Please consider reviewing japan law again for auric cells, only DbD has expiration for currency

PvP games like Apex legends, gacha games like genshin, PvE/MMO games like warframe, or even steam wallet, all of those things have currency that can be purchased through real money(apex coin, paid jewels, platinum, and "wallet"), but LITERALLY none of those have expiration date like this game has

Maybe something has changed in laws, or BHVR is misunderstanding the way it works, I don't know, but I'm 100% sure auric cell doesn't need to have expiration date if all those other games doesn't need to (unless japan has a law specifically targeted towards a country BHVR is in), so please consider reviewing it again with whatever internal lawyer or something

Comments

  • @Neaxolotl said:

    PvP games like Apex legends, gacha games like genshin, PvE/MMO games like warframe, or even steam wallet, all of those things have currency that can be purchased through real money(apex coin, paid jewels, platinum, and "wallet"), but LITERALLY none of those have expiration date like this game has

    Maybe something has changed in laws, or BHVR is misunderstanding the way it works, I don't know, but I'm 100% sure auric cell doesn't need to have expiration date if all those other games doesn't need to (unless japan has a law specifically targeted towards a country BHVR is in), so please consider reviewing it again with whatever internal lawyer or something

    They have a date on which they expire? How long does this take? Literally didn't see it ever and I'm playing since sometime 2021 xD

  • @KatsuhxP said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/444526/please-consider-reviewing-japan-law-again-for-auric-cells-only-dbd-has-expiration-for-currency

    They have a date on which they expire? How long does this take? Literally didn't see it ever and I'm playing since sometime 2021 xD

    It's country specific I think, and it's rather short

    The thing is, BHVR said japan law disallow currency to stay forever in games, but nearly every single one of other games in japan has paid currency, yet none of those have any expiration date like that, there must be some misconception

  • How long is the expiration date?

  • @Callahan9116 said:

    How long is the expiration date?

    6 months, not even an year

  • That's absurd!!! Do you have any communications about them saying why this is the case?

  • @Callahan9116 said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3922751#Comment_3922751

    That's absurd!!! Do you have any communications about them saying why this is the case?

    As I said already, their reasoning was "japan law", so fair amount of request to change it has been denied, but I don't believe that is accurate when any other games has similar paid only currency, paid/in-game earned currency, and outright alternative to real money without any expiration date at all

  • @Neaxolotl said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3922735#Comment_3922735

    It's country specific I think, and it's rather short

    The thing is, BHVR said japan law disallow currency to stay forever in games, but nearly every single one of other games in japan has paid currency, yet none of those have any expiration date like that, there must be some misconception

    Ah I see. Well I live in germany so I can't imagine it expire here, germany is pretty consumer friendly in general xD

  • Do those laws have anything to do with how the auroc cells are acquired? Maybe it matters in Japan if it's bought through the game's store or not? Or if they come from the rift?

  • @Neaxolotl said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3922752#Comment_3922752

    As I said already, their reasoning was "japan law", so fair amount of request to change it has been denied, but I don't believe that is accurate when any other games has similar paid only currency, paid/in-game earned currency, and outright alternative to real money without any expiration date at all

    To be clear, are we accusing BHVR of lying and its not actually against Japanese law, or are we accusing these other games companies of breaking Japanese law?

    Cause the difference is quite important... and the details of the law are also quite important, because I don't think we can reasonably ask BHVR to break the law in those countries, even if the law isn't enforced.

  • Doing some quick googling I see this is true for Helldivers and Bethesda games as well, so it definitely seems to be true. I also see people on Apex forums complaining about expiring currency in the Japan region, but I've never played the game so I don't know more about that.

    Seems that if the currency exceeds six months Japan's taxing authorities need to be involved, so companies avoid that by having the currency expire (which seems to be the goal of the legislation).

  • @UndeddJester said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3922754#Comment_3922754

    To be clear, are we accusing BHVR of lying and its not actually against Japanese law, or are we accusing these other games companies of breaking Japanese law?

    Cause the difference is quite important... and the details of the law are also quite important, because I don't think we can reasonably ask BHVR to break the law in those countries, even if the law isn't enforced.

    More like I'm thinking there would be whatever method to not break the law while achieving practically similar goal as auric cells, not saying they are lying or breaking the law

  • @crogers271 said:

    Doing some quick googling I see this is true for Helldivers and Bethesda games as well, so it definitely seems to be true. I also see people on Apex forums complaining about expiring currency in the Japan region, but I've never played the game so I don't know more about that.

    Seems that if the currency exceeds six months Japan's taxing authorities need to be involved, so companies avoid that by having the currency expire (which seems to be the goal of the legislation).

    Well that's strange, my coins haven't been expired since forever, perhaps it has to do with acquiring it through battlepass or something

    @JPLongstreet said:

    Do those laws have anything to do with how the auroc cells are acquired? Maybe it matters in Japan if it's bought through the game's store or not? Or if they come from the rift?

    Maybe, but this game will grants expiration date regardless of acquisition method

  • @Neaxolotl said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3923047#Comment_3923047

    More like I'm thinking there would be whatever method to not break the law while achieving practically similar goal as auric cells, not saying they are lying or breaking the law

    Ah gotcha, fair play, objection withdrawn ๐Ÿ˜

    Also thanks to @crogers271 for the leg work I was too lazy to do xD

  • @Neaxolotl said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3923075#Comment_3923075

    Well that's strange, my coins haven't been expired since forever, perhaps it has to do with acquiring it through battlepass or something

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3923035#Comment_3923035

    Maybe, but this game will grants expiration date regardless of acquisition method

    Well that's strange, my coins haven't been expired since forever, perhaps it has to do with acquiring it through battlepass or something

    So if I'm reading the law correctly (which goes off a translation, I'm not a lawyer, and I'm just skimming):

    Japan's Payment Services Act is meant to regulate financial transactions and prepaid services (putting money into one thing then to use it for another thing). Numerous exceptions apply, such as bus passes, but Virtual Currencies are specifically named as subject to the act.

    Now the idea is to protect consumers (though like laws in lots of countries it might accomplish the opposite). The law also has provisions that if the business ceases operations, they need to refund customers for existing virtual currency, though I suspect that is harder in practice than in reality. (compared to most countries where a company could shut down immediately and you'd be left with a lawsuit over fraud)

    Its not that the law mandates virtual currencies expire at six months, however if the currency lasted longer than that it would make BHVR and their customers subject to a lot of reporting requirements that neither likely wants to deal with.

    As for your cells, if you never paid for it, it's not an issue. As I said its not about all virtual currency, just those that have been paid for.

  • @crogers271 said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3923204#Comment_3923204

    Well that's strange, my coins haven't been expired since forever, perhaps it has to do with acquiring it through battlepass or something

    So if I'm reading the law correctly (which goes off a translation, I'm not a lawyer, and I'm just skimming):

    Japan's Payment Services Act is meant to regulate financial transactions and prepaid services (putting money into one thing then to use it for another thing). Numerous exceptions apply, such as bus passes, but Virtual Currencies are specifically named as subject to the act.

    Now the idea is to protect consumers (though like laws in lots of countries it might accomplish the opposite). The law also has provisions that if the business ceases operations, they need to refund customers for existing virtual currency, though I suspect that is harder in practice than in reality. (compared to most countries where a company could shut down immediately and you'd be left with a lawsuit over fraud)

    Its not that the law mandates virtual currencies expire at six months, however if the currency lasted longer than that it would make BHVR and their customers subject to a lot of reporting requirements that neither likely wants to deal with.

    As for your cells, if you never paid for it, it's not an issue. As I said its not about all virtual currency, just those that have been paid for.

    So I suppose maybe rift cells could not have expiration date? wish it to be changed like that