Flashlight clicking is a risk to Photosensitive Epileptic players
This is a 2 part request/suggestion.
First I want to inform the playerbase that flashlight clicking is more than a toxic mindgame, it is a serious risk for users or spectators who are sensitive to flashing lights, potentially causing seizures leading to harm or worse. Consider what kind of harm you could be causing to real life, and disable those clicking macros.
The second part of this is a call to action for BHVR to implement a 0.5 second cooldown in between flashlight clicks in order to meet safety requirements for photosensitive epilepsy:
Photosensitive epilepsy triggers:
– Any sequence of flashing* images that lasts for more than 5 seconds
– More than three flashes* in a single second, covering 25%+ of the screen
– Moving** repeated patterns*** or uniform text****, covering 25%+ of the screen
– Static repeated patterns*** or uniform text****, covering 40%+ of the screen
I would also like to point out that Dead by Daylight does not present a warning for Photosensitive Epilepsy on launch or in the EULA, which creates a risk of legal liability when posts like this are made public and met with inaction. Please add a warning, along with the functional cooldown of flashlights mentioned above, as these are very real health risks to many players/spectators.
This isn't a demand, or a threat, this is a genuine plead for assistance in helping to minimize the health risk for players and spectators of the game.
I don't recall any official statement being made regarding Flashlight rapid click macro use by the dev team, but the problem is still very present in the latest PTB from today.
Thanks,
Comments
Which is why I've said that all flashlight activations should consume a minimum of one charge.
I think this might be a bit too severe. Cinema and Game standards for Epilepsy safety indicate that a rate of 3 flashes per second or faster are potentially triggers for photosensitive epilepsy. I think a cooldown of 0.4 - 0.5 second from when a flashlight is unclicked before it can be clicked again would be the safest compromise.
Additionally, to minimize the impact to gameplay, this should be a setting available to players, where the default keeps the behaviour as it currently is, and a Photosensitive Epilepsy mode toggled 'on' would make it so that the visual effect of the flashes are reduced in frequency/intensity to fit within safety limits, but would functionally act the same in regards to triggering stunning blinds.
I believe this approach would keep the competitive level of flashlight use where it is, while providing the safety option needed.
People have more than the right to make a video game without giving any consideration to how it may affect certain conditions or disabilities. Kind of on each individual to make wise decisions about what is a safe activity for them to engage in. Bhvr, don't give into the snowflakes!
Your comment is horrible.
Noone asked to change something in the core of the game, literally nothing will change in the torch usage, people only asked for a very minor adjustment to help sensitive people TO NOT DIE!
And you call them SF. Probably only because you like to harrass macro clicking, there is no other explanation.
I have no words.
So having seizures is being a snowflake?
Or maybe you're upset a macro invented for the sole purpose of harming human beings could be removed, because you're a shite human being?
BHVR: Don't give into the snowflakes who want to hurt people; remove the flashlight macro-spam!
There are plenty more explanations and at least one of them is the applicable one here. I don't even really know what a macro is. I mean, I know what it does based on the context I see it in, but other than that no.
I think autonomy in a video game is important and if you start changing things to accommodate for every condition what kind of game do you have left. People with disabilities should determine for themselves what is safe and have all the means to do so.
If the change is super minor for you but can save lives for them, like this, it is only a positive change. Like when they iintroduced the colourblind mode.
Did your games get signifitanctly worse because of that?
Either you are completely ignorant, completely awful human being or a macro clicker kid. Choose your poison.
The ability to correct a mistimed flashlight save with a short click would be impacted, making flashlight saves even harder than they already are. Don't get me wrong, the person you responded to is repulsive, but let's not act like a flashlight click delay is even a remotely good idea from a gameplay perspective, in a game where responsive controls are a must. The only solution I can think of that would actually protect epileptic players without disrupting gameplay is a setting that makes flashlight beams anywhere from 0%-75% more transparent, on a slider. And that would be a client-sided setting that hackers wouldn't be quite so able to find a way around, unlike a delay on when you can reclick your flashlight.
Let me explain what the macro does; it turns the flashlight off and on about 50 times in a second.
Imagine a strobe light. Now imagine that strobe light maybe 3 feet from your face (or however far away your computer monitor is). Now imagine that strobe light flashing 50 times a second.
THAT is the flashlight macro spam we want to remove.
You really saying that you need a flashlight speed of 1/50 th of second? You know that everything under 1/30 th of second is invisible to human eye?
Please guys... stop BS
Yeah, I'm probably an ######### because the idea of accommodating peoples special needs for video games reeks of ... entitlement. Poor people can't afford to play this game, should we go out and buy them a pc/console so they are not deprived of the majesty that is dbd? Or should they accept that due to limited means which may or may not be completely out of their hands, they'll have to do without
There's a difference between not affording the game and making sure people don't have seizures, you horrible person.
Do you look at handicapped spots, or those ramps on sidewalks, and think that's 'entitlement'? Why don't they just walk, am I rite? I mean YOU can walk, so why do THEY have wheelchairs?
Jesus Christ, it's hyper-speed clicking, which serves no purpose other than to inflict pain and possibly cause someone to seize. And you think removing it is 'entitlement'?
Think about someone other than yourself, you absolutely horrible person. You have absolutely no actual valid points for keeping it in the game. None.
Dude. 10th comment on the first page.
There's no "probably" about it.
She said on page 1 that she's bringing the issue up to the dev team.
Well, being nasty to her about it won't make her respond any quicker. 🤷♂️
I do think something needs to be done with the flashlights. I dont suffer from epilepsy, but sometimes after multiple matches with clickers and macro clickers my eyes and my head might hurt so its affecting a lot of us.
Also on the side it would make the game little less "toxic" but mostly it would be nice to play without having headaches.
One thing also that might cause issues is the flashlight blinding with friends. Its constant even if i look down im still getting blinded with rapid speed and its not easy on the eyes.
Why do you to "competitively" need to use a flashlight for less than one charge worth of value? A fractional charge will not dispel a crow, hag trap, or blind a zombie.
Not Community Manager but Community Co-Ordinator.
and maybe she was instructed to not give any further info out on this (colorblind mode was also very late revealed during the implementation process).
You could make it as an increasing delay. You basically need to stop it once to correct it and I agree it should stay, because it's quite hard to do and impressive imo.
So if you stop it once nothing will happen, but if you will stop it more times per some interval let's say 5 seconds, it will increase delay and it will not get lower during that match.
Um behaviour..you removed my message when i called this guy out on his message but you keep his here while hes insulting people with disabilities? My message wasnt even all that rude but this here is nasty. Please remove his messages as well since he is insulting a wide range of people.
I agree.
but this is not the first time and it doesn’t make sense to blame it on one single person (who might even agree with you as far as we know, but they can’t do everything they want to..)
People also have the right to ask for accessibility options/settings and video game devs have the right to implement those if they want to.
Mandy has commented on this very thread though..
They have been slow to address these things overall. But in this case, holiday season was in-between and they probably don’t have any further info they can give out atm.
first you say you just want them to acknowledge the issue and when pointed out they actually did then it’s not enough for you?
also the flashlight clicking isn’t the only thing that might be triggering/causing seizures for people with epilepsy. It is something that affected people should be aware of in video games and they should inform themselves if they are at risk.
Again, I agree it is an issue that should be relatively easily be fixed.
but Mandy did say they are aware of it, and it has been brought up many times.
there might be reasons why they are not saying more now. if they announced they are working on it, people would just expect it in the very next PTB/update and will be mad at the devs if it’s not there. Just see what happens with the Ghostface/Legion changes…
Main issues are indoor gens with flickering lights and flashlights. Doc is not that bad for me, because it's not in fast intervals.
I usually avoid indoor gens if I can or try to find an angle looking at wall, but flashlights are not in my control.
And I think flashlights would be just easier to fix too.
I had already written a post about sound-sensitivity today, before I saw this one. I feel like there is a pretty big overlap and I hope they can address both of those things. I'm carefully optimistic seeing that they are currently working on the "wiggle-checks", but I'd love to know if anything is planned here.
But to add a small note: I used to work as a community-manager in the past. It's all the way up there with "play tester" for the most thankless jobs in the industry. I get the frustrations very much, but letting them out on the team is not gonna improve it. Back when I was working, almost anyone in the team refused to read our own forums, because of the harassment they would get. It all had to go through me. Bad for my mental health and bad for productivity.
Basically: Be nice to your Devs, even if you aren't always happy with their work. It will make for a better game and a healthier community in the long run.
I think the community that would benefit most from this type of support don't want to flame on the dev team. There's the added concern for audiences of streamers being subject to this, just for wanting to be involved in the game in some way.
There's definitely some considerations that need to be done before making any changes, but the added security for the health of players (and viewers) would be a major win for BHVR to achieve.
Did the devs mention this at all today in their Q&A? Or was it ignored?
I didn't see it mentioned, might have to promote the idea in the Q&A section closer to the next one?
I am pretty sure it doesn't.
BHRV at least ban the obnoxious people who use macros to click 50 times a second.
Nothing after all these months, it's sad.
I'd make it 8 seconds, but split it between multiple survivors. Since 2 killer seconds = 8 survivor seconds.
Your monthly remind.
its not necessarily a macro, you can do it by binding the flashlight to the mousewheel, and if your mouse has a hyperscroller, a mechanical switch that allows the mouse wheel to continue spinning with it's intertia after you spin it, you can just spin the mouse wheel very fast and it will click the light.
I wanted to express my thanks to the dev team for finally addressing this in the latest PTB:
This is very greatly appreciated, by those who needed the change.
Thank you,
Make it an accessibility option. If on, you will only see flashlight clicks every .5 or whatever the predetermined time is. This would purely be visual, and still allow survivors to click. Either to fix the timing on an early flashlight save or to BM, which is fine. This option could also affect the flashlight blinded screen for killer; as well as many others such as Doctors shock, Dredges nightfall, Plagues infection, Tricksters laceration affect, and others.
There is a photosensitive warning, which I saw this weekend when logging onto a freshly made account. But I have never seen that warning on my main, which could suggest that it will only show that screen once.