BillToLast
BillToLast
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@sulaiman said:
Tell me, did the No Limit -showcase involved matches with 4 random solo survivors? Because that is - as far as i know - still the majority of players. Or did it envolve high level swf?
The thing a lot of people dont understand is that swf and solo are 2 completly different experiences, and you cant balance the game around both. But instead of acting on that, the devs just try to balance killer in the middle between those 2 extremes, so i would agree that the game is swf-sided. But against average solo survivors? I dont think the game is in their favor.
Majority of killers don't play Blight or Nurse, your point?
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@I_CAME said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3504802#Comment_3504802
Bam there it is. You just acknowledged why DBD is not survivor sided and never will be. Killers who struggle to win consistently against randoms are just bad at the game. If killers were playing against Team Oracle every game then they'd have a real argument about DBD being survivor sided. 4 man SWF in particular is only like 3 percent of survivors to begin with. How many of them do you really think are esports caliber players? Every scenario about the game being survivor sided is hypothetical and does not reflect a typical match. "WELL IF YOU PLAY AGAINST FOUR SURVIVORS WHO ALL HAVE TEN THOUSAND HOURS AND MAKE NO MISTAKES THEN THE GAME IS SURVIVOR SIDED!"
also since we're talking about Otz : Otz said flat out on stream a month ago that the game is slightly killer sided for this very reason. He has also put out recent videos saying that the game does not actually massively favor either side and any advantages are very slight. People who genuinely believe that DBD is massively survivor sided are coping HARD.
"He has also put out recent videos saying that the game does not actually massively favor either side and any advantages are very slight"
Otz uses Blight with Compound 33 and the Nurse as examples there, which is literally what I'm saying. He specifically said that the game is fairly balanced when you play high tier killers (which everyone always asks to be nerfed).
If you play any killers weaker than Spirit/Wesker, the game is severely survivor sided, period. Just because most survivors are trash at the game doesn't mean they don't have inherent advantage.
You could make generators take 30 seconds to repair and give survivors 10 hook stages each, and the kill rates would still be above 50% thanks to dumb soloQ teammates. Weak solo teams are not indicative of the balance of the game.
Try playing Ghostface with his best addons and a meta perk build and go up against 4 survivors *of the same skill as you*, who all bring commodious toolboxes with extra charges and full meta builds. Unless they mess up majorly, you will lose and there is nothing you can do.
If you are playing Blight/Nurse/Spirit, then you have a fair chance against any team, even the ones that go full meta. And yet people always ask for these balanced killers to be nerfed. My argument is that the game is survivor sided unless you play the trio.
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Obviously this was sarcasm, but how difficult is it for the devs to actually tell me if my report even did anything?
That's the same reason why a cheater can play 1000 matches before getting banned. People don't bother submitting a report that won't do anything or even give them any outcome feedback.
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Nurse and Blight are perfectly balanced killers. They are the only ones able to challenge meta survivor teams with busted toolboxes.
If you think Nurse is uncounterable, it's purely a skill issue on your end.
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How do you beat this
You don't.
May as well stop playing Doc and other low-tier killers until this perk is nerfed, which won't be anytime soon.
Knowing BHVR, this perk will probably receive a slight nerf in 5 years after it reaches 90% pick rate. Until then, learn Nurse or switch to survivor.
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Not enough killers are playing right now. I guess many of them quit after having to deal with MFT + Hope, the new Buckle Up + FTP combo and majorly buffed survivor basekit, which all make playing most of the killer roster unenjoyable and frustrating.
Enjoy the new queue times until MFT is nerfed and killers can once again have a fair chance playing anyone other than just Nurse and Blight.
I personally don't have fun playing M1 killers anymore, since trying to win with them is an uphill battle, while survivors have an easy time.
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@thisislastyearsmodel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3504614#Comment_3504614
I mean... which killers do you play though? If you tunnel on Trapper and Clown, sure, I understand. But if you're playing Spirit and Wesker every game and still "have" to tunnel then uh... well...
I play almost all of them, usually Artist, Blight, Nurse, Ghostface, Pinhead, Pyramid Head, Wraith, Nemesis, Wesker, Knight, Plague, Legion, Bubba and Myers. Planning to level up Pig, Hag and Singularity soon, maybe even buy Onryo in the future.
I find chases to be the most fun part about the game, and tunneling efficiently lets me focus purely on that aspect while also having a better chance to win.
I play about 30% survivor as well, and for me personally tunneling is fun on both sides. As killer I can get one person out and have a more enjoyable match, and as a survivor I don't have to sit on gens and can instead focus on improving my loops, while having all of the resources available on the map.
I really cannot see why so many people think that tunneling isn't fun. I can understand hating camping and slugging, since you are doing nothing, but tunneling means more chases and more action.
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As an example, let's say you're playing Huntress with her best addons and a meta build against the survivors who also brought the strongest stuff they can, with the best toolboxes and meta builds on everyone.
Huntress is considered a very strong character and both teams have brought the best stuff they can.
Yet, if the survivors are of the same skill as you, you are practically guaranteed to lose in this situation. Unless they make huge mistakes, you probably won't even get 2 kills, if any at all.
In Community Cups sponsored by BHVR, survivors had very restricted loadouts: no matching perks, no matching skins, no matching items and only up to yellow quality.
Whoever makes the rules of the tournaments recognizes that the game is very survivor sided and requires placing restrictions on the survivors. And yet, survivors still win vast majority of tournament matches (with 3+ people escaping).
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Clarification that I need to make. You can still win most of your games as killer, but only for 1 simple reason:
Most survivor players in the game are low skill or have mixed priorities. And if you go up against a soloQ team, there is a 4x higher chance that at least one of them will be low skill.
Hens333 said that what makes an SWF team strong is not communication/discord. It's the fact that you have 4 good players with the winning mindset on the same team.
If all 4 survivors are as equally good as the killer, and the latter is not playing Nurse/Blight/Spirit with best addons, the survivors will have the win given to them for free.
The reason killers win most of their matches and can get good winstreaks is because most survivor teams are inefficient on generators. They will do dull totems, complete their glyph challenges, mess around and still have a chance to succeed.
I've had matches where I sacrificed all 4 survivors at 5 gens as Ghostface (without tunneling/camping), because they were not doing generators.
I've had matches that I lost as the Nurse despite getting a hook stage every 20 seconds, simply because the survivors were very gen efficient on a very large map.
Survivor gen efficiency determines the outcome of the match, and *good* survivors are almost guaranteed to win by default against anyone but the trio.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3504616#Comment_3504616
Cheating is against game rules. Do you even know what you are talking about? Imagine comparing legal perk with cheating.
You completely missed my point, so I will make it easier for you to understand. The point is, survivor mains say that this is a "fun" perk, simply because it makes them stronger without having to do anything. It doesn't require any skill, timing or preparation. You simply receive a number boost that makes your character stronger.
Saying that "Made For This is a fun perk" is pure coping. It's a crutch perk that makes less skilled players look better, and more skilled players almost unstoppable. It's the same as saying that Brutal Strength is a fun and engaging perk. All it does is increase a number permanently, to give you a slight edge that you wouldn't otherwise have.
And I'm saying this as someone who uses Made For This with Resilience all the time when I play survivor. These are very strong boring perks that I use purely to increase my chance of winning.
A fun build for me as a survivor is Head On with Flashbang. Not as strong of a combo, but more fun than "you are now 3% stronger thanks to a single perk".
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@I_CAME said:
People complaining when nearly everything killers have complained about has already been nerfed. It's just trolling at this point
- Every objective metric shows that the game is slightly killer sided on average. Both third party and official statistics.
- Dead Hard - dead
- Decisive Strike - dead
- Circle of Healing - dead
- Iron Will - dead
- Prove Thyself - dead
- BNP - dead
- Gens - longer
- Self Healing - heavily nerfed
- Numerous survivor sided maps - heavily reworked to make them less survivor sided
I don't even know what people want anymore. They've addressed almost every killer complaint and people still whine. What is even left other than toolboxes and maybe a few maps? Both of which have been partially addressed with the BNP change and map reworks. At some point it becomes a git gud issue. As killer you can literally dodge an infinite amount of lobbies and shop for an easy match due to how killers are able to see prestiges, hours, etc. The game is as easy as you want it to be as killer.
Literally wrong. A bunch of ungrounded complaints from a survivor main.
- 60% killrate is what the devs are aiming for and it takes into consideration that the survivor team is 4x more likely to make a blunder that costs them the match. Therefore, if both sides are equally strong, the killer is 4 times as likely to win.
- Dead Hard is still a strong and viable perk that pairs well with MFT and Balanced Landing, and now the killers won't even wait it out.
- Decisive Strike is a decent perk, as long as you use it correctly and go down near a good tile. It requires skill to use and isn't a free win if the killer has to tunnel.
- COH is still a very strong perk, especially after they increased the altruistic healing bonus. You can set up a safe reset area for the entire team for a single perk slot.
- Iron Will is still fine and completely prevents you from being heard inside lockers while injured.
- Prove Thyself nerf doesn't mean much, because doubling up on gens is a bad idea to begin with.
- BNPs are even stronger than before and can counter most regression perks, watch Otzdarva's explanation.
- Gens take 10 seconds more, meanwhile all passive regression perks have been gutted severely.
- Self Healing is heavily nerfed and that is a good thing. Survivors are meant to work as a team, not be 1 man armies.
- Coldwind maps have been reworked from being extremely survivor sided to being slightly survivor sided.
Your post proves that survivor main opinions are ignorant of the experience of the other side.
Killers have taken many severe nerfs with the last 5 patches:
- COB and Overcharge both massively gutted, making them completely worthless even in dedicated builds. COB is now straight up a much much weaker version of Surveillance.
- PainRes nerfed. It's still good, but is a lot weaker and less reliable.
- Survivor basekit massively buffed with fast vault changes.
- Killer basekit nerfed with hook grab removal, guaranteeing an easy trade that most killers cannot prevent. Even team Eternal complained about it being too easy for them now.
- Survivors received very powerful A- and S-tier perks:
- Made For This gives you passive speed boost with no skill required, Scavenger gives potentially infinite toolbox charges, Troubleshooter is an all-round good team perk, Plot Twist can let you force the killer into a lose-lose situation, new Buckle Up can be paired with FTP to make survivors literally unstoppable with no counter from the killer.
- Killers received trash or very niche perks:
- Genetic Limits is garbage, as explained by Otzdarva, Forced Hesitation is decent, but not strong enough to justify a perk slot outside of slug builds, and Machine Learning is so useless I had to actually look at the wiki right now to see what it was even called.
For context, I play both sides almost equally, but I have much easier time when playing survivor, even in soloQ.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3504316#Comment_3504316
I am really so happy BHVR did not listen these complains and killed unpopular perk. MfT is fun perk but it's far away being op. And obviously it's not meta as well.
*Gives a flat stat boost with no input or skill from the player, making it miserable against M1 killers* = "Fun perk"
Sprint Burst can be considered a fun perk, Head On is a very fun perk and Dead Hard was arguably fun to use.
Made for This is a basic stat boost that simply makes the survivor stronger. That's it.
If that is your definition of fun, you may as well use cheats and give yourself a massive advantage with little skill required. That's also fun, right?
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@Depressedlegion said:
Why do you want to tunnel though?
It's most efficient strategy that significantly increases the chance to win, simple as that.
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The perk is fine. It's a crutch perk that makes the killer's blindness perks/addons much more useful.
Any blindness effect completely disables WoO, making survivors expose their lack of skill or map knowledge.
Map design and huge number of safe/god pallets are the problems.