Oppression shouldn't even have a cooldown
It literally makes NO sense at all for Oppression to have a cooldown. I mean it's not like it regresses faster than the normal regressing rate when kicking a gen. If anything Oppression should make gens regress faster when kicking a gen by maybe 10-15% or something.
Comments
Anything that requires a hook or a gen kick shouldn't require a cool down except for that same hook or gen.
It should, just not such a hefty one, just like some survivor perks like Repressed Alliance.
Ehhh, I dunno. Could be an issue with Surveillance. Maybe buffing it in some other way, but I don't think this is one where the cooldown should be removed.
Why? It's not like you kick a gen THAT often.
I feel like in a vacuum, you make a fair point, but compared to Ruin (which basically needs a third perk to bolster it or risk it being super inconsistent) and Surge (which requires you to win chases with an M1), I think Surveillance would hit a bit too many things too easily if you removed the cooldown from Oppression.
With perks like Ruin in the game, I don't think Oppression without a cooldown is actually going to be a big problem balancing wise. The affected gens only regress at the normal speed and the killer still has to get out of their way to kick gens which most of the time isn't worth it anyways (unless you're running pop of course).
I actually haven't had someone use the perk against me so I don't know how hard the skillcheck is but I'm assuming it's like DS and Overcharge, in which case I don't think it's going to be really problematic, but you could always just remove the seemingly useless skillcheck part of the perk if it does turn out to be too strong or annoying.
It can catch you off guard, that's about it. I think it is just like overcharge in terms of size but I'm not sure if you happen to let go at the same time if you can still clear the skill check or it fails.
Repressed has an activation requirement, not cd. It's more demanding as you have to get prepared before being able to use it.
I would remove Oppression CD and tie it to each gen instead so after kicking a gen up to three other available gens start regressing or pose a difficult skill check in case they're being repaired and go on an 80 sec CD. That way, the killer may still make use of the perk when more than 4 gens are available without being oppressive (pun intended) on late game scenarios.
If it didn’t have a cooldown you’d have goofy situations where the killer keeps kicking a gen and spamming survivors on other gens with skill checks. Maybe not OP or anything but like I said, goofy.
That said, I definitely think its cooldown needs reducing, it’s pretty hefty and the perk isn’t that good.
OP is right. Oppression starts basic regression speed or delivers an Overcharge style skillcheck on 3 more gens at random, which means it also has a tendency to pick gens that haven't even been worked on in the early game, and has the possibility of effecting all gens when there's only 2 gens remaining for the survivors to repair. Honestly, I've paired it with Surveillance and rarely ever see another gen on the map light up, because even if a survivor working on it fails that skillcheck, regression doesn't kick in and activate Surveillance's tracking... Either that, or Oppression keeps hitting gens that haven't been touched. Pairing Oppression with Hex: Huntress Lullaby can be good, but only as long as H:HL remains standing long enough to get 4 tokens, and the survivors aren't a little more than "decent" at nailing skillchecks.
Comparatively we have a hot topic on these forums that people have also asked the devs to remove the cooldown from: Surge
Surge can deliver an instant 8% loss of progress on any generator it hits when activating, but has so many conditions that its mostly useless:
Even if you took away the range restriction, Basic attack downing condition, and cooldown of Surge, the best it could do damage wise is 96% to all gens with progress on them... after 12 downs, and if the killer hooks after each down, then the killer has already won the game and doesn't even need the additional damage.
In direct contrast we have Ruin, which can reduce a gen that's been repaired for 40 seconds or is at 50% complete, to 0% in 80 seconds of being left alone. A feat of which the normal regression rate (the one Oppression applies) would take 160 seconds to accomplish. Then, there's also Pop Goes the Weasel, which if used after every hook performed in my Surge comparison, would do a total of 300% regression spread out among generators that the killer chooses to use it on. Both Ruin and PGTW have much fewer requirements for activation and do FAR more damage than Surge and Oppression, and neither of them even feature a cooldown. True, Ruin can be destroyed, but PGTW can't and all it requires is hooking survivors first.
Even if you could argue that the Damage Surge does is somehow even remotely comparable to Ruin or PGTW, the same can't be said at all for Oppression, and yet it has DOUBLE the cooldown time of Surge. Arguably, It's far easier for a killer to Kick gens than down/hook a survivor, (even easier for a survivor to tap a regressing gen though), but without any extra damage applied to the gens it affects, and only a mildly irritating skillcheck for survivors to deal with if they are working on said gens when Oppression activates... the 80 second cooldown is both excessive and pointless.
I agree with everything that you just said! Also, you forgot one condition that Surge has and that is that the gen within 32 meters of downing someone has to have progress on.
If it didn't have the extra effect of causing hard skill checks I would still want this to have a cool down. This perk is a major time savor when used the problem is that the super long cool down makes it not worth using but that doesn't mean it shouldn't have one.
This perk should have a 60 second or even 40 second cooldown, 60 seconds if they want it to be usable and 40 if they want this perk to be competitive and im fine with either.
Also it should only effect gens that have been worked on, the fact that it might trigger on a non active gen is just stupid.
My bad, and that just makes the argument even more valid for removing the cooldown on Oppression, as until there are only 2 gens left to repair, or 4 total gens available on the map, Oppression, unlike Surge, can still randomly activate on gens that don't have any progress... Seriously, What the hell are the devs thinking? Are they afraid of the situation wherein a survivor kites a killer around a gen, and the killer keeps kicking it, while the survivor keeps tapping it causing all his teammates to suffer those mildly irritating skillchecks every 3-5 seconds while they repair gens? Because If that's all they are worried about... they need to play their game more.
Honestly It needs a buff or two
First the perk doesn't go on cooldown if it doesn't affect any other generators (always this one its stupid that it currently always goes on cooldown even if it doesn't affect other gens)
Second it should either
A: affect all gens on the map so the 80 second cooldown is reasonable
or
B: highlight the gens it affected for a few seconds or give the notification like surge and decrease the cooldown to like 40 seconds at tier 3
I'm okay with Oppression having a cooldown (though I agree with everyone who's said that it should get a shorter one than it's current 80 seconds of downtime).
I actually think Oppression is otherwise in a pretty good spot and is mostly let down by how impotent base-game regression is.
I think it would be better if we saw some improvements to standard regression instead of lumping a bunch of buffs onto this perk. For example, I'd say a small amount of "instant regression" should occur on any gen kicked by the killer (maybe around 5%, a.k.a. 4 seconds of progress) and the regression speed should be bumped up by 100% (to -0.5 charges/sec up from -0.25 charges/sec).
I honestly don't see how Oppression is in a good spot or even why it needs a cooldown. If it applied a 5% regression to up to 3 generators after kicking 1, and only to generators that had progress on them, on top of giving survivors the Overcharge style skillcheck to deal with, Or if it duplicated the damage or effects of PGTW and Overcharge to every gen it affected, but had a chance of affecting gens that haven't been worked on... THEN I could totally see justifying the 80 second cooldown.
As it is however, it only applies base regression rate to a randomly selected 3 other generators, that includes gens that haven't even been touched/worked on. If any survivors are working on any of the gens selected at random by the perk, Surveillance doesn't trigger, even if the survivors fail the skillcheck, so as far as tracking goes, you are actually more likely to see survivors on gens with Discordance, or even Gear Head vs. the Surveillance + Oppression combo. Worse yet, is that because it only applies basic regression to those gens, it takes double the amount of time to bring a generator down in progress as Ruin does, which honestly feels far from "Oppressing". Against Ruin, if a survivor taps a regressing gen, they don't stop the regression until the totem is destroyed, and you can't say the same for Oppression at all.
Even if a Oppression had no cooldown, and a killer kicked a gen every 10 seconds, that means that a max of 4 possible survivors working on gens would get an annoying skillcheck to contend with every 10 seconds, and while that may be enough to beat the lowest level survivors who haven't mastered nailing skillchecks, for the other 3/4's of survivors ranging from Decent-Pro, it's so laughable, it doesn't even count as a "threat" as much as a "mild annoyance". For the completely new players, I see it less as punishment, and more as practice in order to get decent.
Overall, Much better gen regression perks exist, and they do much more damage while featuring 0 cooldown time. The only benefit Oppression has is the possibility of saving the killer time on kicking multiple gens themselves, which is honestly very similar to Surge, except at least Surge applies extra damage and a range requirement, whereas Oppression has neither, and for some godawful reason, perplexingly has DOUBLE the cooldown time as Surge...
How is this "in a pretty good spot" ?
Honeslty though, I agree with you that the Standard regression rate either needs to be improved, or the act of Kicking a Gen should apply a 10% regression to the affected gen immediately before starting the current standard regression rate. Otherwise, without a dependence on perks Like PGTW and Ruin, most killers can't even try to Compete with the efficiency Survivors currently have when repairing gens. 10 seconds of the current regression speed reduces a generators progress by 2.5 seconds of repair time or around 3%, whereas for a survivor 10 seconds of repair should increase a gens progress by 8%, but for some reason survivors repair that amount alone within 6 seconds, which tells me that it must be slightly higher than 1 charge per second. If the devs increased the base regression speed to where Ruin is at now, OR applied a 10% reduction per kick to a gen (the same damage applied when a survivor fails a skillcheck mind you), then things might be a bit more balanced towards the struggle between gen regression vs gen progress, but unless that happens, Oppression and perks like it will remain amongst the weakest perks in the killers roster... especially with such an excessive and unnecessary cooldown.
Of course it should. It 3 gens without actually having to 3 gen
Please tell me you're being sarcastic @TheClownIsKing ... I like you... and yeah, about a week or 2 ago I admit I messed up on responding to another user in these forums, but I've always respected your opinions regardless, and we've had some decent debates between us. Please tell me you are just being sarcastic with this response, despite all of the evidence to the contrary in this post I and others have vehemently presented. I'm not asking you to stick up for my beliefs, to each his own, I'm just asking that, if you are going to present a contrary opinion, please explain it in better detail for us than this short 1 and a half sentence reply, so that we may argue/debate it in a civilized manner.
No sarcasm.
Not everything needs to be balanced around elitist play. No cool down on Oppression would make late game hell for low rank/mid rank survivors due to the sheer volume of difficult skill checks. They’ll hit some. They’ll miss some, and experience heavy regression. And if the killer did in fact engineer a genuine 3 gen or 4 gen set up, there’s no way survivors in those ranks are getting the last gens done.