Hyperfocus overhyped
Why do people seem to fix onto hyperfocus as this super gen perk. Like your first great skill check, no difference and then its only and additional .3 for the second, .6 for the third, .9 for the 4th. Like stake out gives an additional 1% flat per great skill check which takes hyperfocus. To get an average of that increase with hyperfocus alone you need to hit 8 great skill checks IN A ROW. Which if you're able to sit on a gen from start to finish is about all the skill checks you can get, you will get more with a toolbox but that also is a one time uses as you cant choose to stop working with the toolbox without losing all your stacks. This just seems like a lot of hype for something that saved an additional 7.2 seconds when you are able to sit on a full gen. I mean this is the same amount that Overzealous gives on a dull totem and less than resilience gives when injured and both of these allow for you to leave if needbe. Like I really don't get why this perk is getting so much attention and hype.
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You are risking a perk slot. An entire perk slot is an ask. There are alot of things that need to go right for you to get value and you really need to dedicate 2 perks slots to get actual value. Like people often consider hex totems a high risk because you lose the perk if survivors cleanse it. Or scourge hooks if RNG gods are not in your favor.
I wouldn't say it's overhyped but it's way too inconsistent to consider it a meta perk.
The perk doesnt deactivate though, it only resets. Again, you get more chances at getting value from it, and it doesn't impose any negative (especially when failing.) Hex totems are high risks because they can be removed from play by the other side, and are not guaranteed any value before they can be removed. Thats not the same thing as one that can be interrupted. Scourge hooks vary because they are dependent purely on map RNG, which is an entirely different beast altogether due to how procedural generation works.
Many streamers come up with the perfect optimal conditions for perks and then cry about it being broken. I remember the hype and OP drama videos showcasing "broken" Soul Guard, Tenacity, and Unbreakable. They went on about how unfair it was and would make videos with a Hex active showing a Survivor getting up 10x in a match, etc. The game was over; killers will never be able to slug and so on.
They are usually performing either Sanity Checks or Smoke Tests, aka seeing if a broken situation is possible, and then seeing if it is prevalent enough to not be acceptable to go into live versions of the game. These are extremely important in high level play because they involve isolating and evaluating tools that people will potentially be able to exploit. Its actually pretty standard in terms of playtesting, which is why its wild when content creators provide that labor and build up a sample set for free.
They're the reason why boons lost their ability to overlap before they were released, as in that PTB they were able to stack effects like CoH to unintended values. That type of testing might seem like things you wont see in your average game, but they are about assessing those two above hypothesis: is it Possible, and does it break existing mechanics or content.
These tests are supposed to serve as either cautionary or reactionary to updated content as it is applied to the game. If/when their results are ignored, they then turn into countermeasure assessments at high level play.
I quite like it.
There are times where you get tunneled out and it's useless. There are times where it will win you games, provided you hit skill checks.
It's very much a feast or famine perk.
Soul guard was broken. You could create a train of unkillable survivors until they slapped the cooldown on it.
It's true that without a toolbox this was extremely unlikely, the problem with hyperfocus is that at 6 stacks without a toolbox or other gen speed perks you have an expected gen speed of 1.611c/s
EDIT: Rest of the comment got eaten
Hyperfocus: 2.52c per great, 8% base skill check chance + 24% from hyperfocus, add 1 extra second to actually hit the skill check. Expected time to hit skill check is (1/0.32) + 1 = 4.125s, 6.645c/4.125s = 1.611c/s
Base: 0.9c per great, 8% base skill check chance, add 1 extra second to actually hit the skill check. Expected time to hit skill check is (1/0.08) + 1 = 13.5s, 14.4c/13.5s = 1.067c/s
With a commodius toolbox, wire spool, scraps, and built to last you can reliably hit max stacks before the toolbox runs out if you have over half the toolbox, which means you can do 3 gens 50% faster than without bringing a toolbox or gen perks at the cost of two perks (Hyperfocus + Built to Last), an item (Commodius toolbox), and spending 12 seconds in a locker after a gen assuming you dont get pushed off the gen while repairing
Compare this with Overzealous which gives a gen speed of 1.207c/s assuming you hit greats and cleanse a hex totem (14 seconds, 2 more than BTL)
Side note: Prove Thyself is an anti 3-gen perk not a genrush perk. Two people with prove have a combined gen speed of 1.96c/s, which is slower than the 2c/s by doing two gens seperately
Hyperfocus is only good if you use it with stakeout.
The 30% of the "base value" from hyperfocus considers the 1% from stakeout as a part of the "base value"
So, When using both, not only is a regular skill check granting you 2% and giving you more skill check chance, but each consecutive skill check is an additional .6% instead of .3%.
You also can't simplify a series of hit skill checks being "mostly stake out" because if you've ever repaired a gen with just stake out you will know that the sometimes you get like 2 skill checks. Hyperfocus increases the odds of skill checks appearing. Which gives consistency.
Prove doesn't save time unless you are stacking on gens and even then it's only saving the time you are losing from being on the same gen. Which is only good in a three gen scenario. Splitting is always the best and hyperfocus/stakeout is the best at getting single gens done. I will never lose to teams trying to force prove thinking it's better than splitting in general. Overzealous requires a hex totem which means it's not as efficient and people don't really run hex's anymore. What else is there? Deja vu? Resilience? Your math is irrelevant when applied to the real game.
Go watch scott junds vods. He does it several times. You are welcome
Perk is reliant on RNG. As much as I like how hyperfocus makes gens kinda fun it was also equally unfun sitting on a gen and barely getting skillchecks. Something you don't care about too much when you're not running it but with it, it is really annoying. Eventually I just went back to Prove Thyself, can't stand RNG and definitely an overrated perk.
You wouldn't get 12 skill checks in under a minute without hyperfocus, you say stake out is the big one but it's not. You might get half those skill checks normally without hyperfocus. The synergy is the issue.
It’s what happens when “content creators” put out videos and gets people rattled about something that isn’t even seen that much.
When I play killer I barely even see this perk.
A solo survivor finishing a gen in 45 secs because of this perk and stake out is not an overhype,, it's a sad reality and shows how devs are out of touch,, first they add 10 secs because gens were too fast and then give you a perk that allows you to do gens even faster than before,, i can guarantee you if the perk wasn't behind a pay wall more people would be running it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smoke_testing_(software)
The thing about those types of situations is that once they are identified and their conditions streamlined, they do become important to understand at higher level play. I'm certainly not going to pretend that nobody has ever hidden context to try to sell people on their point, but those situations that "aren't seen that much" still exist and are feasible, which is the point of said videos: education and hopeful prevention first, countermeasure second.
They also almost always involve a perk or mechanic having outliers far different from their intended/advertised outcome, which is another reason why they may be identifying issues before they happen. The entire reason the basekit UB was needed alongside the mori change ptb was because of how absolutely awful slugging would have been without it. If they hadn't done the two tests side by side, there would have been millions of "NO DBD MATCH WILL EVER LAST MORE THAN 2 MINUTES AGAIN!" videos left and right to gobble it up.
As a build to last enjoyer - it can be pretty busted. Bringing commodious with both charge add ons can be devastating to killer. Especially with 3 gen where killer thinks he have time to chase one survivor a bit but when you jump on 0% gen and it's done super fast. Especially if two survivors jump on it with prove which I also always run with build to last build.
if the entire team goes down, there is no base-kit unbreakable currently in the game. The killer wins if the remaining 2, 3 or 4 survivor are downed simultaneously as the killer can wait the survivor's abiltiy to kobe off hooks then proceed to hook them or wait for bleed out(if survivor are hiding) whichever comes first. implying the survivor need base-kit unbreakable is saying that current slugging is "awful" for last 6 years of dbd. the update for instant-killing the survivor changes nothing for killer for whether the killer wins or loses. only thing that does change is survivor having base-kit unbreakable throughout the entire match making it much harder to slug multiple survivors simultaneously.
What exactly are you arguing with? I wasnt saying anything opposed to any of that, just that the two mechanics were related and they basically necessitated each other as opposed to doing one but not the other. As in no basekit UB would mean killers wouldnt even bother with hooks and go on a slugging rampage, so the opposite side would have a reactionary action that would put a hard time limit on the last man standing situation before resetting it.
Zubat finished a gen in like 50 seconds with it.
I did want to test this and after looking at the data I still don't know how I feel. If anyone wants to look/check my math they can do that here. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wmxWjp7aO_uvjb63-RCOmNXzVJL692TqW3Qlr0qPz_o/edit?usp=sharing
I guess the reason I don't know how I feel is it still looks to me like the main issue is toolboxes and that built to last will give more value than the stakeout/hyperfocus but that doesn't get near the attention. You can get 39 seconds shaved off a gen (without hitting skill checks or lose another 12 seconds if you hit them) with built to last and you dont have the restrictions of hyperfocus. I recognize the downside of needing to spend 12 seconds in a locker on the recharge but this is a simple task in between gens. Brand new parts are crazy with how much they give (granted no longer fully completing a gen but still 22.5 seconds).
By itself hyperfocus can save ~15 seconds with perfect accuracy on a gen by yourself from start to finish. If you are extremely lucky you can get ~20 seconds. This is a obscenely large amount however being interrupted by any means, working with someone else, or starting a gen with any progress dramatically decreases the value gained from this perk. Meaning the value of the perk is going to decrease throughout the game. The bonus given by stake out gives and addition 1% per skill check whether a token is used or not. This allows for the perk combo to be significantly more powerful throughout the game because it doesnt require the high streak for value. Even the first skill check will give double value. If they changed this to only give the bonus when a token is used like it states on the perk I don't think people would see near the value.
I guess I think that the restrictions on hyperfocus are sufficient but I would adjust stakeout to only give the bonus when a token is used. Anyone who is using hyperfocus without stakeout is wasting a perk slot atm IMO not because just because they might break a streak, destroying the perk, but because stakeout will double the value of hyperfocus as it is now. I still think BTL is better and gives an additional perk slot but does require the bringing of a toolbox which med kits are very valuable so I understand it not being as popular.
The problem honestly is the more they keep adding ways to speed up and slow down gens, the more they necessitate.... all of them. Its one of the particularly egregious cases in the game of conflicting variables turning into necessary advantage stacking, since at worst you're countering their advantage while at best you're assuring your own. They fully admitted that gen times are near impossible to balance, and keep taking 1 step forward/2 steps back each time they touch them to try to make the variable more "fair." They completely ignore how bad things can get in either direction, but keep adding more tools to try to mess with the middle average.
Hyperfocus (+ Stakeout) is only good with Built to Last + Toolbox because with the base 40% chance per second of a skillcheck when using a toolbox you can quickly get 6 stacks of Hyperfocus as long as you have half of a Commodius Toolbox with Wire Spool and Scraps which gives you about 1.611c/s gen speed after the toolbox runs out as long as you keep hitting greats, making it more valuable as the match goes on and you start to run out of BTL charges. If you're only doing one or two gens however then it's probably more worth it to bring Streetwise or PT with Commodius + Socket Swivel + Wire Spool and BTL instead
I mean you can just do a gen at double speed which is kinda nuts but it doesn't really matter in most matches because people either don't have it, don't use it because they are doing something else or don't want to waste their items. But if you have everything and a group to do it in it is just a free win
Thats why those types of variables don't fit into balance. You can't ignore how extreme a variable can differ compared to average usage, you adjust the extreme to be more in line with the average while keeping the average untouched if it is where it should be. All ignoring extremes does is encourage the more cunning to abuse the example as much as possible and increase its usage at higher levels, which is a big part of why this game becomes such a ****show toward the top. Its all just advantage stacking.
In KoF15 there was a balance change this year that made a single character have an extremely good tool, even though he had a low pick rate and most of his kit was very average. That one tool made him show up in almost every single game in every single region in competitive play since.
The issue isn't hyperfocus, it's the synergy with stake out. Toolboxes exacerbate the problem a ton but I'll focus on perks only atm, stake out doesn't add 1% in this situation, it increases the base by 1% so each token of hyperfocus increases 2% base bonus by 30%. It's a very minor difference that makes a huge impact. It's 5.6% of a gen per skill check and at max tokens the skillchecks are coming at you damn near like merciless storm.
Now a toolbox can get you to 6 stacks pretty quick and that's how survivors are doing gens solo in sub 40 seconds. The fastest I've seen was 34 seconds and it wasn't even that clean of a run, they missed a skill check at 25 ish seconds and if they'd have hit it, it would have been a sub 30 seconds gen. Solo. That's a third of the time the games balances around.
Hyperfocus alone is fine, it shouldn't stack with stake out the way it does.