FearedbytheGods
FearedbytheGods
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Survivor got harder, killer got easier. Whats new?
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@metalklok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348603#Comment_1348603
Pretty sure you dont know what anecdotal is. Its not a bubble its the whole community. Thats why theres the survivors rulebook joke because its such a common occurrence that survivors feel entitled to how the killer should play. I dont know whats more cringeworthy your replys or your name.
That a majority group of entitled people got together to prove their own belief system by selectively adding things (I simplified it for you).
BTW when people resort to personal attacks, it typically means theyve lost at critical thinking.
Thanks for playing.
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@Erk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348580#Comment_1348580
Alright. So let's unpack this, shall we ?
Killers have been buffed because they need it. Like you said, 2k 2 escape, so that's why.
There is ONE killer that takes no skill to play and that's the Nightmare, if you complain about him, that's understandable. But there are killers that really really REALLY need buffs. Trapper is one example. There is also Clown, Leatherface and so on. You should take into account that not everyone has all killers maxed out. I don't have a single DLC killer ! The devs also have to take that into account, so write this onto your mind.
Trajectory of this game part :
Infinites gone : Should they stay ? Should you be able to loop a killer endlessly ?
Vaulting/map/perk/pallet nerfs : Vaulting feels much more smooth now, maps got bigger, killers have perk nerfs aswell and I don't know about pallet nerfs.
Bloodlust : If you encounter a baby killer, you can pretty much loop him for 5 years. That's why bloodlust was added. Red ranks don't use bloodlust that often anyway.
End game timer : There are 2 doors in the game. You need to police them both. If players just hide in a bush with Spine Chill and just hide in the bush again when you come back, there is nothing you can do.
Hatch close : OK, so you want 3 doors ?
You're saying this made killer easier and survivor harder. Yes, it did do that but it also balanced stuff out. If you look at them now, they look broken because they WERE broken !
If a survivor knows that the killer is going to get a 4k, which most survivors disconnect very early onto the game because they were outplayed or something, then the survivors did something wrong. It's not the killers fault for being good.
Nurse and Legion are hard killers but Nurse is balanced imo. Legion is in a weird spot.
A salty killer is easy to find. They show themselves.
I tried to give you something comprehensive referring to stats and units of metric. In response some of your points were lukewarm, if were being honest.
You skipped over things like pallet nerfs and state "I'm not sure', which then makes it hard to take most of what else you said seriously.
I mean the question over infinites is fine but it COMPLETELY ignores the context which is that it was a nerf to survivors so therefore benefited killers.
And your argument about end game timer is probably the best example of your bias, Its literally one select example that may play out: I mean what if, as a survivor, you have adjacent doors, with a high mobility killer during end game? There's absolutely no point to try for those doors, youre better off farming totems/hooks till timer ends if hatch is closed. But once again, its side point, the main one being 'survivor harder, killer easier'.
So I'll just defer to my first post in this thread.
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@hahadrillgobrrr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348580#Comment_1348580
Hahaha, good one. Best joke I've heard in a while.
You know, you have a very limited vocabulary.
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@metalklok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348581#Comment_1348581
uh no its not its LITERALLY things survivors cry about in post chat. I dont understand how you can say the examples bad when i see this junk in post chat all the time but whatever helps FEAREDBYTHEGODS feel warm inside.
That killer mains collected, because killers never say anything bad in chat -.-
You see that? That thing surrounding you? It's called a bubble. B U B B L E.
Please, your anecdotal points you've collected mean nothing outside of your bubble.
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@metalklok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348571#Comment_1348571
https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/cdmzft/the_survivors_rulebook_for_killers/
its a collection of what survivors cry in post chat im pretty sure most of them are from you!
HAHAHA it was from killer mains.
OMG I knew it.
That's how a bubble works fyi, serious, you couldn't have proved my point any better. A bunch of killers back slapping each other.
Oh I love it.
Your example is still bad.
EDIT: Reddit DBD has been a killer echo room longer than this place. Decent survivor posts would get downvoted while 'poor killer' posts were upvoted ad nauseam. Seriously you just keep proving me right.
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@Erk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348391#Comment_1348391
Can you debunk me, please ? Like I said, I would really like to hear your opinion on this.
OK, sorry formatting, copy and pasta below:
Since release, killer has been buffed, survivor nerfed. This is important to understand and through examples you’ll see why that has happened. It shows you why the game has had the trajectory it has and why we are now in our current quagmire.
It all started with the introduction of swf and the 2 escapes, 2 kills devs unit of metric. You don’t have to like the metric but it’s whats given the survivors all their nerfs and all the killers current buffs.
The devs failed to understand that people would want to play with friends in an online game (serious), what we got was ‘lobby wars’. Where survivors would join different lobbies looking for their friends and leave if they couldn’t find them. It was horrible trying to find games. Hence why we got swf, that completely unbalanced the game by creating coordinated survivors that could communicate. The devs have been nerfing survivor ever since and completely crippled solo survivor play.
Killers now are up around 70% kills due to the trajectory of the game and the devs metric system, unless you feel their metric system is bad, in which case they can undo all the changes I've just mentioned....
It also important to mention marketing and advertising. There’s nothing special about survivors, they are just reskins with some new perks that all play the same. THATS IT. EACH killer has its own unique play style and as you see from their advertising, its always new killers they promote. Survivors get a mention, but its never really the selling point.
DBD reddit, back in the day was all about poking fun at survivors and giving you the impression that every second game is SWF and heavily biased against killers. Which was a lie. OP SWF games are maybe one in 30 games with most swf games being friends who are just wanting to have fun and usually end up wiping. But there was no push back, the killer echo room there would down vote anything survivor sided.
That coupled with the points I mentioned previously meant that a lot of survivor mains left the game. Which is kind of obvious, I mean you understand the devs unit of metric sure, but you just watch nerf, after nerf, after nerf as it all gets taken away. Why would you stay for that? Its kind of miserable.
What has this created? In short. Entitlement. Killer mains know if they whine, they get what they want.
THIS is the environment the devs have created and what you see on the forums.
Trajectory of this game
Infinites gone, vaulting/perk/map/pallet nerfs, bloodlust added, end game timer added, hatch close added. All this has made being killer easier and survivor harder since release.
2 escapes, 2 kills is the devs unit of metric. You don’t have to like that but it’s whats given the survivors all their nerfs and all the killers current buffs.
You look at the SB vs. NOED debates that happend at release all those years ago. SB now is mediocre at best where as NOED is still a high tier perk.
Killers now are up around 70% kills due to the trajectory of the game and the devs metric system, unless you feel their metric system is bad, in which case they can undo all the changes I've just mentioned....
It's only been recently that killers have started getting push back from devs because the state of the game is disconnecting survivors who know a game is going to end in a 4k so why bother for 3k BP.
And what do we see? Thread after thread recently of nurse players whining, legion players whining. People talk about salty survivors alot in this forum but ignore the elephant in the room.
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@hahadrillgobrrr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348397#Comment_1348397
Hahaha, good one. Best joke I've heard in a while.
Nice bubble.
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@metalklok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348429#Comment_1348429
dude have you ever even seen these forums? Blank killer op, ban camping/tunneling,nerf noed/mori is made everyday. But yeah youre right we shouldn't bring up the fact that cry baby survivors can abuse dc'ing to let someone get a win.
I assume its a rhetorical question given I have more posts than you.
Also you highlight a poor example, why would the baby cry, if it just won?
haha
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@metalklok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348402#Comment_1348402
hello? this community made a whole survivors rulebook because of how entitled some survivors are.
What is this rule book you speak of?
I'm curious because i never heard ANY survivor refer to it. I suspect you place more weight on it that any survivor does.
Now you got me wondering if it was crafted by a killer main posing as a survivor.
Link me in baby.
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You already get penalised for d/c.
Could the whining of the killer community get any louder?
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Killer entitlement.
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@Bmj2 said:
LOL killers still complaining about brand new part thinking it is OP ?
Yeah dude.. I suggest they remove all the survivor items and only let them use 1 perk slot instead 4. Also remove SWF as a whole and only let survivors solo queue. That way all the baby killers will finally be happy they can get 4k in all games and feel better about their life.
You do realise that there are Survivor players (like myself) that ONLY play SWF because thats how they get the most fun out of the game.
If you are feeling too "stressed" playing killer maybe you should find some other game that doesn't put so much pressure on your shoulders.
Welcome to the killer forums, there's a few decent survivors mains that do some good push back here but mostly its just killers talking in a bubble.
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@Erk said:
This is the biggest problem of this game by far. The fight between survivor mains and killer mains. We just can't agree, can we ? The only thing (that I know of) both sides agree on is : iri head. That's all. So, I will give some information first.
The game is balanced around 2k 2 escape and solo survivors. SWFs don't ruin the game but they basically disable most killers' powers. Trapper, Hag, Wraith, Shape, Ghostface, Demogorgon. If the whole team knows where Ghostface and Shape is stalking from, Trapper's and Hag's traps are, Demogorgon's portals are and where Wraith is, all of these killers at best become M1 killers and at worst become useless.
SWFs don't need to be too competent to win. You can just "have fun with your friends" and still have a huge adventage. A decent killer (green or purple ranks) can counter somewhat good SWFs but the way matchmaking works right now, its impossible to get people at your skill at these ranks.
But if you are a solo survivor decent killers can destroy you. This is important, you'll see why.
Since the devs balance the game around solo survivors, killers get nerfed. The maps get bigger, powerful perks get nerfed and so on but the important part is, since the survivors get soft-buffed, SWFs get even more stronger. As a casual player that doesn't like competitive too much I can say that, playing killer has become stressful at best and infuriating at worst. This needs to change.
Playing survivor is way easier than playing killer. I know that killer should be harder but it shouldn't be scary. I am scared of the survivors that will be going against me. While playing survivor is the easiest thing. If you press shift and get to a window AND the killer commits to you, the game is over. Even if you die, the killer will have a 1k.
While survivors claim that killers are too op with their iri heads, moris and NOEDs, killers claim that survivors are too op with their keys, BNPs and 2nd chance perks and items. This really needs to be sorted out by either the players uniting under the common goal of balancing this game or the devs balancing it.
I don't know how to balance this game. You need to make SWFs weaker but nerf survivors while also maintaining the balance between the killer and the solo survivor.
I would really like to hear your thoughts on this.
killers vs. survivors title.
Proceeds to make poor killer post No. 2,347,997
Next.
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@Hex_Generator said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348372#Comment_1348372
It's called 'hyperbole'.
Nice wall of text then i guess.
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@Hex_Generator said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348296#Comment_1348296
OP SWF are 1 in 30 games? Try 11 in 10 games. No, that was not a typo.
Camping WAS punished, but Survivors found a way to abuse the mechanic, so it was removed to prevent further abuse. So blame yourselves.
Tunneling is just a BS phrase that it will never be an issue. 'I was unhooked and went to work on the generator 3 feet away, and the Killer hit me! He TUNNELED!' or 'I was unhooked, ran 15 feet, then started healing, and the Killer hit me! I was TUNNELED!' Sometimes, hitting the wounded person is the smart play, since it's 50% faster to down them (One less hit).
Or maybe the Killer saw you had a toolbox and gens are going too fast, so they want you out.
Or maybe they saw a key. Or maybe you were making damn good flashlight saves, so you're a threat.
Or maybe they saw your scratch marks but the person who unhooked you is hiding. No rules state that the Killer HAS to ignore you.
But no, none of that matters. Entitled Survivors seem to think they should have infinite immunity to being hit after being unhooked, because they 'deserve' to play the game until THEY decide they have played long enough. If the Killer eliminates them before they have 'played enough', then they slink onto this forum and whine about 'camping' and 'tunneling' and demand punishments with mechanics that can be easily abused.
As for claiming the game is Killer-sided simply because each Killer has a gimmick that Survivors don't; ROFL. This is a design choice and has nothing to do with which side they like more. This is like going into Overwatch and saying 'The devs favor Widowmaker because she has a sniper rifle! They want Widowmaker players to die as little as possible!' Keep looking for fake reasons as to why 'Devs hate Survivors!'
Now, when it comes to nerfs, let's remember that Legion was nerfed into the trash bin, and has stayed there for years. And Survivors whined that Nurse could not be looped like every killer, did not eat pallets like every killer, and bE listened and nerfed her as well. bE Also started building Killer powers with built-in counters so Survivors would not have to think while playing, or pick off-meta perks EVER. Every Killer was basically a free 5th perk slot.
bE Also refuses to admit that voice comms with SWF are ruining the game with depip squads and bully squads and gens done in 17 seconds. They refuse to admit that running a SWF is basically like running 10 perks, so Survivors have a massive advantage.
But yes, sure, fine; poor babby Survivors are sooooo bullied and bE nerfs everything and never listens to them. Entitled Survivors are like spoiled children. 'I want the Nurse nerfed! WHAAAA!' Ok, we nerfed the nurse. 'I want Legion nerfed!' Ok, Legion is now trash. 'I want camping and tunneling punished! WHAAA!' Well, no. They are play styles.. 'You never give us ANYTHING! WHAAA!'
It is a typo, otherwise how can i trust you understand the rest of what you just typed lol -.-
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@JustCats said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1346301#Comment_1346301
That's how I feel about looping with 2+ second chance perks but it does help survivors at least waste a lot of time.
Just cause you think it's pathetic and lazy doesn't make it indefensible if the strategy furthers the killer's objective. Camping and tunneling is just doing too much of the only thing the killer gets to do in this game, and it seems that more often than not we let survivors draw the line of how much is too much of the killer's one thing.
lol that's stupid logic, you only have it because devs allow it.
By your rationale infinites should still be in the game, there's a bigger picture here.
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@chenais said:
In dbd, killers have multiple strategies: they can mindgame or they can just camp and tunnel. Camping and tunneling are really unfun and there is no good argument for defending them. If your argument is "gens" or "its still possible to escape as a tunneled dude" or "killers have to deal with unfair stuff, to", then you better find something else, since I am gonna destroy all of these arguments in this post.
First of all, I need to explain why they are so bad. Camping and tunneling someone pretty much removes any chance of that person escaping.
"Yes but people can do gens, and then its a 2 man escape, which is balanced since 2k is what the balance of this game should be around". Yea, you are right, camping is balanced because of that. But there is another question here: the fun factor. If a game is not fun, then balance does not matter, people will not play it. Here is why it is unfun: first, if you are one of the 2 camped or tunneled survivors, you have pretty much no chance at escaping, which does not feel good. If you are one of the 2 people doing gens, then what fun is this? You are skipping the most fun and interactive part of the game, which is getting chased, to do the boring task of holding m1. So none of the survivors have fun, and fun is more important than balance, since it is what makes people play a game.
Then, we have the "it is possible to escape even while being camped or tunneled". Yes, I agree, it is possible to escape such a situation. However, you are at a massive disadvantage if this is the case. It does not feel ok at all to lose because of a big disadvantage that you do not have any control on. Its like saying "4 man swf it is still possible to win".
Finally, we have the "yea but killers have to deal with unfair stuff, tho". I am gonna reapply your logic so that you can understand that it is not that good. Imagine this scenario: they are 2 countries at war. Country 1 kills innocent people in country 2, so country 2 justifies killing innocent people from country 1 by saying that country 2 did the same. Now, I get that there is a difference between playing unfairly in dbd and killing real people, but this is the exact same argument, just on a much smaller scale.
So hopefully people start realizing that camping and tunneling are not fun. Hopefully they are fixed soon enough.
Have a nice day.
I don't think your wrong the issue is that the devs have babied these camping/tunneling aspects since release.
The inverse would be infinites for survivors, which have now been removed. I mean REAL infinites too, not these pseudo-infinites some killers hold onto when they get owned.
I mean just look at your first response 'PS: Camping and tunneling are fine and fair. Go do gens.' Like you already explained that in your OP and yet this guy gets 30+ upvotes, lol this forum.......
Here's the long version of what I'm saying that might make the devs and therefore the attitude of people on these forums clear:
Since release, killer has been buffed, survivor nerfed. This is important to understand and through examples you’ll see why that has happened. It shows you why the game has had the trajectory it has and why we are now in our current quagmire.
It all started with the introduction of swf and the 2 escapes, 2 kills devs unit of metric. You don’t have to like the metric but it’s whats given the survivors all their nerfs and all the killers current buffs.
The devs failed to understand that people would want to play with friends in an online game (serious), what we got was ‘lobby wars’. Where survivors would join different lobbies looking for their friends and leave if they couldn’t find them. It was horrible trying to find games. Hence why we got swf, that completely unbalanced the game by creating coordinated survivors that could communicate. The devs have been nerfing survivor ever since and completely crippled solo survivor play.
Killers now are up around 70% kills due to the trajectory of the game and the devs metric system, unless you feel their metric system is bad, in which case they can undo all the changes I've just mentioned....
It also important to mention marketing and advertising. There’s nothing special about survivors, they are just reskins with some new perks that all play the same. THATS IT. EACH killer has its own unique play style and as you see from their advertising, its always new killers they promote. Survivors get a mention, but its never really the selling point.
DBD reddit, back in the day was all about poking fun at survivors and giving you the impression that every second game is SWF and heavily biased against killers. Which was a lie. OP SWF games are maybe one in 30 games with most swf games being friends who are just wanting to have fun and usually end up wiping. But there was no push back, the killer echo room there would down vote anything survivor sided.
That coupled with the points I mentioned previously meant that a lot of survivor mains left the game. Which is kind of obvious, I mean you understand the devs unit of metric sure, but you just watch nerf, after nerf, after nerf as it all gets taken away. Why would you stay for that? Its kind of miserable.
What has this created? In short. Entitlement. Killer mains know if they whine, they get what they want.
THIS is the environment the devs have created and what you see on the forums.
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@Loner said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1347842#Comment_1347842
I only started playing around the end of 2017,4.1k hrs by now. So was it like that on release then? How did the mechanic work?
Just what happens to all the others, you either had a couple attempts then went to struggle state, or if you wanted to troll the killer you'd just sit there slowly counting down to struggle state. Which is why they got rid of it.
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@Dwinchester said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343289#Comment_1343289
I'm a pretty decent killer. 69% kill rate against average survivor ranks of 3.7. That said, I only pip in 50% of my games, because I am so pressed for time. I got a death squad earlier tonight, one hook total.
Trust me when I say the game is still very survivor sided. If you're not winning as survivor, it's totally on you.
Even if i accepted your numbers at face value (which I don't) you failed to even mention the polarisation between solo and swf which is VASTLY different.
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@BlazeNightash said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1347863#Comment_1347863
Well no point in arguing with a moron who can't research his own facts, You have nothing to add anymore but go ahead and try to "Prove why you're right"
You know what they say about critical thinking, once you resort to insults, you don't have it.
Perhaps if you consolidated your talking points and offered something more than anecdotal points I'd listen. But all your doing is jumping up and down saying 'stats aren't facts' but not offering anything better.
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@BlazeNightash said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1347602#Comment_1347602
man going straight to the insults are we now, someone's butthurt. Why? Because i said the data you got is completely flawed because the devs pile everything together instead of matches where no moris no d/cs no farm games troll games etc etc it would be more around 40-50% not 70% for sure especially at higher ranks, the data is extremely flawed. But instead of researching for the facts on your own you rather copy paste something from the devs who are known for not having accurate information on alot of problems with the game
LOOOOL
Wow that reach...... is golden.
All your doing is reiterating yourself. I could literally copy and paste my reply to you from your OTHER post and completely close you down.... again.
Their stats are better then your anecdotal talking points. Do you know what anecdotal means?
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@Loner said:
When was it ever like that? Pretty sure you could never attempt escape when you were last in the trial,actually 100% sure. Only time you can do is if someone else is alive or dying on the hook and you get hooked before he dies. Then the game lets you attempt escape.
Well we all know you haven't been playing since release.
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Can't upvote this enough, lets stop with the hyberbole.
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@NitpickDropkick said:
the killer experience at rank one is stressful at its best and just dreadful at its worst. I have heard many killer main streamers/youtubers complain of the same fact. Its just not worth sweating your ass off ever game just to have a chance and im done with it.
I have lost all hope that these devs have any clue how to fix their game and im sick of SWF groups roaming around in a game that was clearly balanced around solo que. I was looking forward to the balancing map changes and im saddened to see that only the most obvious of issues was even looked at. This leads me to think that the balance team of DBD plays and balances around what feels right for low skill solo players. Ruin was nerfed into oblivion entirely because new players understandably couldn't hit that skillcheck, so the devs removed it. Even though at high ranks it only gave the killer a sliver of respite from gens flying. Pretty good job so far.
DBD is a great idea, ruined by incompetence. And I don't think its going to get better anymore. Anyone in a similar situation to me and is fed up with this nonsense, go play Escape from Tarkov. Its a game that can crank the intensity to 11 like dbd, but made by devs who actually care.
The epitome of killer entitlement right here. Take a photo.
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@LetsPlayTogether said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343302#Comment_1343302
Sad if thats want you think.
Sad if you don't see it, do you know what tribalism is?
Welcome to a bigger world.
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@BlazeNightash said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343289#Comment_1343289
Except your 70% winrate is extremely flawed because the devs dont' account for moris, people d/cing, low rank high rank, etc etc, hell i don't even know why you're taking info from the devs anyway they barely play their own game let alone high rank killer games against swfs. The main issue isn't survivors are op, its mainly the maps and the gens are the problem and the devs really won't take action to fix these issue so they just take the easier route of buffing killers and nerfing survivors because its alot easier than redesigning problematic maps and testing how quickly a gen should go.
Its alot harder to apply pressure on survs with alot of killers espeically a 4 man because, Game starts you got limited time to find and start trying to down one surv before gens start flying, and that chase can't prolong so long due to the fact the time works against you. I had games where i downed 2 survs within a min and i still lose 3 gens in that period But "JuSt PrESsure GenS" like how am i able to do that and you notice the only killers that have higher potential for quick downs are ones who break the rules of loops and sometimes just completely bypass them (Spirit, Nurse) Can make up for this issue
While other killers can struggle because chain loop into chain loop of safe pallets is extremely time consuming and you can say OH JUST LEAVE THEM ITS A WASTE, ya sure now i need to go find another surv and hope they're out of position so i can down them fast or they're just gonna do the same exact thing, its not difficult to loop in this game, you don't even have to be amazing at it to heavily waste the killers time as some loops are just that safe. And most killers basically have to capitalize on surv mistakes to get ahead, but it almost feels like if you just ######### up even once on killer the games over, its way harder to recover from mistakes as a killer than it is as a survivor
Then, as if to highlight my point that you were responding emotionally and not from a point of logic you respond to my exact same post AGAIN, with another wall of text AGAIN.
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@BlazeNightash said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343289#Comment_1343289
Your data is flawed, 70% is not accurate as devs don't account for moris, d/cs, troll teammates, farm games etc etc. They don't even play their own game half the time and for sure not at higher ranks. The real issue is map design and gen speed, Some maps are just way to big and some are just fill with so much crap in them its hard for some killers to perform in, Yes we need 60 trees on one map for some odd reason. Chain loops are a massive problem as well especially when majority of them are unmanageable for most killers to mind game in. Thats why killers who can bypass alot of loops and safe loops(nurse, spirit) Perform extremely well unless the player is in lack of skill for those killers. Other killers struggle with this time crunch because you only have so much time per chase that includes finding a surv to chase from the get go before gens start flying. and when you have to hook each surv 3 times to kill them it just takes way to long. Killers almost needs to capitalize on surv mistakes to even get ahead and its alot more punishing for the killer for them to make a mistake than it a survivor since its a 4v1. And don't act like survs don't whine about every little thing that the killer does, because you know damn well survs mains are hell of alot more toxic than killer mains. The game is unbalanced due to alot of reasons and the devs don't care to fix the main issues they just rather take the easy way out of over buffing killers and nerfing survs
'Your data is flawed'
You then provide anecdotal subjective information to support your own points.
LOL, just lol.
Even if I take your points of criticism about the stats as true (which I don't) it's still better than your 'because I say so' points.
People will work harder to maintain their belief system, then to establish truth. Welcome to being a human.
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@chenais said:
Lately, I saw a lot of killers complaining about survivors being overpowered. This is not true! How about all killer crutches? Ebony moris, iridescent head, infinite tier 3, all a free win! How about all the weird hitboxes and dead hard that often bugs? How about the indoor maps? How about the stats that devs showed that told that killers had a 60%-75% kill rate depending on the killer? I meen, yes ruin nerfs maybe have dropped the numbers, but they are still perks like corrupt intervention that allow killers to stop generators early game. Killers have noed, to. So the kill rate must be around 50%. Killer mains, explain to me why survivors are overpowered.
On a side note, I am not doing this post to tell that killers are overpowered, I get it, they have a few issues like 4 man swf, all I am trying to do it to convince killers complaining that the game is balanced.
You must be new here, so I'll be gentle.
Tribalism is the short answer.
Long answer:
Since release, killer has been buffed, survivor nerfed. This is important to understand and through examples you’ll see why that has happened. It shows you why the game has had the trajectory it has and why we are now in our current quagmire of killers that are overly buffed but killers still whining.
It all started with the introduction of swf and the 2 escapes, 2 kills devs unit of metric. You don’t have to like the metric but it’s whats given the survivors all their nerfs and all the killers current buffs.
The devs failed to understand that people would want to play with friends in an online game (serious), what we got at release was ‘lobby wars’. Where survivors would join different lobbies looking for their friends and leave if they couldn’t find them. It was horrible trying to find games. Hence why we got swf, that completely unbalanced the game by creating coordinated survivors that could communicate ingame. The devs have been nerfing survivor ever since and completely crippled solo survivor play as a result.
Killers now are up around 70% kills due to the trajectory of the game and the devs metric system, unless you feel their metric system is bad, in which case they can undo all the changes I've just mentioned....
It also important to mention marketing and advertising. There’s nothing special about survivors, they are just reskins with some new perks that all play the same. THATS IT. Each killer has its own unique play style and as you see from their advertising, its always new killers they promote. Survivors get a mention, but its never really the selling point.
DBD reddit, back in the day was all about poking fun at survivors and giving you the impression that every second game is SWF and heavily biased against killers. Which was a lie. OP SWF games are maybe one in 30 games with most swf games being friends who are just wanting to have fun and usually end up wiping. But there was no push back, the killer echo room there would down vote anything survivor sided.
That coupled with the points I mentioned previously meant that a lot of survivor mains left the game. Which is kind of obvious, I mean you understand the devs unit of metric sure, but you just watch nerf, after nerf, after nerf as it all gets taken away. Why would you stay for that? Its kind of miserable.
What has this created? In short. Entitlement. Killer mains know if they whine, they get what they want.
THIS is the environment the devs have created and what you see on the forums.
This is the culmination of what you observe.
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@Shocktober said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343166#Comment_1343166
It was also posted that mori spam wasn't bannable on these forums (because technically the bleedout timer is still going). But I know of people who received temporary in-game bans for doing it.
For the reasons? Why ~wouldn't~ you do this to some teabagging flashlight macro spamming survivor?
I remember back when infinites were in the game, REAL infinites too, not these pseudo-infinites soft killers hold onto. A prominent killer at that time commented that once infinites were gone, they'd have no reason to do these things to survivors anymore.
Oh how I laughed. People always find an excuse.
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@Peanits said:
None of those are bannable. I'd have to question why you would choose to go out of your way to do them, but they wouldn't get you banned.
What's even the point of clarifying, you're just bringing it to people's attention that they can do it and get away with it.
Make sure you wade into a conversation about survivors teabagging next time too huh, you know to even things up.
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Same here.
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I don't recommend this game at all anymore, unless people express an interest to play killer. It's just a miserable experience, and I see more smurf accts at low ranks as killers to, which compounds the issue.
At this stage I just encourage people to play killer or play something else.
You're just going to get decimated if you come into this game as a solo survivor.
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@xGodSendDeath said:
Man, I thought from all the teabagging and bullying that you survivors wanted a challenge. That's why the bully squads exist right, boredom from the game being so easy?
Rather typical over simplification, if you don't mind me saying.
Complaining about something that doesn't impact the game AT ALL (teabagging) except you're feelings.
How could we forget the generic r/allsurvivor. Feel free to discuss swf vs. solo and show you have a modicum of insight.
I don't know what's worse you're simple statement or the people upvoting simple.
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Play killer or don't play at all.
It's the only way these killer dominated forums will understand anything beyond their own bias.
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Looks like the devs got on their knees for killers once again.
Time for survivors to find something else to play for awhile.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1239126#Comment_1239126
3 months ago - the devs went through with the Ruin changes and they nerfed Doctor, clearly they only care about survivors, look at the way they worded their developer update, they only care about survivor gameplay.
Now - this comment
Its hilarious watching these kinds of comments with my popcorn when three months ago it was the exact opposite.
You.Cannot.Please.This.Community.
Well you obviously haven't played since release, or you'd be eating that popcorn laughing at yourself.
But you take that out of context small snap shot. People will work harder to maintain a belief system, than to work for the truth.
Killer is easier now, than at any point in the games history.
Try a list of changes since 2016, try again.
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@USELESS said:
I think this game is comltely survivor sided, without paid killers like reddy or demogorgon maybe you can't do anything. Map pressure? Gone. HITBOXES? Are broken as glass. Anything on this game seems to be survivor sided when you are killer. Imo this game needs a perk to put pressure on survivors that even with clown we could kill someone. If you not believe me, play killer as rank 4 as trapper or clown
Killer is easier now than at release. If you can't play killer now, you should give up because it wasn't made for you. If you want a participation trophy, this game is not for you.
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@Mister_Holdout said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1212902#Comment_1212902
Except, I can back up my claims.
- This game has always been survivor-sided (still is).
- I see many survivor mains who try say the game is fair enough as it is (it's not by a long shot).
- Killer mains come up with ridiculous ideas too, but at least their intentions are understandable (because the game is unfair to them).
The point being: DbD has always been survivor-sided. And survivor mains have gotten used to it. So when killer mains (justifiably) want more balance updates that make them stronger, survivor mains act like we are selfish. Since when is wanting a balanced game selfish?
I can make these claims because I've been here for years and gotten to experience everything about this game. Not to mention, the devs have a track record of being very biased. They are starting to change finally (thank god), but we'll see how long that lasts. I'm pretty sure the only reason the devs announced the map reworks is because of the enormous blow-back after the Ruin nerf. After that shameful decision, the devs could no longer pretend like they weren't biased.
Did you look up the words I used? Because you just did it again.
Also I was here since release and if you scroll through this thread you'll see rudimentary examples of my intimate knowledge of changes the game has gone through over time.
Perhaps I should try a different tac:
People will work harder to attempt to disprove a truth, if that truth counters their belief system.
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@batax90 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1211211#Comment_1211211
I always assume survivor got BT just like when im on the survivor side i always assume the killer got bbq
I've seen that argument before.
There are so many perk/addons/traits to keep in mind that the raw cognitive ability to remember EVERYTHING is impossible.
But hey, your the exception to the rule.
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@Mister_Holdout said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1212106#Comment_1212106
Survivor mains want to maintain the status quo (which is in their favor). Killer mains know the game is horribly balanced, and make recommendations that give more power to killers (which is justified).
Where to start...
- Anecdotal subjective talking points.
- Group think mentality
- Biased tribalistic narrative
- Generalised consensus
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When people discuss the concept of 'critical thinking' its stated that once someone engages in personal attacks, they do not have it.
People will work harder to maintain a belief system and actively work against the truth if their belief system is compromised.
Tru3 IS a killer main, he IS a biased tribalistic streamer.
I've watched him since release, and at release he'd say survivors 'are doing wrong' by engaging with the killer (juking etc.), survivors are supposed to play 'sneaky sneak'. Which anyone with half a brain and any decent time in the game will tell you is BORING.
One of the last games I watched Tru3 in was against an SWF team. He spent the ENTIRE TIME whinging about how SWF was OP and not fair. He finished that game as a 4k and did this pathetic pivot saying 'oh I meant swf is not fair for new killers'.
You watch Tru3, your subscribed to him, that's fine. But when you step out of that bubble, don't be surprised if reality is alot different.
Tru3 NOED idea is stupid.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1211586#Comment_1211586
But legion and spirit still got nerfed, unless you think a nerf is only a nerf that destoys the nerfed object, but then neither exhaustion nor ds were nerfed.
Also, can you show me those statistics plz? killer at 70% killrate implys thats the average, but the only statistics i know 70% were the top, not the avarage, wich only 2 killers could reach, while every one else was behind that, too under 50% as nurse.
But maybe i dont know the recent statistics, so link it to me plz.
Thanks for clarifying what you mean by recent. And i have to say, i dont know about nerfs before 2018, because thats when i started playing the game.
Look you can argue that they were nerfed, but I dont see the point in that being the hill you want to die on because overall those killers are fine, so even if I agree with you its hardly relevant to the game changing elements Ive listed in my last 2 posts. So if thats what you want, Ill give you that spirit got a slight nerf overall but it was small and she's still a high impact killer, and I just cant give you Legion because even the devs came out and said that his numbers are slightly up. So to hold onto 'it was a nerf' is a strawman argument as far as Im concerned because your taking a compartmentalised perspective and saying 'see look'. But like I said, aside from nurse, it wasn't game changing, so I don't know why you want it.
For the record, exhaustion wasn't present at release, you could run balanced landing and spring burst simultaneously. I'm not arguing the change but it REALLY highlights the LAYERS of nerfs that survivors have gone through, relative to killer.
I'm referring to the November stats, but I assume your looking at all ranks? The devs at one stage said that they base their '2kill, 2 escape' metric based off red ranks. But I don't know if that take is still current.
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@SpEz said:
I’m taking this idea from one of Tru3talents most recent YouTube videos, where he said change the endgame where when all 5 gens are completed survivors die instantly on the hook to prevent killers camping hooks at end game.
Using this idea for noed change would be :
Once the last generator is completed the killer gets increased movement speed of 2/3/4%
Once the last generator is completed ALL survivors who get hooked will die instantly on the hook.
This effect lasts while the hex totem is still present.
This would prevent killers camping hooks and hook trading.
Your opening sentence, was a bad idea.
Tru3 is a killer main with biased tribalistic talking points.
Please don't watch him, if you want a healthy take on the game.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1211388#Comment_1211388
I assume with recently you mean the ruin nerf? So you dont consider the Nurse or Legion or spirit rework nerfs?
While it is true that survivors had a lot of nerfs, most of them i consider justified. Instaheals, DS, exhaustion, meddle of man, yeah i think they were op.
The thing is that surivors are mainly skins, and if you nerf survivors by nerfing perks or other mechanics, you are nerfing all of them. That was done with ruin nerf to killers, too, but most other nerfs on killers were on specific killers and didnt affect the rest.
This ignoring of the specific killer nerfs is the thing that makes your post seems very biased, because you just ignore them.
I still think survivors are in a good place. If the upcoming changes swing the pendulum too far in the other direction, there will be a next wave of corrections. But that said, i play both sides, but mainly survivor (60-70% of games, mostly solo), so every change to whatever side affects me anyway, both good and bad. Maybe thats why i am more relaxed than people that play only one side.
I can just tell every one to play both sides, a) to learn the limitations of the other side, and i think its widen your viewpoint.
If were talking since release then nurse, legion, spirit reworks are all new changes (you skipped the doc rework), so it absolutely falls within the timeline I mentioned, so Im not sure what you think I'm ignoring. Also its around this time that we got hatch close which benefitted killers and EGC which was a HUGE carry for killers. Things like bloodlust and entity blockers were added YEARS ago that benefit killers and fundamentally changed the game. So if anything your points about survivors as skins and individual changes to killers is a net gain for killers overall.
But your statement is disingenuous because your assuming that all 3 reworks you mentioned ARE nerfs. Legion is doing as good as, if not better prior to its rework and spirit change wasn't even a blip on the radar, spirit kill rate was higher than any other killer based off the last round of stats. The only killer whose significantly down is nurse, who was fundamentally broken at release because she can hard countered everything a survivor can use to survivor. Her only limit was people's potential. Honestly the argument is so old, that this was back during the time of 72hrs (streamer) who was the last great survivor in this game. My issue with nurse was ######### it took so long.
The pendulum is already too far, killers are around 70% kills, as I said. That's not inline with the devs metric I mentioned.
Finally you saying that survivor nerfs were justified, doesn't really do anything based of what the OP said and what the point of my post was.
If you wanted a more concise summary it would be that the devs have mismanaged their community by hitting survivors with nerf after nerf and creating this expectation for killers that they've now been unable to deal with because its changed. Just look at Tru3 (streamer) who despite getting 4k after 4k, still finds the time to whine about how oppressed killers are.
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@Todgeweiht said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1211306#Comment_1211306
Damn this is interesting, this guy basically predicted the behaviour of the community for the years to come trough sheer psychology. This explains a lot of thing.
OMG.....
You want psychology, you should read up on the psychology around expectations. Then read my post.
To associate an entire demographic with an attitude shift due to a singular perk change is just so untrue, its almost unbelievable.
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@Dehitay said:
A year ago, you would see far more entitled survivors making posts about stuff like how nerfing MoM was unfair and demanding an easier escape after they failed to finish generators or get to the hatch first. Even though there were some entitled killers, the vast majority were throwing facts around and making decent points.
But geez, has that changed in recent months. I think the floodgates of stupid killers opened around the implementation of the 3.6 patch where I was seeing a terrifying amount of threads about how it was a killer nerf which makes absolutely no sense to a sane rational person. And nowadays, I'm seeing killers in about half the threads claiming stuff is bait which makes absolutely no sense based on the context and doesn't really do much more than prove that they're too ignorant to know the difference between bait and bias.
For what small percentage of you are actually willing to learn, here's some clarification on the difference. Bait is when a person intentionally says something misleading or exaggerated in order to get a heavy response. Bias is when somebody posts something that they actually believe cause they're not open minded enough to see reason (ex: the vast majority of you that claim bait at anything that goes against your own beliefs without bothering to honestly think about the post).
It's been happening much longer than a year ago. But it's more like grains of sand, its just gotten worse and worse over time.
Since release, killer has been buffed, survivor nerfed. This is important to understand and through examples you’ll see why that has happened. It shows you why the game has had the trajectory it has and why we are now in our current quagmire with entitled killers.
It all started with the introduction of swf and the 2 escapes, 2 kills devs unit of metric. You don’t have to like the metric but it’s whats given the survivors all their nerfs and all the killers current buffs.
The devs failed to understand that people would want to play with friends in an online game (serious), what we got was ‘lobby wars’. Where survivors would join different lobbies looking for their friends and leave if they couldn’t find them. It was horrible trying to find games. Hence why we got swf, that completely unbalanced the game by creating coordinated survivors that could communicate. The devs have been nerfing survivor ever since and completely crippled solo survivor play.
Since release; infinites gone, vaulting/perk/map/pallet nerfs, bloodlust added, end game timer added, hatch close added. All this has made being killer easier and survivor harder since release.
You look at the SB vs. NOED debates that happend at release all those years ago. SB now is mediocre at best where as NOED is still a high tier perk.
Killers now are up around 70% kills due to the trajectory of the game and the devs metric system, unless you feel their metric system is bad, in which case they can undo all the changes I've just mentioned....
It's only been recently that killers have started getting push back from devs because the state of the game is disconnecting survivors who know a game is going to end in a 4k so why bother for 3k BP.
And what do we see? Thread after thread recently of killers whining. In short, killers haven't had to deal with any significant nerfs, till recently. Hence why its so noticeable, they've just never had to deal with it before.
People talk about salty survivors alot in this forum but ignore the elephant in the room.
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@Pigforever said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/143414/dead-by-daylight-is-dead
Play killer then Since you think it’s so easy you’ll earn all kinds of bp
Why so many upvotes.
You just got owned lol.
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So the OP thinks its too easy for killers, and that survivors need a buff.
Queue: killer nerd rage
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@batax90 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1209719#Comment_1209719
Insidious get rid of your terror radius you need a terror radious to be able to borrow time so thats why in my opinion if one of those perk get rework the other perk should be rework too its only fair
There's so much reach in that idea that it almost unbelievable.
The only way the exchange for bt and isidious works if you assume that camping is OK because you THINK someone has BT, you have no way to detemine until its already proc'd..