Skittlesthehusky
Skittlesthehusky
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- Skittlesthehusky
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it looks like the thread that had it got nuked, i cant find it anymore. but at this point is a frequent weekend issue so :shrug: gotta assume it'll keep happening until otherwise
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@cogsturning said:
We're at 9 hours now. The posts are getting earlier and earlier. The previous was two hours later than this one. The one before that was two hours later than that.
its a good thing at least bc it keeps this post busy
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i think it would make sense to have anything that's cinematic and doesn't contribute to gameplay or the timing of things, as either killer or survivor, should be able to be skipped or turned off im ngl. i can't see it being so critical that it has to be witnessed by everybody
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4040555#Comment_4040555
Oh God is that today's flavor? I'm choosing to dodge this time.
LMAO its not exact that its more like autopsy photos, but its still mildly annoying. people just do anything nowadays to get a reaction
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@cogsturning said:
I thought they were gonna get us on Christmas day. My predictions are getting weak.
merry christmas, heres an ISIS beheading or something stupid
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@AcesSpeedo said:
as someone said not everyone celebrates xmas but also you have to remember not everyone has the luck of being able to celebrate xmas with family or friends and could very well be dealing with a lot themselves. i know it sucks to be on the receiving end of someone who may not have had the nicest xmas but it's an explanation as to why they might not play as forgiving as someone in your usual match. whilst we spent time receiving and gifting presents they were probably alone and tbh, i'd rather them take their frustrations out on me in a game of dbd if it makes them feel better on christmas. just take it with a grain of salt really, try not to get to caught up in it. it's a tricky one i suppose. i think just be grateful that your issues on christmas is having a sweaty dbd game and not having no one to spend xmas with.
thats how i see it anyways
this basically. for perspective, while i personally don't go out of my way to make people miserable during christmas, i am not as joyous as others and my expectations of having a good holiday is always low, either due to isolation or terrible circumstances. so i'd probably be using DBD to escape right now if i wasn't still in bed right now.
it may come out in the way i play because i tend to be less tolerant or forgiving of others, which might translate to "making people's christmas games horrible" for others. but the intentions aren't to cause pain. some of us just want to keep ourselves busy until dec. 26th.
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it's so funny that we've reached the point where people are so bored that they're creating accounts just to complain about things in order to milk interactions almost weekly. what a waste of time and resources honestly
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039946#Comment_4039946
If you're interested in things like hard truths and narratives, you might benefit from reading up on Plato's Dialectics. Its a fascinating perspective into how subjectivism can adapt into objectivity. Its also a topic about the hardest truths of all, like learning from one's mistakes and identifying when subjectivity can be a detriment to objectivism. Instead of looking up players on social media to be angry at for their opinions, it could be a more productive way to kill an afternoon.
+1 for being a philosophy buff. you wonderful human being
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@jedimaster505 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039938#Comment_4039938
it's calling a spade a spade and citing relevant household names as clear examples. the only "bait" factor is that it goes against the killer main victim narrative being pushed on big social media platforms like YouTube, Reddit and Twitter. I tell the hard truth whereas the major content creators have an audience to pander to so they water down their PC opinions to gain acceptance from the hive mind.
we respect you for providing a perspective to the discussion, but the opening post seems to have a heavy bias against killers and language that doesn't really feel like it's meant to promote conversation with you specifically. it sounds very 'my answer is the only right answer, this group of people i'm talking about is terrible'. this is very common of bait posts and 'us vs them' rhetoric on these forums.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039917#Comment_4039917
That's kinda what I said? I just think there's more psychological aspects to it. Getting humped for four minutes or 4-man slugged isn't just a time waster, it's a morale killer. The faster you get away from it, the more likely you are to queue up again. Everything is about retaining engagement. Saying it's entitlement or favoritism is just silly.
I don't think there should be any abandon options so I'm not advocating for either the ones we have or any new ones. I still get humped/bled out for 4 minutes and I just accept it, but I'd like to see in-game solutions, like fast bleedouts or self-recovery. I don't want any more reasons for abandons.
that's a fair point. the only challenge i have for this response is that there's still going to be circumstances where people will simply choose not to engage at all if not given an ability to escape their situation as part of the same psychological aspects you're talking about, and it's primarily because of the emotional aspect.
people don't like seeing themselves in a losing situation, period. it's worse when they're forced to confront it and they're the type of individual to try and avoid something like that at all costs. even if there's a way out via. in-game means, as long as they are still in what they consider a dead match, they have no reason to continue. i can see fast bleed-outs being beneficial and a potential countermeasure to this, but depending on how it's implemented, a player may intentionally get themselves slugged so they have access to a "legal" way of leaving the match like they would with intentionally dying or throwing a game in general.i think the issue is less so the features and the game, but instead an individual-specific issue. you can't patch out emotions or the human ego unfortunately.
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@runningguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039913#Comment_4039913
actually the abandon option was designed to prevent survivors being needlessly humped for 4min. it was designed as a way to get out of a hopeless situation instead of having time wasted for no reason. The abandon option has been used far beyond what it was designed to do. Now its used as a skip 5 to 10 seconds of mori (dont see why killer cant have abandon to skip 5 to 10 seconds of hitting people out the gate, thats what survivor currently have). Also used as a free go next. one throws, the team quickly finds out whats happening and decides "this match is a bust" and they all throw…when all downed or hooked all abandon, go next penalty free. i have seen players stand by and watch as team mates drop then last player runs out not to help the team mates but gets downed intentionally just to abandon.
My point is the abandon option was designed to let players out of a hopeless match where all are downed, saving them 4min. It has been used far beyond its purpose which is why so many killer feel they should either get the same choice or the survivor side abandon needs to be reworked.
@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039909#Comment_4039909
Two minutes? If you go hide in the basement and cry, sure, but you can just push them out in seconds. That isn't the case if a killler is humping you to death for 4 minutes.
Also, you could argue the opposite. Survivors get to leave matches more because they lose matches more (which is a statistical fact) and want to move on faster. I hate the abandon feature but I'm pretty sure it's there to make survivors hop into another game faster instead of getting annoyed with their 5th mori of the session and logging off instead.
i'd argue that it has the potential to serve both purposes, allowing survivors to escape excessive slugging or unplayable experiences, while also skipping things that waste time (mori animations at the end of the game for example). both situations are the equivalent of skipping a cutscene to me and i see it justifiable, since things like cinematics or waiting for players to leave does not contribute to the core gameplay.
i can agree that the abandon feature is being misused, but also at the same time who's to say that it really is getting misused if the person is simply tired of seeing the same things over and over again and would like to move on? i'm not defending the serial disconnectors, the people who refuse to play the game, or people who "forsee" an outcome and pre-emptively leave, but i can understand if someone quickly wants to move onto another match because something is genuinely a waste of time or isn't necessary.
the problem is how do you account for those who misuse it? it's like the usage of a gun. a gun is a useful tool for hunting, gathering, or destruction of an object. yet, it can also be used to murder or cause undue harm. unfortunately there's really no real answer to something like that outside of either allowing it for everyone regardless of the circumstance, or simply not allowing it at all.at least i can't think of a way you could successfully stop malicious intent without limiting those who do have reasonable intent.
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my ideal year for DBD would be for both us as a community and the developers to focus entirely on bringing the game to a state where we can all have a worthwhile experience.
i think the introduction of public custom matches and true customization of the game would make a huge difference.
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@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039844#Comment_4039844
Excuse Them? You buy something, it should work. End of story. Stop with this equivocation and broad generalizations. I have bought eevery killer. I cant reliably play every killer because they didnt bug test. Now they want me to bug test for them. What on earth is so hard about this to understand? You want to be an intern that pays to work somewhere?!?!
you are doing the equivalent of QA and bug testing from the very start if you ever offered feedback to BHVR by any means. i fail to see the difference.
once again i will repeat myself because i don't know how to make this any clearer to you: i do not disagree that the burden of quality testing and mistakes should be placed on the customer. i disagree that BHVR is not allowed to make the process of providing feedback and communication easier.
since you are hard pressed on accusing me of making excuses for BHVR, then i'll go ahead and make an excuse for them. :)
respectfully, BHVR does not care about your emotions regarding these changes and this is not going to change anything, because this isn't about you. no company that focuses more on growing every day cares about what you choose to not do in spite of their decision.
and rightfully so, because it is people like you that hamper progress. you seem like the type of person to complain about something being an issue, but take no steps to resolve them and instead wait for someone else to address it because "it's not my problem/has nothing to do with me". whether you like it or not, sometime somewhere, something is always going to require community effort to make a difference. what BHVR chooses to do with this is up to them, just as it is up to you as to whether or not you even bother to try to help.
you can do what you want. nobody is forcing you to " work", nobody is telling you to offer feedback. but do not complain when something you care about is broken and it continues to take 20 years for BHVR to make it right, like some issues already have for a combination of reasons.
it is individuals like you that give companies an excuse to be detached and tone deaf to positive changes, rather than capitalizing off of opportunities to hold them accountable.
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@Callahan9116 said:
Replicated where? There are tons of games and DLCS that release without being buggy piles of mess. Knight and houndmaster are still bugged as I am writing this.
@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039491#Comment_4039491
Wowww you make so many excuses for them
Its not too much to except you bought something and it works.
and you're trying to defend the fact that you believe that BHVR is entirely obligated to conform to your unique expectations as an individual, by claiming that i am (somehow) making excuses for them. i am merely presenting a reality to you. excusing them would be forgiving them entirely for their wrongdoings. as far as i'm concerned, trying to improve a system is not a wrongdoing but rather an optimization, so i don't know where you are getting this from?
the replication i'm speaking of is in our current society, not just the video games you play. you see this in fast food services, governments, industries, and even in personal relationships. there's a specific subset of people that will do everything possible to make sure that they are not held accountable for anything they do. what i was talking to @Wezqu about is outside of what i was discussing with you.
trust me, i understand your position. i agree that, when it applies, a company should be responsible for things that go wrong that clearly could be prevented from the very beginning and that the customer shouldn't bear the responsibility or the burden of a mistake. i don't agree, however, that a company shouldn't improve things when they have the opportunity to do so and shouldn't ask for feedback. being shortsighted spells disaster not just for them, but for the customers that want their product and its quality.
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@Wezqu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039502#Comment_4039502
Its the sad reality of the current society with no patience of any kind. Some people expect everything to be ready and that they would not have to lift a finger to get something done. Its sad to see but thats where the society seems to be moving towards. In reality nothing is ever really ready and sometimes you have to do something to get it how you like it. The world is not existing for you it exist despite of you.
very well said. :(
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@Wezqu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039413#Comment_4039413
Yeah I don't understand people who keep complaining about some bug in the game and then don't even bother reporting it. Like even if they experience the bug often does not mean most other players do. This game is surprisingly complicated game with a lot of different things that can get bugged several ways.
I have seen some content makers complaining of bugs that have not been fixed but they don't take the time to even report it. Then some point somebody that watched them reports it but then there is no logs or anything because those are in the streamers computer and fan can't even give those and the id is wrong too because the reporter is not the person who experienced it so behavior can't find the match from their servers logs.
Then we have those that report things that are not bugs. There is currently a report of someone reporting that Overcharge is not working correctly when their description of how it should work is not correct as they are describing Eruption perks effects. Then we have several of those that state that their customization items or some of them are missing when they only have somehow some filters on that cause them to not be shown. This also shows quite a lot don't know what is a bug and what is not. The customization not showing up would be maybe few minute figuring out the problem on the screen checking all options you have to get it to work. That would be what I would do in that situation first myself.
doublepost, but i agree. part of why everything is such a mess is because of the lack of tangible effort from everyone: from those who expect BHVR to wave a magic wand, and from BHVR's lack of being proactive when it matters. it's amusing but also somewhat sad to see because this is replicated almost anywhere you go.
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@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039413#Comment_4039413
ThThis Game has an insane amount of bogs. You want me to spend 10-15 minutes reporting? For what? They could EASILY make a blank format where you talk, dont need a profile and have an LLM data entry. Asking your consumers to work for you is ballsy when they already bought the product. Furthermore, reporting bugs and behaviors never feels like it does anything.
so from what im understanding, you want a flawless product on a silver platter, 100% of the time, because you paid for a license to gain access to a service that sees changes every month? you don't want to put in any effort to help BHVR identify issues while they're giving you the opportunity to do so.
yes, the game has many bugs because they are working with a code base that is based off of a very old version of unreal engine. yes, they have had their issues with patching things on time. but this has nothing to do with the fact that you are insinuating that you want your cake and to eat it too. rather than being open to helping, you wrote a complaint on the forums about a system that isn't only for you.
when you bought your license, you agreed to all the terms in the EULA, including BHVR reserving the right to make any changes as they see fit.
C. Updates: Possible Setbacks and Loss of Data
IMPORTANT: BHVR MAY FIND IT NECESSARY TO MAKE UPDATES, OR RESET CERTAIN PARAMETERS TO BALANCE GAME PLAY AND USAGE OF BHVR SERVICES. THESE UPDATES OR “RESETS” MAY CAUSE YOU SETBACKS WITHIN THE RELEVANT GAME AND MAY AFFECT CHARACTERS, GAMES, GROUPS OR OTHER ENTITLEMENTS UNDER YOUR CONTROL. BHVR RESERVES THE RIGHT TO MAKE THESE UPDATES AND IS NOT LIABLE TO YOU FOR THESE CHANGES.
they technically don't have to do anything for you. they're not obligated to resolve bugs as per this specific paragraph. but they're still putting in effort to communicate and improve the product where they can anyway by adding a service that streamlines their workflow while being transparent to the end user.
you don't have to do anything, and you're not obligated to promote feedback. that's perfectly fine. but encouraging people to not help because "BHVR is responsible for everything" is an unhelpful mindset and can actually harm the game even more than it already has been with some of the poor decisions they made.
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happy holidays :]
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@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4039232#Comment_4039232
Holy airball, can you glaze a company any harder that that? Turbotax is a tax document, this is entertainment. Stop making excuses for them, and tell them to fix the game. There are bugged characters that have been bugged since release, (knight, houndmaster).
i didn't know offering a different perspective and playing devil's advocate was considered "making excuses" and "glazing" nowadays. turbotax was additional context to what i'm trying to discuss with you.
the developers are at least making an attempt at fixing the game. they're also offering a resource to allow you to offer feedback.they can't fix something that they also don't know is there to begin with. that's one of the reasons for why this system exists. to acknowledge and to show progress where people are asking for it. if you don't want to participate, you are not obligated to.
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at this point i think i would prefer a ranked mode than continuously playing in the pubs we have now. i want to take my experience to the next level. it would be a good change of pace.
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i don't think corrupt being base kit is going to help the issue for setup time. like others have said, corrupt would cause the survivors to run into you quickly, which hampers your ability to be able to use your traps right away. the more adequate solution would be to delay survivors from reaching generators at the beginning of the match quickly. ideally, this can be done by changing spawns and making it so survivors spawn at a point that is at a minimum distance from generators. however, this also risks making distance-covering killers stronger, since now it's practically guaranteed that they can interrupt early-game progress.
potentially, another solution would be to have traps pre-set at spawn. if the killer wants to adjust their traps, still they have the ability to pick up and replace or simply recycle a trap. frankly i'd recommend this method since it increases the risk factor of using tiles earlier and can bridge the gap in early-to-mid game pressure. i feel like this is also fair, since survivors could counter this by bringing perks or items to find these traps quickly.
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@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4038736#Comment_4038736
I dont want to work on a game i paid to play. When you work you are supposed to get something. Maybe they could give shards or something for actual useful ones. Im not working for free, and neither should you.
you're right to want to receive an experience in which there are no bugs present in the product you bought and paid for. you're also not expected to contribute to anything if you don't want to. however, you paid for a license to have access to a live service, not a finalized product. this live service is subject to many changes that may or may not impact your experience using said product. the product may have oversights, in which the developers of said product may rely on external feedback to improve the user experience. no product is perfect, and feedback helps said product improve if its applicable. you're not entitled to compensation for providing external feedback. this is standard with live services or products that are receiving support. technically, behaviour also is not obligated to listen to your feedback either. but they are providing you an opportunity to say something about their product in order to help them improve it.
there's also a double-edged sword with providing compensation for bug-hunting. putting an incentive behind bug-hunting encourages feedback, but can also encourage false reports or misrepresentation of issues. this can burn resources if something is misreported, which takes away from being able to address other issues that can be more pressing or increases risk of addressing an issue incorrectly and making it more likely to break something else. that's probably why bug bounties are not often done by companies. regardless, this is all a choice that they are not obligated to make.
if you buy intuit's turbotax, which is technically a live service product, and you encounter an issue, would you not contact them for support or provide information about your issue? do you expect them to pay you for reporting an issue to them? this still falls under "working for free" in your case, but because it is something more important by relating to your taxes, you would be much more inclined to provide the information to them to resolve your issue. bug reporting is no different. -
@Callahan9116 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4038715#Comment_4038715
You can integrate them yourself, stop expecting your consumers to work for free and do data entry on a problem you made by not testing properly.
the whole point of this system is to replace the forums and make bug reporting more efficient according to them. how are you expecting them to be able to accurately track the presence of bugs from a game that has over 500,000+ functions and lines of code, not even counting issues that the game engine itself can cause?
problem tracking is not efficient with forums, point blank. forums are a communications platform, not project management software. this workflow is for assisting the engineers and programmers to help them do their job more efficiently while adding the benefit of transparency for the users.realistically, how and what do you expect out of bug reporting when bug reporting itself IS data entry, and you don't want to do it? it is what helps them support the game in the first place. do you not want them to even remotely try to make your experience with the game more tolerable?
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@I_CAME said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4038687#Comment_4038687
They just want people to get less bloodpoints. It's an intentional design choice as evidenced by how they nerfed the drop rate of cakes during the anniversary.
this. from what i'm witnessing, the goal seems to be increasing in-game time to give you more exposure to micro-transactions, thus increasing the likelihood that you will buy something. this same type of tactic is deployed in a lot of modern games.
it's very similar to how big-name grocery stores have end caps at cash registers and self-checkouts. they want you to spend a dollar or two more before you leave.
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to be fair: DBD has a lot of moving parts. from a software developer/IT perspective, a platform like this is actually pretty crucial in trying to find hot spots and make priorities out of things that otherwise may be difficult to find, or gets missed during QA.
while it is their job to find bugs before they release a patch, this helps speed up that process a bit. i think this is also part of their attempt to be transparent about what is being addressed. it's a good step in the right direction.
you don't have to use this form either. they also encouraged that you make a report in their discord as well.
the forums were good for this while there was a little less going on, but now that there's so many issues coming up, the forums are limited in information for what the community can see and they can't accurately show the status of things that are getting addressed. i say this is fine and kind of necessary given the magnitude amount of issues going on.
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@ArcT said:
Absolutely wild to be posting a personal attaboy and cash grab like this while the game and the community are in the state that they're in on the heels of a completely failed and abandoned nearly year long 'health initiative'.
the game itself and IP section of DBD, at least in my eyes, two separate products. that's the only thing that can explain the disjointed perspectives. that's really no fault to them, BHVR is a business that aims to grow every year. that's part of the reason as to why mathieu is on the front-lines hosting events right now and focusing specifically on that.
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unfortunately i think this is currently a difficult issue to address. i've been seeing them pop up more frequently recently too. they're all over tiktok especially. the best thing you can do is simply report and discourage people from purchasing these services.
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posting over to bury this and encourage people to post over. heres a cat. pls flag the post above. thank you
edit: post was in reference to gore that was uploaded to forum. mods can hide this if they wish ty
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posting over to encourage burying this until mods wake up. here's a cat
edit: post was in reference to gore that was uploaded to forum. mods can hide this if they wish ty
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4038192#Comment_4038192
There's four total in recent posts. I'm trying to flag them but I'm getting hit with a spam block, which is wild.
yeah unfortunately there's a timer on how many reports you can make. i think its like 5 minutes from each other or something
vanilla kinda sucks as a forum platform lol i hope they get addressed promptly. people are strange -
placing another post to incentivize others to keep posting over gore/shocker posts like this.
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unfortunately we have another one. i'm placing this post here to bury this one.
its a shame what the forums are like now -
@Junylar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4036305#Comment_4036305
unfortunately it's a rat race when it comes to cheating
Only when it comes to client-sided cheats, like wallhacks, aimbots, etc. When it comes to things like speedhack, insta gens, game hostages, self-revive, etc., where you can validate an action against the game state, you don't even need anti-cheat, it's permanently fixable with server validation, as it's done in any other multiplayer game where such cheats are impossible. This commonplace ignorance about what server validation is and how these two kinds of cheats are fundamentally different is the main reason why the playerbase underestimates DbD's vulnerability to cheats (and lack of effort to fix it). People just say "well you can't win against cheaters, it's back and forth, mmmkay", but you actually can, server validation makes speedhack impossible once and forever.
that's a fair argument, though my position isn't that it's worthless to attempt to combat cheating as a whole, more-so that people will continuously try to find ways around it and that eventually even server-side validation may only address half the battle. i am well aware such technology exists. i do believe BHVR is well within their means to deploy something right now to begin to address it as well, but the speed in which they do so is questionable and determined by multiple factors.
my comment was more of a question: what could truly be done about cheating as a whole? hence why i stated it's a rat race. inevitably, something will be reverse engineered or cracked by someone determined enough. you can only prevent certain kinds of cheats as the server, but as long as a person has access to some information as the client, as well as sending information, something is still at risk of being vulnerable or modified. this can even be something as simple as user input. for example: can you truly validate if someone's aim with a mouse is actually legitimately a human's, or a bot?if we are to deploy server-side validation, there's still issues that needs to be solved as a developer:
you also have to take into account performance, both in networking as well as physical game performance. in order to adequately perform checks, the server needs to be given time to think about the information it received from a client, give it the okay, then permit the action. this can add more latency to a game that already has some issues with accurately registering game events. now you have to create or modify an existing system, including scripts you have running within the game's engine, to account for this latency, which adds complexity and more time to the development cycle.
in theory you could engineer it where the server and client both run something akin to a simulation and pass checks to each other, but then you have to write a system intelligent enough to be able to determine if the client is sending legitimate data… in which someone may engineer a counter to that solution to trick the server into passing that data, to which BHVR then has to engineer another solution to counter that counter… so on, so forth. and this is where kernel-level anti-cheat COULD come in, but there's solutions to that too as you can see by our current issues.
i'm not saying that preventative measure are impossible and not worth it, but this is a much more complex problem than merely just implementing server-side validation. that's why i asked such a question if you know what i mean? it very easily becomes a pigeon hole when you realize how solutions can be dismantled. it is always an interesting discussion to have though, and i do hope that BHVR at least does something about all of this in the future.
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i'm not sure if this really falls under "code of conduct", per say, but i often say to myself to simply try and have a good game when i load in. whether this means winning or losing is entirely dependent on how i feel or what my goal is.
i also be sure to treat other's with respect and practice a level of stoicism if someone tries to impede on my peace. i find that the game offers a good mental exercise from time to time.
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i agree that it is very frustrating. i understand that their recent change to give all maps a (supposed) equal chance to be given was put in place to prevent realms from suffocating one-off maps, but it's been getting increasing noticeable that certain maps are popping up too frequently over others.
lery's, RPD, midwich, dvarka, the game, and hawkin's have come up most commonly for me. i have seen less of eyrie's, garden of joy, and redwood. i rarely see the other realms. i think lery's is the most frequent map i end up loading into and it's a little disconcerting.
i'm unsure what they did with the map chances as of late, but i really miss having variety. it does get very boring seeing the same 6 maps each time i log in. i suppose the easiest way around this is to simply join groups and play customs rather than playing public matches nowadays. perhaps this is the new way?
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unfortunately it's a rat race when it comes to cheating. i believe even if they did somehow come around to investing the money into a better anti-cheat solution, reverse engineering will always exist and someone will always find a way around it.
if it's man-made, it's hackable. that's the rule with all technology that we've made as a species. this still doesn't really excuse the fact that there doesn't seem to even be a visible effort to confront these issues outside of the reporting system. sadly it feels as if BHVR's interests are entirely elsewhere at this point. part of this is why i don't really play pubs as frequently as i used to and stick almost entirely to custom games.
it reminds me of older multiplayer games where cheaters would intentionally grief servers until everyone left. i do miss when modding and hacking was done for fun and amusement through absurdity rather than solely gaining an advantage or making someone's experience miserable.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3989152#Comment_3989152
Welcome to any form of online communication.
Or any form, really.
Brain likes generalising things for ease of processing.
Issue is that that generalising is almost always wrong in some way.
it's a shame, really. unfortunately negativity is what draws the crowd and makes the show.
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i hate to say it, but i'm to the point where i'm really starting to dislike the amount of generalization some of these community members tend to do. why do we insist on lumping others up with bad actors? not everybody uses anonymous mode to troll. sometimes people want peace. not everyone needs to be punished because someone decided to act a fool. lol
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i think it's great that bhvr has decided to ramp up communication and has been trying to be more direct with their audience in comparison of how it used to be. however, the frustration that comes with playing a game that's been in a less-than-stellar state kind of wears on you after a little while. i think when it comes to the handling of how the community tends to react to things, they're definitely trying to handle things the best that they can.
i just think that repeatedly saying "sorry" to things that are a very clear oversight and not addressing it right away kind of gets old after a bit. especially if it follows after something that has already went wrong in the past, or is a repeat of another mistake. -
@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3981416#Comment_3981416
As a Software QA Engineer, and someone with a degree is game development, the fundamental problem of games is the scale of new content and non negotiable release schedules.
You don't want manual testing in software development, it's error prone, time consuming and costly. You want automation as much as possible, and even if you could automate it (which would involve a pretty incredible test harness that I balk at the idea of even attempting to write), DBD's fundamental issue is it has so many potential interactions between killers, survivors, perks, items, add-ons, maps that even such a theoretical test harness would have literal millions of possible combinations, and would takes hours, probably days, to run on EVERY change.
I am not defending the quality of the releases, even as a programmer apologist, they've been pretty glaringly bad... and while I also hate the casual use of the phrase "spaghetti code" as an insult, the fact is some of these bugs do raise the question of how are they are occurring for seemingly unrelated features being updated. However in the same breath... it's just unrealistic to expect any level of manual testing to cover all these combinations, find these issues, isolate and report them, investigate and fix them all in time for the extremely tight release schedule.
What I do think might help is get the community involved a lot more, build the PTB to be a much more effective test build environment and give incentives in the real game for players to search for bugs.
Time based rewards doesn't work cause you get people who AFK farm, but establish a test queue system where instead of 1vs4, players can play 1vs1 or 1vs2 games with the rest as bots who AFK until the killer walks with 4m of them, to just experiment with new mechanics.
Add tally's/heat maps of what other players are playing in menus so players can see who is online and what might need covering. Make testing things in the PTB as easy as possible with short queue times and special mechanics with better support for testing purposes.
Create a proper in game reporting sysyem, and give actual rewards back to the main account for making good bug reports.
this goes back to what i've been saying about the strain dead by daylight has been under as a product for a long while. project management and product testing becomes a nightmare when you introduce so many objects that have to be accounted for. this is probably as real of a "biting off more than you can chew" scenario as you can get.
and unfortunately with the added pressure of being a live service game, you're forced to operate within the lifespan of the game in order to grow your business, which incentivizes the usage of release schedules. this would be more manageable if dead by daylight wasn't scaled so aggressively i feel.
i'm not a software engineer, but looking at this from both a systems administrator and business owner's perspective gives me a migraine. i can only imagine what the project pipeline looks like now with all of the constraints they imposed on themselves.
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i hate to be that type of person, but maybe this was needed, with all due respect.
from what has transpired over the past couple of years, i think the company needs to be reminded of what happens when you lose sight of your product and your audience
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@Rlabotath said:
I'll start by saying your analysis on the perks is a bit off. Yes, the Teamwork perks are… Well, the Teamwork archetype is just bad as a whole, let's just leave it at that. And I'll agree, Rick Grimes' other perks are quite mid. However, Michonne's are what used to be called "5th perks." To explain, these are perks you have to play around in the off chance they are being played, meaning their existence in the game means you have to play around it. If a Survivor dies around a window, what if someone has Background Player, Window kick? But I can't leave them because anti-slug perk. It's not so bad yet because players are still figuring out how amazing they can be, but it requires smart play to occur.
To answer why they don't release perks in a stronger state, I reference the Mettle Meta. To play Killer when Mettle of Man was strong was… Awful. It immediately required most killer players to find some way to apply exposed so they didn't have to deal with MoM. It was called the Pay to Win Paragraph, and rightfully so. But then they nerfed it, and everyone reacted as if they were baited into buying the DLC.
In regards to the perks that are "usable" that's because there are certain mechanics that when broken, grant Survivors an immense advantage. Having 3 health states with Dead Hard is one such example. Having DS for a "Get out of tunnel free" card is another (I don't advocate tunneling, but let's face it, it happens.) Certain perks make it into the meta when they define the new meta. MFT was such an example. Everyone truly believed that the %3 haste had such a massive effect on the match, so much so that Otz and Hens tested it (although their test was probably the worst control test I've ever seen, no offense to them.) It defined a meta, in which people attempted to abuse haste as much as possible, thus haste stacking was born. The penultimate example would be Circle of Healing.
I truly believe the Devs are struggling because their publisher overhead/Chinese Company "Partner" is looking for millions of dollars while the game is going through a "health patch." This put strain on the Devs who are probably overworked and screwing up due to all the pressures on them. And who do players blame when there are problems? The Devs.
Are they innocent? No, this chapter is a dumpster truck of bugs.
Are they solely at fault? No, the publishers and Chinese Company "Partner" could have told them to take the time needed to fix these glaringly obvious bugs. But they won't, because they don't care about you or I, they care about our Wallets.
Should we blame the devs? Yes? But also no. We should document EVERYTHING, and make it clear to the publisher that our wallets are locked until they give the devs actual time to fix the game.
Will players stop putting money in? No, because people are fickle and will give up on the fight when they really want the next Feng Ming costume with yet another set of bunny ears.
So in summary: Players will bash the devs instead of the two parties actually responsible for this: Those that want money, and those who give them money.
very well said. thank you for your perspective
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unfortunately even as i'd like to play devils advocate, it's to the point where i can't really defend the development team for the lack of adequate quality control anymore. between the backlog, to releasing patches that are clearly not ready yet, to the rush to create content for licenses as a priority over taking the time to properly address issues is kind of sad to see.
over the years, dead by daylight has progressively become more of a hot mess. and i think that even with some of the good patches and fixes come through, they tend to get overshadowed by little things very quickly. understandably, the community will always nitpick SOMETHING. but when it comes to repeated issues, bugs that exist for years or get reintroduced, or stuff making it to live servers that has not been properly tested and thoroughly considered, it adds up and outweighs the benefits that some patches can bring and i start to believe that a lot of the general complaints and criticisms mentioned by the community are justified.
it's kind of a shame that live service games like this have become such a standard in the gaming industry. it's also a shame that dead by daylight is being given the treatment that all triple A live service titles receive. rather than improving the product, its gradually becoming full of microtransactions and gradually being adjusted to become a shell of itself. there appears to be no cohesion between departments and it's greatly affecting the quality of the game.
this game is no longer a passion project. it's a corporate cash cow that got sucked up by its own popularity and monetary value. there's a focus on frequency, not quality. it's part of the reason why i don't spend money in this game anymore, personally. while i'd like to support BHVR and believe that not all contributions to the game are negative, i can't bring myself to support something like this like i used to.
the game is still fun sometimes, don't get me wrong. but it's just what you'd expect out of a generic live service game now, and this game just so happens to catch you because it targets profitable icons and content creators who show it off to their viewers. not its substance. it's still capable of building communities and giving people something to share memories together, but is it really deserved or worth it at this point?
that's all i gotta say, i'm going to bed
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this makes me really wish DBD had some sort of way for you to walk around and observe the entirety of the realms rather than just pieces of them. i know that the entity cobbles them together like they're legos, but sometimes i wish to see what the places actually looked like as if they were still one whole, yknow?
i think it would make for a very interesting way to navigate realm-based lore, but unfortunately i don't think lore is cared about as much nowadays.
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as someone who's been having intermittent DNS issues as of recent (im an IT guy, so i have my own network that i setup), i too have been getting punished by the DC penalty in ways im not used to, and i'm not necessarily a fan of it. i understand that players should not be subjected to a killer or a survivor DCing on them at the worst possible time. it makes sense to do things this way.
however, there's many variables to this problem that BHVR is trying to solve that's rendering this penalty system to be more of a pain than anything. i've had a major gripe with this system ever since its introduction a few years ago, and i honestly wish it was never added to the game.
for one, the game does not have the ability to determine whether or not a DC is on purpose or not. thus, BHVR has made it so that it is going to punish everyone equally regardless of the circumstance. this is fine and, in a perfect world, this system would be wonderful since it encourages everyone to play by the rules and accommodate them.
with how the game and what reality we're in, though, this does not work for the following reasons:
1.) this game is notorious for being unstable
unplayable FPS drops, bugs and glitches, engine issues or unexpected behavior in the game can cause a player to DC or give a reason to DC. for some platforms, this is much more common. players are unfairly being subjected to matchmaking bans for circumstances that are out of their control.
2.) this game has a track record of cheaters rendering the game unplayable
given that cheaters are at an all-time high for the game, players are put in predicaments that cause or incentivize people to DC. whether its them not wanting to play or contribute to a cheater's tomfoolery, being put in a situation where they're not in control of their character, or forcefully having their game crashed or client disconnected, this is again something that is out of their control.
3.) the nature of the game does not always account for a healthy player experience
humans are very emotional creatures. this is a given, and we regularly see overreactions or people being unwilling to participate in something they don't like. however, there are genuine circumstances where a player may see a reason to not participate such as; games are completely out of someone's favor and they would like to move on, they are not getting the experience they are trying to obtain, or that they are repeatedly being exposed to undesirable features or situations that have a very negative perception in the community.unfortunately, as nice as it would be to prevent ragequitting and give players an incentive to improve or overcome challenges in the game, these three glaring issues prevent the system from being effective. not to mention that people will always be people, so there will always be ragequitting no matter how much you try to take away the ability to leave the game. if someone does not want to play, they simply wont.
in my honest opinion, i think all restrictions and adjustments applied to public matchmaking that are built into the game need to be removed. there is simply way too much working against it to make it a healthy feature for anyone. at the end of the day, a game lives and dies by its community.
what i would probably recommend is instead to give an option for players to make and host lobbies themselves with rulesets they would prefer and make it so that they are publicly available to join. this way you can ensure that everyone gets a chance to play exactly how they would like to play. i think that most issues that dead by daylight has as a game would be completely mitigated since balancing and preferred methods of play would be in control of the players. if someone does not want to host a lobby, they are free to either join a randomized public queue or select a lobby that best suits their interests for that time. this methodology is what kept multiplayer games like quake alive for many, many years. it even invited creativity and new ideas for gamemodes over the course of time.
its clear that the players want what's best for their experience and many players are very passionate about dead by daylight. why not give us the ability to do just that and love the game for what it is, but in our own way?
that's my two cents.
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honestly? no. i wouldn't want darth vader in the game. due to the media he is from, as well as the aesthetics, he would not fit in the universe of dead by daylight. it would make more sense for star wars to merely be a cosmetic pack of some sort.
going off on a tangent for a moment: i personally miss what dead by daylight used to be thematically and genuinely miss when it didn't have so much content. it's becoming more generic and bloated with each new addition, and it's kind of gotten to the point where it no longer feels like it's own thing. sure, there's no game quite like it in terms of concept, but it now feels like what you'd expect out of a triple A title mainstream game.
while i don't think the game is dying any time soon, it has lost its charm and i can't tell if i'm even enjoying the game for what it is anymore. it's also sad to see that some people share the same notion as me. games are just simply not what they used to be, and it really sucks given that DBD used to be one of my all-time favorite games.. :(
i understand BHVR is in the market of making money. that's the nature of all business. but it's depressing to see the soul in something gradually be sucked away by modern day consumerism.
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you're not the only one. i've been getting them back-to-back so far unfortunately. i just hopped on after not playing for a week and majority of my matches had at least one or two subtle cheaters that were using speed, walls, and softlocking by putting themselves in a dying state when you carry them.
it's getting really difficult trying to get a good game in tonight.
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wait is that actually what her boots look like 😭 i never paid attention until now
girl what did they do to your heels..
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@Defnotmeghead said:
I think a lot of players, on both sides, have complaints about balancing changes, because they dont realize they have been MMR boosted and facing opponents they shouldnt have been able to face in the first place. I'm taking killer specifically for this post due to current changes affecting them the most, but its also true for survivors when medkits were being changed, or when MFT got changed (people saying they now needed to genrush to compete with the killers they were facing, like, duh, you boosted yourself and now you have to deal with the consequences of that).
Think about it, for killers claiming that its impossible to win without slugging, in the past 4 years the following things happened:
Gens have been increased by 10 seconds.
Mapsizes have been reduced.
Basekit generator kicking applies 5% damage and the gen keeps regressing untill the survivor fixed the 5%.
Chase related interactions are 10% shorter for killers, and survivors received a 10% nerf in boost duration.
DS has been nerfed to a point its rarely being used.
Killers in general have been upped in strength.
Less pallets on average.
Less windows on average.
More hooks per square meter of map so less time carrying survivors to hooks.
And sure, BT has been made basekit, sure, hook timers have been increased by 10 seconds. But how often does basekit BT actually trigger unless you tunnel? How often do survivors stay on hook for longer than 60 seconds?
All in all, the game should have been easier for killers in general to the point where they didnt need to rely on slugging, tunnelling and 4 gen regression perks. But yet people did. And now they face survivors who are basically out of their league to the point that they have to keep relying on the things that boosted them to those brackets in the first place.
And while I think there are some valid points, I am also 100% convinced that the vast majority of players have accidentally MMR boosted themselves and now simply have to deal with the consequences untill their MMR lowers to more realistic numbers.
The game has objectively been getting easier for killers, yet you claim its harder than ever. Then maybe the conclusion should be that you're facing opponents that are out of your league.interesting take. i actually had a conversation a long time ago that involved quite a few of the same things you said.
i think with gaming culture in general, a select group of people have gotten very accustomed to being allowed to curbstomp repeatedly rather than taking satisfaction in their own progress. there's a heavy reliance on having the tools rather than the skill it takes to use the tools effectively. MMR has proven this immensely which is why i now think that it should remain the way that it is.
at this point, i'd even argue that a lot of the game's issues have nothing to do with the way its designed, but player psychology. this is prominent throughout the entire gaming industry. -
oddly enough, i haven't really felt much distaste for the swamp. i sometimes feel a bit disconcerted by the tile generations, but i came to realize the map forces you to be strategic and honestly? i like it. it's one of the few maps that requires you to think carefully about what you do.