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Yes, because a survivor team being able to ban literally 1/3 of the cast is a GREAT idea and WILL NOT be used to ban the top 12 killers just to face the weaker ones. This is truly enlightening, and I hope BHVR adds it immediately.
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Only if survivors had to do 6 gens to escape instead of 5
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3763685#Comment_3763685
"Does that mean this survivor lost? I don't think so"
By every metric, this is a loss. It's a loss of MMR, a loss in the sense that you died and it's at the very best, a team tie if 2 people escape.
Same with the other example.
Yes, and that means the matchmaking/win condition sucks, not the kill and escapes rates
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They can't simply balance the game around a lower kill rate (like 50 or 55%) because escaping isn't everything for the survivor side. Yes, it's the end result, but it doesn't account for what happens during the game.
For example, a survivor might run the killer for five gens, but just as they're about to escape, the killer hooks someone else and activates Blood Warden, causing the original survivor to be caught too. Does that mean this survivor lost? I don't think so.
Or if a killer faces a 4-man SWF that bullies them throughout the game and they can't get a single down, then they get one hook at the end and the SWF decides to have fun and swarm the hook, getting everyone killed. Would that SWF consider it a loss, knowing they could have had a 3-man escape but chose to have fun instead? Probably not.
These and many other scenarios are ignored when only looking at kills or escapes. We know that BHVR can track chase time, vaults, pallet drops, hits, etc., so it's clear they aren't balancing the game solely based on kill rates but by considering everything. Also, it's worth noting that people who post in these forums are more likely to be those who had bad games rather than good ones.
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
BHVR knows that they can afford to crank out new content quickly without fully testing to make sure that these kind of game-breaking bugs don't happen, clean up the mess afterwards, and really not lose any players. People will trash the devs on the forums, but they are still playing the game and still spending lots of money on it, which is really the only thing BHVR should care about as a for-profit business. Despite the game being massively broken, you can bet BHVR raked in a ton of money on the new content. I do give them credit for addressing some of the worst bugs fairly quickly. But there will be others that take a very long time to fix and will be ongoing frustrations for players. There's really no reason for BHVR to operate any differently because the player counts remain strong and people are still spending a lot of money on the game despite stuff like this happening with every new patch.
I still remember how they fixed Lopro Blight instantly but double fatigue on him is still going strong after all these years
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Sadly, BHVR won't even glance at this post. Their designer is probably a manager who doesn't care about feedback and only cares about implementing their own changes and forcing people to look at the store. They've already said that "somehow they can't go back to the old design," which tells you everything you need to know.
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@GeneralV said:
Worse than Twins release? I'll be very surprised if that is the case.
Twins release was awful but if you didn't play them you were fine. This time gens are broken in every single match
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@Krazzik said:
Survivors also sometimes don't get basekit BT so tunnel to your heart's content.
I'm 99% sure it only happens if the survivor is running Dead Hard, so that's the way to avoid it.
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It's great, especially considering that I've noticed a lot of more deadzones after this update. Not sure if they also messed with hook spawns but they feel scarcer than before
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I think it's really dumb that, despite having the code for Vecna's power wheel, they decided to go with a cyclic power instead. What?
Yeah, you can choose your guard, but since you have to cycle through them, it’s not as quick or smooth as it is with Vecna's powers. You still have to land on the right one, use M2, wait a second on the ground, and then move the orb. Good luck trying to quickly select the right guard to break a pallet during a chase.
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What’s the point of her blink closing the distance if her main way of dealing damage is ranged? Both the old blink and the new 'Take Your Breath Away' ability don’t seem to fit well in the same kit.
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This is one of the most disappointing updates ever.
You'd think that after 8 years, BHVR would understand that a perk removing one tracking aspect is unhealthy, but apparently, they don't. And no, the fact that it doesn't work while exhausted is inconsequential.
The UI changes are the worst in years, but they are stubbornly releasing them anyway. The loss of the current customization tab will haunt everyone forever, serving as a constant reminder that the game is losing everything that makes it look unique and is instead becoming a mobile game.
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VHS had a smoke bomb and it was fun. It would work here but probably as a perk similar to flashbang rather than a new bloodweb item
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This post seems written by someone who hasn't played these killers ever. Making them "refuel" wouldn't reduce frustration, it would just make them annoying to play as. Good Blight or Billy players would simply adapt and still win.
Also, are you seriously comparing Wesker's mobility to Blight's and Billy's? What?
Instead of nerfing the few consistently effective killers, we should focus on buffing those that rarely perform well to have more variety.
This is the perfect example of why playing both sides is necessary, otherwise you come up with ideas that only hurt a chunk of players but still doesn't do anything to solve the core of the problem.
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Saying that Oni is overpowered is crazy lmao
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Tunneling is just another strategy in the game, like camping, 3-genning, hit & run, slugging, and 12-hooking. Sometimes, tunneling is the most effective play. Targeting the weakest link can be the best way to compete against good survivors.
You're supposed to equip perks to counter these strategies. For example, I use Deja Vu to avoid giving a killer a 3-gen. You can also use perks like OTR, DS, DH, and the upcoming Babysitter to avoid and punish tunneling.
It’s not the most fun playstyle to go against, but you can't expect killers to always go for 12 hooks to avoid frustrating survivors. It's an online game, and both sides will use what’s most effective because most people like to win.
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A killer who wants to tunnel will do it anyway, and everyone knows that. Being able to see hook stages would lead the killer to target survivors who are dead on hook in the mid to late game. For example, if the killer finds two survivors on a generator and one of them is dead on hook, the killer will go for that survivor instead of the other. However, a killer can already do this by paying more attention to the game, so this feature would just lower the skill floor (which isn't a bad thing). Ultimately, this feature would be a good addition, but it could hurt Solo Q players if killers start targeting dead on hook survivors more frequently.
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They said they only received one actual report with evidence. Everyone else on social media isn't actually reporting the bug but is bashing BHVR for 'not doing anything.' It doesn't make sense to killswitch a character for the entire player base when only one report was made and no one is able to replicate the bug
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I tracked 80 survivor games and was tunneled in only 2 of them. I almost always run OTR, and the value I get from it consistently is not as an anti-tunnel perk but rather as distortion/iron will for 80 seconds. I also used to run DS, but I got so little value out of it that it was crazy. It’s the most useless perk I've ever used.
As a Killer, most survivors I face who use OTR and/or DS play aggressively with it to make me eat the stun or the endurance, and then I get called a tunneler, lol. Yes, tunneling is effective, but mindless tunneling literally makes you lose more often than not. It's easy to play around unless someone on your team is really bad and the killer takes advantage of it. Personally, in my games at least, it's far more common for me to lose thanks to someone giving up than to tunneling.
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@Zboard said:
In normal matches? Yes, agree
In the event? Considering the sweat i face as a soloq? I just go in, do my challenge and just stop trying. The amount of sweat is insane, for some reason. Slugging, tunneling and ofc bad matchmaking. So there is no point trying.
I tried/played normally when event started, and out of 20 matches i escaped 2/3, rest were miserable and a waste of time. I also dont use cakes anymore during the event, that is where we are at :)
Imagine telling everyone you're part of the problem, and being so proud of it. No wonder my games are awful with players like you around.
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@Laurie268 said:
Well to stop playing the game, they have to first get out of the match no?
If they stopped playing completely, I would gladly hold their hand and walk them to the hook myself.
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@jezebelthenun said:
Well, it's finally happened. I've become so frustrated that I made an account here to vent.
I've been playing since 2016, and the amount of tunneling I've seen in this event needs to be discussed. It has been, without exaggeration, 9/10 games. When confronted in EGC, they always just say "Calm down, I'm just playing the game". I don't play an anti-tunnel build because it shouldn't be this much of an issue. If I have to waste 1 to 2 perk slots each game on anti-tunnel perks, it's a bigger issue in general that should be dealt with. I don't get BNP, toolbox add-ons, or even toolboxes in more than 50% of my bloodwebs, but I can be tunneled out of 90% of my games. I've even taken to playing gentle killers who chase and release during the event just to spread BP and let people have fun, because they might not otherwise given how toxic killer mains have been lately. It's just a bummer. As I said, I've been playing a long time, but it's just ridiculous lately.
You've been playing since 2016 but are somehow surprised at tunneling?
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One game for each killer doesn’t prove anything. You need stats from literally hundreds of games for the info to be useful. Otherwise, all you’ve shown is that with the right map RNG, bad survivors, and a bit of luck, you can win any match (which everyone already knows)
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It's good that hug tech is gone; it took away some versatility for Blight, but if you're good with bump logic, you won't really miss it. The real problem now is that it's impossible to go through a doorway as Blight while using your power, let alone through two or more doorways (like in Lery's), which makes him feel awful on some tiles. Plus, they still haven't fixed the double fatigue bug or the one where you break a pallet instead of hitting a survivor right in front of it. But you know BHVR won't address these issues; they'll just pat themselves on the back after a week of adjusting hitboxes.
Oh, and Hawkins remains the worst Blight map ever. I used to think RPD was bad, but I'd rather play my next 500 survivor games against Knight than play on Hawkins as Blight. I would love to see a BHVR dev try to play a serious Blight match on this map against average survivors. I guarantee that employee would end up with PTSD, foaming at the mouth and quitting gaming altogether.
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We really need an endorsement feature where every player has a hidden "endorsement level" (or Kudos Meter, Reputation Score, whatever you wanna call it). This way, players can give thumbs up to survivors who actually try, making the thumbs up feature a thing.
Give them rewards like BP, BP multipliers, Iri shards, whatever works. And for those survivors who give up right after the first hook? They should be thrown into the absolute worst games imaginable, with Killers that slug at 5 gens and Legion players. They don’t deserve to play anyway.
There, problem solved. Once we get players who actually play, we can see what the real issues with the game are.
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If someone seriously tries to argue that "not making deadzones" is still a thing, you know they don't play killer. BHVR got rid of most zones with only one hook years ago. And by the time actual deadzones happen, all survivors are dead anyway
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3745013#Comment_3745013
No more survivors dragging out matches, but killers are still allow to do so?
It would be a fair trade if the basekit Unbreakable is in play right now, but its not
Luckily, a Killer can only drag out a match for a few minutes since you either bleed out or repair gens and escape. However, I did mention in my original comment that it would be nice to have a speed-up option for bleeding out.
Sadly, survivors can still drag out matches infinitely thanks to stealth and dropping and picking up items, which prevents crows from spawning. Unlike a killer slugging, this can go on until the match is forced to shut down. Now, if you were to ask me, I would say it's pretty obvious which case is more egregious, but that's just me. Both cases need their fixes regardless, so trying to get into an "us vs. them" discussion is pointless.
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@Peachblow said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3745013#Comment_3745013
I'm saying that it removes one of the few remaining elements of strategy that a killer must take. When I down a survivor that's in a corner or otherwise somewhat dead area AND they are at their last hook before death, I will ensure I take them to a hook that doesn't create even more dead space. Thus creating a bit more strategy for killers to decide where they should hook. If a killer was silly enough to kill the first survivor in a corner hook and creating a bunch of dead space, that's too bad on them. The change negates strategy for killers making them more of a potato and also renders certain Survivor wiggle perks a bit useless. Now if they reduced the overall number hooks in a match and implemented this at the same time, that would be an excellent compromise.
Right... going for the second closest hook instead of the first is such a brilliant display of skill that removing it would completely strip the killer role of any remaining skill expression. Lmao.
Seeing survivors pretend they understand the killer role will forever be funny, but in this case, it's even more hilarious because this change benefits survivors as well since it means killers are less incentivized to slug.
Given that in your first comment you said this change would make it so even potato killers will win, I assume you haven't touched the killer role since you started playing. In that case, let me tell you that it's been a long while since BHVR got rid of most zones with only one hook, so early dead zones (at 1 kill) don't even happen anymore, which you'd know if you played killer.
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3744990#Comment_3744990
There is skill and I already mentioned scourge hooks
Which skill, exactly? Going for the second closest hook instead of the first? lol
You can play every single killer by just going to the first hook you see and you'll do just fine. It isn't deeper than that. This isn't the killer buff you're making it out to be, lmao.
We also don't know the Scourge Hook interaction yet, and even if Scourge Hooks respawned as Scourge Hooks, it wouldn't be strong either. But keep advocating for mechanics that promote slugging, I guess. Everyone's got their own opinions. -
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3745013#Comment_3745013
It's removing the macro gameplay from the killer side, at least for creating dead zones.
Why shouldn't you have to consider creating dead zones when completing your objective? If we apply the same thinking to survivors, are they going to add that you can complete the same gen repeatedly after 60 seconds?
After all, avoiding a 3 gen is macro gameplay, and apparently you shouldn't be punished for creating a deaf zone by completing your primary objective.
Unlike a survivor's primary objective (gens), killing can be done without having to hook anyone at all. If I down someone in a dead zone, I can literally just let them bleed out to death.
If the last survivor is in a dead zone, the fact that hooks now respawn means that both sides get to move on to their next match without having to wait for the survivor to bleed out first.
In a scenario where there are two survivors alive and one goes down in a dead zone, two things can happen:
1) They get slugged because there's no hook nearby, so the other survivor just hides until this happens to grab the hatch/gate.
2) The remaining survivor goes for the pick-up, but since the killer knows where the dead zone is, they just go back and slug whoever they find first, repeating the process.
Both scenarios artificially drag out the match. But if hooks respawn, these scenarios are reduced and matches are faster without that annoying part at the end. This is a positive for everyone. Or do you like being bled out to death?
Also, picking the death hook of a survivor isn't as macro as you say it is. First, because there's a limited number of hooks you can go to (if closer to the edge, usually around two hooks to choose from). And second, because by the time the dead zones become a threat, the match is pretty much over as it means everyone is already dead.
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@Peachblow said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3744990#Comment_3744990
It's making killer play more brainless than it already is. At least with the current system, killers would need to think at least a little bit as to where they're going to hook, adding a small level of skill. Now a literal potato could play killer with how easy it is.
You do realize that in order for the killer to hook you, they have to chase and down you in the first place, right? Or are you saying that youre losing against potato killers? lol
This is simply a great QoL change, no more annoying survivors dragging out matches.
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There is literally no skill involved in having hooks get destroyed permanently. It’s a feature whose only purpose is to be annoying and to force the killer to slug, a product of 2016 DBD.
DBD isn’t a competitive game. If the last survivor runs to a dead zone, it’s only to be annoying and to drag out the match. The fewer opportunities there are to do this, the healthier the game will be.
And yes, killers who want to slug will slug; literally no one said otherwise. This is just a step in the right direction. The next one should be allowing survivors to speed up the bleeding.
Not to mention that punishing the killer for killing survivors is stupid game design in the first place. It’s like if completed generators revealed the aura of survivors nearby. It makes no sense at all.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3744215#Comment_3744215
You should remove your tinfoil hat. There are Bugs on both sides which are fixed quickly and there are Bugs on both sides which take ages to fix.
And I guess instances where Survivors got stuck on Hills on certain maps (which was in the game for weeks and only affected Survivors) or Maps being killswitched because Boons could not be snuffed out, but other Maps not being killswitched when Hexes were unable to cleanse were just a feverdream I had.
I get what you mean, but you're bringing up the most insignificant bugs ever. Getting stuck on hills? I don't think a single person was affected by this more than once (if at all). Unsnuffable boons/Uncleanseable hexes? That's literally due to poor map geometry and object spawns, not related to a boon or a hex.
Smaller bugs, like the ones you mentioned, make sense to be lower priority. However, there are bugs that have been affecting specific killers for literal years and haven't even been acknowledged yet. For instance, the double fatigue bug, Nurse's nauseating camera after blinking, Slinger's harpoon registering a hit but not chaining/injuring, Xeno's whip going through a survivor model and not injure, etc.
Yet, the moment one of these killers has a bug that affects the other side, it gets fixed in the next patch. I don't think you need a tinfoil hat to clearly see where the priority lies.
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@Jacknalls_Paw said:
Literally 4 years to fix Blight's hug tech. But sure, whatever it makes you feel better.
Hug tech took forever because McLean, who left, was in charge of it. Plus, they had to revisit all the object collisions to fix it.
But crouch tech is still a thing after how long? Pretty much the whole lifespan of DBD?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
No.
Just some Bugs are easier to fix than others.
But if it makes you happy - yes, the Devs totally favor Survivors and therefore they only fix Bugs which affect Survivors negatively. /s
Ah, of course. I'm sure they've spent the last three years extensively researching how to fix the bug. I'm sure a lot of progress has been made, but they're not quite there yet. I'll be eagerly waiting!
Also, I'm pretty sure it's just a coincidence that killer bugs affecting survivors get fixed quickly, while those that affect only killers get ignored. I'm not that conspiranoic.
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@Zakon05 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3743924#Comment_3743924
It's not like Franklins is a bad perk.
Bring this combo against a lobby full of medkits and it'll get you a lot of value.
Yes, perks are supposed to give you value. Especially if you have to sacrifice half of your slots instead of bringing stronger stuff. Thats how it works.
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If a Killer sacrificing half of their perks for aura reading that can be almost completely negated is too much for you, maybe you should stick to playing against the Killer bot instead of online.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3740531#Comment_3740531
So the counterplay you described with Mage Hand is actually the reason I have to admit that I underestimated Mage Hand's counterplay a bit. My problem with Mage Hand was that Vecna can just react to pallet drops instead of having to predict it. However, as I have learned thanks to one survivor I went against, if you react to the pallet drop, i.e. use Mage Hand after the survivor already pretty much dropped the pallet, the survivor can just drop the pallet on top of you because the cooldown is too long for you to get a hit before the survivor can drop the pallet. Meanwhile, if you predict the pallet drop, enough of the cooldown is spent during the pallet drop animation and you can get a hit before the survivor can drop the pallet back on you.
So in that sense Mage Hand does have counterplay, since theoretically you do have to predict the survivors pallet drop. But the problem is that pretty much no one knows of this. Which is why in most cases, as Vecna, you can just use your power on reaction. So in my opinion the nerf to Mage Hand that is confirmed is a good nerf. As it will simply allow survivors to loop the pallet again if Vecna uses his power on reaction instead of prediction, meanwhile survivors will be less likely to redrop the pallet on Vecna immediately because the pick up time will be longer.
When it comes to Fly, I really do wish you could bodyblock vaults and pallets, but that right now sadly doesn't work. Crouching under Fly should probably not be a thing. It's still a great map traversal and anti-w tool.
However, we disagree when it comes to FoTD. It can deny vaults and dropped pallets, and hit survivors while they are in animation, in my opinion FoTD will still be strong enough, even if it loses it's insta hit tech.
It's really hard to test right now because he's a new killer, and most survivors don't even know about the counters yet. This is also why I think the nerf was rushed. You can immediately tell the difference between survivors who know the counters and those who don't because they are super hard to catch in normal chases.
Yes, theoretically, the Vecna player can use Mage Hand at the right time so that the cooldown ends just before the survivor can drop the pallet again, but this window of time is around 0.1 to 0.3 seconds. It's not realistically feasible to pull this off. This makes Mage Hand's only consistent use (pallet lifting) pretty much useless once survivors know how to counter it (which isn't even hard, just stay still and spam the spacebar).
On the other hand, FOTD will still have its uses even after the insta-hit nerf, that's true. But using FOTD for guaranteed hits at vaults is extremely boring for both sides. This wouldn't be an issue since many killers have guaranteed hits in their kits, but it's a big problem for Vecna because his cooldown is so long that it discourages risky shots. Why go for a risky FOTD shot when a miss (which is likely) means you can't go for another shot for the next 40 seconds? And with the rest of his powers being as counterable as this one, it's just straight-up a bad play.
I'm not saying they shouldn't nerf the insta-hit interaction, but if the cooldown remains the same, Vecnas will only use FOTD when it guarantees 100% a hit (at animation locks) and won't attempt riskier shots that might miss. This results in extremely boring gameplay for both the killer and the survivor.
I've been playing nothing but Vecna, and the only things keeping him from the bottom three killers are 1) survivors not knowing his counters and 2) FOTD insta-hit. These two factors will disappear over time, and I think that once they do, Vecna will plummet to Freddy-tier, and the average player won't even understand why it happened.
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@Sarrif said:
I mean it should be nerfed if it's uncounterable. If he can just get free hits then that's obviously not okay. Would you be fine if they brought back old brand new parts and survivors can just insta pop four gens?
To be fair, you can counter it. You can predict if Vecna will try to do it, and you can also watch his model because he raises his hand right before spawning the skeletons. Sometimes it's super obvious and easy to counter. For example, in a short loop, if Vecna is standing on the pallet and you're on the other end, he's definitely going to try it.
It's hard to say right now because this "tech" was discovered pretty recently. Not only is Vecna new, but playing this way is even newer (less than a week). I've played against Vecnas who did this, and I haven't been hit by it yet. The counter is literally just crouching in spots where it makes sense for Vecna to try this move.
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@Pit_Bull_Love said:
Seeing that every match against any killer is a 4k now...I think Vecna's ability to tunnel and slug will be just fine.
And that is relevant because…
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They should've buffed the weakest slowdown perks along with nerfing the strongest ones. Honestly, they could even buff and nerf a bunch of slowdown perks every few months, and it would be pretty fun IMO.
But just nerfing the most useful slowdown perks without giving any alternatives really screws over the weaker killers. I don't use slowdown perks on Billy or Blight, but now Pop is useless for everyone. Your only decent options are Grim Embrace and Pain Res because the other 15 slowdown perks are totally awful.
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@ad19970 said:
Well mage Hand definitely needs the nerf it is going to get. When it comes to FoTD I am not quite sure what I should think. I can understand arguments from both sides. But I definitely doubt that nerfing FoTD like that would make Vecna weak. Far from it. Flight of the Damned will still be really good at denying pallets and windows.
Personally, I don't get why Mage Hand needs a nerf at all. If Vecna uses Mage Hand to lift a pallet and the survivor just stands on it instead of running, they can always drop it if they spam the button because Vecna can't hit or do anything else, so he just gets stunned.
There's a similar interaction with Fly. If Vecna flies over a dropped pallet and the survivor is on the other side, the game literally snaps Vecna in front of them, so the survivor can just vault back over, lol.
So if he gets FOTD nerfed (because let's be real, without that interaction, it's the weakest power in the game), Vecna will easily drop to being one of the top 5 weakest killers in the game. Every single aspect of him can be easily countered, lol.
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@SleepyLunatic said:
where is that hinted at?
The Japanese DBD account posted that they're looking into an uncounterable Vecna ability. It's not Mage Hand since that's already getting nerfed, so the only other option is FOTD.
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Happened to me once as Ghostface. And on him I also noticed that some chases took longer to start
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3737311#Comment_3737311
they probably do play the game but issue with bugs is finding ways to reproduce them reliably. if you can't figure how to reproduce, it is very difficult to fix bugs.
I agree. However, there's a clear lack of urgency in addressing about 90% of quality of life and bug fixes related to specific killers. For example, the Nurse has had a bug for at least half a year where the camera swings awkwardly after every single blink, making it extremely nauseating. This bug is so common that you can notice it in a single match. Yet, I guarantee that BHVR won't fix it until someone on Twitter goes viral, claiming that BHVR doesn't care about people with motion sickness or something like that. Then they will rush to fix it.
It's the same with almost every killer bug: BHVR doesn't care and doesn't fix them until they get publicly called out. Blight, for instance, has had a bug for around two years where you experience two fatigue animations. This is crazy, especially considering he has received numerous balance changes without any mention of this bug.
The priority simply isn't on making killers smooth to play. Actually, I can't think of a single killer that doesn't feel janky to play as in one way or another.
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Almost every single killer has at least one janky mechanic or bug. For example:
- The Knight can't place a guard if there's even a pebble nearby.
- Blight has a double fatigue bug that's been happening for years now.
- Nurse's nauseating camera POV after blinking.
- Spirit's FOV can lose you games due to how it works.
- Slinger's harpoon sometimes hits a survivor but doesn't spear them; it just goes back.
- Victor can easily go out of bounds after leaping.
- Plague's projectile vomit can visually hit a survivor, play the contagion sound effect, and still not infect the survivor.
- Dredge can't select a locker to go to if one is behind the other.
- Xeno's whip can go through a standing survivor and not connect the hit.
- The Artist's crows aren't tied to the ground, so the slightest bump will make them go out of bounds, leaving some areas unhittable with the crows.
These are just the ones I experience constantly. They are so common that if a single BHVR employee even played the game, they would experience them, but here we are.
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Deliverance can literally turn a lost game into a won one. It's fine as it is.
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Watch BHVR fix this but not the double fatigue bug
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3734308#Comment_3734308
Why you assume that I struggle getting down?
Because that is what you bring up as a counter-argument when I point out that Vecna's kit is wider than just his in-chase potential.
Because I say competent survivors have many ways of countering this killer?
That's a natural consequence of Vecna's kit being so multi-faceted. The more stuff a killer does, the more interactions survivors have with their kit, which in turn, inevitably, means more counters. This doesn't mean the killer's weak though. A killer with 15 abilities and a counter for each of those abilities, bar one, is stronger than a killer with three abilities with a counter for each of those. Even though the former has more counters.
Vecna doesn't just come with "a counter" for each of his (weak) powers; he comes with multiple.
Flight of the Damned:
- Dodgeable by crouching
- Dodgeable by standing in between
- Dodgeable by running up to Vecna
- Audio cue (to know when to dodge)
- Magic item that shows its aura (to know when to dodge)
Mage Hand:
- Susceptible to holding W
- Re-drop a pallet that's been lifted up
- Magic item that gives the survivor haste, completely nullifying the purpose of the power
- Magic item that shows the survivor which pallet is blocked
- Keep looping normally (lol)
Fly:
- Making sudden and tight changes of direction
- Magic item that shows the aura of the killer, revealing their location map-wide
Dispelling Sphere:
- Magic item that shows you the sphere, completely making it useless (and giving you info on where Vecna is)
Despite all of this, you will be able to pubstomp with Vecna simply because of how Solo Q is. But when facing a team of competent survivors (they don't even have to be in SWF), they will punish you and counter your abilities. In this scenario, Vecna's only strength comes from the guaranteed hits, one being Mage Hand to lift up a pallet as soon as it's dropped (which is getting nerfed soon anyway), and the other is using Flight of the Damned when a survivor is running to a vault. That's about the extent of Vecna's abilities when it comes down to good survivors.
Now, to all the counters I listed above, add the fact that each of those powers has a 40-second cooldown. This means that unless you use them in guaranteed hit scenarios, you will be punished for missing. If you go for a risky shot of Flight of the Damned in a chase, a good survivor will punish it, and you won't be able to try another shot again for the next 40 seconds. This makes playing Vecna against good survivors awful and boring since you can't take risks without having to drop chase or extending it for 40 seconds. This is simply, weak killer design.
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@Senaxu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3733989#Comment_3733989
Okay, then keep practicing. As you can see, you're getting better, you just need to give it some time.
If Nurse were released today, many players would describe her as "extremely weak and poorly developed" as it takes 30+ games to achieve. This is an established fact.
You're already doing well with your 8/10 3K games. As a nurse you would need more time to achieve the same result.
Just keep it up and I look forward to further updates on how you get on.What? If Nurse were released today, most players with time spent in the game would immediately realize her potential and place her at the top of the tier list on day one, lol. It's not hard to gauge a killer's potential in the first few days, which is the point of my entire post. You completely ignored my arguments about the design choices I critiqued and instead jumped to kills per match, as if that indicates how strong a killer is.