BillToLast
BillToLast
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@Biscuits said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3533617#Comment_3533617
My statistics are an accurate representation of what her kill rate would look like against the average solo queue team. His statistics are a dump from what I would hope is top end killer mains? But I would have to look at his FAQ if he even has one. 2.3k games in this time frame is a ton of different people sending him numbers. How do you know the numbers you are getting from them aren't lies? What if survivor and killer mains are sending in numbers? What if the people sending in numbers are trolling or just paying for fun?
I use the same perks every game I record, I keep track of DCs but I keep the 2 stats separate. I also have a separate row for killers who hard tunnel. To see if tunneling actually increases kill rate (spoiler it increases your kill rate by 15-25%).
I just reset it a few weeks ago so I am fresh, with only 60 games. And Xeno just came out so it would be impossible to get to a respectable data set in the time frame. That being said, she is performing very strong with how new players should be with her.
Bruh, even trapper has a really high kill rate against the average soloq team. Weak players being destroyed aren't a measure of the killer's strength.
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@Venusa said:
STBFL hasn't been adjusted to match the 6.1.0. update and it's been very over-tuned with full stacks since then but nobody wants to admit it out of fear LOL.
Survivor mains complaining about the only basekit buff that killers got in the past 3 years, which is 10% shorter M1 cooldown to help weaker killers.
Survivor mains asking to nerf a perk that only weaker M1 killers benefit from.
If you nerf STBFL, you will see a lot more Nurses and Blights in your games.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Not really worth it to punish legit Epic-players with such a drastic measurement against Cheaters. The game costs 3-4 bucks, this is not much difference to a free account considering that cheaters can probably run around for weeks before their account gets banned.
Legit Epic users got the game for free, so they shouldn't complain too much. They can still play against other Epic users, which there are hundreds of thousands of.
Right now you are punishing non-Epic players who have paid for the game. I suggest to punish people who didn't pay and lose nothing.
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@Lixadonna said:
Why run one Perk to counter another?
Killer complained about Boons but never used Shattered. Now Boons are dead.
Shattered Hope has garbage even during the boon meta, as you had to find and snuff 5 totems just to counter Circle. Calm spirit completely destroys Ultimate Weapon, just like Distortion destroys Lethal Pursuer.
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@Krazzik said:
The new Alien perk where survivors scream after you check a locker is absurdly busted. It lasts so long and there's no way for survivors to counter it besides run Calm Spirit. On most killers its the best information perk by a long way but on killers like Oni it's crazy.
You counter it by repositioning.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
knock out, franklin, noed, sloppy butcher, STBFL.. not all overpowered but game would be fine without it
Franklin is the only thing killers have to counter some powerful survivor items.
STBFL and Sloppy only work on M1-killers, who are usually weak to begin with.
NOED is a weak perk. If you lose to the killer running it, that's purely a skill issue.
Knock Out is garbage, it needs a buff if anything.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Comp players like this are why dbd is in such an unfun state. Meta perks come and go maybe chill out. It's supposed to be a fun party game. Let's try and get back to the fun. This perk was only created because of how comp killer side of dbd has become.
I agree, let's go back to 7-blink Nurse and old Eruption. These things were very fun for the killer, even if a little unbalanced.
I think Blight's addons are in a perfect state right now too. Alchemist Ring, Compound 33 and speed addons are very fun to use, who cares about balance or enjoyment for the other side.
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@mizark3 said:
People who are bad need crutches, see Blight/Nurse/Spirit mains. Survivor should get crutches too. That being said it still is overtuned, remove the Endurance and I think its fine for normal matchmaking. You want to troll post ("Discuss."), you get a troll answer.
Blight, Nurse and Spirit at least take a lot of skill to use. A crutch would be something that compensates for your lack of skill, such as Windows of Opportunity.
Blight is arguably the hardest and most complex killer to play as, since you need to learn the collision properties of every single prop in the game and be able to make crucial decisions on the fly. Spirit and Nurse require you to have good hearing and game sense.
Made for This simply gives you a raw stat boost when you lose the first chase. That is the definition of a crutch.
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@JPLongstreet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3520932#Comment_3520932
This is my assessment as well. I term it a "high MMR" problem, because in the hands of the very skilled survs it's beyond useful in chase, and can feel busted as lots of perks do at that level.
For the vast rest of us normies you get a loop or two more at most, or maybe to that window, and get slapped then, triggering the endurance effect. And that's best case scenario.
Same argument can be applied to Blight. He is one of the hardest killers to learn, therefore most people won't be able to use his strong addons to their full effects.
At least Alchemist Ring requires you to hit a survivor, MFT just rewards you for losing.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
"if you disagree you're bad at the game"... okay strong argument, he just called Otz bad but at least his 20 min video had some explanations, not just "you bad lol"
Otzdarva also says MFT needs to be nerfed, as does almost every top-tier player.
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@KaTo1337 said:
Its annoying to face as M1-Killer. When I play Oni for example, I dont care about MfT.
Also I dont care what a comp. players says. Comp. in this hardcore unbalanced asymmetrical game is a joke itself. Making their own rules and bans for addons / maps etc. is so funny.
The more interesting discussion would be
A) how to bring weaker killer and stronger killers closer together
B) How to bring SoloQ closer to SWF (for me DBD Mobile is showing a way with small orders like "Im in chase", "I go for the unhook" etc. available ingame.
This is the point of the post.
MFT increases the divide between killers, as Blight/Nurse/Spirit are not affected by it, while Legion is devastated.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Comp players like this are why dbd is in such an unfun state. Meta perks come and go maybe chill out. It's supposed to be a fun party game. Let's try and get back to the fun. This perk was only created because of how comp killer side of dbd has become.
I agree, let's go back to 7-blink Nurse and old Eruption. These things were very fun for the killer, even if a little unbalanced.
I think Blight's addons are in a perfect state right now too. Alchemist Ring, Compound 33 and speed addons are very fun to use, who cares about balance or enjoyment for the other side.
Also comp players have no effect on BHVR's decision making. They simply push the game to the limits and can show what is broken and what isn't.
Made for This is not a fun perk to go up against, just like old Eruption wasn't fun for the survivors.
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@jesterkind said:
There are two general things to say in response to this.
The first is that the appeal to authority is a fallacy even when the authority is granted for a reason. I don't care that KnightLight thinks MFT is OP and needs a nerf, but because they're a skilled player, I might care why they think that. That reasoning isn't present here, and since I can't open twitter links right now (thank you, mr musk...) I can't check if it's elsewhere in the thread.
The second follows on from that, which is to say, what nerf do they think it needs? What are they referring to? If they say that the 3% speed boost is disgustingly OP and completely free, I'd disagree with them, because they're wrong. If they say that the Endurance is too much on top of an already strong effect, and that stacking MFT's Haste with other forms of Haste is where it becomes indefensible, that I would agree with.
TL;DR invoking a skilled player's opinions is meaningless unless you give their reasoning.
Otz, who is also an amazing player, made an entire video about why this perk is problematic.
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According to your logic, Knightlight (one of the best DBD players in the world, both as killer and survivor) is low-skill, because he said that MFT needs to be nerfed.
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Hi guys, I've heard and seen many times where players (of course mostly survivors *akhem*) think that Alchemist Ring is a broken addon that should get nerfed.
My honest opinion:
As a survivor main, I am completely happy how Alchemist Ring is in the current state. It makes chasing literaly tiny bit more challenging and fun, and that's what I like. If I see any Blight rushing right after hitting a survivor, I know that they have that addon for those juicy 5 tokens of his power and I can wait it out, 99% of the times I escape the chase. It's basically like a hazard game. Either they risk addon value or just keep on holding W.
And for slugging for 4k? I am also completely fine with that. Slugging is an ENDGAME strategy and killers need to hardly work for that juicy hatch spawn denial. Basically is a reward for doing the objectives and not sitting in the corner or patrolling around the map for 80% of the match. If they kill 2 survivors and slug the 3rd? Well, it is the survivors' fault that they didn't repair the gens fast enough and/or split up on gens.
Conclusion? Alchemist Ring + Blighted Crow is overall counterable (and the speed CAN but DOESN'T have to be countered by pallets) + the speed stacking is the reward. I am happy how it is in the current state.
If they nerf it, I will literally laugh for those baby survivors and literally make a 10 minute video why it shouldn't get a nerf.
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Killer was far easier and stronger in the past.
You could bring Nurse with a mori after first hook, use M1-perks on her, such as Jolt and NOED (which used to be far stronger), have busted addons with either faster recharge, more distance or extra blinks. Survivors had no basekit BT, so they either had to waste a perk slot or give the killer an easy tunnel right off the hook.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3518654#Comment_3518654
https://nightlight.gg/perks/Boon:_Circle_of_Healing yes very viable. So much, that it has 2% usage rate (and I wonder why so many ppl still bring it. Probably nostalgia only). As of now ALL boon perks are meh at best.
DH can come into clutch, but most of the games it does not even matter. The perk went from 33% usage to 9% - there's a very good reason for that.
Also - nobody ever made a single mention to adrenaline so long as DH was meta. Now that killers convinced devs the perk needs huge nerf, adrenaline (a perk that wasn't touched since patch 1.8.1) is suddenly soooo problematic. Talk about moving goalpost. Succeed in nerfing all the mentioned perk and soon it will be inner healing and blast mine that are nasty OP and definitely needs nerfs. Same as adrenaline - nobody is talking that it's problem right now, but give it yet another nerf to survivor perks and those perks are suddenly nasty OP and totally need nerfs
Skill issue. I use COH quite often when playing in SWF, as it allows you to create a safezone to regroup and recover in a short amount of time. Most survivors simply used it as a crutch perk for easy mass self heals. The self-care aspect of it had to be removed to promote hit-and-run playstyle. Devs buffed the healing speed and gave it aura reading to compensate for that.
DH is just as powerful now as it was before for 1 simple reason - killers will now rarely expect it or wait it out. You can still use it twice per match to significantly prolong the chase, especially against killers with predictable attacks, such as Nurse and Blight. That perk is currently in a perfect spot of being balanced and better against stronger killers, but not extremely annoying to go against.
I've not seen a single person, not even hardcore killer mains, ever suggest nerfing Inner Healing or Blast Mine, so you are exaggerating. Adrenaline shouldn't be nerfed, but it is one of the strongest perks in the entire game. Otz considers it to be the absolute best perk.
On the other hand, I see a lot of survivors on this forum asking to nerf perks that primarily benefit weaker M1-killers, such as STBFL, Sloppy Butcher and Jolt.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3518660#Comment_3518660
I dont think you have a clue how logic works.
First, at no point i say anything about balance, so how you would to arrive that Alchemist Ring is balanced by my logic is beyond me, but i am quite certain it has nothing to do with logic.
Also, my whole statement is about the fact that Made for this only activates at a point where the survivor is already at a disadvantage, and show why i think a lost health state is a disadvantage for many survivors, by the fact that self care is still in the top 10 of perks.
That doesnt mean that made for this is balanced, it just means i disagree with the notion of the TO that survivors have to sacifice anything to have it work, because it is already conditional.
Only bad and low-skill survivors think that being injured puts at a disadvantage against any non-stealth killers. Many unskilled survivors are too afraid to loop or take healthy risks just because they can be downed in 1 hit.
Self-care is in the top 10 because it's extremely popular on asian servers and is most often used by beginners who overvalue it.
And it's not that bad of a perk to begin with, as it can allow you to finish up interrupted heals, assuming lack of haemmorage.
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I agree, let's buff all killers to be just as strong and fun as Nurse, Blight and Wesker.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3514483#Comment_3514483
But Survivors have to sacrifice a health state already to use made for this, while hitting a survivor surly is no sacrifice to the killer, but somehting he wants to do. Meaning made for this activates when the survivor is already at a disadvantage, while Brutalitiy activates when the killer is already at the advantage.
There is a reason why self care even in the current state is still a top 10 perk, because for a lot of survivors, having just one health state is a risk. Yes, there are high skill survivors that can handle it, but the majority of people obviously cant.
By your logic Alchemist Ring is balanced, because Blight is difficult to play and most people struggle with him.
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@Runnit said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3518364#Comment_3518364
So you missed the update towards the end of last year where they nerfed all the survivor meta perks? How is that a buff, and if that wasnt bad enough they nerfed them again! Meanwhile, sloppy butcher, thanataphobia, corrupt intervention, dead man's switch, ALL SCOURGE HOOK PERKS, call of brine, no where to hide, jolt...and many many more. Killers can make builds where they literally don't need to kick a generator their perks do it for them. They literally just need to keep chasing survivors. Half of these perks at least need a timer. But I doubt dbd would do that to their sensitve entitled killers smh🙄
You mean the same update where they also nerfed a lot of killer meta perks?
The strongest survivor perks, such as Adrenaline, Deliverance, Sprint Burst, Made For This and Lithe are still just as strong and haven't been touched for the past two years. Dead Hard and Circle of Healing are still very viable, despite what some people say.
The only top-tier killer perk that hasn't been nerfed in the same timespan is Deadlock. Every other strong killer perk has been nerfed in the past year: Corrupt Intervention, PainRes, Pop, Starstruck, DMS, Call of Brine, Awakened Awareness, and Eruption. The last 3 are now completely worthless outside of niche builds.
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This is the most survivor-main take of all time.
Imagine asking to nerf an M1-only healing slowdown perk. As if M1 killers haven't had it hard enough, we must nerf one of the most viable perks for them.
Imagine asking to nerf a niche D-tier perk that can help killers who don't want to deal with random BS.
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@Saiph said:
DBD is the only game I know where it is considered normal for (killer) players to win 75%+ of their matches. In any other online game, winning ~10 games in high MMR would immediatly put you at the top of the ranked leaderboard, but not in DBD, where a 10-winstreak would probably not get you any attention - in fact most killers on this forum probably got such a streak, several times -. and we're now having someone with a THOUSAND wins in a row.
For comparison, the absolute best player on Overwatch leaderboards, sits at 62% winrate. Despite hard carrying every single of his matches. He still often loses due to RNG and matchmaking, as should be the case in any online game. But not in DBD.
The reason for it is that MMR system is trash, at least for the survivors.
You could loop the killer for 5 gens, get hit by NOED and facecamped to death, which will cause you to lose MMR. Or you could hide all game, wait for the killer to close the hatch, and open the exit gates with Sole Survivor + Wake Up, which will cause you to gain MMR.
Most killer mains already sit at the MMR cap, but there are simply not enough high-MMR survivors available.
This is further amplified by the fact that survivors are naturally 4x more likely to make a major mistake costing them the match.
Additionally, there is a very high chance that at least 1 of the 4 survivors will not play to win, but rather aim to complete an archive challenge or run an off-meta meme build for a youtube compilation. Survivors are also far more likely to DC early in the match, which dooms the entire team.
If the MMR system actually put good survivors against equally skilled killers, and if all survivors on any team played at an equal level of efficiency, we would see the kill rates plummet across the board.
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@Moonras2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3518135#Comment_3518135
Yes above you did list those but in the original post I quoted you only mentioned survivor restrictions. Which is why I posted what it said for both sides. You are right that limiting the survivor loadouts to one perk or item per person is very strong. So is not being able to use Nurse or Blight in every game of the tournament. If its all because they think survivors are still too strong then they wouldn't place restrictions on killers used. Unless the restrictions are looking for variety in play.
I'm not arguing anything about solo queue. That's a whole other topic. I'm not even really arguing balance.
The tournaments work in rounds, with each round allowing certain specific killers to choose from. Nurse and Blight are offered just as much as any other killer. With 30 other killers in the game, they obviously wouldn't be picked very often.
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@indieeden7 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3518122#Comment_3518122
Stop using completely fabricated statistics, like you didn't even try to make this sound even remotely believable 😭
What statistics? I just made a broad observatory statement.
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@Ariel_Starshine said:
I don't.
Nurse and Blight are a joke to loop.
Everytime I see complaints about MFT I'll be running it more and more. Until the vault hit validation is fixed and palette dropping, I'll be running it. Priorities.
Also, people were asking for those nerfs for years. MFT is only a few months old.
You can run MFT, just like almost everyone is doing right now. But then don't wonder why people decide to switch to higher tier killers not affected by this perk, and use their most busted addons.
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@Moonras2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3517982#Comment_3517982
Below is why I saw nothing about hatch offerings. For this tournament anyway. There was another tournament I did see the hatch offerings. Both of them had to be used though, not just one. That means it isn't just to help the killer, it sounds like it's more for giving a 50/50 chance on who chooses the right building. I also don't see anything about unhooking/chest rules in this one but in another one I saw that killers must run cut coin.
I said all this because you made it sound like all restrictions are on survivors because they consider them too powerful. There are however restrictions on both sides. To me it seems more in line with bringing variety and entertainment for spectators.
Tournament Restrictions
Add-ons & Perk Restrictions
- Killer Add-ons: Only Common and Uncommon add-ons are Allowed. Rare add-ons are Allowed for all rounds of play up-to & until the Quarter Finals. Rare add-ons are NOT usable in the Quarter Finals, Semi-Finals and Grand Finals.
- Survivor Items/Item Add-ons: No event Items can be used. Keys and Maps are not to be used. Survivor team is not allowed to bring any item type more than once or equip any perk more than once. Only Common and Uncommon items and add-ons allowed for Survivors in all rounds.
- Offerings: Not Allowed
- Perk / Item Restrictions: All Survivors must have Unique Perks & Items. Survivors may not have Duplicate Perks, or Items
New Content
- Anytime a new Killer, Survivor, Perk, or Item is added to the game, it may not be used for 2 weeks from the release date in any Community Cup event in order to ensure appropriate time for the community to learn & experiment with the new content.
The first, second and fourth rules are exactly what I said above. The final rule is obvious, which is why Eternal was disqualified for using Nicolas Cage.
Different tournaments have somewhat different variations, but the staple of non-repeating perks and items is always there.
Banning survivors from bringing a certain perk twice as well as most good items is a HUGE restriction that is not even remotely comparable to killer addon restrictions. Nurse and Artist, for example, have very strong yellow and brown meta addons.
That repeat ban by itself would seriously scew the tournaments in the killer's favor. Yet in majority of top tier player matches, survivors end up getting at least a 3-man out and killers consider getting 2 kills an overwhelming victory.
Which all proves that the game is still very survivor-sided, but most survivors lack the skill or desire to play at their full potential, which is why even the Trapper has a 60% kill rate.
SoloQ is not really an argument, when I escape about 50% of my trials as survivor despite always running meme builds. And most matches where I don't escape are due to nobody repairing generators or people leaving me to die on first hook.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/82178JJHZ4WL/img-8528.jpeg
been a while since i had to bring this one out
almost doxxed myself doing so too
Not applicable in this case.
People who ask Blight and Nurse to be nerfed are usually MFT users. Pointing out hypocrisy is not whataboutism.
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@Moonras2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3517434#Comment_3517434
I personally don't watch or really care about comp play but I think you left a few things out. From what I seen on the tournament rules, for Battlefy, there are restrictions on both sides. Not just the survivor side.
The only items I saw survivors can't bring are maps, keys, and event addons. Only common and uncommon items and addons can be used though. They can't have duplicates of perks, items, or characters. No where did it say this was to help with tunneling.
Killers can only use rare add-ons up to a certain point in the tournament. Then they also must only use common or uncommon addons. They also must use killers from a pool in each round. They can't just choose what's considered the strongest killer every round.
It doesn't look like killers or survivors are allowed to use a map or any other offering. I didn't see anything about them having to use a hatch offering. I also didn't see that they can't open chest or try to unhook themselves.
I'm sure the rules change from organizers and specific tournaments. Just looking at the rules though it looks like a mix of forcing balance with variety and not all the rules are imposed just because they think survivors are too strong.
Edit: I looked up some other tournaments and see the rules change a little depending on the tournament. I did see one with the offerings and things you were talking about.
Your second paragraph literally reiterates exactly what I said. Only up to yellow (uncommon) quality items. Keys and maps start at green (rare) quality.
Weaker killers, such as Dredge or Huntress, are allowed to bring up to green and sometimes purple rarity addons (e.g. Flower Babushka). Survivors are always banned from anything above yellow, even when facing Blight or Nurse.
Duplicate characters are exactly to help with tunneling, you don't need to say it outright when it's clearly implied. Everyone looking different makes it far easier for the killer to recognize who they are chasing, which is necessary for tunneling.
No map offerings are allowed, because the map is selected by organizers at the beginning. Hatch offerings are mandatory on any map that allows them (so none for indoor maps). And I'm not sure how you missed the unhooking/chest rules, since it's pretty much a staple in 90% of tournaments in order to reduce RNG. Dramaturgy seems to be banned as well, since it can heavily scew odds due to random chance.
Killers do have some perk restrictions sometimes (depends on the killer), such as banning certain slowdown combos to prevent dragging out the match, though by now most of such combos have been nerfed.
And Skull Merchant is usually banned as well. Go figure.
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@Cypherius said:
While i agree that he is overpowered and should be nerfed. I can guess i few reasons why the devs are reluctant:
Devs balance around stats and the average level of play and Blight is very hard to play. His controls are also harder on console. I imagine the average Blight player is not winning that often compared to other killers.
A lot of his power comes from addons, and reworking them all would take time.There might also be some technical reasons related to how his bumps and charges work.
He is probably being looked at but is not at the top of the priority list. 3 Gens and Sleep Merchant might be higher priorities.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3517191#Comment_3517191
One side having busted things does not justify the other side having busted things. Efficient survivors are very strong but that does not justify how strong Blight is.
The scenario you describe only applies to actual comp play. In regular high level matches you have a few more viable killers. Artist, Wesker, Singularity (Also hard to play but quite strong), Spirit, Huntress, and Oni. Plague too if she uses her best addons. These killers can do well in matchmaking despite being significantly weaker than Blight/Nurse.
"The scenario you describe only applies to actual comp play"
Wrong. You have a misconception about comp DBD.
Survivors aren't allowed to bring strong items or matching perks in comp, because tournament organizers see this game as being very survivor-sided and place harsh restrictions on what survivors can do.
In comp, survivors cannot have any repeating perks, any duplicate items, and any items/addons above yellow quality. They must also use different characters to make it easier for the killer to tunnel (tunneling is recognized as the staple strategy in comp). On top of that, they aren't allowed to open chests or try to unhook themselves without deliverance.
They also aren't allowed to bring any map/hook offerings and they must bring a hatch offering to make it easier for the killer to secure a 4k, if he can. Many survivor-sided maps, like Garden of Joy and Badham, are banned in comp. But killer-sided maps, such as Midwich and Dead Dawg, are usually allowed (depending on the killers).
You can, however, encounter full meta map offering SWF squads in public matches. They are almost as rare as hardcore Blight mains with strongest addons, but they do exist.
If anything, comp rules prove that the game is more survivor sided than most people think.
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@GannTM said:
If you use Blight’s add ons, you can’t complain about MFT.
When I use Blight's addons, I don't even need to complain about MFT. That 3% barely has an effect on him.
However, when you play weaker killers, like Legion, this perk hurts a whole lot.
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@Shroompy said:
Yes I can
Just like how if you use Blights add ons you can complain about Made for This
When I play Blight with compound 33, I literally don't care if the survivors have Made for This. So I don't need complain in that case.
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Since the new Buckle Up buff and MFT release, it has been +100% killer bonus all the time in my region.
Finding a match as survivor takes minutes, finding one as killer takes seconds.
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@Melinko said:
Just furthers the need for all survivors to have a basekit unbreakable. Would completely remove slugging from the game or cause the killer a lot of stress to slug all 4 and then have all 4 up and slug them again.
If we are going to give survivors basekit unbreakable, then we need to triple the number of hooks spawning on the map and remove pallet/flashlight saves.
Because most of the time killers slug because they cannot hook a survivor for one reason or another.
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Blight is a perfectly balanced killer.
If a Blight main with best addons plays against an equally skilled coordinated SWF bringing best items, there is a 50/50 chance of either side winning.
If Blight and Nurse were to be nerfed, the game would become too survivor sided. These two killers make the game more balanced.
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People defend the 3% haste with their lives, but then ask the only killers not affected by it (Nurse, Blight, Spirit) to be nerfed.
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Because hatch is a BS mechanic that punishes killer for winning the match and rewards survivors for losing. If the killer won before the final gen is repaired, he is entitled to a 4k.
Imagine if once 3 survivors escaped, the exit gates would be blocked and the final survivor would have to go looking for the hatch while the killer can kill them despite losing.
Even if you win the hatch race, the survivor still gets a chance to escape through the exit gates anyway. So the killer has to win 3 times: win the match, win the hatch and win the gates. Slugging for 4k bypasses than and allows the killer to secure the victory they deserve. If you don't like being slugged, just go on a break, it will only take 2-4 minutes.
Just because 3k increases MMR doesn't make it a win. 4k is required for challenges, adepts, emblems and bloodpoints.
With removal of hook grabs most killers don't even have a chance to secure 1 kill in the endgame, but survivors always have a chance to get 1 escape for free.
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DBD players are such whiners.
In any other game, you can die in under 30 seconds into the match and you will have no one but yourself to blame. You won't insult your opponent or call them low-skill for outplaying you too quickly.
In DBD, even if you are hard tunneled, you still get to play the game and you can still last a good few minutes. And yet DBD players always whine and blame their enemy when they die too quickly playing as the killable role.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3506251#Comment_3506251
And it's been explained to you that the devs have shown us the graphs where is shows not that many players are at "top MMR". Have a search yourself, it's on the forums.
"All I'm asking about is different tactical and efficient builds on varied killers."
You were? I thought you were just asking on builds good for tunnelling. Might need to change your title.
Yes, I am asking for good and efficient builds. Which are tunneling builds.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3506076#Comment_3506076
Because you only tunnel. Maybe youll have the same result by playing in any other manner. Then tunneling had nothing to do with it.
This post is incredible in its ridiculousness. Top mmr asking for advice? On something as simple as tunneling? Are you kidding?
@BillToLast is not a top player, to any new player in here. Dont think this is the norm. Anyone can just say 'im top mmr because i win a lot'. Watch.
I play Trapper and Im higher MMR than OP. Trust me, I am honest.
See? Easy. So this is just OP enjoying the firestorm that asking such a question would bring. Literally it. You're just being trolled.
"Trust me, I'm honest" 🤣
I ain't even bragging about my MMR dude, it's extremely easy for anyone to reach top MMR as killer due to how the system works.
You are the one shifting the discussion here and gloating about your trapper mmr. All I'm asking about is different tactical and efficient builds on varied killers.
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@Sava18 said:
People have this notion that mft is worthless vs blight. 3% can mean the difference between a regular flick and a shoulder flick which is game changing, it can also make a regular flick miss by inches. Yeah it overall means less but it is nowhere near useless.
Compound 33.
Blight is the fastest killer in the game, and even he has an addon to counter MFT.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3505989#Comment_3505989
A huge post that talks about how tunneling isn't always the most effective strategy, and that more often than not, just playing naturally nets you more kills consistently than tunneling does.
If it's not always the most effective strategy, then how did Momo7 achieve 1000 winstreak by tunneling out the first person he finds every single match?
If you are not too great at chase or face players far stronger than you, then tunneling can be ineffective and make you lose. But you would have likely lost these matches regardless.
If you are really good at 1v1 and can end chases very quickly against any player, then tunneling is the best strategy that skyrockets your chances to win. The goal is to get better at that 1v1 and tunneling helps with learning that.
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"But MFT requires skill to be used to its full potential, therefore it's ok if it's too strong."
So does Blight with Alchemist Ring.
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@StrangeGuy said:
Tbh, topics like this make me proud of myself because I don't ruin other people's game by tunneling (exception: toxic survivors) because I know how many people hate it.
You don't need builds. Just play as a Nurse. Easy 4k in every game because she is the best tunneler.
DBD is the only PVP game in the world where the community hates players for actually killing their opponents.
I don't want to only play Nurse/Blight, and it's overkill to tunnel with them anyway. But with weaker killers it can often be either essential or most reliable way to win.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3505608#Comment_3505608
Yeah, sorry. How silly of me. I forgot that literally every killer is in high MMR because you obviously get pushed so hard and nobody ever is wrong about something like that because everyone has perfected the art of calculating this invisible number. I myself recounted all decimal places of pi just this morning. Looks a lot like my MMR. Only without the dot. ;-)
I can say that I win more games than I lose but I'm under no illusion that I am some super high skilled top MMR killer or survivor. I reckon even most content creators are by far not as high up as they think. I believe I crossed the soft cap some time ago (a bit more than a year) because I played against someone who I believe is in MMR. But I can also say that my matches around the time have felt awful on every killer and it took quite a bit of me getting stomped until it felt normal again. Overall I couldn't care less about my MMR as long as my matches are enjoyable and that wasn't the case at the time.
The amount of hours someone has in this game is also not a reliable indicator for how good they actually are. Sometimes you play against people that have surprisingly few hours and they are incredibly good and other times you go against a legacy 3 Dwight with a bit more than 8k hours and are a bit disappointed because they are only an average player. Not bad but not super good either.
I have a bit more than 2k hours and I go against people with play times reaching from not even a thousand hours to 6k and beyond pretty frequently.
Bro, if you don't believe me, even Otz recently said that any mediocre killer can easily reach top MMR in a short amount of time.
Just think logically: If you win more games than you lose, you will inevitably hit the MMR cap regardless of your skill.
That's not even what the discussion is about. I am simply asking around about good tunneling builds with different killers.
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Pure skill issue on your end.
Tunneling is not toxic and is a valid strategy allowed by the rules of the game.
If you get tunneled a lot, just get better at chase instead of complaining about losing. Good survivors don't mind being tunneled.
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There are no "lower tactics". Tunneling and camping are valid and acceptable strategies. You aren't toxic for employing them.
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@stvnhthr said:
Ignorant post. The game is designed to be killer sided. Solo survivor is near impossible. The only time it is evenly matched is with a four man cooperative team. The game used to try to balance for solo que, now the developers only consider team play. It is a really terribly one sided game in the killers favor. Watch streams of the top survivor players, no one is getting out like they used to.
I watched the official community cups, and the survivors still won most of the games despite having heavy restrictions (no matching perks or items). Even against strong killers, like Nurse or Blight. So if anything, tournaments prove that the game is even more survivor-sided than normally perceived.
I win about 50% of my soloQ matches despite always running meme builds with Head On or Dramaturgy.
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The point is, you will consistently win against weak survivors regardless of how you play, so as the killer it is inevitable that you will reach the MMR where you don't yet belong. Every killer main will go through this, even if they play perkless trapper.
So saying that "tunneling and using NOED will make you go against better survivors" is practically a lie.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3504614#Comment_3504614
Yes, it's the most effective strategy for winning but that only applies to mid and low MMR. At high MMR, survivors play around this and will loop you for days while your gens go brrr.
A lot of people talk about how gens fly, so they need to tunnel but they never stop to consider what they're doing wrong. Remember, the survivors ultimate goal is to repair the generators. If you aren't defending your generators because you think a down is more valuable, you're playing the game wrong (At least in mid MMR anyway).
At low MMR, survivors will hide when they hear a terror radius. More competent survivors will see that you're busy chasing someone else and work on a generator that's only 12m away from your location. Tunneling won't make you better at the game. Against competent survivors, you'll find that you can lose two - three gens in the first chase, which means they looped you for over a minute.
Remember, it takes 90 seconds solo to repair a generator. Around 50 for two survivors. With a 2 - 1 Split, that's a total of 140 seconds. If the pair then moves onto another generator, they'll likely get halfway through that third generator by time you down them. At best, you walk away with 1 kill and three escapes.
Tunneling simply isn't fun because the game is balanced around survivors having three hook states and two health states. Tunneling sucks the fun out of the match for one person, and honestly, if that's how you want to play then you really should just move on to a different game instead of deriving your fun from ruining the experience for others. At the end of the day, you're playing against actual people and not bots.
Literally false. I play at max MMR (which is isn't hard to reach as killer), and every time I tunnel, my chances of winning increase by a lot. It is acknowleded by everyone, even the best players, that tunneling is the most efficient strategy. I track my matches and see that when I hard tunnel at 5 gens, my chances of winning or getting more kills increase dramatically.
1 less survivor means 1 less person repairing gens, 1 less person to open the exit gates, 1 less person bodyblocking or pallet/flashlight saving, 1 less person for hook rescues, 1 less to keep track of.
Momo7, the best Blight player in the world, achieved 1000 winsteak by hard tunneling 1 guy out every single match to turn it into a 3v1 as soon as possible. Does that mean that Momo is a weak player, since he has to resort to tunneling?
Anyone who says that tunneling is a bad strategy is simply on good-boy copium. If it was, nobody would be doing it and nobody would be complaining about it.