Is wiggling faster than before now?
Havent really played since a long time but heard its faster now as long as you hit the skillchecks?
Havent really played since a long time but heard its faster now as long as you hit the skillchecks?
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Yes 15 seconds if you hit all greats vs 16 seconds normally
I feel like the time spent wiggling is less relevant than getting manhandled by survivors. Can't walk out a freaking door without their superior strength sending you cascading across the room. Rofl. Screw Agitation, Iron Grasp is clearly the way to go if you have to pick one.
There's a miniscule increase in speed each time you hit a great skill check.
If you manage to hit every single one without fail, it shaves off a single second (so fifteen seconds instead of sixteen), but doing so is pretty difficult seeing as the great zone decreases in size with each successive hit..
I think it is worse for me because my muscle memory is messing with me.
I was dropped and away from the hook and I still wasn't even close to wiggling off before I was hooked. Which is something that definitely wouldn't happen on old controls.
Yes. People will constantly tell you 1 second doesn't matter. But then why was it even put in there if it didn't matter? It's also really easy to hit all the greats since it's just a rhythm.
It matters. I have multiple games every survivor session where I would have gotten free if I had an extra second.
Use both, plus Mad Grit and Pain Resonance. :P
Yes. Survivors got a free 6.25% increase to wriggle speed if they hit every Great skillcheck. Because even QoL changes need to reward Survivors in some way.
I wish we knew why they decided to add in a bonus speed to greats. Just make it give extra BP or something, we didn't need extra speed.
Like, removing Boil Over being an issue rn I really don't think it makes much of a difference so I don't care if it stays or goes, but I don't get why it was added because the difference is so minimal and nobody was asking for it.
As I said; because the devs feel Survivors need a head-pat with every change. They cannot change anything without rewarding Survivors in some way.
But like, not even the survivors were asking for that. Hence my confusion.
True, i would take bonus bp over the speed any day
That's how the game is: Survivors don't even need to ask for buffs; they just get them unasked with QoL changes. 🙃
The increase is very minor, between 0-1 seconds depending on how many Great checks you hit. (And if you accidentally miss a check your wiggle time is worse.) That only makes a difference then if the carry took between 15-16 seconds normally which is rare. (If you don’t think it’s rare then go watch a lot of streamers games and count how often their carries were within one second of a hook or a little more than arm’s reach of it. Most escapes happen before then or they get hooked before 15 seconds elapses.)
The more impactful change is Boil Over’s stagger is massive. If the person with Boil Over is also hitting Great skill checks it’s hard to even walk in the right direction to get to a hook which significantly lengthens the time it takes to reach it. I’ve missed one or two hooks on Boil Over survivors simply because the stagger kept me from being able to maneuver easily through an entryway or around an obstacle for instance. That perk has much more effect on carries than the potential 0-1 boost from hitting Great checks.
The increase is very minor, between 0-1 seconds depending on how many Great checks you hit.
That's still up to 6.25% man. Not all that minor when you put it as a percentage.
Add in Boil OP and that's a possible, free 31.25% struggle meter.
Two things wrong with the above
The stagger increase doesn’t change the wiggle timer itself at all, it just makes you move suboptimally as a killer.
Except, on some maps, Survivors can run into an area where you wither 1) Have to fall, and thus give them the 25%. Or 2) Can't make a hook because of the 1 second reduction.
Saying “but it’s 6%” doesn’t make it have a significant impact on play.
Yes it does. Saying 'It's one second' is hiding the problem by pretending '1 second is not allot'. Hence why percentages exist. If something was 3 seconds long, and the devs removed 1 second, that would still sound like 'It's 1 small second' but it's 33.33% of whatever the 3 second timer is.
This also works in reverse, as with the CoH non-nerf. Where 'It's 25%' is hiding the fact that it's a tiny 4 seconds nerf that did nothing to change the perk.
In essence: 'It's one second' or 'It's 25%' needs to be taken into account WHAT is being changed. Virtually 80% of all Killer hooks are 'My wriggle bar was at 100%!'. Every single one of those is now a wriggle-free. Every one. Yet another mechanic changed to favor Survivors.
And that's not adding the drunk-effect Boil OP gives, making it that much harder to GET to a hook, even if dropping is not in play. Or that Boil OP has no minimum drop height, so no more dropping into the basement! Not even by 1 inch! Take the longest way around you can, which ensures a wriggle-free due to the SIX PERCENT buff to wriggle speed Survivors got for no reason.
Haven't seen ANYONE hit every single skill check yet.
For the average player its going to take longer to wiggle out 🤡
Devs making for troll times.
Umm...Nowhere does saying 'Survivors get 6 boost to their wriggling' mean 'It happens <x> amount of times'. I have no idea where you got that idea.
What I am saying is that a Survivor who can hit the skillchecks (and who can't after 6 years of generators?) and makes the Killer fall 1 inch (Pretty easy, if you lead the Killer to a ledge or hill, given the 75% wriggle effect), gets 31% of their wriggle bar for free. This is broken.
If you’re saying that the extra 25% from falling is broken I have no opinion one way or another on that. The Boil Over survivors I’ve played against so far haven’t forced me to fall while carrying them but that’s just me. 🤷♂️
Boil Over though is a separate question from the great skill checks on their own. Those aren’t broken or even a significant buff.
The skillchecks ARE broken because it's 6% of the bar given for hitting them. You can say '1 second is not much' but it's a different story to say '6% for free is not much'.
Eruption(6%), Huntress Lullaby(6%), Jolt (8%) and Overcharge(5%) all give between 5 and 8% gen regression. All of them are perks that the killer needs to equip + do something specific to trigger them, in order to get the same regression survivors get with the new wiggle meter for free.
So please don´t claim that this 6% reduced wiggle time doesn´t have an impact.
Again, as I said before, 6% of the bar isn’t 6% of the carries.
You’re comparing apples and oranges. 6% of gen progression isn’t the same as 6% of the wiggle bar, nor is the last 6% of the wiggle bar used in 6% of the carries.
Where are you getting '6% of the carries' from? Are you just making up a percentage of people who can hit all the skillchecks and acting like it's fact?
I mean context is important.
not all 6% are alike.
If they made killers break pallets 6% faster it wouldn't matter in almost all scenarios. Brutal's 20% barelly matters
Look how little CoH 25% nerf mattered. It almost didn't change anything
I agree the buff was unnecesary and i would much rather see bonus bp on great skillchecks but you are overexaguratting quite a bit.
That 6% still is still 1 second at the end of the day.
I’m saying “carries” because that would be the relevant statistic, not the size of the wiggle bar that’s shaved off. The question of whether or not that last bit of the wiggle bar is important is isomorphic to asking how often it is used during a carry. Saying “the bar is 6% shorter” does not equate to saying that anything like that proportion of carries are impacted.
Why isn´t it the same? Objective wise, those 2 bars have a lot in common.
Basically the length of time it takes to carry someone is going to follow something like a bell curve where the peak is probably around 8 seconds or so and then it tails off toward either end. It’s not a uniform distribution where, for example, the chance of a carry being between 8-9 seconds is the same as the chance of a carry being 15-16 seconds or being 4-5 seconds. The outlier ranges are less likely than the middle ranges. So the outlying 6% of the bar represents a much smaller proportion of carries in games than the middle 6% of the bar. This wiggle boost only changes the results on carries in that outlying 15-16 second range so the portion of carries it affects is similarly much smaller.
With gens the time to complete gens is basically fixed. So adding time to complete a gen at the front end is the same as adding time to complete it at the back end. If you Pop a gen that is 25% completed and reduce it to 5% it’s having basically the same impact on the chances of the gen being finished as Popping it at 90% and reducing it to 70%. The distribution of games which are impacted by a flat percent increase in gen time is more uniform.
With the difference, that the hook spawning is heavily dependend on the map and offerings. Depending on the position where the survivor gets downed, those 6% can make a difference. Especially if we take sabotage into account. RCPD was already a bad map for killers before the Boil Over buff. Since it was hard to reach certain hooks, even without the 6% additional progress. Sure, not every map is like this, and on some maps, there are enough hooks around. But this is RNG which has a heavy impact on this.
I understand what you are trying to say, and i know that a 6% wiggle increase as a perk would be absolute trash. But it still bothers me, how this unasked buff was introduced.
I'm convinced you're just throwing out a mass of numbers in an attempt to obfuscate the issue.
The bottom line is that the Wriggle QoL change added a 1 second reduction to wriggle time for Survivors. 1 second is 6.25% of the wriggle meter if they hit every check. This is not some freaking bell curve or front end or back end loading equation.
It's 'Up to 1 second' which is 'Up to 6.25% of the wriggle meter'. You're just throwing out bullshit statistics and math problems to sound like you know more than everyone else on the issue.
The Survivors were buffed in the Struggle QoL change to get up to 6.25% of the wriggle meter for hitting Great skillchecks. No freaking math and bell curves and graphs required. You don't need to graph out 500 matches to see IF it happens. The bottom line is that it CAN happen.
And if they have Boil OP and run to ledges; this means the fall, plus wriggling can give Survivors 31.25% wriggle meter. Again; no graphs or anything needed. It. Can. Happen.
You're basically throwing fake statistics into your comments to confuse everyone else and sound like the smartest guy in the room.
Yeah, I agree with you on certain spots on certain maps being an issue. Boil Over in particular is basically making those specific troubled tiles even worse. I think for the long term solution they need to add a hook in those spots to patch those holes where it might be impossible to hook someone with Boil Over.
Lol, I'm not trying to sound smarter or obfuscate anything, I'm trying to explain where you have a fault in your logic. But hey, I can only do so much if you don't understand what I'm saying.
Yes. Hitting great skill checks increases wiggle speed by a small amount. (Which, quite frankly, is very stupid)