Eelanos
Eelanos
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- Eelanos
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I really like lightborn because I don't like to tunnel or camp or anything like that so I just equip it and smack people and pick them up without a care in the world. I just press forward and smack and hook and back. Pretty easy, pretty chill gameplay.
I do like to pretend I don't have it, though. It makes the game much easier while they try to figure out if they failed or if I have the perk.
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@Anti051 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4007654#Comment_4007654
(Gets unhooked), (OTR activates), (gets healed by rescuer in under 10 seconds).
"Wow, I've still got 70 seconds of invincibility! I'm gonna go screw with the killer for perk value!"
(Body-blocks killer in another chase), (Gets exposed by Ghostface), (purposely takes the hit but doesn't go down due to OTR god-mode).
Killer ends up getting significantly punished by the abuse of a so-called "anti-tunnel" perk.
… honest to God, is this actually a problem for you? Because while I've had some premade survivors that were frustrating to face, what you're describing has never been a problem for me because it's so damn obvious what's happening that I just don't touch them unless they intentionally get into smacking range. If they spend 70 seconds running next to me to take a hit, that's 70 seconds there's 2 survivors in chase, which is good for me. And if they're stupid enough to get into range and get hit without me having to chase them, that's value for me, not for them.
If anything, I'd say in your situation you're the one supposed to be punished because you saw a recently unhooked survivor make a beeline straight towards you and your first thought was "wow, they're so dumb, I'm going to waste time stalking them. I'm so smart".
If that isn't getting outsmarted, I don't know what is.
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Honestly, I've been playing more killer than survivor since 6.1 but I was excited about this patch. I thought I could finally play survivor again and have fun. I'm so disappointed that the game is still going to be "Get someone out of the game in the first 30 seconds" because whoever is the first target just queued for no reason or benefit.
Probably the only change I was worried about is the whole "If you kill someone before 6 hooks everyone gets 25% gen speed". I get the concept, but BHVR is so prone to applying 6 different fixes to the same issue and they were already testing ways to give a hooked player some chance of survival. The delayed unhook notice, for example, already does plenty against tunneling. Test that FIRST and only THEN, if needed, push harder.
They keep doing nothing for 6 years and then applying all the fixes they should have tested throughout the years in a single PTB, of course the changes are going to be dramatic for the players.
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@KeefCheif said:
THIS is why we will lose 75%-99% of new players from the FNAF surge.
Pretty sure the anti go next system already did that by banning them for dying in the first 3 minutes of the match.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
If you're looking for PvP, I'm afraid your options are very limited.
If you don't mind PvE, The Outlast Trials, or maybe even R.E.P.O might be more up your alley?
It's such a shame Assassin's Creed multiplayer was left to rot like that all the way back in Black Flag. It was probably my favourite stealth game. Lots of people played for the chase, but you could play full on stealth and outscore the entire room. You just needed one good 1300 point kill and you'd go from last to first. Patience and a good eye to track players was key.
Unfortunately, you're right we're kind of limited on stealth multiplayer nowadays. Carnival Hunt is probably the closest to what they're looking for, but it hasn't even released yet.
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I'm gonna be honest, I can never relate to achievement hunters because a lot of these achievements they complain about can be completed by playing naturally.
This is not like some achievements in some games that require you to spend several months trying to kill some optional boss fight while butt naked to get it, which makes me want to rip my hair out. It's just "play the game. Like, a lot. And it'll eventually happen naturally."
I've seen people complain so much about the RPD achievement, for example, and I got it naturally just by playing the game.
Hand-Eye Coordination? The D&D chapter released June 3rd 2024 according to Google. I got it June 5th by complete accident.
Don't consider this an attack on your person or anything, I genuinelly don't understand the mindset. It's just that in my head most of these achievement are the most basic, easiest "just play the game to get it" type of achievement on par with "Start the game for the first time".
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@squbax said:
While yes bhvr has done a lot of killer buffs since the inception of the game. To my knowledge, aside from trickster, no killer has recieved a base movement speed increase (I may be wrong tho).
And hell no I dont want to go back to old dbd, with infinites, instant moris, maps that looked like dogwater, instant gens, perma sabo and og 5 blink nurse. That was just awfull.
What's the reverse of rose tinted glasses, because if what we have right now isn't worse, it sure as hell isn't better than what we had then.
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The Go Next epidemic became what it was because back then someone could pull the sickest comeback out of a single play and nowadays you know the result of the match within the first 30 seconds.
No one wants to stay on a match several minutes long when they know they lost within the first 30 seconds of the match. That's why the people that disconnect are survivors and very specifically full hex build killer players. Any other killer can pull a 0 to 4k at any point if they're smart enough, so they just endure until it happens (even if it ends up not happening), but full hex builds becoming perkless builds right at the start makes people quit because that chance of a comeback gets severely reduced.
So, yeah, same reason survivors started to "Go next". There was just no reason to play.
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Finally what people have been asking for! "Kick out of my games anyone with less than 4k hours in the game"!
This community and the dev team's aversion to new and casual players is finally taking shape in the form of the ultimate anti-newbies game mechanic.
I'm excited to see what this means for the future of the game.
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This is by design. Killers can't stand when survivors turn corners and they lose track of them, so now every action that hides your scratch marks gives them your location.
Tracking survivors is not a skill they enjoy developing, so the game has been changed so they can focus on the fun parts, which is just immediately locating their fodder players and killing them.
I honestly would recommend people to just switch to killer. Survivor gameplay has changed so it's entirely based on being cute so the killer takes pity on you or dying. If you're looking for some power play, just switch and enjoy playing god. The game at this point plays itself anyway. You just have to roleplay if you want to be the evil killer or the nice killer.
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I've already read about 4 different players coming for the FNAF chapter and uninstalling after the game locked them out of queuing because they got tunneled since the first minute of the match.
All the junk this game has is getting exposed by the FNAF chapter and the anti Go Next mechanic. It's beautiful.
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Because the aim with this chapter is baiting new blood into the game if at all possible, and stealth is notoriously disliked and effective against low level players due to not having a good understanding of the game, the mechanics, and especially the maps.
So if you want the FNAF fanbase to try this game, you desperately need the chapter to be as newbie friendly as possible.
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It would have been cooler if he could have had a "spirit" form in the form of Glitchtrap to weaken survivors, then he snaps back to Springtrap and if he touches the survivor he jumpscares them and instantly downs them. They're both in some way different forms of William Afton anyway, if I recall correctly.
I was fully expecting him to be melee. I was not expecting at all for him to be ranged, even less so like this - a weird huntress knock off.
Like, at least bite someone's frontal lobe off. Sure, it's not lore accurate, but at least it feels more FNAF than this.
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I can 100% guarantee you if the changes drop the killer kill rate average from 60% even by a hair, the role will get major buffs in a couple of months max.
This is not even an us vs them let's farm some rage thing I'm making up on the spot, you have to be very disconnected from reality if you really think the devs are going to make big changes to something they've been considering strategies for so long without a follow-up if things swing too heavily to the other side.
The only two possible outcomes are: None of those strats are neccessary and their removal doesn't actually affect the kill rate negatively that much or at all, or they are and any balancing issues that arise from their removal will be polished in a follow-up patch soon after release (although "soon" for BHVR might be three months after, I will admit).
Regardless of the outcome, this is something that had to be done long ago. No game should reward people for doing nothing, even less so a multiplayer game.
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@Megaspyder said:
They say things like "Survivors have too many 2nd chances", "Survivors get handheld by bhvr" or "They get too much help with basekits and features"
Why do they say such things?
Usually it means they noticed the hud going "THIS PERSON YOU HOOKED IS NOW BEING RESCUED. QUICK, HIT THEM. EASY TARGET." and they didn't count to 10.
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OTR.
DS is a meme perk anyway. It exists solely to make "build value" videos and make people rage while simultaneously doing absolutely nothing for your escape rate.
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@StalkingYou said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3885738#Comment_3885738
that's why splitting up on gens lets you genrush even more efficiently :)
You're right. They should revert the gen stacking nerf and buff Prove Thyself so survivors stop spreading out and doing multiple gens at a time.
Finally a killer-only player take that I can get behind.
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@PleaseRewind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3884313#Comment_3884313
I agree with a lot of your takes but I just can't agree with this. I'll admit I haven't played a lot of 2v8 this time around but I've played around 20 matches. I've escaped 3 out of those. I would love to see your game play where these terrible players are all just walking out the gates. Sure, a number of my games have been with terrible players but they have all be sacrificed and not escaping.
You really should take his opinions with a grain of salt. Everytime he talks about his experiences with the game he tends to contradict himself. He simultaneously faces terrible players that allow him to instantly down everyone as soon as he spots them, yet somehow generators are done miraculously. How? I don't know. SWF must have passive generator progression or something, because it makes no sense how you can have one person in chase, one on hook, one rescuing and one doing gens and still 3 generators pop simultaneously.
Every once in a while he does raise legitimate issues about the game, but that's buried in a pile made of his own ego, thinking he's way better than he actually is. He never makes mistakes and can easily see enemy mistakes that give him almost game winning advantages, yet 3 to 4 escapes are super common for him.
It just doesn't add up. If it did, soloq would be thriving.
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I think it's because this game is simultaneously an asymetrical 4v1 co-op and essentially a free for all, all in one.
If I sabotage every game for every other player but make sure I escape at least 75% of my matches, have I won? Has the killer won? Are my matches counted as killer victories and survivor defeats, or as "killer win, survivor win, survivor defeat x3"?
Is hatch a victory or a tie? Are hatch pities just a way for killers to artificially buff survival rates? What exactly is a "win" here, and how many can win at the same time?
For the purposes of forum discussion, I pretend a 3K is a killer win and a 1K is a killer defeat, with 2K being a tie. Most of us run our discussions under these assumptions. That does change, however, while I'm playing the game. 3K is a victory if I'm the one escaping, and 1K is a defeat if I'm the first one dead because I'm not lingering long enough to see the full result anyway, and if I'm the one killing 2 people I'm satisfied enough that I consider it a "partial win" of sorts.
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You can't try to make a case about why tunneling and camping are necessary and then bring the book of the dead of all things into the conversation. If anything, you end up making a case for why the book of the dead was unnecessary on VHS to begin with.
Defending that this game needs the killers to have the ability to stare to death the first player they down because another game had a mechanic that resurrected players and it failed is insane.You also can't talk about the myriad ways to play DBD brings to the table when we're literally at peak meta staleness with killers having a range between 1 and 2 actual builds to play and a final, meme-y one that gets some play, and survivor gameplay boiling down to "Am I in chase? If yes, then W. If no, then gen."
Plus, the whole "In DBD you as a killer get to be a menace" is extremely subjective. All you have to do is check the forums and I can guarantee you the first page has at least 5 people talking about how you don't feel like a threat because survivors have flashlights and flashbangs, or because they can loop killers for more than 30 seconds. In the end, people just want to kill others when they say the want to feel like a threat. Any resistance the other player can put to avoid getting killed, especially if they can successfully escape the killer, will immediately burst their power fantasy, and that's just unavoidable. It's part of the reason this game has almost 70% kill rate, because even a bad player has to feel like an unstoppable force against a good team.
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@danielmaster87 said:
This is a very simplistic and emotional way to view it. Killers aren't being 'lazy', 'cheap', or 'skilless' by slugging. They're playing smart (playing to win). I can only assume you're playing at a level which doesn't require you to do that. But some of us do play at that level. Yes, it becomes THAT hardcore. Gens done in 5 minutes or less. All 4 run out, with 2 hooks total. Survivors letting themselves get downed just to protect a death hook teammate or to complete a gen. And this is against high level killers, who are powerless to stop it.
We've come to the conclusion that hooking is no longer worth it, because of all the benefits survivors get vs what we get. With Pop, we can knock 8% off a gen or something, with Pain Res another 20%, and then the gens get done away. But with Resurgence survivors can instantly heal off hook, with Deliverance they can unhook themselves, with DS they get a free stun even against non-tunnelers, and they've still got several hooks to go. Why would we want to bother with all that? Playing into all that would be eating out of the survivors' hands. We'd be playing to lose. So we slug, and circumvent all of that. There's no malice, or lack of skill or game knowledge, in doing that.
I can't believe I'm gonna say this, but this is probably the first time I agree with Danielmaster87.
Slugging, not to check for pallet or flashlight saves, but heavily and for a multi-survivor down, is an easy way to bypass core game mechanics by putting very little effort, essentially working as a shortcut to victory. It disables about 80% of the survivor perks and can transform a 0 hook game into a full wipe.
It would be foolish for the killers not to slug when you can essentially bring a game to a halt the moment two people are on the floor. If anything, if you think about it, killers going for hooks are essentially just either throwing or flexing, when heavy slugging is just the most efficient way to gain an advantage over survivors.
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At some point we have to stop complaining about killers doing this and survivors doing that and just hold BHVR accountable.
One of the jobs of the developers and the balancing team is protecting people from themselves and others. They should know people are gonna behave like this and put mechanics into place so this doesn't happen.
They should introduce the self-pick up already. And once that mechanic gets inevitably abused (because there's awful people on both sides of the player base, it's just unavoidable) then fix, patch or introduce a mechanic specifically added to prevent the previous one being abusable.
We can't just have this conversation every event. "Wow, killer players are awful", "Wow, survivor players are awful"… no, gamers are awful. This community is full of people who don't play to win but to annoy others. This is unavoidable, but it's BHVR's job to prevent this from happening to the best of their abilities.
We can't just trash talk the other side into submission because then nobody yields and nothing ever gets fixed.
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"Its impossible to have fun in solo Q man. I think I won 3 games in the last few days."
That's by design. The game is designed in such a way that killers have to kill about 3 people on average.
Someone else said it best on another thread:
- Here's one set of games: 4k, 4k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k
The killer has a 60% kill rate, but only a 20% win rate (with an 80% draw rate).
As you can see, if two people leave in 8 out of 10 matches, the killers only win 20% of the time, so for killers to actually feel like they're winning half of their matches, your team has to get wiped out several times each time two survivors escape a match.
Every match you manage to escape, you're dooming, what? 20 survivors to get killed? So your options are: Play killer, or lose matches until you escape once and then quit.
I especially encourage you to quit playing if you manage a 4-man escape. That's about as much victory as you're gonna experience for a couple of days, so just go and play something else before you become statistical fodder.EDIT: By the way, this is why we have a giving up epidemic. Everyone's killing themselves chasing their golden game. People log in, play the game, give up the moment they go on hook because statistically they're already dead, and then move on looking for their turn to be the one player escaping.
So enjoy the process or uninstall the game, because nothing is gonna change anytime soon.
- Here's one set of games: 4k, 4k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k
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@Sngfun said:
Hate to be that guy but old hatch was the comeback mechanic we got rid of. It made the 3v1 and 2v1 actually playable by adding a dynamic secondary objective that incentivised survivors to move around the map for the chance to escape, risking being found by the killer.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/88UPU0CVJOR8/6ke7zh56wq761.png
The problem with these types of mechanics are that they can be abused by coordinated groups, which are the reason we lost these comeback mechanic in the first place…
We desperately need this back. Even killers complain about games taking forever in 2v1s if both survivors decide to hide, so this would benefit everyone.
Plus, if it's competitive scoring what's worrying people, the game could take hatch escapes as kills for the killer and draws for the survivor. There, a 4k for the killer and a quick way to end the match for survivors. Everyone's happy.
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@H2H said:
The devs' current targeted kill rate is 60%. HOWEVER, this does not automatically mean killers have a 60% win rate!
Imagine a killer plays 10 games. A 60% kill rate means 24 survivors die, and 16 escape. A win for the killer is a 3k or 4k.
Here's one set of games: 4k, 4k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k
The killer has a 60% kill rate, but only a 20% win rate (with an 80% draw rate).
Here's another set of games: 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 0k, 0k
The killer has a 60% kill rate, with an 80% win rate (and a 20% loss rate).
My point here is not to argue the appropriateness of a 60% kill rate or if this is a good balancing decision. It is merely to point out that a 60% kill rate can mean wildly different win rates in different conditions.
Kill rate is not win rate, please stop conflating them, thank you.Here's one set of games: 4k, 4k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k, 2k
The killer has a 60% kill rate, but only a 20% win rate (with an 80% draw rate).Here's another set of games: 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 3k, 0k, 0k
The killer has a 60% kill rate, with an 80% win rate (and a 20% loss rate).Have you noticed that if you take both of your scenarios into account survivors only win twice in comparison to the killer's 10 wins?
Your horrible, terrible, atrocious killer win rate of 20% with a 60% kill rate lands 0 wins to survivors for a wooping 0% win rate.
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I think you should check your recency bias, because I haven't had that experience at all. You got one or two bad weeks and suddenly it's a problem? Come on. We all have bad streaks. Take a break from the game and move on.
I think you're just exaggerating a problem that isn't there. Especially the humping thing, because I haven't had that experience in literal months.
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Let me preface this by stating that I don't necessarily think this is what the devs should do. I need people to understand this before I continue.
Having said that…
If you want people to stop giving up on hook, you first need to remove the d/c penalty.
Most people don't kill themselves on hook because they're spiteful or actively want to ruin the other players' matches or whatever. It's much simpler than that: Killing themselves is the fastest way to end the match without having to go through the penalty. Rarely ever is there more depth to a suicide than "I don't want to do this".
Ideally, I'd much rather have BHVR fixing the issues the game has that lead to suicides, but what those are or how to fix them is an entirely different beast that I don't want to tackle here because it'll quickly derail the thread, particularly because people don't agree on them anyway.
However, with the introduction of survivor bots, I think the removal of the d/c penalty is somewhat of a more defensible stance. After all, it doesn't leave the match in an unfair 3v1 like it did in the past. At the very least there is a substitute for the missing player, and at best, a better survivor altogether.
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@Vishlumbra said:
Ok, everyday there’s dozens of posts crying about tunneling or slugging and such. Let me try to help you understand something: That’s the idea of the game. It’s supposed to be hard to survive, that’s the thrill of the game.
The game is incredibly survivor sided. You might say:
“Killers hold a 60% win rate” Yes buuuuut this is considering every single tier, skill and mmr division there is. How many times have you had a guy leaving the game after his first hook? People doing glyphs, opening chests or just being silly and not doing the objective? A lot right? If people played to win as survivors, it would be at least a 70-30 survivor win rate.“We don’t believe you!”
Have you seen competitive games? Every single game the killer has to slug, tunnel and camp hook and most of the times he gets a 2k, with all gens completed in 5 minutes.
Please guys, understand that is part of the fun, beating the odds and surviving. Even end game is very survivor sided. Hatch, unbreakable, keys, doors, adrenaline. There’s plenty of chances to survive, just enjoy the fun and stop trying to nerf killers to the ground, at high MMR is already very hard to win and dare I say, stressful as hell.
That’s the idea of the game. It’s supposed to be hard to survive, that’s the thrill of the game.
The game is incredibly survivor sided.
You cannot have those two statements back to back. You either believe the game's supposed to be hard to survive, and therefore believe the game is killer sided, or believe the game is incredibly survivor sided, and therefore that it's not supposed to be that hard to survive.
Have you seen competitive games? Every single game the killer has to slug, tunnel and camp hook and most of the times he gets a 2k, with all gens completed in 5 minutes.
I'm begging people to understand that the game they play when they sit in front of their computer after coming back from studying, working or having a hard day of pleasuring themselves after being unemployed for 6 years is not the same in any way, shape or form to a group of trained people specifically on the intricacies of this game.
You, Dude McDuderson, the couple of hours you decide to sit down and play the game, are facing on the daily:
- Luwucie-chan, who's blasting Barbie Girl on her cat headphones while she streams the game and plays Smash or Pass with the killers she faces.
- Captain Shityourpants, who's having a blast playing Seagull Steve.
- Hex: Cuse Me, who is just playing Feng because the bunny ears' physics are hilarious to them.
- xX.BlackDeath.Xx, who's probably younger than the minimum age requirement to play this game, and is having an aneurysm everytime they see the other 3 do literally anything that's not a gen and will most likely sell out any of them to the killer if they so much as catch a glimpse of one of them hiding in a locker, even if it costs them the entire match.
And sometimes, just sometimes, you're facing a premade of 4 that follows you around with Head On and flashbang just to ruin your day, whether they win or not.
You are not, under any circumstances, facing tournament-level players every single match, because you yourself are not a tournament-trained player. Sometimes you just lose matches, either because you misplayed or because someone else outplayed you, and because 70% kill rate just doesn't equal 100% win rate, as much as you'd like that to be the case.
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@Rudjohns said:
Use Object of Obsession and you will see the killer as well
I wish that was true, but for whatever reason, whenever I get object I face either a stealth killer or a stealth killer perk and it ends up being more of a detriment than anything.
I feel like the current best anti-aura perk is Sole Survivor.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3831609#Comment_3831609
Doesn't matter how fast or slow it is. Survivors will leave each other on the ground to gen rush if they're able to do so.
If there is a survivor able to make a rescue, that's the play that needs to happen.
What's the killer doing in the meantime? You're telling me that with, I don't know, a 20 minute timer, a killer is getting genrushed by 1 survivor and is powerless to stop them?
If the answer is "no", that means there's a healthy middle ground we can work with, where an altruistic recovery is multiple times faster, but a self pick up is still possible.
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I want voice chat so badly. I want DBD to have its own streamer granma.
I also want to just tell people "Nah, don't try to pick me up. Dracula's humping my body while in wolf form and if you try to help me he's slugging our asses. Just finish the gens and go."
They just have to make it opt-in and give us a mute button for that one player blasting music through their Happy Meal microphone.
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Hm… not sure. I've been getting more value out of Sole Survivor and Shadowstep than Distortion. Distortion tokens being limited to 2 feels like simultaneously keeps me at cap constantly and yet it's gone when you need it most, unless the killer is running some in-chase aura reading. Otherwise, I get a couple uses per game and that's it because any tokens earned on the last chase are gonna be wasted anyway.
With Sole Survivor you start with nothing and gain power the worse the game gets, which is when you need it most, plus you get the gate opening speed in case hatch is not an option, so it gives you huge amounts of value on any match you're getting stomped.
And with Boon: Shadowstep I get to prevent aura reading while I'm healing team mates which, again, is exactly when I need it most, and if I'm lucky I get to have aura reading prevention on the gen I'm repairing or no scratch marks on some good loops which will throw off killers pretty often.
I feel like if they want to keep it like this, increasing max tokens by one or two would be ideal. Either that or create other anti-aura reading perks for specific situations instead of the more universal ones we have at the moment.
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@VantaNite said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3825723#Comment_3825723
Distortion will be getting buffed again in the future. They've caused too many issues and ruined alot of balancing issues with such a strong nerf and no viable counters.
Is this a confirmed thing or you just think that's what's going to happen?
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@LadyOwO said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3825352#Comment_3825352
I pray it's not a nerf. That would really be lame
It's probably going to be a nerf. Didn't Wake Up also have the hidden benefit of waking you up from Freddy's power? That's probably it.
I'd be very surprised if it was something like "Open gates are revealed to all survivors" or if they change the aura reveal from "while opening" to "while near an exit gate switch".
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High usage rate. That's it.
People lose a match, get angry, go to nightlight to find something to blame and see WoO at the top. They assume if they get the perk nerfed they'll win all of the matches, the perk does get nerfed, they get a month of free wins as survivors find the next best thing to equip, then one of two things happen:
- Survivors do find a perk that gets them value and switch to it in droves. The cycle begins anew, switching WoO by whichever the next top rated perk is.
- Survivors don't find a perk that gets them value and kill rates spike. Killers get inevitably nerfed and they start complaining about the devs being survivor mains and the game being survivor sided when in reality the game went from 70% kill rate to 73% kill rate and back again to 70% kill rate after the nerf.
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Matchmaking doesn't exist. MMR is a lie. We're at the mercy of God whenever we queue and He hates this game and its players as much as we do.
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@Rawrbot5k said:
From forum posts, streamers and youtubers the general consensus is this event as well as the last few events 2v8, lights out, etc. have been arguably killer sided. Just wondering if this is a trend that will continue like a balancing of the scales due to the normal game play being noticeably SWF survivor sided like lets throw the killer mains a bone? I get wanting to please everyone but when both sides are commenting on how it's imbalanced for one you would think that point of fact would have come up in developing the mode no?
This is going to continue that way because people have convinced the devs an asymetric game cannot be balanced around a 50-50 win rate and insist that the killer being the power role means killing everyone in 9 out of 10 matches, with 8 out of 10 being survivor sided and 7 out of 10 being an awful killer experience with every other match facing bully squads. The power role should not get less than 4 kills on average per match and that's why every once in a while you'll see people complaining about mechanics like the hatch because it makes killers lose matches out of pure RNG and not pure skill.
This is why events are usually balanced like "Survivors get reduced pain sounds while crouching. This effect is disabled for 60 seconds after touching a generator, healing, blessing, cleansing, opening a chest, picking up an item, using an item, unhooking or getting unhooked." and "Killers get to kill survivors remotely from the other side of the map".
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3822167#Comment_3822167
I keep seeing posts like this from people who claim they escape far below the average rates. Only one of these things can possibly be true:
- They actually escape more frequently than they are claiming
- They are far less skilled than the average survivor player
- BHVR is providing bogus escape rate statistics
So, which is it?
Hyperbole it's called. To add a bit of drama and let other people see me and my friend's desperation about the state of the game.
My actual escape rate isn't exactly 12%, that number is largely chosen out of what it feels like and not what it actually is. But neither is the 39% average escape rate officially provided by BHVR.
Just last night I played the event for several hours and I managed to escape twice, one of the games out of a killer rage-AFKing. Most games were a full wipe (4k), with a few having either pity or legit hatches. No matches had any more than single player gate escapes.
As you can see, even if the figure is made out of feel rather than hard data, it aligns much better than the so-praised 39% escape rate BHVR gave us.
It would be completely fine saying that I could suck as a survivor, yet this opens the question: Why are there no killers at my same skill level? Is perhaps the skill floor for killers just nonexistent? Survivors are required several thousands of hours to perform "acceptably", but killers can just walk and click to win?
And so, we loop back to the issue I presented.
I recommended the game to my friends. We played together. Inevitably died for hours on end. Absolutely stomped as killers. They got bored, they didn't want to play survivor only to escape two matches a day, then they left.
Is this reply acceptable to you, or do you have more ChatGPT-esque doubts you want me to solve? Because I swear this reads as a "Gotcha!" made by someone that has never talked to an actual human being.
I cannot recommend this game to people if they require 1000 hours of play time and an academy-level training course by Mish herself to have more than two escapes a day. I already tried and none of my 3 friends liked it.
Only one of my friends reinstalled the game, and it was exclusively to play 2v8. The moment the game mode left, they uninstalled again because they do not want to play survivor with me.
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I used to recommend the game, but my three friends did exactly the same:
Play survivor with me for about a week, we get pissed off because get into a losing streak.
Decide to play killer by their own. Literally just click people to death. 1 to 3 weeks of playing the game on and off.
No one wants to play with me anymore.
They get bored because we can't play killer together but we don't want to face a 12% escape rate either.
They leave.
I'm the only idiot that likes the concept enough that's willing to put up with people that don't know what balancing a game means in the forums, and the ######### show that solo q is. And still I need plenty of breaks or this game will make me lose my mind. Heck, this event is already testing my limit as a fan of the game.
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I've been using this, only switching Quick & Quiet with Inner Strength, and while it's not 100% guaranteed you'll escape (Open maps are a nightmare for this build) it definitely messes with killers a lot.
I'm a bit worried, though. This feels like the kind of build a youtuber would make a video about, it would become popular and then the forums will be flooded with "Why this BUILD is the most TOXIC and UNBALANCED thing to EVER happen in the HISTORY of THIS GAME" and then the devs will just obliterate the build out of existence with some nonsense nerf like "Lucky break now reveals your aura to the killer for the entire duration" or "Lucky Star now makes you scream and exposed after leaving the locker".
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3820624#Comment_3820624
You can tell because the Killer bots play so much worse than the Survivor bots.
Also you can tell you’re playing against Survivor bots because on low loops you can see how they match your input perfectly lol
Hm… I wouldn't say so. I mean, yeah, sometimes they're dumb as a rock, but sometimes they will feel like cheaters.
I recall last 2v8 I faced a few Nurses and Billy bots and they would literally dash cross map to catch survivors even when there was no aura reading being applied.
Heck, a Hillbilly literally used his chainsaw from the other side of the map to catch up to me while I was in a locker. I was really confused until I noticed it was a bot in end game.
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Have you tried pairing it up with Furtive Chase for the haste? Plus, people will have less reaction time because you'll be moving around without terror radius, and being a Deathslinger that shortens your time to catch them more than your reeling time ever will, I think.
Then again, I don't have Chucky, so I don't know if the perks pair well together. I'm just going by the description.
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Didn't we just have a thread about how endgame perks were fine because you had to sacrifice match-long perk effects for them? And everyone was like "Yeah, 20% extra speed, undetectable and instadown on killers is fine, you're sacrificing early and mid game perks for these effects. People are just being dramatic".
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@ratcoffee said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3819659#Comment_3819659
Usually when people say "lose-lose" they mean "a scenario where everyone involved is forced into a result that is bad for them personally"
When you say "lose-lose" do you mean "uncounterable," as in no matter what you do you will "lose" because you fail to counter the perk? Neither of those perks are uncounterable either.
This might be me not having English as my first language and completely misunderstanding what the term means, but aren't situations where there's no right choice also considered lose-lose situations?
So, imagine a 1v1, the hatch spawns on a hill, and from the hill both gates can be seen.
As the killer can stand perfectly still and protect all 3 exits, this forces the survivor into a lose-lose situation, as no matter what the survivor does, they will die. They either don't do anything and die by EGC timer, or try to open the gates and die by the killer's hand.
I'm checking Wikipedia and it does seem to mention something like that:
In game theory, a "no-win" [or lose–lose] situation is a circumstance in which no player benefits from any outcome, hence ultimately losing the match. This may be because of any or all of the following:
>
Unavoidable or unforeseeable circumstances causing the situation to change after decisions have been made. This is common in text adventures.> Zugzwang, as in chess, when any move a player chooses makes them worse off than before such as losing a piece or being checkmated.
>
A situation in which the player has to accomplish two mutually dependent tasks each of which must be completed before the other or that are mutually exclusive (a Catch-22).>
Ignorance of other players' actions, meaning the best decision for all differs from that for any one player (as in the prisoner's dilemma).While Wikipedia does seem to mention it's a "circumstance in which no player benefits", they also seem to add that a particular player having to chose between options that only have bad outcomes do count as "lose-lose situations".
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3818451#Comment_3818451
You are comparing an entire build made around the endgame..... To one perk that could completely ruin any momentum and provide a free safe escape
That's not the point, but if you want to compare effects, the entire build shown in the video gives:
- 20% extra speed
- 60 seconds of undetectable (No aura reading, no terror radius)
- Up to 60 seconds of locked gates and a warning when someone tries to open the gates for the first time
- The ability to instadown survivors (2 health state hits per attack)
These effects come from 3 perks and an add-on and you still have a 4th perk slot and a second add-on to round your build to your liking.
This is being compared to:
A) A single use 4 second stun that disables your ability to do anything but running for 60 seconds if you want to get any value from it
B) A single heal (potentially) and 3 seconds of sprint
These are your "ruin your momentum" and "free escape" perks that are single handedly outvaluing your 3 perk end game build.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
Its an endgame build. Chill out. Those are very situational and sacrifice a lot of game control and pressure to attempt a comeback late game
That was also the case with perks like Decisive Strike and Adrenaline: They'd sacrifice a slot that could be used for gen speed perks or heal perks for the entire game for a chance that they'd come in clutch at the end game.
Still didn't stop people from complaining and the devs from changing the perks, so the whole "It's an end game build" kinda means nothing.
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@Bookern said:
Wglf has become so overtuned to the point killers can no longer slug for pressure if you slug for more then 5 seconds they get back up even faster 3 sec pickup if its double healing its become so strong it can be used in chase even more so when killer has to vault or kick a pallet.
4man slugging was ridiculous dont get me wrong but now were punishing basic pressure maybe if we rework WGLF to gain 200% pickup speed after 2 or more people are downed then it would be more fair for both sides
it can be used in chase even more so when killer has to vault or kick a pallet
This is a lie.
now were punishing basic pressure
This is a lie.
@CosmicScarab said:
I think WGLF fine against most killers, but The Twins feel awful when someone is using it. There has been quite a few instances where I cannot cross the map before someone is picked up.
This one is true.
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
Funny you say this, I played a match on haddonfield where two survivors had no mither, soul guard, breakdown, and something else let me tell you there are ways to not be a slug. Just so you know no mither procs soul guards endurance every single time. The third survivor would run head on and flashbang and also carry a bnp, they would all congregate in the basement across the street for Mikey's and proceed to bs. All while the fourth rushed gens with yet another bnp and gen build. Needless to say unlimited unbreakable (no mither I this case) was not fun at all and never will be.
Cool. Ask the devs to prevent that from happening instead of positioning yourself against a good update for 90% of the community from releasing just because you got bullied once by a (snicker)… No Mither squad.
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Jeff and Jane are hot.
Yui and Elodie have awesome designs. They rock and I love them.
And I haven't found anyone that agrees with me and I suppose it's because I have some sort of distorted sense of beauty but I think Haddie is really cute?
I mostly rotate between them when I don't have a mission that requires a specific survivor, but, like, 90% of the time you'll see me with either Jeff or Haddie.
Oh, and ocasionally Zarina. I just think she looks cool. It's not Yui or Elodie levels of cool, but I like her too.
If I have a cool cosmetic for the others I might switch to them sporadically. Lots of characters are one good cosmetic away from me using them more often.
And then there's this **** idiot:
If you see me play with him, I'm not taking the game seriously.