BenOfMilam
BenOfMilam
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A lot of it is that the servers have been iffy lately. I've pretty much never lagged in this game up until the past two or three months. In other games, I can play them lag free even when I'm teleporting and rubber banding all over the map in DbD.
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I always say "ggs lmao" unless it was a particularly unfun match and I just want to move on. If you're so upset about losing that you suspect the person offering you a digital handshake is BM'ing, you're probably the one with the problem.
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imo, Nurse needs a complete ground-up rework. Teleporting through walls breaks the fundamentals of the game, and you simply can't ever make it balanced.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2975437#Comment_2975437
It doesn't have any advantages.
That is the point.
You're in the wrong mindset. If you want to be blind to strategic choices just because you're salty that your teammate ran No Mither, so be it. I can't change your mind if you want to be obstinate for no reason. I for one hate when a teammate is running Autodidact, but I can at least see the advantages it brings.
No Mither is not a "slot it in, get free value" kind of perk. It's a combo perk that only works in a highly strategic and tactical setting.
1: You are permanently injured, and therefore never need healing. This saves time throughout the match. You also always benefit from Resilience. Additionally, your teammates will always benefit from Empathy, Emphatic Connection, Desperate Measures, and Blood Pact (if you are the obsession).
2: The killer cannot slug you, and they know this. This means even if the killer sees a chance to slug for multiple hooks, they can't because you have No Mither. They MUST pick you up, or accept that you are going to pick yourself up.
3: You leave no pools of blood and you are much quieter. This is a big deal. Hiding from the killer is much easier, which means they will waste large amounts of time looking for you just from you rounding a corner and walking.
It's a perk that works with certain people, and certain strategies. I actually don't care what you think, it's just something that only works if you fully understand the upsides and downsides of running No Mither.
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@Valik said:
I know this is a thread from yesteryear, but Ii'm going to revive it because I'd love some clarity.
I, for one, have absolutely no idea what anyone here is saying. Not only are many people flat out coming out and talking about No Mither as some sort of powerful perk, but the rest are often garnering concessions to say that it is only occasionally a powerful pick.
I really don't understand where any of this is coming from, it's almost as if everyone here is playing a completely different game than the one I've been avidly devoting my time to for the past 3 years.
Like, every single point I see people bring up to discuss No Mither as some sort of good pick is completely beside every fundamental reality of the game. must be missing something.
There have been 12 points brought up in this thread alone, and I honestly do not understand the concepts behind any of them because they are contrary to everything I've come to know from my 1,500+ hours of experience and thousands of hours watching content creators over the years.
- "it's a good perk for people who think the game is too easy" this is a very misguided debate, because it takes for granted that there are neither different challenges one could employ on one's self, nor a more eloquent - and perhaps less punitive - means of which to challenge a player. One could just as easily lower repair and vault speeds by 20% to make the game 'more challenging' - but that does not mean that it, by merit, is a good concept or should exist. Just because something makes the game more difficult does not mean that it has merit. One could just as easily bring other garbage perks or no perks to find a challenge in the game. Some have suggested not spawning injured, but becoming broken by the first instance of damage. This could be rendered redundant by the interjection of choice. A player could simply abstain fro healing to challenge themselves. Making the game more challenging does not make something, by merit, good,
- "Protection Hits! You can waste the killer's time by diving in front of teammates!" But it is not wasted time. You just hard traded. Any survivor can do this without No Mither. As keenly observed, killers cannot slug to continue the chase and must hook you - true. However, you exchanged hooks, which is invariably the same as preforming such an action without the perk if not worse still. if healthy you could potentially take two protection hits to the same end. In addition, this is such a convoluted and highly situational feat that could - ideally - only ever find its own employment twice in a match. In a trial where the killer's objective is to hook survivors as many times as possible, forcing the killer to hook you is hardly a consolidation. Hooks are extremely detrimental to the survivor team - they can cut the repair efficiency of the team by more than half and can allow the killer to slow the momentum of the survivors if not seize it absolutely. Giving the killer an easy hook that they cannot turn down is like cackling that you gave your worst enemy exactly what they wanted. When defenders use this point, they often choose to speak as though they can take a hook - and another survivor cannot. However, using such a trash perk that is displayed to the killer is a very easy way to get yourself tunneled out of the game instead. Any perk that's greatest use is "Hah! Now you have to kill me!" in a game where your opponent's job is to kill you - you're not doing much for the team. Even in this extremely fringe and ideal situation, such an accomplishment is nothing you cannot accomplish better without No Mither equipped.
- "You can pick yourself up off the ground! Unlimited Unbreakable!" Slow down there, scout. No killer is going to leave you on the ground unless they are letting you go free out of pity. They can see that you're broken and they know what that means. This aspect of the perk is not a buff, it is a mutual destruction signal. The 'revive self' part of the perk means that the killer is NEVER going to leave you on the ground, but will ALWAYS pick you up as soon as possible. Unless the killer intends to let you go, or frankly doesn't care about you and is fine with you taking a 30 second timeout, they're going to pick you up and walk you to a hook. And all of those hilarious trolls that think they're doing the Lord's work against a 4 slug, all the killer has to do is save one of you for last and stand on top of you - even if they hit you over and over, it takes time to recover. You're not doing yourself any favors. Picking yourself up once with Unbreakable is far, far, far more powerful than No Mither. Soul Guard can accomplish the same feat in many circumstances without forcing the killer to pick you up. You will basically never see any value out of the perk as a slug build - but if you do, it's because the Killer is more than likely taking pity on you or giving you a chance because of the horrendous nature of the perk.
- "You're so sneaky, leaving no blood trail can turn you into a ghost that no killer can pinpoiint!" Except 2 things: 1.) Killers don't often rely on blood pools any more than they rely on crows. The preferred method of tracking other than direct line of sight would be scratch marks. Scratch marks tell killers everything they need to know just by being there - if there are scratch marks, you're running; if there are no scratch marks, you're hiding somewhere nearby. You're not going to lose the killer in chase because there aren't any small red blobs beneath the bright neon red carpet that points to your location. While it may come in handy in very particular and stringent circumstances - it almost never will. Hide in a locker and pray to Jesus in heaven that the Killer doesn't see the little droplets of blood and think to yourself 'oh my, why didn't I take No Mither?!" No, because survivors very rarely hide in lockers so imminently, and often when they do - the killer can hear the squeaky hinges and deduce as much. Leaving no blood is not a selling point of the perk because it hardly does enough to conceal your location beyond what a competent killer is going to find regardless. 2.) Lucky Break, Parental Guidance, and Off The Record exist. Blood suppression is not a point No Mither has in its favor.
- "If the killer leaves you on the ground, you will be impossible to find with no blood trail!" But you still make noise anyhow. Killers rely more heavily on the sound than the blood to find you out anyway. The groans while Dying are reduced, but not muted. The killer is still going to find you if they return to the same general area. But remember - the killer isn't going to leave you on the ground anyway - because they can clearly see that you brought No Mither and want/need to be hooked. You're not a stealth slug, you're a hooked slug. The entity isn't going to care if your "Sacrificed" screen leaves a blood trail or not.
- "It adds variety to the matches, making them a lot more interesting!" Survivors take the same 12-18 perks when they have over 100 to choose from. No Mither isn't the sea salt caramel that we're all pining for. You want to dazzle a killer and your teammates with Variety? Go Red Herring, Solidarity, Repressed Alliance, and/or Blood Pact. Not only do these perks rarely see the light of day, but they do a lot more to help your team and make the match more interesting than No Mither ever could, and that's just to name a few. There are over 60 perks that, if brought into a match, would breath a lot of variety into the game without ruining the fun for everyone else who qued up with you.
- "This perk can make the killer focus on you and try to chase you down! You become public enemy #1 and can loop them forever!" That would be a good point, aside from two things: any killer worth their salt isn't going to go out of their way to attack you, especially not first. You cannot make a safe hook-run with this perk and you don't have to waste time healing, so chasing you first is sub-optimal. Unless the killer catches you out, they're likely going to save you for last - as the riskier the plays get as the trial draws long, the more detrimental your perk becomes. Unless you give them an easy open to the chase, they likely aren't going to prioritize you over anyone else. Quite literally, the killer gains no bonus slowdown or pressure by hooking you while everyone else is healthy - as all available survivors can go for the hook, and they don't even have to bother healing you! It's better to save you for later so that they can draw you into a disadvantaged zone or pull you into risky positions for the 1-hit down. But, even so, let's say that everything goes according to plan and the killer thinks you easy prey, why is No Mither the better perk for the chase? If you are such a strong looper that you can extend a chase for eons - then why is No Mither the best choice? Wouldn't it be better to have an empty perk slot and T-bag at the killer to get their attention? You could accomplish the same ends by different means - a flashlight with annoying clicky-clicks and T-bagging until the killer comes over and smacks you is literally the same exact thing, but wastes more of the killer's time and doesn't require a perk slot or the massive drawbacks. The perk betrays such an intention by working against your interests, it prevents you from capitalizing on it, it doesn't help you if you're good in chase, and it doesn't do anything that the crouch key doesn't already do for you.
- "No Mither allows you to become the tunneled survivor when the killer tries to tunnel someone else!" So, jumping into the fray to keep the killer from tunneling someone can be a good thing, yes. But don't you think it would be better to take a protection hit while healthy than to become the next tunnel? No only could the killer easily leave you so that your friends can pick you up, but even if the killer chooses to make you their new target, what all is that going to accomplish more than taking 2 protection hits wouldn't do better? Either you're in a position where the killer cares if you get up, or they don't. If it's late in the trial and the killer is gunning for that tunnel, why would they care if you go down? You have to spend 20-30 seconds getting back up anyhow and your friends are going to run off of generators to pick you back up, you just handed the killer a win-win they wouldn't have had if you were healthy. On top of it all, the killer could go right back to tunneling and, if they're lucky, they can still pick you up for a cheeky hook on the side. If it's early enough in the match that the killer isn't dedicated - swapping at the hook may make you their new target, but that isn't exactly playing to the strengths of your team, and could backfire very easily. The perk being the 'I'm a pro at hanging on the hook' is not a selling point. In addition, you could better and more effectively accomplish this with For The People: unhook and press E on them then run at the killer. It's not a play that you couldn't accomplish with other tools.
- "This perk allows me to use Dead Hard and Resilience by default!" This, hilariously enough, is the best argument. You can use DH to get away from a T3 Michael or a Cannibal chainsaw first thing, and you get a cheeky 9% buff to repair. But when you realize that most survivors can play super well without being constantly injured, and that you just used 2 entire perks to shave ~8s off of a generator when you could have saved more time by taking a hit while healthy. The ability to use everyone's favorite crutch perk, Dead Hard, whenever desired is very good - but when your entire reasoning behind using a perk is because using your 'everything proof shield' in extremely particular circumstances justifies not having a health state on top of your 'everything proof shield' is pretty bad. You might as well argue that this perk could counter The Shape because the killer can't stalk you for Tier3 if they already killed you in Tier2. It's very weak.
- "This perk makes 1 shot abilities redundant! The Exposure effect doesn't matter with No Mither!" So by giving the killer exactly what they want, they can't take exactly what they want ? That would be like arguing that you can't be mugged if you already gave the criminal all of your money. In the end of the day, you may not be getting exposed/mugged in essence, but you're still going to die/have-no-money. When a cannibal is squaring up against you, the fact he can use his M1 OR his Chainsaw gives him more of an advantage. Just because you feel slightly less pressure doesn't inform the killer's choice. Chainsaws and Exposure are intended to put you down in 1 hit. If you make it so that you go down in one hit by default, your opponent is going to laugh all the way to the bank.
- "It's Bully Squad heaven! Bring it with your friends and run the killer wild!" You wanna know the worst thing about bully squads? They are most volatile when everyone clambers for the saves. Those bully squads that line up to take protection hits for hooks are spending a lot of time off of generators and are very eager to trade precious health states that will betray them later on in the trial. When you bring No Mither, you have made those bully moments far more volatile. Your allies may be able to troll a killer by swarming you and making the killer prove a hard choice of picking you up or letting you revive... except the killer will quickly realize this and search around. Just because you can self revive doesn't mean it's dangerous. A killer can just as easily hit you once you stand up again. No flashlight saves are going to keep you from being hooked after your friends go for some sabotages and take a few hits. To a killer, hooks are time. To a survivor, generators are time. If you have an orchestra of teammates swarming around you to deny your hook - you're wasting generator time and are trading down with health states and resources. Off of a single No Mither squad, the killer can accomplish multiple downs and still manage to get one or more hooks. Trying to sweep in for the save in these situations is the #1 way SWF bully squads backfire. Worst thing is, this can be accomplished BETTER without No Mither. Without, you can be healed up and help your friends when THEY go down - and use that perk slot for basically anything better like Unbreakable, Flip Flop, Boil Over - all superior options. Not only does this perk fail to help these situations in any way that other perks cannot do themselves, but you should be actively avoiding these all-or-nothing saving throws as survivor, not betting everything on them.
- "There always has to be that one bad part of something, which means No Mither must exist - to give contrast to what's good!" Not only would Gestalt disagree, but basically anyone in design, engineering, or production would too. A machine strives for every part to be the best, and to serve a purpose. There is no part of a greater body that should seek to be the least useful. Everything in the known world - through both establishments in all religions and through the principals of evolution - point to the antithesis of this thought. There does not always have to be the bad one in a system. If BHVR was bought by Elon Musk tomorrow and he chose to make each and every perk fun and viable, by golly they could do it. By a combination of poor design and the active choice of the developers to make a 'Hard mode' challenge perk, this one has become the pariah. It is not a bad perk because there is a necessity for something to be bad in any given system. There is no evidence in reality or even gaming to suggest that this is some form of logical rule or reasonable expectation to hold.
- "This perk is very strong with X and/or X perk!" If you have to mix and match other perks to find value, does it really matter in the end? Flip Flop and Power Struggle are both good on their own, but enjoy increased usefulness when put together. Streetwise, Botany Knowledge, and Built To Last can keep an medkit in play - but when used together they greatly increase it potency. The problem with perks is what can be called called 'elective exclusivity'. You have a finite amount of choices, and many options to choose from. When you use more than one perk to accomplish a means, it must earn its keep by a multiple. But the truth is, all of the perk combinations and 'synergies' listed out for No Mither are not noteworthy nor exclusive. "Iron Will makes you always silent!" But Iron will always does that, and No Mither's only contribution is that it always hurts you. "Resilience will make chases and actions faster!" but it will do that with or without No Mither, the only thing NM does in this situation is place you on second square on the road to losing faster - like a killer bringing a new perk "All the Mither" which instantly completes all generators at the beginning of the trial 'it has great synergy with NOED' - but who cares? You were going to have better value from NOED without it anyway. Just because you attach something circumstantially useful to a bad thing doesn't mean it's generally useful. If your favorite mug helps you get through a bad day at work, equipping the new perk 'Work Mither' to make you have a bad day at work EVERY DAY doesn't mean that you net more value from your mug. If a perk gives you $15 - using the perk that puts you $5 in debt isn't exactly the clutch perk that's fully realizing the innate value of the former by fusing it with the latter. Iron Will, Resilience, Blood Pact, Dead Hard, Desperate Measures, Flip-Flop, Soul Guard, Unbreakable - these perks have value that they contribute to a match. No Mither does not, directly nor indirectly, make these perks more valuable than if you spawned healthy and could be healed.
Given these aspects, I have no idea how people can talk as though it is even a viable option in a match. Is it that low-tier killers falter and fail to understand the perk? is it that users are used to going against low MMR killers that lose them in chase and are impotent in their abilities?
What is the logic behind the praise that this perk is getting? I truly do not understand it once bit.
ngl, didn't read.
I'm still gonna give you my 25 No Mither matches tho :p
It's a perk that on paper, is extremely bad. Someone likened it to One With Nothing from MtG earlier in the thread, but I think it's more like Lich from MtG. For context, MtG, or Magic: The Gathering is a trading card game. You normally draw one card per turn and win by getting your opponent's life total to zero. That's about all the context you need to understand the card Lich.
Here's Lich:
When Lich enters the battlefield, your life total becomes 0. You don't lose the game for having 0 or less life. When you take damage, you instead sacrifice a permanent for each damage point of damage you would have taken. When you gain life, you instead draw one card for each life point you would have gained. If Lich leaves the battlefield, you lose the game.
A permanent is anything on your battlefield: lands used for casting spells, creatures, or artifacts and enchantments. Lich is an enchantment, btw.
Lich has MASSIVE drawbacks. For one, your opponent is always one decisive "Destroy Enchantment" card away from winning the game. For two, when you take damage, you're losing massive amounts of pressure from being forced to destroy your permanents. However, due to the intricacies of Magic rules, losing life and paying life are not considered to be taking damage. So you can use cards that say "Draw a card, lose X Life, then you may draw another card and lose X Life. You may repeat this process until you choose not to. " Cards that say "Pay one mana, gain 3 life" instead draw you three cards due to Lich's other effect (for context, drawing ONE card is a big deal).
No Mither is very similar. You pay a massive price, and change the nature of the game in a bizarre way. Using the strangeness to your advantage can create an unusual playstyle that can work. People like me really like things like that. So maybe chill out?
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2975264#Comment_2975264
No, two deads, one slug and him.
Boon: Exponential + Unbreakable? You can get a lot of recovery progress in a very short amount of time
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Maybe it was a stealthy pallet save and you didn't notice? I've had pallet assassins come in and get a surprise save when I thought no one was around.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
You can stop playing Killer, but at least stop opening Forum Posts as well.
This constant complaining is just too much. And most of the time the player behind the PC is the reason why they lose that many games. But for some reason, the DBD-Community (and this goes for both sides) is not able to reflect on their own mistakes. I am 100% sure that there are some players out there who never had the thought "Ok, maybe I did not play that well" and are instead blaming the game the whole time. (I know at least 1 vocal streamer is like that, so there will be more of those)
Queen, Preach! 🙏
No one is willing to say "I just played bad, I need to adapt"
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What? Trickster is basically ranged Bubba in the right hands. He's obscenely dangerous, and doesn't need any buffs.
Main Event is also a clutch button. It wins games, believe me.
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imo, Wraith is pretty close to unplayable without chase perks. M1 is just not viable in 2022. I run Spirit Fury + Enduring on him since you're going to be eating a lot of stuns as a basic M1 killer. I also run Starstruck to get giga value from stealth hits.
Taking away his super lunge was a not so good move, imo. Being able to cloak + uncloak midchase to get a big lunge was a big time investment and very counterable. If Wraith is ringing his bell mid chase, just camp pallet or sneak away from the loop.
Edit:
If you miss "Le Epic Big Lunge," I humbly direct you to Spirit, Myers, and the perk Coup De Grace : )
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If a survivor gets a 4%, it's not the end of the world. Generally the only time they are doing it is if everyone is slugged or hooked, so you basically already won at that point. One more chase won't hurt.
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@Awkweird said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2685137#Comment_2685137
This is interesting. Care to elaborate?
Necroposting.
Can a mod lock this thread?
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@Sakurra said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2974001#Comment_2974001
No. These people called devs worked hard for this map. Why can't you appreciate it?
I can't appreciate it because the map makes some killers literally unplayable. Specifically Billy and Blight. Not to mention the many god pallets and the library.
I also can't appreciate it because the it's a claustrophobic maze that makes finding gens difficult, and makes it impossible to gather information from a distance. I especially hate dying on first hook because the other survivors literally cannot get to me in time because they keep getting lost or the killer brought Third Seal.
I pretty much never play on that map, my computer always mysteriously crashes when I see an offering for it or I load into it.
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Wraith is an actual bottom tier, he doesn't need a mechanic that punishes him for... using his power near someone with a flashlight?
If lightburn got removed from Wraith he'd still be pretty bad, but less frustrating to play as. Like how Trapper used to have his traps get permanently sabo'd with toolboxes and Saboteur. Outdated mechanic that punishes players for picking an already bad killer, no one would be sad to see it go.
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@Claudirt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2974315#Comment_2974315
An interesting thought really, if you could only use it once. I feel like it'd kill the perk and people wouldn't wanna use it. The majority at least. What makes you think people would still use it? You get more value on other exhaustion perks at that point!
Dead Hard is straight up just that good. You can only use DS, Unbreakable, and Adrenaline once per match, and they're all pretty similar to Dead Hard in that they are a "Get Out of Jail Free" card, but Dead Hard can be used as many times as you want.
Dead Hard gives you a short burst of distance so you can reach a pallet or window and extend or reset a chase. Pretty much a free health state, like the other perks I mentioned.
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Kpop Jake:
That One Uncle you only see every other Christmas but his time he came to Thanksgiving and he's wearing the nicest clothes he could find:
A cute Julie:
Ace, my main (pick shirt good):
Catgirl Huntress:
Wraith, but he bankin':
Drip Min:
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If Dead Hard could only be used once per match, you would probably still see 2 or 3 a game.
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The issue is honestly gen speeds. I say that as a killer main that hates slowdown perks because of how boring they are and I hardly use them, and I also think complaining about gen rush is cringe.
It takes 80 seconds to do a single generator, and lets say it takes 20 seconds to find a second generator after you finish one. So 100 seconds per generator.
If only one survivor, I repeat, only ONE survivor out of the four survivors is doing gens and the killer is playing for 12 hooks, the killer has around 40 seconds per hook before the gens are completed. One survivor being chased, one on hook, one going for unhook, on on gens.
If two survivors are doing gens, the killer has 20 seconds per hook. Two on gens, one in chase, one hovering for unhook or flashy save.
If three survivors are on gens at all times, the killer has only 14 seconds per hook before the gens are finished. One survivor in chase, three on gens. The hooked survivor unhooks himself with Slippery Meat or Deliverance.
So the most efficient way to get multiple hooks quickly and put a dent in the survivor's gen efficiency is to just tunnel a survivor off hook. Face camping is a great way to throw the game, but tactically camping someone to second stage to punish a late unhook is a good play. Camping to force a 1 for 1 is also a good move.
Camping and tunneling is more an answer to how DbD works as a game. You do not have time to run around and chase every survivor, you need to kill them ASAP or they have a good chance to escape.
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2974089#Comment_2974089
Ruin is good if you can put on pressure.
blood favor it fantastic on trickster, artist, even plague
Noed can get you a 4k, I've done it many times myself learning a new killer, get absolutely stomped then, then downing everyone
Plaything makes tunneling and catching survivors off guard really easy.
Haunted Grounds punishes survivors for doing a side objective.
Third Seal, Huntress Lullaby, Thrill of the Hunt, and Crowd control I think are kind of bad tho.
Thrill is a pretty good combo perk with Plaything or with an all hexes build. Ruin + Undying + Thrill means cleansing Ruin takes either takes 40 seconds or 54 seconds. With Ruin + Undying alone, it takes 28 seconds.
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Giving keys something like having all keys reveal the aura of nearby survivors on use would be good. The add-ons would have to be changed, though. Then add more charges to all keys. Keys should have a use, but that use shouldn't be a free escape at 3 gens.
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Around this time of day in NA (3pm-ish), there's lots of killer players and not many survivor players. So you'll get matched with a lot of people outside your skill bracket.
Opposite with 8pm-12am. Lots of survivors, but very few killers.
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DbD needs a match timer. A twenty or thirty minute game shouldn't really ever happen
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Interesting! I wonder if it happens with Aftercare and Yoichi's reverse Empathy perk.
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winning quickly and efficiently feels good. blitzkrieg, blitzkrieg. blitzkrieg, BOOM
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He's pretty hard, imo. I played Doc a lot when I first started playing, but he falls off quick in higher skill brackets. Even once you get the hang of him, you learn that he's pretty mid and requires serious effort to do well in a match. His add-ons give him a lot of variety in playstyle, though.
Static Shock is not very good for anti-loop at all, but bringing Discipline add-ons and range add-ons make it way more menacing (and easier to get value). I personally think it's better at stopping double vaults than it is at cutting people off and preventing the first vault. Static Shock is also spectacular for denying unhooks, preventing gen commits, and protecting totems.
Static Blast is your real meat and potatoes. Gives everyone one tier of madness, and reveals everyone's locations. Don't be afraid to just spam it to keep everyone crazy. Fun fact: Hiding in a locker makes a survivor immune to Static Blast. This means if you know someone is around (Whispers, scratch marks, ect.), you should start checking lockers. For this reason, I think Iron Maiden is unironically a good perk on Doc.
Doc has passive slowdown from Snap Out of It, but not as strong someone like Legion or Pig. Slugging Tier 3 Madness survivors is also a pretty safe bet, since they are pretty much permanently revealed to you.
One of his best perks is Starstruck, which synergizes with his power and his Calm add-ons. Get a hook, Blast, and get your Starstruck value baby haha
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Based thread.
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@Mozic said:
"That's good advice, I need to drop my 3D chess set and pick up a 4D chess set. I'll try to think more about the entire chase as a whole rather than just whatever tile we're looping. Running I'm All Ears is a decent alternative to having superior game sense, however."
I'm All Ears is terrific! I had a "Nonstop Nemesis" build I ran for a long time that was BBQ + All Ears + Lethal Pursuit + Hysteria that was dedicated to starting a chase as soon as the match loaded in and being in chase until the game ends. All Ears on Nemesis in particular is choice for sneaking surprise M2 hits through vaults as survivors very frequently double-back past them after vaulting. I eventually traded Hysteria for Hex: Plaything, and I'm considering No Way Out for it now. Obvious gap is the total absence of gen control, but honestly I enjoy chasing on Nemesis to the point that I contentedly cede the objective control game just to keep scootin'
That said, All Ears is a terrific tool for remaining sticky in chase. In addition to the immediate value, it'll help you sharpen your sense of how survivors route.
And as for more intentional pushing survivors around to where you want them to go - the most common consideration I make when approaching a gen is which direction I want them to see me coming from.
I also like to run mostly chase perks, hah. If I'm playing a low-tier though, I'll usually bring three slowdown perks so I have enough time to turn half the map into a dead zone.
Forcing survivors to unhook and pick up slugs is also a form of gen control, but only if you can keep up the pressure and get constant downs.
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@Impalpable said:
The individual power level of the killer and ways of movement makes simultaneous balancing quite awkward. I just wonder if it would make more sense to balance for each killer individually talking about possible adjusted objective time and available maps, maybe some maps should be banned for specific killers if its obnoxious for them to play on them. Like what is a huntress doing on Lerrys, its awful gameplay for both sides each time. Maybe its perfectly fine to keep some of these huge maps if they only appear for high mobility killers. We can never expect the same results of a pig then from a nurse but both are pressured in the same meassurement system and we possible have to nerf cool characteristic to squeeze them in the same condition. But of course this take shouldnt take away from the fact that there are still design issues that needs to be adressed.
truly good take. Something like taking the statistics of a killers top 3 lowest kill rate maps and top 3 highest kill rate maps, and making those maps impossible to get as that particular killer. Then, the top 3 and bottom 3 banned maps can rotate based on changing statistics.
e.g. if a given killer had a kill rate of 1.64 on Gideon's, 1.75 on Ormand, and 1.81 on Fractured Cowshed, and on rank reset the kill rate on Eyrie of Crows is 1.79, then Fractured Cowshed rotates in and Eyrie of Crows rotates out.
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As a wise man once said, "Bwuhhh?"
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@[Deleted User] said:
A couple things you can do on all killers.
Check to see how greedy they are. Briefly cycle off as if you're giving up and then whip back around and try to catch them cheating back towards the gen they were on. I do this all the time with Nurse. It can gain back the distance you lost to Sprint Burst if nothing else.
I'm always playing for a 3 or 4 gen unless I have a crazy good start or I can teleport. It doesn't eliminate holding W, but it reduces what they gain from it and turns it into a stall. It also forces them to position poorly or rotate into their teammates if you approach from the right direction. So yes, you can hold W, but you're going to have to actually think about it or potentially throw the game.
The greed check is a good one. I haven't done it in a while, but I remember it being very effective.
@dugman said:
Probably the best strategic advice is know when to break off a chase or not take a chase in the first place. Sometimes you’re better off not chasing someone who is running into a remote area 20 meters away if it will take you too long to catch them and should instead ignore that survivor and go after someone who is actively on gens instead. Picking your battles based on what’s going on mapwide among all the survivors is at least as important as actually being good in a chase.
Indeed! Although, I overdo this a lot and end up dropping too many chases in a row if I find people back to back that can reach ultra-safe structures. With faster killers or with info perks, it's easier to tell which survivors are where and which gens you can interrupt.
@hailxsatanxeveryxday said:
Also, (and I say this with some irony), play Myers or Ghostface. Myers with Dead Rabbit and M&A means a 6m terror radius at EWII without being in a chase, which is just large enough to let survivors know that they just got hit. They'll also be confused and jumping on and off of gens all match (Ruin/Undying helps here) since your TR is randomly going to jump around from 6 to 40m, depending on what your EW level is and whether or not you're in a chase.
Ghostie's buffs help him a lot, but the increased ability to reveal him can be annoying (but also function as a poor man's survivor finder and can be a serious boon in the late game).
In general, with any killer, just adopt M1 tactics. The way you counter "hold W" when you're a Michael, a Sadako, or a Ghostface (and got spotted from far away) is to loop mercilessly. Eat those pallets, cycle through those windows a dozen times until the entity blocks them, and then take your kill. Sometimes, there isn't a better or easier way, and you'll thank yourself when the survivor is hooked and half the pallets in the map are gone in the process.
It also helps to know which chases to engage in. In every team, there is usually at least one god-level looper and at least one weak link. You're going to have to go after the god-looper eventually if you want to win, but pick them as your first real chase and you'll spend 5 gens playing with them at the jungle gym. Instead, find the weakest link and commit to that person. When they're gone/incapacitated, it drags the entire team down, and the decent looper(s) will have to leave gens to come and rescue them, putting them in a vulnerable position where holding W can't help...
The edit was more directed to the half-dozen people that just said "play my main instead of whatever killer you're playing" instead of giving helpful advice. Stealth makes Hold W way less effective, so I often run at least one stealth perk. Also yeah, sometimes brute forcing a hit is absolutely the play if it means you can get an meaningful down.
@Mozic said:
While much easier said than done, you want to avoid following survivors to where they want to go - try and herd them into worse areas (or catch them while they're forced into suboptimal pathing to reach the better areas and then disengage). When it comes to avoiding the hold W strat, you need to be thinking not just about the immediate loop but which adjacent tiles are worse. If you're playing a killer who is primarily countered by holding W, anticipate survivors doing so and loop in a way that maximizes your visual information so you can catch those disengages and adjust to stay on their tail.
It's daunting on paper, but if you make a habit of thinking ahead, you'll be surprised far less often and open yourself up to a world of reads and mindgames that involve more than just hiding your red stain around corners.
That's good advice, I need to drop my 3D chess set and pick up a 4D chess set. I'll try to think more about the entire chase as a whole rather than just whatever tile we're looping. Running I'm All Ears is a decent alternative to having superior game sense, however.
@ReverseVelocity said:
Get better at predicting where survivors are going to juke for long range shots. You can absolutely hit shots at 12m, you just need to anticipate where they're going to go.
A more general tip if they're holding W often is don't try and mindgame tiles, some survivors will start running at the first opportunity that they break LOS to try and make extra distance.
Indeed! I have no trouble hitting long range shots, and I'm pretty good at hitting those 17.9m shots on my good days. I'm mostly having trouble with highly attentive survivors with fast reflexes. I'll try predicting the juke direction next time I play against someone like that.
Break LOS and hold W is generally my strat as survivor, and it works a few times in a row before the killer starts punishing it. I need to find a good Litmus Test mindgame for quickly gauging a survivor's skill level and playstyle.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2972326#Comment_2972326
You can accomplish this and much more without No Mither.
Replacing No Mither with Built To Last paired with a toolkit is literally more efficient than the No Mither Resilience combination and does not require you to play on a challenge mode.
I highly doubt the validity of your claims to success, because if you escaped most matches, you'd quickly elevate to a level of play where your No Mither build would be obliterated.
I'll record maybe something like 25 No Mither games and then get back to you
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It would be really nice to have a "give up" or "concede" option. Like I get it, you downed the last two survivors, can I go please?
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2971998#Comment_2971998
Can Guarantee you 100% that there is no reality or alternate reality where No Mither becomes a viable perk.
It is literally designed to be the opposite of a viable perk.
It is quantifiably a bad perk, by the designers own admission - and by the core concepts of the game's design. It, at no point, has any intrinsic value to add to any match that cannot be extracted through more beneficial means.
I run No Mither in a lot of my games as survivor, and the end result is usually that either I escape, or I secure a 3 man escape for the rest of my team. The absolutely massive amount of time efficiency you get by never needing to get healed and always having Resilience active means gens will fly. Not being able to be slugged and essentially forcing the killer to pick you up robs the killer of the ability to snowball pressure via slugging.
I'm the kind of guy that will take Magic: The Gathering cards that are considered unplayable or game throws and turn them into combo pieces that can instantly win a game. No Mither by itself is a perk that makes you weaker, but it's quite powerful when combo'd with other perks that play into No Mither's strengths.
Run a couple games with one of the builds I suggested and see how things go.
Gen Rushing: Dead Hard, No Mither, Prove Thyself, Resilience
Gen Rush 2: Built to Last, No Mither, Resilience, Streetwise (and a Commodious with Wire Spool and Scraps)
Looping: Dead Hard, No Mither, Spine Chill, Resilience
Stealth: No Mither, Iron Will, Fixated, Resilience
No Mither + Resilience are your key components. If you are running No Mither, you'll want to run Resilience. Dead Hard pretty much makes the downside of No Mither non-existent, but you can play higher risk by dropping it and running something else. Your third perk can be whatever you want. Ultra-safe would be DS + DH, highest risk/reward would be Built to Last + Streetwise. Fixated is amazing with No Mither since you don't leave pools of blood, so you can always walk away from a loop to confuse a killer without making it obvious that you did so.
Don't build for extra anti-slugging perks, since the killer is going to insta-pick up every time. You could get away with sabo oriented perks like Breakdown or Boil Over, or an Alex Toolbox and prep an area in advance so you can pick yourself up after a drop or force a wiggle... but I don't recommended it since sabo is pretty dodgy and questionable in the first place.
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@Phasmamain said:
That’s deathslinger’s main counterplay so the best you can do is try to cut them off and only shoot when you know you’ll hit the shot
My favorite to is to aim dead ahead and walk slowly in a straight line until they just walk into my shot xD
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Most people that dox you will do literally nothing. I've been doxxed in a lot of different games, it's just something that people do to scare you. Once you learn that they're just some guy trying to be hyper edgy and that everyone's dox is basically public info you can get off of Google or a phone book, it stops being spooky.
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
Well, you are playing Deathslinger. at a lot of loops the only thing you can do is hold w.
Hard disagree, but I haven't played against a good Deathslinger in like two years.
If the tile is tall enough, you can crouch on reaction to him entering ADS. If it's short, you slam the pallet down ASAP to force shots into being chain breaks only. Any tile with tall walls you can focus more on just keeping LOS broken so he can't make a shot, and only taking vaults if LOS is broken.
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@Tostapane said:
that's the neat part, you can't... before his low terror radious paired with monitor and abuse was an excellent way to greatly soften up this problem. but you know, devs nerfed that poor killer into the ground (before the nerf he was my main) cause his 1vs was "unfair and too much strong" without taking into account that it was the only good thing about him (a 4.4 without map pressure/passive slowdown like the one that pinhead has and he couldn't sniping people like huntress from the other side of the map or behind a pallet neeeded those nerfs after all, he was too much strong /s)
Slinger is actually still pretty insane in terms of power, the biggest part of the nerf was the terror radius change. I think he has Nurse levels of chase power, but it requires actual skill and predictions to get value (Nurse takes no skill, you can't change my mind).
If you miss M&A Slinger, you should try out Plaything Slinger. You either get stealth hits or free slowdown, so it's a very good perk on him. But for sure, stealth perks + StBfL makes Hold W pretty much impossible since you're getting a down before they can get distance.
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It's generally a really bad strategy to hard camp and tunnel with the existence of BT and DS, but the second you realize that a particular survivor doesn't have those perks... goodbye JoJo lmao
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It's an extremely strong map for survivor. Depending on which side I load in as, I'm either going "ggs, ez 4 man" or "please heaven let me get one kill"
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I watched a conference some-odd years ago where a game dev that worked on Journey was talking about camera techniques.
In the Q&A section, someone asked, "You mentioned that you should always add in an FOV slider for people with motion sickness. What about players that increase their FOV for a competitive advantage in multiplayer games, especially first-person shooters?"
The speaker responded with something like, "That sounds like a win for everyone to me. The competitive player gets what they want, and the motion sick player get what they want. It's a win-win, so why not add an FOV slider?"
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@XerraFox said:
Since I bought everything for money - how many iri shards does one character cost?
9k, I think.
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@Pumpkinbros said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2972071#Comment_2972071
lets talk about the grind for iridescent shards shall we!
to purchase a single killer with iridescent shards, someone grinded as much as possible for it and it took them 300 hours to grind enough, there are 24 killers in the game. that's 7200 hours in order to unlock every single killer the standard way, seeing you don't spend any of it on the shrine of secrets that is. and not to mention the 31 survivors that you also have to unlock., it's getting a little out of hand
That doesn't seem right. I have around 1.3k hours and I haven't bought a non-licensed DLC in two years, and I have enough iri shards to buy the next 3 non-licensed DLCs outright.
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I'm tempted to make a 2nd account and see how things go when you play without ever buying a DLC. Honestly, I think that there are enough default characters and perks that by the time you have all the free perks unlocked (e.g. every default character at level 40), you will have enough shards to buy multiple new characters.
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Blood Debt is such a time waster. It takes maybe 25+ games when playing normally. When going out of your way to throw the match you can do it in maybe 5 to 10.
e.g. use Object of Obsession and have the killer hook you very quickly, then hide all game and pray that the guy that unhooked you gets hooked at some point and use Sprint Burst to rush the hook before anyone else can get close. Alternatively, get hooked twice and hope two different people unhook you, giving you four potential Blood Debts... if you survive, if they both get hooked twice, and if you're the one that unhooks all four times 🙄
Terrible challenge overall.
Don't get me started on "cleanse 20 totems" or "do the equivalent of three gens in one trial."
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If it had fewer pallets and some fun window loops, I wouldn't mind it so much. As it stands, there's some-odd dozen or so god pallets on that map.
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The weird thing about DbD is how drastically the power level of many perks, add-ons, killers, and tactics/strategies change depending on the skill level of the lobby.
At low skill levels, Huntress' Lullaby is oppressively strong since no one can hit skill checks and no one can find hex totems. As skill increases, the perk functionally falls off the face of the earth in terms of usability.
At low levels, pre-dropping pallets to prevent mind games is one of the most effective ways to stall the killer. At mid levels, pre-dropping pallets instead of looping them is viewed as throwing the game. Then, it loops back around at extremely high levels where pre-dropping pallets against most killers guarantees victory.
We see this a lot in DbD. Some things are oppressive at low levels, but laughably weak at higher levels (such as infinite Tier 3 Myers, Overcharge, and face camping someone 100 to 0). Some things are terrible at low levels, but are game winningly decisive at high levels (such as Nurse, Dead Hard, and holding w).
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2972007#Comment_2972007
Yeah, the passivity does make sense. But I find that people heal fast anyway, and attrition styles aren't great right now - mostly thanks to CoH being in maybe 75% of my games.
I'd honestly rather run Surge...or better yet, Pain Resonance. Also somewhat passive.
My favorite is Deadlock. It buys you an extra 30 seconds on the gen that needs it the most, right when you need it the most, without any input.
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Some kind of quick message system would be amazing. Being able to have a text bubble appear next to your character that says "I'm looking for gens!" or "I'm being chased!" when you press a button would be awesome.
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I personally don't run it, but I see the appeal.
It's slowdown both ways; survivors either waste time healing to clear the debuff or do a slowed down gen. It's also completely passive and requires no additional playstyle changes to get value; such as seeking out a Scourge Hook with Pain Res, a gen to kick with Pop, not hooking the Obsession with Dying Light, downing a survivor with an M1 for Surge, ect.
So it's a "set it and forget it" slowdown perk with 100% guaranteed value every single game. Good for people that just want to turn their brain off and chill, but I would prefer Spirit Fury + Enduring for that haha
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I know we're talking about the No Mither-only tome, but No Mither is actually pretty viable if you build around it properly. I went on something like a 10 game escape streak with No Mither the other day, against mid-to-decent killers.
I used Dead Hard (obviously), Resilience, and Prove Thyself. You can alternatively drop Prove Thyself for Spine Chill to get the bonus vault speed and improved stealth. I could also see Fixated and Iron Will being very strong with No Mither as well.
Not having any pools of blood is kind of a big deal, so is being permanently broken. Instead of wasting 16 seconds of two survivor's time healing (which could be translated into 32 seconds of time on gens with Prove Thyself), you skip it and go straight to doing gens. You also always have the benefits of Resilience at all times, meaning gens take 8 fewer seconds and healing others takes 1.5 fewer seconds.
Not to mention the killer can't risk slugging you, robbing them of potential snowball pressure.
It's not a strong perk for chase-oriented survivors, but it's very strong for stealthy and tactical survivors.