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Let's place bets on how long it takes for a DBD Discord server moderator or admin's Discord account to get breached and the DBD Discord gets nuked as a result.
I'll start with the over/under: equal to or over 1 year/under 1 year
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I really hope this is an elaborate shitpost.
This is meant as a joke, right?
I refuse to believe someone could post this and actually mean every word they typed.
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Honestly, the best thing BHVR could do for the health of the game is enforce a 1-month ban for miserable players with the ban message saying "Please touch grass for a while, then come back. You will be happier, we promise."
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@ShanoaLegendaryPlz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4067876#Comment_4067876
Yea but something that can punish people based on word alone is a double edged sword. If u mean players including killer, nearly every survivor is going to report the killer if they even feel they were tunneled. Theyl even report them for what killer they used. And survivors arent safe from the reverse either. T bag at gates? Report that one, that one, and that one. Flashlight saved? Report. Missed a skill check? Report. Funny name but the other person is offended easily - report.
Theres a reason even the hacker reporting mostly requires video proof these days. And every other report barely works unless someone is sandbagging people in every round and reported for unsportsmanlike. We would tear eachother up without a reason if given the ability to.
The reason the cheater/hacker (and quite frankly, everything else except chat abuse) reporting requires video evidence is that BHVR doesn't keep any logs of what happens in games at all for any length of time, for some unknown reason that probably involves a lack of server-side validation for literally anything.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014169#Comment_4014169
This is a lot of words to say literally nothing.
I know about those instances, and those are specific.
So I'll ask again: what, exactly, are the problems with the anti tunneling/anti slug systems are we looking to fix?
Because so far, the only thing I have seen, and the only things that people can bring up is "don't do it or I'll quit". That level of entitlement isn't something the devs can fix beyond continuing to cater to it. Which is what those people want.
So, what actually happened in PTB matches that we should talk about fixing? Video of it happening would be great.
Because "don't do anything" is all in hearing from detractors. Literally zero constructive anything, and nothing actionable.
I was replying to your comment on bully squads allegedly not being a problem (even though it was clear to me that you think they are a problem and I fully agree).
I was not making a comment on whether tunneling and slugging are a problem. (Tunneling and slugging aren't a problem, by the way. They are a symptom of a much larger problem around a rapidly escalating balance arms race in the face of nearly zero valid perk options for killers to use instead of gameplay strategies such as tunneling and slugging.)
Calm down, take a deep breath, and realize that sometimes, people reply to agree with you and elaborate on your point instead of arguing against you.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4014095#Comment_4014095
I'm not going to feed the troll here, but just to also point out:
And why isn’t bully squads on the official roadmap?
It's not on the road map because it's been addressed directly every time.
Boil over buff reverted very quickly when it was a problem (2 weeks).
Base kit light born on locker grab to effectively delete double locker saves.
RPD library was reworked to have a hook, which was then immediately abused by killers, before they finally deleted the upper library entirely.
Infinite locker glitches got kill switched same day and fixed.
Hooks respawn to make sure there are no dead zones, even if a survivor died on hook.
Maps are smaller to mitigate hook dead zones. (Admittedly, current pallet spawns is messing with this, which is actually 2 issues once they fix pallets).
So yeah, there's no road map for "bully squads" because they actually fix it, and quickly if it's actually an issue.
It took one of the lead devs of DBD getting publicly bullied on a livestream by an instablind flashlight SWF for instablind flashlights to finally get removed after they had been in the game for way too long already.
The best part is, he queued in the public matchmaking queue for a random game, and he did so shortly after saying instablind flashlights weren't a major problem.
Within a month, instablind flashlights were dead and Hag (the killer he played that match) got a few buffs.
During the infamous Chandler Riggs stream, BHVR was very publicly embarrassed by their lackluster security measures to the point that they had a fix pushed out within a week after the stream, but the issue had been in the game for literal years by that point with no action until it made BHVR look bad.
There are at least a few other instances I'm not thinking of right now where other things only got fixed after years of being broken only because an incident publicly embarrassed BHVR to the point they had to take action.
My point is that just because BHVR doesn't think something is a problem doesn't mean it's not a problem.
It just means the problem hasn't resulted in BHVR getting publicly embarrassed yet.
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@Choaron said:
There are anti-tunnel and anti-slug measures already. Those are called DS, OTR, Unbreakable etc.
Your mistake was telling survivors to stop picking paper and to start picking rock if they know killers pick scissors all the time.
Survivors don't like being told to think about perk choices, and don't you dare ask them give up a chase or gen rush perk.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4011159#Comment_4011159
My advocacy is for addressing root problems instead of band-aid fixing things, not for DC'ing. I am stating again that I am not advocating for DC'ing, but rather for addressing causes.
Like I said, I do not know why you brought it up. It is clear that the reasons do not matter to you, so I do not know why you brought up what you thought people were DC'ing over. Even if it wasn't trivial, in your opinion, it wouldn't matter.
So BHVR should continue to add in Killers like SM? Things they know people hate and people should just take it, right? That's the right thing to do? They should release more Killers like Krasue and Ghoul in an extremely overpowered state and then never adjust them. I don't think either attitude is entirely correct.
Community is different than BHVR, thank you for clarifying.
So, all we need to do is somehow get everyone on the same page by enforcing some kind of groupthink and then start banning normal players! Make no mistake, that's exactly what you are asking for.
Let's break down exactly what will happen. You will never achieve your first objective, and I suspect you already know that.
We up the DC penalty. Let's say we make it far more punishing, the first is an hour ban. The second is a 24-hour ban. Three times? A week. So on and so forth.
What will people do? Well, they can't DC and they can't suicide. They will AFK.
Alright, well, let's ban for inactivity, same penalties as before.
Now they can't AFK, DC or suicide. People start running to the Killer.
We can ban for that too, if you get hit without making enough distance post-hit, you get banned like if you DC'd!
Now they can't DC, run to Killer, suicide or AFK! People start soft-throwing chases.
Now you have to start banning for intent.
Does this seem like a path you wish to pursue?
I think the point of covering loopholes with punishments is that eventually those players will either quit the game entirely (which means nothing of much value was lost) or they will finally get tired of being slapped around by the punishment system and play the game they started up and queued for.
I realize this is anecdotal, but I noticed match quality massively improved when self-unhook attempts were removed, and then BHVR loosened the parameters of the Go Next Prevention system and everything went downhill again because actually innocent people were reasonably annoyed at catching strays.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4011142#Comment_4011142
Thank you for restating. Sometimes things just don't quite make sense to me, I appreciate it.
I still don't see the correlation. The PTB was an attempt to address some of the core issues on the Survivor side of things. There were tweaks that needed to be made, but instead of giving feedback, people lost their minds. It is possible that the PTB could have helped things, but we will probably never know. I do not see the contradiction, maybe I am blind.
Because it has taken me multiple years to quit DBD. There really isn't anything like it, which makes quitting hard. I've come back for periods of time, like during Anniversary with my friend who just bought the game, but I don't really play much anymore. That friend comes to me every once in a while, and wants to try DBD again, and it's usually the same result. Regardless, it has taken me quite some time to leave DBD entirely and to stop bashing my head against the wall.
Yes, that is what I said. DC's have always happened, and they are worse because we simply shifted the method by which people quit, not addressing why they quit.
We have gone from talking about people who DC to people who just aren't very good. I don't see the connection.
PTB was probably cancelled because some of my fellow Killer mains literally can't cope without tunneling. So yes, I'd agree that by and large, Killers seem to get more things done.
I think what he's trying to say is that survivors constantly disconnecting does not affect any metrics that might cause BHVR to panic and reassess the situation.
A player who queues for matches and then disconnects is still an online player who facilitates matchmaking and could potentially buy DLC.
The reason why killers keep getting their way, such as with the MFT nerfs and the backtracking on tunneling and slugging changes is that killers, as an entire whole, stated they would (and in the case of the MFT era, actually did) stop playing entirely.
I'm not talking "They started up the game and started disconnecting from matches," either.
I'm talking about not even starting up the game in the first place, and in the case of the recent tunneling and slugging changes, a lot of killer players outright uninstalled and walked away from the game entirely.
This means there were a whole lot of killer players at a bare minimum threatening to kneecap BHVR's revenue stream by not buying DLC anymore, and a bunch of them may have actually followed through on that threat.
Compare that to survivors who chronically ragequit, who do not meaningfully impact BHVR's bottom line, and it's really quite trivial to figure out which group BHVR is going to listen to.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4010940#Comment_4010940
They will stop queuing. These people have quit the game, they just haven't realised it yet.
I'm of the opinion that BHVR should give those players a push out the door to help them on their way, but BHVR is stuck between not wanting to lose current customers who buy DLC and cosmetics and needing to get brand new customers that the previous group are pushing away.
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@tjt85 said:
People forget that players usually DC after a string of frustrating games. You didn't see their games before they loaded into yours to DC for "no real reason". Frustration builds over time until it eventually boils over.
It also doesn't help that BHVR dangled a potential solution to tunnelling and slugging in front of Survivors this patch, only to quickly snatch it away. All because a vocal part of the Killer community complained since they wanted to keep doing those things with impunity.
They also buffed up The Krasue for her release, a top tier tunnelling Killer that has barely any counter play alongside nerfing one of the best free anti-tunnel perks in the game. BHVR have made some questionable choices of late, but that last one could not have been more out of touch. There are also haste Clowns and Ghouls still running around on top of all the usual frustrations to add to all that.
So no, I'm not going to be too judgemental if my fellow Survivors sometimes don't feel like sticking around right now. This has not been a good patch for the Survivor side of the game.
If a survivor is having a string of frustrating games, then they need to stop playing, not keep queueing and ruining the game for others. That's just pure selfishness and entitlement.
The way this problem gets resolved is by forcing players who disconnect to take a break immediately, not entitling them to three free disconnects each day.
If they have bad internet, then an immediate 10-minute timeout forces them to wait out any connection issues and troubleshoot any problems.
If they ragequit a match, then an immediate 10-minute timeout forces them to take a moment to breathe and calm down, or maybe even makes them close the game entirely and find something else to do for the evening.
Either way, the problem of them ruining matches is resolved.
Also, there's a cascading effect to this in both directions.
Survivors feeling entitled to three disconnects every day means there are a lot more survivors having a string of bad games, which leads to more survivors cashing in on their free disconnects, which means there are a lot more survivors having a string of bad games…
On the other hand, if BHVR would implement a mandatory 10-minute minimum timeout for anyone who disconnects for any reason other than a server crash, then it would mean a lot fewer survivors ragequitting, leading to fewer survivors having a string of bad games, leading to fewer survivors ragequitting…
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005183#Comment_4005183
"Everyone played as a team" means no lone wolf survivors that are excessively hiding, and trying to get an escape as the last survivor alive. "Everyone played as a team" means none of the survivors ragequitting.
"Everyone played as a team" doesn't mean that absolutely everything in the multiverse, that involves teamwork, is good for the game.
"Everyone played as a team" doesn't mean that absolutely everything in the multiverse, that involves teamwork, is good for the game.
You're going to melt a lot of brains with that level of nuance.
(I fully agree, by the way.)
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@theMasafe said:
Any info on the anticheat update?
I won't consider the cheating issue fixed until they release a statement saying "Oops, turns out we had an exposed admin panel and associated API letting cheaters do all kinds of crazy stuff. We shut all of that down, let us know if you see anything weird in the future."
There's absolutely no way cheaters are capable of doing even a tiny fraction of what they are without an exposed API endpoint with leaked credentials at the very least.
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@dgbug said:
Can you tell us what the slugging, tunneling, and camping updates are? It feels like Killers are beginning to be punished for playing the game.
Beginning?
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@ratcoffee said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996250#Comment_3996250
Just adding onto your point about hook timers, it's only 20 seconds because even in the worst case, the survivor only spends 2 of their 3 hook states waiting to be unhooked as the third one causes them to be sacrificed instantly.
It's 10 additional seconds of gen time per survivor on a gen.
Since the biggest issue usually occurs with the first chase and hook, it works out to:
3 survivors on gens x 10 seconds of additional time-on-gen per survivor = 30 seconds total additional progress
This does compound over the course of the match, of course, since there are two exploitable hook stages per survivor and multiple survivors to get hooked.
This leads to the common use of tunneling to make it a 3v1 ASAP, as well as highlights the problem with "eye for an eye" types of balance patches. Specifically, it means that one side lost an eye ages ago leading to an eye being taken from both sides now.
Apparently people don't understand what "balance" means and complain about a "one-sided" change without realizing that the change is one-sided at this particular point in time precisely because it was already out-of-balance in the other direction already.
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@hermitkermit said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996063#Comment_3996063
I think I understand your position, and if I do then I disagree. I don’t believe tunneling and slugging were only byproducts of gen speed/pressure. Tunneling was still very common even during CoB meta when killers had no real need to worry about gens. Hook timers being increased was only a recent change, and gen times were made longer way before the hook timers for longer, but tunneling still persisted. In the first iteration of 2v8, when chests weren’t there for items, no unbreakable, no sabo: no reason at all to slug, literally a stomp on the ground and survivors would get instantly hooked: killers still slugged. Slugged in mass even, with all 8 on the ground. Slugging happened often enough that the devs had to add counters to slugging in the second version of 2v8. Just because it doesn’t need to happen doesn’t mean it won’t. I want to believe you, but the history of the game actively proves against this idea that if things are made easier in other aspects that people won’t tunnel or slug anymore. It’s been proven not to be the case. It’s also why no collision on recently unhooked survivors is a great idea. Because even if they do not need to bodyblock, some still will and that’s problematic. It’s not always forced actions, many times it’s players choices and that goes for both roles.
I also don’t really understand when you seem to imply that killers are forced into tunneling, yet also say survivors are entitled if they don’t run anti-tunnel perks. If survivors are expected to adapt with perks, why aren’t killers expected to adapt to these changes? My issue with this stance of these issues “forcing” people to play one way is that it seems like the idea is: forcing survivors to bring anti-tunnel or anti-slug perks is fine. But forcing killers not to tunnel is unreasonable.
I just don’t see why one is alright, but not the other. Perhaps you could clarify your opinion on this, and if I am not understanding your position then feel free to correct me so that I can be on the same page.
I actually kind of agree with your point, but perhaps in a bit of a weird way:
Tunneling and slugging was the "nuclear option" that killers pulled out in response to sweaty SWF stacks, but once released on the DBD playerbase, it became a genie that couldn't be put back into its bottle once people realized how effective it was.
In true "gamers will optimize the fun out of everything they can"-fashion, things have just escalated constantly back and forth between survivors and killers, and that has caused us to reach the point we are at.
One other note about the hook stage vs gen time changes, if I'm remembering my patch history correctly, the hook stages were changed at the exact same time the gen repair extension happened, or within a week or two after at the worst.
In other words, killers got a "buff" and then it was immediately taken away in the name of "an eye for an eye" rather than looking at whether it was actually balanced or not in the first place.
As it turns out, 10 seconds extra of hook time on the first hook of the game translates into around 30 seconds of gen time, which completely negates (and then some!) any benefit the killer received from extending the generator repair time.
On a more general note, BHVR's constant "balancing via pick rate spreadsheet" has resulted in making the tactics and strategy metagame escalation happen exponentially more rapidly instead of mitigating or even possibly reversing it when it was still a lower-stakes issue, precisely because killers were picking perks that filled gaps in the game systems, while survivors had the ability to pick basically whatever perks they wanted for whatever role they wanted to fill in that particular match.
This meant that the killer perks that were the most useful at filling gaps got nerfed into the ground, leaving only in-game strategy and tactics left to fill the gap, leading to further proliferation of tunneling, slugging, and camping as a means to achieve victory.
Now killers are getting some basekit stuff (but only if they have the mobility to be able to use it, thus the complaints about only Nurse, Blight, Kaneki, etc. being viable), but then they are also getting their entire set of perks currently used to fill gaps in the game systems completely gutted or reworked to not be useful anymore.
As for the "refusal to adapt" thing, the entire situation is coming about because of the survivors' refusal to adapt to the ages-old strategy of tunneling and/or slugging with perks that already exist, which could have changed the meta into a more healthy spot if they only chose to use those perks, while killers have been compelled to adapt to the very real changes that BHVR has implemented to spoon-feed survivors.
Basically what I'm saying is that Killers have been using scissors because BHVR banned them from using paper, while survivors have been continuously using paper while refusing to use rock despite rock's existence being pointed out to them repeatedly, because they don't find rock "fun" for some arbitrary reason.
The entire time BHVR has been buffing paper and nerfing scissors because that's what the spreadsheet said had a high pick rate with extreme effectiveness in favor of scissors, which ironically resulted in killers leaning into scissors even harder because it was still the only thing they had left despite BHVR's best efforts.
If the survivors had just swallowed their pride and used rock for a while, then killers might have found a way to "counter" them by using rock as well, but at least that would have resulted in an evenly balanced game state as opposed to the tunnel-slug-camp fest the game became.
Additionally, if the survivors had picked rock, prompting killers to pick rock, perhaps over time BHVR would have made balance change decisions other than "nerf scissors, buff paper" for the last few years.
This patch will simply be the straw that broke the camel's back, and I genuinely hope that the killer player pool evaporates within a week of the patch going live on the main client and everyone realizing how awful it feels to play killer.
This last part is complete tinfoil hattery combined with "There's no way they're that lost in the spreadsheet sauce… right?" but I'm afraid to believe that someone at BHVR went "Survivor is picked 80% of the time in games and therefore needs to have gameplay catered to them because they make up 80% of all profits for BHVR," and that resulted in the changes we are seeing.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3994590#Comment_3994590
It's been 3 years of these same people having literally zero empathy for anyone except themselves in this game.
Similar massive changes over the years have been met with "git gud", "you're refusing to adapt", "just quit if you don't like it", or "you're just entitled".
Mostly from the same group of people currently melting down over this patch that now will affect then and their gameplay instead.
You were correct up until that last sentence.
Killer mains have been begging and screaming at BHVR to stop balancing via spreadsheet (i.e. "Perk X is picked too often, better nerf it!") and to start looking at why players bring/don't bring certain perks and what gameplay systems can be tweaked to encourage different playstyles.
As an example, instead of nerfing gen regression perks for the thousandth time, they could instead negate the need for them in the first place by reducing the time per hook stage and increasing how long it takes to do gens, and maybe look at certain gen speed perks and toolboxes if really necessary.
By taking the pressure off of killers to keep up gen pressure, it gives killers a lot more breathing room to bring other perks instead.
Unfortunately, at this point in the game's balance cycle, the game systems on an inherent level mandate picking the four best gen regression perks while tunneling and/or slugging and/or camping.
BHVR has stuck their collective head in the sand and adamantly refused to look at what game systems impose this style of play on everyone, and instead insist on telling killer mains to look at the river and think of the bunny rabbits for years' worth of patches in a row.
Meanwhile, survivors have had an incurable sense of sheer arrogance and entitlement that they shouldn't have to bring a single anti-tunnel perk to deal with tunneling or a single anti-slug perk to deal with slugging out of the literal dozen or so perks available in each category, and instead they should be given half a dozen different keywords as part of a base-kit mechanic in addition to having core game systems warped to fit their precious handbook.
As it turns out, the real Skull Merchant rework was to give all of her buffs to the survivors instead.
Anyone who downvotes this simply can't handle the truth of the matter.
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3993206#Comment_3993206
I disagree. I think that BHVR are largely going to push these updates through despite the almost universal backlash, and survivor queues are going to hit 10 minutes by Halloween. Especially since the killer looks kinda garbage.
I really hope this happens. Watching the community-wide fallout and sheer blind panic from BHVR would be absolutely hilarious.
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Alternate universe Patch 9.2 PTB notes:
Survivors are now blocked from repairing the current generator once they have accumulated 25% progress on generators.
They must accumulate 25% repair progress on different generators before that generator becomes unblocked.
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I just want to note the upvote/downvote ratio in here.
Every survivor-sided comment is getting 4 upvotes for every 1 downvote.
Every killer-sided comment is getting 1 upvote for every 4 downvotes.
It really doesn't take a genius to figure out what's happening here, and why BHVR, well-known for balancing via spreadsheet, is making these changes.
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By the way, I completely misread your post and retract my earlier sentiment about you being right.
I thought you were using the Magic the Gathering definition of Timmy and Jimmy (or in MTG's terminology, Johnny), which would fit better with Timmy on Survivor and Jimmy on Killer.
I feel like you have it backwards, it's the survivors who make up 80% of the playerbase and are the group who BHVR panders to, because BHVR doesn't want 80% of the game's players angry at them and leaving.
Unfortunately, this comes at the expense of the remaining 20% of players on Killer, and the cracks are starting to show in the facade that BHVR cares about both sides equally with the strange refusal to killswitch Streetwise and other bugged perks, constant nerfs to perks killers relied on to fill balance gaps (Franklin's being the most recent example), buffs to survivors, survivor item changes, poorly conceived ideas for basekit changes, etc.
Since Kaneki's release, I rarely saw any bonuses for queueing as a killer, but for the first time last night I saw a 50% bonus for killer at rather prime gaming hours.
Between Kaneki and Springtrap hype wearing off and killers being in an incredibly unhealthy spot right now, the killer players are starting to leave or switch to survivor, and I for one can't wait to watch the fireworks show that will ensue.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3976547#Comment_3976547
The last stats I saw on the matter (which are pretty old) a bit over 50% of games were full solo-queue. Duos unsurprisingly were next with well over 25%. Actual full 4 man swfs were something around 5%. All that said the person you were responding to is a fool. You don't need a swf for that perk to work. Even a single random teammate hovering is enough to get use.
@topic It's 100% getting a nerf after they sell enough walking dead dlcs.
That's literally false, though.
According to the real stats (not the collective hallucination you are engaging with) 70% of games had at bare minimum a duo, with only 30% being completely made of 4 solo queue players.
Screenshot from an old dev stream if you don't believe me:
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@NekoGamerX said:
well with the change to FD sabotage along with other item got stronger but with that slugging going to be done more often,wasn't dev trying have less slugging?
Your first mistake was to assume the balance team is capable of anything resembling higher-order thinking when it comes to the effects their changes will cause.
Killers have been asking for nerfs to gen repair speed, but instead all we get are a consistent series of nerfs to every gen regression perk simply because the pick rate for those perks is too high.
Killers have been asking for nerfs to off-hook effects in order to incentivize hooking more often, but instead all we get are buffs to second chance perks and sabotage speeds.
Killers have been asking for buffs to chase perks and M1 killer lethality, but instead all we get are high-mobility killers that everyone hates from the PTB onwards.
The list goes on, but you get the idea.
Killer build variety is in the gutter, and it's because the balance team keeps doing the literal exact opposite of what they should do at every chance they get.
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I'd be shocked if this kind of dark pattern isn't illegal somewhere.
The best way to fix this bug is probably to have someone get their local DA's office to give BHVR's legal team a friendly call about non-compliance with consumer laws around deceptive practices.
I've found posts on this forum dating back to 2022, and on other websites dating back even further, so at this point BHVR has to be letting this happen intentionally.
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The best time to fire your perk design and balance teams was nine years ago.
The second best time is today.
All of this patch is awful, and you should expect to need to rework these awful decisions three years from now after you finally remove your head from the sand.
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@SvarturSteinn said:
I'm honestly astonished that they would allow this to go unchecked since 2018;
Then again we're fully aware that BHVR has a severe allergic reaction to anything that even has the smallest chance of buffing Pig.
Determine layout > Populate Generators > Populate Killer Interactable > Populate chests > Determine Spawn Points.
What's really hilarious is that it might nerf Pig.
Someone mentioned bringing loads of chest generating stuff on Singularity in order to send the EMP crates to Narnia, and Pig could do the same thing with her trap removal boxes.
If the spawn logic gets changed so the boxes get generated before chests, they could be placed at good or neutral locations for survivors, instead of the survivors needing to go to the four corners of the map to disarm their traps.
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@Nebula said:
As a console player I'm not really following. Do PC players also not have to shift their directional input when moving their camera as well? Does holding W always move you in a straight line even when turning your camera?
Either way, I don't think this a problem and would just end up messing with thousands of players who have already gotten used to this. Plus, I've seen multiple people say that hugging loops is actually easier if not the same as playing PC. Hugging loops on controller feels extremely natural to me, but that could just be that I've been playing for so long now.
Totally not against giving more controller options though, this game is severely lacking in accessibility options for console, especially considering that the majority of their playerbase plays on console. They don't seem to value the console experience as much as the PC experience and this has been clear for years and years now.
WASD is camera-relative, not charcter-relative.
If you want to look behind you during chase on PC, you need to rapidly swing your camera behind you and switch from holding W to holding S while your camera is pointed backwards.
That said, OP specifically said they were on console, so none of that applies.
I have no clue what they are talking about, it's arguably easier to look backwards while maintaining the same direction on console than it is on PC.
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There have been several games recently where I was accused of "tunneling" or "camping" even though the entire reason I got the 4k was the survivors' hilariously bad misplays.
I'm talking about stuff like "unhooking the survivor before I've even had the chance to walk out of anti-facecamp range" or "running towards the hook one at a time in full view along an obvious path against Bubba while I'm trying to walk away and patrol gens", stuff like that.
What made that second example really hilarious was that I hadn't hooked that Leon once the entire game, because he ran me all over The Game for a good 2 minutes, only 1 generator got done in that time, and then he died at the same time the other survivors did after they all hit 2nd hook stage when everyone failed their self-unhook attempts.
Obviously, that's not even counting all of the times I've been rolled over by survivors for the crime of doing Daily Rituals on killers I'm not familiar with, and then getting teabagged until I chase/hit all four of them out of both of the open gates.
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One sacrifice after four hooks is pretty definitively not tunneling, but I would even say getting sacrificed in the first three hooks of the match doesn't mean you were tunneled.
Sometimes the killer just can't find anyone else and you were the weakest link.
Tough luck, go next, and learn from your mistakes so eventually you aren't the one getting tunneled for being the weakest link.
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@OmegaXII said:
All survivors share a total 12 hook counts, and they won't die at all until the 9th hooks. This'll completely remove all the tunneling & camping in the game.
But at the same time, Gen Speed needs to be drastically reduces for this change, otherwise Killer will have no chance of winning at all.
What do you think?
This would just encourage tunneling the weakest survivor 9 times while kicking gens in between to use the readily available Pop proc, not to mention Surge suddenly seeing its usage fly even higher than it already is.
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@Starrseed said:
either give me a big red button in the basement i can push that sucks them out like a toilet flush or give killers emotes and let me flip them of while they tbag like there life depends on it
I like the idea of creating a generic perk that immediately sacrifices survivors who crouch and uncrouch 5/4/3 times within 5 seconds while inside an open gate.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3691300#Comment_3691300
DS doesn’t actually function well as an anti-tunnel. Unless a very large percentage of the players are using DS, then mathematically, the killer is better off immediately picking up survivors, and risking the DS.
This is true because if a killer hesitates to pick up a survivor because they might have DS, but it turns out that survivor didn’t have DS, then the killer has just wasted time.
Therefore, killers should look at “should I immediately pick up a survivor” as a probability over a large number of games. And if the majority of the pickups don’t result in a DS, then the killer is better off just picking survivors up whenever they want.
The only way DS could actually function as anti-tunnel, is if the killer knew when a survivor had an active DS. This would signal to the killer there is a 100% chance they could eat a DS, and therefore should hesitate to pick up that survivor.
To mildly paraphrase Dr. Strangelove: "A weapon is only useful as a threat if the other side knows you have it!"
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Pain Res encourages hooking every survivor once. It's a killer encouraging themselves to not tunnel, which is what survivors have been asking for for ages. This is good design, and it should stay powerful to encourage killers to not tunnel.
Pop only regresses a generator by 30% of its current progression.
That means if a generator is progressed by 30 seconds out of 90, and a killer uses Pop on it, the generator regresses by 30% of the 28.5 seconds of progression left after the basekit 5% is taken off (8.55 seconds lost to Pop) not 30% of the 90 seconds required to complete the generator (27 seconds lost to OP's non-existent hypothetical version of Pop).
Also, Pop only hits one generator per hook, and there's a time limit, and the killer has to actively find a generator to smack.
Surge can make multiple generators explode automatically per down, which is arguably more powerful depending on how many generators go boom and how many survivors get saved per hook stage obtained. Basically, Surge is a better counter to SWF 4x flashlight squads than Pop is.
In other words, Pop is a lot less powerful than OP thinks it is and needs to be actively used compared to the other "meta" gen regression perk, which means it's perfectly fine.
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@Ohyakno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3690934#Comment_3690934
New players are not new players forever, and they do not need every perk to be effective.
Do you consider "not being new anymore" to happen at 2219 hours or 665 hours?
@BOFH said:
Getting ~100k or more blood points per game like we are getting during the Blood Moon event is where blood point rewards per game should be at this point in the game's lifecycle, in order to reduce the barrier to entry that is currently in place.
There are, as of this post, 76 characters in the game (35 killers + 41 survivors) who all need 3 prestiges each (228 total prestiges) at ~1.1 million blood points per prestige, for a total of ~266,190,000 blood points required to unlock all perks on all characters.
Under the normal system we have, at about 30k BP per game, that would require 8,873 games.
Assuming each game is 15 minutes, that means a player buying the game and wanting to unlock all perks on the 76 characters would require 2,219 hours of actual match time to unlock everything available right now. This does not even take into account the number of new perks on characters that will be unlocked during the course of unlocking the perks on the current character roster.
On the other hand, if the blood points awarded per game was increased to 100k, it would take 2662 games to collect the blood points needed to unlock all the perks. Assuming each game is 15 minutes, this would require a little over 665 hours to unlock all of the perks, a major decrease in the barrier to entry for this game.
On a more player psychology related note, giving players more blood points and giving us 3 to 5 levels per game makes players feel happier as opposed to getting 1 level per game, if we are lucky.
There is literally zero reason for the current BP per match to require over a year of playing 40 hours per week of in-match time to get P3 to unlock all the perks on all the characters.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
Don't you have 2 sticks? One for moving and one for the camera?
Of all the "X is impossible on console" this is a new one. And if I remember correctly, players with a gamepad can look behind them in chase very well.
OP is playing on an Atari joystick or similar, I guess?
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If your concern is "one nerf/buff on each side" then you already got your killer perk nerf to "match" the Adrenaline nerf.
Ultimate Weapon is going to be gutted in multiple ways.
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Not to mention Ultimate Weapon was countered by Calm Spirit, now it's just "yet another reason to run Distortion".
At least make it a Killer Instinct or Loud Noise notification, instead of being dumb and throwing in the aura bucket.
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@fulltonon said:
Honestly, it feels more like "I'm getting stupidly few bps during non-event" than "wow I'm getting so much bps during event" at this point, I believe they should make like at least +100% baseline and nerf events accordingly.
The problem is that it took getting the current Blood Moon event to +300% to make it feel "reasonable", and for there to be multiple BP bonus items in the match offerings (Broken Shell, BPS, etc) for it to feel "good".
Keep in mind, 30k BP is the average match gain from what I've noticed normally, so bumping that up to 100k BP per match is already over a 3x multiplier. I'd say make it 4x what it is normally (so 120k per match to allow wiggle room for bad games), and then make events a +100% bonus at most (think anniversary/future blood moons/etc), with +50% for random weekends.
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I would like to add a couple more points:
- New players might be more inclined to buy DLC if they feel like they can "complete" a character in a reasonable amount of time.
- My suggestion prevents needing to play DBD for 40 hours a week for an entire year. A full-time job is about 2080 hours (52 weeks x 40 hours per week).
Under the current system, needing to play 2219 hours of in-match time means a new player has to wait over year to unlock all P3 perks on all characters, and that's despite them treating DBD like an entire second full-time job.
If a new player plays for a very generous 15 hours of in-match time per week, every week, until they have unlocked all perks at P3, then it will take 2 years and 44 weeks to unlock the P3 perks on the current roster, and that's not even taking into account the new characters that will be released in that time.
Needless to say, this is completely unreasonable.
Telling new players "One must imagine Sisyphus happy," is not the correct policy.
Even under my idea of 100k blood points per match before bonuses, it would still require a little over 44 weeks to unlock P3 perks on every character. That's still too long in my opinion, but at least it would be a massive improvement from where we are now.