DS change seems underwhelming...
I'd rather they have made it work during every unhook instead of this.
It wasn't very hard to tunnel through old DS, if I'm being honest, and I was genuinely interested to see the 'rework.'
I really wasn't expecting it to just be a 2 second number fix...especially with that being the joke around the forum since its announcement.
Assuming the animation/drop still eats some of the time, not much is going to change for most players struggling with tunneling.
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I mean, at least now you can stack a lot more anti-tunnel perks compared to before… not like anyone will use them anyways, since people stopped running perks that solve their issues like Unbreakable or DS a long time ago for some reason.
You're downplaying a perk that will be in the top 10 used perks now and meta every game. The perk is very, very good.
Thank you both for visiting my grave, for my topic title was edited and I am buried in the Feedback section :(
Who said it wasn't easy to counter?
That's not a counter, that's just avoiding to hard tunnel that survivor and therefore do exactly what the perk was made for: Make you stop tunneling xD
Who said there was an issue?
You're assuming I said or implied a lot that I didn't. Someone called it weak, I said it wasn't. That's it.
And where does that say there's an issue? Saying they're downplaying how good a perk is, is not an "issue".
If you have the game sense of a newbie, thats right. Otherwise you know It will be still not doing the job.
It does it's job. It's not supposed to make tunneling impossible, it's supposed to make it much more costly for the killer, of which it does.
High mmr and comp players don't run this perk because it's bad, there's a reason.
Yeah it took them ~2 years to realize that the 2s change was bad. It took them 2 weeks/9 months to buff Pain Res, 11 months to buff Pop, and 2 years to buff DS. Do we need to wait another year before they buff Self-Care or Thana? It was clear the 6.1 perk changes were bad, and trickling out these changes shows they know they were bad, but don't want to admit to all of them at once.
I found 5 second DS to be brutal to deal with as a killer. Though maybe i would deal with it better now that i have more experience but i did find it to be very potent.
I will definitely use it a survivor. I did when it was 5 seconds, it helped a lot.
I'd love a self-care buff >:3
Shame, looks like the buff schedule has Iron Will slotted in for Nov 2024, Thana for Jun 2025, Pharmacy for Dec 2025, Tinkerer in Jul 2026, and Self-Care is back in Feb 2027. Edit: these things take time, garsh. Stop expecting so much.
You responded to me giving counters and calling it easy to do, when I had said nothing about that whatsoever.
I feel like you started coming at me over topics I've never even talked about. Can we just stay on topic of the page?
Thats not really a counter so much as not tunneling because of an anti tunnel perk. The only real counter to ds would be to slug to survivor.
And what made you say that when I'd mentioned nothing about or relating to counters at all?
Well no, that's not actually a true statement.
For an example. You can just choose not to tunnel at all an avoid it (easy counter), however playing ultra fair like that spreading hooks 1,1,1,1 fashion to avoid it is making you play extremely non efficient. IE the forced non efficient play in order to counter it is what makes it strong.
This is why it's never bad to run all anti tunnel/camp perks. If they activate, they're very strong in punishing them. If they don't activate, this means the killer didn't camp or tunnel, which means you should also be winning since they're playing so non efficient. Win/win scenario. The perks have a stronger effect than just "if they activate". The process of making the killer avoid them is an extreme strength in itself.
That would still be forcing the killer to play non efficient, even if not doing the 1,1,1,1. Most survivors would still call that tunneling as well if you just went 1,2,1,2 back and forth. It's also just frankly quite unrealistic to expect you're gonna find those exact two to alternate back and forth all nicely.
Have it activate twice so we can double up on survivors body-blocking off-hook? No thanks, once is enough.
Neither of those I said.
"Only", no. Is it the most efficient way if you want to win? Yes. See high mmr and comp, there's a reason. Do I tunnel? No, I don't.
I spread hooks evenly because I find it more fun personally and it actually takes skill, unlike just tunneling someone out. However me doing that is playing non efficient.
I also am not arguing killers should play that way. I even want the game balanced around hooks to de incentivize that.
The only point I am making is that tunneling someone out is the most efficient way to play if all you care about is winning. I think that's objectively true, even if I don't like it, do it, or encourage it.
I can mostly agree with all that. Although I'd rather tackle the issue with shrinking maps to force interaction of who's better and less hold w so that those killers are less punished when lacking mobility. I also think many loops need balance adjusting. There are way too many loops that once the pallet is thrown it's a forced break and that's bad design. They should mostly all still be playable. We see this in comp and higher mmr where everything is just pre dropped. This is because they know there's so many pallets and gens are so fast that they can pre drop everything, risk nothing, and the gens will get done before they run out.
Well that's why ideally if we did that map adjusting we'd tone down the higher tier/faster killers to even things out. Essentially bringing all those bottom killers up and top killers down. Adjust the outliers.
Here we go again. Ive never seen many "probably" high-mmr players running DS. Also you cannot argue with some player playing by their own made up rules. DS ist not a good perk. Thats been common sense for years now. It ddidnt do anything and it wont do anything useful. Most killer can olay easily against those measly seconds of a stun.
Right and I guess comp players run it for funsies lol
that is why some killer were electing to run Ultimate weapon and perks like BBQ/Nowhere to hide so that they could more easily ping-pong survivor 1 & survivor 2 to ignore DS and selectively tunnel.
that is also reason why many survivor run Distortion to counter aura perks to disallow perfect ping pong. Now that ultimate weapon is getting nerfed, the annoying aspect is how I would WANT to run current ultimate weapon to counter decisive strike but CANNOT run ultimate weapon because nerf+distortion countering it.
they're essentially nerfing the counter to decisive strike in same patch they are buffing anti-tunnel thus forcing you to tunnel. The other counter to DS is Slugging… which has its own problems with 4 minute death timers… not hooking a single person entire match just to not trigger DS is impractical counter-play in the current form.
What if…… the 5s stun is after "new stabbing animation"?
means survivor can running 5s.