Green_Sliche
Green_Sliche
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@iloveandhatethisgame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3803652#Comment_3803652
bhvr has a official discord for dbd so that people find friends to play with one another. They want more people playing their game not less. Thats never changing
It's voice over coms issue. Nobody is against organizing a party match together. Being able to talk during the game and sharing crucial information though clearly is unfair as it's currently not normally possible solely through the game. In fact, you can already organize a party match without a need for discord if you'd like as game allows you to do so.
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Would be nice if there was at least one video of alpha / beta play or some more insight info about the game. Who knows, maybe the game actually had some potential in it. It would also satisfy the curiosity of people here who will now wonder what this Project T could had become if it was ever completed.
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The perk gives certain M1 killers a better chance in the game. It doesn't need a nerf.
If you were slugged by KO, simply crawl to the open area where you will be more likely found by other survivor. If your team mates don't bother searching for you, that's on them, especially if they decide to do something else or get glued to the nearest generator.
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The problem with SWF is voice coms. Everyone knows that.
When one survivor can tell the other one who is on the other side of the map that killer is coming and the remaining ones know where killer is, the gens get repaired uncontested because it's physically impossible to be everywhere at the same time for many killers out of the selection pool.
At this rate, voice coms should be addressed somehow as they give an unfair advantage. It's the same if killer suddenly got a global wallhack or LP perk that last forever.
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@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769878#Comment_3769878
Yah, and me tapping a generator every two or so minutes and leaving at the slightest hint of terror radius is a legit strategy to outlive the two others while not breaking the rules. Nothing wrong with that either then, I suppose.
Absolutely. You play the way you want so long as game physically allows you to. Whenever it is fun to any side is a subject to debate but then the concept of fun is also purely subjective and has no universal meaning.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769878#Comment_3769878
Legitimacy is beside the point.
When you have a goal, you do what you have to do.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769872#Comment_3769872
Killers have started slugging at 3 survivors remaining to prevent hatches from spawning. Killers are slugging for an 8K. That’s what people are referencing.
That is a legit strat for 8k. Nothing wrong in that.
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@Neaxolotl said:
Pretty sure most survivor mains are playing killers in 2v8 anyway, that's the biggest reason of que time
Yep. Of course they won't admit that but that's how things are. Even 400+% bonus doesn't help here.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769387#Comment_3769387
Don't tell me you expected 2 killers be loop-able in the first place?
Oh no, I fully expected this gamemode to be dead in the water for survivors the second people started talking about it.
But to present the issues with the gamemode as little more than 'killers get a bit of info' is infantile.
The way I see it, the mode is not fun for survivors because there isn't really much difference in terms of fun between having 3 allies or 7 allies. Lack of perks also makes survivor players play the game in a way they probably don't like.
From killer's perspective it's fun because for the first time there's someone else you as player can rely upon if you struggle. Unfortunately the way the mode is designed, the more you try to to cooperate with your team mate the faster you lose the gens. One would expect the absolutely opposite effect here but it's not.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769394#Comment_3769394
“but survivors had chests!!!1!2!” - Green_sliche
lol.
You really haven't played that mode.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769382#Comment_3769382
lights out was extremely killer sided. I said Chaos Shuffle was even.
Hardly a killer sided when killers had nothing where survivors had lots of chests to loot from.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3768962#Comment_3768962
Two killers working together completely eliminates the concept of looping, but don't let reality get in the way of a good tantrum.
Don't tell me you expected 2 killers be loop-able in the first place? If you are chased by two killers your only goal is to run towards the nearest corner away from uncompleted gens. Even if you last for 10 - 15 seconds, that is the time that competent survivors spend on doing 2 or 3 gens simultaneously.
Teaming up in this game as killers is the only fun aspect of the mode but the fact that there are potentially 7 other survivors repairing 70 seconds base time gens together puts too much stress out.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3769296#Comment_3769296
He enjoyed it because he is a killer main. The people complaining about Lights Out were survivors. So far, every game mode to release (besides Chaos Shuffle, which evened the playing field) has been largely killer-friendly and survivor-miserable. People, killer mains really, are advocating for bot replacements now because they recognize, I think, that these game modes are unfun foe survivor and have just given up trying to dupe survivors into perceiving these game modes as somehow better for them than killers.
Neither Lights Out nor Chaos Shuffle were killer favorable modes. In fact both were massively survivor sided.
In Lights Out killers had no gen defense or detection tools which made tracking survivors pain and defending gens extremely difficult. Survivors however had more chests spawned on the map so most of the time they had either medkits or toolboxes at their disposal.
Chaos Shuffle could result into a perk set that wouldn't work for a killer, such as both no gen defense or detection. For survivors, the worst case would be no perks match but even then they could still perform well if killer had 4 perks that don't work together.
The only ones who complained were honestly bad survivor players who didn't want to adapt. For everybody else these modes were the blast. This 2v8 is also massively survivor favored, but since the concept of playing with killer team mate was much requested by both sides ( yeah, who could had thought? ) most players want to play as killer duo, including survivor mains, hence why it takes so much time to get a match. The only feasible solution here is to either convert this mode to 2v6 with addition of bots or do bot fill-ups for match search if it is taking more than 5 minutes.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3768724#Comment_3768724
If killer queues are this long with only 5 OG killers available, just imagine what will happen if they re-release the mode with all killers available.
Well, they won't be able fix queue times. At best, they can add few bots to fill up slots so games don't take so long to make.
To be honest, I'd rework this entire mode into a hide and seek type game instead. Slap a timer, add few items and give survivors some objectives to do other than gens and you have a less stressful and more fun mode for everyone.
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@Marioneo said:
Ok what the heck is wrong with most survivors in this mode? 9/10 matches these survivors have never looped or gotten into a chase or done a gen into their lives.
Is this nothing but new players? Like what is going on they can't even do 1v1 chases or healing.
No wonder Survivors are saying this mode is balanced cause of the Awful Teammates are dragging them so far down
It's because maps have different loops and survivors no longer have their crutch perks to rely upon. Nothing surprising here.
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Don't worry, people will soon get tired of this 2v8 mode because of poor balance and limited selection of killers with only 3 of them being somewhat viable.
This mode will probably return back at some point, hopefully with more killers and better balance. For now, enjoy it while you can since you won't be getting that many games as killer anyway and those that you get will be over in 4 or 5 minutes.
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@VomitMommy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3768168#Comment_3768168
I don't think there is need to min max this game mode. It's just for fun...
If basekit unbreakable made it too much survivor sided, all you need to do is add 1 gen, which should do the trick. I don't think it would be needed tho.
I would agree if match wouldn't take ages to start and end in less than 5 minutes if killers don't play tryhard. There's even less room for a chill play there unless you want to let all 8 survivors escape.
Regression can be 500% if you want, it won't matter when there's always a survivor who can stop it. Additionally regression won't help if a gen is completed by 2 or more survivors, especially if one of them has a class that increases gen repair.
As for revelation, it's pretty much a mandatory for killers because the amount of scratch marks left by so many survivors can easily deceive the killer. As the counter to the aura reading, survivors have the speed boosts so they can always run to the nearest pallet. Unless there's another killer nearby for an aid, survivors can easily keep a single killer busy thanks to larger map and bigger number of pallets and loops.
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@VomitMommy said:
Unlike normal game, I could see basekit unbreakable get into 2v8 mode.
There is little to no reason to slug when you can cage anyone.
Actually in 2v8 there are even more reasons to slug, especially when killers are massively behind the hooks. There are 2 reasons for this - one is having a survivor slugged on one side of the map will force others come to the aid, effectively keeping them from doing gens and two is the chance to get everyone slugged at some point. With lack of proper slowdown in 2v8 mode, slugging is the only alternative because cage doesn't really do much since survivors end up teleported very close to their allies. The average caged duration is 5 - 10 seconds where slugged survivor may stay on the ground from 20 to even an entire minute in some cases.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3767962#Comment_3767962
Yeah, that's exactly why the bleedout timer exists. It's to prevent hostage situations.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3767968#Comment_3767968
Oh don't get me wrong, people were getting picked up. For like 10-15 minutes straight. They eventually managed to get everyone down though and then proceeded to bleed everyone out. Probably one of the most boring games I've ever played.
In cases like these where no one can recover, game should simply end instead. This is also an issue in standard DBD game which still hasn't been addressed.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
I don't think anyone goes into this thinking it is going to be a balanced or 'fair' experience and if they do, well…
I think it is utter chaos very much RNG as far as matchmaking, as good team mates seem to = win and killers obviously on comms with some skills = win.
But don't expect these events to be 'balanced' as I don't think that is the point at all
The two games that streamers had during showcase of 2v8 mode pretty much demonstrated all the flows of the balance. Those games ended with 6 escapes and 2 kills which is a loss both times. One of the killers played as trapper and honestly despite all the effort he couldn't do much because Trapper in this mode is G Tier killer.
Surely you can have fun chasing a single survivor together but then you will be losing 2 or 3 gens per chase. It really sucks that the most fun way to play this mode is also the worst way which greatly ruins the joy of this mode for killers, on top of atrociously long wait times.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
Honestly I believe there should be a basekit unbreakable because there is genuinely no reason to slug for more than 20 seconds.
There are 8 survivors in the game. If no one out of the remaining 7 did bother to pick the downed survivor they all deserve to be slugged.
In all fairness, slugging is the way to go in this mode unless there's a possibility to get many downs quickly. The game pace simply doesn't allow killers go for cages-only most of the time
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@Inosennatoki said:
At least the generators should be increased from 8 to 10.
Gen was finished so fast in this mode.
Gen increase won't be enough when gens are done like in 20 - 30 seconds. If you try to stay near your team mate and work ''together'' a pack of 4 survivors will do gens in almost no time.
Killers need extra perks and some form of gen regression. The idea of the mode is to gank one survivor with a killer team mate but unfortunately you end up punished for ''fun'' play with 2 or 3 gens being done.
Just so you know, if you are staying away from your team mate then half of your perks don't work. This means survivors have 3 solid perks plus self heal x 8 where killers have 2x2 plus 2 + 2 when they are close to each other. It's not even remotely close in terms of fairness.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3767591#Comment_3767591
This isn't even remotely true. While it's true that you don't want to be hugging your teamate all game, you ARE gonna have opportunityto provide assists. The powers have also been tweaked, so playing as Trapper for example feels WAY different than normal. So far I've played 3 survivor matches and 2 killer matches as soloQ (Wraith and Trapper) and EVERY match was a win for the killer team.
So were my first games. Then next games it became clear that unless survivors decide to throw, there's little killers can do because 1 down can now cost 3 or more gens unless killers spread wide, in which case they have no synergy perks working.
I'd rather have those perks replaced with something that does grant a slowdown. Killers desperately need it in this mode because gens fly way too quickly.
For reference gens get done in 35 - 40 seconds if there's a guy with gen repair class so all it takes a group of 2 or 3 survivors to slam gens while the rest do keep killers busy.
The only moment when killers shine is when they sandwich a single survivor. Ironically this often does cost 2 or more gens in the process. Additionally caged survivors often end up teleported near other survivors so there isn't much gained from spreading hooks by any means. As killer, you need to get as many people out as possible asap and pray that survivors create a circle of generators that 2 killers can effectively patrol and defend. If not, there's nothing much you can against 3 gates and 2 hatches.
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The mode is way too survivor sided and barely any fun as for a killer ( unless you 2 man pre-made ) :
- Too many gens to defend and no gen defence.
- Too many pallets and chests means survivors have way too much resources, on top of perks.
- Most of the time killers have to spread out in order to cover more area which means half of killer perks that require them to ''work together'' often does nothing. The remaining 2 perks are not enough.
- Only mobility killers stand a chance. Killers like trapper are almost useless and Nurse requires way too much effort to be useful.
The mode is chaotic but unfortunately it's often a double-stress session for killers because they can't commit any chase for longer than few seconds or they risk losing 2 or 3 gens per down. It's almost impossible to keep up unless survivors suddenly stop doing gens and begin to throw. Unfortunately after watching the 2v8 videos and playing 2v8 myself my suspicion was confirmed and balance is way too shifted towards survivors and tools that killers have are counter-productive instead.
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Takes ages to get a match. Hope it gets better sooner.
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Killers will have to tunnel someone out asap. Also trapper will be pretty much auto-lose if someone picks him. Probably the most effective combo would be a good Nurse and Billy. Huntress and Wrath could also work provided at least one of them is competent.
Without tunneling one or two survivors asap, I can't imagine getting 4 or more kills here. Spreading ''cages'' is certainly a no-go if killers wish to win the match.
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C tier is kinda a generous rating to give him.
He is rock bottom tier absolute beginner stomper. He can keep people distracted and apply ''pressure'' but once there are survivors who have a full set of eyes and hands he stops being any problem. At this moment, I'd rather have a pre-patch Knight - he was low tier too but at least he could shine in one out of ten matches. Now if you manage to win with him it's usually because you were matched with really weak or chill opponents.
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Yes. It's common SoloQ experience, at least for me.
There is a griefing report button for such cases but I honestly doubt anything will be done about it. Best you can do is dodge such person by having a list of player nicknames who trolled or ruined your games before. Simply quickly check your list and if the name does match - leave the lobby and go for another one. There is no penalty for doing so and it's best to wait for an extra minute or two than have another match of yours ruined.
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The best solution here is let more cakes spawn per bloodweb for survivors. Killers can always get any value from their own cake if they decide to bring one but survivors are always at risk of getting tunneled or sandbagged at 5 gens and dying with less than 10k points.
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It's end game phase so this is expected behavior. At that moment your team mates must rescue you. No free unhook.
What is problematic here is when killer tries to camp like that but your progress bar doesn't move because another survivor tries to rescue you.
A hud should display your camp bar to all other survivors so they could know if you are camped and stay away from you, essentially allowing this anti-camp mechanic to work. In SoloQ, it often never works because of miscommunication which allows killers camp when there are multiple gens because survivors swarm the hook and disrupt the progress of the bar.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3738119#Comment_3738119
so you're trying to help new, or bad no judging, Killers but they aren't the one's that need help?
by and large, those Killers are averaging over 60% KR. I don't think the role needs such sweeping changes unless 60% isn't enough anymore.
The plan was to give players who distribute hits some sense of progress.
Then again it may be helpful for some or do absolutely nothing to another, like a passive 3 vault bamboozle that game currently has.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3738100#Comment_3738100
It would likely destroy any casual enjoyment of the game from a Survivor perspective, so I think saying it would be better for Killers is short-sighted. It'd be worse in the long run, as the only people left are going to be very dedicated players.
As for your suggestion:
I'm not sure that that's a good idea, especially without other adjustments to gen regression and tunneling/camping. Killers are already doing well, by and large, and buffing them further doesn't make much sense at this time; outside of individual adjustments and QoL at least.
Survivors also naturally get weaker throughout the match, so I'm not sure why you're wanting to double-down on that so much.
Just seems like punishing Casual players or Solo Q while not really affecting the better players at all.
Depends on killer played. I noticed many beginner players tend to land lots of hits but when it comes to downs they struggle a lot or tend to often switch targets. Against survivors with no recovery that could result into a longer matches and higher odds of getting a hook / kill. Since many bring medkits and at least one perk for chase / recovery, the hit distribution play does little in terms of progress. Then again, it depends on player skill - some may be able to utilize gen perk load outs, some may not. When it comes to recovery though, any skill level can benefit from that one way or another on average level.
My idea would simply introduce a hit and run meta. It would require number balancing so it's not too troublesome for beginner players, however it would also encourage killers to distribute pressure because now every successful hit would have a lasting effect on survivor.
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@C3Tooth said:
Finally survivor can put away healing perks and stack 16 Gens boost perks.
Ironically that would make game so much better for killers since many survivors can't loop well and can be relatively easily ambushed if they have no protection against it. With no second chance / recovery perks gen hugging as it is would be much less of an issue because survivors already do that, they just have perks that let them return back to the game if something goes wrong.
On-topic : I'd introduce a mechanic that applies a permanent stack on survivor upon being hit. Each stack would make healing self or others slower. There would be a cap for the stack but the idea here is if killers keeps landing hits successfully over and over but can't down someone or hook yet there is still progress being done because survivors slowly but gradually do become weaker.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735574#Comment_3735574
It counts as a kill, yes. I'm not denying that what you're saying happens, because it does. It just doesn't happen nearly enough on average on a global scale to have any noticable impact on kill rates.
As a reference, Nightlight.gg has kill rates per killer across a combined total of 54,386 games. Now, if we assume the average kill rate is 60% then that's 32,631 games. A 1% contribution is 326. That's how many games in which at least one person always gives up to have any meaningful contribution to that stat, and even 1% isn't very significant.
Thing is when one guy throws like that, chances that the remaining 3 survivors will also get sacrificed increase even if they do their best to survive. I'm not saying that all 4 just run to hook and feed but technically it will still count as 4k, even though it's only 1 guy who suicided intentionally ( aka 1k legit ), the other 3 count as collateral victims.
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@Junylar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735376#Comment_3735376
not gonna happening for lots of reasons
What are those reasons that apply for DbD, but for some reason don't apply for TCM, for example?
proxy text chat
Proxy text chat? Proxy and text? You serious? Not even mentioning text chat is not going to do the same thing as discord does.
How you expect to fix SoloQ?
Balance the game around soloQ, not around SWF and then apply penalties for SWF players. A lot of players suggested slower gen repairing speeds for them, but it's a simple example, anything could go. Another option: two separate queues for soloQ and for SWF, with separate rules. Another option is to make all the information perks that SWF imitate with discord basekit for all survivors. There are a ton of ideas how to fix it, you can look it up, there used to be a whole booklet on how to fix DbD circling around the community. The problem is not a lack of ideas, the problem is that all ideas are actively ignored or rejected by BHVR because they don't want to bother implementing anything. They don't see a problem until the problems manifests into falling profits, it can be said about every major problem DbD has, including cheaters, outdated gameplay and broken balance.
Some people don't have mics. Some people may not know english / language well enough. Some people can't or don't want to talk for w/e personal reasons.
The last thing you want is to hear how your mother is great in bed from some 12 y.o kid who has God-Knows-When bought mic that catches every fart or noise 1 mile around it's location. It's the community that we have that makes mic communication with randoms not the most pleasant experience.
Now when I think about it, proxy text was probably a bad idea given how things do work in the game ( you probably wouldn't have time opportunity to stand still and type something in ). Perhaps a proxy wheel chat could work better. At the very least few extra gestures could be introduced for communication.
As for balancing SoloQs and SWFs - from my understanding devs don't want to separate those. They won't introduce MM for parties apart from standard MM ( we even don't have Casual / Ranked MM ). They also likely don't want to add custom rules to SWFs as they want SWF's have the same experience of the game as SoloQ ( even if they don't since they can communicate and coordinate better via VO chat ).
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735534#Comment_3735534
It's certainly possible, but it wouldn't be anywhere near enough to inflate kill rates since the stats we're given are a global representation rather than strictly one region.
I'm in the OCE Region, I play every night from 9:30pm to 2:30am and games as killer are almost always an uphill struggle. Games as survivor feel just as rough, killers almost always tunnel at 5 gens.
Well, I witnessed myself numerous times playing as survivor where people would intentionally throw themselves at killer and in the post-game chat they would first insult the killer player for whatever reason they found legit and brag that now killer will get nerfed because their kill rate stats would go too high. While I would expect some people would be doing this for such reasons, more often it happens unintentionally as survivor player wants to move to the next game because of bad start which I'm pretty sure counts as a kill which then contributes to the kill rate values.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735516#Comment_3735516
Maybe it was the fact that in this entire thread you're putting off the typical killer is helpless plea, I'm sick of seeing it people wanna cry that survivors want stuff nerfed but these new age killer mains cry harder than anyone else when killer really isn't in a bad place and hasn't been for quite some time. I'm tired of top tier killers becoming boring to play due to bad players complaining to the devs, people don't want a skilled game apparently we want a braindead w and m1 simulator with no thought needed to win a chase just shut your brain off and let the slobber drip down your face while you mindlessly bloodlust everything because those damn survivors need a nerf
I don't put anything here. Calm down.
If you want to talk about nerfs, left talk about recent Vecna nerf. A killer who was released recently receives a nerf already. So my question here is it because killer was that good and had no counter or because killer required a bit extra effort to play against so it was simply easier to nerf him? I can't recall a single survivor or survivor perk being nerfed so quickly. As for Vecna's perks - he still has the worst perk set, wanna bet when his perks will get addressed? I bet not anytime soon.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735513#Comment_3735513
My 1500 hours of playtime beg to differ, and all you're saying is that you have no objective proof other than your own anecdotal experience. I play several hours a day, and I know for a fact that very few survivors actually give up on their first down. In my 1500 hours of playing, I've seen someone give up on their first down less than 15 times.
Your suggestion that it's happening anywhere near enough to inflate kill rates is rather incredulous.
I'm more inclined to believe it's regional differences of MM. Perhaps you are not getting this many griefers on your end.
I get plenty, especially if I play as survivor. As killer, it's less often experience.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3732853#Comment_3732853
Just because you aren't good with those killers doesn't mean no one else is, people like you ruin this game, you think just because YOU get washed it means survivors need a nerf, well we're all sorry you're not the next streamer going on a 500 win streak with trapper, I've been here for entirety of this games life cycle playing both roles don't sit here and try to act like it's unbearable for everyone just because you're struggling without slowdowns
Who did hurt you today?
I wonder which part make you think that I'm bad with any killer to begin with. Stop jumping on the gun the moment you see something that contradicts with your opinion.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735079#Comment_3735079
Unless you have objective proof that survivors are giving up on first down enough that it would inflate kill rates, I don't think that's a very fair statement to make.
If you need an objective proof for that then you clearly haven't played enough. Things like this happen on daily basis, just play few extra games.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735218#Comment_3735218
This doesn't work, if survivors got item to see the orb. You basically get false information and let survivors finish the gen for free.
It'll still push them off the gen for a bit, because the item doesn't immunise them from it. And that's only one survivor that can have this benefit.
It's not that effective for map traversal. It's just more effective to keep it for chase, because cooldown are still high.
Isn't it 40 seconds? If you close out your chase within 40 seconds, you're winning anyway. Why do you care about the cooldown in that case?
But I don't think Vecna is good at neither 1v1, or 1v4. His map traversal is not that much better to any other M1 killer.
He is not good at spreading hits, because of his cooldowns and need to be close to a survivor for his power to do anything. You are not able to get long range hits, or get them fast on multiple survivors.You're not supposed to be good at any of the things you do because he gets ALL of them at the same time. A wide kit is never going to excel in any of its facets, otherwise you'd just get powercreeped.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735276#Comment_3735276
there's little to add here other than remind you that these 3 supports spells also have long cooldown and often players use them just because they are available
If you can't stop yourself from spamming spells off-cooldown, even in situations where this would not be helpful, then that is as clear an example as you could make of 'it's not the character, it's the player'.
Yes it's nice that you can throw an orb towards a nearby gen but if you do go towards that gen then why use orb there?
That's what I was talking about. Or are you trying to argue that sphere is bad because you can use it in an inefficient way?
Fly is a standard traversal, but you won't use it if there's nothing to defend nearby or you aren't sure if there's a survivor nearby.
Are you trying to argue that Fly is bad map traversal because it's not useful for going to places where you don't want to go?
Flight of the Damned is still horrible but at least you can try to use it from distance and behind the wall and maybe it will hit someone. I personally would give Flight of the Damned Killer Instinct, at least that would make the spell somewhat reliable.
Flight of the Damned is probably his weakest ability, but I can imagine that more skilled players can use it to be properly disruptive in chase.
Hand of Mage is his staple power. If you've seen killer use it then you know that for the next 38 seconds ( unless there are addons involved ) this killer can't do anything to you if you are near the pallet. Play around it and you'll see what options does Vecna have when his main power is in CD.
Then you just play the chase as normal and benefit from the rest of your kit when the time comes to use them. Be tactical about the way you use those abilities.
What I'm trying to say here is Vecna depends too much on Hand of Mage. All other spells are there for support but they all can't do much if survivor is in a good spot because they already have a simple yet effective counter.
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@Junylar said:
Aanyone got any ideas
How about this: instead of banning people for missed skillchecks we fix the damn game and stop soloQ from being a horrible experience, which is exactly the cause of all the giving up.
Proxy or normal voice com with randoms - not gonna happening for lots of reasons. I'd suggest a proxy text chat option but I doubt that will happen too.
Option to see each other's load-out mid-game - still not happening.
How you expect to fix SoloQ? What is the definition of fixing SoloQ when all SWF advantages such as option to organize your loadout and basically share info on distance are the only things that make SWF different from SoloQ.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735319#Comment_3735319
I can only speak for myself and some of my friends who dabble every once in a while.
It's usually someone being tunneled out that DC's, in our experience. Perhaps yours is different, perhaps it isn't.
Either way, the KR is what it is.
Well I too experience tunneling and slugging. Sometimes it's justified when killer clearly is struggling and can't do much otherwise, sometimes it's just because killer can and wants to do that at 5 gens.
Thing is the giving up issue is far more often than tunneling or slugging and for us casual SoloQ players it's the biggest fun destroyer. Despite that, I don't blame killer here - he does his job. I blame spoiled survivor players who only want to participate in easy matches against M1 killers who can be looped for entire game and when this doesn't happen they don't give a single damn about others and just try to jump to the next game because it's easier, faster and has no punishment involved.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735304#Comment_3735304
That wasn't happening every game. Let's be real. We know negativity bias is a thing.
The average Survivor was escaping less than half their matches. Solo Q was managing under 40%. Even those pesky, "P100 Premade Discord Squads" were likely escaping under 50% as well, considering high-mmr 4-man SWF's were sub-50.
If Pop was already so weak, then it shouldn't matter too much that it got nerfed.
Deadlock rewarded you, oftentimes, for losing and making poor plays. It certainly enabled camping to be very effective.
I am open to giving out some advice, if you'd like some.
I am an average survivor myself and my escape is below 40% not because I'm matched against Nurse, Blight, Spirit or w/e decent killers are but because 8 out of 10 games I have a team mate who when hooked tries to unhook self asap, then transitions to phase 2 and if by any chance someone makes there in time the guy just stands there and lets killer down them again and get sacrificed.
I can complain like any other survivor about horrors of SoloQ gaming but I have such thing as conscience and I admit that my games are often ruined by my fellow random teammates and so far nothing has been done about it.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3734992#Comment_3734992
This means those 3 ''support'' spells as they are don't decide the outcome of the game much.
See, that's the part I just don't buy.
Sure, it's better to close chases fast. But there's idle time between chases too, and Vecna's support spells deal with that. You don't have to check up on multiple gens if you can just send out an orb to check one for you. You don't have to spend a long time moving from one end of the map to the other if you have flight. In a game of five or six chases alone, this can easily add up to over a minute of time saved.
A short chase isn't the only way to be efficient. There's stuff happening between and outside chases too that you seem to consider entirely irrelevant.
Even Fly has its in-chase use, allowing you to quickly close the gap created by the on-hit sprint. Which you also disregard.
The more you insist that ONLY his in-chase, immediate, hit-securing power matters, the more it comes off as you not understanding the killer.
A poster above me already explained things so there's little to add here other than remind you that these 3 supports spells also have long cooldown and often players use them just because they are available. Yes it's nice that you can throw an orb towards a nearby gen but if you do go towards that gen then why use orb there? It makes more sense to throw orb towards other gen for scouting. Fly is a standard traversal, but you won't use it if there's nothing to defend nearby or you aren't sure if there's a survivor nearby. Flight of the Damned is still horrible but at least you can try to use it from distance and behind the wall and maybe it will hit someone. I personally would give Flight of the Damned Killer Instinct, at least that would make the spell somewhat reliable.
Hand of Mage is his staple power. If you've seen killer use it then you know that for the next 38 seconds ( unless there are addons involved ) this killer can't do anything to you if you are near the pallet. Play around it and you'll see what options does Vecna have when his main power is in CD.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3734990#Comment_3734990
Because these are completely different things we are talking about. On the one side you have an ability of a killer with not much counterplay, on the other side you have the main objective of survivors.
You have survivor perks, you can get items and you know exactly what killer's power is. This is also the only ability that allows killer actually land hits in the loop. Yet this is not enough.
Apparently you will be content when Vecna becomes an M1 killer who can't get anyone downed for 5 gens because everything he can do has a 100% reliable counter. Instead of trying to learn how to play against this killer and adapt you wish to see the only tool of the killer nerfed. It's the reason why buying any new content is stupid - a bunch of people will cry or complain that something is too strong and won't stop doing so until developers cater to their will. There goes their money, good job.
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@Ohyakno said:
What's your idea?
At this point I'd rather add a give up option for survivors. If devs don't want to penalize griefers and trolls ( I still believe they should ) at least let bot take over and contribute somehow.
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@Brightened said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/416545/so-where-are-the-unknown-is-op-people-at
Unknown is horrible for new players to go against. That's why he is OP. They will release these killers that are incredible strong to counter and just expect the survivor players to adapt. (Which we end up doing). Doesn't make them not OP at release, just means we learn to adapt to it.
If every survivor had such mindset the game state would had been much healthier. Unfortunately it's much easier to complain and give up on first down so killer's kill rates get inflated very quickly which will always result into subsequent nerfs.
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You clearly missed those topics where people complained that he can hit through walls and can teleport to his illusions more than once per match.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Seems like they forgot about him Once mid chapter happend.
Also the more I play him the more I think He Isnt as great anymore.
Trolling others by calling him OP and S or A tier grew old and boring.
Now people see he is the low tier killer with extra steps.