the problem with knight

scenicpickle

to start off i think he is decent, situational and can be good sometimes but some issues make him really bad at high levels of play he needs to be some changes that remove his biggest detriments

1. he needs a button to do orders up-close without the summon guard button. Having to back away from walls and pallets to kick a pallet/wall/gen waste time and is disorienting. I think everyone agrees that it feels like that was the dev original intention because you can see the glowing order circle around objects even without being in summon guard mode. im not saying make an instant pallet break it should take the same time as a regular summon but your screen blacking in and out twice instantly messes with your situational awareness
2. either have the knight be able to see survivors while summoning or the survivors can't see where the knight is summoning because guards are a huge waste of time 80% of the time the only time they are solid is when you insta summon one in a small loop in the corner of a map where they have no where to run and even that is getting countered (carnifex not so much since flag has longer spawn time)
3. WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHOSHSHSOSHSHSH. yes that lovely sound every time you summon a guard and the entire patrol time is SOOO annoying i don't know why its a thing and why it is soo loud.
4. no incentive to kick gens only adds slow regression doesn't apply perks or even 2.5% reduction so im told. i usually kick the gen myself because of this
5. guards should have more down time but stronger up time

those are my ideas you guys have any thoughts?

I have more but they are a tad unhinged and may be strong or broken but these ones mention seem fine to me

TheMruczek

Well i think he needs more changes to put him from c tier to b tier.

1. Survivors do not see orb you control while you are using your power. The distance needed for guard to be placed near window/pallet is decreased.

2. You can switch between guards and they hunt survivors for extra 8sec.

3. Guard are improved and are more diffrent. They spawn faster and touching banner doesn't guve survivors endurence status effect.

When they kick gens they can detect survivor near that gen and guards apply:

1. 10% reduction-Carnifex

2. 6% reduction-Jailer

3. 2.5% reduction-Assasin

Carnifex, Assasin have their detection range increased by 4m.

Jailer runs at 110%, Carnifex 107% and Assasin at 113%. Assasin breaks objects in 6sec, Jailer in 4sec and Carnifex in 2sec.

BillsHere101

Bugs:

1. Guards get stuck in or behind objects. My guards got stuck inside a generator, lockers, behind fences or stuck between trees. This is an absolute ball breaker because if it happens then it can ultimately ruin the match, and survivors can use this to their advantage. If they can remember the patterns, they could stop your guards and then you're just a regular M1 killer.
2. Guards and collision. The collision from objects slow guards down as they bump into them, leading to longer chases.
3. A bug where the knight can't use his power anymore.
4. Power and pallet stun. If you use your power while simultaneously getting pallet stunned, you'll get Sonic the Hedgehog movement speed.
5. Extremely loud noise. If you activate and cancel your power quickly then you will hear a very loud noise that you can't stop until the guards completely gone.
6. Visual effects. You sometimes see those green tornadoes that's left behind and doesn't disappear. I don't know what causes this.

Power:

1. It's too survivor-friendly. They receive a ton of information from his power for no good reason. Here is a few examples: The guards give you an indicator of their detection range. Knight's power shows you a flashy green orb and the path is visible. Survivors can see what cycle you are in so if you have Jailer they can see that on your glove. There are probably more that I forgot.
2. It's add-on reliant. There are some addons that are necessary to make him at least somewhat good. Dried Horsemeat and Map of the Realm comes to mind as they increase the chase duration and the vision range of patrolling guards.
3. No secondary power. The Knight should manually cycle guards but it didn't went live. They should rework this and give Treated Blade, Cold Steel Manacles and Battle Axe Head something new.
4. Unnecessary cooldowns. I don't know why that there is a cooldown when the guard is at its end of his patrol. Totally unnecessary in my opinion.
5. You can pallet stun the killer if he's in his green orb. I have no words for this one.
6. You can't see survivors, scratch marks and pools of blood during your power.
7. You can't call off your guards. You can't give your guards orders to stop patrolling, so you have to go over there and hit your mercenary.
8. Guards. Either it's duration, speed or vision range, they all need some small buffs.
9. Power speed and path length. Traveling and creating a path takes too long. I wish they could up the speed and lengthen the path.
10. Counterintuitive camera movement. You can't move left or right. You have to explicitly aim at the direction that you want to move at but you can't move left, right or backwards.
11. Standard. It shouldn't provide haste and endurance effects for the survivor.
12. Guards get slowed down by pallets and windows. While a guard is chasing a survivor, if they're going through pallets or windows, the guard gets slowed down.
13. You, as the knight, cannot bodyblock the survivor while it's being chased by a guard.
14. Dead Hard completely counters his power to gain even more distance from the Knight.
15. Survivors can protect their friends by taking the hit from the guard.
16. Guards that transition from beginning to end to hunt a survivor is slow overall.
17. The guard's spawn time and vision range expansion are slow.
18. When you use your guard to a kick a generator, the generator doesn't lose 2.5% progression and only start the regression process.
19. The Knight's power get blocked by the smallest obstacles, forcing you to move around before you can use your power.
20. You can't use your guard to snuff out boon totems or close the hatch.
21. Survivors being chased by a guard can remove the guard by unhooking a survivor, grabbing the standard or outrun it.
22. Sometimes your power overlaps and instead prioritize kicking the gen or breaking pallet/wall instead of patrolling the area.

killer998

Glad to hear it's not just me who's having my ears blasted with a guard summoned. Why the hell is it that loud? You can't hear anything except the agonising death of your hearing.

danielmaster87

It's his time to down, and built-in counters. It feels like playing Deathslinger or Twins, where there's a slow animation or process for everything that you do. Have to press the button, go into the mode, move, set the guard down (while showing the survs exactly what you're doing AND not being able to see the survs for some reason), they show their own patrol range to the survs, they go "Aaaaaahhh!" (if they have line of sight), slowly move to the initial position they saw the survivor, and THEN they start chasing. If you hit the survivor, I guess you suddenly don't need the guard anymore, because it gets deleted. Besides that interaction, if you want to delete your guard manually, you have to go up and hit them (as opposed to simply pressing the button again). And then while they're chasing someone, the banner gets put down so they can (unlike you) instantly delete the guard and get speed/Endurance. Here's how that plays out: https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxtTJ_zFOc8UR-nGTgcgd1UDZzaczn5weC

viewfan

I wish you could order a guard to kick gens/doors/pallets without having to get into the orb, it's so stupid.

I was hoping it would be like Ashe from Overwatch where she summons BOB.

Veinslay

I can't use a long patrol route during a chase cause I get disoriented easily and lose track of the survivor. Not being able to see the survivor while making a route seems like too much. Also it would be nice not having to hit the attack button to direct them to kick a gen or break a pallet. If you end the patrol selecting that object, they should just break it. It's cumbersome pressing another button and it's not always responsive so it won't take and they end up not breaking the thing im trying to get them to all while i'm losing distance in chase

Chaos999

Many ideas have been proposed. However I find it unlikely that any of that will be implemented

LordSturm

@Veinslay said:

I can't use a long patrol route during a chase cause I get disoriented easily and lose track of the survivor. Not being able to see the survivor while making a route seems like too much. Also it would be nice not having to hit the attack button to direct them to kick a gen or break a pallet. If you end the patrol selecting that object, they should just break it. It's cumbersome pressing another button and it's not always responsive so it won't take and they end up not breaking the thing im trying to get them to all while i'm losing distance in chase

i have the opposite problem, sometimes my guard will just decide he wants to break something before i even get to click the button

NekoTorvic

I think you should definitely have a button to quick order a guard.

And also I think you should be able to have a guard executing an order and a guard on patrol at the same time

If you have a guard on patrol, you should be able to quick order another guard to break a pallet, damage a gen or break a wall. You can't use M1 to call out that order tho, it has to be the quick button for the order.

If you have a guard performing an order, you can only summon a guard on patrol for your normal M1 and they can't perform orders.

If you have neither, you can either quick order a patrol or you can summon a guard normally to either order them or send them on patrol.

I think this change would truly make his multitasking potential exceptional.