Knight's ghosts idea

stvnhthr

Would it not make more sense to be able to stun the Knight's ghosts with pallets and also make it so you can block their hits with deadhard?

Knight is getting a lot of play, and it is not much fun as it just makes the games really long with constant running back and forth across the map, sort of like Legion on steroids.

Games would be sped up, more fun, and higher scoring if the ghosts were treated sort of like Nemesis' zombies. You could stop a ghost chase with a pallet drop or block a hit with dh to make it a better playing experience.

wydyadoit

@stvnhthr said:

Would it not make more sense to be able to stun the Knight's ghosts with pallets and also make it so you can block their hits with deadhard?

Knight is getting a lot of play, and it is not much fun as it just makes the games really long with constant running back and forth across the map, sort of like Legion on steroids.

Games would be sped up, more fun, and higher scoring if the ghosts were treated sort of like Nemesis' zombies. You could stop a ghost chase with a pallet drop or block a hit with dh to make it a better playing experience.

honestly - my instinct was that they were pathable nemesis zombies that get blocked by pallets and such. nope.

they're kinda just moving damage zones. which i guess makes sense if they're ghosts 🤷🏻‍♂️

CosmicParagon

Knight is already the weakest Killer in the game besides MAYBE Trapper, he definitely does not need nerfs

stvnhthr

@CosmicParagon said:

Knight is already the weakest Killer in the game besides MAYBE Trapper, he definitely does not need nerfs

Just wait, open maps with few loops or windows and a skilled Knight killer is torture. You are lucky if you think Knight is nearly as bad as Trapper. You have not met the new breed of Knight Killer with four Gen blocking perks.

Alionis

@stvnhthr said:

Would it not make more sense to be able to stun the Knight's ghosts with pallets and also make it so you can block their hits with deadhard?

Knight is getting a lot of play, and it is not much fun as it just makes the games really long with constant running back and forth across the map, sort of like Legion on steroids.

Games would be sped up, more fun, and higher scoring if the ghosts were treated sort of like Nemesis' zombies. You could stop a ghost chase with a pallet drop or block a hit with dh to make it a better playing experience.

Games speeding up = good for survivors, not killers

Games would become more fun. More fun to whom? Survivors? Thought so, because the killer's fun is apparently not worth taking into consideration.

Games would become higher scoring. Again, higher scoring for whom? Definitely not the killer if your changes make guard hits even less common.

Carth

I'm pretty sure you can block his knights with dead hard? As far as I know there's nothing special about their attacks that would make them immune to dead hard

sizzlingmario4

DH already does work against guards. Completely uncounterable if the survivor does it correctly.

Witchubtet

The guards already have three ways to be disengaged. Unhooks, The Standard, and holding the W key until you reach a window and just vault. It slows down all the guards. Throwing pallets especially with the buff going to AMN is going way too far. It’s not bad that he slows down the game not every killer needs to feel like they should have to set up so the survivors get free points off gens.

stvnhthr

@sizzlingmario4 said:

DH already does work against guards. Completely uncounterable if the survivor does it correctly.

What do you mean? If you deadhard and they hit you it counts as a blocked hit but you still go down. You get teh points but not the protection, how is that of benefit?

Chocolate_Cosmos

@stvnhthr said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344501#Comment_3344501

What do you mean? If you deadhard and they hit you it counts as a blocked hit but you still go down. You get teh points but not the protection, how is that of benefit?

It seems like you need more game time againts this Killer instead of asking for nerfs on allready not so great Killer. If you are using dead hard and it doesn't work for you, then you are doing something wrong, sorry.

Blinckx

@stvnhthr said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344501#Comment_3344501

What do you mean? If you deadhard and they hit you it counts as a blocked hit but you still go down. You get teh points but not the protection, how is that of benefit?

This may happen only with the Assassin because of deep wound, other guards do not inflict deep wounds.

So basically you're running while in DW due the assassin's stab, the knight spawn another guard and yeah you can not use DH, but that's the same for Legion or Slinger

Also, the Knight is the only killer for god know why reason who has a buff to survivor built in his own power, if you pick up the banner, you have a speed boost and endurance.

stvnhthr

@Blinckx said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3348696#Comment_3348696

This may happen only with the Assassin because of deep wound, other guards do not inflict deep wounds.

So basically you're running while in DW due the assassin's stab, the knight spawn another guard and yeah you can not use DH, but that's the same for Legion or Slinger

Also, the Knight is the only killer for god know why reason who has a buff to survivor built in his own power, if you pick up the banner, you have a speed boost and endurance.

I've never seen anyone pick up the banner, it is not really an option in actual gameplay.

MoNosEmpire

@stvnhthr said:

Would it not make more sense to be able to stun the Knight's ghosts with pallets and also make it so you can block their hits with deadhard?

Knight is getting a lot of play, and it is not much fun as it just makes the games really long with constant running back and forth across the map, sort of like Legion on steroids.

Games would be sped up, more fun, and higher scoring if the ghosts were treated sort of like Nemesis' zombies. You could stop a ghost chase with a pallet drop or block a hit with dh to make it a better playing experience.

They need to make it so jumping in a locker despawns the ghost lol

stvnhthr

@MoNosEmpire said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/364516/knights-ghosts-idea

They need to make it so jumping in a locker despawns the ghost lol

That would be too easy. You want a solution which is fair to both survivors and killers. Deadhard is not run by everyone so making it a solution to block ghost hits would not be OP. Since it is taking up a perk slot it should be a useful perk against any hit, not just the main killer. It works on Nemesis zombies, why not Knight's ghosts?

MoNosEmpire

@stvnhthr said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3348743#Comment_3348743

That would be too easy. You want a solution which is fair to both survivors and killers. Deadhard is not run by everyone so making it a solution to block ghost hits would not be OP. Since it is taking up a perk slot it should be a useful perk against any hit, not just the main killer. It works on Nemesis zombies, why not Knight's ghosts?

I think forcing players to use deadhard to counter the knight would cause a spike in deadhard's pickrate and make being a killer more frustrating because they will have to expect it even more.

not_requested49

@stvnhthr said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3348743#Comment_3348743

That would be too easy. You want a solution which is fair to both survivors and killers. Deadhard is not run by everyone so making it a solution to block ghost hits would not be OP. Since it is taking up a perk slot it should be a useful perk against any hit, not just the main killer. It works on Nemesis zombies, why not Knight's ghosts?

Because zombies are meant to be stupid lol

At least the more "common" ones anyway, which is what we have

YOURFRIEND

@Defend said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/364516/knights-ghosts-idea

100%, I've always wanted a counter to his anti-loop. Yes he has counters such as dead hard, unhook and banner. But not everyone brings DH, not every situation revolves around a unhook and a Knight who knows how to anti-loop doesn't give banner as an option.

I would like the guards to be treated similar to nemesis zombies IF the patrol path is shorter than 10 meters. I always want long-distance patrols to be incentivized while the "plop-n'-go" strategy to be punished more. There's a few buffs that The Knight needs in general (such as addon dependency and weaker high rarity addons), but he also needs a counter to an uncountable playstyle (in corners)

If you neuter his anti loop then literally all he has left is holding a three gen. Is that what you want? Right now chase knight is a suboptimal option but still an option.

Dead hard counters knight hard. You say it's not in every game, which is categorically untrue. 3/4 survivors run it every game for me. I am not exaggerating. I can wait it out, my guards cannot. If the survivors are in a bad spot they'll literally run into the guards for a speed boost. It's infuriating.

I dunno how much you've played knight but I suspect it's not at all or very little. The stuff you're asking for would kill the character. Imagine if artist couldn't shoot crows over pallets. That's basically what you're asking for.

YOURFRIEND

@Defend said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349080#Comment_3349080

Currently Prestige 21 on The Knight, been playing him ever since I learned about his independent patrol tech between his PTB and Patch 6.4.2, having fun with displacing his patrol path on slopes/objects and now practicing on his pallet tech. Spamming down guards is not his only form of anti-loop, rarely do I do it since being able to instantly break a pallet when its dropped gets me more hits than his standard plop-n'-go (here's a good example if you want to see it in action).

Yes Dead Hard is an oppressive counter to your guards. Spam it or spend time setting up, all the survivor has to do is press e and run to the next loop. Stated before, I mentioned that it's uncounterable in corners. Anywhere else the survivor just holds W (as is the standard for any anti-loop). In corners however the survivor can't get anywhere else. You plop your guard down, the survivor can't move away since it takes less than a second to activate, you wait near any form of exit to prevent them from running away and finally the guard gets the hit, rinse and repeat until downed. That's uncounterable, there's nothing a survivor can do in that scenario. I don't really see a problem with a change like "under 10m they act like nemesis zombies (with pallets)" because it incentivizes long-distance patrols while at least giving a chance for survivors to stall the Knight in more uncounterable scenarios.

Not stated in my paragraph before, but there still needs to be a lot of work done to The Knight to make him better. If you played Knight before, you've seen the Guards at windows. The penalty of slowdown makes it so Jailer doesn't even have a chance to catch up, Carnifex becomes a joke and if you don't have Dried Horsemeat (which basically you should run every game), The Assassin will never get a hit in. Ever felt the pain of playing him on Lery's then there is no judgement my brother.

There is also addon-dependency (Dried Horsemeat, Call to Arms, Map of the Realm) and horrid rarity addons that need a rework. But before any buff, there needs to be an address to his anti-loop. It's the worst part of his kit, involves zero skill, uncounterable in corners and is not fun for both sides (if you are, props to you).

Prestige doesn't mean anything except how many blood points you cram down a given killer's throat. Considering that we're coming off an event that gave about a million BP every match it means very little indeed.

(As an aside I feel like a psycho for being the only person that pays zero attention to pips, prestige rank and all that. I have no idea what any of my people's prestige are because I don't pay any attention to it. I hold the button down sometimes in the middle and go to the next awful bloodweb. Who cares?)

That "tech" just looks like an exploit or a bug. If you need that kinda thing to for your guy to be viable then it should just be part of their kit in a codified fashion.

You're vastly oversimplifying the guard: survivor loop interaction. You plop your guard down, congrats the survivor is gone by then. Especially if there's no map of the realm in play. He's borderline unplayable without it. His anti loop is vastly overstated and conditional on line of sight blockers. If the guard isn't chasing with you then you're stuck as an m1 killer without a power so you have to be predicative to some degree with it. The only time you can thoughtlessly put a guard down is at a low loop but like any killer can outplay those. The game's wall to wall with uncounterable stuff, that's the only way killers win chases against good survivors.

Your solution is to make him F tier until they sort out some theoretical way to play him that doesn't turn him into discount spirit. You acknowledge his weaknesses and addon dependence and then just handwave them. Absolutely bizzare. Do you hate yourself when you play him? It sure sounds like it.