Xernoton
Xernoton
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@Sluzzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983368#Comment_2983368
They've done that with killers. There's been massive power creep with new slowdown perks stacked. We see how broken Dead Man and Pain Resonance is, especially on Artist. It is only fair game for both sides to get good perks.
Boil Over was fine, except on the Police Station but they fixed the map and nerfed the perk regardless.
DMS was buffed because no one actually used it. Most of us probably forgot the perk even existet. The buff made that perk very strong and viable on some killers, that's true. On Artist for instance the combination of DMS and Pain Resonance is ridiciculously strong. Now everyone uses this combination and it's getting an overhaul, which is a good thing imo. The other new slow down perks aren't power creep but QOL because with Call of Brine kicking a gen is not a waste of time anymore, which is what players begged for for years, and Floods of Rage on a killer that isn't Nurse is a very good perk that makes killers more efficient in their pathing and patrolling of gens but it's not OP.
There were many more scenarios other than on RPD where Boil Over was unfair like on Ormond but that's beside the point.
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@Sluzzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983249#Comment_2983249
That's a big one! Nobody touches Yoichi perks, but I've seen several killers using Floods of Rage and Call of Brine. Every DLC is all about killer with great perks.
Would survivors actually run something new unless it's even stronger than what they already have? Many wouldn't. Creating even stronger perks for survivors might just break the game entirely. We all saw what happened with Boil Over. I don't want to relive that.
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@Sluzzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983249#Comment_2983249
That's a big one! Nobody touches Yoichi perks, but I've seen several killers using Floods of Rage and Call of Brine. Every DLC is all about killer with great perks.
Would survivors really run anything else unless it's even stronger than what they already have? I'm gonna go with probably not. Creating even stronger survivor perks could go horrably wrong. We all saw what happened with Boil Over.
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I agree. I like playing killer with only 2-3 perks from time to time like Doctor with BBQ, Lethal Pursuer and Zanshin Tactics. I also unequipped pretty much all gen defense. It doesn't help and I'm better of applying pressure by finding and downing survivors faster. Also it feels so much more achieving when you beat a full SWF with the best perks and strong items on a survivor sided map as Hillbilly without addons and only with BBQ and Shadowborn.
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You know what the sad part about Dead Hard is? You can't swing because survivors might have it but you cannot not swing because then they'll get closer to the next pallet or window and press E for distance. Very enjoyable and definitely something that survivors wouldn't hate, if it existed for killers. I saw someone make the argument "If Dead Hard is fine, then Coup de Grace should activate every 40 seconds as well." and honestly I find that hard to argue against.
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@JohnWick1654 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983139#Comment_2983139
Sometimes after running straight through and than pulling up a tentacle, they do it again, and than when you wait right behind corner, they walk up, you walk up to pallet, drop it, they don't get stunned and hit you,
cool killer,
also the talk on other killers, other killers won't hit you through pallets while simultaneously destroying them,
other killers destroy the survivors differently, other killers get looped by me from 10 extra seconds to whole 3 gens before I get downed..
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983144#Comment_2983144
I only dodged it against bad Nemesis players
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983148#Comment_2983148
Nemesis M2 is longer than a lunge, Nemesis can both break and injure, you can't hide if the player is good
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983203#Comment_2983203
tho good Artist player can be faster at catching you in loops than clown that stops you with just one bottle to go another lap
Ohhh. Now I understand. Sorry, I thought you were talking about a different killer. You were talking about that guy with that funny little motorized thingie and that cute yellow apron and that so lovingly smiles at you after hooking you in the basement and letting their terror radius disappear with Insidious. THAT Nemesis!
Seriously though, there is only 1 killer in the game that can hit you and break a pallet with the same attack and it's Bubba. Nemesis can only hit 1 target. If it's the pallet you're safe. If it's you that pallet still stands.
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That would deny killers one of their most important and strongest tools build pressure. I don't think that would be a good idea. Also it would make some killer adepts even harder than they are now.
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@JohnWick1654 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983055#Comment_2983055
Demo stops at pallet, Demo's M2 sometimes prioritises destroyable walls and pallets instead of players next to it,
Demo can't hit you over small wall, etc.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983062#Comment_2983062
You remove loop, if someone approaches the loop with the dropped pallet, Nemesis instantly destroys the pallet and you have to move on
if you ignore the loop with a dropped pallet, so will Nemesis, making it nonexistant
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2983075#Comment_2983075
1 ofc his early is weak
2 soloq survivors will insta give him T3
3 "just fake pallets and stun if he puts up tentacle" he respects pallets while holding power
4 pre-dropping pallets get instantly destroyed, you barely waste any of his time
5 "at least he doesn't have mobility right?" that's why he is the only ranged killer with 4.6m/s?
I'm just gonna assume you have no idea how that hole fake pallet thing would work and actually benefit you so I'll try to give you some advice. When the Nemesis puts up his tentacle he gets slowed for a minimum of 0.35 seconds, but because he will probably not release it instantly it's more like a bit over 1 second in most cases. That is 1 second of you getting a bit of distance and also the killer purposefully falling behind so they don't get stunned. Now you're out of danger again. If the Nemesis decides to still go for the M2 get right behind the pallet and you're good (mostly) because the pallet's hitboxes blocks your own. This mostly works well on sharp corners like in jungle gyms and those awful rock loops. For him to get to tier 3 he needs to get a minimum of 5 hits on people that are not contaminated (without Marvin's Blood). So if your SoloQ team mates actually manage to give him that in the early game you would probably lose against any other killer as well. Your best bet is delaying him for as long as possible or be a god tier looper. And when you get chased and downed in under 30 seconds while not being contaminated that is most likely your own fault because once again press Shift + W and use the speed boost after a hit. It takes a lot of time to catch up again and then you might still get another boost not to mention you could get to a good structure.
One of the Nemesis biggest strengths is not to hit with the tentacle but to pressure survivors without, zoning them out until they can't escape. Avoid that by all means. Sometimes it's better to take an early hit than to get zoned to a part of the map where the speed boost can't help you reach a strong loop and immediately go down there.
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@legacycolt said:
It’s getting nerfed because many killers don’t know how to deal with dead hard. I wish more people would evaluate their own plays and realize it’s their own mistakes that lost them a match, not dead hard.
Also dead hard is necessary because of many killers, killer add ons and flawed map design.
Of course the flawed map design is the reason surivors bring Dead Hard. That also explains why they send themselves to their favorite map and STILL use it, doesn't it?
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I have fun playing as and against Nemesis. Really the best way to learn how to counter a killer is to play that killer. At the start of a match Nemesis is at his weakest. His M2 does not break pallets, you don't get injured by it but infected while still receiving the speed boost, he gets slowed down to 3.8 m/s, has a massive cooldown and his range is abysmally short. Also the hitbox of his M2 is very small so it's not that hard to dodge. As long as he is in Tier 1 he is basically no real threat and you'll want keep that up as long as possible. That changes when he reaches Tier 2. Now you need to play a lot safer. Don't pre drop pallets anymore. It won't slow him down much. Instead try to maintain distance and as already said try to fake pallets. If the Nemesis wraps up his tentacle stun him when you can or try spin around him. At Tier 3 though? Well buddy, you're screwed. It's his strongest form and very hard too loop. He now has increased range, shorter cooldowns and higher movement speed while holding M2. If it's the end of the game and all gens are done pre drop EVERYTHING. It will slow him a bit and delay the hit, that will come eventually.
Also keep in mind that Nemesis has no map mobility. That also means, that after hitting you he has some trouble catching up to you again. Especially when you're not contaminated you can get that speed boost twice, meaning double distance and a way longer chase.
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I actually enjoy playing on Ormont every once in a while. Mostly because it looks different from all the other maps and that adds some variety.
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@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2982556#Comment_2982556
Why is this even an argument? Some guy said less bp = more which isn't true. And now i have this?
Anyone who has played this game for long enough knows when a killer is or is not viable. There is a point in this horribly balanced game where your skill as killer is meaningless and will be surpassed by the physical limitations of the game and mechanics of survivors.
the best sadako player in the world is never going to beat the best survivor comp team. Full stop, no argument. A fully stacked Nurse on the other hand has a chance.
Let's put it that way: Even with addons there is a huge disparity between Killers. On that I think we can both agree. More BP is always better of course and I don't see who ever said otherwise, but most spend BP because they want to unlock the perks, myself included. Building a stack of 200+ addons each (a bit exeggerated, I know) isn't necessary and many players still have those even on good addons, that they actually use. So even if the 100% BP bonus of BBQ was removed I don't think it would overthrow the game as much as you make it out.
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@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2982530#Comment_2982530
Depends on your mmr. when you start to reach the areas where nurse and blight are the only viable killers then add-ons mean everything for the other killers.
Sorry but that argument isn't viable. Who defines which Killers are viable in what MMR? Is Nurse a weak killer because some can't hit a single blink against survivors that just installed the game? Is Artist bad because I have no idea how to play her? No, but it might feel that way.
If you can't win with specific Killer sometimes it's not only because the Killer is too weak without addons, but because you just didn't play good enough, brought the wrong perks, got a bad map for you or made some bad decisions. Because we have no way of telling our MMR we can only guess that we might be in high MMR. For all we know we could be super far down or super high up. In my opinion there are only few Killers that heavily rely on addons. Of course when you play against the world's best survivors you'll have a hard time with the weaker Killers, but will their addons change that? Mostly not by much. The Doctor will not be able to teleport through objects like Nurse and Myers can't traverse the map in the same way Blight does no matter what addons they bring. Is there still a chance you might win with them? Yes.
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That's something I can get behind!
But seriously how have we not gotten any answers from devs? It's a bit concering.
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@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2982520#Comment_2982520
you understand that the "grind" is only in relation to perks right? If you take away the extra bp then you will have less addons to use and will be spending more time as a base kit killer.
That's true, but honestly do you need to run 1 or 2 specific addons every match? If not you probably won't need as many level ups any more to build a stack of these specific addons, since you can bring different addons. I have a pretty decent amount of addons on most Killers (other than maybe the 1 or 2 addons I never get in my bloodwebs like green chains for Billy) and I think even without BBQ I would be fine. I often play without running addons at all. I'd probably have to see how it would be without BBQ to really make a good guess but that point in particular doesn't bother me as much.
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Right now BBQ is probably the most game healthy perk for Killers, so I hope they don't nerf it too hard. Just think about it: You get rewarded for moving across the map, hooking multiple people, giving you a reason not to camp and making you more efficient. Without BBQ there is pretty much no perk other than Devour Hope, that gives you a good reason to leave the person you just hooked in order to get some kind of value out of it. Also BBQ is a great perk for beginners since it teaches them about survivor movements.
Would be sad to see that go. Maybe they'll only remove the bonus BP, which would be sad but understandable with the upcoming changes to the grind.
@keepingitril said:
How can the same thing come up again and again.
Having BP attached to Perks is poor game design and should have been done away with long ago. A perk should be a modest change that affects your gameplay in some particular way, not the scoring of said gameplay.
There are 7 perks with BP elements attached and hopefully they are all in the 40 group to be updated.
That so many killers run it as a pseudo-crutch for more BP is a different issue.
It is poor game design. Just try to calculate how many BP you need for ONE character to be complete. It's ridiculous. With BBQ you got something out of your matches at least. Imagine getting a perfect game with 32000 BP, which is not even enough for one level up! Than with BBQ you easily get 25.000 BP for an ok game and double it. That's a lot better. So without the extra BP you need so much more time to get to that point. Also BBQ is the only perk for Killers that can give you more than 32000 BP for a match. The other perks with Bonus BP cannot do that, since they just make you reach the 8000 BP cap on each category faster. and nothing more.
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STBFL has vaious uses. Survivors try bodyblock you? Well, too bad. Now they're all getting hit. You find a survivor in a bad position? Now they won't make it very far before you catch up to them. You hit a survivor with 8 stacks near a pallet or vault? You might be able to get a grab after hitting them. Survivors commit on a gen? With STBFL you can shred through healthstates so fast they might just throw the game right then and there. And then there is also the synergy with some killers's powers. Try it on Doctor. Its lethal! Put it on Demogorgon and you can sometimes hit survivors with the shred right after the first hit. Onryo and Pig can shorten their chases significantly because the survivor might not make it to the next safe loop. Using it on Hag means you can teleport a lot quicker after hitting someone, which can sometimes make a big difference.
I think STBFL is a very good perk. You don't need it on every M1 killer but most of them benefit a lot from it.
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If you want to practise Doctor try Zanshin Tactics and Lethal Pursuer. Find a survivor quick without using your Static Blast and try to prevent them from using pallets or windows by using your shock. Sometimes you can use the shock for mindgames or to lock survivors in certain areas. Zanshin Tactics can help you with that. Learn the exact timing your shock needs to take effect and learn survivor patterns. Some will try to vault in panic while others will stay put. Predict that. Dont worry, if you can't get it at first. It's quite hard and you need to consider the survivors connection since sometimes they can still perform actions after they scream. It's a latency thing. The Static Blast is your best tool to slow the game. Use it to spread and increase Madness. Bring everyone to Tier 2 if you can, then use Static Blast to get them in tier 3. Remember: In tier 3 Madness survivors can't perform most actions, including healing, gens and mending.
For add-ons I recommend Restraint. It doesn't alter your chase power but makes it easier for you to track survivors on a large distance.
Most importantly if you want to get better with a Killer just play them. Just play Doctor for a couple of games. Be not affraid to chase good survivors. They can show exactly how far your power goes and what you can and cannot do with it.
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@MrMori said:
I used to think the same thing, but I don't anymore. I think what Billy needs is some of his addons basekit. I'd give him his yellow boots, and Doom engravings basekit. Maybe even with the 2.5s chainsaw charge he currently has. I'd also change overheat to only be active when within 24m of a hooked survivor, because after all it was originally implemented to combat facecamping.
Although overheat is honestly fine in its current iteration, it was because you rely so much on engravings that people compained about it. but they fixed overheat with engravings. Billy's biggest issue currently is he's really hard to maneuver across many maps without boots, and his ability to down in many loops is neutered when you don't run engravings. Having some of this basekit would help him immensely. And there's lots of potential for reworks to his addons.
Also Shadowborn basekit would be very helpful for Billy.
I 100% agree!
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I do agree that Billy could use some love, but why would you change the charge time of all things?
The 2.5 seconds is perfectly fine. You would still need to pre-charge the chainsaw or keep it 99ed anyway, so what would be the point?