Why was thanatophobia changed?
I don’t get it. Why was this prioritized as a balance issue? Was it broken? No one complained about it though. Why nerf anything when pipping just got a whole lot harder?
I don’t get it. Why was this prioritized as a balance issue? Was it broken? No one complained about it though. Why nerf anything when pipping just got a whole lot harder?
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They were probably cleaning up some coding by making it kind of token based instead of a set amount. They did the same to Fire Up and change the unlimited aura reading perk to really big numbers instead.
Why they nerfed it with the change, idk. Could have been an opportunity to try something new with it. My thought was to crank up the values(something like 8% per injured Survivor) but have it only work on gens.
Because why make a perk useful when you can instead do nothing? That’s just BHVR-sense, right there.
It wasn't nerfed it was reverted. The buffed version never got to live.
Second. It's a bit too powerful on characters like Legion when coupled with Sloppy among other perks
@Kagrenac The current values for one and two injured Survivor are lower than what they were before the PTB.
It should have stayed at 6% per stack like it was on PTB, but it should only affect gens and not healing. They said it was changed from PTB because they want to do something else with healing, but they ended up just nerfing Thana. Killers need more stuff to slow gens, we don't need it for heals. IMO should have just left it as is until they come up with the solution.
Autodidact is a counter to extreme anti-healing, survivors decide not to use it. Welcome to dbd.
Because it's highly unreliable due to requiring skill checks, also it's detrimental until the third skill check. Usually trying to get to the third skill check ends up in a killer tracking you or the injured survivor down and killing someone.
If the perk increased the chance of getting Healing Skill Checks, then it would be a worthwhile perk
@Mat_Sella
Amen
The devs were talking about the extreme case of 60+ second heals with sloppy and buffed thana. If heals take this long you get more than enough skillchecks on 1 guy.
When I tested buffed Thanatophobia in the PTB, it worked just fine as I never got more than 2 survivors injured or hooked at any given time, even when using Legion and Sloppy, which only lowered their repair progress rate by a measly 12% (healing slowed by 37%). If anything it actually gave survivors a reason to heal/bring healing items and perks when facing Legion (which isn't the common practice since Legion can't 1 shot unless they refrain from using their power when chasing an injured survivor, and are easily juke-able due to the 110% movement speed).
I could see how powerful it theoretically could get if no one was healing, but as soon as survivors noticed it, they never gave it the chance to get there. I had no complaints, and no one else was complaining about it as far as I could see (just some speculation posts about how broken it would be when it hit live). As it is now, It's decent, but still not buffed enough to be viable, because survivors never let it build up enough no matter what killer is using it, or what build they put it in. I think they were just afraid of backlash, and didn't fully realize how survivors react when they get hit with de-buffs... They adapt, and if allowed, they rid themselves of it ASAP.
It got nerfed because
"Too strong IF 4 people injured AND Sloppy butcher used AND Selfcare is used AND survivors ignored the thanatophobia-warning "
-If they didnt heal before 4 stacks they werent interested in healing anyway.
-half the healing speed penalty comes from selfcare.
A killer using 2 perks and setting the situation up to somewhat counter selfcare's effiency simply has been deemed "too stronk, nerf now" by either the survivors on the ptb, the devs or the theorycrafters in the forum.
Plague made me take Autodidact out of my build
Potentially, PTB Thanatophobia (max of 24%) + Dying Light (25%) + sloppy (25% to healing) would have reduced healing speed by 68%, and gen repair speed by 43%. That is only counting that you activate dying light (1 dead), and keep the remaining 3 survivors injured, and none of them become the new obsession. At that point, and somehow meeting all of those requirements, there would be very little the survivors could do to win, but that's still a tough scenario to pull off.
If you were just doing it to prevent Healing, then thana, sloppy, dl, coulrophobia on a Doc with his 2 highest Calm add-on's + a small map like The Game + a mori is the only way you could maximize the slow heals. Again however, that's a lot of requirements just to pull off a build denying survivors healing and a killer that's not the best at chases. Plus if the survivors were to use a full healing build with botany, autodidact, We'll make it, solidarity/self-care, then you get a complete counter to the anti-heal build. Survivors already use "all heal" gimmick builds in regular games without anticipating the killer using an anti-heal build because its fun, very strong when it works, and killers have no effective counters to it currently.
Again, if anything, all that PTB buffed thana would do is encourage survivors to take more healing perks and items into matches with them, and get them healing each-other asap so that thana can't build up. It would make Autodidact more popular in particular as a heavy counter to it, plus, every time a survivor dies thana also loses its de-buff potency, so while PTB buffed Thanatophobia had the potential to be "too strong"... the builds to make it that way, and situational requirements are just too impractical in game.
I'm with the OP, de-buffing it wasn't the right call.
No, it actually got nerfed. The old one had better values for one and two injured survivors
@Mat_Sella
Is that the same excuse you use for Bottany, Leader, We'll Make It or Empathy?
There are already strong counters to Thanatophobia but devs decided to just nerf it because survivors didnt want to change their Self-care, DS, Exhaustion, Adrenaline build.
Survivors don't use it because it isn't reliable and completely dependent on RNG
You get a ######### ton of skill checks during a 60 second skillcheck heal also the killer used 2 perks to counter a single healing perk from survivors yet that is deemed too OP rofl.
But I am not a dev, they have the insight that we don't have. I forgot that killers have 16 perkslots compared to survivors and are easily able to fit thana slopy coulrophobia M&A and the high TR perk (Forgot it's name) on 1 build while also using ruin/bambizzle and BBQ.
My guess is that the combination of Legion with Sloppy Butcher & Thanatophobia was the reason for that.
It's not a broken combo but most players fail to realize how to counter it and instead mass DC / suicide.
I think the old value (tier three with all survivors injured) was 15%. Now it is 14% with all survivors injured.
But at least Fire Up got a buff. Which is nice (tokens take effect as soon as you get em', if no one knew.)
The first 2 regress your progress. Even then; you seriously expect me to have enough time to get them all in a heal time that long when the killer is looking for us? That's ludicrous. Especially when Nurse's exists.
The saddest thing about them dropping T3 thana from a max of 24% in the PTB down to a max of 16%, which is 1% more than the original version... Thanatophobia has needed a large buff for a very long time, and for only a brief PTB moment it had that and became somewhat viable. Thana's effectiveness is completely dependent on survivors reaction to it, and since most heal immediately upon noticing it affecting them, it's a rare occasion to have every survivor injured, hooked or dying simultaneously. You may get that experience if you nail all of them when they were clumped together, or if they are new to the game, but against any decent survivor team? It'll never happen. When the PTB came out it finally became somewhat viable, but they dropped its values for live and made it only 1% better than its original version, which adds like 3 seconds on gens repair times and heals IF everyone remains injured.
Not enough people really played with it in the PTB because everyone was playing around with the new killer and perks instead. The Plague has no use for Thanatophobia because everyone insta heals at fountains against her, so how did anybody really get around to playing with it? I think the devs simply read in the comments "speculation" about it and how it will pair with Legion + Sloppy butcher, and panicked when they didn't need to.
The skill checks aren't always consistent though, I've done heals and gens and either get a ton of skill checks non stop or none or 1-2.
I've sat on a gen with Ruin up and gotten 12 skill checks and other time never gotten a single one from 0-100%.
If there was a set min/max on skill checks then it wouldn't be such a crapshoot for Autodiadact.
Here is the simple answer:
Too much survivor tears that BHVR doesn't want to be responsible for.
Was a mistake to nerf Thantaphobia. I feel it'll be reverted...eventually
please don't harass me, i play both sides...
Why don’t they adjust thanatophobia and other killer perks on a per-killer basis? Thanatophobia should be much stronger on killers like trapper, pig, and, myers, and be weaker on killers like billy, hag, nurse, and clown.
... is that harassment to you?
Tbh, devs love to do "uncalled for" changes.
Survivor example: the vaulting change, honestly, it's not such a bad change, but no one complained about vaulting. People have complained about infinites, but this wasn't the right answer to nerf them, and as a matter of fact, it didnt actually nerf them whatsoever.
Killer example: I think we can count the thanatophobia one.