Thank You BHVR

I thought long and hard about making this post. Over the last few days I've been called a shill (by someone who doesn't understand the definition of the word), a "suck up", and apologist, and a White Knight. My crime was to have the audacity to say that I wasn't upset at the company, and that I think it is a bit unrealistic to always expect free things. I think they are a business, and already seem to give an enormous number of things away compared to other game companies I'd dealt with. It suffices to say I was not keeping to the party line. I want to put in context my own personal interactions with the company since I started playing (rather recently):

  1. The game didn't cost much. I bought in during a sale, and every time I've bought something there was another sale, so this may be the least expensive online game I've every bought into.
  2. They gave me a lot of free stuff right from the start. I came in during the last Rift, and while I didn't pay for the upgrade, I got a lot of free cosmetics just for playing the game. I thought that was pretty cool.
  3. I had a melt down when I had a very bad sport of a Ghostface dropped me right next to the hook when I was the last Survivor. Instead of hooking me (or waiting 60 seconds to hook me), he proceeded to dance around me and tea-bag me for the entire time until I slowly bled out. I had video of it posted it forgetting to hide the offensive guy's name at the end of the video. I got a warning (and rightly so). It was delivered to me politely and in a professional way. I was still angry, white hot as we used to say in the day. But they didn't take offense to me in private and clearly understood my concerns. I give them big ups for that. The Moderators have to put out a lot of fires and I think they are extremely even-handed when they do so.
  4. They kept giving me Blood Points. Over the last 1-2 months I have been given over 2.5 Million Blood Points via a direct gift from the company for inconveniences, as well as a large number of Codes. I can certainly say I was happy to get them.
  5. I'm a bit of a "pot-stirrer" on the Forum and the Moderators have leapt into action and fixed some of my oversights (I do TRY to abide by the rules but we all fail from time to time) and have reached out to me in a polite manner every time. They really don't get enough credit.
  6. I had a problem when I bought Monitor & Abuse on the Shrine when it appeared a several cycles back. While unlocked it was not showing up in my Blood Web. I reached out to a couple of different places, and the Moderators sent me to the correct one. The issue was clearly a bug and they have, as of TODAY, fixed it. Monitor & Abuse has showed up in my Blood Web! But on top of that they still gave me some more BP and refunded some of my Shards for the long delay and trouble. I didn't even ask for that.
  7. Not a day goes by that I don't watch this company, that has done nothing but treat me and mine extremely well, get savaged, defamed, called liars, cheats, and greedy. They do this without taking public offense, and are quite professional about it. The only bans I've witnessed were people who clearly broke the rules and were unapologetic about it. It seems you have to do a lot to actually get banned. I should know; remember I told you how I broke the rules earlier and was educated. So I give the company a lot of credit for taking far more crap than I would. They seem superhuman when it comes to patience.
  8. Then this event started and all hell broke loose. I'm not going to rehash it because it is still going on and we all know that the company took a few days and addressed it. We didn't express our concerns politely. We did it in a rude, obnoxious way. If it had been me, I wouldn't have given us anything. They still went back and gave me MORE free stuff. They addressed it. Again, I was impressed. I base this on a frame of reference that includes dealing with a lot of "actual" bad, greedy companies.
  9. And in response, what did they get from a fair number of posters here? NOT ENOUGH! WE CAN'T LET THEM GET AWAY WITH THIS! Yadda... Yadda... Yadda. Me? I would have just changed my mind and taken it back. Not them. Again with the patience.
  10. So I sit here, with my new Dwight-Crow that I just got from a a Streamer code and feel lucky. I know not everyone gets one, but I'm SURE.... POSITIVE in fact... that within a few weeks they will find a way to let everyone have one. That is just how they are wired. Hell, they might just give them away at the end of the darn thing. So judging by all the upcoming free stuff already announced... just for me playing the game... that I would have been doing anyway.... BHVR seems like Sandy Claws (if you get the Nightmare Before Xmas nod).

That is my context. So with this in mind, do you see why I am puzzled, annoyed, and well embarrassed by all the ruckus and noise? Thank you BHVR for being generous and far more patient than I would have been. I suspect there are more people like me than you know; many of them probably just don't frequent the Forum or simply don't want to get tarred and feathered virtually (or called Shills) for saying, "hey... I'm having a good time... thanks for the stuff."

Comments

  • @Terro said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704430#Comment_1704430

    My bad for being overly hyperbolic. I kept rewriting it to try to explain what I meant better and it ended up that way.

    I'm not here to argue about your opinion on how well BHVR deals with their pr cuz it'll get us nowhere.

    Also, about your point on everyone receiving the blood points... Not everyone received the bloodpoints due to bugs and lack of communication. For some ppl it just suddenly appeared without them knowing why. For others they suddenly lost blood points. some ended up with 0 blood points or worse they had negative points. For others they didn't gain anything cuz they were maxed out. Things were(are) pretty buggy and the communication wasn't (isn't) quite all there.

    And I would urge anyone this happened to to put in a ticket. The company must know about its codes and issued points, and whom actually got them. I take a screen shot of my Scrooge McDuck treasure horde of stuff built up on my Myers EVERY day. Why? If something happens and I've suddenly lost all those Add-On(s) and offerings, I want to be able to give them something to show the issue. Do I have faith it will be taken care of? Yes. They have earned that trust from me. So I think it behooves all of us to take precautions and save information. Computers and software are not reliable even when coders regularly work on it. Government systems that control our Nukes constantly have issues. In short, should bad things happen? No. Can we mitigate the damage by being proactive? Yes. Can we get our issues resolved with effort and a little patience? In my experience so far, yes.

  • @BigTimeGamer said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1703340#Comment_1703340

    Fun fact, the previous events were also free, as was the cosmetics at the time

    also this isn’t even an event lol

    And I care about previous events because...?

  • @Marc_go_solo said:

    The negativity towards them feels like it comes from a vocal minority of the player base. Sure, the majority may also have comcerns, but either they don't see it as sufficiently problematic, or maybe they just send tickets and leave it as that.

    There was a post recently about "The beginning of the end" which cited Steam statistics (which the guy did say take stats should be taken with a grain of salt) and showed the player loss. However, I also found this information for PS4:

    https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/NJDXWKNVGULF/screenshot-20201024-090100-samsung-internet.jpg

    This seems to show it's still pretty healthy.

    People become more motivated by negativity. Plus the strong emotions behind it generate more views. Positivity is not as strong a feeling, but it should be. Nice post OP👍

    I did check the csv data used for this chart, two remarks:

    1) The most popular month was August 2018 when it was free (from 1081700 to 5567900 players);

    2) The latest date available (2020-10-18) is before the latest patch (which broke the game for ps4 players);

  • @AnotherJacob said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704582#Comment_1704582

    I did check the csv data used for this chart, two remarks:

    1) The most popular month was August 2018 when it was free (from 1081700 to 5567900 players);

    2) The latest date available (2020-10-18) is before the latest patch (which broke the game for ps4 players);

    Yeah, it was the 18th October that the last data was done, so I do expect it to tank. At the same time, it's still a healthy number. Interestingly, I never knew so many played on console! I genuinely thought PC had more, but this trumps those Steam stats easily - even though we shouldn't take stats too seriously...

    ... why do we bother with stats again, if they aren't taken seriously?

  • @Moundshroud I appreciate you bringing attention to the positive points. There is a lot of good here, but I'm really doing my best to hang in there as a PS4 player. I just want to be able to play the game I bought, and I think a big portion of player frustration is on that issue.

  • @Moundshroud said:

    I thought long and hard about making this post. Over the last few days I've been called a shill (by someone who doesn't understand the definition of the word), a "suck up", and apologist, and a White Knight. My crime was to have the audacity to say that I wasn't upset at the company, and that I think it is a bit unrealistic to always expect free things. I think they are a business, and already seem to give an enormous number of things away compared to other game companies I'd dealt with. It suffices to say I was not keeping to the party line. I want to put in context my own personal interactions with the company since I started playing (rather recently):

    1. The game didn't cost much. I bought in during a sale, and every time I've bought something there was another sale, so this may be the least expensive online game I've every bought into.
    2. They gave me a lot of free stuff right from the start. I came in during the last Rift, and while I didn't pay for the upgrade, I got a lot of free cosmetics just for playing the game. I thought that was pretty cool.
    3. I had a melt down when I had a very bad sport of a Ghostface dropped me right next to the hook when I was the last Survivor. Instead of hooking me (or waiting 60 seconds to hook me), he proceeded to dance around me and tea-bag me for the entire time until I slowly bled out. I had video of it posted it forgetting to hide the offensive guy's name at the end of the video. I got a warning (and rightly so). It was delivered to me politely and in a professional way. I was still angry, white hot as we used to say in the day. But they didn't take offense to me in private and clearly understood my concerns. I give them big ups for that. The Moderators have to put out a lot of fires and I think they are extremely even-handed when they do so.
    4. They kept giving me Blood Points. Over the last 1-2 months I have been given over 2.5 Million Blood Points via a direct gift from the company for inconveniences, as well as a large number of Codes. I can certainly say I was happy to get them.
    5. I'm a bit of a "pot-stirrer" on the Forum and the Moderators have leapt into action and fixed some of my oversights (I do TRY to abide by the rules but we all fail from time to time) and have reached out to me in a polite manner every time. They really don't get enough credit.
    6. I had a problem when I bought Monitor & Abuse on the Shrine when it appeared a several cycles back. While unlocked it was not showing up in my Blood Web. I reached out to a couple of different places, and the Moderators sent me to the correct one. The issue was clearly a bug and they have, as of TODAY, fixed it. Monitor & Abuse has showed up in my Blood Web! But on top of that they still gave me some more BP and refunded some of my Shards for the long delay and trouble. I didn't even ask for that.
    7. Not a day goes by that I don't watch this company, that has done nothing but treat me and mine extremely well, get savaged, defamed, called liars, cheats, and greedy. They do this without taking public offense, and are quite professional about it. The only bans I've witnessed were people who clearly broke the rules and were unapologetic about it. It seems you have to do a lot to actually get banned. I should know; remember I told you how I broke the rules earlier and was educated. So I give the company a lot of credit for taking far more crap than I would. They seem superhuman when it comes to patience.
    8. Then this event started and all hell broke loose. I'm not going to rehash it because it is still going on and we all know that the company took a few days and addressed it. We didn't express our concerns politely. We did it in a rude, obnoxious way. If it had been me, I wouldn't have given us anything. They still went back and gave me MORE free stuff. They addressed it. Again, I was impressed. I base this on a frame of reference that includes dealing with a lot of "actual" bad, greedy companies.
    9. And in response, what did they get from a fair number of posters here? NOT ENOUGH! WE CAN'T LET THEM GET AWAY WITH THIS! Yadda... Yadda... Yadda. Me? I would have just changed my mind and taken it back. Not them. Again with the patience.
    10. So I sit here, with my new Dwight-Crow that I just got from a a Streamer code and feel lucky. I know not everyone gets one, but I'm SURE.... POSITIVE in fact... that within a few weeks they will find a way to let everyone have one. That is just how they are wired. Hell, they might just give them away at the end of the darn thing. So judging by all the upcoming free stuff already announced... just for me playing the game... that I would have been doing anyway.... BHVR seems like Sandy Claws (if you get the Nightmare Before Xmas nod).

    That is my context. So with this in mind, do you see why I am puzzled, annoyed, and well embarrassed by all the ruckus and noise? Thank you BHVR for being generous and far more patient than I would have been. I suspect there are more people like me than you know; many of them probably just don't frequent the Forum or simply don't want to get tarred and feathered virtually (or called Shills) for saying, "hey... I'm having a good time... thanks for the stuff."

    Well people got played by their own fault instead to wait they jup for cosmetics right away....

  • @TheButcher said:

    All this stupid backlash pisses me off, and the majority of people on these forums are the most hypocrital people. They want cosmetics they don't want to pay for. They want characters, and content they expect free. They want free progression, free characters, and free dlc. Then turn around and expect a bug free, cross platform, with cross progression like as if getting that ######### doesn't cost - well I don't know - MONEY?! All the ######### while this game requires so much difficult coding because it's a HORROR GAME.

    I can even go further.

    Let's talk about balancing. Like what the actual ######### people. This is supposed to be a FUN CASUAL GAME! The most of these players can't seem to get that through their heads. They want to min max everything, and be as competitive as humanly possible - ruining the game for the people who actually just want to have fun, and ruining the game for players that want to play Killer because all they get is bullied, and have to sweat every round just to be able to do sub-par.

    How about the consistent toxicity? Calling each other every single thing but a human, literally people telling others to kill themselves over a casual game. Dead by Daylight ended up getting a renown for having THE MOST toxic community in current day gaming - even worse than World of Warcraft, Call of Duty, and Rainbow Six: Siege.

    Then the sheer amount of people that come on these forums and just straight up talk out of their ass - that know absolutely nothing about the games actual balance, programming, or development of the game.

    Like seriously BHVR is one of the few companies that has the most communication with their playerbase, and they get torn apart for it. At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they go as quiet as triple AAA titles and start telling their hypocritcal playerbase "We don't care if you don't like it".

    To be honest, if anything BHVR is doing at this point is straight up a scam. I'm not surprised, with the amount of bullying they have gotten since I started playing. The players deserve it. Hands down. I wouldn't be surprised if the company did just want to take as much money as they can humanly scrap from this game and then walks away from their un-appreciative audience.

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  • I think it's funny you're defending bhvr when they clearly couldn't care less about you or the rest of the community.

    And you're grateful for a damage control addition...lol. You really think bhvr gave a discount and free bloodpoints and shards because they care? It was purely damage control.

  • @Moundshroud said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1703155#Comment_1703155

    And we can agree to disagree. That is what adults do. What you just said to me was polite and fair. I respect that. My issue is how people have gone after the company and the manner in which it was done. If they had been as polite as you were to me, I think they would have still gotten what they wanted, and I wouldn't have said a thing. :)

    I disagree with this. Civility accomplishes absolutely nothing. This is well meaning, I'm sure but utterly unrealistic. Only when players has shown that they were savvy enough to recognize when their good faith has been taken advantage of and respond with outrage when Behavior decided to pay attention.

    I will say this. The outrage will die really soon. If it isn't other players missing the point of community's anger, if it isn't the community doing damage control without even being paid for it, or the community being easily distracted things will calm down sooner or later. And that's unfortunate. I'm already seeing killer VS survivor posts again. This will indicate that business will proceed as usual and the customers will be exploited.

    Oh and those uh free shards? It's a means to ensure that the "engagement" continues. It's a popular trend among big businesses in the gaming community to ensure their live services are still worth a damn to their share holders.

    Which brings me to my temperament towards you, my concern is for you the community and my fellow players than some big company.

  • @Fibijean said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1703546#Comment_1703546

    I just meant it didn't have much to do with my comment, not that it was off-topic for the thread 🙂

    But sure, happy to give my input. Don't want to derail the thread though, so if you want to discuss it further probably best to post on my wall.

    While I don't believe abuse is necessary in any context and therefore don't condone the way some people are conveying their displeasure, I don't think the player response on an emotional level is unfair or unwarranted.

    That said, I don't think the event's integration into the Rift or Tome challenges is the issue. They did that last year and it was fine (albeit a little disappointing in comparison to the 2018 event). The problems this year, in my opinion, are (1) the lack of meaningful free content (i.e. grindable skins), though this has been recently amended somewhat; (2) The Dwight Crow nonsense (pretty much everything about it except for the charm itself - the hypocrisy around the exclusivity, the way it rewards the fastest typists in the community rather than the most dedicated or enthusiastic players and excludes console players or those with disabilities or bad internet or no Twitch access, how generally demoralising it is for the majority of people, etc); and (3) The fact that there isn't much else to the event aside from bloodpoints and charms to make up for how much those first two things suck.

    I should also say that, having taken the trouble to gain more insight into the perspective of game developers in general than probably the average gamer has, I believe there is a pipeline-related explanation for why things went the way they did with this event, and I don't think that the devs are unintelligent or deluded enough to think that this event is on par with others they've released in the past, or to not have foreseen at least some of the backlash from the community. BUT I don't think that's at all obvious, on this occasion, to the community, because without having any insight into the devs' side of things, it really does come across greedy and out-of-touch even to people like myself who have historically been fairly optimistic and gracious about giving the devs the benefit of the doubt. So given that, I do think the expectations players had of the devs in this case were reasonable, and therefore the backlash resulting from those expectations being disappointed is entirely justified, even if I don't agree with how some people are going about it.

    Absolutely. I will be more than happy to do that with you. I'd almost forgotten that was a feature.

    See, that's my issue--(1)I find the community will be far more forgiving if Dead by Daylight was free. As I stated earlier: I think the community was quite tolerant of it, a bit too tolerant for my tastes, but they were fine with the direction DBD was headed until this event? That seems like that was the last straw for most people. Dead by Daylight makes the mistake of having FTP mechanics in a game that cost money. There shouldn't even be a Rift, it's essentially a battle pass.

    (2)I'm honestly not in the know about this. I've seen mention of a Dwight Crow and charms but I don't have any insight into that. I'll have to look into it. But I do agree especially as someone who believe the industry needs to be more accommodating towards those with disabilities

    (3) I'm sure Behavior will whip up something. Though to me, I would like to see real changes. Bloodpoints and shards alone are simply not enough.

    I agree with you. I don't think the developers are clueless at all, that makes this situation even worse. I don't share your insight of game development, my inside knowledge comes from working in the field of customer service, I'd love to elaborate further but I am chained to an NDA. I've seen the victims of these "live services" many of them are mentally ill or former addicts who are exploited by their favorite hobby. EA, Epic Games, and Activation to name a few have these people in their sights and these people end up being my customers. For this reason I believe outrage is warranted, I'd go as far as to say the community isn't going far enough. Outrage is an amazing tool, it's powerful and it could change so much but that alone does nothing. The consumers need to vote with their wallets. Do not waste their money purchasing skins, do not sign in during free bloodpoint days because those are meant to track engagement that's how these services function. Push for changes that are practical instead of being content with being sold a solution to problems the developers themselves cause. This will be blow over in probably another week anyway. Which is sad, seeing the community unite over that matters was neat.

    That being said, I appreciate your response.

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