I don't think it's necessary for Legion to not be able to see blood or scratch marks during Frenzy

In a world where Nurse and Blight exist in their current state (I am NOT implying they need to be nerfed, rather I'd have everyone else brought up to or near their level) I don't understand why Legion still cannot see scratch marks or blood pools in Frenzy.

It's not necessary for him to have these inhibitors. His power is nonlethal unless he hits EVERYONE which isn't always possible anyway. Making it harder for him to chase survivors in a non-lethal power is just unnecessary.

It's not even going to increase his killrate that much. It's literally just quality of life. There's no reason for him to have these inhibitors in his kit.

Comments

  • @Leon_Loves_Cheryl said:

    In a world where Nurse and Blight exist in their current state (I am NOT implying they need to be nerfed, rather I'd have everyone else brought up to or near their level) I don't understand why Legion still cannot see scratch marks or blood pools in Frenzy.

    It's not necessary for him to have these inhibitors. His power is nonlethal unless he hits EVERYONE which isn't always possible anyway. Making it harder for him to chase survivors in a non-lethal power is just unnecessary.

    It's not even going to increase his killrate that much. It's literally just quality of life. There's no reason for him to have these inhibitors in his kit.

    Legion remains in the old dbd, for example screen dimming and slowdown for unknown reason is stronger than that of blight, Legion needs a pack of quality of life improvements or a buff (preferably both)

  • Eh, it makes sense considering that Killer Instinct provides incredibly good information. It's already very difficult to hide from a Frenzying Legion, and the best window to do so is before they've hit anyone. Adding Scratch Mark visibility to their power would make this even harder.

    Legion is already very easy to pick up, and I don't think they should be made easier, but there's the argument to be made that adding back Blood Pools during Frenzy would be helpful at tracking Survivors you've already hit, which doesn't really make it harder to evade Frenzy itself. I'd say Blood Pools, yes, Scratch Marks, maybe not.

    Either way, it's an incredibly minor buff, and I don't think it's worth putting too much focus on. There's a lot more pressing things that make Legion bad, mainly that their basekit is still very subpar. Frenzy could probably do with a duration buff for sure.

  • @ReverseVelocity said:

    Eh, it makes sense considering that Killer Instinct provides incredibly good information. It's already very difficult to hide from a Frenzying Legion, and the best window to do so is before they've hit anyone. Adding Scratch Mark visibility to their power would make this even harder.

    Legion is already very easy to pick up, and I don't think they should be made easier, but there's the argument to be made that adding back Blood Pools during Frenzy would be helpful at tracking Survivors you've already hit, which doesn't really make it harder to evade Frenzy itself. I'd say Blood Pools, yes, Scratch Marks, maybe not.

    Either way, it's an incredibly minor buff, and I don't think it's worth putting too much focus on. There's a lot more pressing things that make Legion bad, mainly that their basekit is still very subpar. Frenzy could probably do with a duration buff for sure.

    I know there's a lot to buff in Legion's kit. I just wanted to start off somewhere easy. Making Mural Sketch and Mischief List basekit (and reworking their effects) should happen as well, so that Legion has a CHANCE of getting Frenzy downs without being addon-dependent. I think it's fair because Legion's power primarily punishes bad survivors who group up and heal; his counterplay is very clear cut for decent and above-average survivors so I think we have room to buff him without being that overbearing, especially in regards to the less sensible limitations in his kit (like the scratch marks and blood pools not being visible)

  • @ReverseVelocity said:

    Eh, it makes sense considering that Killer Instinct provides incredibly good information. It's already very difficult to hide from a Frenzying Legion, and the best window to do so is before they've hit anyone. Adding Scratch Mark visibility to their power would make this even harder.

    Legion is already very easy to pick up, and I don't think they should be made easier, but there's the argument to be made that adding back Blood Pools during Frenzy would be helpful at tracking Survivors you've already hit, which doesn't really make it harder to evade Frenzy itself. I'd say Blood Pools, yes, Scratch Marks, maybe not.

    Either way, it's an incredibly minor buff, and I don't think it's worth putting too much focus on. There's a lot more pressing things that make Legion bad, mainly that their basekit is still very subpar. Frenzy could probably do with a duration buff for sure.

    it is prevent survivors from being tunneled after deep wound. for example if you chain survivor 1 →survivor 2 →survivor 3, No scratch marks & bloodpool is to prevent legion from finding survivor 1.

    in the early days of legion, one of bigger complaints was legion's ability to tunnel survivors especially since he could hit survivors a 2nd time to reduce their deep wound timer. my thought is that legion is primary weak because they remove this mechanic from his kit and never fully re-added it back to his kit. part of reason why it was removed is because it had same problems as Chucky's manual scamper. M1 a survivor is too consistent for killer. the main way to make a killer miss an a basic attack on a survivor is to use old dead hard OR to 99% sprint burst an m1 attack. Legion would be much stronger as a killer if they incorporated 99% sprint bursts or old dead hard into his kit because he would have a higher cieling to down survivors at a much faster-rate.

  • @Devil_hit11 said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3882097#Comment_3882097

    it is prevent survivors from being tunneled after deep wound. for example if you chain survivor 1 →survivor 2 →survivor 3, No scratch marks & bloodpool is to prevent legion from finding survivor 1.

    in the early days of legion, one of bigger complaints was legion's ability to tunnel survivors especially since he could hit survivors a 2nd time to reduce their deep wound timer. my thought is that legion is primary weak because they remove this mechanic from his kit and never fully re-added it back to his kit. part of reason why it was removed is because it had same problems as Chucky's manual scamper. M1 a survivor is too consistent for killer. the main way to make a killer miss an a basic attack on a survivor is to use old dead hard OR to 99% sprint burst an m1 attack. Legion would be much stronger as a killer if they incorporated 99% sprint bursts or old dead hard into his kit because he would have a higher cieling to down survivors at a much faster-rate.

    Yes, I comprehend that. But Legion can't oneshot down a survivor after only 3 hits. If he gets the 4th hit, and turns around to try to find the first guy again to tunnel them down, they SHOULD be far enough that Legion can't find them even if he can see their scratch marks or blood. If they didn't split off and reposition correctly, they deserve to get downed.

  • I think they don't want you to use Frenzy as a passive mobility tool.

    If Frenzy showed blood and scratch marks there'd be very little reason not to use the increased movement speed from frenzy while patroling gens or something.

  • @VibranToucan said:

    I think they don't want you to use Frenzy as a passive mobility tool.

    If Frenzy showed blood and scratch marks there'd be very little reason not to use the increased movement speed from frenzy while patroling gens or something.

    you can use it as mobility tool. so that is not it.

    @Leon_Loves_Cheryl said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3882148#Comment_3882148

    Yes, I comprehend that. But Legion can't oneshot down a survivor after only 3 hits. If he gets the 4th hit, and turns around to try to find the first guy again to tunnel them down, they SHOULD be far enough that Legion can't find them even if he can see their scratch marks or blood. If they didn't split off and reposition correctly, they deserve to get downed.

    like i said, they don't want you to tunnel with it. you could hit all 4 survivors and potencial track the person with most hook states. blood pool & scratch marks become hidden make it harder to do that. that is what legion pitfall is in my opinion. inability to tunnel and requirement to hit 4 survivors. you can't just hit 1 person, hit another person and than stop your feral frenzy to chase the survivor. you hit all 4 or hit nothing. 0 sum power. Legion has not received any changes for long time addressing this so he remains to be average killer.

  • I prefer'd pre rework legion where I could punish the 2nd survivor I hit with frenzy with debuffs rather than waiting for people to mend on their own, terrible idea targeting Solo Q over SWF's as per usual.

  • @ReverseVelocity said:

    Eh, it makes sense considering that Killer Instinct provides incredibly good information. It's already very difficult to hide from a Frenzying Legion, and the best window to do so is before they've hit anyone. Adding Scratch Mark visibility to their power would make this even harder.

    Legion is already very easy to pick up, and I don't think they should be made easier, but there's the argument to be made that adding back Blood Pools during Frenzy would be helpful at tracking Survivors you've already hit, which doesn't really make it harder to evade Frenzy itself. I'd say Blood Pools, yes, Scratch Marks, maybe not.

    Either way, it's an incredibly minor buff, and I don't think it's worth putting too much focus on. There's a lot more pressing things that make Legion bad, mainly that their basekit is still very subpar. Frenzy could probably do with a duration buff for sure.

    One of the ways I think they could buff Joey's Mix tape (easily one of their worst add-ons, in my opinion) is to give it a secondary bloodhound like function of allowing you to see bright red blood pools of blood while in frenzy. It would give the add-on a bit more utility / value against Survivors that are comfortable being injured (plus, maybe they don't want to give Legion a base-kit buff like this for "free").

    I thought about making a post to suggest it but to be honest, I think add-on and perk changes are the kind of feedback that BHVR are least likely to listen to, so I never bothered.

    But I will say this, one of the most frustrating things that can happen when playing Legion is losing track of a Survivor just before that final 5th hit down because you lost sight of them when they turned a corner and now you suddenly have no way to find them anymore. Being able to see scratch marks or blood pools would mitigate this a little and let The Legion get downs a little more often.

  • legion is already a pain in the butt with the mending simulator forcing you to mend 80% of the match he doesn't need to be buffed

  • @codebibi said:

    legion is already a pain in the butt with the mending simulator forcing you to mend 80% of the match he doesn't need to be buffed

    yes he need get buffed, mostly his speed and feral frenzy duration increased, but pools of blood and scratch marks can be a good start