason.
Being top doesn’t mean it’s overpowered. There will literally always be a top regardless. Everything in Blight’s chase is counterplayable. Learn to mindgame better.
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Nurse is the best balanced, Blight is the second best balanced. Since there’s not really any way to be better designed than Nurse (since she ignores all mechanical limits), Blight is the closest ideal model for future killers that still are mechanically limited:
Lot of diverse add-ons, basically almost no bad add-ons, a high skill ceiling that rewards mastery, very interactive and mindgame-oriented chase/anti-loop and good cross-map freeform mobility.
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Do I need to link guides/explanation on how to counter a sliding Blight again?
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They've been bugged for a while. They don't properly show up on a lot of surfaces like stairs.
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@Jaxton2000 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2824589#Comment_2824589
bruh, what if I am going to go to the totem, to bless it but they hop on it before I can?/?????/??
Sucks to suck. Get there quicker next time.
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Bless it before they cleanse it. That’s a you problem. What if they want the points? Or they have a perk that needs to cleanse totems? Or a challenge?
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Killswitch only exists for things that cause major issues in UNINTENDED ways such as bugs that keep someone frozen forever or similar. That said, the addon does need a rework.
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Balanced isn’t passive because that was literally game-breaking. The others aren’t weak. Sprint Burst/Dead Hard are just too overarching in comparison. Eg, making the DH dash only happen when you dodge a hit/SB gives idk, 60s of Exhaustion instead of 40, etc, would be the way to incentivize usage of the others. DH needs a design change regardless. SB isn’t broken but there’s no reason to use others right now for the same boost for the same “cooldown”.
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None of them, in my opinion.
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Nothing in DBD is frustrating/upsetting for me. I have equal good fun with solo survivor, SWF, and killer.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2824183#Comment_2824183
Who is stronger than Blight for that combo though. Maybe Nurse, but then again, you are running on a very difficult to use Killer.
Putting one of the strongest builds on the second strongest killer means only the strongest is going to be stronger than that. But you put that build on any killer being played by a good player and they'd dominate the absolute majority of average public matches. You can stomp the average match with just about anything regardless of side if you're really good at the game.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2824171#Comment_2824171
I'm sorry, I play Trapper, Freddy, Plague, Billy, Pinhead, Hag and Twins and have dabbled a lot with Huntress and Blight.
Blight is most similar to Billy and Nurse and both of those Killers require way more skill than Blight does. Blight is easy to pick up and use right out of the box and is very effective without add-ons.
Don't get me wrong, Blight is very fun to play as. But come-on: Tinkerer, Ruin and Undying makes the game a cake walk.
That's not a Blight thing. That's a stacked slowdowns on a strong killer thing.
Billy is difficult as hell and also barely gives any pay-off relative to the effort put in. Nurse is insanely difficult, but also gives a lot of payoff for mastery. Blight is difficult while less so than Nurse (because 115% and simpler to pick up Rushing, even if not using it well, whereas Nurse can't hit at all without her power), but is also limited because there are multiple tiles or loops he can't use his power on at all if there are no helpful surrounding objects because the structure of the tile itself doesn't allow for sliding/ideal bump logic. So some tiles, he's still mostly forced to be a regular M1 115% killer, and survivors who are aware of that will take Blight there. Same with things like Yamaoka shack, which Blight cannot slide on.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2824133#Comment_2824133
Yes, I have played Blight myself and yes, he's easy. Billy is one of my mains and Nurse is so difficult to learn, that I understand why she's allowed to be one of the top killers. I tried her for a while and just got fed up. So believe me when I say that comparing Blight to Billy and Nurse, there's absolutely no competition on how easy Blight is.
I also noticed you mentioned Billy and Plague, both killers I main, and they definitely don't punish dead zones as much as Blight, because their micro is harder. Blight, I just run into a wall or tree or barrel or rock and I'm going to hit you. With Billy, it's extremely difficult, when compared to Blight, to hit someone in a dead-zone, just because his hit box is smaller and he has less control of his chainsaw sprint. Blight's sprint doesn't zig-zag like crazy when he activates it.
Plague, you slow down when you projectile vomit and a survivor zig-zagging is very effective against her projectile vomit at any amount of distance that is more than 5 to 8 meters out. Plus you have to be on target for a while before survivors get the broken status from her vomit. Again, Blight's hit box is crazy big compared to Plague.
I've not a novice with Huntress either and even though her hit-boxes are as big as Blight, she still has to charge up her hatchet and makes a groaning sound when she does it and slows down. Blight never slows down. I would be hard-pressed to say Huntress is easier to use than Blight on Dead-Zones.
The difficulty from Blight comes from adapting to maps + mindgames with players who are experienced in facing Blight. Both sides have a lot of options. Blight can tackle a loop from a lot of ways (or only a few, depending on the loop and surrounding objects), and the survivor is also aware of that and both mindgame the other. It is just blatantly false to label Blight as low-skill lmao.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2824088#Comment_2824088
Blight isn't fun for both parties. He's a low skill killer that gets to down you the second you leave a loop. And heaven forbid you are in a dead-zone.
He basically an much easier Nurse but with about 95% of the downing potential.
What’s the point of spreading such blatant falsehoods?
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Map offerings would be fine if every map was balanced. As it stands, they shouldn't exist, or their function should be inverted (reducing/preventing chance of map).
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Hag/stealth. For the sole and exclusive reason I’m super weak to jumpscares. Has nothing to do with balance/mechanics/etc otherwise.
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lol no
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lol no
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@Deadeye said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2820314#Comment_2820314
counter? u mean hit? like granting the protection hit? or do you mean "walk around"? like what you cant do in small passages? how about move around the survivor as counterplay to that perk? or hit to remove the hitbox?
Yes have to give up a hit and the resultant 3s cooldown while you've been pushed even further away. Yeah, walk around the survivor walking to keep up with you to push you back. It's terrible design because it's not avoidable at all.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2821271#Comment_2821271
It is a bug
You cannot unhook yourself in the second stage, so why does unhooking yourself take you straight to second stage despite the fact you can only attempt it on first stage? From the looks of it the game still gives you the 'attempt to unhook yourself' penalty even if you succeed
This wasn't a thing before, it only semi-recently became a thing after they tweaked the attempting to unhook yourself animation/penalty
As @sizzlingmario4 said, the time will tick during the attempt itself. This has been a thing for a while. Attempt earlier.
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Don’t go down near it. Problem solved.
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Hopefully the best designed/balanced killer gets fixed and re-enabled soon.
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@SensualPotato said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2821286#Comment_2821286
So do you have any other suggestions, then? The stuff I posted obviously isn't intended to be perfect systems, which is why everything needs polish. But I can assure you the current system is not stopping DC's from happening anyway, so why continue to punish people who are left in the 3v1? I'm all for more ideas, otherwise it reads like you're disagreeing just to disagree.
The remaining survivors should still get punished for their own DC if they were queued with the survivor that DC'd.