Slugging For The 4K - An Exaggerated Problem?
TL/DR: Better to waste 4 minutes while people bleed out while 1 hides than 20+ minutes because that 1 got someone up/unhooked and now I've got 2 hiding…or even just being annoying while teabagging me from hatch.
Now, slugging sucks. Don't get me wrong. It would be awesome to just send survivors to the hook, but it's not how the game is designed.
Bleeding everyone out to be a jerk shouldn't be a thing and it seems to be on the radar to be fixed, but it's hard to do this in a way that doesn't break the already tenuous balance of the game. A 'bleed out' button would help but also opens yet another avenue to quit penalty free which we don't need.
The contentious point seems to be slugging survivors 'for the 4k', essentially leaving 1-3 people slugged while looking for the last person in order to secure a decisive victory.
Yes, it's a nasty thing to do and not something I'll engage in unless the other side are BM.
However…when I play survivor, I'd say maybe half my annoyance is at the killer and half my annoyance is at that last survivor sitting in a bush somewhere.
Nothing is stopping that last survivor from just conceding up rather than stalemating the game and wasting everyone's time further. At best, you have a slim chance at hatch, while the other survivors sit there and rot. You're just as responsible. Let's all just go next.
I think there's also more pressure on the killer to 'win' than survivors, due to just how much survivors seem to enjoy gloating and rubbing an escape in (there is a reason why 'just leave' is a meme).
So yeah. It's one of those things. If it's between playing a bit mean and not getting gloated at or having my time wasted further, just call me Mr. Mean.
Comments
not survive.. escape, but by hiding and doing nothing youre not going anywhere…you're just wasting everyone's time
ok.. so you're stalling, wasting so much time on doing nothing and it's ok but slugging one guy to finish game is bad thing and toxic.. okay, okay i think i understand now how sad survivors are.
if you have to hide and waste 10 or more minutes to have 50% chance on hatch (50/50, you find it before killer of killer before you) because your team WITH YOU couldn't complete gens then you already lost this game and now you're just stalling. and again HOW IS SLUGGING FOR 4K NOT PLAYING GAME? because you obviously ignored that question.. like others
if i don't see one surv whole game it's obvious he is not playing and just hiding somewhere. especially when killer doesn't even have terror radius so surv can't hide before killer come closer and see scratch marks
@alpha5 hey, like this one too? XD
Well if they're staying in one place then you should be able to find them pretty easy by searching the map~ They are playing the "hiding" part of "hide and seek". Know that game? You say the survivors job is completing gens and escaping. Your half right, it ONLY escaping (unless they got some other definition for winning), does not matter how. Because the killer slugged that 3rd, if there's more than 1 gen or if the killer is guarding said slug, then the best way to complete their job is to wait for the slug to die.
Gonna be honest here, we have absolutely no idea how you reached for that logic. Soooo hows slugging everyone equal to slugging for the 4k? If nothing else we'd think it would be longer than slugging for the 4k. Waiting 1 survivor to bleed vs 3 to bleed. Not even touching the heavy details here. Care to explain or you just shouting into the fog random things?
Rulebreaker is a shared account by 3 of us. We say "whatever reason because they were literally listed and we didn't feel like posting each and every detail ohh venerable wisebutt.
So let's see if we understand this correct. It's still a 2v1, the killer had the 3rd at their mercy but chose not to "for whatever reason" hook, got the 4th, lost the 3rd due to incompetence or stupidity depending on what you want to call it (as the killer had that one at their mercy previously) and was bled out, which then causes survivors to complain about the 4k and people who then try to shift all the blame onto them due to not playing how the killer wanted...we'll let you think on how many mistakes are here and if you want us to actually explain everything but personally I'd want a drink first (probably the other 2 as well).
You're not slugging to finish the game, you're slugging to drag it out. If you hooked that survivor, you'd be finishing the game.
I'm just saying that slugging wastes 4min while looking for the last survivor, that's the bit survivors don't like, wasting time when they could kill 3rd. Killers don't like the bit where they have to look for 2 hiding survivors wasting time. Depends how badly the killer wants the 4k if they want to wait it out or try looking for them and getting the match over with quicker. It's not great but at that point if killer wants the 4k and survivors want the hatch then it's a stand off that both sides have to endure. Pointless hiding if killer is that determined to wait it out tho. This point to this post I believe was due to survivors complaining of killers slugging the 3rd for the 4k because they know the 4th is hiding so need time to find them. Is it an exaggerated problem? I would say so especially when killers slug for 4min and not wait it out
The only time I'll mass slug is to finish the game.
But you don't understand. Killers trying to secure their win are evil and survivors who hold games hostage until the server shuts down are just trying to survive. Even though they die when the server shuts down. Only one side is allowed to be upset when their time is wasted because reasons.
If it wasn't for how miserably the win conditions are defined in this game, I feel like people would have a bit more empathy for the other side in this situation. As it stands, survivors will always bemoan that "3 kills is a win, anything more is just being greedy" while killers will complain that "Survivors refuse to accept defeat since they're not dead yet."
Both issues would be fixed if the hatch was changed to a scenario where neither side could stall and the fate of the 4th would be decided by earning it rather than just chance. But unfortunately everyone would rather blame each other than admit the scenario is fueled by both sides being stubborn.
Exactly what I been saying lol I get it that survivors want to escape if possible and as hatch is part of the game and they prepare for it. But killers want 4k if it's possible so hatch being the way it is, they prepare for it. Killers don't want to wait out the game looking for hidden survivors, like survivors don't to be slugged while killer looks for 4th.
The main issue recently seems to be directed at slugging for the 4k not hiding until server ends which are both related to the hatch. I can openly say as killer I will be as stubborn as the survivors and wait it out to get the 4k because at that point waiting for the hatch that will never appear is pointless. But doing that "checkmate" move really does get people worked up.
i thought Chess Merchant was very boring to vs. exactly because matches were prolonged into oblivion this way, how exactly does basekit UB for last 2 survs change anything for the better?
Only if killers continue to slug for the 4k despite basekit UB. Which would make it exactly the same as it already is.
Came back to do some event challenges. Have been bled out or slugged for 2+ minutes in 5/6 games. Definitely doesn't happen a lot. Definitely overblown. I'm currently sitting here being bled out by a Pig on RPD.
Only now killers that don't slug for the 4k are going to suffer, and unhookable squads are going to be impossible to deal with.
And before you say 'oh that's rare'…remember the Boil Over buff patch?
Shudders.
How do you hook a survivor with Boil Over who sits up in the (not going to specify for obvious reasons) on Ormond with Boil Over?
Previously, you'd just slug them.
They added a hook in the place you're talking about, there isn't anywhere on Ormond where you can't get to a hook even with Boil over
They did? I'll have to check but I'm pretty sure they didn't. Not going into details but it's a back room in main structure where, if you have BO, you absolutely cannot be hooked, especially if there's a bodyblock.
They've been doing a really good job of putting second floor hooks in buildings that used to be unhookable
It's the two rooms over the bar, right? Next to the long balcony?
Yeah. Huh, was not aware they fixed that. I'll have to check the DDS and Asylum spot (back rooms of main structure and unhookable spot between the double lockers if you go down just right respectively).
what whe? XD youre alone bro
how is it dragging out ?? he is gonna die soon or sooner, that one slugged is not left to bleed out but to not let last one escape. how is it dragging out
so you're accusing me of assumptions but then youre the one that is assuming things.
Because a bleed-out takes 4 minutes, versus a hook stage taking 70 seconds + Allowing the survivor to end the game early. You're literally stalling for time.
Ya know we were expecting some idiotic ranting...not sure whether to be proud or disappointed
Well to be honest I think people are wishing I just slugged them for the 4k now lol when 2 go into hiding I just wait it out and they eventually come out of hiding or they both die when server ends. Problem solved, they don't get slugged and I get my 4k even if it it takes longer than it should. Compare that to 4min bleed out... I know what I would prefer as a survivor.
1 match there was a 2 person swf left, they both were saying they knew they couldn't win so wanted to hide until server ends "to be annoying". With this sort of attitude is there really any wonder why people slug and don't care if it's wasting survivors time? 🤷♂️ Not annoying to me because I had full intentions of waiting it out anyway and I got my 4k.
With this sort of attitude is there really any wonder why people slug and don't care if it's wasting survivors time?This is just a chicken and egg scenario on what came first. You can say that you are slugging because otherwise they hide out, and the survivors can say they hide out because the killer is going to slug.
That doesn't make sense, because the key difference is the killer slugs for 4min to achieve 4k while these survivors that hide for a lot longer "to be annoying" knowing it's certain death if the killer waits it out. Regardless of who started it, not slugging and waiting it out seems to work fine. They can hide as long as they like and not be slugged. Still check mate because killer will get 4k in the end if they really want it.
Do you expect empathy from survivors for the plight of the killer main when they advocate for anti-camp, tunnel or slug measures?
Not at all, it's survivors that have the biggest issue with being slugged for the 4k and any type of slugging. I'm just saying they should be grateful the killer is slugging them for 4min instead of doing what I do which is not slug and wait it out.
So when there's two survivors left, you purposefully stop playing?
Are you just fishing to get banned?
slugging for 4k is literally a problem forced by another problem, decision to punish it literally means full ignorance for the absolute RNG game aspect called hatch. Hatch was and will always will be the #1 and biggest reason why killers slug for 4k
And deciding to slug for a 4k because of hatch is an ego problem.
The same could be said about teabagging by exits but that can be ended in a max of 5.4 seconds with 2 basic attacks so there's less of an urgent need to address it.
Not at all, I play the game as normal. I patrol gens as the game suggests the killer do. If survivors are hiding avoiding gens that's on them but I'm still playing the game.
@alpha5 No I'm doing exactly as the in game advice says, patrol gens as the best way to find survivors. If they want to hide instead of engaging in the PvP that's on them.
Yeah, but sometimes I'm just not in the right headspace to eat 1000 teabags and 'hey have a free hit…NOT' jukes to BM.
Why can't survivors just leave?
Because there's arses on the survivor side too.
We recommend learning to use snug, he heavily punishes those types of survivors.
yeah for sure I hate it too, I always make sure to call out my random teammates when they teabag in exit gates (unless I personally saw the killer do something super BM beforehand). it's almost always a survivor who did nothing all game, too, so it's really easy to call them out on it. hate survivors that do that. i personally only ever stay in gate when the killer's nearby if i think it'll give my teammates time to reset
i was just preemptively trying to head off the comparison between bleedout slugging and teabagging at an exit because although they're both BM and rude they're very different as far as core mechanics go
So you're not actually 'waiting it out' at all.
It would be awesome to have a doggo on my Hag but I don't think it's in the cards.
Well I'm not looking for them, so in a way I am waiting it out. Waiting for them to come out of hiding while I patrol gens. At some point people will realise hiding doesn't accomplish anything. Doesn't get them the hatch, doesn't get them the escape.
My response to this…vanished for some reason, but short version:
Yet sometimes hiding does get us that door or hatch. So where's that leave us?
An essential component in a vicious cycle.
The same place that 3 Genning before the kick limit had us. Then the kick limit was introduced to prevent that scenario of boring the opponents into submission over a long period of time. This is why many people's answer to the hide and seek dilemma would be for crows to become present when survivors go a significant period of time without making any progress on gens.
If survivors end up escaping after a 30+ minute stalemate, its most likely because the killer would rather leave the match than wait out the server shutdown and instead just let them go. Excessive 3 genning and excessive hiding are two sides of the same coin, but one will seemingly never be addressed.
Edit: narrowing down specifically to the slug for 4k scenario, both sides would react to the scenario in more healthy ways if the hatch was earned, instead of RNG. You can blame sore winners as much as sore losers for that.
It only does when the killer kills the 3rd. But if the 3rd is alive then hiding doesn't do anything. So when both hide it accomplishes nothing. I been playing it that way for about a week, want to know how many have escaped via hatch by hiding? 0. I have had many complaints about it but 🤷♂️ they are the ones hiding.
Confirmation: You are talking about 2 survivors hiding forever or the slugging for the 4k? We may have accidently blended your conversation with someone else.
We gonna hold off on this one cause we may have accidently responded under the wrong thing
Specifically talking about hiding forever, like I said if 3rd is alive, hatch doesn't spawn. Make what you will of that lol
Yeah, there's an auto filter that sometimes auto-removes posts. Not sure what the criteria is but there you have it
I think it's what's known as a positive-feedback loop. Killers sweat and BM, which leads to negative survivor attitudes, which leads to survivors sweating and BMing, which leads to negative killer attitudes, which leads to killers sweating and BM'ing, etc. Which side started it? Whose fault is it? It doesn't matter, because both sides are doing it now, and the best thing you can do is try to break the cycle (or just not play if it gets too much for you).
Definitely agree with you on the third point.
Since that helps little: If 2 are alive and hiding forever then yes it wont help, if 2 are alive and 1 has been slugged then no hiding helps.
Exactly, so answer is don't slug right?