Survivor Stereotypes, and why they're bad.
Introduction
Welcome back to another discussion of mine! Hopefully this one won't span 1000 paragraphs long like the last few...
But today, we'll be talking about why stereotyping Survivors is a bad thing in DBD... I'd like to give an example from myself personally below, but also just touch on the "issue" in a more broader way.
Without further ado though, lets get into it...
where these stereotypes originate from
Let's get this out of the way, for the most part some of these stereotypes are true in regards to how some Survivor mains play these specific Survivors... But that's about it, that's only SOME Survivor mains. For others, they just like these characters for who they're and main them in a different way, of course they'll sometimes do what the stereotype is... but they won't do it ALL the time like most other players like to believe.
For one, not every Claudette runs brown clothes and Urban Evasion or plays immersed, not every Nea runs Balanced Landing and Purple Flashlights, not every Dwight hides in lockers 90% of the game, not every Jake Sabo's hooks, not every Meg camps hatches or runs Adrenaline + Sprint Burst, not every Feng Min is selfish and only is out for themselves...
Things like these, are kind of the issue here... well... "issue" it's more so a discussion that I want everyone to think about the next time to see one of these Survivors... yes they could be doing exactly what the Stereotype inclines, but not all of them do it actually.
a little story about what stereotypes can do
Now, here's an example that I personally had just a few matches ago before writing this post. I was loading up into a game with a key build, I was getting my perks ready to work towards the achievement "Taking One For The Team" an achievement that's last on my list for a 100% completion...
Before the match started, 2 people asked me when the 50 seconds started to not play immersed or crouch around with my Urban Evasion avoiding the objectives or doing anything... Before the match started, I just said "Define Immersed" and that was that.
Fast forward into the game, it's a Wraith! This Wraith was running a all-seeing + Coxcombed Clapper add-on combo... So we couldn't hear them uncloaking and he can see us within 12 meters when cloaked... A deadly combo indeed, but I was ready for it!
Before proceeding some context, my Survivor main is Claudette! But I don't main Survivor, i'm a Killer man. Anyways, after being the first to hit I went to a loop, got chased for maybe 5 seconds, than the Wraith goes after the Jake and just leaves me there. After some time, he actually comes back and proceeds to chase me. This chase lasted for a minute before I got hooked and he left.
Fast forward, i'm unhooked, I get healed, and I go back to working on generators. I finish one of the generators that was on 90% because the Feng was being chased, than I proceed to work on another close by that was on 70%. It wasn't long before the Wraith came back, and proceeded to chase me for another 2 minutes or so before finally just giving up and moving onto someone else, after awhile and a few more generators popping because he was on me for so long, we had 1 generator left! Hurray! Here's the thing though, in the back of my mind... I knew I was going to die... but we'll save why I thought that till the end.
So basically, I do another chase with him when he finds me at one of the last 3 generators, I get hit cause there was no pallets around (and the ones that were there were broken) so I bring him to another loop. I get downed, than... the moment you all been waiting for! He actually brought a mori into the game before we started, and that mori was used on me.
Everyone escaped in the end though, and I noted to my teammates that "So why tell me to not play immersed when I was the one running him around for you guys?"
They replied that "Most Claudettes are toxic, so he probably just wanted to kill you the most since he wouldn't stop chasing you for the most part"
And here we're... I died probably because I was being targeted... but also because he wanted me out of the game since I wasted most of his time...
The reason why stereotyping is bad...
So... that's my story, one of them at least. I have many more about someone literally lying on their wall so people think i'm the bad guy when in reality I was just playing the game... (He DC'ed btw cause I wasted 2 minutes of his time in-game and his Ruin broke.)
And other such things, but besides all this... lemme spit you some truth son!
Stereotyping, especially when it comes to Survivors... can lead to a lot of toxicity in-game. It can label you as something you're not and have people be angry with you for something you DIDN'T even do... People will make assumptions about you because of your main, and overall some people are just nasty in-general...
So when they see their most hated Survivor... you're automatically also hated by them. I'd like to think this is very narrow minded of people, and labeling others for things they don't even do or don't primarily do is wrong...
Of course, it's one thing to meme about it. That's 100% funny, it's just something to laugh about. It's another thing to ridicule and insult people in-game as a teammate and post-chat as the Killer also... Doing this just breeds toxicity and that's no good.
The same goes for certain Killers as well, it's bad to just assume all LeatherFaces camp the basement, or that all Trappers camp the basement... or that all Nurses and Spirits want to be 100% toxic towards you...
These things are bad to assume, and being toxic towards these players for playing these Killers or Survivors is not the right thing to do... Even if they're doing the exact thing you hate, they might not be a bad person. And hey, even if they're doing exactly what most people hate + the toxicity, it's best to be the mature one in the conversation, you know why? It'll make THEM look like the bad guy and overall they'll be the fool in the conversation. Talking in a constructive yet non-toxic way is a good thing... you don't have to be nice to them while they're being the toxic one, but you can at least not also do the same.
So before you face off against or with another Claudette for example... stop and think before you automatically make assumptions about them in a negative way. Or don't. I can't stop you, but it's worth a try!
In conclusion
Memeing about this stuff is fine, that's just being funny. Being toxic and violent towards others because they main a certain Survivor is another thing... And while my example above wasn't equal to the other examples I've had which were far worse, or the other examples others have had... It still drives the point home...
It's bad to specifically target others because they like a specific character... in-game or in-chat.
Stay classy people, good luck in the fog...
tl;dr
Basically, it's bad to stereotype certain Survivors or heck even Killers because they like that character in-general... It's one thing to meme about it which is funny, but it's another thing to be toxic to that person for liking and maining that character off of your previous experience with other characters that do... not the most tasteful things... the same goes for what they say also to you, not every person with that character does that also...
Not every Survivor that's associated with toxicity like Claudette or Nea is also going to be toxic... they might not even do most the things you hate about those players, they might just be a really nice person who likes the character.
Fighting toxicity with kindness and maturity is one thing, but fighting toxicity with toxicity just causes more toxicity... and that's not good at all.
This TL;DR kind of washes over some other points, but the main point is to not be mean or aggressive towards other individuals that like certain characters that YOU specifically don't. This is for Survivor, and Killer as well...
Comments
Yeah, but usually it's a matter of whether I can punish the toxicity that makes them tick that determines whether or not I'll get them. : P
I more find it's the ones that try hard and fail (the lols) to the really amazing players that use Dwight (kill you and your family). I've come across some real gems. Want them dead.
I agree for the most part. However I will say that assuming a Leatherface is going to camp(or even every killer) or certain killers/every killer will tunnel is not really toxic. I view it more as expecting the worst to keep yourself alive. If it's a Bubba, it's a GOOD thing to assume he's going to camp the basement. Helps keep you alive. If you see Bubba, you stay away from the basement. Assuming every killer is going to tunnel also helps keep you alive. Assuming the worst helps keep you alive because you play more warily.
That said, what I do agree with is the part where killers bring moris because they see a Claudette, or someone with a toolbox, or a flashlight, or a med kit, or a key. Basically any time 2 or more survivors have anything in their hands. Assuming someone is going to behave a certain way imo is not problematic. ACTING TOXIC AGAINST PEOPLE BECAUSE YOU ASSUME SOMETHING ABOUT THEM IS.
Yeah, but the main point was not to act toxic towards others because they play a certain Killer or Survivor that say... YOU specifically for example, don't like.
It's just not right...
Well no, they were specifically addressing me... nobody else is really known more for sneaking around and stealth like Claudette (Hide and seek champion 2016)
But yeah, they were specifically addressing me because I was a Claudette... So automatically they made the assumption that I would be worthless to the team because I was a Claudette.
And I was wearing the Producer Pants (The best pants), Claudettes P3 Face, and the black jacket with the red trim on the bottom... It's not entirely stealthy because of that BRIGHT red trim at the bottom, but it can be in some places... but what isn't stealthy for Claudette? She has a built in stealth field...
Anyways, its not like I was running full brown clothes Claudette... Cause than that would make a bit more sense and I kind of don't like it either when I face it as a Killer... But even when people use it, if I OPEN my eyes enough I can still see those people most of the time depending on the map.
Regardless if The Wraith was specifically targeting me or not, the main point still stands. You shouldn't be toxic or make assumptions about someone and openly express it in the pre/post chat... Cause than YOU look like the jerk in that scenario, all because you hate that Survivor from past experiences...
You should NEVER assume how another survivor plays by their choice of cosmetic. Have people forgotten the saying “Don’t judge a book by it’s cover”? Seriously, some people can’t even wear bright cosmetics or play Nea and Steve anymore because they’re always tunneled.
Stereotypes are bad for the overall game design and it’s not something to be fixed.
We, as a community need to be the change we want to see in it.
I don't think this is quite as influential on gameplay as you think. If you were targeted by the killer it could be any number of reasons and I very much doubt the killer out a lot of thought into their actions--games are so chaotic you kind of just chase based on whatever is in your line of sight.
As far as the stereotypes go, they're almost all memes- barring the fact that players with P3 Claud/ brown shirt Claud are almost always intentionally trying to stack odds in their favour and pink hair Nea's are trying to get your attention from the getgo. Slap on any other cosmetic and no one will have any beef on either side. As a killer I do notice flashy outfits in the lobby (an all auric cell outfit suggests a level of investment in the game higher than the average player), but this doesn't influence my gameplay, its just a passing thought when sizing the team up.
I think the stereotypes are kind of fun- I have a fairly set idea that Lauries and Bills are useless, Davids overestimate their chasing ability, any given Feng's toxicity is directly proportional to the number of Neas+Claudettes in the lobby with them... I dunno, none of it actually means anything but it's natural to infer patterns in behaviour and it's amusing when these expectations are met or subverted.
You're right, its all based on personal opinion and it's mostly just for memes...
But it's another thing when people are overly toxic to each other within and outside the game because they play certain Killers/Survivors... it kind of does have an impact within the match when it comes to targeting specific Survivors, and more times than not it's because of a specific Survivor they don't like...
So for example, if i'm targeted and BM'ed and insulted at the end of the match because a Killer doesn't like that Survivor and automatically assumes the worst of me because of that Survivor... does that make it right? No. What did I do to deserve that hate? Because you played against another Survivor that was incredible rude to you? So you need to return the favor to all Survivors that play like that?
Doing that really does continue the cycle of negativity, and that's why a lot of Killers used to be nice but soon turn nasty because of certain players behaviors... and vise versa as well.
I think you're falling into the trap of getting bogged down in the minute details of an incredibly specific situation: I wouldn't say 'more times than not' killers target a survivor they don't like, I think you're assuming a lot based on intuition and giving a little too much credit to the conclusions that you're drawing.
The hypothetical example you give is not 'right', but I don't think that's a particularly meaningful statement- the toxic behaviour in the example is not caused by the player's dislike of a character, that is only a justification. The behaviour would manifest in some way or another regardless of the reasoning behind it.
There's no cure-all for toxicity within the DBD community. Appeals to emotion won't work on the unsympathetic, appeals to reason won't work on the irrational and appeals to fairness won't work on... Well anyone--the game is inherently unbalanced and individual definitions of what are or aren't fair rarely align. There IS a cycle of negativity at play, but it isn't limited solely to the game- you're going to play with people who are unpleasant to interact with because of your character, or because of your playstyle, or because of your teammate's playstyle, or because they thought you were in SWF, or because they got bullied last game, or because they they had a bad day outside of the game, or because they paid X amount for the game and can play however they want as a result. The cycle is broken on an individual level by rising above the provocation- while you are appealing for people to do exactly this in your post, you're tying it to a very specific example which doesn't seem to resonate with many other players.
Going forward don't concern yourself so much with how you're perceived by other players- just focus on having fun and if you come across a game that tilts you a little too much take a break--play killer or find something else to do... Failing that-- main Jeff rather than Claudette? :p
You make a compelling argument. Also, I main Killer actually i'm just basing my information off of personal experience and other the experience of others as well.
But you're right, most if not all games are unpredictable so if someone has an agenda it can easily be changed within the game... regardless if they're specifically targeting someone or not.
Yeah, I was just highlighting the differences between assuming something about someone, and doing something against someone because of your assumption. I've had very few survivors actually DO stuff to me because I play a certain character when playing survivor(I play David though so I guess I wouldn't, as I don't think he really has any stereotypes aside from always using No Mither and Dead Hard, of which I use neither most of the time).
I have had killers do and say things to me when I use Claudette however(when I was leveling her), but no survivors. That said hook farming happens across the board, but I don't think there's anything related to stereotypes in that.
I'm not downplaying anything that killers might experience, but killers being able to prepare before the game by seeing the survivors and what they're holding is the biggest factor in the toxic behavior towards stereotypical behavior(because they bring moris if they see a Claudette with a flashlight, for example). Survivors can't prepare, they can only talk, so acting in a toxic manner against a killer because they picked a certain killer is a little harder.
I mean, ideally someone wouldn't be mean or act out on their assumptions, but I doubt rude kids will stop being rude just cause someone asked them to. Those pants are cool, but I really like her skirts. c: Claudette does have lighter clothes, though I wouldn't consider what you were wearing as the worst tbh. It isn't really blendette (which a lot of people don't like). Most characters have darker options to help with stealth play.
Oh of course some people will always be the way they're... it doesn't hurt suggesting it though, since wouldn't you want to be treated better if you were in their position?
But, they don't really have to and they don't have to even care about what the other side says... it's just nice to know someone actually does care from the opposite side.
I mean, I'm always polite and nice to the other side, regardless of the role I'm playing. I know what it's like to be that random the SWF is blaming for failing the game or the person being tunneled because the killer doesn't want them to do anything other than being chased. Luckily you can get emblems and points in other categories for being a distraction, essentially. The people who do those sorts of things are rarely the sort to listen to reason, though. If they're caught chasing you for 3+ gens, they're understandably hesitant to switch targets (especially if you're injured and someone else isn't). The people who hunt people down based off of the character they're playing are often memers who throw the game, too. I've seen people who tunneled and killed Dwights (even had a name with it and everything). They're just making an excuse to ruin someone else's game. That's their goal. They'd come up with another excuse. They're likely bitter and wanting to take out their bad games/day on someone else.
It's kind of sad that some people think and act on those feelings towards others... but I guess we'll always have people that act like that.
Everyone is redeemable though, it all depends on that first step! Or they don't want to change... it's up to them entirely. It's just better to be positive, since it actually might rub off on someone else you've faced against or played with.
It really does suck, I mained Kate all the way to P3, but I wanna switch to Nea. Almost all of Nea's cosmetics look really comfy, almost like pajama's, and i really love that. But I'm afraid to switch as I don't wanna be seen as a "toxic looper w/a flashlight" when I only bring flashlights to save.
I play my survivors as skins and I don't assume other people's playstyle based on which survivor they play. I usually pick Nea, Meg, Dwight or Tapp and prejudices others might have about them won't stop me from playing them. I don't often get targeted but if I do, there's always the next match. If I cared about avoiding bad treatment due to stereotypes, I might as well just uninstall the game.
On the positive side, when I started playing I enjoyed Dwight and Bubba because both of them have that vibe of being stupid to some extent so it took some pressure to perform well off my shoulders 😄
I understand these stereotypes.
I'm Sheriff Jake after all.
It's a bit odd to expect other players to automatically know your feelings, and then cater to it.
A Laurie running ds is a stereotype that I use to my advantage, after getting unhooked run into the locker in front of the killer and they’ll be scared to pick me up, it’s a bluff that will always work
Stereotypes are pretty real in this game, I find Dwight in lockers, Nea's on ledges, Claudette's in bushes, Jake near birbs and hooks, Feng going YEET, and I'm a Meghead just running around the map.
You keep those law breakers in check after all...
That wasn't the point.
Of course they're real... but you shouldn't identify every Survivor by those same standards.
It's one thing to meme it, it's another to target people directly for using Survivors that associate with that specific stereotype.
let ye with diversion active first yeet the first pebble. My issue with survivors and killers on a whole is that they don't play the game with a ritualistic fair mindset. When you get into a dozen farming matches you realize how this game could be played, but people are too focused on generators and hooks which is the real evil of the Entity. Rank is arbitrary, the grind is pointless, and players don't play to have fun. It seems more likely this game is intended as a personality social experiment than an actual game at times.
Again, regardless of how we view it... it's still wrong to attack people for specifically playing Survivors they don't like. That was kind of the main point of this post.
Tbh, I'm past this post anyways... I'm only responding because someone necro'ed it for some reason...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vd_3JmDoKNc. Reminds me why I used to play Tapp, this video is ridiculously relevant.
The memes are the best part about the stereotypes.
The worst part is the random toxicity against random players... they play Survivors that they like... but some Killers dislike them BECAUSE of those stereotypes or past experiences...
Feng Main here can say I'm a bit selfish when it comes to Totems and Chest. I'm always on them to the point my killer main friend now sees any Feng in a chest and let's then get it out before chasing them. He knows Ill die for the item. It's his own way of respect for me I guess XD
@GrootDude
Actually have you noticed my chest Obsession yet?
Does Ace have a stereotype? I never heard something about Ace.
it's a game. dont take it too seriously
F I N G E R G U N S
Finger guns!
No but seriously, the only Stereotypes that i'm aware of with Ace mains is that if they're wearing a pink shirt with a mustache than they're "toxic" apparently. Or the leopard shirt or whatever the yellow and black spots shirt is.
agreed
I once had someone say "Toxic?" in chat when I joined. I asked them why. They said it was because I was a P3 Meg, so there was a high chance I was a toxic player.
Thought it was quite funny. I'm pretty much the opposite of a toxic player.