Jock21
Jock21
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@Murgleïs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3842267#Comment_3842267
You are proving my point. These content creators are comp players with thousands of hours on her. The average player is a bad Nurse so she is not broken or a problem for the game.
And anyway I think a bigger winstreak was gotten on Blight than on Nurse.
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@PreorderBonus said:
Nurse isn't as broken as people often make her out to be, nor does she "ignore the game's mechanics" as is frequently claimed. She simply plays differently and, as such, has a unique form of counterplay. Contrary to popular belief, she doesn't render pallets or windows useless, and her map control has been significantly weakened after all the blink range nerfs.
Yes, she's consistently ranked in the top tier on every tier list, but that's due to her potential performance, which is a far cry from what you typically see from the average pub Nurse.
Will you rarely come across a cracked Nurse who effortlessly shreds your attempts at a bully squad? Probably. But this is true for other strong Killers as well, like Blight, Billy, Spirit, etc. It's simply a consequence of having killers with such a high skill ceiling. This is actually positive for the game, as it rewards players for investing the time and effort to master a character. The only problem here is that the MMR system doesn't function properly, so matches often aren't balanced.
This. Too bad we know that most people on this forum aren't ready to hear it.
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
Nurse is at the tip top as far as potential goes that's not even an argument, but in practice not everyone can tap into to that potential this is not an excuse. I think if they took away the lunge extend addon, made her 4.4 with one blink, and unable to blink between floors, and through walls she'd be fine.
I mean honestly from my 1000 hours of nurse I learned one thing for sure, most survivors refuse to learn her kit and how to effectively loop her, they still camp pallets, still wait at check spots, path the exact same way even though she's downed them however many times etc. the most cracked survivors that I managed to run across all either mained her at one point or labbed to be able to know how to loop her confidently.
While she does need nerfs, she isn't entirely uncounterableb as many seem to think. Yes anyone with over 1k hours on nurse alone will cook most teams, the same is true for all s-b tier killers as far as win rate goes.
What you described in the first paragraph is essentially Chucky but without stealth, third camera or short size.
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Tbh all the killers you've compared Billy except for Oni are considered hella weak.
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She might have got more nerfs than any other killer
except Pig, so that part about her is already a lie. And I've seen some people (including top comp players) argue that Blight and Billy are better or at least on par with Nurse now that her mobility and map pressure is mathematically weaker than theirs, so at the top level she even lost her aura of the undoubtedly best killer in the game cause of the multiple nerfs she received (so saying that these nerfs were just a slap on the wrist is again, a lie). -
@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/432539/should-this-have-been-an-alan-wake-perk
and that is precisely why they did not add such a perk. a perk that brings back god pallets or regular safe pallets is large time sink. the reason why they're adding that in 2vs8 is because there is 2 killers. even if a there are infinity pallets, 2 killer can beat any loop. I believe the perk that is suppose revive pallets is Yui's perk. Any means neccassary. if anyone remembers, this perk used to have an enormous cooldown of 160 seconds.
I believe that original version of the perk was a pallet revive perk. not a pallet pick-up perk. after BVHR likely realized that picking up pallets is near worthless effect, they buffed Any means neccassary several times. nobody uses it since base effect is irrelevant. it has WoO effect now but WoO is better.
If BVHR removed 80% of the instant kick pallet tiles at loops, than a revive perk wouldn't be a bad idea in 1vs1. unfortunately i don't see them removing them. by concession of keeping them, they're unlikely to ever release a pallet re-build perk.
They might add such a perk for one of the future licensed survivors to incentivize people to buy them and once they've got their sells they'll nerf it into the ground. They've already used this tactic for past broken meta perks.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
Agreed, and Grim Embrace should as well
10 seconds of gen blocking really that scary to you ?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Slightly above average Killer Main goes against a Team which really, really wants to win. This is the expceted outcome and it almost never happens. Most of the time this person wins his games quite easily (which is never talked about).
You can almost never win a slightly above average killer main with a team running full gen speed builds ? To me that sounds like an under average survivor main problem.
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@Valuetown said:
Cherry picking one video to match your confirmation bias.
You start with talking about people complaining about killers running four slowdown, then pivot to "good killers don't need gen slowdown." There's a massive leap in argument there.
Unless you're running Myers or Freddy, four slowdown is too much.
I said that cause I saw people suggesting to new killers in this forum whom were asking for advice on how to improve that they don't need to use any gen slowdown perks at all as long as they don't play a low tier killer, which is why I brought it up as an utter BS advice.
Also in this specific match even 4 gen slowdown perks probably would've been enough considering how much they've nerfed it.
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@danielmaster87 said:
Not even 4 gen perks would've changed the outcome of that match. I'm pretty sure there were some hacks going on, but a legit team would probably be only 30 seconds slower than what we saw, just using gen speed builds. But this is why I say that even bad survivors can beat good killers now. Every time you have a favorable chase with them, they just go down in like 20 seconds. But it literally doesn't matter, as long as they know doing gens = win.
I know some people are gonna say, "He misplayed so much." What was he to do differently? Know exactly where they were at all times, and hope they didn't know how to loop? The match was over so fast, there's almost no room for hindsight. Or some would say he should've used a good build instead of a pure chase one. So, if I'm getting this right, a killer should lose 5 gens in ≤5 minutes because they choose one build instead of another? It's silly.
It's beyond parody, the level people expect killers to perform at. It's not even physically possible. All people seem to do is take the cases of clueless solos getting destroyed, and use that to justify killers experiencing the inverse. I agree with Tru3, that the game's never been this sweaty for killer, for worse results than ever. The only reason every single high level match, and even mid-level match, isn't like this one is because of MMR. The MMR is built to deceive you, because it forces bad survivors in with the good ones, against a killer who's actually trying.
People don't look at the grand scheme of things enough, or aren't humble enough to say, "We lost to that killer because our team sucked." I don't care if you say that everyone on the team sucked except you, because I've been there so I'll believe you on that. But it's not as if all these killers we never see at high level, Wraith, Freddy, Pig, Ghost Face, Knight, are suddenly just dominating survivors off their own ability alone. A good swf would beat them 9/10 if not 10/10 times, 4-man and all. I'm not gonna go into detail, but swf is the only group that reaps the benefit of all these survivor changes, because they've never been nerfed, and solo has (in that you get stuck with uncarryable teams). People framing killers winning too much as a problem, but never swf or solos winning too much, is how we got here.
These were the builds the survivors were running, so no actual hacking needed when the game already gives the survivors all the necessary tools to create matches like this (and the survivors also get the courtesy for not getting shamed constantly for using such builds unlike the killers' builds counterpart).
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@jesterkind said:
So, I watched this whole video, but I want to highlight something that is kinda wrong with your post in a way that stands separately from the video itself: You shift the goalposts from complaints about killers running four slowdown perks, to people saying that the killer doesn't need to run any slowdown perks. Those are different statements you'd go about defending or critiquing in different ways.
When it comes to this video being presented as evidence, there's sort of two small flaws that I want to mention, on top of the obvious flaw that this is a single video so it's hard to draw sweeping conclusions from it, and then a sort of potential third thing? It's hard to tell for that, I'll get to it in a second.
The first sort of follows on from my first point. There is a gigantic difference between a balanced and competent build that just happens to not have direct gen defence in it, and what this guy's running which is a gimmick meme build all dedicated to the same thing. There's no info here, there's only one kind of chase perk here, there's nothing that plays off Xeno's strengths as a killer, there's nothing that indicates any kind of coherent gameplan beyond the meme of watching the vault be really really fast. This build may kinda suck, that doesn't speak at all to what you can achieve with other builds that just don't have direct gen defence.
The second thing to point out is that this was a horrendous start to the match, considering this dude just wanders over to main and breaks a breakable wall before pressuring anyone and even flat out ignores survivors he found. Leaving survivors alone to do generators at the start of the match is gonna result in more progression than if they didn't.
The third point is… I'm preeetty sure that all these survivors have toolboxes? It's hard to tell because we don't see the lobby and we don't see the builds at the end of the game, but this looked like a team that was really going hard on gen progression, and flat out - gen speeds in this game are balanced even if you don't bring gen defence, but toolboxes are not. If this video proves anything, then - dependent on whether they all did have toolboxes - it proves that toolboxes are unbalanced. That, or the team were just cheating, which is possible.
My take, personally, is that a lot of stuff went wrong in this particular video. It was a meme build as opposed to a good one, the start of the match was really bad, and the survivors all had a specific tool that itself is the unbalanced thing. It's hard to really draw any conclusions just from this, but it certainly doesn't disprove the notions that builds matter but don't require gen defence specifically, and that toolboxes are unbalanced.
Wandering around at the start of the match in order to find survivors is what literally every single killer who doesn't run Lethal does, but I get it, you need to find a straw to grasp at considering that he hasn't even missed a single tail attack or had a chase longer than 30 seconds, the killers need to be blamed for not playing like literal AIs but not a single bashing towards the same survivors who were still killing themselves on hook or didn't even set up a single turret in order to improve their chase times.
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It'd be a good change but average survivors would get their knots in a twist if it ever happened and their opinions are the loudest.
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3832601#Comment_3832601
Latest Otz killer list its from 9 months ago, from patch 7.5.0, where Spirit was already nerfed, and he ranked her at 3rd place after Nurse and Blight. I think the only change we could maybe have in that tier list now that could dethrone Spirit is that Chucky has become somewhat of a monster after the recent changes, but thats it.
One advantage Dracula has over her its that its easier to play, but Spirit will always have more lethality in chase due to the fact that you can see Dracula in Bat form while you need to hear Spirit phasing sound well enough to know where she is, and due to her speed while phasing and if she is close to you, the sound can be deceiving, while you will see 100% where the Bat is.
The better the player is, the better results he will have with Spirit over Dracula, due to how easier is to deceive survivors if you know to do good phasing compared to using Dracula's Bat form.
One thing i have noticed that survivors do and probably makes them feel Dracula is unfair is that they throw a pallet, stun Dracula, start running into the next loop, they see Dracula transforming into Bat form to go over that pallet and they try to keep running into the next loop anyways and Dracula just catches them in Bat form and downs them.
If you see Dracula transforming into a Bat to pass over a pallet….just dont leave that pallet. Spirit can totally hit you if she phases just next to you, you dont have time to jump the pallet, but Dracula cant. If he transforms into the Vampire form then you can just safely jump over the pallet and Dracula will not be able to M1 you in time due to the transformation delay where you cannot attack.
The more i play Dracula, the more survivors seem to counterplay me well enough. They bait me while i am in Bat form doing things like running then doing a 180º and running back so the scratch marks overlap, they jump fast a window then slow vault back so i cannot hear them, they wait in a pallet side until i transform to jump over the pallet,…
As i said, i see Dracula as a strong (not overpowered or broken) killer. But Spirit is still better than him, thats why i dont understand the outcry and the comparison between them. If he somehow "dethroned" Spirit in the "tier list" i would understand a little better, but Spirit is still the better killer right now, even counting all of Dracula's tools.
Literally all the things you've listed you can do against Dracula you can do against Spirit efficiently as well, her invisibility is massively overrated against survivors with a good headphone. And if you get juked as Spirit you now have a longer cooldown than Dracula and you're getting looped as a 110% speed killer with no other antiloop options till your power comes back, that's why Spirit is now weaker as well. And Scott Jund isn't the only one putting Dracula over Spirit, I've seen even some comp players doing it as well so Spirit is indeed getting outclassed by Dracula, you're just refusing to see it.
I like I've said, I've mained Spirit for much longer than Dracula for obvious reasons and I've won (or at least 2ked) with her against sweaty teams with map offerings, instant heals, gen rush builds and even stacked Iron Wills but I can still tell that atm she definitely has more weaknesses against good survivors than Dracula does.
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3830490#Comment_3830490
Im sorry but, even if i like Scott (he is one of the few dbd streamers i follow on Twitch) that video is full of BS and it seems he just have some personal vendetta against Dracula.
- Spirit is usually still relegated as the better killer. Usually being put in top 5 killers in the game, and sometimes some people even put her at top 3 just after Nurse and Blight, so i dont know where the "Spirit vs Dracula" comparison comes when Spirit is still the better killer and more competitively viable than Dracula.
- All of his arguments started to fall apart when he called "Hellfire" basically stronger ranged attack than Pyramid Head, Nemesis… I mean, cmon, Pyramid Head is still the absolute king of medium-ranged attacks, being able to bypass basically everything and have 0 cooldown. And he said Hellfire was a better ranged attack. No. Just no.
- Also about Hellfire, he said "misses it and doesnt get punished for it". Like, what? It has a basekit 7 seconds cooldown. Pyramid Head or Nemesis miss their ranged attacks and have a "try again" button ready.
When he started saying those thing about Hellfire i knew he just hates Dracula for some reason and wants to rant about him.
Dracula is strong. Not broken or overpowered: just strong. But Scott was just blatantly lying on that video.
People are still blinded by the period when Spirit used to compete with Nurse in terms of strength but after all the nerfs she received + buffs other killers received and new strong killers being released she's now pretty comparable now in terms of strength with pretty much any A tier killer, which includes Dracula. Heck even other 10k hours killer mains streamers like Tru3 and Otz started placing Spirit outside of top 5 in their killers tier list so the better players are starting to see that she's not all that anymore.
And considering that she has weaker mobility, longer cooldown, punishes mistakes harsher and is more add-on reliant than Dracula I don't see why a comparison should between these 2 should be forbidden. I main both and in my eyes, Spirit just has more weaknesses against good survivors. And even tho kill rates aren't the end all to a killer's strength, I highly doubt Spirit's kill rates considerably falling off ever since IW went back into the meta is a coincidence.
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@MrMori said:
This take isn't as profound as many think. Spirit and Dracula in bat form are wildly different and not as comparable as people think. Bat form is faster yes, but has noise that obscures survivor audio. It is also completely visible to survivors, so a ton of counterplay is given for free, you don't have to listen at all to counter batform. Yet if you for any reason aren't able to hear directional audio either due to not having a good headset, hearing or anything, Spirit will destroy you.
People say Dracula can "immediately attack out of transformation and has no cooldown so he's stronger" but that's a gross overestimation. He's slowed down for more than a full second before he can even attack or act, his movement is glidey and inaccurate in bat form, his own bat noises overshadows the survivors noises heavily, making it hard to pinpoint their location in a chase. Spirit on the other hand not only can attack immediately after exiting phase, she gets a significant speed boost which she can use to do very unpredictable lunges and turn semi-safe tiles into extremely dangerous 50/50s, while having even tighter and snappier controls than regular movement.
As for cooldown Spirit has a cooldown yes, but she doesn't have to use her entire power and wait for the entire cooldown either. Slap on the yellow movespeed addon or even MDR for speed, and you're way, way more dangerous than Dracula is in bat form since you can catch up faster and get hits without depleting your whole power gauge, so the cooldown isn't that impactful.
What I will give Dracula, is that he's way more approachable and easy to play compared to Spirit. It doesn't take that long to learn how to use bat form for mobility and then follow up with hellfire. It's pretty telling that on nightlight, not that it's the most accurate website, Dracula is both the highest pickrate killers as well as extremely high killrate, which indicates pretty heavily that he's too strong for being so simple.
Dracula is for sure overtuned, but I'm tired of people pretending bat form alone is better than Spirit, that's parroted nonsense. It's batform with its incredible mobility and catchup combined with hellfire that makes him so extremely dangerous when played right, and he's pretty straight forward to play too.
I honestly don't have much trouble tracking survivors with the bats, especially when they're injured, but I did use to main Spirit before him and maybe that's why. And yeah I already took into account his other 2 powers and even his 115% speed when talking about how he's stronger than Spirit, Dracula doesn't even need to play perfectly with the bats in order to get a hit (either with a M1, Hellfire or even the Wolf) while Spirit for the most part has to play perfectly with her phase cause she has nothing else going for her and her power cooldown is much more punishing than any of Dracula's on a miss.
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@danielmaster87 said:
So Dracula, in the grand scheme of things, isn't that strong a killer. You'd get better results playing Nurse, Blight, Unknown, even Plague. So if we're saying Spirit is a weaker version of him, can we now agree that Spirit is way overrated, and not that good of a killer? Or are there more mental gymnastics to get through?
Dracula's def currently stronger than Unknown, especially after they nerfed his best add-ons. Plague only has a claim of being stronger than him when she uses her iri add-ons.
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Glad to see I'm not the only one seeing the reality of these 2 killers as it stands currently (tho probably not for long considering Dracula's upcoming changes in the next month):
https://youtu.be/s_rj_hwN2i0?si=24qN7wKdPwTpU9Bu -
@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3830179#Comment_3830179
I just assumed you would be one of the people who adamantly believe Huntress is A or S Tier like everyone else on these forums tend to believe. So I was trying to use it as an example of a “strong” killer being asked for buffs but I guess I was mistaken.
I’ve never played against teams that have consistently wiped out my traps so I guess I can’t really say. But every time I play her it’s a 4k blowout so that’s where I get my idea from.
I just posted my tier list and I never once said anything related to Huntress so that was a hella weird assumption.
You can 4 blowout with all killers, but relative with other killers Hag has been massively powercrept as other killers can do what she does (proxy camp, basement camp, 3 gen) better and that's without having to set up a web that can be easily destroyed and having the risk of being rendered as a powerless 110% speed M1 killer. The fact that even most of her mains seem to believe she's weak against high level survivors in her current state is all I need to know about her strength considering that a killer's mains should be the ones arguing for their strength to begin with.
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@THE_Crazy_Hyena said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829775#Comment_3829775
You sure about that? Wouldn't you like to get Old Ruin back in some way?
Plus it incentivices spreading hooks. Win-win!https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829778#Comment_3829778
Yes, the current version is just BAD, and there are plenty more and much better options for gen slowdown in the current game.
It takes a generator 360 seconds (or 6 whole minutes) to regress at 100% speed (0.25 charges/sec.)
At 200% speed, this gets cut down to 180 seconds (or 3 minutes).You only get it if you hook all 4 survivors and the totem hasn't been broken till that happens and even after it happens, it could still be immediately broken afterwards before you get any real use out it. Also for some reason it also helps survivors with the bigger great skill check area so they can power through it even after you get it at its full power.
So yeah, it'd be garbage.
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829882#Comment_3829882
1st of all stop calling me babe. That’s offensive. Secondly I’m allowed to have my own options and I believe she is A tier. Name a single person who doesn’t want a buff for the killer they main. Maybe Nurse mains but that’s it.
And a lot of Huntress mains said she needed the buffs she got and still needs more. So by your logic she should get more buffs.
I don't see any A tier killers get asked for buffs by their mains as much as Hag, when some of her own mains are saying she's arguably worse Trapper then you know she ain't a good killer when even her own mains don't rate her.
Also what Huntress has got to do with this discussion ? She ain't an A tier killer either anymore lol.
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829652#Comment_3829652
If you know what you are doing she is A tier easily. The Queen of camping hook and gens and good at anti loop. Maybe you could put her at the top of B for being 110% when she shouldn’t be but I’d say A comfortably.
Yeah, she's A tier comfortably even tho all the Hag mains are begging for buffs and some of them even think she's worse than Trapper in her current state lmao.
Like literally all the things you've mentioned over half of the current killers roster can do much better than her and that without having to set up, a set up that can be easily removed by survivors and against SWF teams with comms ? She's legit just a 110% speed M1 killer lol. Like seriously babe, you need to join us in 2024 cause the "A tier Hag' you're talking about don't exist anymore after the massive power creep she suffered.
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It'd still be garbage.
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@TheArbiter said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/6UD8ZT2TJKF1/my-image.png
Few notes and Explanations:
Each row is ranked Left to Right, so for example Nurse is better than Billy
I'm only taking into account yellow and brown addons and I'm assuming this is against a SWF
Billy is easily #2 in my opinion, almost every tile in the game is unsafe against him, he has instadown and map control. Throw on iron maiden and he no longer has any counters in chase.
Blight drops down a couple spots due to no longer having hug tech. Artist has better map control, and Plague wins if one survivor cleanses at the wrong time
Dracula is currently a better spirit
I'm obviously biased as a Sadako main, however since she can now look in condemn stacks she is a lot harder to play around, mid to late game all I have to do is keep tvs on cooldown and ill get 2-3 condemns easy
Hag drops only because you no longer need a flashlight
Freddy has zero chance of snowball whereas trapper and Mikey do. Don't think I have to explain Skully
Rofl at Artist having better map control than Blight when chick's getting W keyed for ages on any multi-level map.
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@SuspiciousBrownie said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/VXEXWDI0EGVP/img-5503.jpeg
All the top tier killers have very high mobility imo. With the exception of Pp head and Plague. Plague has hella slowdown basekit with survivors being insta down able always. Pp head dodges all strong survivor posts with cages and makes tunneling impossibly easy.
Hag in A tier ? This ain't 2019 babes.
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Based on my experience on PC on how powerful I feel they are to play as and to play against.
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He's not even top 3 best licensed killers currently lol.
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@GeneralV said:
My prediction, and wish, is a total Wesker death.
Kind of hypocritical to wish something like this on another killer as a Freddy main ngl, you can do better than this babes.
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My guess for Vecna would be that they're gonna nerf both Mage Hand and Flight of the Damned cause Reddit survivors were complaining about "uncounterable hits" from them while reducing the cooldowns of his powers as a compensation buff (considering that Dracula has like 5 seconds of cooldown each for his multiple powers it's crazy Vecna's still stuck at almost 40 seconds cooldowns despite having weaker powers overall).
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@TonTon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3826490#Comment_3826490
Majority of players want Chucky gutted ghost face is getting buffed and wesker and vecna are leaning towards nerfs. yknow if devs somehow buff chucky itll face huge backlash so my assessment is a somewhat accurate of what the community wants and Devs should listen towards.
Sorry your upset people like to speculate. i also believe Devs should remove extremely bias takes should be deleted but iknow they wont
Just ignore that user, if survivors meta perks were on the list for tweaks instead they'd be crying harder about it than any "killer main" they've been complaining about.
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So which are the other 4 killers that are supposed to get changes next month ?
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3820070#Comment_3820070
I didn't say that Trickster was stronger than those killers overall. He's not. But just because Trickster isn't stronger than those killers doesn't mean he doesn't have problems or design issues.
A killer can be poorly designed and be weak at the same time. That's where Skull Merchant is right now.
So you've just proved my point. A 110% speed Trickster won't be better designed either way as the majority of people didn't consider him as such when he was, whether to play him or against.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3820044#Comment_3820044
Artist (often) and Unknown (always) both have to hit survivors twice with their power and unlike Trickster it isn't spammable either. Missing 1 Trickster knife means little to nothing, missing a dire crow shot or UVX hit is a bigger deal and is generally enough for survivors to "reset" the power through repelling crow swarms or staring down Unknown. That's why those killers are fine being 115% and Trickster isn't.
But if they hit them Unknown and Artist have much shorter chase times and much more map pressure than Trickster could ever achieve (unless he snowballs hard from Main Event). Also again Unknown and Artist are placed much higher than Trickster in virtually all the killers tier lists, usually a whole tier above him as well so how come these 2 clearly stronger killers are fine but Trickster isn't ? Once again, just a skill issue playing against him.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3819974#Comment_3819974
But you gotta think about survivors, the killer isn't playing by himself. The fact remains that 4.6 m/s Trickster was terrible to go against, due to the nature of his power.
He is a ranged killer, therefore he is meant to use his power to get downs. But having 4.6 m/s removed that aspect, allowing him to play any tile the usual way. This is fine for other killers, but not for ranged killers. Their weakness is movement, that is good design.
Survivors have to have something they can do.
Unknown and Artist are both 115% speed ranged killers whom are much stronger than 115% speed Trickster as it is, so your entire point about ranged killers needing to be slower is moot. Current Trickster isn't even making the A tier of any tier lists so complaining about him is genuinely a skill issue.
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Horrible changes, 110% Trickster was by far one of the worst killers in the game, devs clearly just want to nuke him like they did with Knight and Skull Merchant so survivors mains will stop crying about him.
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Meh, this perk is really only worth using on Spirit in order to counter IW and mayyybe on Nurse as well. But survivors can still generally use their meta exhaustion perks before getting hit and 8 seconds of exhaustion isn't that much anyway, so I wouldn't say it's worth a perk slot on anyone else.
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Huntress is powercrept and hella weak against good survivors even after her buffs, Idk how people can still gaslight themselves into thinking she's an A tier killer.
Artist is just a weaker Unknown and against not clueless survivors her power only has value in zoning.
Making Trickster a 115% speed killer was a good decision and I'd say he's definitely at least better than Deathslinger when it comes to ranged killers.
Without her current very strong add-ons Plague probably wouldn't be an A tier killer (which I suspect will become the case as they'll very probably gonna nerf them in November).
Vecna's honestly a bordeline C tier killer.
It's funny seeing people debate who's the top of A tier killer between Spirit and Chucky when Dracula clearly wrecks both of them.
Deja Vu deserves to be nerfed now that we have the 8 gens kicks limit.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3812019#Comment_3812019
Its not really brain dead. Aura's will now dominate the game on killer side, dare I say, more so than regression. Might be a balance, idk. But bringing Distortion was quite the opposite of brain dead. Also, maybe killers should learn to play the game instead of relying on brain dead aura perks.
How's using aura reading perks more braindead than using pre-nerf Distortion when most of them have requirements in order to activate unlike current Distortion ? Also why shouldn't survivors also learn how to play the game when chases are, you know, part of the game ?
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@Lixadonna said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3811927#Comment_3811927
Because Killer role increasingly braindead with every Nerf that happens to Survivor. Killer should learn how to Track and search Survivor instead of crutching on Aura.
Maybe survivors should be the ones to learn how to last in a chase instead of crutching on braindead anti-aura perks.
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No, he's just not a pushover against decent survivors like the previous multi-power killer they've released before (Vecna).
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3809773#Comment_3809773
well of course, i am not going by popular opinion. this is my opinion. wesker can't use his power on jagged rock wall loops either. he often needs straight type loop where he can slide over to perform his hug tech. He doesn't end up bloodlusting the loop but he is at best 115% m/s on said loop which isn't very much better. rock loops is often 1 or 2 loops at best that waste 10 extra seconds. You can save ton of time on other loops that wesker isn't efficient on but huntress is.
i am sure this is subjective opinion for whose is stronger.
There are plenty of other loops and just maps in general where Huntress gets destroyed even harder compared to Wesker than just rock loops, they were just the most common example of how much of a pushover good survivors can make her be at these loops.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3809570#Comment_3809570
eh bloodlust kinda deletes that problem for huntress. admittedly she is prone to pre-running.
She has no strong 1v1 as her anti-loop is outdated
I don't agree. good survivors wreck wesker a lot harder then Huntress. Huntress usually has this problem. She wrecks every survivor in the chase but loses to gen speed. if i lose as huntress, it is because i didn't snowball effectively enough due to survivor not giving many opportunities to do so or I snowballed too late and the lost. I suppose that is the entire skill-cielling of huntress. Knowing how to create an early lead on top of her mechanical skill-ceiling of landing 60-80%+ hatchets.
If she has to bloodlust then that already proves Wesker is stronger lol. Pretty much all the high MMR streamers and comp players rate Wesker above Huntress cause they know too well what good loopers do to a Huntress.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3809550#Comment_3809550
her 1vs1 is vastly superior to wesker. Wesker's infection means nothing when you can go to the start of the game to a chest and hold a infection spray for entire match. you won't get infected and the slowdown his spray has is minimal when it is done at the start of the match.
The only thing Huntress is vastly superior to Wesker is getting looped around a rock multiple times lmao. She has no strong 1v1 as her anti-loop is outdated and even average survivors have an idea of what to do against her with lullaby allowing pre-running in maps full of clutter and getting spoonfed 3 audio notifications before she throws a hatchet.
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@Thisgamesucks2024 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3809392#Comment_3809392
all of the killers I listed have better fitted kits…
Ain't no way Huntress is better than Wesker, good survivors wreck her hard.
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Pre-nerf Unknown and Dracula.
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Not surprised about Spirit's placement, IW meta wrecks her.
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He's literally still just a weaker Xeno lol.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806312#Comment_3806312
Neither is bad. I usually dominate with Hag in particular, but don't take it from me (<115% killers highlighted):
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ZDMZA444I5KG/tierlist.png
Hag is definitely underplayed, though - thanks for pointing that out. I didn't realize she was so low nowadays.
The general point still stands. All I'm trying to say is that there is no merit to dismissing 110% speed killers on the basis of them being "terrible" and "nobody [wanting] to play that trash".
Nah Hag's bad lol, even her mains have been asking for her to be buffed to 115% for years by now, so that tells me anything I need to know about her. Deathslinger mains seem at least more confident in his abilities but there's so many 115% speed killers with better antiloop powers than him by this point that he's comparably weak. And frankly even Huntress is hella overrated considering how map dependent and easy to loop she is.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3805251#Comment_3805251
The best killer in the game is 96% and Spirit, usually considered the third best, is 110%. Now that I think about it, is there a single bad and/or very underplayed killer below 115% speed right now?
Blight is an S tier killer as is and gets a lot of mobility and chase potential from his power. 110% would raise his skill floor without doing much to his skill ceiling, as he'd have to rely more on his power for success. A high skill floor and high skill ceiling is exactly what you want for the strongest killers in the game, so I think it would be a great change.
Yes, Hag and Deathslinger are both bad and underplayed 110% speed killers.
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806059#Comment_3806059
Spirit is still relegated as one of the "top 5" killers in the game, sometimes still even being put at the "top 3" just after Nurse and Blight. Im not really sure on the "can easily counter it" thing.
This was probably done before Iron Will was buffed back to 100% cause now I'm seeing even popular streamers dropping her down on the tier list for this exact same reason. Nobody would willingly choose to play Spirit against a full IW squad and considering that IW is currently the 6th most used survivor perk according to nightlight going against such a squad isn't uncommon anymore. So far I can't even remember the last match where at least one survivor didn't have Iron Will.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3805675#Comment_3805675
Don't know what gonna happen or if anything is gonna happen. Wolf and Dracula are no problems at all. It's just the quick in and out of bat - form that seems problematic to me.
Nerfing the other forms seems unnecessary to me.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3805721#Comment_3805721
Spirit is harder to play against due to being invisible to survivors and being able to instantly hit out of phase. That's why she had better chase than Dracula.
Dracula however has a lot less cooldowns. Therefore he a lot longer and faster on people than spirit.
Spirit is stronger than Dracula. If she misses, she gets punished harder. If she doesn't miss, she gets hits and downs faster than Dracula.
Being invisible barely matters cause of her directional phase audio, hitting out instantly of phase is the only thing she has over Dracula but good survivors aware of her power's limitations can easily counter it, she sure as hell don't feel like she can do anything faster than Dracula, not with all of her nerfed add-ons and in this IW and OTR meta.