Archol123
Archol123
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572473#Comment_3572473
Unpopular opinion: People can think for themselves and while content creators do have an impact, they don't create the meta. The recent Otzdarva video where he talks about "problematic" perks is a pretty good example for that. Many of us disagree with most of what said in this video and Otz is pretty much as influential as it gets when it comes to DBD because he has the biggest platform.
Pre 6.1.0 DH was not used so much because content creators constantly told everyone to use it but because it was ridiculously overpowered. It had literally no counterplay when used for distance. By now there are also some content creators, that suggest survivors run anti tunnel perks again because they aren't quite so bad as some would like you to think. Yet, no DSs or OTRs in most games. Almost as if people would run whatever the hell they want.
The complaints about MFT started the moment we saw the what it did. By that time there weren't even any videos about it yet. But people already knew how strong it was. Demi is another popular content creator, who plays with a lot of different niche builds, that are pretty powerful, when everything works perfectly and pretty bad when they fail. You will often find him claim that these builds are "broken" or "overpowered" but everyone understands that they are very situational and overall more fun than powerful.
It's pretty much impossible to tell, if players have really improved over the last 2 years. Personally, I think it's about the same as it has been before. Survivors make less stupid mistakes, not because they play overall better but because the game gives them way more information to tell when something might be the wrong choice. The game has changed quite a bit in that time and any comparison would require us to define 2 entirely different norms to even get an idea of how good players actually were at the time, which already affects the integrity of any results we could get. Basically, it is impossible to tell because this is not the exact same game it was 2 years ago, which means a 1 to 1 comparison would not work and any attempt to fix that would further falsify the results.
If you compare dbd to other online games you can easily see that people always get better at the the more time passes, look at Dota or Starcraft for example if you look at how bad even the top teams for example at TI played 5-6 years ago compared to now then you can easily imagine that across all players the same thing happened, and that is exactly my point here, people just were not that good to realise it (same with item choices in Dota for example)... Also I don't see how it is not the same game anymore? Because there were patches? Because new content got added? That would be the same for every game...
It is fairly easy to tell if people have improved... There more than enough gameplay videos from two years ago you can look and compare them to how the same people play these days, or look at old tournament videos... You can easily see whether or not the overall level has increased.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572438#Comment_3572438
Then by that logic, WoO should have been the most used perk for years. Because it allowed (and still does) players to bridge quite a lot of the skill gap between good and bad players. But that wasn't the case. It would also mean, that as time goes on and players supposedly get better overall, WoO becomes more and more obsolete and its pick rate would drop. But that's not the case either.
Most people 2 years ago knew just as well how to play the game as they do know. Maybe even better because back then there weren't as many demands for base kit perks (people understood that not running a perk would mean they couldn't capitalise on it), but that is material for a different discussion.
Exactly not, because they didn't realise it was good... That's the point... You are still missing the point... It is not a good perk because it shows you what you already can see, where certain map tiles are, it is a good perk because it shows you what pallets are still available, which you just cannot know from a distance.
I disagree on the second part as well, people were way worse 2 years ago xD
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572389#Comment_3572389
And you want me to believe that this happened out of the blue? 5 years into this game's life cycle and 3 years into the perk's? Seems unlikely. Or like a convenient guess.
No matter how much work they put into it, the hierarchy will stay. The only thing they can do is bringing solo queue and SWF a bit closer together. But then they'd also have to deal with a new issue. The fact that SWFs have such a big advantage, that balancing killers around that, is a catastrophy waiting to happen.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572390#Comment_3572390
You can. You still see that giant bubble in the distance. If that is not an indication, that something is going on over there, we are not talking about an issue with Blindness anymore but about an issue with the player, that can't identify very obvious clues.
The fact that you don't see the survivor themself makes little difference. How hard is it to remember the hooked survivor's location for a while?
In the end it is still mostly player skill, you can communicate as much as you want, if the individual players cannot last a bit in chase it is worthless...
You should just look back to the history of this game to see how bad people played like 2-3 years ago and how even worse they played even with literal infinites and what not... I totally think it could be just that.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572361#Comment_3572361
However did people play without WoO, I wonder. Solo queue is not a new thing and neither are the issues that come with it. The old Windows of Opportunity did that too. You do not need permanent aura vision on your surroundings to know, which pallets have been dropped / destroyed. Even with a cooldown you can still look around and see where to go. But it wasn't used back then. Almost as if this was just a strawman to defend a crutch perk.
The game has never been balanced around SWFs. It will always be the hierarchy of SWF, then killer, then solo queue. And solo queue can perform perfectly fine still. Just as a full blown SWF on coms can easily lose to a Trapper with no perks, if they screw up big enough. Almost every single perk in the game either works better in a SWF (even WoO because SWFs use longer chase times more effectively and can communicate set ups) or is a bigger disadvantage for solo players. The same goes for every killer. Are we going to remove all perks, addons and offerings as well as all killers, so that solo queue and SWF can be equally strong?
The point is, you'd need to break / change the metric to achieve that. But this is not an option as it would also completely break the game's balance or mean we'd arbitrarily enforce a certain result.
Or did people just find out that knowing exactly how far away a certain tile is can be quite usefull? Also I think a few content creators changed their mind about WoO not being useless and therefore they might have impacted the pickrate as well.
But the devs are working on closing the gap between solo and swf so we will see if it stays the way.
Windows basically does nothing for swf, they can call out everything over voice, same for perks like bond or kindred, so I don't agree on that part at all.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572302#Comment_3572302
It doesn't for hooked survivors. I'll let you in on a little secret. When there is a huge bubble on your screen and someone is hooked at the same time, then you can deduce that this is the hooked survivor's location. Blindness will not remove this bubble. You still know exactly where to go. Well, as long as you can be bothered to pay the least bit of attention and don't actually fall asleep. Oh and you'll need to remember that for the next few seconds while you play a thrilling game of "holding M1 and pressing Space every once in a while".
For slugging, you can make the argument that Blindness helps. That's true. But you know what's also true? You can keep track of the killer and you can see when someone goes down. So you still have a pretty good idea where the slugged survivor is. The only killers that can really capitalise on this are the same killers that dominate anyway. Because they need to traverse the map and down survivors quicker than they can get up. Again, this is a problem with the very strongest killers. A Myers will not suddenly teleport across the map, Blight rush to get near you and activate tier 3 in the process just so he can slug you.
I can't remember the last time I actually saw someone (other than myself) using Bond. Even Kindred isn't all that popular. WoO has slowly gained popularity since its buff all the way back in patch 5.3.0. One of the reasons it wasn't quite as popular is, that survivors only had 4 perk slots, one of which was used for BT, one for DH, one for DS and one for something else. Then, we headed into a healing meta, where looping didn't matter all that much either. Now we have a chase perk meta and WoO needly fits in there.
Third Seal has, as I said before, been in the game for way longer than most of us have played. It was never a good perk though. Because Blindness is not a big deal when survivors don't rely on aura vision, which they don't for the most part. You really see the difference when a player has WoO and when they don't due to Blindness. WoO does not serve its supposed purpose anymore. People that rely on it do not learn maps because there is simply no need to. But when this fails, they crumble. So Blindness is in a weird spot, where it is way too strong because it gives survivors a huge handicap in deactivating a crutch perk, that some can't play without, but it's also pretty weak because survivors can just as well play without it. A noob stomper if you will. Though, even some very experienced use it.
But windows also serves as a solo queue perk becaue even players that know the map already don't know which tiles have been used already by a teammate so it help them keep track of where they can bring the killer... Which brings us back to my initial claim that blindness hurts solos more than swf, because if you have coms you don't need to see the aura your teammates can tell you which pallet they already used...
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572203#Comment_3572203
Lethal Pursuer is a fix to a problem as old as the game itself. Spawns. Tell me, how do you know which direction to go to when you spawn in the middle of the map? Or when you find yourself on Haddonfield, where spawns are about as random as it gets? The game does not give the killer any extra time to find their first survivor, when it clearly messed up. When a killer loses the first gen before they can get into a chase just because they got unlucky, that is not something, that they can learn to circumvent. But it does leave them with a severe disadvantage, that the game does neither consider, nor compensate for. That's why Lethal Pursuer fixes a problem, that no amount of skill and knowledge could ever fix.
Blindness was never an issue before. And it definitely wasn't for a lack of ways to apply this status effect. Third Seal for example has been in this game for longer than most of us have played. Yet, it sucks. Because Blindness has only one single use. To deactivate WoO. What other aura perks do survivors commonly use? That's right, none.
Are we really going to nerf a perk, that is fine because the very strongest killers in the game are too good with it? Again? This has happened and if I recall correctly most of us agreed, that nerfing Awakened Awareness because Nurse was / is too strong was not a smart move. I guess it's also time to nerf Lethal Pursuer, BBQ, Pop, Pentimento, Nowhere To Hide, Discordance, Floods Of Rage, Pain Res etc. then?! Because all of these perks are much better when you use them on a killer that is already strong. Nevermind, that even STBFL, a perk that is widely considered a helping hand for weaker killers, is stronger on Spirit than it is on Trapper. The stronger the killer, the more use they can get out of each perk. It's called scaling.
Blindless also removes the ability to see hooked or slugged survivors my man, which is why knock out and third seal are so annyoing to go against.
You do see bond or kindred from time to time, Windows of Opportunity came in the meta not that long ago...
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@KayTwoAyy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571092#Comment_3571092
...i guess? lol
I think I'd go a step further to call it a leadership/design direction issue. Cause last I heard, MMR works exactly the way it was designed to
I would not say that, the problem is just that the system cannot find appropriate people, if there were enough players it would work just fine but since the majority of the community wanted queue times between 3 and max 7 minutes this is what we got now...
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Well I don't think there needs to be such a mechanic at all, if we look at other games giving up when you know you lost is fairly common and it is somewhat fair, why should the winning player be punished by a random percentage chance just getting unlucky and being unable to do anything about it is pretty annoying... As for examples for games that have that: Starcraft 2 basically always ends with one player calling it gg and leaving, most RTS actually end this way, same goes team games where it is two stacks against each other and I don't see much of an issue with a button that starts a vote to just give up. Would prevent games like 1 h holding the game hostage skull merchant even more effective than what we have now. Also I don't consider hatch a win either anyway so even if you get it it is basically worthless you did not do anything to earn it, it doesn't count as a win for the mmr syste, so all you get is bloodpoints so yeah thats that.
They should just remove both things figure out something else instead that at least allows some skill interaction or just nothing and get a give up button.
Besides that as for the idea itself: You can always just go afk and wait for the killer to hook you or not, just tab out and do something else if you don't want to play the match against some 3 gen garbage or whatever, I don't think people would necessarily dc, because of the dc penalty just going afk might still be quicker than waiting that out.
I find iti s too much of an effort to make a bad mechanic less bad, just get rid of the whole thing, make luck offerings give you better items in chests or more skill checks on gens or whatever...
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571922#Comment_3571922
I dont understand why the blindnes is a problem for you when you also claim that is the weakest status effect in the game?
When i say genrusing in this matter i mean you have a full build ment to fix gens fast, i still dont see it as offensive.
Virgil can help you getting out of blindness faster.
But really everything in this game hurts SoloQ worse than swf, so i think thats a strange argument.
Being hooked as you only have 2 hooks where swf can "switch" and get up to 6 hooks and still live.
Also SWFs are more likely to help their freinds than you should they have to choose. I have also been used as killer bait by SWFs, where they unhook me in the last second when the killer are in front of me, while they rush the gen, and then the killer ofc. goes for the quick kill.
Also the perk Residual Manifest do give the same blind effect to the killer for 30 secs, it works with both Flashlight and Blast Mine
It is still the worst status effect, just compare to hindered, oblivious, incappacitated and so on... The reason it is still problem is that it can be easily and repeatedly applied to the entire team, therefore making all aura perks somewhat useless. What makes it also problematic is that you might accidentally run the killer into your teammate despite running bond for that not to happen, which once again does not happen if you are on coms.
The other status effects are stronger but not as easily applied, so despite blindless being the weakest one it can still hit pretty hard on certain perks, and such a thing somehow kills perk variety on both sides, because when every killer runs ultimate weapon survivors probably won't run aura perks as much because they don't get too much out of it and once again those perks help in soloq.
I don't think everything hurts them more, but there are for sure certain perks or powers that do more in particular.
I mean I will still do a 1 for 1 even in solo queue if it is necessary to keep 4 people in the game, and so should you, just because some people do stuff like that does not mean it is the optimal play to do, just shows you matchmaking is terrible and many people have know clue how to play the game.
Yes, I mentioned the perk already when it was about which perks give the blindness effect...
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571880#Comment_3571880
You mentioned that it was hard as SoloQ, so I tried to help you out by saying :
if you are having trouble with surviving as SoloQ, use perks for SoloQ and leave the gen rush to the SWFs.
I often run with Distortion and Calm Spirit when im SoloQ, and it does wonders for my survival, in some games the killer dont see me at all, i also use them in my SWF but not as frequent.
And you Replied :
That's a weird argument... Especially since the perks you mentioned don't counter the aura reading effect...
And because your claim was incorrect i said :
That is exactly what Distortion do :
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Distortion
And Calm Sprit counter the scream effect :
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Calm_Spirit
And since you said :
Blindness is probably on of the if not the weakest status effect in the game
Then using the perks I recommended should effectively resolve your issue with the "Ultimate Weapon" perk.
And im not sure why you take offence to the word genrushing ? we use it intern in our SWF, i have specific genrush builds.
BHVR also recently added so that you can see who of the survivors are doing what, even if they are being chased, AND a visual on the terror radius (heartbeat) that should be a really good substitute for constant aura reading. So i dont get why you are complaining, other than you want more.
My claim was correct, you just misunderstand... I didn't mean survivor perks that protect you from being auraread, but perks that enable your aura reading perks again... If you suffer from the blindness status effect your own aura reading perks don't work, and there is no perk that removes this effect, only one that makes it tick down faster...
The blindness status effect hurts solos more than swf because those guys are the ones that run aura perks like kindred and bond for example.
Those perks do nothing about the blindness, the entire time that was my only point... Blindness hurts the solos more than the swf.
Because usually when people are talking about genrushing all they mean is survivors doing gens, and that's just plain stupid.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571852#Comment_3571852
That is exactly what Distortion do :
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Distortion
And Calm Sprit counter the scream effect :
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Calm_Spirit
let's stick to the facts and avoid spinning tales that aren't accurate, alright?
So because they do counter the main effect of the perks you think are too strong, it would be the perfect solution to run with them, the only effect they do not counter is the blindness that in your own words are one of the weakest effects in the game.
What would you call it instead of genrushing ?
Should we not call looping for looping because its one of the main things in the game too ?
I said nothing against the tracking aspect of the perk so once again you are completely off here, you said you use UW mainly for the blindless effect and I explained why I think the effect is not a good thing because it hurts solos more than swf. I would not consider calm spirit or distortion solo q perks since they don't help to close the communication gap. I have no clue what you are talking about man. On a side not I don't even think distortion is a healthy perk since it can induce tunneling or incentivise killers to run slowdown instead of tracking because this perk severely limits how useful aura reading is... So with more people in a match running it the killer will find the same survivor every time and if he doesn't want to walk around for someone else make those guys getting tunneled...
Genrushing would be stocking to gens no matter how bad it is for the team... Not what many in the community think where it is just being efficient on gens.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571848#Comment_3571848
well you already know where they are. they're on gens. i am saying depending on how you approach gens can allow you to cut people off.
Then you might as well just patrol them normally if they are there ^^ Because the time it takes you from the bubble up until actually being there gives them enough time to hide so where... Which is why i don't think this perk is really problematic.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571840#Comment_3571840
Survivors have 16 perks, the killer have 4, ofc the killers need stronger perks than survivors. its not a 4 vs 4 game but 1 vs 4.
And if you are having trouble with surviving as SoloQ, use perks for SoloQ and leave the gen rush to the SWFs.
I often run with Distortion and Calm Spirit when im SoloQ, and it does wonders for my survival, in some games the killer dont see me at all, i also use them in my SWF but not as frequent.
That's a weird argument... Especially since the perks you mentioned don't counter the aura reading effect... The point I made was it hurts soloq harder than it hurts swf and your argument against that is I should play stealthy?
Those perks I mentioned are perks for soloq, and they get countered by the blindness effect, so what exactly is a soloq perk in your mind?
On a side note I cannot take people seriously that say genrushing, when it is the main objective the survivors have, if you don't put them under enough pressure as killer then gens flying is entirely on you.
It is not about survival but using perks that close the information gap solos have compared to swf, and with aura reading removed there are none that do that. It is also not about survival directly but more about finding your teammates, you can still be good enough in chase to outrun the killer, does not make it less bad of an idea to create a perk side effect that hurts solos way more than swf.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571813#Comment_3571813
it depends map. for example Yamoka maps. the sanctum of wraith has like 2 boxes and like one gen spawns on the top of the staircase. the other gens spawn in the corners of the map. you cannot pre-run if you strategically cut people people off. it is like difference between opening a locker and going from left to right vs opening locker in the center and pathing down.
I went to wiki to get map shape. this is what what I mean. Like i said, it depends from map to map.
That would somewhat require you to know where people are already to approach them in that way, but then again yamaoka has shack and jungle gyms in all corners where you could effectively cut them off, so they don't need to run to a strong part of the map, they are already there...
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@Pulsar said:
I just think it outclasses every other info perk in the game, like OG Spies. It is extremely strong tracking.
I would not say that, I can agree that it is a great tracking perk however it's info is not that useful in chase, whereas floods of rage or other aura perks can do wonders there...
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571788#Comment_3571788
If that is so, why are you so determined to have it removed then?
Because I think it's main effect is good enough and it does not need this side effect. Survivors don't have aura reading in their base kit so all it does is counter aura reading perks, which are mostly soloq perks: kindred, bond, empathy, windows of Opportunity. If you play with friends on coms there is no need for those, so all this does is hurt soloq players more than does in comms. All the information you gain through those perks can be acquired through coms, besides perks that show the killers aura, but then again I haven't seen those in use in ages...
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571789#Comment_3571789
one of few skill-caps to killer to use this perk is to use it like whisper where you want to "predict" where survivor is arbitrary as you walk with the perk. the idea is that you can scan corners around the map quickly but if you see a scream, you can approach the survivor from the an angle where you can cut survivor off so they cannot pre-run. this is one of few skill-caps to using the perk.
strangely enough having low tr like huntress ends up being benefit in some sense because you can start the chaser closer but scanning is worse.
I mean sure, but that would mean the survivor does not know you are approaching or from where and depending on the map and the position of the survivor that got hooked you can have somewhat of an idea from where the killer is approaching and pre run. If you know the perk is in the game you just need to pre run early to a safer structure, it is really not that hard...
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571655#Comment_3571655
yes and survivor have an easy mode perk. Window of opportunity. Ultimate weapon is like window of opportunity. easy mode looping vs easy mode tracking. I don't know if they did that on purpose but it is hilarious.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571698#Comment_3571698
people can only scream once so 30 second activation and 30 second cooldown is 1 minute cooldown. it is same as doc blast. lowering activation time end up being a buff because you start cooldown faster.
But you see them so far away depending on killer... So let's say you hook someone and then open the locker and look for them and if they don't scream instantly they will scream at the maximum distance of your heartbeat, so 24-40 m away from you... Those survivors have so much time to find a hiding spot or start pre running now... I don't see much wrong with the concept...
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571760#Comment_3571760
Call it what you want, it dosnt matter, you see the location of the survivors and thats the point, im even running fright+ult on one of my killers, ult is because of the blindness mainly.
So why exactly is not seeing auras on Survivors so massive for you? Blindness is probably on of the if not the weakest status effect in the game?
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571753#Comment_3571753
You don't see auras with the perk though? Just a bubble up? I would need to look it up but I think bubble ups/screams are not that many... Screams without bubble sure, but otherwise... Infectious fright, maybe dragons grip? Make your choice kind of, other than that I would need to look it up... Whereas blindness is a rather weak effect anyway, not seeing auras... Fear monger? And some others surely
According to the wiki besides a ton of addons there is also: third seal, knockout and septic touch besides the other two mentioned and residual manifest.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571732#Comment_3571732
Its more unique, there are a lot of other ways to make people scream and see auras.
You don't see auras with the perk though? Just a bubble up? I would need to look it up but I think bubble ups/screams are not that many... Screams without bubble sure, but otherwise... Infectious fright, maybe dragons grip? Make your choice kind of, other than that I would need to look it up... Whereas blindness is a rather weak effect anyway, not seeing auras... Fear monger? And some others surely
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@CaulDrohn said:
Guess I'm alone with this issue ^^''.
Nah dude I think the idea is good, there should be all sorts of information + replay mode, question is will they do it though? ^^
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571716#Comment_3571716
Yeah I guess just seems odd to me, 30 seconds duration with 30 seconds cooldown is 100% uptime
But does the uptime really matter if it makes the survivors all scream once anyway?
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571716#Comment_3571716
Blindness is the best thing about the perk
How is blindless the best thing and not the tracking?
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
I don't understand why it activates for 30 seconds with a cooldown of 30 seconds ?? it's more than enough to cross entire map multiple times especially for blight, duration should be 15 seconds or less
also blindness is such an useless solo q stomper effect, someone on hook should stay visible, I hate that it's useless against people on voice com and punish solos
I agree blindness should go but I think the duration is fine, since killers without map mobility should also be able to locate people...
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@FriendlyKiller said:
I started playing DBD again for the Halloween event. So far it's been great fun so I've just been trying different builds on different killers. All good till I went to play a game of Wraith and all my add ons were gone. All of them.
I still had sacrificial cakes.
Also all my killers had reverted back to default cosmetics and had unequiped charms. So I started going through all of them and I swear I'm also missing cosmetics.
I've been playing this game since Clown came out I can't possibly keep track of them all. But if things I buy/earn are going to randomly disappear I'll just play the game for fun and never drop another penny. How does this even happen?
I love your game BHVR but please get your act together, I'm actually very upset.
Did you check the last pages? Because when they cannot be bought through the bloodweb they get moved to the last page of offerings for example, did confuse me as well once.
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@TeleportingTurkey said:
i wish survivors had a meta perk which can be hardcountered entirely 100% by taking a perk killers have.
You could argue that blood echo counters people who stay injured with MFT Resi but I don't know if thats worth it ^^
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571588#Comment_3571588
SM also makes the exact same short-range noises that the other stealth killers make. Except she suffers from all of the drawbacks I have already mentioned. This point doesn't support your argument. Among the others that you haven't bothered addressing.
Also: "It still allowed him to rather consistently get Gen grabs.." is just wrong. Unless the survivors aren't paying attention to the game there's no way to consistently grab them off gens. Especially with how buggy DbD's grab system has always been.
I don't think she has any breathing noise or foot steps or anything, she does not have sound cues like the stealth killers.
I never said she was stronger, just stealthier, so I didn't engage In a debate about the other points.
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I just gives a bubble up, not an aura, you can just walk behind cover... It is really not that hard... Yeah sure the debuff is a bit much on top, but the perk is really not as op as people make it out to be...
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@IamFran said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570528#Comment_3570528
I don't get what's the problem of "free injuries" from Skull Merchant. Legion and Plague also have powers with free injuries, and less countereable than the skull merchant one in fact, and almost nobody complain about them, well some people used to complain about Legion, but about how boring is to face them not about their free hits.
I mean complaining about having to mend all the time, what people basically did is basically complaining him getting a free tag ^^ But they don't complain that much since to get the down most of the time needs to loop normally, unless he runs never sleep pills, which is still super annoying... Depending on the map
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571088#Comment_3571088
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570973#Comment_3570973
The only thing that was wrong with my statement was my wording. When I said "The only audio that any of them produce are their breathing noises..." I should have specified that I meant the unique noises that each killer makes. The fact remains that these noises are only audible when the killer is right next to someone and moments away from landing a hit. And none of these killer's stealth are broken in any way.
Which leads me to explain that the claim that SM's stealth was broken is clearly wrong when compared to every other killer that has both easier access to undetectable and additional benefits on top of that.
- Wraith can keep undetectable as long as he wants and gets a considerable speed boost by default. Add-ons only make his cloak stronger with options to increase is action speed, instantly decloak upon breaking something, constant aura reading while cloaked, and completely removing the audio que for him uncloaking.
- Ghostface can keep undetectable until he hits someone or a survivor spots him. And can expose survivors to get insta-downs. The add-ons that enhance his stealth allow him to use it more often or get extra benefits after exposing survivors.
- Pig's stealth is the only one that can be argued to be worse than SM because it makes her much slower than Ghostface and doesn't give her a quick speed boost like Wraith does when exiting it. But it synergises with her main power very well by allowing her to ambush people around Jigsaw boxes to potentially get free downs.
Now let me explain how SM's "Stealth" works:
- She has to constantly micro-manage drones to keep her undetectable since it lasts for only 8 seconds.
- In doing so she is likely to place a bunch of drones that aren't in good positions and have to be recalled and placed later, which takes more time thanks to her drone's cooldown.
- She can't her keep undetectable up 100% of the time since by default it wears off before she can place another drone to refresh it.
- The only add-on that allowed her to do what 3 other killers already do by default has just been reworked to be quite possibly the most useless killer add-on in the game since Trapper's Padded Jaws.
- With her only useful stealth add-on nerfed, the only add-on remaining that aims to buff her stealth, the Iridescent Unpublished Manuscript, is completely in the hands of survivors in order for it to activate.
There's no valid argument to be made about SM's stealth being broken. It was one of the worst stealth abilities in the game. And with the nerf of her Low Power Mode add-on it's even worse.
But since Hens made a video with a click-baity title that involved him stomping randoms people falsely assumed that something in SM's new kit was redeemable. It isn't. She's still the worst designed killer in the game and removing what limited options she has will just encourage people to continue doing the one thing she's good at; camping.
It still allowed him to rather consistently get Gen grabs since there is no sound cue that she is approaching... Yes the others are rather short distance but might still give you enough of a warning to reach a tile by yourself or sprint burst away.
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@betelgeuseyes said:
From this Halloween event entering portals, this idea occured to me. This kind of mechanic could be applied to Freddie's power, literally sending survivors to a dream world where Freddy could kill them, which is literally what Freddy does in the movies.
Insta kills are always problematic, just look at Myers and Onryo... I would like the pulling in dream stuff, but not with something that drastic... Also please no massive slowdown... There are surely other things that would be fun and allow skillfully interaction in combination with the dream world... Might as well do different levels of dream world with changing effects...
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@MeowMeow93 said:
Instead ot teasing next chapter better take a look and fix old ones .
Blight rework him this killer is broken , he doesn't need 4.6 his speed must be 4.4
He doesn't need 7-8 jumps make 3 max increase cool down as well
All his top addons like blighted crow, alchemist ring,blighted rat change them
Nurse increase her cool down it's still too fast nerfing addons it's not enough or rework her ability or give her only one blink it's more than enough for that type of killer
Wersker a lot of people would cry that he is balanced but he needs some changes don't think that people would pick him ,blight or nurse a lot of times if they were balanced .I don't see people maining pig,ghost face,freddy,billy and etc they are balanced why they dont play them it's even funny.
Wesker needs his ability cool down longer and may be his addon for cool down removed .
Ofc as always a lot of killer mains will run and try to tell me that they are fine as always .(p.s. ofc they will loose matches after this killers will be nerfed and they are scared) And let me remind you playing as killer should be also a work not easy win as this killers .
Nobody plays Billy because he is the hardest killer in the game and barely average in strength, his curving does not do much on the newer maps and since collision is weird as well and he bumps into air or little branches. As for the other killers you mentioned they are all on the weaker side... Freddy and Pig are probably in the bottom 5 of killers whereas Ghostface is slightly higher... Also what do you define as balanced? Do you mean weak? Because yes those killers are on the weaker half of killers.
Sure Nurse Blight and Wesker are strong killers but they also have fun powers to use, what does Freddy have? A teleport and putting stuff on the ground woweeeee so much to learn there, whereas other killers offer way more to learn and reward you for it with a strong killer... The issue about Billy is he is hard, really hard, and not good enough for how much effort you need to put into him.
As for your ideas for Nurse, Blight and Wesker, nah... Blights base kit is basically perfect, same with Wesker, they allow skill expression and decision making that influence the outcome of the chase, both are great killer designs. Yes some of Blights addons are busted, insta pallet break and Alc ring are stupid, but without speed his anti loop becomes way worse...
I would say Nurse is in an OK spot now, her addons don't add much to her power, basically making Blight the strongest killer... Her base kit mobility really is not that great, making her even slower might lead to even more holding w since her mobility averages out below 115%ms, yes she can go through walls, but that does not help too much on large open maps, if someone is running you on Ormond does it really matter that you can go through walls when the guy pre runs from 40m away?
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@okaayletsgoo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570437#Comment_3570437
300+ hours of gameplay, good at looping, videos to prove it. Nothing you say will change my mind that he needs slight adjusting with his blood pools. There's a reason that if he gets hits within 30 seconds it's ggs. That's because he NEEDS ADJUSTING. Again SLIGHT adjusting. I never said he was broken or op or needs a nerf to the ground. SLIGHT adjusting.
Y'all act like the game isn't killer sided other than high tier swf which is 1% of players.
You do realise that 300 h makes you basically new to the game and people will not take your claim serious now ^^ And with 300 h you re most definitely not good at looping... No offense buddy but even then it is only GG if you give oni the information to catch people and then not loop him during his power which is completely possible if the oni is of similar skill level...
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@KayTwoAyy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570340#Comment_3570340
Do I seriously need to hold your hand and explain to you the difference between a Killer learning to counterplay Survivor(s) and Survivors learning to counterplay each and every Killer?
And once I've walked you through those differences, do I seriously need to hold your hand and explain to you how the Survivor's job becomes exponentially harder with each Killer release, while the Killer's job remains exactly the same?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570496#Comment_3570496
...should have a rather high mmr and theefore not be matched with the average player
The problem is...MMR in DBD does not exist to frequently match players of equal skill. Maybe things have changed since I last played (Feb/Mar), but MMR was designed to make sure everyone won roughly half of their games. BHVR decided that the quality of each match was less important to their bottom line than the outcome of each match, and in turn created a system that cared more about predicting outcomes than creating close matches.
As an unnecessary aside...
DBD's MMR system is like a rich, out-of-touch parent who thinks they can make their kids happy by throwing money at them, when the kids need love and attention. It might solve one or two problems in the short-term, but it is damaging in the long run.
Which makes it an mmr issue right...
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570842#Comment_3570842
No they don't. The only audio that any of them produce are their breathing noises when they're literally right behind someone. Wraith has an add-on that completely removes his bell noise. And no one uses Pig's ambush attack so they just un-crouch. For all intents and purposes, they are completely silent until they can land a hit.
But somehow this is a problem with SM? Yeah right!
Yes they do? Ghostface has his cloak making noises, Wraith has his gnarling, Pig has a noise when she is standing up as well, the blade that comes out again makes a noise, so yeah, you re wrong on that...
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570826#Comment_3570826
I like separating the use of skill from memorization work, because different approaches lend themselves to growing your abilities.
I don't care what others call what, it just helps me to decide how best to go about correcting the issue.
Blight is very different, he can decide to bump many places or decide that a hug works out best on this specific loop at the given time. There is a lot of memorization in there, but there is also adjustments to make with your mouse, and consideration over best practices that happen once you recognize that a specific tile is causing you issues. That sort of categorization of approach leads me to call it skills to build and judgement to refine.
Xeno on the other hand has quite a few tiles and obstruction spawns that just don't give the character's M2 room to do things. So, I'm more prone to approach the situation with a "Yes" can hit or a "No" don't waste the time on it, chances of manipulating the elements to allow a hit are too low to justify the risk. In community terms, I don't see that they allow for "Skill expression".
I framed my response the way I did because the original poster said "No skill" to Xeno. And if the OP is doing what I suspect he's doing, it really will look like there is no skill involved. Because if you always vault +W you're going to get hit. You can't argue with someone that is essentially correct, you can only hopefully point out why it isn't really that big of an issue.
Sorry for length, but I hope that clarifies the thinking.
But with Blight you also have the muscle memory of doing a flick or a bump in a specific way, which is also a skill you need to learn... So I don't really see the sense in the differing between skills and muscle memory, both are something you need to learn...
I mean, what you described allows for skill expression, if it is worth to go for it is something completely different, if we go with a Blight example: When LilithOmen goes for the wildest flicks despite the ability to just get the hit easier and more safe a different way, it is still skill expression nontheless, has nothing to do with how reliable it is.
A little bit I guess, I still don't agree with the no skill for Xeno because of the knowledge and dragging you need to put into Xeno if you wanna use the tail attack properly.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570526#Comment_3570526
For The Skull Merchant, Low Profile mode was causing an issue which allowed her to stay Undetectable indefinitely (the cooldown was shorter than the duration of the Undetectable effect).
Oh no. Could you imagine if the killer was able to get undetectable infinitely? It's not like
Wraith, Ghostface, Pig,some killers are already able to do that and have it be a completely fine part of their kit! This is why I am highly sceptical of the devs. Their reasons for changing things are often completely detached from the reality of the game they're developing.This new version offers a different way to use her drones, letting you set up a static 'scan wall' of sorts rather than a rotating beam.
This new effect is worthless. You're cutting down on the ground covered by your drone in exchange for nothing. If you want a specific doorway covered by a drone it's actually better to have the drone rotate since it makes approaching the drone slightly harder than if it wasn't. They're easily avoidable enough as it is by just crouching or standing still. Why did anyone think that making an add-on so the drones were even easier to avoid was a good idea???
However they all have an audio cue that let's you know they are near, Hens made a video about skull merchant lately mentioning this and said she might be the stealthiest because of not having such a sound cue.
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
As of last night, most survivors have figured out that vault or pallet+ strafe with a duck moves their hitbox enough for Xeno to miss his tail if he is shooting through the center of the vault or pallet.
So, it becomes a matter of prediction with each survivor, they aren't dodging in a traditional sense of the word, they are running an evasive script, and 2-3 exposures to it and the Xeno player will adjust the hit to catch them after their evasive pallet or vault move.
I don't think of such things as skills, its more familiarity with the availability of such counter play and a willingness to adapt to the specific person you're playing against.
The vault hits are worse because the vaults tend to reject most tail hits that aren't straight through their centers, it really depends on the surrounding geometry, which again, I can't define as a skill, I mostly think of it as map memorization and muscle memory.
Shooting the tail over object does generally have some elements of deflection shooting in it, which is a skill, but the whole concept is overshadowed by Xeno's dropped camera(from his POV) which means you're making assumptions about the vertical axis of the hit, and the generally wonky hit rejection on tiny elements like desk lamps, or beaker holders, and other assorted scene dressing items.
I find most of the skill in playing him involves knowing who to chase to where and when to exert area control. Not so much the twitch aspects of tail hits.
I wish they would make some adjustments to his various numbers, most pressingly the PoV in crawler mode, but I wouldn't want the entire tail mechanic removed.
You do realise though, that muscle memory is a form of skill... Because most abilities will at some point become muscle memory...
As for the objects you either assume their hitbox or you learned the hitbox of those objects, same with the really good Billys or Blights that know the collision of tiles on the map.
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@Anthony15 said:
Xenomorph is one of the most boring killers to play as and against. I hate the fact that you don't work for your power and the power is so basic that it literally takes no skill.
Xenomorph's power should have something with the face huggers and have the ability to climb over walls and pallets. The tail should be their main weapon not as a range weapon unless it has a cooldown. The face huggers should be at gens and hooks so the survivors are forced to deal with them unless with a flame turrets. Keep the tunnel system but remove the whole crawler mode idea, it's so lazy and boring. Please have Xenomorph more screen accurate
As for your idea, I don't think climbing over walls is that good of an idea, it would be completely useless in indoor maps depending on the speed it would either be broken or useless in chase. I think the moving through tunnels/vents is rather screen accurate.
With the tail as before mentioned there is at least a skillfull play to use it properly to hit over tiles, whereas vaulting or climbing above walls is just a thing about knowing or not, and even more basic than a shortrange anti loop ability...
So if I understand you correctly the face huggers are somewhat of build in slowdown? And what exactly happens if the survivors just ignore them? Is the gen just blocked or what is their effect? Obviously not growing another alien and killing them in the process like in the first movie right? That would be stupid.
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@Skaphegor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570542#Comment_3570542
These downsides remain untouched? maybe increase Hindered back to 20%. It should just go up if you perform working actions.
it's an in-built slowdown. Wesker shouldn't earn a guaranteed down just for landing a single hit. He is already an oppressive chase killer who can get downs very easily and fast. Infections only benefits Weskers who haven't learnt how to use their ability effectively, yet.; in-built crutch.
It takes 100 seconds to get to full infection if wesker only gets a single hit with his power... If you continue the chase that long the game is basically over...
But yeah sure, that would be alright if it increases drastically when you repair gens instead of cleansing, but I think it is so slow that it is not really too bad...
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@Skaphegor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3569305#Comment_3569305
If you outplay a Wesker by predropping pallets, and he fails to zone you properly or to catch you with his ability while you're holding W, it's def on him. My point still stands: Wesker should not be rewarded for his failures.
not to mention that predropping against Wesker doesn't work, bc he can vault over pallets to catch up pretty fast. you're literally forced to loop him and dodge his ability
I mean after unhook yes infection should not start increasing before some action happened from the survivor side, but otherwise wesker earned it by landing his power, so now the infection I creases... It is what it is, if there was not some sort of downside as massive as slowdown + instadown with power then what is the reason to get rid of infection at all?
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@Emeal said:
cause you could abuse it with Head on to stun the Killers for 7 to 8 seconds.
Buffing it wont stop tunneling.
But that totally sucks and you can hit through if you immediately swing and they just go down... Or maybe even get a grab if you re that fast
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@pizzavessel15 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570485#Comment_3570485
the only time when its potentially useful is at a god pallet with no windows nearby. majority of the time its useless (not to mention iv had survivors just vault again and it doesn't hit them for some reason)
If they try to vault back you need to press "S" I think it was? Otz or Hens explained that some months back, so if you do it properly they cannot vault back without getting hit.
I would not say God loop, but rather safe loop for sure.
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@KayTwoAyy said:
Unfortunately, the more Killers BHVR releases, the more problematic "high skill" Killers are for game health.
The average player has no influence over which Killers they face, and are therefore unable to keep pace with the skill development of players who only play one Killer. Every time a new Killer is released, Survivors have fewer opportunities to learn the counterplay against every other Killer.
If I was BHVR, I'm not sure how I would address this issue.
My inclination is to design a series of LTMs that reignite interest in the game whilst promoting a diversity of playstyles, all with the hopes that one of the LTMs gains enough traction to eventually replace the core game mode.
The alternative would probably be to institute a Killer/Perk ban system, and see what the landscape looks like after a few months of player-regulated matchmaking. Survivors could forcibly increase the variety of Killers they encounter, and Killers could either ban meta Survivor perks or ban perks that uniquely hinder the Killer they are playing
That sounds like a matchmaking issue though... Such one trick killer players should have a rather high mmr and therefore not be matched with the average player... Also high skill characters are good to keep players on board, the game would be really boring if there was nothing to learn.
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@Zokenay said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570299#Comment_3570299
Certainly the fact that hes the second strongest killer only behind freaking Nurse, while having arguably the strongest addons in the game and an unfair tech has nothing to do with said complains....
So what? He can be strong and fun to against? I for example think Nurse is rather fun to go against... Also I would even argue that Blight is stronger than Nurse because of how op some of his addons are and nurse not gaining much strength from her addons...
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@pizzavessel15 said:
- the tail does have a cooldown.
- Wesker can go over stuff and its borderline useless in chase
this really just shows you do not play xenomorph much or at all
The vaulting for Wesker is not entirely useless, but just really situational, you can slap them when they try to vault back, but it is only ever useful besides that when the loop has a certain length so you can hit them before they make it around...
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@Anthony15 said:
Xenomorph is one of the most boring killers to play as and against. I hate the fact that you don't work for your power and the power is so basic that it literally takes no skill.
Xenomorph's power should have something with the face huggers and have the ability to climb over walls and pallets. The tail should be their main weapon not as a range weapon unless it has a cooldown. The face huggers should be at gens and hooks so the survivors are forced to deal with them unless with a flame turrets. Keep the tunnel system but remove the whole crawler mode idea, it's so lazy and boring. Please have Xenomorph more screen accurate
I mean it has quite a skill cap in the sense of being able to hit over certain objects and such, so it is not entirely basic...
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@okaayletsgoo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570129#Comment_3570129
And back to my previous comment, if you pre drop, he insta breaks it, quickly recovers and is right back on you. Yes you can do this and chain pallets IF there are good pallets, IF you get lucky with a good layout and then all pallets are gone in 1-2 minutes and the rest of the game is an unsafe map. That's hoping your team was doing gens and not hiding or afk or etc. You can't balance the game based on swf high MMR or the rest of the 95% of players suffer.
Like I said in the post he doesn't need major changes just something minor with the blood orbs preferably
What do you mean quickly breaks? He does not have his power... And by doing that you can deny his power long enough without needing any skill, if you are good at looping even better than you don't necessarily need to ore drop, but otherwise just play it super safe and don't get hit...
Also with the talk about skill, are you assuming that the Oni player is just that much better than all the survivors or what? If so seems like a matchmaking issue and once again nothing wrong with the killer...
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@okaayletsgoo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570131#Comment_3570131
You act like most survivors can loop like pros. Most solo qs are not pros and you need to realize that and stop trying to balance things around that mentality
Dude if you just predrop pallets you don't need to play good, that's the entire point we re all making... Predropping and running to the next pallet does not require anything from a skill perspective but finding the next loop...