RpTheHotrod
RpTheHotrod
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BHVR practically removed all kick perk gens from the game with the latest patch. There not much left for killers to even equip.
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@xltechno said:
In the first place, the killer can determine the survivor's position to some extent from his or her starting position (because there are rules). If you want to make effective use of distortion and CS, leave the scene immediately after starting. Hiding self from the beginning is the biggest mistake in making the most of these Perk.
What I do as a Distortion user is start heading towards the killer from a side approach in a sneaky manner because they always make a run over to the survivor spawns. Distortion let's me sneak passed them, then I pretty much have guaranteed free time on gens where the killer originally spawned, as they'll be busy chasing the other survivors who just walked a few yards away from spawn to work on a gen.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3676356#Comment_3676356
I'm not saying kicking gens without perks is abnormal, I'm saying it is foolish (without someone on hook). I shouldn't expect Kobes to save every Survivor's chance of victory, just as reckless gen kicks shouldn't save every Killer's chance of victory. Survivors as a team can lose because a singular teammate is weaker than the Killer. When the Killer is the weakest player in the match, it should track that they should lose from their mistakes. Making poor decisions consistently, makes someone a weaker player, and they should continue if they are having fun, or stop making those mistakes if they wish to win/improve.
It would be more accurate to describe my position on normal gameplay as: "the Killer should always seek to provide pressure on the Survivors", and kicking gens (without a hooked Surv or perk value) to give a visible Survivor 12 extra seconds in chase is never providing that pressure. Some Killers operate on investments, so what may seem to not be short term pressure may still be long term pressure (hit and run, Ghosty 99's, gathering their power's resource, etc.). (Looking back at the quote on the patch notes, they said "This can lead to very long games and frustration." [bold mine], so the part you take issue with was likely to target [Survivor] frustration as well.)
I never argued against kicking pallets, and if anything, my statements have been in favor of it as a means to whittle down the Survivor's resources for victory. At the same time, if I am kicking an edge map pallet from the outside, I am making a mistake as Killer. I should instead kick from the inside of the map, to lessen the distance the Survivor gets, as well as limit their options.
As far as the 2.5->5%, I think they did that to encourage more healthy usage of the now limited resource of gen kicks. As I see it, they probably felt 16 2.5% gen kicks max on a single gen was happening, so they halved the number and doubled the regression to maintain parity. This feels like BHVR is actually trying to train Killers to be more effective at Killing, and getting spat in the face for it.
Ah, so you're saying peek optimal gameplay with no foolishness or mistakes is normal gameplay. Okay, well, I'm going to have to disagree with you here, but I suppose that's one point of view. For me, normal gameplay absolutely includes sometimes doing suboptimal plays, for example your situation where you said kicking a gen when someone isn't on hook is foolish. I still say that's normal gameplay because BHVR specifically said that camping 3 gens from the beginning of the match without progressing the objective with the intent on dragging out the match as long as possible is what is NOT normal gameplay. That means normal gameplay would be trying to play with the intent on advancing the objective (without cheating, of course).
If playing perfectly with no mistakes or foolishness is your "normal gameplay", you should start streaming. You'd be famous overnight.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3675609#Comment_3675609
Kicking a gen isn't trying to win by attrition, but kicking a gen while an unhooked and chaseable Survivor's location is known most certainly is. Kicking a gen when there is no perk value to be gained is trying to win by attrition. Kicking a gen while no one is on hook is trying to win by attrition. Its fine to win through attrition, but it should be done through offense (pallets) not defense (meaningless gen kicks).
What I am saying is taking the mathematically inferior option shouldn't help the player, and should harm them. Attempting hook Kobes is also an option, and I'm not asking Survivors to not attempt Kobes, but I do think Survivors attempting Kobes should lose because they forced themselves into 2nd stage. It is the same foolish behavior done by Survivors (Kobes) and Killers (wasted kicks), and when that side does it, they should lose or at least hurt their chances of winning.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3675755#Comment_3675755
P1: Yeah no prob, I was being a bit jokey to diffuse the tension.
P2: While normally I am not a fan of tunneling, I am a fan of meeting sweat with sweat. If the Survivors 'genb4fren', or prioritize gens before altruism (heals and unhooks), then I very much think Killers should sweat back and tunnel the person the Survivors killed by not unhooking in 1st stage. I only don't like how the victim of the countersweat isn't the perpetrator of the sweat, but you gotta do what you gotta do. As far as 'reliably applying pressure' I don't quite agree with, but that depends on the matchmaking more than anything. If I run into the clock squad when I bring the build for casual SWF or serious soloq, I'm not gunna have a good time. Since the game keeps pushing people to sweat due to MMR, that is what I blame for M1/weaker Killers from not being able to enjoy the game. I had far more enjoyment 2-hook tangoing at red ranks (back during rank based matchmaking), than I ever did after MMR.
P3: I don't necessarily think the devs thought of the regression limit as a tool, but I do think the players should. It helps the player prioritize better decision making IMO. That's why I keep making the gen kick/pallet comparison, as both are the respective sides' limited resource, and the other side can weaponize that limit against them. A foolish Surv will predrop 12 pallets and screw over their team, just as a foolish Killer can kick every non-regressing gen. The main difference is the Killer is responsible for the mistake with wasted regression, or only 25% of the Survivor team is with wasted pallets.
P4: In the Knight example the 1st event isn't shown, but likely below half since no hooks for strong regression was used. The 2nd event is at about 33% with no hooks. The 3rd is about 45%, and still under 50%. This 3rd event is the only one I can defend, as someone was on hook, and it was high enough to justify a minion kick. Personally I think he should have patrolled the guy out in the hall, as it would provide the same gen prevention, without contributing to his regression limit. Plus he wasted the Assassin on that, as opposed to the Jailor or big boy. The 4th is in pursuit of the Survivors (and none on hook), and like I said before, the gen kick gave the Survs 12s of extra chase time because of that. The Knight is too busy playing defense when he should be playing offense. Like I said in the above reply's 2nd paragraph, he is punished for making the mathematically inferior play. Just like a Survivor would for attempting Kobes. Should a Survivor just get 3 Kobes without sacrificing 20s of hook time per attempt? Its the same overarching concept, of taking a bad option, and being punished for it. Also the key thing here is that the Killer is attempting to pre-defend the 3 gen by kicking 1 gen that much. That is attrition Knight. That is the system working as intended.
P5: I don't doubt the regression limit nerfs gen kick perks indirectly, and for Eruption I could be persuaded for the proc to not count towards the limit as the kick already did it. The issue is that it forces the Killer to use their brain in actually assessing the value of what they stand to gain. I love Trail of Torment on Myers, because no one expects the T3 without a TR. But if I don't know where the Survivors are, then I shouldn't waste a kick in the first place, with or without the regression limit in place. Because of the regression limit, smart Killers will learn quicker and not take the inferior option as much.
P6: That's the thing, I don't think the argument stands that it does affect normal gameplay. I haven't had it happen to me once as Killer, but I play a more offensive and heavy stalk styled Ghosty. I haven't played my favorite skillcheck Freddy build in a while, but I'm sure that would actually be impacted by the change. Same with slowdown on my Clown (only Pop and/or PR), Myers (only Thana/Penti/Plaything), Legion (Thana and/or PR), and other M1 Killers I like playing. I refuse to kick if I don't have a perk or a Surv on hook, and that means I am safe. I think it is merely a matter of unlearning old unhelpful behaviors.
Side-note: Ahh, I never tried it myself and didn't see it in the patch notes, but I didn't look too deep either.
Your definition of normal gameplay is skewed though. You're saying kicking gens without perks is abnormal. That pretty much makes your definition of what is normal absolutely voided out. It's literally a game mechanic for any killer to participate in. That's like saying kicking pallets is abnormal when there are survivors to chase - it's a key basekit mechanic of the game, and they even bumped it to 5% to try (but failed) to make it more relevant for killers to use.
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This 8 gen limit really hurt the weaker killers because by design, they are forced to focus more on centralized gens - they literally can't afford to run off to check gens extremely far away. I'm all for buffing the weaker killers so heavy regression or blocking is no longer mandatory for them for optimal plays.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3675613#Comment_3675613
Are you really seeing it that much that this has made you stop playing? I guess I'm not kicking gens enough.
Not necessarily kicking gens. I use surge a lot because as an m1 killer, I'm not allowed time to stop and kick gens.
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@nikkixo87 said:
I agree with EVERYTHING you said
I've made my own posts about this as well. Not sure how to get the devs to listen. I am often getting gens blocked mid game. I have removed My favorite perks, surge and eruption , from all of my load outs because by the time I've downed 2 people I usually have generators blocked, leaving me with no options for late game Gen defense. But even without surge I am having gens blocked. Weak m1 Killers NEED Gen regression perks, but are punished for using them.i vastly prefer killer but I am playing less and less because it's just becoming too frustrating.
Possible solutions;
1. Raise regression limits
2. Do not have regression that's tied to a perk count towards limit. Only count kicks
3. Only start limiting regression events once a certain number of generators are completed.
Really sad I'm losing interest in my favorite game due to this horribly unfair mechanic.
You bring up a fair point. This mechanic alone has made me go from playing daily to playing once every week or two. It's that much kf and experience ruining situation.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673339#Comment_3673339
I'm sorry but you first asked to not comment on the play/mistakes made, so I held my tongue, but now you specifically said to watch and comment on the videos. You very often dropped chase/pressure opportunities to kick a gen for no reason. That contributed to the gen limit because you were trying to slow down the opponents win condition instead of advancing your own. Not only that, but you nearly never made use of your power to pre-stalk 2-3 players, or even approach from odd angles to get a free down. I can understand if you kicked a gen, stalked the person you pushed off, then they are forced to follow you and reveal, or stop the gen regression, but you would kick and follow instead (most often). The first match showcased multiple bodyblocks, and one of the times you got a free down because there was a pre-stalk, but that was far from as common as it should be happening.
As far as the Knight video, that also showcases attempting to delay the game indefinitely instead of actually progress the win condition. Winning through attrition shouldn't be the primary means of Killer winning, but it most certainly should help (pallet destruction). The Knight needlessly sent a minion to kick the gen (which denied him a Nowhere to Hide usage), when he should have plopped the minion near it to keep people off and chase them (as the minion likely would have seen you through the wall, even if he didn't know you were there specifically). The Knight not running any regression perks shows how much of a foolish mistake it was to kick the gen over and over for no real benefit. Get a down and then use Pop or PR or Eruption proc or whatever, just don't try to stall the game.
Gen regression is now a resource for Killer, just as Pallets are for Survivor. If you recklessly kick/pre-drop all your resources away, you will cause your side to lose. That seems better for the game at large. It isn't affecting normal matches, just the ones where people refuse to chase are being punished. This is an important time to learn the new mechanics and adapt to get away from stalling playstyles. I do think Surge and Eruption need to be adjusted, but I don't know how to fix Surge. For Eruption, I would just make the proc not count as a regression event (as you needed to kick the gen to set it up regardless, so it would still advance the max regression count).
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673371#Comment_3673371
See final paragraph in the above reply for Eruption/Surge, as well as the Pallet/Gen Regression comparison.
I think the problem is from weaker Killer players getting too used to attrition wins against Survivors by running them out of pallets for free wins. Kicking the gen gives a Survivor 7.2m, or since a Killer moves .6m/s faster than Survivor, 12 free chase seconds at the cost of 5 gen seconds. That is a losing proposition unless they are cornered (and not actually getting that distance), or you are applying a perk to give you 7+ seconds of chase shortening or gen regression (eg. Nurse+Nowhere to Hide, or the gen is PGTW'd at 50%+).
As far as hidden Survivors, Lethal+NTH solves that. Lethal lets Killer know how many people have Distortion, and how to plan their early game (excellent for Ghosty/Myers to plan a multi-stalk route). As far as gen speeds, if a chase takes 60s to down and hook, there were massive mistakes made by the Killer. The Killer with extended chases like that should record their matches, then watch the recording and think about different options they could have made, or if they destroyed a lot of pallets in that area, push future chases back into that deadzone. Kicking a 30% gen down to 25% only to regress to 22% after 12s(when the Killer ran 55m away) and the hidden Survivor gets on the gen is still the wrong move to take without relevant gen perks. Even there wasn't a Survivor, the Killer has to still lose that 12 chase seconds while 2 or 3 other Survivors are repairing gens for 36s of gen time. Getting to chase is more important that random gen delay.
Tunneling has undergone a significant increase ever since they deleted all anti-tunnel perks from the game after patch 6.1. (Yes they didn't 'delete' them, but 3s DS is useless against the majority of Killers, and OTR doesn't work if the Killer tunnels off-hook.) It is an easy free win against soloq, and since 60% of matches include soloq, Killer wins more than loses by doing it. Just like instakicking gens, it is a bad habit formed from previous free wins, causing the Killer to believe that win was 'earned' instead of simply cheesed by abusing soloq bad habits.
Personally, I would prefer instead of the Regression limit as X events(per gen), it was X%(per gen). I would set it at 100%, so you never would have to spend more than 3 minutes to repair a single gen (90s+90s).
You cant be serious. Kicking a gen isn't trying to win by attrition. You can't ask killers to not kick gens. It's literally a game mechanic, and if killers don't kick them, those gens get done even faster than they already are. Gens fly.
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Adrenaline has always just pretty much been a pressure eraser perk risk free, lol. I did this last night. I felt so bad, but still couldn't help but laugh.
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Ran into 4 cheaters yesterday. Definitely more than usual.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3674601#Comment_3674601
That's a fair argument. If I had to critique it further you should be in the bottom of basement, because as of now you can walk halfway down the stairs to heal.
That said, you're still injured in the basement so you need to be aware of what the killer is doing/who they're playing so you don't get followed in.
Not really that difficult. I go to basement all the time to try at a chance to get a medkit. Now I get a guaranteed heal an unlimited amount of times AND I don't even actually have to to into the basement since just the stairs is all that's needed. If the killer gets close, then I have an immediate window or pallet right next to me and I can loop the killer at the strongest looping area in the entire map (if basement is in shack, at least).
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The effect is broken as hell (no pun intended). If anything, it should take longer or not be able to be rushed.
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I think the fact that BHVR realized that circle of healing was a problem...where someone just has to run to one location and get healed up to delete killer pressure...and then they add another perk that just brings it back into play again is just silly.
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I'm getting gen blocks left and right with surge alone. This is getting freaking unsatisfying to play any m1 killers. Why is BHVR insistent on driving m1 killers into the ground?
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Kind of pointless to add gen kick perks when they are strongly discouraged from use with the new 8 limit system.
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Frankly, I'd rather have basekit regression and gen defense and absolutely no gen related perks. That waybwencan actually use interesting and quirky perks instead of mandatory gen perks.
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@mizark3 said:
This is just a Surge issue, not a low-tier Killer issue. I run PR/Floods/Coup/Lethal and never have issues reaching 8 events on 1 gen while killing them (in 70%+ of matches) before they can pop the final. If you have enough Iri Cams you can even substitute Floods for something else like Bamboozle. I find lethality to be the most useful for Ghosty, but I also refuse to chase until I get 2-3 99s in early game. You can also replace a slowdown perk with the Driver's License if you engage in a heavy stalk playstyle. With DL you can somewhat frequently mark a second person mid chase on another injured person just to boot them off the gen and regress it.
Similarly with Clown I run Pop as my sole slowdown and also have no problems winning (again in 70%+) before the final gen pops. No Tombstone Myers I don't even run gen regression perks and run Thana/Plaything/Penti/(Coup or Bam 4th), although that build had a steep learning curve before I reached close to my Ghosty/Clown winrates (9/10 first matches were losses before I understood game flow to win).
As you can see from the videos provided, the issue happened even when not running surge. Still happens on normal matches. That being said, it happens FAR more often with surge - absolutely! I'm just pointing out it's still affecting normal matches even without surge. I also posted a follow-up video showing how my survivor team was able to reduce a knight's charges on a gen down to HALF of his charges on the main gen before the 3 minute mark of a match. He was not running ANY regression perks.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673262#Comment_3673262
its only situational always remember it could take you 20 sec to get to basement or 40 if you dont know where its at.
Not knowing where it is is kind of moot within the first few minutes of the match. As for the 20 seconds, the same could have been said about getting to a boon of healing, and even that was deemed too oppressive against killers for their self heal capabilities.
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@Hexling said:
Another week as a survivor in a new patch to help killers.
I think the nade launcher is too oppressive, but giving survivors a way to easily self heal again really reduces killer pressure (which is why self healing was nerfed before). Also, map wide BNP is ridiculously strong, but perma being broken...not quite sure yet if the cost is enough to pay for that. Some people do want to be injured especially with resilience. Gens already fly too fast, so BNP on all gens is kind of silly. That being said, I LOVE the idea of alternative ways to accomplish goals.
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@menacing_goose said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673199#Comment_3673199
Oh sorry I didn’t realize all 5 gens getting done in 4 minutes because NOT A SINGLE ONE OF MINE HAS BEEN LIKE THAT. Even against an afk killer my match doesn’t end in 4 minutes 😃
Happens at higher mmr. Not really an issue at lower mmr.
With this ridiculous 8 regression limit, this has pushed killers into needing to do heavy gen blocking builds since regression has been gutted. BHVR utterly failed at making it only affect 3 gen campers. It's affecting normal matches on a regular basis.
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BHVR, here is an example of how survivors can easily get a gen locked up in the first few minutes of the match. That means the majority of the match, the gen is permanently locked up meaning it's incredibly easy to get it repaired - especially for a vital central gen. This was about 2-3 minutes into the match. We already managed to cause the killer to lose HALF of his allotted charges! If it was eruption, it would have been twice as fast. The killer was chasing, downing, hooking, clearly not just sitting at the 3 gen and just camping. Despite all of this, he was severely punished by the game mechanic and lost a vital gen easily just because we kept ninjaing this center gen. What else could he have done? Just not kick it? Then we'd finish it even faster. This is ridiculous. This is even worst for m1 killers.
https://youtu.be/JsA8ApZOCTA?si=fG4xnl-vpzLFinws -
It's a broken perk that needs to be adjusted. It literally makes every pallet in the entire map unsafe due to the distance the BG player can be from the pallet. There's just no way for a killer to be able to "chase them off" or even be able to investigate if someone is close enough to the pallet. It also makes any pick up not at a wall unsafe, as well. A whole team of BG player can pretty much guarantee picks up won't happen until all the pallets are eliminated.
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https://support.deadbydaylight.com/hc/en-us/requests/new?ticket_form_id=360000942011 then fill out the form and link them your youtube link in the descrption.
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@bleep275 said:
How many hours do you have? I’m rank 1 as survivor and killer. High mmr is easy mode for survivor but miserable at low mmr. Where as high mmr is miserable for killer and low mmr is easy. It could be that you’re just inexperienced
While this quote here may sound like it's being "mean", it's generally the truth. The game is killer favored at low MMR, generally balanced around mid MMR, and survivor sided at high MMR. If you're feeling like the killer is unstoppable, once you get more experience, you'll start learning about just how much power survivors have over the killer with various perks and map elements. A LOT of it also comes down to how coordinated a team is, so a bunch of people just randomly playing without any teamwork will have a much harder time than a team completely working together.
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Needs to be fixed, but killswitches only occur when there is a game breaking bug. For example, if playing a certain killer could disable everyone's ability to interact with gens. That's game breaking. Having two basements doesn't stop a game from happening.
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@Gabe_Soma said:
I am failing to understand the point of all of this.
Never seen a killer hit the 8 gen regression limit nor did I, this is just a Surge problem ,which leads to more gen exploding at the same time, and only 8% so this leads to them not regressing much, forcing you to kick them all the time (which you did).
The mechanic is simply a band-aid for poor map design and generator spawning, and if you add to this the fact that the size of the maps has decreased over time, it is much easier to run into such a situation. Activating it when you are just at the end would be useless, precisely because it is too late.
In the only game you lost (and whose ending you cut out for some reason) you stayed the whole time in the central area of the map, in the other 2 I don't understand the problem, you won and you were constantly complaining like 'oh no another regression', as if this one was activated without sending down the survivors and so you were playing your game well.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3669326#Comment_3669326
If I were you I would try buffering my hands instead since this percentage that you have fished out is a symptom of a problem that only you have.
I edited it out to trim the fat, just to show its a forced game loss. I have the original of you seriously want to watch a bunch of people just hiding when I'd get near, but was just a boring watched so I cut to the ending. As for the other two that I won, again, the point is that BHVR stated that this would extremely rarely ever kick in in matches where a killer isnt just sitting camping at a 3 gen from the beginning of the match and refusing to progress the game. I'm literally proving that this assumption isn't correct. It is absolutely affecting normal matches where killers are not sitting at 3 gens from the beginning of the match refusing to progress the game. Doesn't matter if the end result is a loss or a win. What matters is if it is affecting normal matches...which it is.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3669217#Comment_3669217
"Free escape"? They managed to get through 5 gens without dying, that's already an achievement. The killer shouldn't get a free kill at that point just because.
The game is generally balanced around mid to mid-high mmr. The game is killer favored at low mmr. Mid MMR, it's generally balanced, High MMR, it's survivor favored. They aren't going to balance the game around an mmr level where it's considered an achievement surviving 5 gens. Surviving 5 gens isn't that difficult as experience is gained unless you're facing a broken killer like skull merchant\blight\nurse. Once you get some more time in the game, you'll start understanding why these perks disable in the endgame. If someone gets unhooked in the endgame collapse, it's an almost guaranteed escape with their endurance protection unless they are REALLY far from a door, and if there are other survivors to bodyblock protect them, it's gave over for the killer.
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Visible MMR just promotes a toxic elitist mentality in communities.
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The devs don't like this whole "us vs them". We should be encouraging more "everyone" BP offerings, not discouraging them.
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@Justa335i said:
Its a thin line.
If they don't do enough, people will complain.
If they do to much, people will say they are ruining the game and "forcing it" on everyone.
I feel the devs have gone above and beyond to show they are allies and hate will not be tolerated. The LGBT movement had its own event and charms, which cant be said about other marginalized groups. I also do not think that sexuality plays a part in this game. It doesn't matter which characters identify as or who they are attracted to. The survivors are all working together to survive a killer, not go on a date.
I'm LGBT and agree entirely. I think this whole need to push this is kind of silly. There are so many better things to focus on.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3668453#Comment_3668453
Its not unrelated, you are saying your use of Surge is making you smash into the regression event limit.
And I said even using kicks alone without surge does. What's your point?
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This seems like a skull merchant issue, not a global killer issue. Let's stop wrecking all killers - especially the weaker m1 killers - just because skull merchant exists. Nerf the skull merchant directly.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3668449#Comment_3668449
So you wanna nerf or buff Surge?
Completely unrelated topic. We are talking about how matches that are NOT killers just camping a 3 gen all match refusing to advance the objective and in turn creating very long matches are absolutely being affected by this mechanic which BHVR said would not happen. It clearly is, and it needs to be looked into.
Not sure why you brought surge up. As I mentioned in the school video, surge wasn't even used. It's happening simply with kicks, as well.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3668242#Comment_3668242
If I am able to trigger that feature easily on 4 gens left, then that's not excessively long match.
Could also be another problem, like if you pick the right build, you can spam that gen so hard in a short time. Outliers.
Just saying I don't want to see crying about killers using pop/pain res. This feature is direct reason for this, when most alternatives are just trash, because of it.
Use whatever you want my friend, I wont berate you for your build. You go have fun and dont pay mind to those who berate you-
This is happening fairly often with simply using surge alone as a regression perk. It's even worst with something like eruption. That's not a build, that's a single perk in an already limited amount of available regression perks. This isn't people stacking 4 regression perks, as my videos clearly show. Heck, the silent hill map video shows one locking up entirely due to kicks since survivors were focusing that gen constantly. That's not a killer created problem, that's the survivors creating the problem and forcing it on the killer. "Well, don't kick the gen!" isn't a valid response to that issue. You can't ask the killer yo go sit afk in a corner and let gens get worked on.
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Its 4 v 1. The 1 is supposed to have extra help.
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I've found it fairly easy as a survivor even as solo queue unless it's vs a nurse/blight/legion. If the other people are also solo, then we might be in trouble, but if I'm the odd one out, I can hold my own and work with the team just fine. I do mostly play killer, to be transparent, but I do my fair share of survivor, as well. It's just fun being that solo queue survivor that ends up being a team player to the surprise of those 2 or 3 man swfs.
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I still think they need to entirely remove the ability to speed up or regress gens manually. Give them a set amount of repair needed. Remove kicks. Have gens naturally regress slowly when not being repaired. No way for the killer to absolutely dump a gen progress anymore, but survivors can't just power through them insanely fast, either. Gens would be a lot more consistent in the natural flow of the game.
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As a mostly killer main, I'm all for it. I'm not a fan of slugging for the 4k. The match is over at that point, the killer won, no reason to rub salt in the wound. Let's move onto the next match. I honestly just prefer to give the last survivor hatch - more bp spread out.
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@Bran said:
We still calling exploits tech?
That's exactly what this is, a cheater. Cheating doesn't require hack use. Cheating can also be using exploits.
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@sinkra said:
Another killer complaining they can't get a 4k every single game even when the game is already massively killer favored.
Nowhere did I complain about kills. I'm saying their mechanic is not working as intended, and I'm providing evidence to support it. This has 0% to do with kills. Not to mention if you watch my matches, I almost always give last hatch. I couldn't care less about a 4k.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667428#Comment_3667428
the mechanic is not so much of 3 gen mechanic as much as it is a anti-gen camping mechanic. 3 gen most common way to gen camp. You can gen camp at 5 gens by kicking same gen over and over and if survivor are silly enough to keep contesting you over spreading out and doing gens then you'll get 8 regression event for gen camping. that is was case of game 2 & game 1. you can milk a lot of hook-states but eventually system allows survivor to win the gen.
in game 3, there 1 gen remaining so 3 gen. the mechanic works as intended. the perk delayed the game in accordance to their balance and then eventually survivor breaks through due to anti-gen camping mechanic to prevent long match extension.
The mechanic is literally to affect killers who camp from the very beginning of the match. The devs stated themselves here on the forums that it isn't supposed to affect matches where the survivors end up 3 genning themselves (I believe it was mandy?) It's only to affect killers who specifically camp a 3 gen from the very beginning of the match...so no, it absolutely is NOT working as intended. I absolutely did not just sit there the whole match refusing to leave those 3 gens and refuse to chase and hook survivors as you so claim.
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@Shroompy said:
Like I understand not wanting voice chat in a game because you want to avoid toxicity, but to this day I have not seen a game where disabling VC wasn't an option.
Its just as dumb as people who complain about the endgame chat. Don't like it? just turn it off. Plain and simple.
Agreed, here. If you don't like how someone is communicating, just mute them. Heck, there's a good 3 people that just follow my threads posting troll comments and nonsense. Just blocked them. They eventually gave up since they couldn't fish me for replies. Same works ingame. They are trash talking? Mute and continue playing. They are effective a good teammates? Then you got some good voice comms to use.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667413#Comment_3667413
Simple explanation; You are a Killer, not a Gen-staller.
Advanced explanation; Game Design, balance, common enjoyment.
As you can clearly see in my videos, I'm actively chasing and downing survivors. I'll even chase at the cost of losing gens. As for your gen stalling comment, there are perks literally designed to gen stall. Gen stalling is one of the tools built into the game by the designers and is absolutely a legimate part of playing the killer to reach their ultimate goal. "Gen stalling bad" is a very weak hill to die on.
The devs clearly stated that this mechanic will not affect normal gameplay. I'm merely pointing out that they were incorrect due to forgetting about how they designed most m1 killers to not be capable of spreading pressure mapwide like they expect "normal gameplay" to occur. This mechanic unfairly punishes already weak killers. The intention was to stop hour long matches, not to kick weak killers in the gut on normal matches. This isn't "common enjoyment" as you claim, it's making an already frustrating killer experience even more frustrating. If all you want to ever play against is nurse, blight, and skull merchant, then this is the fast track way to do it.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667386#Comment_3667386
No, the update specifically says excessively long matches. 3gen is just a particular issue in the group of excessively long matches.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/H80HGN28AW8M/image.png
What you are thinking of is probably the second paragraph which says;
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XXQSJ0XRAERC/image.png
A Moderator can comment on if the understanding is in error, but Im pretty confident in it.
So Nobody is saying you 'strong HAVE' to change your perks and strategy. it just means you are now affected by the new system.
I never play with more than 1 generator stoppage or regression perk anyway, I am in the unaffected majority.
One of my biggest problems is that despite my matches being 10-15 minutes on average, I still hit the 8 limit. This is not considered excessively long of a match time, and yet the mechanic kicks in on a regular basis. Again, this is normally happening when survivors are ONLY focusing on center gens. Why is this system designed to punish killers aiming for hour long matches capable of being entirely controlled by survivors and allowing it to punish any killer they want?
If their goal was to end long matches, they only needed to reduce the max match time to 30 minutes or something.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667347#Comment_3667347
My apologies, I meant " isnt precisely "
Ah, I was VERY confused, lol! Thanks for clarifying.
@skylustv said:
Skull Merchant should be the only killer to have this stupid mechanic tbh
Skull merchant seriously needs some adjustments.
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@Emeal said:
If that is the case, buffs can be considered for those Killers instead of implementing special rules regarding regression event limits. Additionally, there are other perks available, some not even related to regression, that could enhance a Killer's performance in specific situations. I understand that the strategy you employ is precisely what this change is meant to counter. However, there's the option to adjust your perks and rebalance your MMR to adapt to the evolving dynamics of the game.
You'll have to clarify. You said my strategy that I employ is what the system is designed to stop. The system is designed to stop killers from camping a 3 gen from the beginning of the match and never committing to chases, never hooking, and so on - essentially to draw out the match as long as possible (effectively holding the game hostage). Remember that hour long skull merchant video? It's exactly to counter those situations. In all three of those videos, I'm committing to chases, I'm downing in hooking and advancing the objectives, and I'm never sitting on the gens refusing to leave them. I'll even go out to the far away gens just to check on them. I also don't tunnel, and I don't facecamp. How is that not normal intended gameplay? How on earth is not camping, not tunneling, not facecamping, and not slugging considered gameplay that should be stopped? I think you're vastly misunderstanding what the 8 regression limit was intended to stop. If survivors are only focusing on a single gen and not touching the rest, the killer is naturally going to be forced into a position to either defend it or allow it to get repaired. That's not something killers should get kicked in the teeth over. Now granted, it's lame if the killer sits there then never commits to a chase (and in turn never advances the game due to no hooks), but that's not what qe are talking about here. We are talking about the killers who do commit and advance the match but still get punished for doing so.
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We need to stop nerfing perks that encourage the killer to advance the game. For example, pop only comes into effect when the killer actually downs and hooks someone. Doesn't work with slugging. Doesn't work with camping a 3 gen and never leaving them. Every nerf to these kinds of perks just pushes more and more killers to slug and camp.
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Used to play daily. Every major patch is some sort of update that restricts the killer more and more. Makes it incredibly frustrating to play m1 killers. I like the added challenge, but they are turning a challenging experience into a frustrating one when screwing over m1 killers constantly. Now I play maybe one day every week. I have been touched killer in at least 2 weeks. Killers are frustrated - they are going to play far more toxic or aggressively if they play, at all.
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@shiiroo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3660265#Comment_3660265
The problem you’re describing was fixed with removal of hook grabs…so no - that’s not what the devs wanted to achieve with anti camp
That's literally what the devs wanted to achieve - their own words.
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There is literally nothing the killer can do at the endgame other than secure a kill. Do you expect them to just afk in a corner? Of course the anti facecamp disables. That's not being toxic, that's the killer doing their only objective.