arcaneGospel
arcaneGospel
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I will say, I don't really want him to be some high-grade explosives character. I can cope with them deciding his weapons are tonally dissonant with the game! My problem is that they added nothing else in his power, and also that some killers have equally tonally inappropriate things. He doesn't have an information power, or anything, he can't request/receive information or assistance from Umbrella, he can't even just move fast. He does nothing!
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@Devil_hit11 said:
my thoughts on nemesis is that he was first killer to introduce AI to the game however the dev were scared that AI would be too strong, so they went extremely safe with his kit to not make nemesis too strong. Too strong killer for survivor mains is to unfun to face.
In RE3R, we see the Nemesis mutate common zombies to pose a greater threat to Jill. Even just something like this not only makes zombies less of an afterthought, but gives the Nemesis more room to use the Nemesis-alpha parasite's mutations and more importantly to strategize.
I believe his gameplay was suppose to be that you infect survivors and funnel survivors into zombie AI that chase survivor down, Similar to Knight except AI is more random. A lot of survivor dislike Knight and his gameplay but I think Knight gameplay is perfect encapsulation of what Nemesis gameplay was suppose to be like. So in many ways, that description is following what lore is meant to be representing. it is just nemesis kit is chronically under-powered. every part of his kit is under tuned from his nemesis mutation levels giving irrelevant bonuses that could be base-kit, zombies being almost irrelevant beyond tracking and infection 3rd health-state system.
I am sure BVHR want to rework Nemesis and likely will rework nemesis in 2 years however they first need to rework twins and freddy. While nemesis is weak, he's not chronically ineffective/unfun like other two killers.
It's odd how they haven't even had zombies interact with the T Virus as a mechanic, either. They don't better track infected survivors, or chase them any faster, or passively move towards them after a while, or give Killer Instinct when they start chasing them or literally anything at all. They're a completely empty system like everything else in his kit.
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@mecca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3665579#Comment_3665579
I agree that Myers was well adapted but he is far from weak. Insta-shot, insta-kill, are very difficult to counter.
I'm gonna be honest, I've always thought Myers without tombstone was massively underrated. He's at least miles better than Ghostface, so the fact people always say GF is better Myers is baffling.
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@biggybiggybiggens said:
Completely agree. Nemesis feels absolutely nothing like he should. There is 0 reason they shouldn't have given him his flamethrower. Just give Survivors a 'pat out the fire' animation similar to the Artist's crows.. He feels so lame without a weapon... If I was Capcom, I would've forced them to include it or at least have him whip out a rocket launcher for his mori, but they didn't even do that right..
No flamethrower..
No rocket launcher..
No tentacle through the head mori..
No auto immune to pallet stuns during specific part of his power..
No Survivors turning into zombies once they die..
AND STILL NO ZOMBIES THAT ACTUALLY FREAKING DO SOMETHING...
This chapter was a huge fail for them in my books..
I don't even think he had to use one of his larger weapons to get the idea across, give him a bomb he could set, or something, I dunno. They didn't need to deliver a Call of Duty character but they could have included anything. At all. Let him actually set up an ambush to cut off survivors' routes preemptively, that thing he does literally all of the time.
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Don't run those perks if you don't want them to get countered like that. Or run Unbreakable. This isn't killers slugging you for no reason, this is just the appropriate response.
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@mecca said:
There is a thing called balance. Similarly, look how puuny Jill and Leon is. They are such a small shadow of their capabilities in Resident Evil. Nothing was brought over.
But look at Myers. He's not at all as strong as he is in the Halloween series, but he's undeniably faithful--The fact survivors need to constantly be watching for him in the background, the way he can erupt into violence and lethality at a moment's notice after being completely unseen, how he needs to spend time watching survivors rather than blindly going full-force into an offensive? It's an amazing adaptation even if he's weak. This is also true of, say, old Freddy--It perfectly encapsulated the feeling of isolating a survivor into his world, even if it wasn't as strong as he actually is in his home series.
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@Quizzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3665465#Comment_3665465
Well for one, sable being in the fog will not have an effect on mikaela anyways. They dont do tome lore where a character interacts with another in the fog that are in the trials. Because it would be a plothole towards their own base lore of memory wipe etc. So i doubt devleopment between the 2 will occur. What they will obviously do, is tell the story about what sable has done after mikaela disappeared which lead her into the fog. They've been doing that recently with these new characters.
Well, if you ask me, this would actually be a great time to break that limitation--Make a story about the Entity noticing the renewed hope Mikaela feels from meeting Sable and that Sable feels from finding Mikaela, have it stop scrubbing them of such memories, maybe? It would be a good way to keep the lore from stagnating, I think.
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I think it's fascinating that a lot of people in this thread's knee-jerk reaction is that BHVR is relentlessly money hungry and cares more about that than creating a good narrative or anything. Is it so hard to believe that BHVR just... Maybe never intended to use Julian again, at least not as a survivor? I won't deny it'd be cool to see him again, but it'd be rather dull if he was a survivor instead of a killer. Toothless, I think. With Sable, Mikaela gets to hold onto the hope that hey, maybe Julian is in the fog, given Sable came looking for her just like she'd be hoping to find Julian. It makes for a perfectly good story, I'd argue a better one than if we just got Julian as a survivor or if we got Julian as a killer who only connected back to Mikaela.
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@Smoe said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663764#Comment_3663764
It is, everything about The Unknown is a reference to the many theories surrounding it in it's lore, from Add-ons, to weapon, to power and to design.
It's basically a combination of it all since it doesn't have a identity of it's own except what people give it.
It's kind of fascinating how the character who is a manifestation of all these different myths about its own existence is being derided for not being like the story the community made up in their heads. It feels fitting, even if it's a little annoying how insistent some people are that the devs can't have intended something else for the character than what the community thought it would be.
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@KardanBustum said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663716#Comment_3663716
There is no Lovecraftian in Unknown concept. Only wolf in sheep coat.
What's your actual basis for that argument? What, exactly, prevents it from being considered a Lovecraftian character? Lovecraft played around very heavily with the idea of the uncanny valley, such as in The Festival or in the iconic Shadow Over Innsmouth, both stories centered around communities full of things that looked incorrectly human.
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@TheNameIsGilgamesh said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663710#Comment_3663710
You don't want to know.
No, I think I do. Nothing about her design seems to be designed with the sole purpose of being conventionally attractive--We've seen a design like that when Vittorio wore modern clothes with modern tastes and an on-release shirtless skin for no real good reason. Sable's just a woman who wears eyeliner, has a strong sense of style.
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@TheNameIsGilgamesh said:
It's unoriginal. Terrible design. Survivor is ok but still lame she's friends with Mikaela and another thirst trap for immature folks.
I like the look of the map although it's just another poorly balanced map lmao.
In what way is Sable thirst bait?
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I think that, while it would obviously be cool to see a mimicry-based stealth killer, it's not fair to say the current power is completely unfitting (or unoriginal, either). The power creates this sort of discordant, self-contradicting feel that fits the actual concept. The Unknown isn't a mimic. It is a bunch of urban legends swilled together into this one, awful thing, not unlike the Dredge. The power is simultaneously a venom and just a psychoactive fear you can only confront by directly staring down your fears, making it both a government bioweapon and a silent hill-like manifestation of one's own mental ailments. The hallucinations give it a sort of omnipresent feeling that befits the sort of bogeyman it's supposed to be--You aren't really supposed to get a strong read on the killer. Hence why it's the unknown, and not the mimic or the imitation or the bioweapon or anything.
I think teasers can sometimes be misleading, and I think this time, that was more purposeful than SM accidentally implying a cyborg or something. BHVR wanted us to speculate, it just so happens we didn't nail it exactly. I think the feelings of paranoia represented in the stories they posted are evoked well by forcing the survivors to look at the killer, while also giving it a very freeform teleportation ability, which means you have to always be looking for the killer when it could reasonably come from any direction, or it could even not and could simply fire another shot at you. It forces you to look for it--which is when it targets its victims in its lore, when someone looks for it.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663351#Comment_3663351
Then, perhaps, instead of removing it, there needs to be some form of addition to help prevent tunneling in some regards without hindering normal gameplay
Yeah, that's what I actually suggested--the title itself is at least partially clickbait. I don't want tunneling to be made any stronger, I just don't want to have to do it, I want to play a game that isn't over before second generator's finished just because someone made me go for them, or something.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
Uhhh as a killer main I think the BT is fine as is. Survivors need to keep that.
I think a similar mechanic needs to exist, but the way it works now is my issue. It doesn't really meaningfully hinder tunneling but it's easy to use to force a killer to tunnel.
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@MadameExotine said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3662752#Comment_3662752
Re: "In an ideal world getting on hook on each survivor before one of them is dead is the goal anyway"
I think we are at very different MMRs to understand each other.
I'm not saying it's optimal now. Hence why I said 'In an ideal world". There needs to be more incentive to go for varied hooks, I just didn't find it immediately relevant in the original post.
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@MadameExotine said:
"If a survivor body-blocks for their teammate" using basekit BT, when killer was clearly going for person who unhooked, it is perfectly acceptable (even expected) for killer to switch and down the body-blocker again.
I don't think anyone would argue about that scenario.
For "Martyr" status suggestion, it sounds too OP for survivors tbh. B unhooks A, then C unhooks B, then D unhooks C,.. meaning killer's first 4 hooks will likely have to be fresh hooks,.. and in most games (at least at my MMR) by 4th hook, the 4th gens pops, or most likely all five pop since no one is on death hook/no pressure.
I want to have the ability not to tunnel without being penalized for it. Yeah, I could just tunnel, and if they try to bodyblock yeah I'm gonna, but I shouldn't have to.
I don't see how it'd necessarily be overpowered to have to get your second hook on someone by not focusing them off the hook, and--Your example, forgive me if I'm wrong, works now? If a new survivor goes for the unhook each time now you're only going to get fresh hooks via proxy camping. (In an ideal world getting on hook on each survivor before one of them is dead is the goal anyway. If you really want someone to be at risk of death hook you probably should have to take some risk for that.) I don't see how this would be any worse for killers at all.
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@mikewelk said:
Basekit BT is a pretty fair mechanic, waiting it out for ten seconds really isn't that big of a deal when they spend five thinking they are invincible until reality sets in.
Well, sure, you could, but that's part of the problem--that is, still, tunneling, which is something we want to avoid. Do they earn getting downed like an idiot? Yeah, but it still shouldn't be NECESSARY, and if you could do it when it's forced on you, you can surely just tunnel anyway on purpose. That's not ideal, I'd say.
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I don't even think Slinger is actually BAD, so far as viability goes. I think he's kind of alright. The problem is they tried to remove everything that actually made him interesting. BHVR does this all the time--they make a super compelling kit, freak out, go "What the #########" and rip out all of the good or interesting design they made, they're doing it with making Pig another dash attack killer right now.
The problem with his ADS was always that his projectile was super hard to dodge... AND reeling survivors in was really easy. The ADS, I would argue, was actually fine. The intended counterplay was always in either making a strong read on how to get him to screw up his shot, or simply avoiding being reeled in. The problem is that reeling backwards is too free. They should have increased the rate the chain breaks moving back but decreased the rate of that moving forward, so that fishing survivors to you is an actual point of counterplay. Instead, it's a time waster on a killer that now feels clunky.
It's the same thing with his TR. Yeah, he could sneak up on you in a way neither other ranged killer could. That was the intent. He was a sort of sniper, content to take it a little slower and get you when you're not looking... As a way of making up for the lack of range on his projectile. Not to mention survivors could just pay attention for once in their lives and avoid getting stealthshot. I almost think BHVR had his changes done by people who had no involvement in his original creation.
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I will say, it certainly doesn't help that this game has a downright magical ability to somehow always match you with people who are playing with the intent of being insulting and obnoxious whenever you run something off-meta.
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You know what? I really don't get it.
What's even the big deal about these changes? Literally nothing in the universal kit changed, it was all, like, 0.3 to 0.5 second changes for a couple of low tiers. And also those buffs to Huntress and that Blight addon which, yeah, were unnecessary and could probably get rolled back a bit. These were only called tweaks and that still feels like overselling the impact, now that we've seen them.
I feel like the only killer who got a sizable buff--Again, Huntress' unfathomable changes aside--was Clown. And it was in the form of, like, two extra bottles and some half-second adjustments. I guess if clowns killed your whole family and Clown's very presence in this game is unforgivable to you as a result?
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I think even if it doesn't make her necessarily weaker, these changes make her much less interesting. I get that it's sort of lame to deal with, but RBTs as a win condition made Pig unique. They're really the only part of her that tries emulating what Saw is. I think these changes are mostly bad because they assume there's something compelling that RBTs and Ambush compliment, but there's really not. If there was another part to her power, buffing her not-at-all unique dash and nerfing her actually unique RBTs would be fine. The issue isn't that RBTs themselves have been nerfed, it's that BHVR is taking Pig in a direction that makes her a basic dash attack killer with some passive slowdown rather than a killer that represents Saw. If RBTs don't work as the core of her kit, then there should be something else introduced to be, rather than making it the incredibly bland charge I worry both BHVR and the community at large seem to favor.
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Yeah, Knight feels terribly clunky even if he has two of these addons--He's desperately wanting for these effects to be folded into base a bit. These're actually the exact three addons I've always felt I needed to stack but couldn't. I'd argue Call to Arms is the most necessary, as without it he kind of gets forced to not make long trails because it takes so long and he doesn't have the distance for it, resulting in the constant dropping of guards in the middle of a loop. He can't play around guards strategically and interestingly when he isn't even afforded the ability to set things up strategically.
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@GroßusSchmiedus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653735#Comment_3653735
The strength of the camera swing and the survivor running into it is actually dependant on the survivors position relative to the trap, therefore an increased trap trigger radius makes this effect much stronger and harder to counter, to the point that you can even redirect survivors into different rooms/paths against their will.
They can just make the range infinite and use the now obsolete add-on set to decrease the trap trigger distance.
That first point is fair, in that case ideally they'd have set to increase and one to decrease the range--or at least one to decrease the range and one to increase the pull effect--but I don't understand the 'make the range infinite' part. What do you mean by that?
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@GroßusSchmiedus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653716#Comment_3653716
That depends on your setup, its camera swing traps are definitely a very valuable piece of her kit, thats why i made a thread about it for solutions that keep both. I don't see a reason to nerf camera swing traps.
I'm not gonna say they have no value, but not only are they not the core of her kit I wouldn't even say they're worse, unless I'm misunderstanding somehow. You have to put them a little closer toward the position you want to bait the survivor into, I guess, but I don't see how that changes anything.
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I mean, it's a neat strategy, but you have to be honest. Her gameplan is to hit someone after teleporting, not to force turning. Having survivors closer to where you teleport from is vastly better for this strategy. It also prevents traps from being activated by someone passing by at the very edge of the radius, thus wasting your setup time.
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I have never understood why people like playing against Huntress so much. It's not always terrible!
But it's usually the least interactive thing I've ever had the misfortune of experiencing.
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I'm gonna back General's argument, if fewer maps were such particularly smoldering ass they'd be fine. But with RPD, The Game, maps like that make them bad. Map offerings are fine for achievements, or playing killers on maps that don't completely turn off their power(See:Myers on Coldwind). But right now they're just a way to make the game unplayable for the enemy gamer.
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Like, in Saw 2 and 3, the whole POINT is that the location of the game is not just one singular trap, but a large series of diverse traps that--by making the subject panic--string into one another, you leave one and trigger another. In Saw , the entire thing is just one make-your-choice, one lives one dies escape room. In Saw, the ENTIRE environment is the trap. That should be so easy to emulate in DbD.
Besides that, Ambush and RBTs just don't interact with one another, they don't contribute to a singular mechanical identity. If Pig had more forms of traps or even just, surveillance cameras, even, she could have everything play into that snowballing mental stack. Pig herself could be anywhere, but there could also be a gas trap or tripwire or camera somewhere that would also screw you over. As is, Pig is a brute force slasher who can buy herself 20 seconds per down.
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If nothing else, I really think Pig's RBTs need to interact with more mechanics than just the boxes. They're incredibly surface level for what is ultimately the only interesting part of Pig's kit, and for what is apparently supposed to represent the whole of Saw's traps and kidnappings. That it doesn't reveal any auras of other nearby survivors to incentivize putting other survivors in traps, or reveal survivors doing gens while a trap is yet to activate so the Pig can go and sort of make them face consequences for trying to progress their own survival while putting the trapped survivor at risk, or do ANYTHING beyond serve as a tool for stalling or cheesing out a kill is frankly pitiful. It doesn't compellingly represent Saw in any real way.
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Not only would that be too homogenized with other trapping killers(Hag, Adriana, Hux) but it wouldn't actually help him in a way that matters. Trapper's issue is not that he takes time to set up, it's that his set up can too easily be denied any meaning. There's better ways to compensate for his setup time--increased set speed, the ability to recover his farthest trap from a locker on a cooldown, etc.--and there's more important issues he needs fixed. Disarming traps is easy, quick, and free, and this is a serious issue. There should be some risk to disarming a trap. It should either take a noticeably longer time, or it should injure the survivor. This would result in his traps being more inherently valuable, which is his actual issue. It is too easy for him to put everything into nothing.
I really just want to see Honing Stone and Bloody Coil made basekit, or at least something similar, and maybe he should get IriStone's effect when he downs a survivor. These would make individual traps more valuable and would also prevent disarming his traps from interrupting his entire offensive flow. Maybe there's a better option, but it isn't Trapper Sack.
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I don't think I've seen any complaints about getting RE cosmetics and stuff myself. As for the matter of chapters, I honestly do want a third RE chapter, but more because we should have gotten a different chapter than Project W than because I want more or all of RE in DbD.
As well-executed as Project W is, I can't help but feel like Wesker doesn't belong in this game. Not in his RE5 incarnation, anyway. He's far too much a Matrix action character to not totally sunder my immersion, and a version of Wesker from RE1 where he would play more strategically around setting zombies and traps--not unlike REsistance--would have been an amazing fit. DbD's issue with RE is that they just aren't made to be DbD characters, they're too much of loud chase machines. None of the horror elements of the series are well implemented outside of Nemesis' TR and the RPD's aesthetics.
And when Resident Evil 7 was right there? With Jack goddamn Baker? He's gotta get in, he's perfect for this game, and you could make him so incredibly terrifying and complex. The other RE killers are as strategically deep as a kiddie pool, but Baker's use of the mold would make him a weird, omnipresent terror that just belongs in DbD.